Lone Star Ball: An SB Nation Community

Navigation: Jump to content areas:



Around SBN: Want to help build SB Nation? We're hiring! Bar-right-arrows



Some late evening thoughts

Okay, a few more things I wanted to touch on this evening, in the aftermath of the deadline deals.

First, it is August 1...where the hell is Jason Botts?  He better be in the lineup tomorrow, or else I'm giving Ben a case of Miller High Life and a couple of Red Bulls and sending him to Jon Daniels' house.  

And with Tom Hicks now saying that he's not going to allow Sammy Sosa to be released, I expect apologies from all you poop-flinging Sosa monkey who insisted that this was a no-risk signing because if Sosa sucked and Jason Botts hit well in AAA, the team would just release Sosa and Botts would be up.

This is the worst case scenario -- and one that I feared from the time he arrived.  Sosa isn't good enough for any other team to want him, but the team doesn't have the nads to bite the bullet and let him go, so they continue to waste ABs and a roster spot on him while Jason Botts destroys AAA pitching for the third year in a row.  I told you so.

Next...if you haven't already, read zywica's post from earlier tonight.  I'll wait...

...

Okay.  Here's the importance of these Latin teenagers.  If you aren't drafting in the top several slots in the draft, it is real, real hard to draft future superstars, particularly positional players.  The players with that sort of potential are generally off the board by the time the good teams back.  So unless you plan on sucking for a while, you've got to find another way to get potential stars into your pipeline.  Going and getting raw Latin players who are a couple of years younger than American high school draftees is the obvious choice.

That's important to keep in mind when talking about draft compensation.  Jon Daniels said tonight that Elvis Andrus is a top 5 draft choice type talent, and I think he's probably spot on in that regard.  

And for those of you carping that the Rangers would have been better off taking the draft choices instead of trading Eric Gagne, consider this...Engel Beltre, if he had been in this past June's draft, probably would have been a first round choice, and probably would have been off the board by the time the Rangers picked at #17.  Given that the best the Rangers could get in compensation for Gagne is #16, that means that the Rangers got a player, in exchange for Beltre, better than any player they could have reasonably expected to get with the best draft choice they could have gotten as compensation for Gagne.  Assuming, of course, that Gagne was a Type A, as we've been assuming, and further assuming that he didn't re-sign with the Rangers, and further assuming that he didn't sign with a team that signed another Type A or that finished in the bottom half of the majors (in which case we'd get a second rounder).  

Oh, and getting Beltre instead of a 2008 draft choice also means not spending $1.2-1.6 million on a signing bonus, as well.

The Transaction Oracle likes the return the Rangers got for Teixeira, and is underwhelmed by the return for Gagne, which pretty much dovetails my reaction, as well.

Dave Cameron says the Teixeira deal was a "home run" for the Rangers, and calls the Gagne deal a win-win for both teams.

Keith Law is unimpressed with David Murphy and Kason Gabbard, but has good things to say about Beltre:

The wild card here for Texas is center fielder Engel Beltre, a 17-year-old signed for about $600,000 out of the Dominican Republic in 2006. Beltre is an exciting player with a lot of ability. He has a clean swing with some loft in it, a plus arm, and he might be able to stay in center. If not, his bat will play in an outfield corner. He's playing in the Gulf Coast League at an age when most Dominican prospects are still playing in the Dominican Summer League, and he's holding his own, with five homers (tied for eighth in the league) and a .198 isolated power (10th in the league). I like the Rangers' willingness to take a short-season prospect in each of their two deals this week (pitcher Neftali Feliz was involved in the Mark Teixeira trade), knowing that contenders are nearly always willing to part with those guys to get a deal done. If this trade is going to turn out to be a win for the Rangers, it will almost certainly be because Beltre developed into the star he's capable of becoming.

The BP chat session gang o' chatters didn't care for what the Rangers got for Gagne, but really killed Brian Cashman for letting this deal happen, saying that Ian Kennedy is the type of prospect you give up to get a difference maker in a deadline deal (and to keep a rival from getting a difference maker), and Cashman's inability to differentiate between a Kennedy-level prospect and a Chamberlain means he blew it here.

Jeff Passan lists the Rangers as one of the "winners" at the trade deadline, although he suggests that it might not save Daniels' job.

I don't know if Daniels' job is really in danger, but he certainly isn't acting like it is, given the way he's targeted long-term solutions in these deals rather than short-term fixes (other than Gabbard).

I don't know how the Rangers ended up with Beau Jones thrown into the deal with the Braves, but that's a pretty sweet little trade kicker.  Jones was ranked #14 in the Braves' organization by BA coming into the season, and apparently was part of the deal because of Matt Harrison's barky shoulder.  I have to wonder if this isn't a sign that John Schuerholz isn't planning on sticking around much longer...

Although he didn't really like the Teixeira trade this much, Tim MacMahon loves the Gagne trade because the Rangers got Gabbard, who MacMahon suggests will be heading up a rotation that includes Brandon McCarthy, Kam Loe, and Eric Hurley in 2010.  

I'm still trying to figure out if he's kidding about that or not.

Kevin Sherrington has praise for the way Daniels negotiated at the deadline, and notes that even the Hicks critics will have to give him credit for the 8 year, $140 million contract extension he offered Teixeira.

What the hell is going on with Nelson Cruz?  Hot streak?  Did the light just come on all the sudden?  

And what is in the water in Oklahoma?  Is there anything the coaching staff down there can't fix?  I'm ready to start sending terminal cancer patients up there for the coaches to lay hands on, or maybe sending the Redhawk coaching staff to Baghdad and let them straighten out the Sunni/Shi'i/Kurd conflict.

0 recs | Comment 41 comments

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

Display:

I was
comparing Fausto Carmona's minor and major league stats to one another. They are GB pitchers that underwhelmed in the minors while showing up in the majors. The problem with Gabbard of course is that he walks tooo many while Fausto walks none, however Gabbard can strike people out a little. I think Rheinecker could be this way too. I wouldn't be surprised if Rheinecker and Gabbard impress in the 2nd half and show some staying power in the rotation. Maybe enough to win rotation slots next year as Loe is sent back to the bullpen in favor of Hurley.
Duncan Hunter for President in '08

by dstar442005 on Aug 1, 2007 12:06 AM CDT   0 recs

I meant
Carmona's minor and major league stats with Gabbard's.
Duncan Hunter for President in '08

by dstar442005 on Aug 1, 2007 12:07 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Fabio Castillo
6 ip 7 H 2 ER 6 K 1 BB

nice line

thats after going 6 and striking out 8 with 0 walks 2 ER's in his last appearance.

i like it. i like it a lot.

.500 or bust!

by Jayslick on Aug 1, 2007 12:12 AM CDT   0 recs

who
is Carlos Pimentel in rookie league? He struck out 8 in 4 IP.
Duncan Hunter for President in '08

by dstar442005 on Aug 1, 2007 12:23 AM CDT   0 recs

He could be a pretty big deal
He's another 17 year old from their last Latin class.

by zywica on Aug 1, 2007 6:11 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Botts
probably just trying to find an excuse for why he wasnt in...

but perhaps with how the deadline worked out and the rangers only having 22 men in the stadium to start the game kept botts from being activated for a day?

of course that doesnt explain why he played in oklahoma, i cant imagine if he was coming up tomorrow they would play him in oklahoma for the hell of it.

so... who knows.

but if its more than a couple days, yes the situation has officially reached the ridiculous point.

i want to see a lineup with cruz/salty/botts all in it and i want to see it now

by DSheppard on Aug 1, 2007 12:28 AM CDT   0 recs

read some of the new stuff
well its reassuring to hear sammy will have a new role.  

I expect to see botts no later than thursday and hope he is in everyday, not just against righties.  rather that means sosa plays LF vs lefties or botts does.

by DSheppard on Aug 1, 2007 12:34 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Sammy's role
Should be "goodwill ambassador."

Call a press conference, let him retire with a bunch of accolades, and let's get the Botts era rolling.

"Then I met some friends for a beer, went to a BoDeans's concert, and son of a vondruke, if I didn't leave him at the concert hall."

by RCCook on Aug 1, 2007 12:52 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Just make him an..
honorary Ranger.  Let him wear a uniform, tour the clubhouse, attend a clinic and get a letter from Jerry Hairston.

by bflood36 on Aug 1, 2007 9:34 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

when and if botts gets in the lineup
what will the lineup look like?

no real leadoff guy here, but byrd is better than hairston so...
cf-byrd
2nd-kinsler
ss-young
1st-salty
rf-cruz
c-laird
lf-catt
dh-botts
3rd-metcalf

in my opinion that should be the lineup until blalock gets back but should be the lineup for the rest of the year...with a rotation looking like
millwood
mccarthy
rheino
loe
gabbard

by weslyenkid01 on Aug 1, 2007 12:36 AM CDT   0 recs

Schuerholz
any thoughts that he was guided more by emotion, maybe to give Cox, Smoltz and Chipper Jones one or two more shots at another WS? I don't see him making a trade like this at any time in his past - especially settling for Mahay.

by Randy Richardson on Aug 1, 2007 12:42 AM CDT   0 recs

CJ vs Mahay
how was it settling on Mahay?  the whole idea of their trade was a world series push...Mahay's numbers are stellar, and he's a lefty specialist, exactly what they needed...
"No, Donny, these men are nihilists, there's nothing to be afraid of."

by Walter Sobchak on Aug 1, 2007 11:27 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Mahay
lefties hit him better than righties, so what's the point?

by Randy Richardson on Aug 1, 2007 11:51 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Even so
he's still a huge upgrade compared to any and all lefties they've had this year.
mmmmmm...64 slices of American cheese...

by t ball on Aug 2, 2007 12:27 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Gabbard and Gagne
So many people crack me up with the Gagne evaluation.  

Gabbard has injury issues. Did they get enough. Hello?

One quick snap of any crickety Gagne ligament and it's game over.

It's not confirmed that Gagne would be a Type A free agent either. In fact, if hurt later this season, he would have 3 years of mush for pitching stats. How does that yield 2 Type A draft picks? It probably would NOT.

 

by 3Bagger on Aug 1, 2007 12:43 AM CDT   0 recs

Gagne
I think that's a relevant point - being a type A wasn't a certainty - he could have had a mediocre second half or like you suggest, an injury, which probably would have resulted in the Rangers not offering him arbitration.

by Randy Richardson on Aug 1, 2007 12:48 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Gagne
The press is generally very un-impressed with this signing. Which is shocking to me.

Boston baseball is something Gagne's body has not tested. He didn't exactly need to reach-down-deep for the Rangers.

I loved the guy more than anyone this season, BUT...his arm and shoulder twitching makes me doubt his longer future. Pitching is painful under the best of circumstances. Even if you're healthy.

Stay tuned Mr. Theo! Thanks for the threesome.

by 3Bagger on Aug 1, 2007 1:03 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Am I right ...
... reading between the lines of your comments here and at the NMLR board that you think the Rangers will sign all of their draft holdouts at the 11th hour, possibly even Nash?  The idea being that revealing their naughty above-the-slot deals as late as possible will dull Bud's wrath.

by shroomer on Aug 1, 2007 12:58 AM CDT   0 recs

Not sure about Nash
But I'm guessing they'll sign their first rounders, other than, maybe, Neil Ramirez.

by Adam J. Morris on Aug 1, 2007 1:00 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

All but Nash
I think we end up signing all our picks but Nash, who has said for a while he plans on going to OSU. He is not worth much more than slot money because he doesn't have huge upside, so I can't see them blowing him away with money.

I think it is pretty much a sure thing they sign Borbon and Beavan, assuming the reports about them only being $100K apart are true. Ramirez will be a lot trickier since he probably wants first round money, but Hicks just saved tens of millions the last two days so they can't use the excuse they don't have the money. Bud will be very upset, but my guess is that 15 or more teams go way over slot to sign at least one pick, so I am not too worried about Bud's feelings.

by uthornfan on Aug 1, 2007 1:02 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Saving $$$
Is it confirmed that we're not paying any portion for Tex or Gagne? I missed that part.

by 3Bagger on Aug 1, 2007 1:08 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

yep
no cash involved in either trade.

by Randy Richardson on Aug 1, 2007 1:30 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I read
that 400K is going to Boston with Gagne.

by BHill on Aug 1, 2007 7:26 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Stuff like that last paragraph
...sets you apart from the pack Adam. Brilliant.

Nelson Cruz is a beast.

by jamcadbury on Aug 1, 2007 1:06 AM CDT   0 recs

Noooo!
Keep them in OKC or bring their voodoo to Arlington.

Whatever you do, don't send them to Iraq.  You know, since Al Qaeda in Iraq* is determined to attack us here and all.  We're going to need the OKC voodoo stateside to help protect the homeland...  Whose home, I'm not quite sure.  But someone's home is in danger!  Raise the terror alert!

* Al Qaeda in Iraq is simply the name a group of insurgents adopted.  There was no original tie to Al Qaeda Classic.  So when Bush says that Al Qaeda in Iraq is determined to attack us here because they have in the past and that's why we have to fight them over there so they don't fight us over here, ignore every fucking word he spews.  It's complete bullshit, blanketed with horse manure.

Lick by lick, mountains erode

by RangerMoto on Aug 1, 2007 1:31 AM CDT   0 recs

Al Qaeda Iraq
Is the Crystal Pepsi of Al Qaeda.
"People hated Jackie Robinson because he was black. People hate Barry Bonds because he's a cheating douchebag." -- Lewis Black

by ghtd36 on Aug 1, 2007 9:55 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Except...
...Crystal Pepsi didn't kill anyone.  It killed some tastebuds, sure...
Lick by lick, mountains erode

by RangerMoto on Aug 1, 2007 10:53 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

politics in the middle of this great discussion?
get naked and kill yourself.
"No, Donny, these men are nihilists, there's nothing to be afraid of."

by Walter Sobchak on Aug 1, 2007 11:32 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

nice little throw in there
inconsistent with his delivery, but when he doesn't try to overthrow, it's coming in at 90-93 with good control. looks like he tries to ramp it up, but gets wild and loses velocity. just putting him on a decent clay mound will probably do wonders - he's slipping and sliding on that sand box.
buffering....

by SteveP on Aug 1, 2007 1:54 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Video
Early in the video he has some trouble throwing strikes, but he figures something out and is pumping in one strike after another by the middle of the video. He is still raw and has some things to work on, mainly his changeup and control, but he has a great arm and you can never have too many of those.

by uthornfan on Aug 1, 2007 2:35 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Wondering...
Hey shroom,

Was it that Jones started in High A, got demolished, then went down to low A?

It appears he's been pitching low A for several weeks, but I wasn't sure what the exact course of this season's been for him...

by hightowersmith on Aug 1, 2007 11:38 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I haven't really looked into it either
We got a new dishwasher and I've been riding a bitchin' Cascade high, so ... I don't know - Jamey will clue us in some in the NMLR here soon.

by shroomer on Aug 1, 2007 12:05 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Jones
Jones started the year in Low A, was promoted to High A and then demoted back to Low A. He was called up sometime around May 18 and sent down after pitching very poorly.

by uthornfan on Aug 1, 2007 4:14 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Nate Silver
In the BP chat said that the prospects we got for Gagne "aren't very much."  I wonder why he's so dismissive of Beltre like that.

by hca4 on Aug 1, 2007 2:14 AM CDT   0 recs

I got the feeling
I got the feeling some of the people answering the questions had no idea who Beltre was, or weren't aware he was included. I got the feeling because they never mentioned any of the prospects names, just named them prospects.

by uthornfan on Aug 1, 2007 2:36 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Ron Washington loves Sosa
That's what AJM doesn't want to adfmit, as AJM refuses to criticize Rwash.

by Sharky on Aug 1, 2007 7:40 AM CDT   0 recs

Funny
I've seen AJM criticize Ron Washington on a number of occasions.
"People hated Jackie Robinson because he was black. People hate Barry Bonds because he's a cheating douchebag." -- Lewis Black

by ghtd36 on Aug 1, 2007 9:56 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Sosa....
poop throwing monkey official apology.  I thought he'd never even make it out of spring training.  

Ok....when do I get my Wilkerson apology?  ha.

by bdavison94 on Aug 1, 2007 10:39 AM CDT   0 recs

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

Welcome to the SB Nation blog about Texas Rangers.

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recommended FanPosts

Small
OT - Meno 71
Pomeranian2_small
OSU fans are inhumane and stupid...
Small
Can we have a moratorium on the JD bashing?
Thumbsup_small
TexasLeaguers.com - Delayed Internal Rotation: Performance Implications

Recent FanPosts

Cmkelly_small
BCS National Championship Thread
Small
Fun with pitching projections
Miles_small
David Dellucci 2004 Oakland A's Video
Ghostbusters_stay_puft_small
Q & A with CD
Jd_pray_small
BoSox adding Smoltz
Images_small
OT - Cowboys release Pacman
Small
Joe Crede Rumors...
Krang_small
BATTING FOURTH... RIGHTFIELDER... NELSON CRUZ?
Kyle_small
scioscia extension

Post_icon New FanPost All FanPosts Carrot-mini


Site Meter