Sammy hits 600

Cold.

Heart of ice.

by TexGoesYard on Jun 20, 2007 9:09 PM CDT reply actions

and DFA wilkerson?

i agree!

by DShep on Jun 20, 2007 9:14 PM CDT reply actions

Exactly

Mitt Romney should "get out his small-varmint gun and drive those Guatemalans off his lawn" -- Sen John McCain

by DJCahill on Jun 20, 2007 9:59 PM CDT up reply actions

YES !!!

Get that whiffing machine Wilkerson out of here NOWWWWWW !!!!

GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 20, 2007 10:10 PM CDT up reply actions

Well...

Sosa: 755 OPS
Wilk: 751 OPS

Wilk has struck out once every 3.7 plate appearances this season.

Sosa has struck out once every 3.7 plate appearances this season.

by Adam J. Morris on Jun 20, 2007 10:15 PM CDT up reply actions

Doesn't Wilk make more?

And injured more?

by Longhorn on Jun 20, 2007 10:15 PM CDT up reply actions

Yes and yes

Not sure why his salary would impact whether or not you'd release him ahead of Sosa, though.

If anything, you'd want to hold Wilkerson a little longer, since if you could trade him to someone else in July, you'd save about $2 million versus releasing him.

by Adam J. Morris on Jun 20, 2007 10:18 PM CDT up reply actions

Neither is the future

But I think you could get a useful player for Sosa instead of just releasing him.

"The Summer of Suck"

by boomer1 on Jun 20, 2007 10:21 PM CDT up reply actions

surely

in your wildest dreams you dont think that the Rangers would cut Sammy?

Not offering my opinion here on Sammy the player, just stating that Dean Palmer will make a comeback before the Rangers release Sosa.

Maybe we can make a deal at the deadline and get Oil Can Boyd in here!

by rkh on Jun 20, 2007 10:22 PM CDT up reply actions

I agree

if we don't finding a trading partner for Sosa he'll probably be here all year. Unless of course he completely falls off the map.

"I'm an aggressive guy, I'm not a guy who's going to go up there and swing like a girl." - Sammy Sosa

by cgolden on Jun 21, 2007 7:04 AM CDT up reply actions

I have no problem with that

so longas he's the righty side of strict lefty/righty platoon in LF with the Cat.

If he stays up all year clogging the DH spot... then I'ma get mad.

"The boxing scenes in 'Million Dollar Baby' were so realistic, I initially thought it was a documentary." -Brian Thomas.

by thedirkatron on Jun 21, 2007 9:14 AM CDT up reply actions

he gone

at the first sign of someone offering a warm body, or maybe even "future considerations"

by mjh on Jun 21, 2007 9:27 AM CDT up reply actions

Correction

After that double...

769 OPS for Wilk
755 OPS for Sosa

by Adam J. Morris on Jun 20, 2007 10:17 PM CDT up reply actions

Another stat for you

Sosa: 53 rbi
Whiffy: 22rbi

by doolindalton on Jun 21, 2007 6:52 AM CDT up reply actions

RBI's

The true measure of a player.

"The boxing scenes in 'Million Dollar Baby' were so realistic, I initially thought it was a documentary." -Brian Thomas.

by thedirkatron on Jun 21, 2007 9:15 AM CDT up reply actions

that statheads completely dismiss the RBI stat, but you have to admit there's something to that. That's not completely luck. The guy does drive in a lot more runs. He, overall, has a lot better at bats when runners are on.

Chris Young/Adrian Gonzalez for Aki Otsuka, the new Sammy Sosa/Wilson Alvarez for Harold Baines

by badradiorules on Jun 21, 2007 10:11 AM CDT up reply actions

Yes, he's hit pretty well with RISP, but

he's also had more chances for an RBI than Wilky and many others on the club. You can't use only a counting stat to judge a player. Wilkerson has only had 47 at bats with runners on, and Sosa has 121. He damn well better have more RBI than Wilkerson.

by t ball on Jun 21, 2007 12:01 PM CDT up reply actions

Why?

His BA is slightly lower than Sosa's, his OBP is higher, and their SLG is about the same. At least Wilkerson adds a little value defensively with Teixeira out.

Sosa also strikes out more often than the guy you call the whiffing machine.

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 10:16 PM CDT up reply actions

Damnit, Chris.

Quit ruining the illusion that everybody's favorite whipping boy is a vastly inferior player to Sosa. You're such a damned killjoy.

by Athos on Jun 20, 2007 10:46 PM CDT up reply actions

Sorry

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 10:50 PM CDT up reply actions

And to be clear

They both suck.

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 10:50 PM CDT up reply actions

They both suck...

But Sosa was pulled off the scrap heap and Wilkerson is what we have to show for trading away one of the best players in the history of the game.

I know that is no fault of Wilk's, but it just hurts to turn ARod to Sori to Wilk.

by tricer on Jun 20, 2007 10:59 PM CDT up reply actions

Don't forget Arias

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 11:01 PM CDT up reply actions

thats the rangers for you

should have told him to stay and play OF or go to hell - its not like he can hold out (sori).

equally should have kept arod. plain and simple.

and look at the players on their own

wilkerson.

sosa.

dont look at wilkerson<--sori<--arod

dont look at alvarez/sosa-->baines-->etc-->sosa

look at them on their own.

by knockoutking24 on Jun 20, 2007 11:03 PM CDT up reply actions

Sosa may strike out more but hes also hit..

600 Home Runs ..sluggers like that strike out a lot..simple as that..hes one of the top 5 sluggers EVER.. Wilk a slugger? thats laughable..he doesnt have many home runs and not many RBI's and sucks in the clutch..as well..
he PALES in comparison to the superstar we call SLAMMIN SAMMY !! GO SAMMY !!

GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 1:53 AM CDT up reply actions

Sammy...

Steroids or not, washed up or not, Botts or not...

... That was a pretty neat moment!

by Topgun22 on Jun 20, 2007 9:16 PM CDT reply actions

anyone else see

the guy in the bullpen (CJ i think) jumping up and down right before it hit chiti? LOL

by knockoutking24 on Jun 20, 2007 9:16 PM CDT reply actions

as much as most of us hate him

personally and professionally (for blocking progress), that has to put a smile on your face.

i say he's got at least 2 weeks. if not, next time he has a real bad streak, he's gone.

Al Gore 2008 http://www.myspace.com/igotsculture

by gossamer on Jun 20, 2007 9:17 PM CDT reply actions

They're not going to cut him.

They might trade him, but they won't cut him.

by Athos on Jun 20, 2007 9:18 PM CDT reply actions

Just for fun

Piniella should ask the umpires to check the bat.

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 9:19 PM CDT reply actions

oh my

sammy jr. looks exactly like sammy...

by Longhorn on Jun 20, 2007 9:19 PM CDT reply actions

No doubt

"The Summer of Suck"

by boomer1 on Jun 20, 2007 9:32 PM CDT up reply actions

Yeah

He isnt going anywhere.

by TexGoesYard on Jun 20, 2007 9:19 PM CDT reply actions

Hello Mrs. Sosa

by cmkelly29 on Jun 20, 2007 9:20 PM CDT reply actions

Go Sammy!

Now let's trade him :)

sportsdeals.blogspot.com

by BudLight on Jun 20, 2007 9:21 PM CDT reply actions

Still nothing on ESPN.com about it

hmm

by cmkelly29 on Jun 20, 2007 9:22 PM CDT reply actions

here

http://espn.go.com/

by Longhorn on Jun 20, 2007 9:29 PM CDT up reply actions

Yep

I know it's up now.

by cmkelly29 on Jun 20, 2007 9:29 PM CDT up reply actions

More important thing from tonight's game

Loe is doing alright again.

by t ball on Jun 20, 2007 9:31 PM CDT reply actions

Wow

Sammy has the 2nd fewest ABs to get to 600 HRs. Only Ruth got to 600 faster.

by Longhorn on Jun 20, 2007 9:33 PM CDT reply actions

4 straight 50 home run seasons

(3 of which are 60 home run seasons) will do that for you.

what stopped bonds from doing that was the fact that he was initially a leadoff speedster guy getting 19-22 homers a season...but since 1992 he has been a god.

Al Gore 2008 http://www.myspace.com/igotsculture

by gossamer on Jun 20, 2007 9:35 PM CDT up reply actions

that record

and all others(home run related) will soon be AROD's.

Maybe we can make a deal at the deadline and get Oil Can Boyd in here!

by rkh on Jun 20, 2007 9:37 PM CDT up reply actions

Yep.

I doubt he'll break the single season record, but the career record will be his for sure.

by Athos on Jun 20, 2007 9:38 PM CDT up reply actions

Yep

"The Summer of Suck"

by boomer1 on Jun 20, 2007 9:39 PM CDT up reply actions

yeah

a rod will probably end up being the best player since willie mays. pujols would be up there if he were a little better defensively.

i can see a rod being up there with musial, williams, dimaggio, gehreg, ruth, mays, wagner, horsby, cobb, lajoie, anson, speaker and tettleton

Al Gore 2008 http://www.myspace.com/igotsculture

by gossamer on Jun 20, 2007 9:40 PM CDT up reply actions

LOL

Putting Cap Anson in that group was funny. Well done.

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 9:41 PM CDT up reply actions

I wish they would call up this Botts character

so that he can suck, be good, or do whatever it is that makes you guys beg for his arrival.

by Ranger914 on Jun 20, 2007 9:46 PM CDT reply actions

I was more amused

by Tettleton.

sportsdeals.blogspot.com

by BudLight on Jun 20, 2007 9:47 PM CDT reply actions

Sammy Hate Turns one Web Poster away

I have not posted in a while mostly becuase I have been too busy. However, I have not posted as well becuase of the Hate from Adam with regards to Sosa.

This Rangers season has been a total disaster and it is hard watching game after game. However, I have at least caught most games (even if only for a few innings) and honestly I care to see Sammy play. I wanted to see HR 600. I wanted to see it at home and wanted to see the smile on his face.

Yes, yes I want to see young players I want to see the future, I want to see and be given a reason to think the future is bright but you know what I also want to be given a reason to watch right now. Sammy gives us that reason. He is making history. He is only the 5th player every to hit 600. Yeah, he probably used the juice but then again so did many players of his generation. Does not make it right but it is what it is...but he is still making history and makes watching enjoyable.

I have been completely turned off of this site by the Posts and comments by Adam in regards to Sosa. no, he is not our future but he is on this team and I support him 100%. Daniels and Hicks picked him for the team and if you support at least Daniels (as I do) then you support this decision. Also I hate hearing the "we should see what Botts can do" argument. Granted the guy has not had much chance to prove himself at this level but if Management (i.e. Daniels and others in the Minor league level that would help Daniels evaulate Botts) were high on his ability he would be here. He is not and I don't think the reaason is 100% becuase Sosa is here for publicity reasons. I think partly becuase some think Botts can't get it done here and honestly I trust the judgement of the scouts and Daniels much mroe than I do of Adam.

This is a rant no doubt and this site is very popular entirely becuase of the hard work and long hours put in by Adam and others but the Hate on Sammy (a current player) has turned at least one person off of this site.

by simbaa on Jun 20, 2007 10:06 PM CDT reply actions

Keep the Sammy hate

With the love fest going on almost everywhere else regarding Sammy it's nice to see at least one place where he is called out for being what he is and that's a below average baseball player.

Oh, and he's a scumbag too but nobody seems to care about that since his jersey says Rangers across the chest.

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 10:12 PM CDT up reply actions

he's a scumbag?

how?

by Longhorn on Jun 20, 2007 10:14 PM CDT up reply actions

elaborate

on "scumbag" for those of us who are unaware.

Maybe we can make a deal at the deadline and get Oil Can Boyd in here!

by rkh on Jun 20, 2007 10:14 PM CDT up reply actions

Scumbag

He's a blatant cheater and fraud. The corked bat and the "me no speak the English" show he put on in front of Congress are what make him a scumbag in my opinion. I have a strong suspicion that many here would share that opinion if he played for the Angels.

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 10:22 PM CDT up reply actions

rooting for the jersey

is what sports fans do.

see..........TO, Charles Haley, Deion, etc with Cowboys. Mike Irvin was a scumbag, but he was our scumbag, dammit.

Maybe we can make a deal at the deadline and get Oil Can Boyd in here!

by rkh on Jun 20, 2007 10:24 PM CDT up reply actions

Rooting for the jersey

To me, that is different than rooting for the player in the jersey.

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 10:29 PM CDT up reply actions

Word.

And screw Owens.

by Athos on Jun 20, 2007 10:49 PM CDT up reply actions

nah.

by Longhorn on Jun 20, 2007 10:25 PM CDT up reply actions

so..........

you only root for players who meet your moral standards.

as if you even know what these players do when your not looking.

since you dont know them personally, how do you know who is worthy of rooting for?

Maybe we can make a deal at the deadline and get Oil Can Boyd in here!

by rkh on Jun 20, 2007 10:30 PM CDT up reply actions

Gaylord Perry = scumbag

He was a known cheater.

"The Summer of Suck"

by boomer1 on Jun 20, 2007 10:26 PM CDT up reply actions

Correct

And all the people bellowing to keep guys like Bonds and McGwire out of the Hall of Fame need to look at guys like Perry.

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 10:31 PM CDT up reply actions

for others

out of curiosity do you feel the same towards McGwire, Palmeiro, etc.

If you do great just curios

by simbaa on Jun 20, 2007 10:27 PM CDT up reply actions

Pretty much

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 10:30 PM CDT up reply actions

some of your favorite players are scumbags then

i guarentee players you liked and still like from the 90s were steroid abusers.

just because sosa hit 600 homeruns doesnt make him more of a cheater then the steroid abuser who hit 10 and was out of baseball in 5 years.

baseball turned its back on steroids, i cant blame all those players. I look up to the ones that didnt do it, but baseball was letting it go by... its just a tainted era, but calling everyone from it a scumbag is unreasonable.

by DShep on Jun 20, 2007 10:30 PM CDT up reply actions

Favorite players

That's the thing. I really don't have any and I haven't since I was a kid. I view players as commodities. To be honest, I don't really care that Sosa is a scumbag as much as I do that he isn't a good player anymore. I mainly posted this stuff to point out the hypocrisy of most fans.

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 10:34 PM CDT up reply actions

Do you want Botts instead of Sosa

Botts in 77 AB (not much granted has this)

AvG: .247
OBP: .333
SLG: .338
Ops+ : 77

Sosa this year:

AVg: .241
OBP: .298
SLG: .338
OPS+: 92

Heck, give me Sosa. I hope Botts is good, the Rangers need it...but honestly I like I said before I trust the Scouts and Daniels before I trust others.

by simbaa on Jun 20, 2007 10:44 PM CDT up reply actions

Scouts and Daniels

Aren't they the guys who put together the worst team in baseball this year?

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 10:49 PM CDT up reply actions

Ouch.

Talk about slamming the door on a debate ....

by Athos on Jun 20, 2007 10:51 PM CDT up reply actions

you are right

but then again if you have such crappy pitching coaches as Mark Conners what do you expect...yes that is also Daniels fault.....maybe Daniels should go by that theory.

However, and I hope for the best..but in the end if Botts were any good he would be in the Majors...Teams don't keep good players in the Minors..heck usually they promote them too fast....Sosa keep it going and make Adam post about 20 more comments about how you should be gone.

by simbaa on Jun 20, 2007 10:53 PM CDT up reply actions

Conner

I don't really fault him for this year. The bullpen is still pretty good and I think that Loe, Tejeda, and McCarthy have been about what should be expected. They are young guys with talent how have been inconsistent. That happens. Millwood has been bad but he's also been hurt. I think the only guy that has not lived up to expectations and doesn't really have an excuse for it is Padilla but he's such a nutcase I can't really blame Conner for that either.

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 11:06 PM CDT up reply actions

Chris you are on to something..however

why is that it took Loe going to the Minor for what 4 days and just TALKINg with Andy Hawkins and getting fixed....explain that...coincendence...mayber...

by simbaa on Jun 20, 2007 11:09 PM CDT up reply actions

Two good starts...

doesn't really mean he's fixed.

by chase1971 on Jun 21, 2007 12:39 AM CDT up reply actions

funny

at some point in the season it will be

"10 good starts doesn't mean he's fixed"

Forget Johnny Bench, we got Gerry "the Jet" Laird

by ab03 on Jun 21, 2007 9:10 AM CDT up reply actions

Exactly !!

there were tons of players doing them back then so I guess they're all scumbags..LOL..Sammys on par to hit close to 30 homers and drive in 120 runs.. hitting 360 with runners in scoring position ..steriod free..give the man a break !
Who else could do better? Botts? The man couldnt catch a ball if his life depended on it..thats why hes labeled a DH only candidate..thats sad and limiting..what the hell has he been doing in the minors all these years? hasnt learned to catch a damn ball yet.. why bother !

GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 20, 2007 10:39 PM CDT up reply actions

Yes

Botts could do better than Sosa has done this year. Sosa has a 755 OPS and an OBP barely above .300.

If Botts can't do better than that, then the Rangers should put him on waivers, because he's a waste of a 40 man roster spot.

by Adam J. Morris on Jun 20, 2007 10:41 PM CDT up reply actions

I agree

But Adam at the end of the day the Scouts see something they don't like (at least I believe or he would be here) and I think that is That Botts can't play in the Majors. Heck he is fine for the Minors...we need guys to fill the ranks unless we have better replacements or hot prospects in his place so fine keep him there.

by simbaa on Jun 20, 2007 10:46 PM CDT up reply actions

Sammy is knocking in a LOT of runs..and doing an .

amazing job with runners in scoring position and even better with 2 strikes with runners in scoring position.. I think maybe all these OBP and OBS..may be well ..Oh B.S.lets not be guilty of being overly technical with the stats .. the bottom line is you want someone who knocks in runs..thats exactly what Sammys role is and hes done that exceedingly well.and he can catch a ball too..imagine that !!.. Botts will not hit no 360 with runners in scoring position..period ! Theres a VERY thick line between triple A and the Majors or he'd of been here already.. look at Nellie ..knocking the cover off the ball but sucking like mad up here...happens all the time.

GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 20, 2007 11:05 PM CDT up reply actions

Sosa

He's played 16 games in the outfield this season.

He's been a DH who occasionally plays in right.

by Adam J. Morris on Jun 20, 2007 11:06 PM CDT up reply actions

no there isnt a VERY thick line

look at how long a lot of AAAA guys have stayed around

look at guys in the past who have been seen as quad A players but have had it "click" -- guys like GMJ

theres a ton of guys who hang around forever shuttling btwn AAA and the majors

botts SHOULD have been called up before. end of story - to say anything else is foolish. to say that the scouts "didtn see what they liked" owuld mean that they should have released/traded him before now.

he needs to be in the majors. end of story.

by knockoutking24 on Jun 20, 2007 11:08 PM CDT up reply actions

I disagree

I think the scouts and GM (daniels and Hart before) hoped Botts would progress further and and least display that he should be up here...but in the end the there is a Thick LINE and he has not even measured up enough to warrant a look.

by simbaa on Jun 20, 2007 11:10 PM CDT up reply actions

The proofs in the pudding...

if he was that wonderful he'd of been here a long time ago.. NEXT !!

GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 20, 2007 11:24 PM CDT up reply actions

Yeah!

And if AGon was any good... wait nevermind.

And if Hafner was any good... wait nevermind again.

by tricer on Jun 21, 2007 12:19 AM CDT up reply actions

id say hes progressed

pretty damn well.

typical late bloomer...

by knockoutking24 on Jun 20, 2007 11:33 PM CDT up reply actions

Dude

He used a corked bat once.

He probably used PEDs like most of the other sluggers of the period.

Get over your hatred.

by tricer on Jun 20, 2007 10:41 PM CDT up reply actions

He was caught once

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 10:44 PM CDT up reply actions

I LOVE SAMMY !!!!!!!

HE ROCKS !!

GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 20, 2007 10:12 PM CDT up reply actions

Not sure about the peeps on this sight

but it seems that many Ranger fans are against the superstar

Maybe we can make a deal at the deadline and get Oil Can Boyd in here!

by rkh on Jun 20, 2007 10:16 PM CDT reply actions

I've watched # 600 several times...

what a special moment for the Rangers and Sammy !
The fans went bonkers.. they love Sammy so much as do the players and management..there were girls actually crying and people just losing it in joy...its a shame theres some that cant give him his due credit for being a baseball legend on and off the field.. I hope he hits # 700 as a Ranger.. Wilk pack your bags .. Botts is on his way !

GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 20, 2007 10:34 PM CDT reply actions

why wilk pack your bags

if you look at stats, hes better than sosa in many categories.

plus...no offense, but im not sure i want the only 1b on our roster to be botts, catt while teix is on the DL...

WHY IS THERE SUCH AN OUTCRY TO RELEASE WILK?

he K's, yes (so does adam dunn fwiw)
he was bad last year (as anyone could see)

but this year he isnt that bad...and who do you replace him with on teh roster? freddy guzman? nelly cruz? COME ON.

OPS+ this year is 92 (EXACTLY the same as sosa)
he has MANY fewer K's than sosa
he has MROE BB's than sosa
higher OBP
almost the same SLUG (.441 for wilk vs .448 for sosa has 11 more runs in 120+ ab's
wilk has hit into fewer DP's
wilk has more SF
HR: sosa-12 in 232+ ab's wilk- 7 HR in 118+ ab's

look at the whole picture. wilk has been at LEAST as good as sosa this season.

by knockoutking24 on Jun 20, 2007 10:58 PM CDT up reply actions

I agree

Don't cut Wilk..

Honestly, forget Botts...if he were worth anything he would be here already. Teams don't hold back Young players that can produce.

Scouts, Daniels, and the team know something we don't...that Botts can't cut it.

I trust the scouts and the team before Adam.

Botts is a fantasy of this site..the great hitter that will be the one to overtake Sosa and and make this team better or at least bearable../Botts has been and will be a failure.

Listen, I am sure Botts is a great guy and he has many productive MINOR league years ahead of him..but teams don't hold back players that can produce at the Major League level, especially teams that are as bad as the Rangers.

by simbaa on Jun 20, 2007 11:07 PM CDT up reply actions

thats a foolish idea

what about teams who already have studs at the position (look at the A"s a few yrs ago with the SS depth of aybar, wood, etc) -- were they "holding" those players back by not promoting them ASAP and endin gup with a bunch of guys at one level?

look at last yr -- aybar did well but they were set at SS already.

equally look at the white sox a few yrs ago w bmac. were they "holding him back" by not putting him in the rotation ASAP?

so the bosox are holding back buchholtz and lester cuz they have a good rotation? or the tigers are holding back a miller cuz they have solid SP?

what abt james loney? do the dodgers think he blows, so they re-signed nomar?

equally, there is NO way to know if botts is good or not (at the ML level) - give him a chance. if he sucks, drop his ass. if not, keep him.

to say that teams intentionally "hold players back" because they "know" that the players arent good is foolish. if they KNOW this, why is the player in the org. in the first place?

by knockoutking24 on Jun 20, 2007 11:15 PM CDT up reply actions

Great Points

But we are talking about the Rangers and their Last Place IN THE MAJORS record. If Botts were any good he would be here.

Botts is not some stud that we have been anticipating for years and just waiting on...he is some tall lanky overratered player (by Adam) that has proven nothing and has players in front of him at the majors that have skins on the wall. Are those skins great no...but you know what Botts would be here if the scouts and Daniels saw ANYTHING....

by simbaa on Jun 20, 2007 11:18 PM CDT up reply actions

So basically

We can't say anything about any move the team makes.

Thanks

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 11:23 PM CDT up reply actions

dude

what is your deal...NO that is not what I am saying.

I am saying that Botts has been talked up to be this player we need to see here and now...and I say that Scouts and Daniels (all things being equal) would have him here if he were any good.

We can say all we want all I am saying is that we have gone way too far on the Botts thing...I personally believe if he were worth anything (heck even a hill of beans)he would be here...he is not and I think that is becuase he is overrated or more to the point...not good enough to be here....

BTw...Jack Cust...great few weeks..but in the end I would not want him on my roster.

by simbaa on Jun 20, 2007 11:26 PM CDT up reply actions

That is exactly what you are saying

Repeatedly.

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 11:28 PM CDT up reply actions

Actually no

that is not what I am saying...I am saying that botts is so overrated it is not even funny.

The fun part about sports and baseball in general is we can debate this but in the end there is a THICK LINE between the Minor and Majors and there is an even THICKER line between the guys in charge of Major League teams and Blog guys like us.

Bott is so ovverrated by so many it is nuts.

by simbaa on Jun 20, 2007 11:37 PM CDT up reply actions

Why you gotta hate?

I am so turned off to your postings now.

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 11:40 PM CDT up reply actions

No problem

since I think that you and I don't see eye to eye.

Maybe I am wrong but the idea behind a blog such as this is to debate things like this.

contrary to your feelings I am not turned off by your posting and I am interested in seeing what you say....but you can feel differently and that is fine.

In the end...yes I think Botts is so ovverated it is not funny.

by simbaa on Jun 20, 2007 11:44 PM CDT up reply actions

why do you think hes so overrated

hes doing pretty well at OKC this year...and last year too.

i think YOUR overrated lol

by knockoutking24 on Jun 20, 2007 11:45 PM CDT up reply actions

By us

He is ovverated by us.

Two different GM Regimes (Hart and Daniels) have had a chance to look at him ...granted Hart was at the tail end of his tenure but many scouts...the guy is what 25? Not sure and for that I feel bad becuase my argument would be stronger if I knew. but in the end if he could cut it he would be here.

I am a Rangers fan from 1984 so I have lived the Ups and Downs...granted I have at least enjoyed many of the good times...but I think if he were worth anything he would be here.

I do think he is ovverrated primarly because unless i am dead wrong (and if I am...tell me) he has had a chance in spring training to show something and he not made the cut and his few AB in the majors have not been overwhelming.

by simbaa on Jun 20, 2007 11:52 PM CDT up reply actions

We thought

Adam Eaton was good. We thought Mario Ramos was going to be good. We thought Chris Young didn't have any upside and would break down. We didn't think Adrian Gonzalez would hit enough to be a DH. We thought Travis Hafner was expendable. We didn't want Michael Young to start at 2b because we didn't think he'd hit enough to be useful.

You say the fact that team hasn't brought him up means he sucks... I say I think the team doesn't know everything.

"The boxing scenes in 'Million Dollar Baby' were so realistic, I initially thought it was a documentary." -Brian Thomas.

by thedirkatron on Jun 21, 2007 5:28 AM CDT up reply actions

"not good enough to be here"

This line of thinking punched tickets out of town for AGon and Hafner.

by tricer on Jun 21, 2007 12:23 AM CDT up reply actions

you do realize

Botts is out of options after this year and Sammy isn't gonna be here next year no matter what?

buffering....

by SteveP on Jun 21, 2007 1:31 AM CDT up reply actions

he has

proven nothing because he has been given no chance to prove anything

my god, we gave matt kata 70 AB's this year and we have given botts ZERO this year and 77 in his career.

he hasnt proven anything because he hasnt been given a chance

remember we gave hafner 82 AB's, the guy hit .240 and i know they are compared a lot (im not - just saying its another young player we gave up on and i dont want to see use give up on any more.

by knockoutking24 on Jun 20, 2007 11:24 PM CDT up reply actions

Don't worry about that

The scouts knew that Hafner sucked so there was no reason to give him more of a chance.

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 11:26 PM CDT up reply actions

exactly

they thought -- 240? and hes 23?

HE WONT EVER LEARN HOW TO HIT!

by knockoutking24 on Jun 20, 2007 11:44 PM CDT up reply actions

Holding back players

http://www.baseball-reference.com/h/howarry01.shtml
http://www.baseball-reference.com/h/hafnetr01.shtml
http://www.baseball-reference.com/c/custja01.shtml

I am certainly not saying Botts is in the same category as these guys but it does happen all the time.

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 11:20 PM CDT up reply actions

Again goodpoints

I will stand corrected, teams do sometimes do stupid things such as holding back or more to the point not seeing how some young players can do..but you know what...the blogworld and has rated Botts on a pedestal and I think I will stick with scouts that know much much more than us....I am stats geek..heck I am a math major and an accounting clerk...but in the end...throw stats out the window...and scouts can see things...Botts does not have it...let him languish in the minors and be happy he can fill that role. Move on.

by simbaa on Jun 20, 2007 11:23 PM CDT up reply actions

Botts on a pedestal

One last thing before I go to sleep. How is saying that Botts can hit better than .240/.300/.440 putting him on a pedestal? I don't think anyone here believes he is the second coming of Frank Thomas. He's a guy who has hit well at AAA and in a year where the team is going nowhere it seems like a logical thing to give him a good look at the major league level to see if he can play or not. If we don't, then we will be having the same discussion next year.

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 11:36 PM CDT up reply actions

We won't next year

becuase Botts will go back to the Minors like he has every year and rightly so.

by simbaa on Jun 20, 2007 11:39 PM CDT up reply actions

And why would that be "rightly so?"

by Athos on Jun 20, 2007 11:55 PM CDT up reply actions

you give scouts

wayyyyy to much credit.

buffering....

by SteveP on Jun 21, 2007 1:32 AM CDT up reply actions

too much

dammit

buffering....

by SteveP on Jun 21, 2007 1:33 AM CDT up reply actions

Holding back players

Edgar Martinez says "hi" too...

"Then I met some friends for a beer, went to a BoDeans's concert, and son of a vondruke, if I didn't leave him at the concert hall."

by RCCook on Jun 21, 2007 9:03 AM CDT up reply actions

i really

hope your not comparing wilkerson to dunn...
since he has almost tripled the amount of home runs that wilky has

by weslyenkid01 on Jun 20, 2007 11:11 PM CDT up reply actions

im saying that

ppl bitch and complain about dunn and wilkerson and their K's while ignoring their other stats

equally ppl ignore certain player stats (ryan howard had the 2nd most in the NL, bill hall 3, jason bay 5, chase utley 8 in K's last year)

by knockoutking24 on Jun 20, 2007 11:20 PM CDT up reply actions

A common thread

between those last guys that you mention and wilk. The other one's produce.

Chris Young/Adrian Gonzalez for Aki Otsuka, the new Sammy Sosa/Wilson Alvarez for Harold Baines

by badradiorules on Jun 21, 2007 10:31 AM CDT up reply actions

If Sammy leaves this team this season

I'll give anyone within driving distance $5.

"Fire Jon Daniels!" Someone has to start it.

by chief on Jun 20, 2007 11:05 PM CDT reply actions

i dont think they will do anything with him

but they need to tell him his role WILL be reduced.

no reason for him to get 500 AB's on a team as god-aweful as the rangers when theres guys like botts/cruz/byrd/diaz we need to find out about.

by knockoutking24 on Jun 20, 2007 11:09 PM CDT up reply actions

sammy

George W looks the fool (Again) way to go Sammy!

by jimy777 on Jun 20, 2007 11:09 PM CDT reply actions

good or bad thing

is this a good or bad thing...I love our country and hate that GW has us pointing south more than north.....at least we have so many great people here so that long-term we will be fine.

by simbaa on Jun 20, 2007 11:12 PM CDT up reply actions

What does Bush have to do with anything?

Milk, milk, lemonade, around the corner fudge is made.

by LoneStarBallUser on Jun 20, 2007 11:13 PM CDT up reply actions

they always find a way to bash him

whose really suprised?

by knockoutking24 on Jun 20, 2007 11:46 PM CDT up reply actions

Yep, poor George!

Always getting bashed for no apparent (ha!) reason. We can only dream that trading Sammy wouldn't even make the Top 100 (1000 maybe) on Georgie's list of fuck-ups!

by tklawless on Jun 21, 2007 10:18 AM CDT up reply actions

Typical liberal exaggeration

I would love to know the hundreds or thousands of f-ups by GWB that you speak of in your post. I'm not even a Bush supporter, but I dont speak filth based on someones party affiliation. Yes, he has made mistakes in hindsight, which we know is 20/20. If you can do any better I expect to see tklawless on the ballot in 08'.

The lemmings are calling tk! The lemmings are calling!

by Ranger914 on Jun 21, 2007 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions

"I'm not even a Bush supporter"

What a ridiculously obvious lie...

I guess you thought by feigning neutrality (the O'Reilly ploy) your assertion would carry more credibility.

"Why wasn't I moved by Million Dollar Baby? Because I have no soul, that's why." The Dirkatron, movie hater

by Brian Thomas on Jun 24, 2007 7:43 PM CDT up reply actions

Bush

Someone asked W what is your biggest regret. He said that trading Sammy Sosa while owner of the Rangers was his biggest regret.

Derek S

Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!

by DerekSTheRed on Jun 21, 2007 7:43 AM CDT up reply actions

agree with that

is it a stretch to think that maybe sammy could help botts...course i donno how much sammy wants to do that

by weslyenkid01 on Jun 20, 2007 11:13 PM CDT reply actions

well

at least we have more comments in this thread than the game-day thread.

BTw...i agre Bush has NOTHING to do with this thread of anything. He had no idea what he was doing when we traded Sosa...heck he was probably partying too hard to even realize he made a trade :)

by simbaa on Jun 20, 2007 11:15 PM CDT reply actions

It is not hate

to point out that Sosa is not helping this team a whole lot and it's a waste of time for him to be a Ranger. How is that hateful? It is an objective analysis of the team's needs. If you say you think Sosa has value to this team, I wouldn't call you a "Sosa lover", I would just say your viewpoint is different.

Just because you disagree with Adam's viewpoint, and that of many others here, does not mean that anyone espousing that view is hateful.

by t ball on Jun 20, 2007 11:56 PM CDT up reply actions

T Ball you are right

To say that those that don't like Sosa are Sosa Haters...but the distate for Sosa is nuts......listen I would love to see young players here but who is better.

You want to see Botts flail away at the Major league level and make us even a bigger laughinstock...yeah...that is what I want to see

I sosa this great thing...no, not at all. Generally I Like Sosa but I Like the Rangers more and want to see them at least respectable if not contending..

However, Botts in my opinion ONLY is not the answer...if he were anything at all he would had some significant at-bats already..he has not and I think becuase scouts and GM's have seen something.

We can talk about how he has been held back but now it is being held back by TWO different GM's (Hart and Daniels) and two Different Manageers (Buck and Washington).

I would love to say and hope that Botts is a contributable player at this level.

by simbaa on Jun 21, 2007 12:03 AM CDT up reply actions

he's being

held back because every year they lie to us and say we have shot of contending for the divison...how can they say that with botts in the lineup and actually expect us to believe. They can't, so we always bring in a guy like Phil Nevin or sammy, whcih im glad they did bc i love sammy and want him to do well and have him prove hes worth something. Now that he has trade him for something and lets atleast see if Botts can do anything up here

by weslyenkid01 on Jun 21, 2007 12:08 AM CDT up reply actions

Still

I'm on the fence a little bit on this topic. However, while I think its silly to drink the Kool-Aid on Sosa, I also think its silly to say that he is not helping this team. That's taking it a little far.

He is, whether you like him or not, the only reason that this team is relavent at all. I know that is not the goal, but it is somewhat important.

I know that everybody loves peripheral stats and everything, but if he continues to produce runs the way he is, he is very valuable.

I don't think that a team should just throw in the towel and throw kids out there that lose 120 games. They do have a responsibility to be competitive. What is more competitive, a guy that is on pace to drive in 120 runs hitting cleanup or Marlon Byrd.

I still don't feel really strong on whether to keep him around, or whether I enjoy this feat, or if he's good for this team, but he isn't worthless as some of you contend, OPS be damned.

Chris Young/Adrian Gonzalez for Aki Otsuka, the new Sammy Sosa/Wilson Alvarez for Harold Baines

by badradiorules on Jun 21, 2007 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions

I was at the game

That was a very fun two minutes.

by cstorm15 on Jun 20, 2007 11:20 PM CDT reply actions

Me, too......Great moment!

by tklawless on Jun 21, 2007 10:19 AM CDT up reply actions

im jealous

because i have tickets tomorrow...now that sammy hit #600 what else do i have to look forward to?

by weslyenkid01 on Jun 20, 2007 11:25 PM CDT reply actions

you can watch Wilk stike out a few times..

at least they'll be a nice breeze :)

GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 20, 2007 11:27 PM CDT up reply actions

or you can watch

the guys who have more K's on the team than he does

laird, kinsler, m young, sosa

guys sosa is 3rd in the AL in K's - wilkerson is in a tie for 68th (including ties)

also turn on a phillies or a marlins broadcast -- they K all the damn time.

last year: wilkerson had 116 k's (10th place in ML: swisher with 152, 10th place in the AL: inge/teix with 128) wilkerson was tied for 17th in the AL

by knockoutking24 on Jun 20, 2007 11:54 PM CDT up reply actions

wilky

has been hurt alot...and wilky doesn't have 52 rbi's...dont compare wifferson with sosa.

by weslyenkid01 on Jun 20, 2007 11:56 PM CDT up reply actions

he has a lot fewer AB's (over 120)

he has overall, been JUST AS GOOD as sosa

and RBI's have everything to do with where you hit.

by knockoutking24 on Jun 20, 2007 11:57 PM CDT up reply actions

no when the

whole lineup sucks, wilky was behind byrd a couple spots tonight and he's been pur hotest hitter...WILKY IS HITTING .222. He sucks and by time were good again he'll suck even more

by weslyenkid01 on Jun 21, 2007 12:01 AM CDT up reply actions

guys

repeat after me.

average. is. not. everything.

by knockoutking24 on Jun 21, 2007 12:27 AM CDT up reply actions

of course Sosa has a lot more K's....

hes also batted a lot more times..dont forget that tiny detail..and last year Wilkerson had 116K's in not too many at bats.. it would be fine if he was a power hitter or drove in a lot of runs..but he DOESNT !Sosa is one of the most prolific power hitters EVER..dont compare that slouch wilkerson to Sosa.. there is no comparison.. Wilk is and always will be an average to below average player.. he had maybe one good year in 2004..Sammy had hit more home runs in any 5,6,7, 8, 9 or 10 year period in the history of the game..dont tarnish his legend comparing him to that SCRUB wifferson..

GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 12:39 AM CDT up reply actions

Aaron Bonds Mays Ruth and our...

SLAMMIN SAMMY !! WOO HOO you go SAMMY .. you're taking the headlines tonight..check out the ESPN sports page..what a tribute to a true legend !

GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 20, 2007 11:30 PM CDT reply actions

thank god

which names do you guys like better...wilkkkerson or wifferson?

by weslyenkid01 on Jun 20, 2007 11:30 PM CDT reply actions

How about... .. you've been released.....

Son ?

GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 20, 2007 11:32 PM CDT reply actions

they all work

what about nate gold...dont you think we'd be better off with him at first then wilky? correct me if im wrong

by weslyenkid01 on Jun 20, 2007 11:35 PM CDT reply actions

YES ...

I'd love to see Nate Gold at first.. Wilk has sucked from day one and he isnt getting any better.. still hitting .220 like last year and striking out in record numbers..so yeh since this is officially a rebuilding program out with the SCRUBS and in with the STUDS !

GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 20, 2007 11:40 PM CDT up reply actions

no

the front office doesnt think he can cut it evidently

by knockoutking24 on Jun 20, 2007 11:41 PM CDT up reply actions

Not really directed at you

but, we believe them on Gold, but not on Botts?

Chris Young/Adrian Gonzalez for Aki Otsuka, the new Sammy Sosa/Wilson Alvarez for Harold Baines

by badradiorules on Jun 21, 2007 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions

look

botts has proven he SHOULD have a chance to play here:

.307, 24 2b, 2 3b, 6 hr, 50 RBI, 52 bb, 72 SO, .421 obp, .490 SLG, .911 OPS

tied for lead in 2b, leads league iN BB, 3rd in OBP

id say on a team as "bad as the rangers" this should warrent brining him up no matter what the scouts/front office say or see.

by knockoutking24 on Jun 20, 2007 11:40 PM CDT reply actions

yeh but everytime he trys to catch ..

a ball it hits him in the face.. we need guys who can play DEFENSE too... not some unproven one dimensional player whos a liability in the field.. he can only dream of being a SAMMY .. someday...like thats gonna happen..LOL

GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 20, 2007 11:46 PM CDT up reply actions

umm

sosa isnt exactly a gold glover out there (neither was kata, dero, diaz)

by knockoutking24 on Jun 20, 2007 11:55 PM CDT up reply actions

agree with all of that

leave metcalf at third too, vasquez is just taking time away from travis...kinda the same with wilky and botts or gold, although botts's place is most likely taken by sammy but we should'nt have to worry about that anymore

by weslyenkid01 on Jun 20, 2007 11:47 PM CDT reply actions

Yeh ..Sammy has got a few more years in him..

and I hope its with the Rangers.. people love him..(well most do) he missed all that time..was considered a has been and he comes back and possibly knocks in 120 runs this year.. on a sad sack of a team with guys in slumps all hitting in front of him ... how many ribbies would he have if young, cat, lofton and others had actually been on base..he'd be leading the league or close to it.. he can do this for years to come and play some field too here and there.. I'd love to see him hit # 700 as a Ranger.. hes major headline news tonight.. the Rangers need more of that kind of exposure instead of how pathetic they are as a team..thats gotten tired REAL QUICK .. GO SAMMY !!

GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 20, 2007 11:56 PM CDT reply actions

Ron Washington

Will see to it Sosa gets plenty of playing time the rest of the season!

One of his rare good moves as manager..

Cool Hilary in hi-def (needs divx)

by Sharky on Jun 21, 2007 12:17 AM CDT reply actions

Agreed !

Sammy could hit another 20 homers still this year and begin the steam roll to 700 !!!

GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 12:41 AM CDT up reply actions

Coward

Lick by lick, mountains erode

by RangerMoto on Jun 21, 2007 11:12 AM CDT up reply actions

Great!

Sammy hits and rounded-number of homers. Now for some DL time.

buffering....

by SteveP on Jun 21, 2007 1:35 AM CDT reply actions

Is it possible that Sosa might get a little better

since he broke 600 and now doesnt have to concentrate on hitting a hr every at bat? Just a thought although who's to say that it's going to change his approach. But I have to say, I see Sosa as 2 different players this year. One, a guy who when given the opportunity to help himself out with a hr, he will go for it. But then another guy who will help his team with a single to drive in a run when there's runners in scoring position (.350 average with RISP). So despite his underwhelming OPS, he has been pretty clutch and the RBI's have not been inflated purely by oportunity. He's just cashed in.

by slimshadty12 on Jun 21, 2007 1:40 AM CDT reply actions

YEH I think Sosas avg will go back up to where ..

it was ..since hes not pressing for the long ball ... like he has been the last few weeks closing in on 600... I think he'll be a lot more relaxed and hit a bunch more homers too...GO SAMMY !

GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 1:47 AM CDT up reply actions

Hey Simbaa

Could you say again your view on botts, and the scouts seeing something we dont?

Because I lost count around the 12th time you said it.

Can you imagine saying something that dumb, 12 times in one single diary? I mean, you my friend really are trying to climb past Hurley on the pecking order.

by TexGoesYard on Jun 21, 2007 9:01 AM CDT reply actions

Regarding Botts and Sosa..

I after reading this thread (and taking asprin for the headache), I figured I would chime in with my opinion.

No problem with celebrating Sosa's 600. He probably juiced, but Brady Anderson probably did as well and he, among many others, didn't come close to 600. In my opinion, it's a great baseball accomplishment, so enjoy the moment in an otherwise un-enjoyable season.
The point with Botts isn't if he's better than / worse than , etc. in comparison to Sosa, et al. The point is that he hasn't had a large enough sample size at the major league level to know if he's a valuable commodity or not. When a team is this far out of it, continuing to give AB's to a guy who has ZERO % chance of being part of the next decent Ranger team is useless. With Botts, there may only be a 5% chance that he's a meaningful contributor in the future, but 5% is better than the 0% that Sosa gives you.
Scouts may know a bit more about baseball than most of us, but there are only a handful that really, truly have an eye for tallent. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem that they are in the employ of Tom Hicks. The same scouts who may be of the opinion that Botts can't cut it (and thought that AGON and Hafner couldn't either) are the same scouts that give opinions on 50+ rounds of draft picks that never pan out to be worth anything.

Jeff Henn is an idiot.

by Red Shoe Fan on Jun 21, 2007 10:19 AM CDT reply actions

Wrapup

To all that have contributed and read this diary i will start with an apology. I was taught long ago that if you do or say something that you should change or alter then do it as soon as possible.

My views on Botts still hold but there is no reason to mention that fact (any my reasoning) more than a couple of times. Everyone here after reading my thoughts a couple of times will get it.

I was only trying to state my point of view and in the haste of responding to others comments I came back to my same reasoning and explanation.

In the end, I am a Rangers fan first and want to see them win and win as much as possible. I also want to be given great reasons to watch (which include winning but also watching good baseball, good players giving their all, etc.). I have stated my point on Botts and that is that. I do wish him well and hope as a Rangers fan he can produce at the Major League level but for now I will take Sosa primarily becuase in this miserable season thus far he is one reason to watch.

I know that is a short-term point of view (long-term would give Botts AB and see if he can stick at the Major League level) but sometimes as a fan that is what we have.

I hope and believe that Daniels has the long-term view in mind and that no matter what we will see Botts here this year and he will be given his chance. At that point at least some of our questions will be answered.

With that I am done (on this topic) at least.

by simbaa on Jun 21, 2007 9:26 PM CDT reply actions

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Lone Star Ball -

Sammy hits 600

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