The Big Dombrowski

by 3Bagger on Jun 18, 2007 10:21 PM CDT Comment 23 comments

Hicks mentioned the other day that he regretfully chose Hart over Dombrowski. Oh well. And that Hart fell apart when the team sucked.

The Tigers have killed-it in the First-Year Player Draft during the past three years. By drafting potentially hard-to-sign prospects like Verlander in 2004, Cameron Maybin in 2005 and left-handed pitcher Andrew Miller last year. These are the names that light up the LSB blog all the time.

AND YET. Few at LSB seemed to be for drafting Porcello? It was right there for the taking, we had the security of Beavan, plus we might have pulled the Big Dombrowski? Picking the best pitcher (on most people's board) at #24?

Where are my Dombrowski people? We were so close!

Sob. Sob. Sob.

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I wasn't totally tuned in on draft day

but the impression that I got was that lots of people here really wanted to take the shot at Porcello. The only reasons that most anyone would have been against it were a) that they really believed that he wanted to go to UNC and just wouldn't sign and/or b) that the major league contract, in addition to the high monetary demand, might be just too much. But just in terms of talent acquisition you'd have to be pretty foolish to not root for a guy like that to be added to the organization.

by Brett Perryman on Jun 18, 2007 10:20 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Porcello

Yeah, it's always hard to account for everyone I guess.

Reading some of the Boras comments has been pretty comical. I think Detroit really has Porcello by the nuts.

A great pitcher's park, $5 million bucks, the odds he can improve on his reputation at UNC? How? College ball might be cruel.

I bet the Major League deal never happens. But the big bonus probably will.

by 3Bagger on Jun 18, 2007 11:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I agree 100%

This has been my exact take all along.

Porcello was the consensus #2 prospect in the draft, it's kinda hard to move up from there ain't it?

And why risk 6 million today for the possibility of 7 million 3 years from now?

I'm glad the Rangers didn't pick him, but I bet he gets the largest signing bonus of the draft and no ML contract.

by tricer on Jun 19, 2007 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

JD > Dombrowski

by Longhorn on Jun 18, 2007 10:25 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I wish

by Brett Perryman on Jun 18, 2007 10:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

yeah

it sure does help him when he is one of the more luckier GMs out there. Maggs was suppose to be hurt, everyone didn't like that sign, now he's really really good. He's like the bizaro Wilky.

His first round picks, well, he picked 8th overall, 3rd overall, 2nd overall, 10 overall, 6th overall...wish JD could have that chance of suckage before doing well...Even with those high picks, he's missed on Moore and Sleeth.

It's weird how he gets a pass for losing year after year after year, with pitchers losing 19 games a season, 20 games a season...

Lets see, 106 losses, 119, 90, 91, then finally he wont in '06.

Why can't we give JD the same chance of rebuilding?

So, not sure how anyone can say DD is better than JD yet...

Also, there should be a stat for GM+, that should include park factors. FLA and DET...awesome pitching parks.

by Longhorn on Jun 18, 2007 10:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

This is good stuff

You bring up a great point. Seriously, let's not change managerial philosophies yet again and can our GM; give him the same chance that Dombrowski got. Still, didn't Dombrowski have some feathers in his cap due to his Florida years? If he had not have had some previous success, do you think Detroit would have trusted him as much?

I shudder to think of what the carping and moaning will be like next year if we are yet again on track to lose 100 games in a pattern similar to Detroit.

by talkingmike on Jun 18, 2007 11:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

This is how good the Sori trade was

when JD made it.

Or just maybe how lucky Detroit is or how unlucky we are...

People would have been gigantanormously pissed off if we turned around right after that trade and traded Wilkerson for Maggs.

by Longhorn on Jun 18, 2007 11:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

406 losses in 4 years

That's a great point.

But I disagree that JD is worthy of Dombrowski's rope. And I really disagree that JD is better than Dombrowski.

I like Domb's clarity of thought. You can almost predict his next move before he even makes it. Same with Beane. Can you say that about JD? I can't.

I have no idea what will happen with Teix, Gagne and Aki. And so on. I won't re-hash all the trades and signings again, but, this team needs a vision. Are we the Twins? The Indians?

If it's about pitching, which it seems to be, let's move the damn fences back. 400 in Right Center? 350 Down the Right Field line? I'm in.

by 3Bagger on Jun 19, 2007 12:39 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

moving fences

I've often wondered what difference it would make to simply move the Rangers bullpen somewhere else and move the fence to what is now the back of that bullpen.

Seems like about 30-40% of the homers in our park end up in that bullpen and moving the fences back in that one area could make the park play a LOT different.

by tricer on Jun 19, 2007 1:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

JD> Domb

Can you prove that on an etch-o-sketch for me?

by 3Bagger on Jun 18, 2007 10:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I was a big Fan of Dave at the time.

and am even more so now. and the thing is, im totally convinced that when Hicks interviewed DombDomb and Hart, he asked, "What moves would you make to this team if you were to take over now?"

Domb: "I'd blow this baby up, Id trade everything not nailed to the ground for the best prospects possible and then do a total rebuild from the ground up. Dont get me wrong, this team will suck, we may lose 100 games before we win again, but thats my style, i build from the ground up and i promise its the best answer long term if your looking for a WS contender."

John Hart: "We arent that far off, Tom. You gotta believe me, i really think if we add a few key pieces, the rangers will be a playoff contender right now."

Hicks was a fool. he looked for the easy answer and he based his decision on what he wanted to hear, not what he needed to hear. Dave told him the truth, EGS told him what he knew he wanted to hear. The rest is history.

.500 or bust!

by Jayslick on Jun 18, 2007 11:17 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

It's hard

to lose that much for 4 years. A lot of people in DFW are just passing time until the Cowboys start up again.

When your job kicks your ass, or the kids need feeding, is there anything worse than watching $60 Million Millwoods blow in the wind? Game Over by the 3rd inning? To me that's much worse than Dombrowski's blow it to hell plan.

At least Detroit were clear. I don't feel that level of honesty right now.

Instead, I see: look people! Shiny object! Sosa to hit 600!

by 3Bagger on Jun 19, 2007 12:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Um

you do realize that the Tigers lost a TON of games in '05 while paying Pudge and Magglio a ton of money, right?

How was it "clear" at that point what the Tiggers were doing?

I'm officially on the bandwagon: FIRE JOHN DANIELS!!!

by thedirkatron on Jun 19, 2007 3:35 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

2005?

They were starting to add people by then.

In 2003, the Tigers started with a 3-20 record. Attendance that year was like 15,000 a game, or less. It was the beginning of the real misery. They were talentless. Dombrowski said at that time, and I researched this quote:

"We're tied to our philosophy of youth. We can juggle a few faces, but it's not like we're in a position to acquire a superstar for the middle of the lineup...This will take some time."

In 2003. Higginson said, "We knew things would be tough - we just didn't anticipate they'd be this tough."

Trammell said, "I don't think about our record on the field, not one time."

Being "clear" is not just for Scientologists. I'm hoping JD explains the plan soon. I'll give him until Aug. 1st.

by 3Bagger on Jun 19, 2007 9:47 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Great how all that luck & insight worked out

for Dombrowski.....Trammel, not so much.....he got to be the sacrificial lamb, while Dombo is a genius!

Everyone on here talks a good game, but just listening to the wailing & gnashing of teeth this season makes me shudder to think how 400 losses in 4 years would go over.

by tklawless on Jun 19, 2007 11:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Considering we are on pace to lose 100

with only Kinsler, Tejeda, Loe, and Mccarthy as young players, I don't think people would be much more upset losing 100 with more young players.

Mitt Romney should "get out his small-varmint gun and drive those Guatemalans off his lawn" -- Sen John McCain

by DJCahill on Jun 19, 2007 12:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Next Season

I think next season would be the time to take a flyer on a draftee with singability issues. The current farm system is considered to be weak, though mostly due to the lack of talent at the upper levels. A year from now, the good prospects will make their way to AAA, and the solid draft from this year will fill out the lower levels; all in all, the Rangers will have a farm system with promising players across the board. A good farm system is one that continually promotes players with potential (not necessarily one that creates great players, for that would be impossible). Daniels has put the Rangers' farm system in such a position. So should he take a chance on a player with lots of questions in the next draft, not signing him won't be as detrimental because the farm system is already solid. If Porcello was drafted this year and did not sign, then the Rangers would still have a farm system with holes. I think Daniels did the right thing this year. However, it would be a shame if he passed on a very talented player due to money issues in next year's draft.

by Excel Hearts Choi on Jun 19, 2007 7:48 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

this

is exactly the right answer to porcello.

Forget Johnny Bench, we got Gerry "the Jet" Laird

by ab03 on Jun 19, 2007 10:29 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Enough about Porcello already

I'm tired of this argument. Yes, it would have been great to have Dombrowski, but he had the benefit of the losing seasons and nothing to lose in re-building. I think the Rangers need to stick with a long term plan like that and stop trying to patch together a winning club every year -- but that decision is almost certainly NOT up to Daniels. That would have to be ok'd by Hicks.

by t ball on Jun 19, 2007 8:59 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Tired?

Can I get you a chair? Bed? Pillow?

by 3Bagger on Jun 19, 2007 9:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

More like a stick

to continue beating a dead horse. Look, I'd have been excited if they'd drafted him, but I can certainly understand the reasoning behind not doing so. and judging the draft solely on whether or not they got Porcello is just inane. Comparing Detroit's present situation to that of the Rangers is equally inane.

by t ball on Jun 19, 2007 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I agree on Porcello......

and the major league contract clinched it for me. The Ranger's could't afford the risk this year. It was/is a pivotal draft for rebuilding the farm, we couldn't take a high pick that might not sign. Next year, maybe we can.

by tklawless on Jun 19, 2007 11:12 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs