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On Sosa, Wilkerson, and Botts

So we had #600 yesterday, and there are warm and fuzzy stories about Sammy Sosa and how he's revitalized his career in Texas, and all that.

Meh.  Maybe I'm cold-hearted, maybe I'm a bad baseball fan, but I just didn't care.  He isn't any greater of a hitter, any more or less HOF worthy, now that he's at 600 than he would have been if he hadn't come back and had retired with 588 homers.  Watching that yesterday didn't do anything for me, other than make me relieved that we were done with barrage of "Sammy is just __ homers away!!!" coverage, and hopeful that we'll see Jason Botts soon.

And to reiterate something I've said before, now that the 600 watch is done, and the Rangers are out of the race, I think the Rangers should trade him to a team that wants him, and if they can't trade him, release him.  There's no point in him continuing to be on this team.

There have been a plethora of responses to suggestions that the Rangers should let Sammy go, and I want to reply to some of them:

You can't release Sammy -- he's done better than anyone could have expected.

Sammy is hitting .242/.297/.458 on the season.  If that's better than the Rangers expected him to hit when they made him their regular DH when the season started, then put me on the fire JD/Washington bandwagon.  

A guy with a sub-.300 OBP, an OPS+ of 93, and an EQA of .254 is not a quality major league DH.  He hasn't been good this year.

As a point of comparison...Ian Kinsler, who seems to be viewed as a massive disappointment, a guy who some are clamoring to be sent to the minors, has a .271 EQA this season.  

If the .271 EQA second baseman is a disappointment, then the .254 EQA DH isn't a rousing success story.

If you want to release someone, release WilKKKKKKKerson/Whifferson, he's worse than Sammy, and all he does is strike out.

Well, first of all, Wilkerson is playing first base right now while Mark Teixeira is out (and Teixeira supposedly won't be back for another month).  You don't have a ton of other options to play first base right now, particularly if Jason Botts' back makes playing first base problematic.

But secondly, Wilkerson has been better than Sosa this year.  Wilkerson has a .264 EQA, compared to a .254 EQA for Sosa.  His line of .225/.319/.450 is better than Sosa's .242/.297/.458, as evidence by his 98 OPS+ (compared to Sosa's 93 OPS+).  His RC/27 is 4.98, versus Sosa's 4.65.  

And strikeouts?  Sosa has K'd once every 3.76 plate appearances, while Wilkerson has K'd once every 3.92 plate appearanecs -- Sosa is striking out more frequently than Wilkerson this year.

Sosa is SUPPOSED to strike out -- he's a power hitter.  Wilkerson doesn't hit enough homers to justify his strikeout totals.

I don't believe that the underlying premise -- that strikeouts are only acceptable if you hit for power -- but nevertheless...

Sosa's slugging percentage is 8 points higher than Wilkerson's.  Wilkerson's Isolated Power is 225, to 216 for Sosa.  

And remarkably, Wilkerson has averaged a homer once every 20.14 plate appearances this season, while Sosa has a homer ever 21.33 plate appearances this season.  Wilkerson is homering more often than Sosa.

You are just defending Whiffy because you liked the Soriano trade.

No, I'm defending Wilkerson because he's been a better player than Sosa this year.

That said, I don't have a huge problem if the Rangers decided to release Wilkerson tomorrow and call up Botts, rather than release Sosa, although I think Sosa should be axed first, given that Wilkerson, playing first base, isn't really blocking Botts, while Sosa, who has been the DH in the majority of Ranger games this year, is blocking Botts.

But if you release Wilkerson now to make room for Botts, that's fine.

However, I do think there are a couple of things that mitigate in favor of Wilkerson sticking around.

First is the fact that I think Wilkerson is going to be easier to trade.  Sosa is a DH.  He's played just 16 games in the field, and Ron Washington has said that he doesn't want to play Sosa out there too much because he's afraid he'll wear down, and the perception is that Sosa isn't going to be able to play the field regularly.  Wilkerson is viewed as more versatile defensively.

Also, Wilkerson is the type of patient, work-the-count hitter that a lot of teams are valuing more, and have been attempting to obtain the past couple of years.  Sosa...not so much.

This isn't to say that Wilkerson is going to bring back something huge in a trade.  But I think there will be more of a market for Wilkerson than for Sosa.

Wilkerson's contract also makes him more desirable to hold onto and try to trade.  Wilkerson gets $4.5 million even if he's released.  Sosa gets $500K and a few incentives if he's released.  If a team is willing to take Wilkerson, and send nothing back but another Jason Fransz or Steve Shoemaker, that still results in saving a couple of million dollars.

How can you get rid of the guy that is leading the team in RBIs?

Because the RBIs are pretty much irrelevant.  Sosa isn't hitting well.

Look at Pedro Feliz last year.  He had 98 RBIs, despite an awful .244/.281/.428 line.  No one would credibly argue that he was driving in runs and thus deserved to stay in the lineup for the Giants...why do that for Sosa?

RBIs are largely a function of opportunity.  Sosa has more ABs, by far, with runners in scoring position than any other Ranger.  He should be leading the team in RBIs.  But it doesn't change the fact that he's not been very good this year.

Sosa may not be great, but Jason Botts probably wouldn't hit any better than Sosa.

If Jason Botts isn't capable of putting up at least a .254 EQA and a .242/.297/.458 line in the majors right now, then the Rangers should have waived him, rather than Daniel Haigwood, in April.  If Botts can't hit that well, there's no point keeping him on the 40 man roster.

Of course, looking at his minor league numbers, there's no reason to believe he can't hit that well.  That's why it is so baffling that, with a last place team whose season is already over, he isn't being given the opportunity over the last few months of the season.

Sosa is an outfielder and can play defense -- Jason Botts doesn't even know how to use a glove.

No question, Botts isn't a very good defensive player.  He's a sub-par defensive outfieder.  

But does that really make much difference, in comparison to Sammy Sosa?  Sosa has DH'd 43 times this season, and played in the field 16 times.  Like Botts, he's a DH who is going to play some outfield occasionally.  They fill the exact same roles.

There are ABs available for the Rangers the rest of the year at the DH slot.  Botts should be getting them, not Sosa.

If Botts were really that good, the Rangers would be playing him already.

The problem with that argument is that the Rangers also thought Adrian Gonzalez couldn't hit well enough to be a good first baseman.  They thought Travis Hafner was a AAAA slugger.  They thought Adam Eaton was better than Chris Young.  They thought Matt Kata was a better option than Marlon Byrd coming out of spring training.  They thought Jamey Wright and his "electric stuff" deserved the #5 starter role.

And you know, maybe Botts won't be that good.  Maybe he's a AAAA slugger, a guy who won't ever hit in the majors.  

But now's the time to find that out.  Botts is going to be out of options next year, and the Rangers are going to need a DH next year.

There's no point in continuing to give a guy who isn't going to be part of the next good Rangers team ABs, when they could be going to Botts, a guy who at least has a chance of being a contributor when the Rangers are in the playoff hunt again.

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Only Sharky is qualified
to make an appropriate response, like "I hate Adam Morris so much".

However, the thought that we need Whifferson rather than Sosa because Whifferson can play 1B neglects the fact that Whifferson isn't very good at 1B, Cat could probably play 1B, and so probably could Sosa.  Just about any ballplayer can play 1B, hell even Frank Thomas played 1B.

As far as which player is better, it changes week to week.  Next week, my money is on Sosa.

My money on who has better trade value is also Sosa.

Mitt Romney should "get out his small-varmint gun and drive those Guatemalans off his lawn" -- Sen John McCain

by DJCahill on Jun 21, 2007 12:23 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

sosa cannot play 1st base
why would you even say that.

Cat has played first base already so I guess you could play him.  but is cat better than wilkerson?

Forget Johnny Bench, we got Gerry "the Jet" Laird

by ab03 on Jun 21, 2007 12:33 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Why can't he?
Stick a 1B glove on him.  It's not like Wilkerson is some Gold Glove 1B.  1B is where a lot of OFs go to die.  The only reason not to put Sosa at 1B, is that his arm still functions, so he can still play RF.

I've seen Frank Thomas play 1B, I've seen Giambi  play 1B, Ive seen Wilkerson play 1B.  I doubt Sosa will be the worst 1B I've seen. I mean, its not like he'll be Matt Kata at 3B.

Mitt Romney should "get out his small-varmint gun and drive those Guatemalans off his lawn" -- Sen John McCain

by DJCahill on Jun 21, 2007 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i mean
i guess techncially the argument that if wilkerson can do it, sosa can do it is as good as any.  but, that would go back to the fact that washington doesn't want sosa to play the field every day.  
Forget Johnny Bench, we got Gerry "the Jet" Laird

by ab03 on Jun 21, 2007 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I have no idea
why Washington doesn't want to see Sosa in the field.  He actually doesn't look horrible in right in his limited opportunities.
Mitt Romney should "get out his small-varmint gun and drive those Guatemalans off his lawn" -- Sen John McCain

by DJCahill on Jun 21, 2007 1:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

1B vs. LF vs. DH
If his defense is truly awful, doesn't it make sense to give him the fewest possible chances to impact play there?  At 1B he is going to touch the ball many many more times than he would in LF, and obviously the safest thing to do is stick him at DH.

by t ball on Jun 21, 2007 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You're missing one
The PR nightmare that would follow by ridding the team of Sosa.  Did you see how many people were at that game last night?  I know most of them were there to see #600, but do you really think the casual baseball fan is going to stop going to games?

I don't.  I think it drives attendance up even more.  Water cooler talk is probably "Well, the Rangers have Sosa, a HOFer-in-waiting.  He's only the 5th player to ever have 600 homers."

From a business standpoint, Sosa is a great investment.  He puts butts in seats and generates media attention (though I expect that to die down now).  

"Fire Jon Daniels!" Someone has to start it.

by chief on Jun 21, 2007 12:29 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

exactly
Right now sosa is a huge cash cow for Hicks, he is going to make much more off sosa than the cost of his contract. He's going to milk it for all it's worth... #600 merch, increased ticket sales, and they already mentioned a sammy sosa night at the end of  july to commemorate the home run.

Like it or not I think sosa is here to stay the rest of the year... Hicks would not want to get bad PR or lose all the free publicity he is getting.

Also, I think a fair argument could be made that Cat is blocking Botts as much or more than sosa.

"Pimps be damned, it's harder out here for a Rangers fan!" "If you don't throw strikes first, you're last."

by rentz on Jun 21, 2007 12:37 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree with you guys
The only reason Sosa was ever on this team was for PR and selling tickets, and to release him right after he made 600, that looks real  hypocritical, and money-hungry...I don't think he will get released.  Not that Hicks isn't hypocritical or money-hungry, he just doesn't want to look like it, it's all PR!!!
"I am in a world of shit" Full Metal Jacket

by SanDiegoKev on Jun 21, 2007 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

then the worst possible
scenario when Sosa was signed will come to fruition.
buffering....

by SteveP on Jun 21, 2007 12:57 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Judging by...
...what I heard on WGN as the crowd reaction to good plays by the visiting team, the majority of fans at the game last night were bandwagon Cubs fans.
Lick by lick, mountains erode

by RangerMoto on Jun 21, 2007 12:38 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah
the vast majority of that crowd were rooting for the cubs, but I think almost everyone was pulling for sammy.. ton's of those cubs fans had sosa shirts and jerseys on.

Btw, i HATE feeling like a fan of the visiting team in my teams own ballpark, its just sad.

"Pimps be damned, it's harder out here for a Rangers fan!" "If you don't throw strikes first, you're last."

by rentz on Jun 21, 2007 12:39 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

if
a fairly marginal amount of money stands in the way of evaluating player development, that should be your battle cry to get hicks to sell the team.
Forget Johnny Bench, we got Gerry "the Jet" Laird

by ab03 on Jun 21, 2007 12:38 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Thank You !!
Details Details... just what we dont need is crowds of 10,000 a night.. tha's what we'd be seeing on a regular basis without Sosa on the team..Brad Wifferson isnt going to bring in the crowds unless they're looking for a nice cool breeze from his bat.. fans arent bringing in their cameras to take pics of Wilk missing a ball...trust me..you can see that any ole time.. with his measly home run and Rbi totals to boot.
hes a classic punch and judy hitter...certainly
no slugger .. SAMMY packs em in...don't forget the simple philosophy that if you dont have fans coming to your games you cant pay a decent salary.. and you're left with a team of AAA players like Jason Botts whos a nightmare with a glove..does he even own one ? you'd think after all these years of minor leagues he'd of learned something..the fact that he hasnt is a HUGE RED FLAG..
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 12:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

nice cool breeze
so, was it just that adam's post was too long, or that you just don't understand words and number put together?

because tell me exactly how you missed the part about how sosa strikes out more than wilkerson?

Forget Johnny Bench, we got Gerry "the Jet" Laird

by ab03 on Jun 21, 2007 12:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

and apparently you dont get that..
Sosa hits a lot better in the clutch that Wilk.. and is hitting 20 something points highter..
and has twice as many homer and rbi's which part of that do YOU not understand ?? and is a baseball legend.. wilk only dreams of being where sosa has been ! got it? get  it ? GOOD !! better late than never :)
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 12:49 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wilk is an non entity...
always has been from day one.. he comes and he goes ..rarely wins a game for ya.. doesnt have much power...doesnt drive in many runs..hits .220 both years.. strikes out contsntly.. NOW you get it ?
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 12:51 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i guess
i am the retard for continually arguing with a dumbass.  I know this.  I just don't know why i keep doing it.  in the face of that many stats, that much evidence, to continually repeat these baseless statements without actually arguing anything...
Forget Johnny Bench, we got Gerry "the Jet" Laird

by ab03 on Jun 21, 2007 12:57 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

20 points higher, RBI's, HR's
counting stats, Batting average - yawn.

they both suck equally this year.  

Forget Johnny Bench, we got Gerry "the Jet" Laird

by ab03 on Jun 21, 2007 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I hear you
on most of the argument that they are equally as bad, but you can't ignore the fact that he is not just driving in more runs, he's driving in WAY more runs.

I'm sorry statheads, that has value.  I just don't think that Wilk is capable of that.  I know that I'm in the minority on that.

Chris Young/Adrian Gonzalez for Aki Otsuka, the new Sammy Sosa/Wilson Alvarez for Harold Baines

by badradiorules on Jun 21, 2007 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

well
think about it this way.  you want to bring botts up.  The point is, do you want botts to replace sosa or botts to replace wilkerson.  the argument could be made that botts can't replace wilkerson because of his 1b defense but he could replace sosa because his minor league numbers suggest he can and he doesn't really have to replace much defense.

so, even if you think sosa is better, I dont' think he's so much better that you need to have both bats in your lineup.

really, those people in favor of sosa, is it because you want the rangers to win?  and if so, why?  the season is over.  if it is just a matter of principle, that you think sosa is better than wilkerson, than i think the 1b thing is more imporant.  

Forget Johnny Bench, we got Gerry "the Jet" Laird

by ab03 on Jun 21, 2007 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I hear you
but, that's where I part ways with Wash.  Sosa should play RF 2 of every 3 days with Botts DHing.  With the other day rotated as a day off for Sosa or Sosa DH with Botts playing RF.  

However, this is where Cat clogs things up, who by the way, should be blasted as much or more on this blog than Sammy or Wilk.  Look at the bang to buck ratio on that guy.  And like I said below, I'll be interested to see if his number take an upswing now that the 600 cloud is out from over his head.

I didn't say get rid of either, but obviously if you can get something for either send them off.  I just think its crazy on this site that somehow the OPS stat is the difinitive end all for hitters.  

Chris Young/Adrian Gonzalez for Aki Otsuka, the new Sammy Sosa/Wilson Alvarez for Harold Baines

by badradiorules on Jun 21, 2007 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

To be fair
Wilkerson has been hurt much of this season, so we are dealing with a fairly small sample size.

As a Ranger Wilk has K'd once every 3.25 plate appearances which is far worse than Sosa's once every 3.76.

by tricer on Jun 21, 2007 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

hasn't learned something
yup.  we should trade him to cleveland for a spare catcher.

but that's probably too subtle for you.

Forget Johnny Bench, we got Gerry "the Jet" Laird

by ab03 on Jun 21, 2007 12:46 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Water cooler talk
is more like, "Ranger suck, again. When's Cowboy's camp start?"
buffering....

by SteveP on Jun 21, 2007 12:52 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Probably both
but, eh, it doesn't matter now, i guess..

by Longhorn on Jun 21, 2007 12:46 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

response to the post
i think your only valid point is the 1b thing.  but, i can see them waiting until tex comes back to dfa wilkerson.  i don't see any urgency being attached to trying to get botts playing time.

but i agree with dan that whether sosa is better than fluctuates way too much week to week to definitively say one is better than the other.  flip a coin, they both suck.

although, it might be hard to carry both botts and sosa on your roster (2 guys with defensive liabilities)

Forget Johnny Bench, we got Gerry "the Jet" Laird

by ab03 on Jun 21, 2007 12:51 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

who cares...
...about defensive liabilities?  The goal for this team the rest of the way should not be to win games.  If they have to keep Sosa, why not just bring up Botts and platoon them DH/OF?
Lick by lick, mountains erode

by RangerMoto on Jun 21, 2007 12:52 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

well
you still have to put someone out there who can catch the ball and throw the ball.  i would think that the only way they bring up botts is as a full time DH, in that if he's nto DH'ng, he's sitting.
Forget Johnny Bench, we got Gerry "the Jet" Laird

by ab03 on Jun 21, 2007 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think
it will be very interesting to see if Sosa's numbers will go up now that he doesn't have the 600 cloud hanging over his head.  Nobody seems to mention that.  Again, I don't feel strongly one way or the other on the Sosa topic, but maybe he's been pressing the last couple of weeks.

Maybe now he will start swinging the bat a little better.  Wilk just sucks, maybe Sosa will get better the next couple of weeks and have trade value.

If Wilk has value, trade him for a bucket of BP balls.

Chris Young/Adrian Gonzalez for Aki Otsuka, the new Sammy Sosa/Wilson Alvarez for Harold Baines

by badradiorules on Jun 21, 2007 12:55 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

For the most part good points, but....
"No, I'm defending Wilkerson because he's been a better player than Sosa this year."

Well, thats an outright lie.  You wernt positive about sosa when he was top 5 in HR/RBI for a while.  You wernt positive about him when his ops was in the upper 800s.  Hell, a mere THREE DAYS ago, if you had made this post wilkerson would have had a lower OPS and a higher strikeout rate for gods sake.

And please, a .014 ops difference is completely irrelevant.  Wilk has 120 at bats.  When sosa has 120 at bats, he had a .870 ops.  If he goes 0 for 4 today and sosa goes 2 for 4 he will probably leapfrog him.

Obviously you have the right to support one player over another, but come on your being against sosa does not revolve around wilkerson having a very slight edge in a couple stats over the past few days.  For the vast majority of the season on the days theyve both been on the roster, sosa had better numbers and thats just a fact.

"First is the fact that I think Wilkerson is going to be easier to trade."

If Wilkerson is easier to trade, how does that promote keeping him around longer?  If hes easier to trade, trade him and viola, hes not around longer.  I mean what, are we talking like 2 weeks it might take to trade him keeping botts down as a reason to just cut loose sosa TOMORROW apparently?  Even if we DFA'd Sosa, you surely know its not going to be in the next week.  Its just not, rather its logical or not the rangers simply arnt going to do that.

So yeah.. if wilkerson is more desirable in a trade and to trade from the rangers in a money saving perspective... then trade him over the next couple weeks, sosa isnt leaving before then anyway.

But, i do have to alter some of the things ive been saying for the 1b thing.  If botts cant even play 1b at a below average level without hurting himself (which is ridiculous), then yes that means wilkerson is needed more then i thought because the rangers dont really have anyone else to play there while tex is gone, especially if hes traded.

So yeah, this 1b situation probably means that sosa should go instead of wilkerson.  

But, thats not happening for a while.  Here is where we move to reality.  There were over 40 thousand people on a tuesday and wednesday night for the team with teh worst record in the mlb.  Obviously taht was a one shot bonus, but i believe i heard attendance has been up a bit all season despite the record.  Sosa is bringing in at least a few fans.  If youve got two not great hitting esentially DH's that it really doesnt matter who you keep, and one has fan appeal, hes the one getting kept.

And ill comment on the rbi.  RBIs are not meaningless.  They mean hes produced runs.  Those runs wernt imaginary.  The guy has a .987 ops with runners in scoring position, THATS why he has all those RBIs.

If you think thats a fluke then you can look at his overall numbers and say that we just got lucky with timely production and from this point forward he probably wont produce those runs so they can be ignored for future production, fine.. but don try to erase what he did.  Michael Young racked up RBIs in years past by hitting far better with RISP than in general and got all the credit in the world for it.  

It may have been by pure luck, but sosa HAS been a productive run producer for the rangers and deserves credit for it.

SOOOOOOOOOO............ if 1b wernt an issue id still say trade/release wilk over sosa.

But if the rangers really dont have any other 1b options (i really cant believe botts cant play 1b without injury problems), then i guess wilk is more important now.  I havnt checked on nate gold lately but i imagine he isnt really enough of a prospect to just bring up and stick in there for half a season regardless of production.

by DSheppard on Jun 21, 2007 12:57 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

BINGO !!
you got that right D Shep !
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 12:59 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

*1 note
i want to clarify that if the rangers decide getting rid of Sosa is the best way to get botts playing time, i will not complain at all.

and i do not think sosa has been a particularly good DH.

i just happen to be more entertained by it and think he hasnt been as bad as some otehrs on here do.  and dont think our other options have been that great.  i mean for the first whatever ammount of time botts was doing quite poorly in AAA.  But yeah.. i do tihnk he HAS to play at least the entire part of the season after the all star break, and if Sosa has to go for that, thats fine.

by DSheppard on Jun 21, 2007 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Did ya see the Sammy Sosa hour .. uhmmm I mean ..
ESPN last night.. the commentators across the board raving about what a great season Sammy is having...they seem to GET IT... funny how they didnt mention a word about Brad Wilkerson.. but his name may come up later in his carerr if he ever breaks the all time strike out record...LOL.. if you're gonna strike out a lot at least be a slugger so you look good doing it..
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 12:58 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Seriously?
You're using ESPN as an example of intelligent baseball analysis?

Sosa's not having a great season, or even a very good one. He's making outs over 70% of the time. Yes, he's hit well with RISP, but if he's got a 988 OPS with RISP, and a 755 OPS overall, what does that tell you about his at-bats when he's not hitting with runners on second and/or third?

A DH with a 755 OPS, and a sub-300 OBP, is a sub-par performer for his position.

"Then I met some friends for a beer, went to a BoDeans's concert, and son of a vondruke, if I didn't leave him at the concert hall."

by RCCook on Jun 21, 2007 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sosa trade
He would trade for Sosa?  For any team to trade for Sosa that team would have to be
  1. In the AL so he can DH
  2. Still in a divisional or wild card race
  3. Need an upgrade at DH
That leaves the Angels, Mariners, A's, and Twins.  Do you still think we can trade Sosa?  I don't.

Derek S

Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!

by DerekSTheRed on Jun 21, 2007 12:59 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

he = who
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!

by DerekSTheRed on Jun 21, 2007 12:59 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think
it will be easier to trade Sosa than Wilkerson.

If I needed a bat to hit lefties, I'd think about Sosa.

I don't think the Rangers will get a ton for either, but I certainly would try to move one before bringing up Botts, given how depleted our high minors are.

Mitt Romney should "get out his small-varmint gun and drive those Guatemalans off his lawn" -- Sen John McCain

by DJCahill on Jun 21, 2007 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

RBI's are meaningless !!!
hmm... i thought the object of the game was to score more runs then your opponent.. so that makes ERA meaningless as well..that comment in itself is quite funny really.. hehe
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 1:01 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

so the whole pedro feliz thing
you got lost at that point?

RBI's are meaningless when comparing one guy to another.  

Forget Johnny Bench, we got Gerry "the Jet" Laird

by ab03 on Jun 21, 2007 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yep
And to score runs, you have to not make outs, which Sosa is pretty terrible at, judging by his 298 OBP.
"Then I met some friends for a beer, went to a BoDeans's concert, and son of a vondruke, if I didn't leave him at the concert hall."

by RCCook on Jun 21, 2007 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wilkerson strikes out more than SOSA ..
throughout their careers...Sosas being prolific and Wiffersons being * lackluster * .. Wilk has struck out once every 3.34 at bats ( seems like a lot more since it seems to happen at the times we need a hit the most )  see RISP stats :)
and Sosa has struck out once every 3.81 at bats.. the only differance is that Wilk has 105 home runs and Sosa has 600 ..woo hoo... lets say Wilk hits 15 home runs for 5 more years thats if he hasnt been released yet.. he may wind up with 200.. what a weak sister ! so chew on these numbers AB ..LOL
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 1:29 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wilkerson
What does his K rate have anything to do with the fact that Sosa hasn't been very good this year?

I don't care how a guy makes outs- if he's making them 71% of the time, as Sosa is, he's not helping the team.

"Then I met some friends for a beer, went to a BoDeans's concert, and son of a vondruke, if I didn't leave him at the concert hall."

by RCCook on Jun 21, 2007 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

thank you
for pointing out that Wilkerson's play has nothing to do with Sosa's worth.  Hopefully they will both be gone in a month.

by t ball on Jun 21, 2007 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I knew there was a reason I just picked him up
Feliz in my fantasy league, well, it's a thin league on the waiver wire, I need another 3b because Chad Tracy is getting platooned in Az.

He still starts every day.

"I am in a world of shit" Full Metal Jacket

by SanDiegoKev on Jun 21, 2007 5:05 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Somebody forgot it was a day game
No game thread
"I'm an aggressive guy, I'm not a guy who's going to go up there and swing like a girl." - Sammy Sosa

by cgolden on Jun 21, 2007 1:08 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Pedro Feliz is NO SAMMY SOSA ..
in any way shape or form, perhaps in his dreams.. and i doubt very much if he hit .360 with runners in scoring position... very few do.. certainly not the anemic bat of wifferson..so comparing a no name to a legend who people come to see hit a home run ..well there is no comparison.. YOU have no point to get ! THANK YOU ...
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 1:11 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

How many players hit .360 with RISP?
All of them are capable of doing it for a couple of months.  Just playing devil's advocate here, your point is weak.  Of course Feliz is not Sosa, but Sosa at this point in his career is not much better.

by t ball on Jun 21, 2007 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

all of them are capable?
what a * silly * thing to say.. then why dont many do it ? Sammys been a clutch hitter all his life.. you either have it or you DON'T ..all of them are not capable..for almost half a season doing that well with RISP...or all of them would be in the hall of fame..like SAMMY will be .. so nice try but LAME !!
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 4:55 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yes, all of them are
for a short period of time.  I bet you could find a two month stretch in the vast majority of players' careers where they did that well.  

Maicer Izturis is hitting .429 with RISP, he has a career batting avg. is .262.

Omar Infante is hitting .483 with RISP, .255 for career.

Sosa has had 80 at bats, that is a small sample and he is to be commended for taking advantage of the opportunities he has had.  But it is not necessarily an indicator of future success, and it does not mean the Rangers should hold onto him and keep Botts at Oklahoma.  Sosa is more than 10 years older than Botts, who do you think is more likely to suffer decline?

by t ball on Jun 21, 2007 8:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

No
Sammys been a clutch hitter all his life..

His career batting average and slugging percentage with RISP are almost exactly the same as overall career numbers.

His OBP with RISP is higher than overall, but that's because of intentional walks.  If you remove them, his OBP with RISP during his career is lower than overall.

by Adam J. Morris on Jun 21, 2007 8:39 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

btw
today's 1b solution - Vasquez!
Forget Johnny Bench, we got Gerry "the Jet" Laird

by ab03 on Jun 21, 2007 1:19 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

and
isn't it a bit annoying that sosa can't play every day?  
Forget Johnny Bench, we got Gerry "the Jet" Laird

by ab03 on Jun 21, 2007 1:19 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Given that we supposedly want
players that will be here in the next few years getting at bats, shouldnt that really be a good thing?  Even if we keep him he wont be playing every day taking all the at bats.

by DSheppard on Jun 21, 2007 1:25 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sosa's RBI Total
look - say what you want about opportunity, but what is Sosa's average with runners in scoring percentage, given that he's had so many chances?  and what about runners in scoring position with 2 outs?  I'll give you a hint, they're pretty good.

somebody will trade for him...don't just drop his ass, give it a few weeks now that 600 has happened and get a potential future piece for him

"No, Donny, these men are nihilists, there's nothing to be afraid of."

by Walter Sobchak on Jun 21, 2007 1:22 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Sammys hitting around 350 with RISP ..
and even higher with 2 strikes on him.. but RBI's are meaninless so i guess its a moot point.. as of today the object of the game is NOT To score runs according to some innnovators..
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Missing the point
Joe Carter drove in 115 runs one year where he hit 232/290/391. A number of others (including Pedro Feliz) have done something similar.

Yes, Sammy is driving in runs, but that's as much a product of where he's batting in the lineup as anything else. If you bat cleanup, you're usually hitting behind runners who are good at getting on base. More baserunners on in front of you equals more potential RBI.

RBI aren't irrelevant, but they tell you just as much about the players batting in front of a given hitter as they do about the hitter himself. If nobody gets on in front of you, you could be Albert Pujols, and you're not going to get many RBI. If everyone gets on in front of you, and you're Neifi Perez, you're going to get a bunch of RBI.

That's why RBI are a poor measure of a hitter's ability. I'd rather focus on a hitter's ability to avoid getting outs (the thing that leads to runners on base, and hence, scoring runs) which Sosa is pretty freaking lousy at.

"Then I met some friends for a beer, went to a BoDeans's concert, and son of a vondruke, if I didn't leave him at the concert hall."

by RCCook on Jun 21, 2007 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Addendum
Wilkerson and Cat have also both been pretty lousy at not making outs this year. I think there's a pretty good case for getting rid of both of them, in addition to Sosa.

Jason Botts, OTOH, has a .420 OBP in AAA. So he's only making outs 58% of the time- albeit at a lower level- as opposed to Sosa's 70%, or Wilkerson's 68%.

"Then I met some friends for a beer, went to a BoDeans's concert, and son of a vondruke, if I didn't leave him at the concert hall."

by RCCook on Jun 21, 2007 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

runs batted in
Are never irrelevant.  Whiffy would not have 53 of them regardless of how many opportunities he had.  

by doolindalton on Jun 21, 2007 1:28 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

LOL....you got that right...
unless he starts hitting the ball as the bat comes around after missing it.. the man has NO redeeming qualities.. I've been a Ranger fan for 20 years and hes right up there with the worst Rangers ever.. cant hit for avg...cant hit for power..strikes out at all the wrong times..slow in the outfield..chicken wing of an arm..doesnt steal bases.. lol.. why is he here ??
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Fresh Take
We all know that Botts can hit, but his glove is a liability right? My solution to this mess is simple. Sammy can still play RF, so platoon  Lofton, Hairston and Byrd in CF, put Sammy in RF as a SPOT starter (3-4 games per week) and make Botts the everyday DH. Then, Sosa is in the lineup enough to audition for a trade and Botts is getting his at-bats as well. The problem with moving Whiffy is that Teixiera will be traded at some point before the deadline which will once again leave us with no-one that can play first, meaning the Rangers would have to get a first baseman in the deal. By keeping Wilkerson, the Rangers can at least get the best deal possible for Tex instead of having to fill a hole in the deal as well. That puts all of our tradeable assets in the field on a regular basis and gets Botts a much deserved regular spot in the lineup.
"My theory of hitting was just to watch the ball as it came in and hit it." --Tommy Lasorda

by BReed on Jun 21, 2007 1:35 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

you have to get rid of someone
who are you getting rid of?
Forget Johnny Bench, we got Gerry "the Jet" Laird

by ab03 on Jun 21, 2007 1:38 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Whoever we can trade 1st
of Wilkerson, Sosa and Cat.  I don't bring Botts up until we've moved one of those folks.  To me its more important we get High minor league depth than it is for Botts to get 50-100 ABs while we try to make a deal.
Mitt Romney should "get out his small-varmint gun and drive those Guatemalans off his lawn" -- Sen John McCain

by DJCahill on Jun 21, 2007 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Lofton
will probably be the first veteran traded which would be perfect. You could almost DFA Lofton because I don't see us getting much in return for him.
"My theory of hitting was just to watch the ball as it came in and hit it." --Tommy Lasorda

by BReed on Jun 21, 2007 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The value of Sammy Sosa to the Rangers...
...as a marketing piece is more important than his stat line, whether any of us want to accept it or not, especially in a lost season like this one.  Personally, I think Sammy's been slightly better than I would have expected, but I'm also indifferent about the fact that he got #600 in a Rangers uniform.  On the other hand, passive fans think Sosa is a God, and they've come out to watch this "future Hall of Famer" climb the homerun ladder.  At the end of the day, I think it's reasonable to assume that Hicks and JD are looking at this as a stroke of marketing luck, since they'd probably be lucky to draw 18,000 a night if Sammy wasn't around...

The fact of the matter with Sammy is that he has put butts in the seats this season, and if that can somehow translate into increased revenues for Hicks in a season that shows no promise for a championship (let alone 3rd place), I can pretty much guarantee that the front office is demanding that they keep around one of their primary sources for the up-tick at the ticket office.

Sammy, whether good or bad, is here to stay for the rest of the season, so Botts better hope somebody else gets traded of DFA'd if he wants to play in Arlington in 2007.

"Hello, win column..."

by rangersfan34 on Jun 21, 2007 1:40 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

VERY well written !

and right on point ! thankfully some fans get it !
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Thanks...
To expand on my point a bit, we all come here and debate stats, yet we forget that the bottom line with the Rangers and every other sports franchise is that this is a BUSINESS.  Making money counts, whether any of us like that aspect of it or not...  Sure, we'd all love to see a winner at any cost (since it isn't our money), but I think it's fair to say that making money while fielding a loser isn't going to break Hicks' heart, and it definitely won't hurt his bank account!
"Hello, win column..."

by rangersfan34 on Jun 21, 2007 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i don't think
sosa is going to stay.  in fact, i bet the rangers will be able to move him and are going to
Forget Johnny Bench, we got Gerry "the Jet" Laird

by ab03 on Jun 21, 2007 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't doubt that they could move him...
...but they have almost NO reason to do so.  Dumping him for a prospect (or even a "serviceable" major leaguer) won't make us better in '07 or beyond, but keeping him will continue to generate a revenue stream and that's what matter to the front office this season.
"Hello, win column..."

by rangersfan34 on Jun 21, 2007 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Exactly !!
you tell em !  Gotta make that $$$ .. at least if Hicks is making a profit he may actually spend some... if hes not making a profit.. its an easy * OUT * .. PLUS ..people love watching future hall of famers... everyone wants to see a sammy sosa hr...a piece of history... not a brad wifferson strike out..who career wise strikes out more :)  and hits a LOT less HR's
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 2:04 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Living in Orange County...
...and supporting the Rangers has led me to have numerous conversations with Angels (and other baseball fans) this season about Sammy being on our team.  Most of these people aren't "educated" baseball people, so they hear his name and make comments about how great he is, not bothering to look deeper at the stats.

Everyone here knows that Sammy USED to be a great player, but now he's just a potential "future Hall of Famer" that's clogging up our roster.  Of course, he's EXACTLY the type of player that passive fans love going out to the ballpark to watch, which is why he'll be with us all season.

"Hello, win column..."

by rangersfan34 on Jun 21, 2007 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

K's
Wilkerson strikes out more than Sosa?

I guess that's why Sosa has four seasons with more K's than Wilkerson's career single-season high, and why Sosa is second on the all-time strikeout list...

"Then I met some friends for a beer, went to a BoDeans's concert, and son of a vondruke, if I didn't leave him at the concert hall."

by RCCook on Jun 21, 2007 2:24 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

YES do the math !!
Wilkerson strikes out every 3.34 at bats..and Sosa strikes out every 3.81 at bats .. its not complicated to figure out.. do the math !! These are career stats ..their track records..expect WILK is a punch and judy hitter.. ie...NO POWER
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 2:29 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Dude
Seriously, calm the f down. You're about to have an aneurysm...
"Then I met some friends for a beer, went to a BoDeans's concert, and son of a vondruke, if I didn't leave him at the concert hall."

by RCCook on Jun 21, 2007 2:33 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

More math
So far in 2007:

Wilkerson: a HR every 17.14 AB, .225 ISO

Sosa: a HR every 19.67 AB, .217 ISO

So if Wilkerson is a Punch & Judy hitter, what does that make Sosa?

"Then I met some friends for a beer, went to a BoDeans's concert, and son of a vondruke, if I didn't leave him at the concert hall."

by RCCook on Jun 21, 2007 2:39 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ummm....Wilk has not had many at bats this year..
it doesnt take much to hit 6 home runs.. LOL.. Kevin Mench did that in a week not too long ago..
Sosa had not played in almost 2 years .. and will only get better .. Wilk hasnt had many at bats this year..so your stats are bogus.. Wilk has a measley 22 ribbies.. Sosa has more than twice as many..thats punch and judy stats guy...like Wash said today.." I think Sosa is going to get better next year then this year..hes going to get better off speed stuff and start crunching some of that" hes already on par to have 120 rbi's .. so will he have 140 next year if wash's prediction is true?  Wilk will have 60 ribbies this year max.. thats a weak sister hitter.. steamrolling towards the infamous mendoza line..
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 4:42 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ya got that RcCook..
if you need to have me explain it to you in simplier terms ..i'll be happy to :)
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 4:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

No
I understand pretty clearly that you're a condescending asshole.

And like you said, Wilkerson has about half as many AB's as Sosa, and has hit mostly down in the order. You think that might be a reason he's got 30 less RBI's?

Middle of the order guys tend to drive in more runs than leadoff hitters and guys who bat lower in the order. That you don't grasp something so basic tells me who the idiot really is...

"Then I met some friends for a beer, went to a BoDeans's concert, and son of a vondruke, if I didn't leave him at the concert hall."

by RCCook on Jun 21, 2007 4:55 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

well I'm glad you get something !
better late than never :)  Wilks been a disater since he first got here..no matter where he was in the order..and for most of the season everyones been hitting in the low 200s..lofton, young, teixera, cat, all guys in FRONT of SOSA..so its not like he was hitting 4th in an ideal situation.. and the guys in front of Wilk were hitting around the same if not better..so thats WEAK !! Hit your stat books CHUMP.. you got a lot of work ahead of ya .. you SCHMUCK  :)
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 5:00 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well
Sosa had not played in almost 2 years .. and will only get better ..

In April:  .244/.309/.547  
In May:  .255/.307/.426
In June:  .214/.262/.375

He's getting worse, not better.

by Adam J. Morris on Jun 21, 2007 4:58 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

so if hes had a slower than usual June..
that doesnt mean July he wont break out of his June slump like MY broke out his May slump this month by hitting .385 ...LOL..Sosas obviously pressing being so close to the historic 600..he'll revert to form soon enough..like MY said hes incredibly strong mentally..."something we can all learn from"
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 5:02 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

OK
Now you're just either being a sarcastic asshole or you're trolling...
"Then I met some friends for a beer, went to a BoDeans's concert, and son of a vondruke, if I didn't leave him at the concert hall."

by RCCook on Jun 21, 2007 5:12 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

um yes it will help
if you trade sosa you get prospects that will help in the future.  

sosa is on a one year contract.  surely you are not suggesting they negotiate a long term contract with him, are you?

Forget Johnny Bench, we got Gerry "the Jet" Laird

by ab03 on Jun 21, 2007 2:30 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

By no means...
...do I expect (or want) a long term contract to be offered.  From what I've read in various places (I think Evan Grant was one of the sources), the Rangers aren't expected to get anything of value back in a Sosa trade.  Of course, if an offer came along that knocked JD's socks off, he'd have to consider it, but I really think Sammy's value as a marketing tool is viewed as being more important than anything else regarding him.  We should definitely dump his ass at the end of year, but it's hard to deny that the average (not-stathead) fan thinks Sammy is great, and I've stated it in previous psts that those people are the ones that help fill up the stadium in an otherwise miserable season.
"Hello, win column..."

by rangersfan34 on Jun 21, 2007 2:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

this kind of thinking
its funny that so many people want to stick it to hicks and want him to make no money so he'll sell the team but then when we are faced with a question that makes you confront directly whether you want to win in the long term or whether you want to sell tickets, so many people are opting for the latter.

for those of you saying, "this is why sosa won't be traded," i get it.  but a lot of you sound like you are saying, "this is why sosa shouldn't be traded."  that i don't understand at all.  why do you care about filling up seats?

Forget Johnny Bench, we got Gerry "the Jet" Laird

by ab03 on Jun 21, 2007 4:18 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sosa
Myself, I am not against him being traded I just don't think he will be because of the reasons given about money coming in. And money coming in is good IF hicks uses it on the team! But we all know that won't happen.
"Pimps be damned, it's harder out here for a Rangers fan!" "If you don't throw strikes first, you're last."

by rentz on Jun 21, 2007 4:21 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Personally, I don't give a crap...
...about filling up seats, but the people sitting in the Front Office out in centerfield have to consider this kind of stuff in putting together a master plan and budget for the season.  I think it's pretty ignorant for people on this board to look at this simply as a case of Sosa blocking other players from getting a chance.

If we have a major firesale, attendance would probably drop to around 15k/game, but if we keep some of the box office draws (primarily Sammy) the Rangers have got to be looking at the flipside and realizing that drawing 30k, while increasing revenue is not such a bad outcome for a last place team.

As I said in a previous post, this is a BUSINESS first and foremost.  Winning obviously matters to the Rangers organization, but making money can help cause the product on the field to improve.  Sammy is a "cash cow" for the Rangers, and his value as a revenue generator, to me, outweighs the value of the random prospect (or scrub) we'd probably get in trade.

"Hello, win column..."

by rangersfan34 on Jun 21, 2007 4:41 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Filling Seats is the probem
with the current admin brain trust.  That's all they care about.  Winning???  Winning costs money.  I do not see this team going another direction, and having Sosa remand the rest of the year will prove it.
"I am in a world of shit" Full Metal Jacket

by SanDiegoKev on Jun 21, 2007 5:14 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

cat
is worse than sosa and wilkerson.  but his "upside" is better than both.

unfortunately his upside is taking a while to get even halfway there

Al Gore 2008 http://www.myspace.com/igotsculture

by gossamer on Jun 21, 2007 1:47 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Cat and Millwood
You can argue that this year is simply a fluke with these two guys. Their track record has got to be considered at this point.
"My theory of hitting was just to watch the ball as it came in and hit it." --Tommy Lasorda

by BReed on Jun 21, 2007 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Adam
You'll be a better blogger if you stop these obsessions with players.

I like how you declare wilkerson better because he's got .010 better EQA this year. Yeah, that proves a lot.

I'm sick of hearing about Botts and Laird for the past five years. At least pick good players to get behind.

by Sharky on Jun 21, 2007 3:02 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Yeh he HAD .10 EQA.. he just went 0 for 4 ..
with guess what? 2 more strikeouts..theres nothing to defend there..he plain ole SUCKS...
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 4:45 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Anyways
What did you guys do to my juneteenth thread? My guess is Cahill was in there trolling it up..

by Sharky on Jun 21, 2007 3:19 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Ugh ... I can't believe what I've been reading.
Well thought out post, Adam.  But there are some people that can't be swayed no matter what evidence you put in front of them.  And then they tend to feed off of each other until you're submerged in a torrent ridiculousness.

Either way, they're right about one thing, Sosa will likely be kept if he can't be traded because there is the perception that his mere presence on the team sells tickets.

by Athos on Jun 21, 2007 3:33 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

He'll be kept because Rwash likes him
Which I love the delicious irony in that, since LSB refuses to criticize RWash.

It'd be like if Apple and Nintendo got in a fight. PC at loggerheads.

by Sharky on Jun 21, 2007 4:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

What?
Adam's criticized Washington on several occasions lately.
"Then I met some friends for a beer, went to a BoDeans's concert, and son of a vondruke, if I didn't leave him at the concert hall."

by RCCook on Jun 21, 2007 4:33 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

very true...
if you have to use that as an stat of desperation...why bother ?
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 5:13 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Huh?
OPS is a "stat of desperation"?

by Adam J. Morris on Jun 21, 2007 5:50 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

let me ask this
who would you rather have up at the plate...not considering who gets on more, just who do you have more confidence in?

Sosa or Wilky

by weslyenkid01 on Jun 21, 2007 6:16 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

holy jumpin'
First off, I haven't gone through this whole thread so I'm sorry if i'm just reiterating points that others have made...

But to argue that Wilkerson has been better than Sosa this year is just flat wrong. I hate to quote Randy Galloway, but never has "Watch the damn games" been more appropriate. I'm no huge Sammy fan or huge Wilk detractor, and I hope that in the next few weeks the Rangers find a roster spot for Jason Botts as much as everyone, but Sammy has been significantly better than Wilk and Cat this season.

Picking out one stat like EQA and deeming all other stats "irrelevant" is incredibly convenient. all this Sammy bashing has gone on to a bit of a ridiculous level. When you consider on the field performance and especially the feelings of your average Ranger fan (not the baseball freaks on this website but the average fan), Sammy is much more valuable to the team than either Wilk or Cat have been. I'd much prefer to see them get rid of one of those two guys to make room for Botts and then wait till the deadline to see what they can get for Sammy in a trade.

by disposablehero on Jun 21, 2007 6:26 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

stats
while i am admittedly not a total stathead i do buy in to some aspects of stats. And the stats backup what i keep saying about wilkerson, he is NOT as bad as everyone tries to make him out to be.
Sure he strikes out a lot, but many hitters K as much as he does an more (sosa in this case). Rbi's are always going to be higher for someone who hits 3-5 than someone who hits 7-9 like wilkerson.

I am more than willing to admit that Sosa is not as bad as I expected him to be, or as bad as people around here make him out to be, but you also must admit that wilkerson is not the worst player to ever put on a ranger uniform like many believe.

"Pimps be damned, it's harder out here for a Rangers fan!" "If you don't throw strikes first, you're last."

by rentz on Jun 21, 2007 7:01 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

wilkerson
his homerrun and rbi totals are pretty decent for the amount of at bats he had. sosa has nearly twice as many atbats. if wilkerson had as many at bats as sosa he would probably be on pace for similar numbers.

by selppuc on Jun 21, 2007 10:39 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm not in this,
but how can RBI's be irrelevent.  Especially when you are comparing how 2 guys have perfermed in such a small sample.  

I realize over time, everything will even out, but, I think, you guys are debating who's been better the first 2/5 of the season.  That has to be relevent doesn't it.

At least when there is such a large difference

Chris Young/Adrian Gonzalez for Aki Otsuka, the new Sammy Sosa/Wilson Alvarez for Harold Baines

by badradiorules on Jun 22, 2007 8:45 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Because the RBI total
is a counting stat largely resulting from the number of opportunities you have.  Sosa has had 3 times as many at bats with RISP, or even just runners on period.  He should have more RBIs.

by t ball on Jun 22, 2007 10:42 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

addendum
I should add, that off the top of my head, I think no one on the entire team is within about 20 at bats  of Sosa's opportunities with runners on.  Again, he should be leading the team in RBIs with the number of chances he has had.  Kudos to him for taking advantage of those opportunities, but if you're going to use a stat, use his OPS with RISP to compare to his teammates and not RBI total.  And even then, keep in mind that you're dealing with a small sample.

by t ball on Jun 22, 2007 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

once again Randy Galloway...
is exactly correct about Sosa being "significantly better than wifferson or Cat"
and you as well mr. disposablehero.. compliments on your intelligent and correct posting ! Lets dump that scrub Wilk..he struck out before he got to the plate the other day.. never seen that before.. :) Cat is a seasoned veteran who almost always hits around .300 ..he'll come around
   Also correct on * cherry picking * these ridiculous stats..to make Wilk not look so sorry.. that his EQA WAS better than Sosas b4 he struck out twice today and went 0 for 4 ..
well its not anymore .. and he doesnt have many homers or rbis and sucks in the clutch.. DUMP HIM..havent we suffered enough !!!
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 10:34 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

wilkerson
if he continued hitting at his current rate he would have simiar home run and rbi totals to sosa if he had as many at bats as sosa does right now.

by selppuc on Jun 21, 2007 10:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

IF IF IF..we've been IF fing with Wilkerson since
...he got here... but he doesnt .. and he has enough bats to have a decent runner in scoring position avg...it sure aint .360 like Sosas...
IF MY UNCLE HAD TITS HE'D BE MY AUNT..IF IF IF ..
  :)
GayRangerFan

by RangerDisaster on Jun 21, 2007 11:01 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

While I don't necessarily agree that
Botts is going to be the second coming of Travis Hafner or anything I think it is clearly past time for him to be on the big club and playing every day. Basically, it is time for both Botts and Cruz to either sink or swim at the major league level. Bring both up and play them every day. If they do well keep them. If they prove they can't hit major league pitching then give them their outright release. There is just no sense in having someone like Botts in the system if you can't or won't give them the opportunity they deserve, especially when every other DH on this team sucks ass. The guy has worked hard and done everything that has been asked of him. Now is the time for the Rangers to hold up their end of the bargain and give him a shot. He has put up numbers in AAA for a couple of years now. What else do they want?

by gp on Jun 21, 2007 11:17 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

agree with the
botts arguement...if his time is here he better prove it soon, but we have to let him prove that. Remember when we brought hank up to early, he sucked and we sent him to oklahoma for the year, the next year he was fine. Although im not comparing blaylock to nelly cruz but that might be the same time of situation were dealing with

by weslyenkid01 on Jun 21, 2007 11:28 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Sosa
I think Adam is 100% accurate in his assessment of the current situation. But, the Rangers are in a very unfortunate "no-win" situation. JD simply can't, in good faith, DFA Sosa. It would be a completely shitty thing to do after all of the attention/money that Sosa has brought to the org this year. Sosa has absolutely zero trade value. No team is going to take him, period.
What does that mean for the Rangers? Sammy will be on the team the rest of the year and yes that means blocking ABs for Botts and Diaz. I simply don't think there is any other option for the Rangers.

by Randy Richardson on Jun 22, 2007 2:25 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Sosa's best statistic
From TR Sulllivan:

Sosa is hitting .341 with runners in scoring position. That's tied for the highest for a single season in his career. He hit .313 in those situations in his MVP year of 1998.

by doolindalton on Jun 22, 2007 6:16 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

In other words...
suddenly, at age 38 after a year out of baseball, Sammy Sosa has become "clutch".

You're gonna have to excuse me if I don't believe it.

by a bebop a rebop on Jun 24, 2007 1:27 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

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