Hindman's prospect previews -- RHPs 1-5
by Adam J. Morris on Oct 28, 2008 1:09 PM CDT
Email
PrintMike Hindman has the latest installment of his prospect previews up, running down his top 5 pitchers in the Rangers minor league system...
Michael Main edges out Neftali Feliz for the number 1 slot, and Hindman sees Main getting to Frisco at some point next summer, and possibly to Arlington in 2010...
That would be impressive...
91 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Hey!
I’m the DMN blog RSS service, not you.
:)
"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Feliz
Pretty damning take on his secondary pitches, among other aspects of pitching.
I love hearing voices of dissent.
Go Strangers.
Yeah
before I read MJH’s take, I had a feeling that’s what I’d see. It seems more and more likely from what I’ve read that he’s bullpen bound dude to his lack of secondary pitches.
Now, if Main turns into the Ace everyone thinks he will be, I have zero problem with Feliz bringing 100 MPH to close out games.
I'm undefeated in fights. Have I been in any? No. Thats because people know my f'ing status. Don't mess with the elite. - Miles
by Dirk Diggler on Oct 28, 2008 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions
don't worry
i think i believe what BA, BP and the geniuses over at minorleagueball have to say before i would this guy from the dallas morning news.
he doesn’t even mention derek holland who imo, is a hair behind only neftali feliz.
furthermore, here’s BA’s take on the year Michael Main just had. He didn’t even make the MWL league top 20 list.
Q: Matt from Ft Worth asks:
Where is Michael Main? He wasn’t in the NW League top 20 and not in the Midwest top 20? What gives?
A: Jim Callis: He didn’t pitch enough innings to qualify for either league. Like many high school pitchers in their first full season, Main saw his stuff dip a little bit. His fastball sat around 91 mph and his curveball was average, though his changeup was better than anticipated. He’s still a quality prospect.
I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?
by the pinstripes on Oct 28, 2008 2:18 PM CDT up reply actions
whoops!
missed the right hand starter part. my bad! i still stand by the rest though.
I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?
by the pinstripes on Oct 28, 2008 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions
Holland
This is just righthanders…
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on Oct 28, 2008 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions
"this guy" from the DMN
Knows alot more about prospects than you give him credit for.
I'm undefeated in fights. Have I been in any? No. Thats because people know my f'ing status. Don't mess with the elite. - Miles
by Dirk Diggler on Oct 28, 2008 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions
"this guy from the dallas morning news"
Is more piped in than you or I could dream about, and this has been a passion of his for many years.
"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
heh
great minds think alike
I'm undefeated in fights. Have I been in any? No. Thats because people know my f'ing status. Don't mess with the elite. - Miles
by Dirk Diggler on Oct 28, 2008 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions
lol
true!
"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
lol
not buying it. he’s probably the only person in the country that would rank main ahead of feliz.
we’ll see where they rank when the BA/BP lists come out. My guess is Main isn’t anywhere to be found on either list.
I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?
by the pinstripes on Oct 28, 2008 2:28 PM CDT up reply actions
first of all
let me first explain that the reason i jumped into the fray here is that i just completed a top 50 pitching prospects list for minorleagueball.com.
a poster commented that he had a conflicting report on main and that he was throwing mid 90’s fastballs whereas i heard his velocity dropped to the 90, 91 range along with diminished “stuff”.
i’ve since read a report from the AZL where he topped out at 96 with the fastball over 3 innings, maybe threw 5 or 6 curves and 2 changeups at most with only one of them recorded as a strike.
now, maybe his velocity jumped and his secondary stuff is still lacking? i don’t know but i do know Callis from BA is pretty piped in as well so I don’t know what to make of this.
i do remain firm in my stance that i can’t imagine a “national columnist” would rank main higher than feliz as if i’m not mistaken the person who wrote the article for BTiA’s top 25 is a ranger “loyalist”. please correct me if i’m wrong.
furthermore, i am not trying to antagonize or piss anyone off. yes, i am an avid yankee fan as i’m sure you figured out but i have lived in teh dallas area for the last 10 yrs and attend at least 10 ranger games a year. in fact, i’d have to say that the rangers are my 2nd team and i want to see them do well. well, maybe not as i’m used to sitting in the first 10 rows .. :-)
I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?
by the pinstripes on Oct 28, 2008 2:58 PM CDT up reply actions
It's all good,
even though you root for the MFYs…
:)
"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
I don't have a problem with your opinions
In fact, I think they add some much needed perspective. I’ve read your takes on minorleagueball and I tend to agree with you, for the most part.
BTiA’s top 25 is my work (along with Joey) and I am a very unapologetic Rangers loyalist. The prospect list was produced for fun and to spark debate/discussion.
I’m also the author of the AZL report on Main you referenced. It was one of the single most impressive performances I’ve ever seen at instructs, and that opinion was shared by many of the scouts in my vicinity. Of course, it was just three innings and the competition wasn’t exactly up to AFL standards, but it obviously left an impression with me and several others as well.
I’m fortunate enough to have a relationship with a few people within the Rangers organization, and the opinions expressed in top 25 list were subject to their influence. I’m also friendly with writers from BA/BP and have received positive feedback from them regarding my FIL reports and the Top 25. Like you, not all of them agree with me regarding the prospects, but the opinions expressed are respected.
I agree with you that most if not all national writers will rank Feliz ahead of Main. I’m fine with that. However, just because they write for BA/BP or post on minorleaugueball.com, doesn’t mean they have a greater insight to the potential of a player. It’s just a matter of preference.
I hope you continue to post on LSB and I look forward to reading more of your excellent prospect work on Sickels’ site. Feel free to shoot me an email if you ever want to discuss this off of a public forum.
by jparks77 on Oct 28, 2008 3:23 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
thanks
thanks so much for responding to my post. it’s great to hear your insights on this subject as i’m really trying to get to the bottom of the michael main mystery ..
can you tell me if his fastball velocity spiked in winter ball or was it like that all year w/ the BA report being wrong? i’m also interested to hear what you have to say about his curve and change piece because it doesn’t seem like he threw it all that much in his 3 inning stint.
i have to say that after reading what you had to say you really earned my respect. after further review, what better source of info than that from a “ranger loyalist” who concentrates on ranger prospects (not that that’s all you know).
i’d love to hear back from you regarding main as i need to adjust my top 50 list accordingly. i also wouldn’t mind hearing where you think he should rank on the list.
p.s. lumping the minorleagueball geniuses in w/ BA/BP etc.. was totally tongue in cheek. believe me, where far from that!
again, thanks!
I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?
by the pinstripes on Oct 28, 2008 4:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Not sure...
But, could the dip in velocity have been due to the fact that he was shut down for a few months with a rib injury, and it took him a little while to get his arm/mechanics back to where they needed to be?
Secondly, as far as where Main will rank in terms of the top 100’s list relative to Feliz and Holland… keep in mind that those guys have both had success at AA, Main hasn’t pitched above Low A. Many prospect rankings take into account proximity to the Majors whereas Hindman and others may not weigh that as heavily.
That said, you’d have to think 94-96 with advanced (for a 19 yr old) secondary offerings and Main’s numbers would show up fairly high in the rankings lists.
Main
Main’s velo was down a bit this year, sitting in the 88-92 range. At fall instructs, his velo was in the 92-95 range with reports of it reaching 96. After a slight mechanical adjustment, not only did his velo increase, but so did his command.
I’ll say this: Main looked like a major league pitcher this fall. His stuff was ridiculously good. Now, because of my feelings towards the Rangers and Main in particular, my opinion on his national prospect ranking is going to be skewed. I honestly believe that he is the best pitching prospect in the Rangers system. When I ranked him above Feliz and Holland it was because I truly believe in his ability to reach his potential.
The problem with Main’s national ranking will be that his professional resume doesn’t accurately paint his prospect profile. If your list is based on pure stuff and realistic floor/ceiling, Main should be ranked in the top 20 arms. If it is based off a combination of things, with his statistical record carrying the most water, Main should not be ranked that high.
If you ever need anything else on our prospects, feel free to drop me a line.
So what?
I’d say that Hindman has a lot more personal information about prospects in the Rangers system than does Baseball America. He likely has a better grasp on the player’s makeup, their day-to-day development, and how they compare to one another.
Just because Baseball America disagrees doesn’t mean that Hindman and others are wrong. Other less “prestigious” yet very detailed prospect evaluations like those from BTiA also show Main ranked that high.
by Stephen Rushin on Oct 28, 2008 2:48 PM CDT up reply actions
Hindman
I’d say that Hindman has a lot more personal information about prospects in the Rangers system than does Baseball America. He likely has a better grasp on the player’s makeup, their day-to-day development, and how they compare to one another.
This is why I always take his opinions with caution. I think he has tendency to give more credit to guys he likes on a personal basis.
"Colt mccoy sucks, mack brown needs to be fired." - Longhorn
by LSBUser on Oct 29, 2008 7:43 AM CDT up reply actions
FWIW
I really don’t know any of the prospects anymore. To the extent I did know some of them, that was a function of my association with Jamey which ended two years ago. I watch as much as I can, study as much as I can, talk to others and take in all I can from every source available.
Just one man's opinion
I know that BP will not have Main in the top two or three and I doubt that BA will either. Thanks for reading the DMN Rangers blog.
Excellent writeup
And I have one major complaint and that is that these aren’t able to be published one per day until you’re done. Eagerly anticipating the rest.
Also, the more I read about Feliz the more comfortable I get with him being trotted out as a closer and not a megaawesome starter.
Editorial decision
They want to see one per week for 11 weeks. That takes us to the beginning of the new year at which time we’ll start a countdown of the top-31 prospects overall, as selected by a panel consisting of Evan, Richard, myself and possibly others.
x
Yeah, I meant “complaint” sarcastically. Whenever they want to publish them is cool with me, as long as we get them!
actually
i’m just getting a feel for the site and i have to say i like it quite a bit. i definitely plan on being a regular. thanks for having me!
I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?
by the pinstripes on Oct 28, 2008 4:18 PM CDT up reply actions
Well...
In the Dallas Morning News Blog’s September 29th Armchair Farm Director Roundtable: Top-20 Prospects, Mike Hindman had Neftali Feliz at number 2 overall (number 1 righthanded pitcher) and Michael Main as the number 5 overall (number 2 righthanded pitcher).
However, Hindman, in his piece this morning, did say this:
Main’s stock jumped up a tick or two after the season ended and he reported for work at fall instructionals.
He elaborated on this, but there was also a piece from October 4th by Jason Parks that included a tracking of Michael Main’s pitches for three innings. Using the velocity numbers listed (including 93 for the last pitch instead of 96), and assuming I’m doing my addition right, his average fastball was 92.64 MPH. Of the 25 fastballs thrown over those 3 innings, he hit 95 twice, 94 on six occasions, and 93 eight times. That’s a bit better than what you have from Jim Callis from September 23rd, when the Rangers’ Fall Instructional League was just under way.
Never say you can't do something, because when you do, you're likely creating a self-fulfilling prophecy. Oh yeah, and know your limits.
by YourNameHere on Oct 28, 2008 4:27 PM CDT up reply actions
FWIW...
This was my Sept. 28 report from Surprise:
What tends to get lost, unfairly, amid the Latin American signings and the trade acquisitions and the emergence of a guy like Derek Holland is how much upside there is in a guy acquired in the traditional manner like Michael Main. It turns out that his effort on Saturday was, along with the daily Justin Smoak Show, the best thing I saw this week.
Main took the ball in the third and retired Seattle in order, throwing nothing but fastballs, sitting 92-95. He was overpowering. He broke out the curve in the fourth and kept everything down, giving up a groundball single but nothing else. He came out for the fifth ― the only pitcher in the four games I was at who was given three full innings ― and he made quick work of the Mariners, inducing a routine grounder to third and striking out the next two hitters, the final one looking.
Typically the handful of coaches on the field will stand from their chairs along the chain link fence and shake hands with a pitcher whose work is done out here when he reaches the dugout. When Main was done, however, every coach met Main halfway between the foul line and the dugout, shaking his hand with bigger smiles on their faces than the 19-year-old had on his. It wasn’t until the final handshake that Main let his game face relax into a smile of his own.
He was heyday Tim Hudson.
by Jamey Newberg on Oct 28, 2008 9:48 PM CDT up reply actions
This is so nice to hear
from not just Jason, Joey, MJH but now Jamey. I’m very excited about MM I hope he has a break out year like Dutch had this year.
Jamey how long do you think it will be before we see him in Frisco?
A bunch of midgets with no arms could pitch better than us. -iorange555
Bullpen? What the hell.
Why is he being ranked so high then, in top prospect lists, and in Rangers list.
If he is just some glorified reliever, don’t rank him so high.
If hes going to be another Mariano Rivera he should be up there don't you think?
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
Yah but...
His stuff doesn’t at all resemble Mariano Rivera. Rivera lives and dies (very infrequently does he die) on an exceptional cut fastball. Feliz would be living and dying solely on pitch speed. It seems like Feliz more closely resembles a Joel Zumaya or Matt Anderson which scares the crap out of me. What happens when those pitchers get injured? Their careers are over.
Fastball
From all accounts his fastball has good movement. Couple that with his speed and it could be a devastating pitch. Plus hes still very very young. he has time to learn a secondary pitch
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
Yep
Plus pitch movement to go along with plus-plus fastball velo. Devastating combo. Because of his heater, he will still be effective, most likely in a bullpen role, even if his secondary stuff does not develop. He doesn’t turn 21 until May. Lots of time left.
Agreed
I agree that he has a lot of time left and that his primary pitch seems to be excellent. I like the depth in the system and Feliz’ potential; however I get irked when this kind of bio merits a spot in the top of prospect rankings. I can remember a hundred guys wtih an excellent first pitch who never could develop the secondary pitches to become an effective starting pitcher. Anybody remember Juan Dominguez? He’s the next Pedro much like Feliz is the next Rivera. I’d rather see him turn into a pitcher before I put him high on the prospect list. Otherwise he’s just an attractive bullpen arm; which shouldn’t be anywhere near the top of the prospect list. If it is, you’re depth isn’t as deep as you thought.
Plus movement &
plus plus velocity…huh? Ya’ can’t teach that stuff!
"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
And you can't teach speed
which gave the world Juan Pierre.
You can teach pitching and I’d like to wait and see if it works with Feliz first. He sounds promising but he’s a long ways away.
Have you seen Feliz pitch?
The movement combined with the velocity is breathtaking. He could be successful even if he just has a show-me secondary pitch.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
Successful Closer?
Not many great one pitch starters, but there certainly are some successful 1 pitch closers.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
Well
he’s been compared to Mariano Rivera his whole career. Not that he’s going to be, like, the best reliever of all time, but it gives you an idea of the nature of that one pitch.
by Brett Perryman on Oct 28, 2008 4:32 PM CDT up reply actions
Absolutely
And I think that their is some value in that train of thought. However, and this is another can of worms, I have trouble valueing someone this highly who’s so far from being a quality starting pitcher. The major leagues are not largely comprised of one-pitch startings. It is nearly completely comprised of guys who have honed the craft and have several major league quality pitches, not just one. I can’t remember how many cases of a quality starting pitcher with only 1 major league quality pitch.
Until Feliz learns how to pitch and develops at least one more major league quality pitch, I don’t see how we can value him this highly as a starter. He needs to either be valued as a John Sickles type B- or B (a guy with a lot of raw skill but is a ways from putting it all together) or be viewed as a bullpen guy. If he is viewed as a bullpen guy, then how can he be viewed so highly. Closers are the most overrated position in baseball. How much more valuable is a guy who holds a 1 run lead in the ninth compared to the guy who holds the same 1 run lead in teh 8th. Would Lidge be as valuable without Ryan Madsen closing the door before him? The list of situations like that goes on for miles.
I appreciate the quality of his pitch. I won’t make the mistake again of going crazy over a guy with one amazing pitch and a lot of other question marks.
No way
do you just view him as a bullpen guy at this point, even if he breaks into the major next year in the Rangers’ pen. He has lots of time to develop secondary stuff, he’s just 20. And I’m not suggesting that you rank him that high solely on one pitch. But that one pitch, delivered with graceful ease, is an awesome start, and he is working on his other stuff. I hope they don’t put him in the bullpen next fall since that might hinder the development of his secondary stuff.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
We have an accord
On some level. I might also be a little sour grapes because I watched Liriano come out of the pen and then get moved to starting. His pitch (a slider) was awesome and people had trouble adjusting to it. However, I believe the crazy arm angle and quick move from bullpen to starter I think lead to his arm nearly falling off. The major difference here is of course the method of delivery. Feliz has a graceful motion and Liriano had a violent motion. I just get nervous hearing about one guy with a great pitch and not much else.
Hopefully Feliz works out and becomes the next biggest thing since SPAM. I’m hopeful yet skeptic.
I didn't really catch how negative that sounded
and I edited the paragraph; his talent is such that it’s absolutely possible that he’ll gain consistency with his arm slot and staying on top of his curve; if so, the sky is the limit
Salty fan
I assume you’re a Salty fan. What are your thought as to what the Rangers will do with him? What do you think they should do with him?
I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?
by the pinstripes on Oct 28, 2008 2:29 PM CDT up reply actions
Deal him for young pitching
Tea looks like the incumbant, with Max in AAA for 2009.
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on Oct 28, 2008 2:34 PM CDT up reply actions
Bullpen?
So I’m glancing over at the R/L SP duo thread and I notice how everyone is overjoyed to see that Feliz/Holland currently rank as the 2nd best pairing to Price and Davis.
How can that be when Feliz is obviously moving to the bullpen?
Anyone care to explain?
I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?
by the pinstripes on Oct 28, 2008 2:34 PM CDT up reply actions
Hes not "obviously" moving anywhere
I think what MJH is saying is that if he doesn’t develop anymore than he currently is he would still be a top reliever. But he is young and raw still. he jumped from around 30 innings pitched to over 130 innings this season. His fastball is amazing and he has shown flashes of plus plus secondary stuff. If he is promoted as aggressively next year as he was this year I don’t think he will be a starter. but if the rangers allow him to develop that second and possibly third pitch he could become one of the best.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
I think this is a pretty good example of something that we talked about yesterday
Feliz has reached AA and has a few warts, even though he is a phenomenal talent. Main has pitched only a handful of innings at the lowest levels, so he still looks shiny and new. Plus, there is a certain incentive for prospectophiles to be the “first” to tout a guy, so ranking Feliz number 1 in this system isn’t going to gain an author any acclaim, while if Main explodes next year – an author ranking him first this year would have quite a feather to put in his cap.
What would you ask Nolan Ryan: "... as a former pitcher, what would you think about having a useless lug standing out there behind you."
Then I'd tell him that useless lug’s name is Michael Young. -- lonestarJesus
I sincerely doubt
MJH and JParks ranked Main once so they can post and say “First!”
I'm undefeated in fights. Have I been in any? No. Thats because people know my f'ing status. Don't mess with the elite. - Miles
by Dirk Diggler on Oct 28, 2008 6:01 PM CDT up reply actions
*one not once
I'm undefeated in fights. Have I been in any? No. Thats because people know my f'ing status. Don't mess with the elite. - Miles
by Dirk Diggler on Oct 28, 2008 6:01 PM CDT up reply actions
I doubt that also
I respect both of those guys.
What would you ask Nolan Ryan: "... as a former pitcher, what would you think about having a useless lug standing out there behind you."
Then I'd tell him that useless lug’s name is Michael Young. -- lonestarJesus
I find your post
very confusing then.
Plus, there is a certain incentive for prospectophiles to be the "first" to tout a guy, so ranking Feliz number 1 in this system isn’t going to gain an author any acclaim, while if Main explodes next year – an author ranking him first this year would have quite a feather to put in his cap.
Being that MJH and JParks/Joey are the only ones so far to rank Main as #1, what would you be referring to if you’re not saying they’re just doing it to get the jump on a prospect?
I'm undefeated in fights. Have I been in any? No. Thats because people know my f'ing status. Don't mess with the elite. - Miles
by Dirk Diggler on Oct 28, 2008 8:32 PM CDT up reply actions
Well..
I knew that I wasn’t going to be the first to publish a list with Main at the top since Jason and Joey’s list had already come out., so that’s not it.
I would have had Feliz at the top but then I did that Q&A with Adair. Afterwards, it was clear to me that Main was the guy. I’d never heard him so excited about a pitching prospect. So my primary reason for putting Main on top was that I believe that Rick Adair knows his pitchers better than anyone else and he seems to think that Main is the guy at this point.
Now, perhaps Main is just the flavor of the month and if so, we’re all wrong. But based on the information I had, he jumped ahead of Feliz. Based upon what JP saw for himself, he also jumped him ahead of Feliz. I think it’s really just as simple as that.
Yeah, I never thought you did anything else
I’m just confused by what tricer is trying to say. He’s probably just talking in generalities, not specifically about you are JP/Joey.
I'm undefeated in fights. Have I been in any? No. Thats because people know my f'ing status. Don't mess with the elite. - Miles
by Dirk Diggler on Oct 29, 2008 7:24 AM CDT up reply actions
Feliz...
I had heard about his inability to hold runners, but MJH’s take seems to reveal many more flaws. Doubts in his ability to ever develop quality secondary offerings, trouble with mechanical consistancy, etc. If the Rangers see things the same way is the 100mph worth keeping and trying to develop into a closer, or should they sell high and try to pull off something like Feliz + for Cain?
whoa
let’s give him another year in AA/AAA to see if he improves his ability to hold runners and develop his secondary stuff to at least passable before we write him off. MJH still obviously things highly of him, or he would not have ranked him 2nd among RH starters.
+1
i can’t believe i’m reading this on a rangers fan site. the rangers, are in no way, thinking of moving him to the pen at this point. if they are, heads need to roll.
I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?
by the pinstripes on Oct 28, 2008 2:30 PM CDT up reply actions
Eh
It’s more that right now, without any further real improvements, he could be a pretty badass closer. If you’d read MJH’s offerings on Feliz at all this year he’s a pretty big believer that Neftali ‘gets it’ and has the makeup/coachability to correct the flaws in his game. He might just need to be challenged by hitters that he can’t just blow past, and that won’t really come until AAA. Until then, it’s all projection.
Just for fun
Everyone is talking about Feliz’s secondary pitches and how there’s a chance he won’t be a front of the rotation type of pitcher. His value won’t be any higher than what it is now. Would you do Davis and Feliz for M. Cain? Or any other young pitcher if you think they’re better than Cain.
no way
i like matt cain and all but don’t forget he benefits tremendously from the pitcher’s paradise he resides in. i’m extremely leary that he’ll ever figure it out and improve his command.
that said, i am a big davis fan and a big believer in feliz making it as a starter.
I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?
by the pinstripes on Oct 28, 2008 3:02 PM CDT up reply actions
Woah kay
For a second I thought you were speaking from the Giants’ perspective…
Yah, I’d call that an overpay. Totally agree.
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on Oct 28, 2008 3:06 PM CDT up reply actions
Is SF
really a pitcher’s paradise? Park Factors I’ve seen put it in the top 1/3 of hitter’s parks, and just a shade past neutral towards hitters.
Take away Barry Bonds
And those numbers go way toward the pitchers
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
Davis and Feliz for Cain?
Are you kidding me?
Jon Daniels should be fired if he did that.
by Adam J. Morris on Oct 28, 2008 3:09 PM CDT up reply actions
I was just giving a hypothetical.
If he can be had for less with Feliz as the main piece, what would it be?
If we did that
It better be for Lincecum.
I am the motherfucking shore patrol, motherfucker! I am the motherfucking shore patrol! Give this man a beer.
Here, I'll fix it
Are you kidding me?
Jon Daniels should be fired shot if he did that.
"[Tim McCarver and Joe Buck] are the Gabe Gross and Ben Broussard of the broadcasting booth." - dirkatron
If Feliz is going to be a reliever
Hell yeah trade him, and trade his ass now.
Reliever…and everybody is thinking he is some bad ass around here.
by SaltyGoesYard on Oct 28, 2008 3:17 PM CDT up reply actions
He may turn out to be a reliever
But it might be wise to not take that as gospel. Lots of people said the same thing about Edinson Volquez and Tim Lincecum, for two.
by Brett Perryman on Oct 28, 2008 3:18 PM CDT up reply actions
And dominant relievers are quite valuable
check what Brian Fuentes and K-Rod get in the FA market this offseason.
What would you ask Nolan Ryan: "... as a former pitcher, what would you think about having a useless lug standing out there behind you."
Then I'd tell him that useless lug’s name is Michael Young. -- lonestarJesus
+1 BuzzRec
for this thread
"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
+1
"[Tim McCarver and Joe Buck] are the Gabe Gross and Ben Broussard of the broadcasting booth." - dirkatron
I like it.
"He wants to double the capital gains tax, or almost double it," Huizenga said. "I'd rather give it to charity than to him."
In regards to Feliz's secondary pitches....
Dude is only 20. There is the school of thought that says if you ain’t got a curveball by 19 you won’t have one. That’s not the issue with Feliz, apparently. It’s more that his motion is inconsistent. It would seem to me to be a difficult thing to repeat a delivery that is that blazing fast and it might be 2 or 3 years before his delivery for the curveball becomes second nature.
Go Rangers!
I think that's pretty astute.
He can whip off a pretty dirty curve at times. He’s just really sloppy right now. Feliz grew up a lot as a pitcher this year as I understand it. There’s no reason to believe he won’t grow again next year. The arm angle thing concerns me because I think changing it is easier said than done. Sometimes, when the body wants to make the arm do X, it’s almost impossible to make it do Y or Z, if you get my point.
Okay, that Main writeup made me horny.
Honest to Science.
I took it with a bag full of salt grains cause it’s MJH and I know how excitable he can be (see: Massett, Nick), but, still… Horny.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
I ranked Masset #13 that year
Behind Omar Poveda and Zach Phillips, among others.
This LSB myth of what I allegedly wrote about Masset is out of hand. Here’s what I actually wrote:
Masset has a solid assortment, featuring five pitches including a heavy two-seamer, a quality cutter and a good curve. His astounding 2.74 grounder-to-fly ratio was the best in the system and places him in a class with the best ground ball pitchers in the big leagues. It’s not a lack of stuff that keeps Masset from succeeding with greater consistency. It seems to be what is going on between his ears.
Even in the games where Masset’s final line looked horrible, he usually dominated for three, four, five and sometimes six innings, but when things started to go badly, they quickly got way out of control. At times, you can actually see a change in his demeanor and body language on the mound that precedes the implosion.
I didn’t write that he had seven plus pitches. I didn’t even write that he had one plus pitch. I wrote that he had “solid assortment” of five pitches including a “heavy” two-seamer, a “quality” cutter and a “good” curve.
and that was #13 among starting pitching prospects
not #13 overall
However,
much like Scap loading, the myths about Masset make better reading than the reality. LSB is a better place with Scap Load or Die and Nick Masset’s 42 Plus Pitches.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
In Association With
Big League Stew - MLB - Yahoo! Sports
- The Citi Field All-Star game has finally been made official for 2013
- Brett Lawrie receives four-game suspension, fined for ‘aggressive actions’ toward umpire
- PNC Park security guard loses finger in struggle with fan during Pirates game
- Create-a-Caption: Partying like it’s 1988
- The Ron Washington puppet is watching you while you sleep — and has possibly jinxed the Rangers
