OT: DDT (Debate-Day Thread)
by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 15, 2008 2:53 PM CDT
640 comments
Thought I'd put it out there just in case anybody still cares. I think this one might be a little more interesting that the last two -- based almost wholely on the fact that the pundits are saying that McCain has to do something dramatic in this debate to turn things around. Here's CNN's preview:
WASHINGTON (CNN) -- GOP Sen. John McCain must clearly differentiate his plan to fix the ailing economy from that of his rival Sen. Barack Obama at Wednesday night's presidential debate if he is to shake up the race, political analysts said.
"I think what he has to do is talk about the issues. ... He's got to talk about his economic plan," CNN senior political analyst Gloria Borger said. "Yes, he's got to convince voters that he's got the judgment to be president, but he's also got to convince voters to like him."
The third and final debate, taking place at Hofstra University in Hempstead, New York, at 9 p.m. ET, may be the last time the Republican presidential candidate may be able turn the race to his favor before Election Day, now less than three weeks away.
The 90-minute face-off, which will air on CNN and CNN.com, will undoubtedly focus on the economic crisis plaguing the country.
CNN political editor Mark Preston said the debate will likely be McCain's "last chance to reach tens of millions of people with his vision for America."
"He needs a game-changer," Preston said.
As the nation has been going through a financial crisis over the last few weeks, McCain has slipped in the polls behind Obama, the Democratic nominee.
A CNN Poll of Polls calculated Wednesday has Obama leading McCain 50 percent to 42 percent. Obama is also leading McCain in battleground states such as Ohio, Pennsylvania, Virginia and Florida.
As Obama has opened up his lead, the McCain campaign has responded by trying to raise doubts about Obama, particularly by tying Obama to William Ayers, a former 1960s radical who belonged to the Weather Underground, a group that bombed federal buildings to protest the Vietnam War.
A New York Times/CBS News poll released Tuesday night suggests that the McCain campaign's negative attack strategy may be backfiring on the Republican presidential candidate.
In the poll, 60 percent of the voters surveyed believed that McCain had spent more time attacking his rival than explaining what he would do as president. In contrast, nearly two-thirds of the voters surveyed, 63 percent, felt that Obama has spent more time explaining his policies than attacking McCain.
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First question tonight
Peavy or Greinke?
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
by t ball on Oct 15, 2008 3:18 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
McCain instantly goes with his gut and says Peavy.
After meeting with his advisers and plenty of careful deliberation, Obama chooses Grienke.
At this rate, he’ll be throwing 107-110 by 2012
by trident on Oct 15, 2008 3:23 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Then
McCain tries to tie Obama to Connor and Chiti, and Obama says that McCain backed the SD trade.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
by t ball on Oct 15, 2008 3:29 PM CDT up reply actions 9 recs
first time i think i’ve ever rec’d something for making me laugh that hard
At this rate, he’ll be throwing 107-110 by 2012
by trident on Oct 15, 2008 3:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
LOL
In reference to how good the Steelers have been in their history: "No one is even close to them."- Steal Home
by hinduplaya on Oct 15, 2008 3:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
McCain did always seem like the Buck Showalter of the political world.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Oct 15, 2008 4:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
and that makes obama...
ron washington?
on an experience level at least lol – clearly he is much smarter than wash
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"I'm more happy to be a Dallas Cowboy than when I got my first bike" - Roy Williams (WR)
by knockoutking on Oct 15, 2008 4:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was gonna say Obama = JD
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Oct 15, 2008 4:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i was just trying to stick w/ the manager reference lol
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"I'm more happy to be a Dallas Cowboy than when I got my first bike" - Roy Williams (WR)
by knockoutking on Oct 16, 2008 8:02 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
well...
…the market is down again today another 700+ pts… mccain doesn’t stand much of a chance as long as that continues… he can ask about ayers, farrakahn, and the crazy minister… but, right or wrong, thats not gonna stop the association people are making between the GOP and the economic collapse…
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
by ivysafety39 on Oct 15, 2008 3:53 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Yep
The Economy Trumps All!!!!
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
by DJCahill on Oct 15, 2008 4:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The way that it looks...
the market is going to stabilize until after the election, anyway. So, if McCain is going to gain ground it’s going to have to do so without any market improvements.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
by benmor78 on Oct 15, 2008 5:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The All-Knowing Market
The Dow was up, what, 700 or 800 points the other day and wasn’t it down by nearly as much today? What exactly changed in the meantime? I know some new economic numbers came out, but were they really surprising news?
Believe me, I’m definitely a capitalist andI do think that in the long run markets are usually pretty smart. But in times of crisis they go completely and totally insane. Don’t these people know that these bailout measures will take a little while to work? It’s total panic. But then the other day the G7 gets together and says “ok we’re going to do some things together” and it thrills the market to death. So much so that we saw the largest points gain in history, right? Why? Because the market is having a nervous breakdown.
Capitalism is imperfect. That’s where I’m going with this. If we went back to 1890 when there really were no rules, everything would totally suck. The market is fine and should be the dominant force, but it needs to be tempered a dash of “liberal pinko communism”.
by Black Francis on Oct 15, 2008 6:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Liberal pinko communism...
Uh, I don’t think so.
The large market gains were due in no small part to retail investors getting back in the market. There are going to be a lot of selling pressures as hedge funds sell to meet redemption requests.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
by benmor78 on Oct 15, 2008 6:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
x
That was an exaggeration. For effect, you know.
I still think the market is crazy. If you look at all the stocks that were up the other day and all the were down today, it’s just nutty behavior in the market, no matter who’s buying and who’s selling and for what reasons. And I’m not condemning anyone, really. If I were in charge of a lot of peoples money in this market I’d probably be nervous as hell, too.
But, no, I’m not talking about nationalizing anything. The government’s doing that to an extent, and I understand the basic principles behind it, but I’m not really talking about full on balls out takeovers of any privately held organization by the government. I was just referring to some regulation is all. And if buying some stock helps capitalize the banks, I guess that’s fine with me as long as it’s not permanent.
But anyway, I was just pointing out some very erratic behavior and no matter what you say, you and I both know there’s at least an element of mob mentality when the single day gains and losses are this huge. The market’s not always rational.
by Black Francis on Oct 15, 2008 7:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The market is not always rational.
Neither are regulators.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
by benmor78 on Oct 15, 2008 8:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
McCain May as Well Cede
…the election to Obama. There’s nothing he can do to make up the kind of ground he needs to make up.
by Black Francis on Oct 15, 2008 4:27 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
We will see
I’m not sure a major terrorist attack or similar shock couldn’t change things.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
by DJCahill on Oct 15, 2008 4:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
what's sad is
that obama probably hopes the markets keep declining until eleciton day and mccain probably hopes that something bad like that happens…but i really don’t think mccain would be better suited to handle that. he’s…“erratic”
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
by gossamer on Oct 15, 2008 5:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I seriously doubt
that Obama hopes the markets tank. One, I don’t see him hoping for bad news, two, he doesn’t need it. I also seriously doubt that McCain wants a terrorist attack. I give both men much more credit than that, they’re dedicated public servants even though their also double talking politicians.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
by t ball on Oct 15, 2008 6:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
that may have been a little harsh
to say they “hope”.
lemme try it this way, obama realizes that he is benefiting from the economy going in the pooper. mccain realizes that it’s hurting him. mccain realizes that americans think he’s more suited to handle national defense stuff, obama knows this as well.
now it’s the party hacks that indeed “hope” for those things. the right wing media spinnsters like limbaugh and hannity etc… hope for an “event”.
the left wing hacks like amy goodwin, michael moore and greg palast are probably rooting for the econonmy to tank (or at least not get better) until november 5th.
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
by gossamer on Oct 15, 2008 7:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
michael moore
ugh
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"I'm more happy to be a Dallas Cowboy than when I got my first bike" - Roy Williams (WR)
by knockoutking on Oct 16, 2008 8:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Again, there's nothing HE can do.
And I’m not sure a national security crisis like that would be enough, as Obama’s poll numbers on those kinds of issues have risen, too. It may be enough to win him Ohio, but Obama’s lead in the other large battleground states has grown insurmountable if you believe the polls.
Anyway, the reason Obama will win this election is because of his ground game, which is incredibly disciplined, well-funded, extremely organized, and is everywhere. Nothing short of a time machine can change the outcome now, in my opinion.
by Black Francis on Oct 15, 2008 5:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What if:
We invade Iran btw now and Nov 4th?
I actually bet one of my buddies on this in early Feb, and Nov 4th was the cutoff. He thought the repubs would use it as an “ace in the hole” move, but they seem to be running out of time. I think he can go ahead and ship the monies.
-or-
We “find” Osama bin Laden
At this rate, he’ll be throwing 107-110 by 2012
by trident on Oct 15, 2008 5:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I thought that second one would happen
right before the last election. Just wanted to jump in there.
-- Micah
Baseball Is My Boyfriend
"Football is like having a fling once a week. Baseball is a relationship." - oc
by baseballismyboyfriend on Oct 15, 2008 8:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
People
Actually are saying they trust Obama to handle an emergency better right now.
by brettgardner on Oct 15, 2008 5:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
George has pretty much
poisoned the well for any Republican right now.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
by DJCahill on Oct 15, 2008 5:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fascinating
Article in the NYT the other day about how Republicans, and Gordon Smith in particular, are running against themselves and are trying to ride on Obama’s coattails.
by brettgardner on Oct 15, 2008 5:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gordon Smith
sounds like real conniving scumbag… but all I know of him is what I just read in that article.
The problem appears to be the same at every level, the bipartisan system is a joke. Quoted from the link above:
‘Why don’t you put "Republican" on these fliers?’
‘Because I don’t want to lose.’
That’s what it’s usually about, R or D. Get rid of that bs and run as candidates with ideas and solutions compared to your opponent. How can it be that every damn republican with a chance for the presidency is for the right to bear arms? Isn’t that a civil liberty? Why do dems stand against it? I don’t get much of this crap.
I’m liberal in a lot of areas, but you’ll never take my guns and I’m not sure universal health care is such a good idea (neither is what we have today, though). I hope for the day that a legit third party can come shake things up…
At this rate, he’ll be throwing 107-110 by 2012
by trident on Oct 15, 2008 5:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The problem
with 3rd party candidates is that they siphon off voters from one candidate and that allows the other to win. See 1992.
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
by RangerMad on Oct 15, 2008 7:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Or on the other end of the spectrum
2000.
by Black Francis on Oct 15, 2008 7:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Third Parties
If third parties ever get any momentum in this country, it will be after some huge calamity or perhaps the GOP splintering off the religious right. Either way, the minor part will be, at first, relatively narrow in scope and will align itself in the legislature with whichever party it came from, and because they could threaten to hold out their votes the extremes would actually become even more powerful.
Now I’m not defending the two-party system. They’re just structurally entrenched and it’s unlikely a third party could ever get enough traction to be a major player for any length of time. For better or worse, we seem to be locked into this.
And I’m kind of like you. I don’t favor nationalized health care like the NHS, but do think we need to do something. Universal insurance may not be a bad idea, but whatever the solution, it’s apparent to most of us that the status quo just isn’t working. In terms of guns, I don’t like having to carry but in my business I kind of have to, and I sure wouldn’t like it if the government were to say I couldn’t. I think I would just carry it anyway. It’s AMERICA!
by Black Francis on Oct 15, 2008 8:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks for the info
Just out of curiosity, what is it you do that requires you to carry a gun?
And I checked out your pictures linked from your profile, you have some really great shots in there…. do you have to be armed to be a photographer? I noticed you were in some seedy parts of town in a few of those
At this rate, he’ll be throwing 107-110 by 2012
by trident on Oct 16, 2008 2:54 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Uh
I’m a very effective community organizer? Mafioso? I’m trying to think of something cool sounding to answer that question. To be honest I don’t want to say exactly what I do. It is legal…I’m not a drug dealer or a pimp or anything like that. The fact is that I am in those neighborhoods a lot, though, which is why they are photographed so much. Plus I just like those parts of town. The people there are more real, and their surroundings reflect that. The young ones who aren’t employed, though…you have to look out for them.
Being a photographer in these parts of town, yes I would say it’s practically necessary to be armed. Photographic equipment is very expensive and a criminal would know it’s worth something. When I have that shit out on the streets in some neighborhoods I’m extremely careful without a doubt. Out of 200 people, 199 won’t bother you. But if you’re out there enough that 200th person will come around. I’ve never had to shoot anyone but twice people have tried to take my camera and lens. They were unsuccessful. I have three things working for me: 1) I’m careful and very aware, 2) I’m a mean looking son of a bitch who displays no fear, and third and most importantly, to get the best light you have to get up early and most criminals simply aren’t awake yet.
In spite of the very few who will cause trouble, I really like those parts of town like I said. They’re authentic and even the decay has a certain beauty to it. As long as it’s there I’m going to photograph it. I realize that may put me at a higher risk of being a homicide victim or having to draw my weapon, and that’s just a trade-off I’m willing to make. Every time I go out I pray that neither of those things happen.
Thanks for the comments on the photos. I’m glad you enjoyed them.
by Black Francis on Oct 16, 2008 5:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
third and most importantly, to get the best light you have to get up early and most criminals simply aren’t awake yet.
this is pure gold
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"I'm more happy to be a Dallas Cowboy than when I got my first bike" - Roy Williams (WR)
by knockoutking on Oct 16, 2008 8:07 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
thanks kind of what brought mccain back into it
well other than palin but being right about russia didnt hurt lol
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"I'm more happy to be a Dallas Cowboy than when I got my first bike" - Roy Williams (WR)
by knockoutking on Oct 16, 2008 8:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Also
I wonder when ben will pop in to tell us that this debate will be graded on a curve.
by brettgardner on Oct 15, 2008 5:33 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I'd be interested to hear that logic.
I think the bottom line is that McCain needs a clear, obvious win. Not a draw, not a “victory on points” or some such nonsense. It’s got to be a legit, almost inarguable victory tonight.
Anything less, and the ballgame really might be over.
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
by ghtd36 on Oct 15, 2008 6:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
OT: Anbody
see the ABC show ad at the top of the page? It’s cool and all but I’ve got to say I miss the Snorg Tee girls.
Fire Todd Dodge. Seriously. 59-30 to U LA LA? Come on.
by sprite on Oct 15, 2008 6:41 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
The girls didn't do much for me
but the shirts amused me
-- Micah
Baseball Is My Boyfriend
"Football is like having a fling once a week. Baseball is a relationship." - oc
by baseballismyboyfriend on Oct 15, 2008 8:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
McCain on the offensive early
Good for him.
Fire Todd Dodge. Seriously. 59-30 to U LA LA? Come on.
by sprite on Oct 15, 2008 8:11 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
McCain could really be owning Obama right now on the Joe the Plumber point
if he could just articulate his point a little better. He doesn’t seem like he really knows what he is talking about.
by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 15, 2008 8:12 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
i think that
joe sixpack doesn’t mind if the super wealthy “share the wealth”…but mccain seems to think they do. he should have just said, “socialism!!!” i think that gets his point across better
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
by gossamer on Oct 15, 2008 8:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He just seems really uncomfortable
by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 15, 2008 8:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i'm not able to watch the debate much
right now. i am catching bits and pieces. from what i see mccain is doing real well and obama ain’t really doing great.
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
by gossamer on Oct 15, 2008 8:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Joe the plumber is totally getting laid tonight.
God that whole argument was just stupid to me. You’re right they gave no facts. They both danced around this rather ambiguous hypothetical situation and gave no facts. Bleh.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Oct 15, 2008 8:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Senator McCain you're first.
I wonder why?
I am the motherfucking shore patrol, motherfucker! I am the motherfucking shore patrol! Give this man a beer.
by TheBZA on Oct 15, 2008 8:26 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I like this question
about how they’re running their campaigns
-- Micah
Baseball Is My Boyfriend
"Football is like having a fling once a week. Baseball is a relationship." - oc
by baseballismyboyfriend on Oct 15, 2008 8:29 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Hey Hey Hey
Taking a shot at the Cowboys. Not cool.
Fire Todd Dodge. Seriously. 59-30 to U LA LA? Come on.
by sprite on Oct 15, 2008 8:30 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
he's trying to win them Eagles fans in Pennsylvania
heh
In reference to how good the Steelers have been in their history: "No one is even close to them."- Steal Home
by hinduplaya on Oct 15, 2008 8:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
McCain keeps ripping Obama but Obama seems reticent to counterpunch
Seems to this uneducated observer that he just knows he’s way ahead and is playing not to lose. This strikes me as the political equivalent of the prevent defense.
Or maybe Obama just ain’t got enough mean in him.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Oct 15, 2008 8:32 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
McCain is kind of a crybaby...
“You didn’t stick up for me!”
by cmkelly29 on Oct 15, 2008 8:34 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
and
“the campaign got dirty because you didn’t wanna have town hall meetings on my terms!!!”
i watched the whole exchange on why they attack each other and if they’d talk about it face to fact. i don’t think mccain did much to damage him, he had no new info and obama addressed each issue. mccain is acting childish in what i’ve seen since the beginning when he was winning
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
by gossamer on Oct 15, 2008 8:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh my
McCain’s answer will be interesting for this question
by cmkelly29 on Oct 15, 2008 8:41 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
heh
Obama is trying really hard not to say the word “experience” as a reason Biden > Palin.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Oct 15, 2008 8:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
what was the question?
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
by gossamer on Oct 15, 2008 8:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
McCain
is one of the biggest smart asses i have ever seen.
In reference to how good the Steelers have been in their history: "No one is even close to them."- Steal Home
by hinduplaya on Oct 15, 2008 8:43 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Yah
He’s just throwing as many punches as he can trying to see if one can connect. He’s playing like he has nothing to lose.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Oct 15, 2008 8:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
because really he doesnt
hes how far behind, and needs a hail mary to win
so might as well air it out lol
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"I'm more happy to be a Dallas Cowboy than when I got my first bike" - Roy Williams (WR)
by knockoutking on Oct 16, 2008 8:09 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Breath of fresh air?
Look across the table.
I am the motherfucking shore patrol, motherfucker! I am the motherfucking shore patrol! Give this man a beer.
by TheBZA on Oct 15, 2008 8:43 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
"America has gotten to know Sarah Palin"
lol…
A.) Not true, she’s talked to what, 3 media types?
B.) The more we’ve found out, the worse it’s been for you, John.
by cmkelly29 on Oct 15, 2008 8:44 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
You know
I wonder why I put myself through the continual beating of watching these things.
That 20 minute exchange about “Joe the Plumber” was an extended exercise in demonstrating a policy difference between the two that’s been very public for quite some time.
Boring. I’m watching South Park.
by brettgardner on Oct 15, 2008 8:56 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
If McCain wins
your new secretary of defense: Joe the Plumber.
He loves this guy.
by cmkelly29 on Oct 15, 2008 9:01 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Joe the Plumber is pissing me the F off.
No more Joe the Plumber references. Please.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Oct 15, 2008 9:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm one more Joe the Plumber reference away from turning this off.
McCain is just pissing me off at this point.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Oct 15, 2008 9:02 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
joe six pack
is getting jealous
and so is suzy the moose, soccer mom and my pitbull with lipstick. mavericks love it though.
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
by gossamer on Oct 15, 2008 9:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Obama's in prevent defense.
He’s happy to run out the clock. Obama’s trying to duck punches, but to him, a draw is a win.
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
by ghtd36 on Oct 15, 2008 9:03 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
They should have a BS Debate
with questions like
“Ketchup or Mustard?”
“George or Kramer?”
by cmkelly29 on Oct 15, 2008 9:04 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Obama will pick Ketchup.
McCain will claim that Obama’s only picking ketchup because terrorists love ketchup, and choose mustard.
Obama will say that McCain has supported Bush’s mustard policies for the past eight years.
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
by ghtd36 on Oct 15, 2008 9:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Here's a good one
“If you could take a running punch at one of your opponent’s body parts, which one would it be?”
by cmkelly29 on Oct 15, 2008 9:07 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I'd prefer one where they were forced to answer the freaking questions.
“How much do you think you can reduce dependency on foreign oil in your first four years? Give me a specific number as a target.”
Guess whether or not either of them gave anything resembling a number to that question.
God I hate political debates.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Oct 15, 2008 9:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That was an unanswerable question
by Black Francis on Oct 15, 2008 9:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Most probably, yes.
But neither of them even tried or even tried to address why that question was unanswerable. They just did that annoying politician thing where they make a quick vague reference to the basic premise of a question and then go off on a tangent that allows them to slam the other guy.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Oct 15, 2008 9:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
When McCain met JTP
JTP must have let him bump uglies with his wife.
by cmkelly29 on Oct 15, 2008 9:05 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
don't tax my health plan!!!
reduce my costs???
i think we all know who wins on that subject.
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
by gossamer on Oct 15, 2008 9:07 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
drudge poll!
{{{{DRUDGE POLL}}}} WHO WON THE FINAL PRESIDENTIAL DEBATE?…
MCCAIN
75% 9,325
OBAMA
24% 2,990
NEITHER
2% 199
Total Votes: 12,514
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
by gossamer on Oct 15, 2008 9:07 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
MUST BE TRUE!
Shit, Obama’s done.
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
by ghtd36 on Oct 15, 2008 9:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
why is the drudge poll always the same
seriously last time it was 75-24.
by cashman on Oct 15, 2008 9:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
on the litmus test
wouldn’t it be nice if candidates were honest for once.
we KNOW obama would appoint a pro choice justice. and mccain would appoint a pro life justice. just admit it.
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
by gossamer on Oct 15, 2008 9:10 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Pro-Abortion
No such thing, McCain.
Pro-choice? Yes.
by cmkelly29 on Oct 15, 2008 9:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
a lot of people seem to think
that there is some welfare lady in some ghetto that gets knocked up 3 or 4 times a year and then gets an abortion just for fun
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
by gossamer on Oct 15, 2008 9:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Some welfare lady in some ghetto
couldn’t afford 3 to 4 abortions a year. They are not cheap.
-- Micah
Baseball Is My Boyfriend
"Football is like having a fling once a week. Baseball is a relationship." - oc
by baseballismyboyfriend on Oct 15, 2008 9:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
but see
anti-choice taxpayers are probably paying for it unwillingly
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
by gossamer on Oct 15, 2008 9:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's probably how they see it
I just think there’s a huge misconception about the pro-choice stance. (No pun intended.)
-- Micah
Baseball Is My Boyfriend
"Football is like having a fling once a week. Baseball is a relationship." - oc
by baseballismyboyfriend on Oct 15, 2008 9:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That drives me crazy too
Pro-choice does not mean pro-abortion.
-- Micah
Baseball Is My Boyfriend
"Football is like having a fling once a week. Baseball is a relationship." - oc
by baseballismyboyfriend on Oct 15, 2008 9:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly.
Nobody likes abortion.
And he mentioned adoption as if that is always a 100% solution. Memo to John McCain: everyone likes adoption. Nobody is against you on that.
That’s like saying, “I want to protect puppies! My opponent voted against puppies five times!”
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
by ghtd36 on Oct 15, 2008 9:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Obama's record
seems to indicate otherwise. And his words:
"I’ve got two daughters. 9 years old and 6 years old. I am going to teach them first of all about values and morals. But if they make a mistake, I don’t want them punished with a baby."
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 1:06 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Whatever.
Obama was talking about sex education, not abortion, when he made that statement. That is not a pro-abortion statement, it is a pro-sex education statement. The “punishment” is coming from the people who would deny sex education to youth other than abstinence. Abstinence-only kids have sex just as much as others, it ain’t working.
Meanwhile McCain votes against measures that would protect women from domestic violence. McCain thinks putting Palin on the ticket is going to get him women’s votes while he is anti-almost anything a majority of women support.
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by t ball on Oct 16, 2008 1:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Huh?
How can “people who would deny sex education to youth other than abstinence” punish his daughters with a baby? The mistake would be theirs, not anyone else’s. Obama meant what he said – that a baby would be punishment to his daughters. You can’t spin that. And btw, abstinence-only kids by definition don’t have sex. Abstinence is 100% effective.
Obama has a terrible pro-abortion record. And this is a guy who doesn’t even know when life begins. Or at least he doesn’t want us to know that he knows…
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 2:41 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
God Help Us
Look, abstinence is obviously effective, but abstinence-only education will not. People will have sex and that’s the way it is whether you like it or not. It’s far better if they know about safe sex.
It’s funny how the “red” states — the ones all up on their moral high horses, including Texas — have the highest teen pregnancy, divorce rates, etc. When a young girl not even out of high school gets pregnant, that is a clearly a disadvantage to them because it makes it so much harder for them to educate themselves. I’ve known a few girls to get pregnant during high school and college and it was not easy for them. So, yeah, even though the baby itself may not be a punishment (they all loved their kids), the timing sure as hell was.
And nobody is pro-abortion, you zealot.
by Black Francis on Oct 16, 2008 5:30 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Abstinence only is a failure
A long-awaited national study has concluded that abstinence-only sex education, a cornerstone of the Bush administration’s social agenda, does not keep teenagers from having sex. Neither does it increase or decrease the likelihood that if they do have sex, they will use a condom.
By the end of the study, when the average child was just shy of 17, half of both groups had remained abstinent. The sexually active teenagers had sex the first time at about age 15. Less than a quarter of them, in both groups, reported using a condom every time they had sex. More than a third of both groups had two or more partners.
The stick your head in the sand approach does not work.
As for abortion, I can think of many issues that are far more important right now. Anyone basing their vote on abortion is blindly ignoring a whole host of urgent problems that need Obama’s cool head and willingness to listen to other opinions over McCain’s knee-jerking reactionary temper.
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by t ball on Oct 16, 2008 8:06 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Be careful with your header
It’s not “abstinence only” that’s a failure – it’s young people making wrong choices. No education works unless it is applied. (That goes for “comprehensive sex education” as well.)
If young people remain chaste, then it works. If they ignore it and have sex, then it doesn’t work. Teaching kids things always has a varied success rate and depends on their motivation to actually apply what is taught. Teenagers generally have strong urges and weak wills. (Though I wonder how educators can expect teens to say no to drugs, yet they then hand out condoms with advice to “keep it safe.” Are not both drives equally controllable?) Abstinence-only works if the person has the good character attributes required for success – and that education begins in the home.
Another problem is that many people don’t want to teach an abstinence-only message, b/c they don’t really believe it themselves. It’s really hard to persuade someone else about what you don’t believe – and kids can see through that hypocrisy.
Concerning abortion, it is no longer mainly a “teen only” issue. The abortion problem in America is sustained primarily among fully-grown, adult women (inc. many who are married or are in committed relationships), and primarily in low-income and minority communities. So even in that sense it’s an important issue.
But even more importantly, though there are certainly many other important issues, what is more important than the right to life? ‘Choice’ in itself isn’t a value – that value depends on what is chosen. We need a culture that protects life.
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 10:00 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sure if they remain chaste it works
the argument though, is that spending the time to teach chastity is a waste of time, because it isn’t any more effective than not teaching anything at all.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
by DJCahill on Oct 16, 2008 10:18 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wrong
Thousands of young people can testify otherwise. There is abundant evidence that abstinence-based sex education programs work, and work well. A recent Virginia study concluded that Virginia teens who receive abstinence education are half as likely to initiate sexual activities as students who did not receive this education. And contrary to what Planned Parenthood suggests, Virginia’s abstinence programs do include information about contraception and sexually transmitted diseases. But they also put it in the proper context: that abstaining from sex is the most effective way to avoid the dangers of casual sex.
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah!
We need a culture of LIFE, people. LIFE is the single most important thing in the world.
Well, unless that inscrutable, microscopic dot we call life becomes a flaming liberal. Then it’s OK, and completely justified of course, to wish death on that person.
Oh yeah, and if that little dot pushes its way out of that slimy birth canal and is subject to a life of abuse, poverty and utter cruelty? Fuck ‘em. Pull yourself up by your bootstraps and stop suckin’ on the government teat!
by brettgardner on Oct 16, 2008 11:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Assert yourself.
It’s enough of your conclusory language.
by brettgardner on Oct 16, 2008 12:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is a real slippery slope for you
One might wonder how Gov. Palin, the VP candidate you support, can support abstinence-only programs when she conceived out of wedlock and her daughter has conceived out of wedlock.
Neither her parents or herself as parent has done a very good job of promoting abstinence-only sex-ed in her own home. Do as I say and not as I do? In the case of abstinence, I’m not sure that’s a real good philosophy.
by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 16, 2008 1:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Where did
you hear that her eldest son was concieved out of wedlock?
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
by RangerMad on Oct 16, 2008 2:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
She's never commented on it
But, based on the dates she has provided, her oldest son would have to have been born six weeks premature in order for the conception to not have happened before her and her husband eloped.
by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 16, 2008 2:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So of course you
just assume that she got pregnant before they were married. You do realize that premature births are a common occurence.
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
by RangerMad on Oct 16, 2008 3:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sure, you could say I'm being assumptive
7.5 month pregnancy + eloping + chooses to neither confirm nor deny = if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck …
Anyhow, if you’d like to strike that statement from the record, you’re welcome to. I’ll stick by my initial assertion based on her daughter’s current situation.
by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 16, 2008 3:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Mr. Ostrich
Get your head out of the sand. Kids that receive abstinence only education – even from committed people who totally believe in it — have sex anyway at the same rate as other teens. It does not work.
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by t ball on Oct 16, 2008 11:18 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
See
Obama win the election on Nov. 4. You do understand that a lot of Christians, including Barack Obama, are pro-choice and approve of sex education, right?
Barack Obama is a Christian who holds his beliefs just as dearly as you hold yours.
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by t ball on Oct 16, 2008 11:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What makes you think
that Obama is a Christian?
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 12:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Please tell me that was a joke.
Please. For my sanity.
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
by ghtd36 on Oct 16, 2008 12:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No
Of COURSE Obama’s not a Christian. He hasn’t advocated killing John McCain. Duh. What part don’t you get?
by brettgardner on Oct 16, 2008 12:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No joke
Go ahead and tell me why you think he’s a Christian.
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 12:45 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Obama
has shown more Christian behavior than you have with your terrible, tasteless jokes.
What makes you think he isn’t? The man attends church and claims he’s a Christian. That’s all I need.
I am the motherfucking shore patrol, motherfucker! I am the motherfucking shore patrol! Give this man a beer.
by TheBZA on Oct 16, 2008 12:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
they don't go to the same church...
….therefore Him deserves the right to cast him off because of his name… if his name was john graham is christianity would NEVER be questioned…
and btw Him… are you implying that all Muslims are terrorists and evil doers? since you are trying to say barack isn’t christian, he must, and i’m guess your opinion here, be muslim, cause of his name, and therefore be a terrorist cause he’s a muslim…
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
by ivysafety39 on Oct 16, 2008 12:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
well...
and explanation of your though would clear all that up… but you tend to make vague assertions implying such things without actual accusation…
so go ahead and explain, please. i’ve laid out several questions to several of your points and they all got brushed aside… a bit of a “i hear your point, i just don’t wanna address it cause its a tough one…” mentality… my dad, a devout catholic, was the same way…
nows the part where you question whether my father was “really” catholic…
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
by ivysafety39 on Oct 16, 2008 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I told one joke – don’t get carried away.
Going to church doesn’t make someone a Christian any more than going into a garage makes someone a car.
If someone claims that he/she is a Christian then it makes it so?
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i believe...
from what i understand, all someone has to believe is that “jesus died for their sins” to be a christian… to far off base? and if thats true, then who are YOU to question barack obama’s faith, and more than i can question yours?
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
by ivysafety39 on Oct 16, 2008 12:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No no no
You’re not getting it. In order to be a Christian, you must agree with every political tenet of the ideology of whatever purported Christian is in your immediate vicinity.
Actually believing that Jesus died for your sins is wholly irrelevant to the question. Frankly, it’s offensive that you live in a predominantly Christian nation and you haven’t yet grasped the foundations of the religion.
by brettgardner on Oct 16, 2008 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
funny.
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
by ivysafety39 on Oct 16, 2008 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
offensive
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"I'm more happy to be a Dallas Cowboy than when I got my first bike" - Roy Williams (WR)
by knockoutking on Oct 16, 2008 1:49 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
ivy
I have to give up the computer right now, but you have a good question there, and I’ll get back to you…
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lynchin' time, huh?
We’ve all got our priorities I guess.
by brettgardner on Oct 16, 2008 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
A Christian
is a true follower of Jesus Christ. It’s someone who has placed their faith and trust in Him, and seeks to do His will.
In the end, only God really knows peoples’ hearts, and who are the true believers. However, there are ‘evidences’ that someone is a true believer, including: the fruit of the Spirit [Galatians 5:22-23], the character of the Christian as described in the Sermon on the Mount [Matthew 5-7], and the various ‘tests’ that are sprinkled in I John (test of consciousness of sin, test of obedience, test of freedom from habitual sin, test of love for others, test of belief).
So, in other words, God will have changed that person’s life in such a way that the fruit of his/her life will show that he/she is a true follower of Christ.
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 2:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So all good people go to heaven?
by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 16, 2008 2:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You tell us
You seem to think you’re qualified to judge.
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by t ball on Oct 16, 2008 2:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I need to know
what Robert means by ‘good’ before I can answer.
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 2:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If you don't practice the teachings
of the Sermon on the Mount on a daily basis and pass the tests I John then you cannot go to heaven?
by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 16, 2008 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Follow up question
If you are saved, does that make you a Christian?
by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 16, 2008 3:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
When someone becomes a Christian
God will begin to change that person from the inside out – thoughts, attitudes, etc. A believer who is truly changed will exhibit the character qualities that are described in the Sermon on the Mount (it’s a description of character rather than a set of “do’s and don’ts”).
With the I John tests it’s important to emphasize that they are talking about habitual conduct, and not one-off sins. A person who habitually lives by the precepts of those tests shows evidence of being a rue believer.
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 3:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So when
does God begin to work this change in you?
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by t ball on Oct 16, 2008 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
what evidence do you have that obama is less a true believer than you are 4him?
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
by ivysafety39 on Oct 16, 2008 3:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
no its my turn to ask for a response.
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
by ivysafety39 on Oct 16, 2008 4:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Do you know true believers who are
overweight?
smoke?
judgmental?
materialistic?
struggle with any type of addition?
Certainly your answer must be yes. The sins committed by these people are habitual, so therefore they cannot pass judgment with you. Fortunately, you’re not the jury.
But here’s my real problem with the way you are behaving on this board: Do you see how many people you have inflamed? Your arrogant stance and attitude have done nothing but further alienate those who — I will assume — you’re trying to reach with your Christian message.
The tone you set is counterproductive to what I will assume is your goal of participating in these discussions.
While society has made WWJD cliche, if anyone needs to think about WWJD before they speak/post, its you.
by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 16, 2008 3:57 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Robert
the things you mentioned are not the tests of I John – don’t confuse the issue.
I am not the jury, nor I am the judge – God is. What I’ve shared here is His truth, not mine. If anyone is ‘inflamed’, then it is toward God Himself. Where is the arrogant tone that you are talking about?
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 4:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow
What I’ve shared here is His truth, not mine. If anyone is ‘inflamed’, then it is toward God Himself.
That comment seems somewhat Koreshian in nature.
It appears that you have a desire to share your views on faith. Unfortunately your inability to relate or sympathize with those who don’t share the same views have kept you from being an effective communicator. It’s a common issue with theological egoists.
by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 16, 2008 4:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sorry
but Koresh had nothing to do with God’s truth.
Unfortunately your inability to relate or sympathize with those who don’t share the same views…
Is that so? Well then, given the impersonal nature of such a blog, how do you propose that I do this? And how have you related and sympathized with me?
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 4:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Your holier than thou
comments here hardly inspire sympathy. None of us have a monopoly on “true” faith. I could be totally wrong and you could be totally right, but none of us is qualified to say so.
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by t ball on Oct 16, 2008 5:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I am simple sharing
truth from the Bible, which is God’s Word. That is the standard of true faith. So instead of putting labels on me, I suggest that you take it up with God by searching the Scriptures for yourself.
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 5:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I understand your goal
and that would be considering sympathizing. I’ve tried to explain from a factual perspective that the way you communicate is counterproductive. I can’t do any more than that and there’s no sense in continuing this dialogue with a religious egoist. There’s nothing that I can say that stop you from alienating those you seemingly wish to reach.
by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 16, 2008 5:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm trying to understand you
Instead of calling me names, show me where I’ve exhibited an arrogant tone. How have I communicated in a counterproductive way?
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 5:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Here's how
I am simple sharing truth from the Bible, which is God’s Word.
Statements like that make it seem you think you have the one, correct and true interpretation of the Bible. That is an extremely arrogant stance for any Christian. You do not have a monopoly on Truth. We are all aware of the concept of Grace.
All of your posts today imply that Obama is somehow not a Christian. If he says he is, why should I doubt it anymore than I doubt McCain’s profession of faith?
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by t ball on Oct 16, 2008 8:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good luck
I’ve given up. I try very hard to keep to myself and generally stay civil, but hypocrisy is my Kryptonite.
by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 16, 2008 8:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
There is
only one Truth. There is only one way to God, and that is through Jesus Christ. Jesus says, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.” He proved His uniqueness by dying on the cross and rising again, taking on the punishment that we deserved b/c of our sins.
No other religion can point to a moment in history and say, “This is what God has done for us.” No other religion tells us how God took the initiative to save us. Religion is man’s way of trying to reach God through good works. Christianity is God taking the initiative to reach down to us and offering us a free gift – forgiveness and eternal life. That’s what grace is all about.
The question about Obama would require a much longer answer, but on this particular issue (the uniqueness of Christ) he has indicated that people from other religions are “children of God” and that being a ‘good’ person can get someone into heaven. In other words, he is suggesting that Jesus Christ is not the only way to heaven and a relationship with Him.
by 4Him on Oct 17, 2008 1:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ok, so your position
is that because Obama shows respect for other religions, a founding principle of our country, he is somehow not Christian.
And are you saying that people who do not believe are not children of God? All people on earth are children of God, even though not all of them are either aware of it or have accepted it.
And when you delve into Grace vs. actions, you are talking about a theological point that religious scholars have argued about for 2000 years. I don’t see how you can use that to say Obama isn’t a Christian.
If you polled every Christian in this country, many would share the view point expressed in Obama’s statement, either out of ignorance or because they were actually taught that in church or Sunday school.
I seriously doubt you have examined McCain’s statements in such detail. You are selectively judging the faith of Obama only because he is a Democrat. And you contradict your own statements in doing so. If Obama truly believes, he is saved by God’s grace EVEN IF he says the statement you use above.
God does not require a Christian to be doctrinally correct to be saved. We only must believe. Doctrine is something agreed to in a committee of men and subject to interpretation. God alone can give grace.
Stop trying to pass judgment on Obama’s faith and stop trying to give all of us unwashed heathens the true word as interpreted by you.
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by t ball on Oct 17, 2008 8:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don't confuse
being respectful of other religions with the exclusiveness of the salvation message. One can respect other religions (which contain some truth as well), but that doesn’t take away from the fact that there is only one way to a relationship with God, and that is through Jesus Christ. People (however sincere) have all kinds of false concepts about God, but the God of the Bible has clearly revealed Himself and proven Himself to be the one true God.
So the only true “children of God” are those who have placed their faith and trust in Jesus Christ. John 1:12 explains: But as many as received Him (Jesus), to them He gave the right to become children of God." All people are created by God, but they become his children when they take that step of faith and become believers.
That is a basic teaching that a Christian should know, and Obama has said other things about the Bible that clearly show that he doesn’t know what he is talking about. Which leads to another issue – his church. Not only does it seem that he didn’t receive solid teaching from the Word of God, but he actually sat under a racist preacher for over 20 years. If I have enough time, I will try to write more about this.
I don’t know if John McCain is a true Christian, but I haven’t seen evidences that he might not be. With Obama, as I’ve said, I have serious doubts.
by 4Him on Oct 17, 2008 9:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
"True" Christian
There is no such thing. Stop trying to be the arbiter of true faith.
If I have enough time, I will try to write more about this.
Spare us, please. You have said more than enough already. I get it. You alone (or your church I guess) know what a true Christian is, and anyone who says anything that does not fit your doctrine is not a true Christian.
You are the most spiritually arrogant person I have come across in a very long time. You would have made a good Pharisee.
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by t ball on Oct 17, 2008 10:20 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thank you
Spare us, please.
Absolutely agree. 4Him please spare us your comments. Not just on this issue, but your opinions in general. The whole point of this was to try and determine why you think Obama isn’t a Christian. Evidently his reason is “I don’t want to vote for him”.
You have successfully hijacked this thread and turned it into a religious discussion. I’m all for constructive debating but it’s hopeless with you. You cherry pick your arguements, spin the conversation and ignore direct questions. Please. Stop. Posting.
I am the motherfucking shore patrol, motherfucker! I am the motherfucking shore patrol! Give this man a beer.
by TheBZA on Oct 17, 2008 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Another promoter of tolerance
I hijacked the thread? Look, I simply responded to people’s questions and comments as I had time. Whether people had true interest or simply wanted to attack me, you can judge for yourself.
by 4Him on Oct 17, 2008 1:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
My problem
Was with your assumption on Obama’s faith, which you have done a terrible job of communicating and elaborating on. tball summed up everything else.
I am the motherfucking shore patrol, motherfucker! I am the motherfucking shore patrol! Give this man a beer.
by TheBZA on Oct 17, 2008 1:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, you don't get it
It’s not about what I know, it’s about what God’s Word teaches. Show me something that I’ve shared here which isn’t true based on what the Bible teaches. There are thousands of churches which faithfully teach the Word of God.
You know, I have consistently responded to you on this blog b/c I saw you as someone who, despite having a worldview which is far different from mine, would at least seek to attack ideas, and not the person (unlike many on here, bg being the worst). I guess I was wrong about that, and you have also shown yourself to be incredibly intolerant.
by 4Him on Oct 17, 2008 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You have
No ideas, save those that you’ve invented in order to speak for God, which I find most disgusting and, in a way, amusing.
by brettgardner on Oct 17, 2008 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, I get it.
It’s about Grace, and you seem to think that Obama’s politics are more important than God’s grace. You have the nerve to judge someone else’s faith, and just coincidentally, that person happens to be on the opposite side of the politicial spectrum as you. I find that arrogant and convenient.
You don’t agree with Obama’s politics so you slander his faith credentials. You accuse me of attacking you, yet all I’m doing is calling you out for attacking Obama’s faith, which you have no standing to do.
Every comment you post just makes you seem even more obtuse. You don’t get it. It is NOT UP TO YOU to judge someone’s faith. Just stop.
Disagree with someone’s politics, fine. Debate Christian doctrine, fine, but don’t assume that you are “right” and everyone else is wrong on doctrine. Doctrine is simply man’s interpretation of God’s word, and you are confusing it with God’s word.
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by t ball on Oct 17, 2008 1:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What
“doctrine of man” have I espoused here? Can you articulate it? Again, I have simply shared what God’s Word says. If you can’t receive what the Bible says, then you’ve got a real problem on your hands.
Many politicians claim that they are Christians, for obvious reasons. Obama is running for the highest office in the land. As a believer, I want to know how real his faith is (with God’s Word, the Bible, being the standard). He should be for the things that God is for, and against the things that God is against.
Obama espouses that there are many ways to God, when God clearly says that there is only one way to Him (through Jesus Christ). He is the most pro-abortion major-party candidate for President in American history (including support for the barbaric procedure known as partial birth abortion). God is absolutely pro-life.
What about his character? Character matters. And bad company reflects character. Obama has had long-term associations with people like convicted felon Tony Rezko, unrepentant terrorist Bill Ayers and rev. Jeremiah Wright. Unbelievably, he sat for over twenty years as a disciple of Wright, who repeatedly spewed hatred, racism and anti-American statements.
While Obama may not agree with the incendiary views of Wright and Ayers, it’s alarming that he tolerated them for so long. At minimum, he has shown very poor judgment. And having good judgment is something that is very important for a President.
If you want to vote for someone like Obama, that’s your choice. But don’t tell me that I can’t have an opinion about his faith.
by 4Him on Oct 18, 2008 2:50 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ayers, Wright, etc.
So, it’s ok that McCain calls G. Gordon Liddy a friend even though Liddy advised people to deal with ATF agents by shooting them? That seems even worse to me than anything Ayers or Wright have done, but no one is calling out McCain on that.
And yes, it is wrong for you to question Obama’s faith. It is perfectly alright for you to disagree with his theology but you go beyond that and actually questioned his faith. That’s a line you can’t cross in my view.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
by t ball on Oct 18, 2008 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think
that you’re making a false dichotomy here. I’m not questioning his freedom to have faith – I’m questioning what he believes. That is his theology, right?
Faith is only as good as the object that it’s placed in. The object of that faith must be trustworthy. We don’t need just opinions about God, but we need to know the truth. It’s the truth that sets us free. Truth means that there is ultimate reality, ultimate meaning. There is something that is objectively true, and we need to respond to the God who exists objectively.
Fortunately, God wants us to know what he’s like. 2000 years ago He became a man in the person of Jesus Christ. In John 18:37, Jesus said, This is why I was born and came into the world. To tell people the truth." The truth sets people free from false ideas about God.
So if someone has a belief system that doesn’t match up with the God of the Bible, then it’s not true.
by 4Him on Oct 19, 2008 8:14 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I believe Obama said
in the latest debate that he did not support late-term or partial birth abortion.
-- Micah
Baseball Is My Boyfriend
"Football is like having a fling once a week. Baseball is a relationship." - oc
by baseballismyboyfriend on Oct 18, 2008 7:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Surely
you don’t believe whatever Obama (or other politicians) might say in a debate (such as the “tax break for 95% of Americans” gimmick). What’s much more telling is his pro-abortion record, which is appalling.
Obama has said that his first act should he become President would be to sign the Freedom of Choice Act. Unfortunately, the lip service that the pro-abort side pays to "abortion should be rare" is just that – lip service. Every effort to reduce the number of abortions has been opposed, and the mere existence of the Freedom of Choice Act proves it. People aren’t fooled – or at least they shouldn’t be.
by 4Him on Oct 19, 2008 8:30 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dumbshit.
That quote is completely out of context. The question he was asked was, essentially, what is your plan to restore some of the pro-choice gains lost in the SCOTUS decision of Gonzales v. Carhart. He answered, inartfully, that the first thing he’d do to combat that particular issue is pass the FOCA.
But I’m sure you don’t care about any view other than the one you’ve latched onto from some other nutty racist.
by brettgardner on Oct 19, 2008 8:40 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hold the phone
If god said the only way is through christ, then why did he write qu’ran?
by cashman on Oct 22, 2008 5:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
so if there was a person who is of a another religion
and has not done any bad deeds in their entire life, they would not go to heaven because they didn’t except JC?
by cashman on Oct 17, 2008 10:21 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don't go down that path
You know what he’s going to say.
I am the motherfucking shore patrol, motherfucker! I am the motherfucking shore patrol! Give this man a beer.
by TheBZA on Oct 17, 2008 10:38 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No one is perfect
Everyone has sinned, whether in word, thought or deed. The Bible is very clear about that:
No one is good – not even one. (Romans 3:10)
For all have sinned; all fall short of God’s glorious standard. (Rom 3:23)
That’s why we need a Savior. That’s why we need Jesus Christ.
For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. (Romans 6:23)
by 4Him on Oct 17, 2008 1:45 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not every human
in the world is a Christian. It’s a fact. So you’re gonna have to except that other people have differing opinions. You can’t say that the only way to get to heaven is through Jesus. Because you don’t know that. If you actually believe in God and are a Christian, then you would know that he is the only one that would know this. Not a spare blogger on LSB.
BTW anybody remember the greatness of “Huck” a couple years ago? I think this might be the same guy.
by AirJordan on Oct 17, 2008 2:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The issue of salvation
isn’t about who has what opinion. It’s about God’s plan for us as specified in His Word, the Bible. And God clearly says that the only way to have a relationship with him (and eternal life) is through Jesus Christ.
Maybe you missed the John 14:6 verse from an earlier post. Here is another (among many):
The apostle Peter, speaking about Jesus: "Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved" (Acts 4:12).
by 4Him on Oct 18, 2008 3:31 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
4Him's RHETORIC DRUM
him… until you actually answer the questions your being asked without deflecting to the same answer all you’re doing is giving christians a bad name… you can’t be asked a straight question about a statement you made question obama’s religious stance a deflect deflect deflect without answer the question… it just shows a lack of substance… i’ll give you one more shot at a respectable answer…
FINAL CHANCE:when you questioned whether obama was christian. from what you’ve written, you’re in no position to judge whether he is, or isn’t. only "god" can make that decision. yet you question(judge) the validity of his statement he is.
clarify your stance on how you can question Obama’s christianity.
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
by ivysafety39 on Oct 16, 2008 5:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don't forget this passage
You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.
Or maybe Do not judge, or you too will be judged.
Who do you think you are to judge someone else’s faith?
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
by t ball on Oct 16, 2008 2:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Slow down
t ball. I wanted to get to your other comment, but I guess I’ll reply to you here now.
Just b/c someone says that he/she is a Christian doesn’t make it so. As mentioned above, in the end only God really knows a person’s heart, but you can have a good idea based on the spiritual fruit (or lack thereof) in a person’s life.
So far, I haven’t even said what I think about Obama’s spiritual condition (but everyone jumped on me anyway). You made the claim that he’s a Christian, so I ask you again – on what basis do you think so?
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 2:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
completely assinine.
so, if only god knows, are you a christian? how do you know if only god knows? how can you dare say you are to anyone, since that would be presuming to know gods thoughts…
you use flawed logic. but then again, you think the world was created in 6 days.
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
by ivysafety39 on Oct 16, 2008 2:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah
My question would be, if you don’t know, why ask the original question? And what the hell is spiritual fruit?
This guy is a way out there holier than thou type who thinks he knows what’s best for everyone and ends up turning people away from the religion, which really sucks because if one reads what Jesus had to say it’s very tolerant.
by Black Francis on Oct 16, 2008 2:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I gave you an answer, now answer my question please
Besides his stance on abortion what has he done specifically that would lead you to believe he is incapable of being a Christian?
by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 16, 2008 3:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Anyone
is capable of being a Christian – he/she must simply be willing to trust in Christ and follow Him. Grace means that salvation is a free gift that we must simply receive by faith.
If have time, I will answer by responding to your comment below.
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 3:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
On what basis do I think Obama is a Christian?
Because he says he is, just like you, I, and John McCain, do. Who am I to doubt him?
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
by t ball on Oct 16, 2008 3:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
And one other thing.
So far, I haven’t even said what I think about Obama’s spiritual condition (but everyone jumped on me anyway).
You would not have asked the question if you did not think there was some doubt. You are coming off here as spiritually arrogant.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
by t ball on Oct 16, 2008 3:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
hahaha
Yes. If someone claims they are a Christian that’s all I need to know. There’s no reason to question someones faith. In fact, it’s pretty despicable.
What do you want him to do, take a freaking bible test? You are a joke.
I am the motherfucking shore patrol, motherfucker! I am the motherfucking shore patrol! Give this man a beer.
by TheBZA on Oct 16, 2008 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
hallelujah.
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
by ivysafety39 on Oct 16, 2008 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bible Test
I read that one of the primary debates, I believe it was a republican one, asked each guy to name their favorite Bible verse.
by JBImaknee on Oct 16, 2008 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm a dirty, dirty left-leaning moderate...
…and I have a favorite Bible verse.
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
by ghtd36 on Oct 16, 2008 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Judge not, lest ye be judged, my friend
You are the type that give us who do have sincere convictions a bad name.
Your piety gives you no right to judge someone’s faith.
by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 16, 2008 1:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i'm not the one he has a problem with.
stop redirecting. you caused this fire, don’t avoid the flames.
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
by ivysafety39 on Oct 16, 2008 2:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What are you talking about?
I can only reply to one person at a time – not ten at once.
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is a great point
and another thing to point out those who want to pass judgment is to remember that God did not reserve his greatest wrath for sinners, non-believers, adulterers or even thieves or murderers. His greatest wrath was reserved for the self righteous. Christians who want to be holier-than-thou should heed this lesson, as it is in the Bible and (imho) isn’t open to the (mis?)interpretation that so many other lessons in the Book fall to.
by Melmart1 on Oct 16, 2008 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
you've passed judgement.
when you questioned whether obama was christian. from what you’ve written, you’re in no position to judge whether he is, or isn’t. only “god” can make that decision. yet you question(judge) the validity of his statement he is.
i’m begging you to respond to me. as you seem to avoid all my direct questions.
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
by ivysafety39 on Oct 16, 2008 4:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Like many others
I do have a life outside of this blog. I respond when I can.
As I said, I haven’t even given my opinion yet on what I think of Obama’s spiritual condition (and given people’s hysteria here, I don’t know if I will). Some of you (starting w/t ball) have claimed that Obama is a Christian, and I have simply asked on what basis y’all can make that claim. The overall response has been: “Because he says so.” But saying that you are a Christian doesn’t make you a Christian – that’s God’s contention as outlined in His Word, not mine. So if you consider that as passing judgment, then so be it.
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 5:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I try not to respond directly to you
…but I have to this time.
The mere fact that you think you could even have an opinion on Obama’s “spiritual condition” is absolutely ridiculous. Can you not see that? Unless you’ve been withholding, as far as I know you’ve never met the man. All you know about him is what you see through the media. You have no basis for opinion, period.
by Black Francis on Oct 16, 2008 5:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Right
but others can say that Obama is a Christian even though they’ve never met him. Gotcha.
That was my one response to you.
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 5:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You do realize
That Christianity is an organized religion, right? It’s not a “quality”. Thus, if one professes to follow the teachings of a particular religion, that’s what he is.
What you’re talking about is how “good” of a Christian he is. No wonder you’re lost.
by brettgardner on Oct 16, 2008 5:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Right.
My comment was about the “spiritual condition” of Barack Obama, something that is totally outside of any of us to ascertain.
And I agree that if someone says they’re a Christian, then yes I take their word for it ESPECIALLY if I don’t know them.
by Black Francis on Oct 16, 2008 5:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
when do you lose credibility?
What makes you think that Obama is a Christian?
when you start saying your facts are true and mine aren’t….
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
by ivysafety39 on Oct 16, 2008 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
How much credibility does 4Him have on religion?
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
by ghtd36 on Oct 16, 2008 1:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'll answer
I have no reason to believe that he’s not. He made a public declaration of his faith, who am I to judge whether he is sincere or not.
If you believe that you have a moral right or — worse yet — obligation to judge another man’s faith then I would wonder about your guiding principles more than I would Obama’s.
by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 16, 2008 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why do you not think
Obama is a Christian? Who are you to judge his faith? He may not share your exact beliefs, but if you want anyone to respect your beliefs you need to return the favor. I am not surprised, though, that you feel you have a monopoly on “true” faith.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
by t ball on Oct 16, 2008 2:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why do I think he's a Christian?
The same reason I think John McCain is a Christian. The same reason I think George Bush is a Christian. The same reason I think my mom is a Christian. The same reason I think you are a Christian.
You have outwardly expressed your Christian faith, and proclaimed Christ as your Lord. That makes him, and John, and George, and my mom, and you, a Christian.
To claim that he’s not would be pure speculation without evidence. That would be like me saying that you are a Muslim: pure speculation without evidence.
Beyond that, who the hell am I to judge who is a Christian and who is not? I can’t read into peoples’ hearts. All I know is the evidence, which is overwhelmingly that Barack Obama is a Christian.
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
by ghtd36 on Oct 16, 2008 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
waiting on my response?
i believe ght was being jestful… you take him seriously… i wasn’t talking about your credibility with religion… frankly i don’t think there is credibility in religion when every side thinks their the only way and everyone is a fool… i was saying you lose credibility in any arguement when someone brings up a counterpoint and you disregard it with a broad sweeping generalization and misplace the focus of the conversation.
“what makes you think that Obama is christian?”… what are we supposed to draw from that little morsal. it was very inciteful and cleared up any issue you might have. bravo.
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
by ivysafety39 on Oct 16, 2008 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah...
…i don’t think i know ANYONE who is “Pro-Abortion”… a “hey abortions for everyone… no new babies… death to babies…”
its Pro-Choice. plain and simple. quality of life and existence of life are not interdependent though… i can’t see how having a child after you’ve been sexually assaulted, having to carry it to term, being reminded everyday for 9 mo’s of that experience and then giving that kid up for adoption, in a system where tens of thousands of children are waiting to be adopted… how is that good for anyone??
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
by ivysafety39 on Oct 16, 2008 9:00 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Unfortunately
the vast majority of abortions don’t happen as a result of the extremely rare cases such as you mentioned. By far the biggest reason is convenience.
The bottom line is that abortion is murder. We need a culture of life that protects all of our citizens – including the unborn.
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 11:15 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I love
Your bare assertions.
Mr. Abortion Expert.
by brettgardner on Oct 16, 2008 11:22 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
well...
….the whole abortion is murder thing really is a beat down… murder of what… if its done in the first term its hard to say that its murder… if you are saying from conception its murder, well, its hard to call that life, at that point its just dividing cells, which can happen in a peitrie dish… as far as citizens, you aren’t a citizen of this country til you’re a) born and get a social security number, or b) pass the immigration and naturalization test, and receive your social security number… either way, the unborn are far from US citizens yet…
and back to my first point: “rare” cases aside, do you think a rape victim shouldn’t be allowed to terminate her pregnancy?
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
by ivysafety39 on Oct 16, 2008 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's only murder
if you believe life begins at conception, and that is the fundamental difference between pro-life and pro-choice advocates. Pro-lifers believe life begins with the fertilized egg, pro-choicers believe it begins much later.
-- Micah
Baseball Is My Boyfriend
"Football is like having a fling once a week. Baseball is a relationship." - oc
by baseballismyboyfriend on Oct 16, 2008 10:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The facts
of medical research make clear that life begins at conception (all data and material for life being present at that moment).
by 4Him on Oct 17, 2008 1:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You are free to think that
but you cannot dictate to others what they must believe.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
by t ball on Oct 17, 2008 8:29 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Of course
I can’t dictate to others what they must believe. But we are responsible to our Creator. Taking the lives of all those innocent ones (in the USA alone over 40 million, more than 1.3 million per year) breaks God’s heart, and those responsible will one day be held to account.
by 4Him on Oct 17, 2008 9:38 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yikes.
So you’re the guy who kills doctors who perform abortions, then?
Why not—after all, you have the ability to speak for God, apparently. You might as well act for Him too, right?
by brettgardner on Oct 17, 2008 9:55 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ugh...
I’m anti-abortion, but it freaking sickens me to listen to all the Christ zealots using their perverted zombie-based logic to make their (and, by extension, my) case on the subject.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Oct 18, 2008 12:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
hmm
…“all data and material for life being present at that moment”…
thats inane… all material and need for life is present in a corpse… but without a heartbeat, they aren’t alive… sorry… i don’t care how many times you want to redefine it, and i-have-the-“true”-answer it… life starts the same time it ends… heartbeat… “material and data” don’t matter if embryo never develops a heartbeat….
and you never answered my question: do you support making a woman carry the child of her rapist?
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
by ivysafety39 on Oct 17, 2008 8:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hey
I like your post, but it’s missing something. Hmm…what could it be?
Ah yes. It needs a racially-tinged knee-slapper which intimates that Obama deserves to be assassinated.
by brettgardner on Oct 16, 2008 1:41 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hey
your personal attacks are not impressive.
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 2:42 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Impressive?
I’m not trying to impress anybody. I just think you’re a racist faux-Christian, and you disgust me.
by brettgardner on Oct 16, 2008 7:01 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Uh-huh
a racist. You’re a real winner, aren’t you?
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 7:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm a loser
Unquestionably. But I don’t wish death on people I disagree with.
by brettgardner on Oct 16, 2008 7:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nor do I
I also don’t make personal attacks on people who I disagree with.
Are you by any chance related to John Murtha?
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 8:07 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
God the irony.
I’m not a politician, so you’re not scaring me off with this talk of “personal attacks.” I feel no shame in calling you an ignorant bigot who does a great disservice to the religion he purports to follow.
But hey, why even bother responding to me? Aren’t there dirty liberals that need to be blamed?
by brettgardner on Oct 16, 2008 9:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What are you referencing here, BG?
What did he say?
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Oct 16, 2008 10:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
His cute
Little email “joke” about killing Obama. The “punchline” is that murdering a man you disagree with would be not only acceptable, but understandable.
by brettgardner on Oct 16, 2008 10:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, how cute.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Oct 16, 2008 10:26 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I see
that you missed the main point of the joke. It isn’t about “murdering a man you disagree with.” It’s about the President thinking that he is so high and mighty that the deaths of the others are of no consequence.
No wonder you are so lost here, and your petty insults are so baseless.
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 12:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bullshit.
I’m not one of your rube friends rocking on the porch.
Bu since I’m so lost, what does this mean, exactly?
Finally, at the back of the room, Little Johnny raised his hand. In a quiet voice he said:
‘If the plane carrying you and Mrs. Obama was struck by a ‘friendly fire’ missile and blown to smithereens, that would be a tragedy.’
‘Fantastic!’ exclaimed Obama. ‘That’s right. And can you tell me why that would be a tragedy?’
’Well,’ says the boy, ‘It has to be a tragedy because it certainly wouldn’t be a great loss…and it probably wouldn’t be an accident either.’
That sounds like the punchline to me, schmuck.
by brettgardner on Oct 16, 2008 12:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
my only question is
would people be saying the same thing if the joke was this?-
Finally, at the back of the room, Little Johnny raised his hand. In a quiet voice he said:
‘If the plane carrying you and Mrs. Bush was struck by a ‘friendly fire’ missile and blown to smithereens, that would be a tragedy.’
‘Fantastic!’ exclaimed Bush. ‘That’s right. And can you tell me why that would be a tragedy?’
’Well,’ says the boy, ‘It has to be a tragedy because it certainly wouldn’t be a great loss…and it probably wouldn’t be an accident either.’
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"I'm more happy to be a Dallas Cowboy than when I got my first bike" - Roy Williams (WR)
by knockoutking on Oct 16, 2008 1:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well
I can’t say that I don’t have a bias. I’m human, therefore I can’t help it. But I will say that, IMO, there is a significantly higher level of aggressiveness and what I would call over the line behavior from the right then from the left. I think much of that behavior is stoked by the neo-con radio talking heads like Hannity, Mark Levin, Rush, Mike Church and John Gibson. I’m not saying that any of them wish ill on anyone. But I do think that they use extremely aggressive talking points in an effort to incite their listeners in a way that doesn’t happen on left-leaning programs.
by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 16, 2008 2:02 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don't
Be stupid. You think I’m in love with Obama or something? I’d be just as outraged if some gospel-spreading liberal mushhead made that joke about Bush.
I don’t want Bush dead, so find a better way to defend that horrid joke.
by brettgardner on Oct 16, 2008 2:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
im not defending it
i dont think you like obama
it was a general question, not one that was you-specific
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"I'm more happy to be a Dallas Cowboy than when I got my first bike" - Roy Williams (WR)
by knockoutking on Oct 17, 2008 7:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The exact same joke
was used with Bush’s name years ago.
by 4Him on Oct 16, 2008 4:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Talking to you.
Is like talking to a brick wall.
Or Longhorn.
I am the motherfucking shore patrol, motherfucker! I am the motherfucking shore patrol! Give this man a beer.
by TheBZA on Oct 16, 2008 4:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just as
Dumb then, too.
I honestly feel sorry for you. Tell the truth—you were molested as a child, right?
by brettgardner on Oct 16, 2008 4:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
that might be the worst defense for a bad joke i've ever heard...
seriously?! you take that joke and say its about how distant he is as a leader… not how insensitive people can be about people they don’t like or accept…
assinine.
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
by ivysafety39 on Oct 16, 2008 12:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Having a baby is "punishment"?
If any woman thinks that, please, get an abortion.
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
by RangerMad on Oct 16, 2008 8:13 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
OMG
Nobody is fucking pro-abortion! Get it right, McCain!
by cmkelly29 on Oct 15, 2008 9:15 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
He knows that
he just says “PRO abortion” because that riles up the far right religious types for whom abortion is a major issue. It’s a tactic.
by Melmart1 on Oct 15, 2008 9:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Amen, Mel
I was just gonna say that.
-- Micah
Baseball Is My Boyfriend
"Football is like having a fling once a week. Baseball is a relationship." - oc
by baseballismyboyfriend on Oct 15, 2008 9:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The worst part is
is that this is simply PANDERING. Roe v. Wade will never be overturned. Never ever ever. But they use it as a wedge issue and that drives me up the wall. Just like gay marriage is used … there are bigger fish to fry, but if you can siphon votes from people who are afraid of the Queen next door getting health insurance from his husband’s plan, then they will do it.
by Melmart1 on Oct 15, 2008 9:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Again, Amen
-- Micah
Baseball Is My Boyfriend
"Football is like having a fling once a week. Baseball is a relationship." - oc
by baseballismyboyfriend on Oct 15, 2008 9:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
"They" use as an issue?
Meaning Democrats, right? Liberal? Pro-abortion choice groups?
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
by RangerMad on Oct 16, 2008 8:16 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
what's the point?
i would imagine that he should be trying to get the independent vote. independents that place much importance on that issue already know who they will vote for. getting into that benefits nobody.
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
by gossamer on Oct 15, 2008 9:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1
and im a member of the religious right lol
that said, what did you expect him to do? be nice?
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"I'm more happy to be a Dallas Cowboy than when I got my first bike" - Roy Williams (WR)
by knockoutking on Oct 16, 2008 8:12 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Uninteresting Debate
Obama’s clearly not hitting McCain; he’s instead defending himself where applicable and that reflects his position in the polls. McCain’s is Rob Deere, swinging hard…sometimes connecting and sometimes missing.
I don’t like these debate formats. I would actually like to see discussions meander with the candidates talking for longer periods of time. Each candidate gets equal time. I believe this is the way it was done before television. To say “here’s a question, go!” is kind of stupid. I’d rather get into these candidates’ heads more. I mean the only other interaction we get with them is through stump speeches and TV ads.
Anyway, they’re on the last question now. I guess if I had to call a “winner” it would be McCain, but it wasn’t a knockout or anything like that. It doesn’t change anything. Really nothing has been said in this debate that hasn’t in the last two with the exception of the Supreme Court nominees, and I don’t think most of us learned anything on that one.
by Black Francis on Oct 15, 2008 9:19 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I think this one has been more interesting than the other two
Not that they set the bar very high.
-- Micah
Baseball Is My Boyfriend
"Football is like having a fling once a week. Baseball is a relationship." - oc
by baseballismyboyfriend on Oct 15, 2008 9:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It hasn't been interesting in a policy sense
At least to me. McCain’s aggressiveness and bizarre, out of place mentions about autism and such have been interesting like a car wreck is interesting.
The spending freeze is also completely nonsense.
by Black Francis on Oct 15, 2008 9:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yuppers
The town hall debate or whatever that one was was the absolute worst. I watched like 30 seconds. Brutal.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Oct 15, 2008 9:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
First 20 minutes? McCain won.
Everything else? The black guy.
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
by ghtd36 on Oct 15, 2008 9:20 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
yeah
up until it got to the point where bob asked about the dirty politiking, mccain was winning. obama was solid after that. then again, i wasn’t able to watch the whole thing, probably half of it here and htere.
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
by gossamer on Oct 15, 2008 9:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Regardless of how much you watched...
…you nailed it. The “dirty tactics” segment was the turning point.
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
by ghtd36 on Oct 15, 2008 9:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
the black guy?
don’t you mean THAT ONE
by cashman on Oct 15, 2008 9:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Or
the messiah.
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
by RangerMad on Oct 16, 2008 8:18 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fir the last time, HE'S NOT ARAB!
He’s a god family man!
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Oct 16, 2008 10:24 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oops...
Should have been “good”.
I almost like the typo better, though.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Oct 16, 2008 10:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I thought Reagan
was the Messiah?
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
by t ball on Oct 16, 2008 11:18 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He is
He’s just waiting for Nancy to join him beyond the pearly gates so that she can tell him when to return.