World Series ratings and the falling sky

by Adam J. Morris on Oct 25, 2008 12:00 PM CDT

There's a fair amount of hand-wringing over the poor ratings for the World Series after two games. In the DMN, for example, Barry Horn goes through various bits of gloomy data, and ends with this:

If I was Channel 4, I'd talk to the Cowboys about filming today's walk- through at Texas Stadium and broadcast that instead of the World Series.

So, yeah...my reaction to this is...who cares?

I mean, why should I, as a baseball fan, care whether or not the World Series gets good ratings?

I can see why I would care about whether the Rangers' local broadcasts get good ratings, since good ratings means more revenues, and more revenues means more money that can be spent on the team, and that will (generally speaking) mean a better product and more wins.

But whether or not the national audience is watching the Phillies and Rays...why should I give a rat's ass?

The downside, I guess, is more gimmicky stuff like Scooter and more jacked up starting times and the like. And the reality is that MLB could care less about catering to me, in terms of their TV presentations. MLB is going to cater to the marginal audience, the "persuadables" to borrow the parlance of this election cycle. MLB wants to bend over backwards to try to attract the people who aren't particularly interest in baseball, or the Rays, or the Phillies. Those are the folks it is knocking itself out to appeal to.

Me? MLB could care less about trying to appeal to me. And to most of you, I'd wager. MLB knows that we're the type of people who are going to watch the World Series no matter what. MLB (and its broadcast partners) takes the hard-core fan for granted, and many of the things we find so irritating are efforts by those folks to bring in the casual or non-fans.

So what the ratings indicate is the casual and non-fans aren't watching. Which isn't something that I see should end up impacting me.

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I agree with the point

but isn’t Tim McCarver the expection to this. McCarver is an old white guy who hates everything (and I could stop there) that is new and different or progressive. Seems like they could find someone who might be a little more fresh and hip.

I’m absolutely not saying this is something that I’d like to see, but something like a Buck-Grace-Rome (or someone like him) booth would seem to do a better job of bringing in a a non-core audience. Kind of like what ESPN tried to do with Kornheiser — just not an old cynical white guy.

by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 25, 2008 12:10 PM CDT reply actions

Rome sucks

A bunch of midgets with no arms could pitch better than us. -iorange555

by boomer1 on Oct 25, 2008 12:13 PM CDT up reply actions

Or just put Vin Scully in the booth.

Barring that I’d like to see a Gus Johnson or Bob Costas or Al Michaels (or someone else who is excitable and seems to give a damn) paired with a Buster Olney or Peter Gammons (or someone else who’s knowledgeable and actually enjoys the game without being obnoxious) pairing would work. I know most of those wouldn’t work cause they all work for different companies, but still…

Joe Buck is just so cloying and boring.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

by thedirkatron on Oct 25, 2008 1:34 PM CDT up reply actions

Gus Johnson rocks

he’s the antithesis of Greg Dobbs’ and Gabe Gross’ child.

Meaning of life? The aggregate collection of moments that you allow to enter into your consciousness, imo, fwiw, etc. (etc.)

by inactive lsb user on Oct 27, 2008 1:00 AM CDT up reply actions

Just to raise some thoughts

How do “casual” fans become hardcore fans? Is it simply that certain types of people are just naturally inclined to do so or is it something that MLB can encourage? Casual fans will come and go, but do you think MLB actively tries to build its hardcore fanbase?

by Telegraph on Oct 25, 2008 12:14 PM CDT reply actions

Simple

If you know the in and outs of the 40 you’re a hardcore fan. If you don’t, you’re a casual fan.

"Obama is a Christian - He's always been a Christian...But.........what if he is[a Muslim]? Is there something wrong with being a Muslim in this country? The answer is no, that's not America." Colin Powell on Obama/Muslim assertions.

by AirJordan on Oct 25, 2008 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions

Yeah, but at what point does a casual fan cross over to the dark side and say, “gee, I really want to follow the 40-man day and night”? What makes him do it? Alcohol? Too much free time? Obsessive-compulsive disorder? Religion?

by Telegraph on Oct 25, 2008 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions

I think it is how you are raised

My dad loved baseball and we would go and play catch every day after he got home from work. On Saturdays NBC game of the week he would teach me about the history of baseball. When I was old enough to play I was a baseball junkie.

I think a lot of Soccer moms push their kids into other sports now because the dad is always at work. IMO

A bunch of midgets with no arms could pitch better than us. -iorange555

by boomer1 on Oct 25, 2008 1:18 PM CDT up reply actions

how you were raised

My dad can’t stand baseball and never watched a game in his life. So there are some of us that found the game without any family influence.

What would you ask Nolan Ryan: "... as a former pitcher, what would you think about having a useless lug standing out there behind you."

Then I'd tell him that useless lug’s name is Michael Young. -- lonestarJesus

by tricer on Oct 25, 2008 4:02 PM CDT up reply actions

same here

I’m one of the few people I know from my friends and family that watch baseball much less follow the Rangers as closely as I do.

By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
-The Outlaw

by Gdawg on Oct 25, 2008 4:47 PM CDT up reply actions

Ditto

My Dad doesn’t watch any sports that someone else isn’t already watching. I’d venture to say he has never once purposely turned on the tv to find a sporting event.

G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....

by t ball on Oct 25, 2008 5:20 PM CDT up reply actions

Involvement

Already a lifetime baseball fan, yes with some Dad influence, my attention has peaked since joining discussions that go beyond casual observation. Adam and a half dozen others have exposed sabermetric views of the game that enhance, or even correct, casual observations. Anything I spend time at, you can bet I like pretty well because there are thousands of choices for what to do regularly.

"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang (1844-1912)

by Ed Coffin on Oct 25, 2008 6:16 PM CDT up reply actions

OCD & Booze

does it for me…

"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2

by Rodney on Oct 25, 2008 1:36 PM CDT up reply actions

420?

Steal Home R.I.P. 9/10/08

by LAMuscleFag on Oct 25, 2008 2:04 PM CDT up reply actions

funny

A bunch of midgets with no arms could pitch better than us. -iorange555

by boomer1 on Oct 25, 2008 2:04 PM CDT up reply actions

Individual players

People don’t watch the NBA for the game, they watch it for the players. MLB does a very bad job of marketing individual players, imho.

They have an opportunity to turn Chase Utley and Evan Longoria into near-household names in this series, but they don’t.

by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 25, 2008 12:22 PM CDT up reply actions

Well, basketball is the most individual player driven game out there, imo.

So it’s not really fair to think you could ever market baseball in the same player-centric manner.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

by thedirkatron on Oct 25, 2008 1:36 PM CDT up reply actions

Honestly, I don't think MLB does it at all...

I’ve converted a few of my friends into baseball fans because I watch the Rangers so much and talk about baseball on an almost constant basis. My friends are like most people: they want to be entertained when watching TV. The underlying problem is that the nuances of the game are not easily accessible to the average person. My old roommate’s then-fiance once asked me what made a particular count in baseball so important, and after I explained it to her, she understood why I cared about each at-bat. She knows enough now to even comment on things like bad pitches in an 0-2 count, or what a hitter could expect to see on a 2-0 or 3-0 count.

Major League Baseball doesn’t seem to get this, and I would argue that many hardcore fans don’t understand why they love the game. I don’t think this is the sort of thing you change through an announcing team, but perhaps segments done in between innings (or during lulls in the game). Talk about the different kinds of pitches (this was another huge barrier for all my friends, especially with the interchangeable terms for many pitches) and show video to reinforce what the commentators talk about.

Hell, maybe even go so far as to have some sort of round-table discussion (again with video) on the most exciting plays in baseball like outfield assists, plays at the plate, strike-out/caught-stealing double plays, etc. None of this would really kill anyone to try.

by jwiscarson on Oct 25, 2008 2:47 PM CDT up reply actions

I'd agree

Many of the nuances of the game tend to be mostly overlooked by the broadcasters (television, not so much radio), and an understanding of those nuances is probably what separates the hard-core from the casual fan. So, I’d think that a telecast that emphasized the finer points of baseball would be exactly the type of thing that would bring in more hard core fans.

What would you ask Nolan Ryan: "... as a former pitcher, what would you think about having a useless lug standing out there behind you."

Then I'd tell him that useless lug’s name is Michael Young. -- lonestarJesus

by tricer on Oct 25, 2008 4:06 PM CDT up reply actions

Great topic, Adam

And one of my truly fiery and impatient beliefs goes with it. We’ve become a dismissive society, in that “what’s hot” gets more ink than many things that matter a helluva lot more. I’m not pleased that when I open my yahoo start page, the top news is about celebrity divorce settlements, some relatives of a pop singer murdered, who among Hollywood’s elite is “in” fashion and who is out, etc. A media driven “entertain me” feeding frenzy (exaggeration only slight). The only hard news that matters (rating wise) is all negative. Investigations into people, and unpopular war, distressed economy, in short the bad and disappointing stuff.

Long story short, market driven and demographic demonstrative trumps true general interest. Baseball is competing with such as the effect of botox etc. for paid attention.

/ rant.

"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang (1844-1912)

by Ed Coffin on Oct 25, 2008 12:21 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs

Ditto times a thousand

on the Yahoo page type stuff. Only “scary” news like the market crashing beats out celebrity crap for Yahoo, other pages, and local news headers.

G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....

by t ball on Oct 25, 2008 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions

Ratings

I’m on my way out the door so this will be brief, but I wanted to ramble on this subject a bit since its my bread and butter. There’s no secret FOX was praying for a LA/BOS World Series. Instead they have Tampa Bay which is about as bad as Colorado was last year. On that note, it wasn’t worse than DET/STL (Worst ever) and I found that a pleasant surprise. I think there’s enough going on with the Rays that people have picked up interest. I know several of my baseball-hating friends have been watching their run.

Game 1 Ratings: 10.3 Rating/17 Share

I am the motherfucking shore patrol, motherfucker! I am the motherfucking shore patrol! Give this man a beer.

by TheBZA on Oct 25, 2008 12:28 PM CDT reply actions

David Stern NEVER would've let this series happen.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

by thedirkatron on Oct 25, 2008 1:38 PM CDT up reply actions

Hahahahahahahaha

too true, tron.

Meaning of life? The aggregate collection of moments that you allow to enter into your consciousness, imo, fwiw, etc. (etc.)

by inactive lsb user on Oct 27, 2008 1:08 AM CDT up reply actions

Fans

You’ve got fans of the sport and fans of the teams. True baseball fans love the game and watch the Series because it’s the Series. Team fans identify strongly with their clubs and tend to lose interest when they are not involved. (Of course, the hardcore fans have their favorites, too.) What has changed over the years is that the number of casual fans of the sport have declined relative to the number casual fans of the teams. Thus the TV guys want the teams with the most casual fans. Which is why every damned network game this year had the Yankees, Mets, Cubs, or Dodgers. Since no one else got the exposure, they did not attract casual fans.

Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. If they get mad, you're a mile away AND you have their shoes.

by Caradoc on Oct 25, 2008 12:34 PM CDT reply actions

You left out the kings of the bandwagon -- Boston

by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 25, 2008 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions

Same could be said about the Rays fans

Atleast the Sox sell out every home game. Tampa on the other hand had a great team all year and avg. 9,000 per game now they are selling out every playoff game and acting like they were there all year. If the Rangers would have had the year the Rays did they would have avg. 35,000 a game.

A bunch of midgets with no arms could pitch better than us. -iorange555

by boomer1 on Oct 25, 2008 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions

Casual fans are interested in football partly

because nearly every one of them has bought a square in the football pool or know how to bet the point spread. This brings about a fundamental interest in the outcome even if they did not by chance bet on a game that week. Baseball (or any other sport for that matter, except, of course, horse racing) does not have this deep seated connection to the great majority of fans.
Football has a huge advantage in popularity because of this.

by mcgee48c on Oct 25, 2008 2:00 PM CDT reply actions

gagree

I'm undefeated in fights. Have I been in any? No. Thats because people know my f'ing status. Don't mess with the elite. - Miles

by Dirk Diggler on Oct 25, 2008 2:09 PM CDT up reply actions

MLB

one thing they need to do especially for the playoffs/world series is speed up the damn game.
the world series doesnt need 30 freaking minutes of pregame and star spangled banner extravaganza. and with so many umpires and replay, its turning it into an even longer game

"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it." - Mitch Hedberg

by rentz on Oct 25, 2008 2:50 PM CDT reply actions

Agreement with everyone (except for Rome)

I already mentioned the weird hatred of baseball.
http://www.lonestarball.com/2008/10/24/641899/friday-a-m-things#
Ratings? One of the most recently highest rated series was Indians/Marlins.
http://www.lonestarball.com/2008/10/24/641899/friday-a-m-things#

Here’s a short story about baseball fandom. The Girl and I started dating around ‘03. We worked across the street from each other and during the playoffs I’d ask her to walk down to a close bar after work so I (we) could watch the playoffs. After a while she said that she used to go to Red Sox games as a kid while spending summers in Mass. She used to just watch NFL and NASCAR on the weekends, but she really got into baseball that year. Now she has a Red Sox tat (ASB of 2004 before they won it) and since then we’ve taken a baseball trip every year at the beginning of the year (living in Cheyenne – not so easy).

One of my favorite memories is us sitting in a bar in March of 2005 and she sees a guy in a RedSox hat in 2005. She gets pissed and starts vetting him about the Sox and he finally admits he just liked the hat.

Short (long) story is that baseball is a love that either you have or don’t. Once it gets you, you’re done.

This might be the elitist thing I’ve seen or read here, but us baseball fans are just a bit smarter. We like the slow development – like a good book or a classic movie. Not everything has to happen at once. The season unfolds over the span of months instead of weeks. Success happens over the span of years – sometimes many, many years. In football or the NBA, the most exciting thing that happens is the thing that just happened. In Baseball, it’s the event that might happen: will they hit and run? Will they change the pitcher"s hand? Is it the right count for a SB? Is that kid in single A going to be the next one?

I love George Carlin’s piece bit about football versus baseball and how one is so violent and the other is so “pastoral.” I love it not because it degrades baseball (as some might think) but because it’s accurate. If you want immediate gratification, you know your outlet. If you’d like the other to linger and challenge you – then it’s Baseball.

Nothing pithy here. Please move long.

by WyoRanger on Oct 25, 2008 3:58 PM CDT reply actions 3 recs

great post

wreck him.

What would you ask Nolan Ryan: "... as a former pitcher, what would you think about having a useless lug standing out there behind you."

Then I'd tell him that useless lug’s name is Michael Young. -- lonestarJesus

by tricer on Oct 25, 2008 4:11 PM CDT up reply actions

I'd tweak that a bit to say...

we’re more patient. We like certainty, and with the baseball season’s length, you know what kind of team you have by the end of the season. You know if that kid on third is doing better or worse. You know if your young pitchers are slowly figuring things out.

I like to tell my friends that there are no surprises in baseball (even though there are in the statistical anomalies) and that all the players are who they are. Charlatans masquerading as superstars fall back to earth, and the best players rise above even the most soul-crushing at-bats, slumps, and losses to do what they’ve done all along.

Baseball is a game where numbers speak the truth, and yet we still find ourselves watching night after night for that moment when the numbers speak the truth, and the answer surprises us.

And now I’m going to go watch Field of Dreams for the 27th (or so) time just so I can hear that speech about baseball marking the times once again.

by jwiscarson on Oct 25, 2008 5:11 PM CDT up reply actions