Another new political thread
by Adam J. Morris on Oct 29, 2008 10:30 AM CDT
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PrintMan, I'll be glad when the election is over.
I'm bored with all this.
506 comments
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I'll start the thread...
with some completely irresponsible speculation about Obama’s extra-marital affair.
http://confederateyankee.mu.nu/archives/276853.php
You know, because there’s at least as much substance there as there was when NY Times ran their affair piece about McCain, or the affair speculation about Palin.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
tit for tat.
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
by ivysafety39 on Oct 29, 2008 10:36 AM CDT up reply actions
Works for me
I assume all politicians are hammering groupies, because they can.
All I ask of our president’s is they try to elevate their game closer to JFK’s level, and they try to hammer Monroeesque pieces of ass.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
+1
You gotta go for it at all times, at that point.
Meaning of life? The aggregate collection of moments that you allow to enter into your consciousness, imo, fwiw, etc. (etc.)
by inactive lsb user on Oct 29, 2008 10:43 AM CDT up reply actions
+1
The Lewinski thing was embarrassing for this nation for one reason and one reason only: Because it told the world that the best our leader could do was some tubby intern with bad hair.
If Obama gets elected and isn’t neck deep in the Maxim Top 100 by June I say we move to impeach.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Oct 29, 2008 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions
Man
I never thought she was that bad. Besides, sometimes you just want to feel better than the person who’s under your desk.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 10:46 AM CDT up reply actions
hahahahaha
And no, Clinton could have done much, much better. The fact that he would stoop that low almost negates his charisma, for me.
It’s Bill Fucking Clinton. That’s a bad look.
Meaning of life? The aggregate collection of moments that you allow to enter into your consciousness, imo, fwiw, etc. (etc.)
by inactive lsb user on Oct 29, 2008 10:48 AM CDT up reply actions
Yep.
Surely he could have banged some liberal Hollywood starlet. Surely he could have got the hummer from Julia Roberts or Sandra Bullock or whoever was hot back then.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
regarding sandra bullock
if you listen to bob schneider, evidently his relationship w/ her was the inspiration for much of his early music (and some of it now)
2002 is a damn good song
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"I'm more happy to be a Dallas Cowboy than when I got my first bike" - Roy Williams (WR)
by knockoutking on Oct 29, 2008 12:30 PM CDT up reply actions
Well
Of course he could have hired a Jersey 10 to come down and give him the goods, but part of the allure of power is that he could take anyone, including the local intern.
I always thought it was an exercise in power rather than penis.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 10:52 AM CDT up reply actions
Nailing Marilyn Monroe
shows power. Nailing some dumpy, overweight intern is an exercise in convenience.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
by DJCahill on Oct 29, 2008 10:54 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Point for you.
Meaning of life? The aggregate collection of moments that you allow to enter into your consciousness, imo, fwiw, etc. (etc.)
by inactive lsb user on Oct 29, 2008 10:55 AM CDT up reply actions
Big difference though.
Kennedy wasn’t a narcissist. It was actually about the pussy for him.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 10:56 AM CDT up reply actions
Well put..
Always raise your game to nail the best you can, not the most convenient hero-worshiping trollop.
Nailing an intern is also exactly what the laws regarding sexual harrassment are about.
I always liked this one.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Oct 29, 2008 11:25 AM CDT up reply actions
give her some glasses
and monica looks a little like palin.
"Never go with a hippie to a second location."
I assume all politicians are hammering groupies, because they can.
In the internet age, that seems naive.
And the part about family values being unimportant to Dems just because the GOP values them more?
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on Oct 29, 2008 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions
No,
the Republican base gives a shit about “family values”. I don’t think the Dems do.
Thats why you can have openly gay Dems like Barney Franks. I’m not sure you could have an openly gay Republican, even if you have had more than a few closet knob slobbers in the party, like Larry Craig, Mark Foley, and Ted Haggard, for example.
If you think politicos aren’t having sex and don’t have groupies, you are the one that is hopelessly naive.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
you are the one that is hopelessly naive.
Ad hominem already, awesome.
I don’t mind accepting the criticism. Risking a political career for a piece of ass just doesn’t compute for me. That’s all the thinking going on, here.
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on Oct 29, 2008 1:20 PM CDT up reply actions
We hear of a
couple of sex scandals every year. You reckon we hear of all the ones that actually happen?
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
Again
Risking a political career for a piece of ass just doesn’t compute for me.
I’m just thinking homo economicus here.
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on Oct 29, 2008 1:49 PM CDT up reply actions
Ol' Barn
…could take Longhorn in a fight.
by Black Francis on Oct 30, 2008 12:02 AM CDT up reply actions
One good thing about not being the party of "Family Values"
your constituency really doesn’t give a rat’s ass. It’s even funnier when its one of the guys like Larry Craig who is actively tub thumping the Family Values agenda gets caught.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
Yep..
Trying to preach morals and falling short is a much better way to get hammered as a hypocrite than just not having any moral compass to speak of.
Walking the walk is a bit out of fashion in Washington these days.
ie: Tim Mahoney
Sex is an equal opportunistic scandel.
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20081013224420AALzNJp
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
Fox
What I have confirmed via both the intelligence and strategic communications source and the (now former) McLean Clark National Operations Director is that NewsMax, the National Enquirer, ABC News, and NBC News have all had the basic facts of the Baker-Obama liaison for some time now, and so far, none have come forward with any reporting.
If this is true, then it shows just how pathetic the “journalists” at Fox News are.
by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 29, 2008 12:02 PM CDT up reply actions
Answer to JB
Regarding ben’s affiliation and ideology from other thread:
There is an internal coherency in his position if you accept that he’s not lying about voting for a Democrat when Republicans control Congress (One house? Both? Who knows?). Of course, he’s never actually done it, which is where a lot of the doubt comes from.
No, I understand his position, I just think it’s incredibly immature and not well thought out. He’s one of those guys who gets his rocks off trying to disprove common assumptions—e.g. that the President matters. His whole bit is based on the hipster, junior-in-high-school premise that Presidents don’t actually matter. It’s silly and discredits him from serious consideration on any of these matters. He’s just a sideshow attraction to be gawked at and quickly walked away from.
I can accept that is a rational position to take
But in my experience, people who have said that generally use it to justify voting for someone who they want to support, as opposed to a lifelong strategy. And I don’t think that it is a fundamentally more sophisticated position than say, a conservative or liberal who prefers one candidate over another for ideological reasons. (Although as Cahill likely will argue, a true conservative for limited government maybe should prefer divided government gridlock over either free spending party…)
There are some states that have a history of splitting their representation – the Dakotas always vote for Republican Presidents, but usually have one and sometimes two Democrat Senators. Given the strong conservative nature of those states (particularly South Dakota), I have often wondered what the rationale is.
Well I agree
Our capacity for rationalization is amazing.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 11:34 AM CDT up reply actions
Yeah,
I think I would definitely arge the true fiscal conservative would prefer a Democratic President, a Republican congress, and a lot of tension between the two. It ensures that any new spending has broad, bipartison support, and also puts a check on the vast kickbacks and earmarks we see when one party holds all the cards.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
I think that depends on if fiscal conservatism
is the only tenet that really matters to you. For me, I view Congress’ biggest responsibility being fiscal legislation (i.e. tax reform), while I view the President’s biggest responsibility as the role of Commander in Chief.
Thus, I will typically defer to whom the military supports when determining who I vote for President and I will typically vote for the congressman who has the best plan to lower taxes.
Call it selfish or lazy…it’s how I vote. I just don’t think the President has that much power (he can’t legislate, he can’t rule on anything…he can basically just veto legislation (and only in certain situations) and declare war. Since the military is the group who is really sacrificing anything of substance during a war (and thereafter), I will typically trust their opinions on the matter over my own since I am rarely ever affected by the acts of the President.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
Not just lazy
It’s almost fascist. By the way, who is “the military”?
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 1:14 PM CDT up reply actions
well...
1) a donor report backed that up several months ago saying that more contributions were being made to obama while larger contributions were being made toward the republican party… the analysis i heard at the time said it made sense as most soldiers think obama will end the wars so they contribute to him, though they have less money… and that officers, who get promoted much faster(easier to earn commendations in war time) we contributing to the republicans, and had more money to contribute…
2) my brother is a marine stationed over seas(on a boat in the indian ocean currently)… said most of the non-officers are all backing obama… since they are the ones in harms way…
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
In a boat...
the officers and enlisted would be equally in harm’s way.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
he's only on the boat...
…in transport…
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
Looks like...
you’re brother might be mistaken…
http://www.militarytimes.com/static/projects/pages/081003_ep_2pp.pdf
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
That's an unscientific poll, Ben
you, who have been linking “problems” with polls.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
Okay...
Show me some other polls.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
There are none
Either way, there are none. So someone voting for whomever “the military” chose to support would have no idea who to vote for.
by Black Francis on Oct 29, 2008 3:59 PM CDT up reply actions
Sounds like
Another rationalization, no?
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 4:00 PM CDT up reply actions
thanks...
…ignore the part where you tell me the officers are in as much danger as my brother, ignoring the fact you’re taking into account the time when they are acutally in danger on land… my brother could very well be wrong about the make up of the militarys opinion… i was talking about HIS observations… thanks for playing.
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
the donor report that i saw
showed Obama with a 6 to 1 lead in contributions, but it was like $150K to $25K and it was months old.
Most polls of actual voting support though have been heavily weighted towards McCain. Most of that is based on the racial composition of the armed forces in this particular election, but even if Obama was white, I don’t see it causing a big enough swing to lead him to a majority within the military.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
Aw hell
I can’t find it. About a month or so ago there was a story in the news about Obama outpolling McCain by a sizeable margin, and raising more money than McCain from soldiers as well. The poll last week that favored McCain was unscientific.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
I don't think you can poll members of the armed forces scientifically
…even in peacetime it would be a challenge.
by Black Francis on Oct 29, 2008 4:01 PM CDT up reply actions
I view the most effective
commander in chief as the one who accomplishes more of our objectives while using the military the least. So on that front, a guy like Kennedy who got the Russians to back missiles out of cuba without going to war rates much higher than a dink like Bush who went to war over absolutely nothing in Iraq.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
Thank God
he kept us safe from the Grenadan invasion that would have ruined the American way of life.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
It also gave us a horribly cheesy Clint Eastwood movie....
Donit underrate that contribution to modern society.
You know any movie with
Mario Van Peebles has to be great.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
here's a question
if Bush was just a one-termer up for reelection at THIS point in time, would the military still be Pro-Republican? Would they support Obama?
I’m curious…I don’t really know what the answer would be.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
Hmm...
But, the truth of the matter is that I’m more ideologically sympathetic to McCain’s views. So why, then, wouldn’t I just say I’m supporting McCain on those grounds as opposed to what I’ve actually stated?
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
I think you should just admit you prefer McCain
for what McCain says, not for some abstract divided government rationale. There isn’t any shame in supporting him for actual fiscal/economic reasons
But, that's not why I support McCain.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
But
He has no answer as to whether he would vote Republicans into Congress to offset the Democratic majority, or, in an attempt to keep gridlock, would vote in Democrats along with McCain. Or would he vote Reps for House and Dem for Senate? My guess is that he hasn’t thought it out that far.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 11:46 AM CDT up reply actions
Right
The reason you support McCain is because you’re a racist. Just like all McCain supporters. Heh!!!
by robert_d_wilfong on Oct 29, 2008 12:13 PM CDT up reply actions
Ah, crackpots...
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
From a thread I had earlier
I look forward to a Republican who actually lays out a program of fiscal conservatism rather than just giving it lip service, and then spending more than the Dems.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
You'll be looking forward for some time, I suspect.
Meaning of life? The aggregate collection of moments that you allow to enter into your consciousness, imo, fwiw, etc. (etc.)
by inactive lsb user on Oct 29, 2008 10:46 AM CDT up reply actions
Rep or Dem...
anyone, I don’t care. But fiscal conservatism isn’t sexy.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Huh?
You’re gonna have to flesh this out.
Meaning of life? The aggregate collection of moments that you allow to enter into your consciousness, imo, fwiw, etc. (etc.)
by inactive lsb user on Oct 29, 2008 10:51 AM CDT up reply actions
Nvm
Didn’t realize you were generalizing. I thought you were arguing a point.
Meaning of life? The aggregate collection of moments that you allow to enter into your consciousness, imo, fwiw, etc. (etc.)
by inactive lsb user on Oct 29, 2008 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions
Yeah,
its easier to say “I’m cutting your taxes” without any idea how to pay for the programs than it is to say “I’m cutting these programs”.
I guess thats why the Republicans are the party of fiscal conservatives in name only.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
Personally
I’m generally against any and all federal government spending, outside of three major areas: national defense (doesn’t really include invading other countries) and interstate infrastructure (highways, pipelines, etc), and funding basic scientific research at fundamental areas that are not profitable for companies to pursue.
Given that certain segments of society have become dependent on the federal government (elderly, poor, etc), I am practical in accepting that social programs won’t go away. But I am for limiting any further growth and for paring down when it makes sense.
I vote against every California proposition that proposes new bonds / spending, even if my job will directly benefit (stem cell research, for instance).
I agree
It is time for some fiscal responsibility, acccountability and reform in govt. Where have I heard that?
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
On EVERY political ad on TV
"Colt mccoy sucks, mack brown needs to be fired." - Longhorn
by LSBUser on Oct 29, 2008 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions
I would agree with your areas
although the amount we might spend on national defense is always open for discussion. From a practical standpoint, I really don’t want to see tax cuts in advance of spending cuts, because I believe its a case of pay me now or pay me later, and its probably cheaper to pay now.
One thing I do appreciate more than I used to on the spending side is food safety inspectors and the like. I used to think it would just be bad business not to poison your customers, but I think we saw that some companies will not spend money in safeguards to protect their business, which wouldn’t be bad, but they will end up killing consumers in the process.
Business will not spend money to fix problems that the executives can convince themselves have only a low probability of happening. If they have to choose between yearly bonuses and eliminating risks that will kill their customers, they will take the bonuses every time.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
Good point about regulators
I think that as far as spending goes, they’re probably a negligible cost. Its really more of a question of the degree of regulation – which so far as safety goes, I think there is a strong national interest for it. While it isn’t in any industry’s interest to have scandals, at the very competitive individual actor level it is often in companies’ interests to cut corners.
While I have full faith that Adam Smith’s invisible hand is a perfect regulator in the big picture, in the short term effects of corporate misbehavior can be so devastating (as we’ve seen lately) that you need government control over some of these things.
But regulation should NOT be used for pandering political purposes, which both parties, but especially the Dems, have been guilty of.
Ladies and gentlemen...
…behold the glory that is Bill O’Reilly’s electoral map.
Kindly note that:
-Oregon (which RealClearPolitics puts at a 15.2-point average Obama lead) is a tossup.
-Michigan (RCP Avg.: Obama +17) is a tossup.
-Iowa (RCP Avg.: Obama + 11.4) is a tossup.
-New Hampshire (RCP Avg.: Obama +12.6) is a tossup.
-Minnesota (RCP Avg.: Obama +11.3) is a tossup.
-Pennsylvania (RCP Avg.: Obama + 11) is a tossup. (I guess I’m willing to concede that, since McCain is putting all his eggs in that basket.)
-Wisconsin (RCP Avg.: Obama +10.6) is a tossup.
-New Mexico (RCP Avg.: Obama +8.4 and growing) is a tossup.
-Colorado (RCP Avg. Obama + 8.3 and growing) is a tossup.
MEANWHILE…
-North Carolina (RCP Avg.: Obama +1.3) is solid red.
-Indiana (RCP Avg.: Obama +1.4) is solid red.
-Montana (RCP Avg.: McCain +3.2) is solid red. (Again, willing to concede, but it’s just kind of funny that McCain’s up 3.2 and it’s solid red, but Obama’s up 17 in Michigan and it’s a “tossup”.)
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
I'll tell you
its good that he is bipartison and won’t announce his party allegience. It makes him so fair and balanced.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
interactive map
ghtd36, it is an interactive map. Click on a state to change its color. I don’t think the defaults reflect what O’Reilly thinks.
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
really
how did he arrive at the defaults? flipped a coin?
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
You really
think that O’Reilly believes that is where the election is right now?
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
i think he has his agenda with that map
and its transparent and stupid.
only one place in the world that might have mccain ahead in an electoral projections map.
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
the defaults
were probably set a long time ago – back in April or something. That’d be my guess anyway – because before this race really got under way, places like Michigan were battlegrounds and North Carolina were considered pretty safe.
I have zero proof of this, and can’t even load the site on my computer for some reason. But I’ve noticed that defaults on maps like that don’t get updated.
More polling oddities...
http://www.bobkrumm.com/blog/?p=2034
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Is it your contention that McCain can/will win this thing?
No sarcasm or joking intended in that question, for the record.
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
I said...
two threads ago that the race is a lot closer than the CW would have us believe.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
i dont' think you're right
this is where i’d nromally make a bet but i’m not that confident. however, I don’t remember the last time i picked instinct over stats so I’m not sure why I’d doubt Nate now.
also, I’m not exactly sure what the infomercial will do
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
I think...
the Khalidi videotape gets released tomorrow, which will negate whatever positive effect the informercial has.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
and Obama surrogates won't mention that McCain gave a bunch of money to Khalidi?
people don’t care
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
Jewish populations...
in Florida care, I bet.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
worst case he loses florida
(which i don’t think he will)- then what?
obama doesn’t need florida
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
Okay.
I get it man, you like you some Obama.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Ben
Do you understand how big Obamas lead is?
Obama has all the Kerry states locked up – 252 EV
Obama has Iowa and New Mexico locked up – 12 EV
Obama has a 6-8 point lead in both Colorado(9) and Virginia (13). If he wins one of these its over.
Ohio and Florida are meaningless unless McCain can win both Virginia and Colorado.
Not to mention Nev,NC,Mon,ND,Ind,Missouri and to a lesser extent Az,SD, and Georgia.
"Jesus was a community organizer. Pontius Pilate was a governor"
i don't understand the problem
Ben: I don’t think Obama’s going to do so well – here’s why
Me: I don’t think those things matter but assuming they do, it only affects one state
Ben: quit questioning me and let me live with my hunches.
is that about right? cause I’ll be more than happy to.
incidentally, i don’t’ think the tape is getting released but i dont’ know as much about that
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
thats...
…traditionally how it goes…
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
uhhh
how does
I get it man, you like you some Obama.
=
Ben: quit questioning me and let me live with my hunches.
if its the overall thing your going for thats one thing but from a —> b doesnt make sense there
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Oct 30, 2008 7:58 AM CDT up reply actions
Sure it does
He didn’t answer the criticism at all. He just deflected.
by brettgardner on Oct 30, 2008 7:59 AM CDT up reply actions
Yeah
I get that it will have an effect if it gets released but it really shouldn’t have an effect at all. I don’t think it’s that big a deal. But don’t tell that to Joe the Plumber, a vote for Obama is definitely a vote for the death of Israel.
"Obama is a Christian - He's always been a Christian...But.........what if he is[a Muslim]? Is there something wrong with being a Muslim in this country? The answer is no, that's not America." Colin Powell on Obama/Muslim assertions.
McCain can win it
I don’t expect that he will.
My electoral projected vote tally: Obama @ ~310. Far closer than people anticipate
More from the WaPo...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/10/28/AR2008102803675_pf.html
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
I've noticed
you never link Nate Silver’s site when talking about polls.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
I've noticed...
that Grape Nuts are tasty and Swiss Cake Rolls are part of a balanced breakfast.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
What's wrong
With Nate’s methods.
I am the motherfucking shore patrol, motherfucker! I am the motherfucking shore patrol! Give this man a beer.
Yeah...
I don’t see it that close.
Obama finishes with about 350 electoral votes, would be my guess.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
Offered without comment...
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
by benmor78 on Oct 29, 2008 12:10 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Okay that's the best thing ever.
There’s a picture of Dirkles on the shelf behind her!
Is that part of her campaign pledge?
Cause I’d vote republican if I thought she’d put a pic of Dirkles up in the oval if she ever got in there.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Oct 29, 2008 12:14 PM CDT up reply actions
Some fun interactive stuff, too.
Very clever site.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Somethingstan on the globe
"Colt mccoy sucks, mack brown needs to be fired." - Longhorn
by LSBUser on Oct 29, 2008 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions
That's so inappropriate.
What an insult to dingbats ….
is anyone watching...
…the half hour infomercial tonite? i would call it overkill, but at this point, i think the point is overkill… i do laugh at the whole “i can’t believe he’s delaying the start of the world series!” arguement since MLB has already shown the first half hour is joe buck and company and not baseball…
does anyone think this could back fire on obama? or is the common feeling it will be so rehearsed it can’t be screwed up?
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
Obama's only appearing on it twice, to kick off the show, and then a live piece at the end
It will be so slickly edited and put together I don’t think it will backfire, except to the people that hate Obama already.
Obama
Personally, I prefer Channel 73 on Dish Network that has been Obama 24 hours a day for the past few weeks. It is captivating television.
"Colt mccoy sucks, mack brown needs to be fired." - Longhorn
by LSBUser on Oct 29, 2008 12:36 PM CDT up reply actions
What is TVone?
Out of all the networks carrying the ad, I have no idea who they are. Anyone get it or know what it is?
Fire Todd Dodge. Seriously. 45-17 to Troy. 0-12 is only four games away.
early voting
Does anyone know if early voting has ever been challenged in court as being unconstitutional?
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
For
State constitutions only. The U.S. Constitution only requires that the electoral college voters all vote on the same day, not citizens.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 12:45 PM CDT up reply actions
OK
I read article II again for the umpteenth time. I think I was reading something into it that wasn’t there. I still don’t think early voting is a good idea. It will come back to bite us one. day.
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
I think the argument probably would be
People vote early before something major is revealed about one of the candidates, and the country is stuck with someone who
The counter would be 1> where do you draw the line – you can always assume something COULD come out the Wednesday after election day – what do you do then? and 2> the electors are what matter ultimately – if it came out that whoever won was a murderer or being paid off by a foreign government or something else truly heinous, the electors (in most states) aren’t bound to vote for who they represent.
No
The basic argument is that you don’t trust democracy. That’s a sad one.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions
Missing his point I think...
The idea of everyone voting on the same day is that everyone theoretically voted using the same pool of information. Those voting early are voting on a subset of that.
However, since most folks voting early are apparently committed already, I tend to think that even the murder revelation wouldn’t change their minds much.
I think all the efforts to make voting easier are just silly ways to engage the “shouldn’t be engaged”. if you can’t be bothered to vote on Tuesday because of lines, what’s next? Do we drop by their houses and collect the votes personally? It’s the same thing that drives me batty about motor/voter. How freakin’ hard is it to pick up an app and fill it out? and these slugs are the ones we want to engage??
Hah.
It’s ironic that you would claim I missed the point, when you not only missed it by a mile, you actually demonstrated mine.
You’re of the “I don’t want people with circumstances different from my own to vote” camp. That’s a big piss all over democratic ideals, and it’s pretty disgusting.
There’s never been a rule that everybody has to vote on the same day, and there’s no “idea” behind it, just procedural economy. Electors vote on the same day, and that’s all that matters. Saying that someone who happens to be busy with several important affairs on a Tuesday that he or she is “unengaged” and thus doesn’t deserve the privilege of voting is the real stuff elitism is made of.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions
Nice job trying to paint me into corner, sport..
Especially since you don’t know jack-shit about my “Circumstances”, but chose to make an prejudiced assumption about them.
My point is that if you can’t be bothered to put any effort into voting or even registering then why should you vote? You’re the one who attemtped to draw the prejudicial correlation between that position and something else.
Are you really suggesting that somehow expecting people to make voting a priority is elitist? This has been studied to death numerous times – the vast majority of people who do not vote do so for reasons of convenience, not because they can’t. Move it to Saturday, or make it a national holiday, and you won’t see much of a change in the turnout. Again, it’s been studied to death.
BTW, voting is not a privilege; it’s a responsibility.
Yeah...
plus Obama is encouraging people to take the day off and vote on Tuesday, so nobody has an excuse!
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
long lines?
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
You can sit in long lines for an iPhone...
but you can’t sit in long lines for an election? Jesus, as I said, disenfranchisement gets a bad rap.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
ok
i think the people sitting in long lines for an iphone aren’t the same people unwilling to sit in long lines to vote
how many people do you think sat in line for an iphone? ballpark it.
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
i am the winner by TKO
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
You're awesome!
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
btw
did you know that i sat in line for an iphone?
cause I don’t know what you’re talking about.
also i would be a person who sits in line for an iphone and would be really pissed about having to do so to vote. i’m pretty pissed about sitting in any line unless you can convince me that it is absolutely necessary – iphone wasn’t
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
Heh.
Voting is not a responsibility. There’s no command.
But it’s all unrelated to your point, which is that if people can’t vote on one day of the year, they shouldn’t be allowed to. I think it’s a silly position to take.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 2:40 PM CDT up reply actions
Show me where I said "shouldn't be ALLOWED to"...
I said shouldn’t vote. And it’s only a silly position to those who like the idea of bloc voting by uninformed voters who watch “Rock the Vote” and follow the leader blindly.
What IS silly is the inability (or unwillingness) to recognize the difference.
And also, look up responsibility, and you won’t find any link to compulsion. Responsibility is about personal ethics, not any requirement.
Nice try…
Hmm?
1. The state of being responsible, accountable, or answerable, as for a trust, debt, or obligation.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 3:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Still looking for compulsion in there... and you DO know what "or" means right?
I am responsible, accountable AND answerable to my conscience, but I am not compelled by it. I have the free will to act out of accordance with it.
I noticed you didn’t address your morphing of “Shouldn’t” into “shouldn’t be allowed to”.
Projection onto others is a difficult course, dude.
"Shouldn't"
Or “shouldn’t be allowed”…it doesn’t much matter to me. You can’t control it one way or the other. It was your desire that I found disgusting.
Also, if you’re denying that the word responsibility carries with it an obligation, I’m just not even sure what to say to you.
Notwithstanding your silly platitudes about “responsibility”, voting is an affirmative right. Choosing to exercise it or not plays no part in its definition, and your argument here is just pointless.
But I can go all day if you want to keep it up.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 4:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Having watched over the months/years...
I have no doubt you can, especially when you gloss over critical distinctions like whether or not compulsion can exist without a 2nd party even being involved, as in my example.
And you’re right, it IS pointless for me to think otherwise about the debate.
When
Did I ever say compulsion can exist without a second party?
If you’ll remember correctly, I was actually attacking your position, not advocating it.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 4:36 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't think voting rates
are a concern. If people don’t want to vote, that means they either 1> don’t care, or 2> don’t understand the process. Either way I don’t want them choosing our government.
Twisting people’s arms to vote only pushes the country more towards identity politics (you’re black, you should vote for Obama; you go to church, you should vote for McCain)
Agree.
Sometimes I think they should go with the Heilein “Starship Troopers” model, or have people take the citizenship test prior to voting.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
well
I’m not saying that those people shouldn’t be allowed to vote. I just think they shouldn’t be coerced into voting.
The idea of people taking old people with dementia into the polling booth to vote horrifies me. If they want to vote, then let them. But if they don’t care because they think Kennedy is still President, then let them sit in peace and don’t force them into the room.
I think disenfranchising people...
gets a bad rap.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
But don't you know...
that long lines are a elitist attempt to control the outcome?
C’mon keep up here.
Speaking of elitists...
P.J. O’Rourke, in discussing George H.W. Bush’s inauguration, said that he rode the parade route in a closed limousine, popping out occasionally “like the Beatles.” “Americans prefer their populism in small doses, and, preferably, from an elitist.”
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
I'm not sure
not allowing folks to vote who don’t
1) Fill out a form at a post office or other government building.
2) Have a form mailed to them and fill it out.
should be considered disenfranchising.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
No...
I mean actively disenfranchising people gets a bad rap.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
I'm all for it
as long as I get to pick who is enfranchised.
That way I could set the bar at High School Degrees (GEDs don’t count). All here who can’t clear that bar, raise your hands, Ben.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
That is slightly inconsistent
with your credo of allowing people to make bad choices because they’re stupid.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
Stupid people...
should only be allowed to do stupid things to the extent that it only inconveniences them. When it inconveniences me, I have a problem with it.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
you are so radical!
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
I agree
I don’t mind a low bar to voting. You can get applications at every post office, thats a low enough bar for me.
I am glad we spread out the voting dates. I hate long lines.
As far as “pools of information”, regardless of what we find out, McCain has a tranny operation scheduled, Barack is the love child of Saddam Hussein, whatever, it won’t change some basic things like Texas will vote Republican, and Massachusetts will vote Democrat. We might as well start getting out of the way the folks whose minds are made up.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
I vote on election day every year
in the morning right before work, and I’ve never stood in line in my life.
Maybe that is just California – which means that there is one government thing this state actually performs well
Nope, it's not just California
I’ve never stood in a line longer than an hour in my life, unless you count staying on line all night for Stones tickets.
much worse in inner cities
densely populated areas
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
Come on now
People in inner cities don’t vote. Right???
"Colt mccoy sucks, mack brown needs to be fired." - Longhorn
by LSBUser on Oct 29, 2008 2:53 PM CDT up reply actions
here
As bking stated below, everyone would make their decision using the same set of information.
What effect do stories about early voting turnout have on the election? http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/10/29/early.voting/?iref=hpmostpop
While an Oct surprise is unlikely in the Presidential race, there are many other races/issues on the ballots that can be effected by late news. See Ted Stevens.
Increased early voting will eventually have an effect on how candidates campaign.
How soon before actual results from early voting start getting released?
It will give time for the state/local election officials to complete voter registration. Get rid of provisional ballots. Are they even counted?
Do we really want more people casting ballots in early voting or on election day?
Why not open the polls for three days instead of just one. The first Sun – Tues in Nov would work.
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
everyone would make their decision using the same set of information.
That’s ridiculous. People aren’t reading, watching, paying attention to the same things.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
The same set of
information would be available. At what extent they choose to use it is up to them. How about I change “same set of information” to “same news cycle”?
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
I like that
much better. I just think that people who have not decided or the least bit unsure can wait longer to vote. Even major news (just in, Obama eats babies!) would probably only cause a small minority to change their votes at this point. We have had 2 years of election coverage. If people don’t know enough now about Obama or McCain they simply haven’t tried.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
But
people haven’t been paying attention for two years.
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
the point is
there is a LOT of information already available about the candidates and their platforms.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
one of the reasons cited for the obama ad buy
appeal to female voters who are too busy to care about the election and just wait till the last week to soak up information.
speculation by political consultants but might have some basis. would refute your general notion that they don’t care – or they dont’ care but have a good enough reason for not caring but still care now.
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
That's whay I said "Same pool of information"..
Man, the mis-quoters are in full force here today. :D
bill o'reilly and dick morris
have fantastic electoral projection maps.
it’s a big pic, so i’ll just post the link to it
"At least I don't plaster on the makeup like a trollop, you c*nt."
-John McCain to his wife, in front of reporters
By the way
I love that McCain quote :) Good family values!
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
mccain keeps catching up in the national polls
he’s gained like 3 points in 4 days. wow. assuming the state polls are a few days behind, obama may need to figure out how to stop the bleeding.
"At least I don't plaster on the makeup like a trollop, you c*nt."
-John McCain to his wife, in front of reporters
As I've been saying...
I don’t think the polling is accurately reflecting what’s going to happen 11/4.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
do you believe mccain is going to win?
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
i think it's possible.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
anything is
i was never one of the ones that said obama had it locked. we both agreed that obama would likely win, but mccain ain’t out of it.
right now mccain really is having that surge. i hope that obama turns it around in the polls tomorrow and his commercial resonates with undecideds, we’ll see that in the polls starting friday.
"At least I don't plaster on the makeup like a trollop, you c*nt."
-John McCain to his wife, in front of reporters
way to hedge your bets and be non-commital.
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
By saying that I think the polling data...
and conventional wisdom is wrong, and that McCain is probably going to do better than is being projected, I still think that’s going out on a limb.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
either way, not answering the question.
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
I don't know if McCain is going to win.
How am I supposed to answer that?
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
its a simple opinion question. do you not have an opinion?
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
"Do you believe McCain is going to win?"
Answer: I don’t know.
Are you having a hard time figuring out how the reply button works? You’re replying to yourself.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
i replied like that...
…because i i hate seeing the columns get tiny after 6 back and forths…
so, you don’t know what you BELIEVE?… awesome.
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
I don't know what's going to happen.
Do you?
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
did i ask what you KNOW?
i asked what you believe… you know, your take on what you think might happen… i’m not asking what will happen, just what you think will happen… there is a difference…
at this point i BELIEVE obama is going to win.
i find it repugnant that you refuse to say you believe mccain will win, or even you believe obama will win…. keep riding that fence so the day after you can say you knew it was going to happen that way all along.
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
Uh huh.
Okay.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
I'm voting for
Obama but am 95% sure McCain will win. Call me ignorant but, when it comes down to it, I don’t think America will vote for a black president.
"Obama is a Christian - He's always been a Christian...But.........what if he is[a Muslim]? Is there something wrong with being a Muslim in this country? The answer is no, that's not America." Colin Powell on Obama/Muslim assertions.
let alone a muslim terrorist
"At least I don't plaster on the makeup like a trollop, you c*nt."
-John McCain to his wife, in front of reporters
heh be careful
i got blasted in the other thread for saying that the number of people who vote for Obama because hes black will cancel out the number of people who vote against Obama because he is black…
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"I'm more happy to be a Dallas Cowboy than when I got my first bike" - Roy Williams (WR)
by knockoutking on Oct 29, 2008 2:08 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't think that's necessarily true.
"Obama is a Christian - He's always been a Christian...But.........what if he is[a Muslim]? Is there something wrong with being a Muslim in this country? The answer is no, that's not America." Colin Powell on Obama/Muslim assertions.
which way do you think it tilts?
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Oct 30, 2008 8:01 AM CDT up reply actions
I don't think it is worth trying to trap Ben here
He’s saying that he thinks McCain may do better than people are saying. That isn’t a radical or biased position. Its just his opinion.
Pretty much all of us could come up with a percent chance that McCain or Obama will win the election. 538 has McCain’s chances at 4. CW is probably 10 or so. Ben is suggesting “higher” . I’d give McCain a 25% shot at this election.
The real question for Ben (and all of us) is how confident is he in the outcome?
I would agree with that.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Heh
And your absolute lack of information to base that opinion on is mighty impressive.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 2:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Nah
McCain’s numbers have risen slightly, but Obama’s number has been steady. McCain has drawn marginally closer in the national polls, but he would have to have a miracle in the state polls to get to 270.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
so what will you do when obama wins
wear the lima dress and take a picture?
kind of makes it sound like i have some sick fetish but I would assume that it would be somewhat embarassing for you.
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
No, it wouldn't.
Why would that be embarrassing?
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Come on
McCain would have to do a lot better than current polling indicates in several states to win. Sure, it could happen, but this is not going to be a Dewey-Truman thing.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
Ben's got his super hot top secret info
from Limbaugh, Hannity, and O’Reilly.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
miles' ohio informant
possibly a blue haired woman in del boca vista
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
good points.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
why do you still lump o'reilly in with those guys
im conservative, yes…
but not even i listen to/watch hannity/limbaugh
o’reilly gets a bad (historical) rap but hes not on the same level as those guys
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Oct 30, 2008 8:02 AM CDT up reply actions
I agree, he isn't nearly as bad as the other two
Some people have a big problem with him, though, b/c he won’t stop fronting that he’s an independent.
Those who would sacrifice liberty for safety deserve neither.
by Brian Thomas on Oct 30, 2008 12:07 PM CDT up reply actions
McCains path to victory?
I just don’t see one. Somebody show me how he wins this election using the map.
"Jesus was a community organizer. Pontius Pilate was a governor"
Well, it all starts
with Hawaii, Massachusetts, and DC all voting for McCain …..
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
path
nothing complicated – just win OH, PA, FL – and hold onto the other big Bush states.
I don’t think Obama will win FL and I think if McCain wins, he turned PA with some Applalachia friendly argument. OH in a very close race might follow suit.
NC and VA – you, as McCain, would just hope that the red states stay red.
definitely not impossible
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
VA
Is gone. No use looking back.
There is a plausible scenario where Obama loses Ohio, Pennsylvania, and Florida and still wins.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 2:50 PM CDT up reply actions
hmm
even if VA is gone, McCain can still win with NV
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
I could see
McCain maybe pulling out FL and NC, but not the others, and that still leaves Obama with over 300 EV.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
like tim kaine said
obama can win w/o virginia
…but mccain cant win w/o it
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Oct 30, 2008 8:02 AM CDT up reply actions
Okay a little fun here
Give me a response saying your confidence in an OBAMA victory. 0% (certain Mccain win) – 100% (certain Obama win).
In other words, if you had $1000 to put on an intrade bet, at what value do you think its an even-money bet
95%
There’s just nothing in any of the numbers or trends to indicate that McCain is going to miraculously rise in all the states he needs to rise in. In-fighting within the campaign is only underscoring the general belief that they have no chance.
I think people are only hedging now because they either don’t want to seem overconfident, or they’re letting their desires influence their analysis.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 3:05 PM CDT up reply actions
my rational brain
tells me that it is closer to 95% certain. But I have this gut thing going on – this campaign is a little too different from those in the past to think all of our proven predictive measures are valid. Sure there probably is no Bradley Effect – but there has never been a test at the national level. What if there is an equivalent reverse Bradley Effect for Palin (women will vote for Palin, but are embarrassed to admit to a pollster)? Obama is hands down the “cool” choice for President – does that affect polling? 538’s pollsters are tuned mainly by the many competitive Democrat primaries – is that a selection bias towards the ones who poll Democrats better?
It works both ways of course – minority turnout is impossible to project but will definitely be up. I am convinced the “youth vote” actually shows up this time (how well did 20 year old college kids relate to John Kerry?).
There is a lot of uncertainty, and a lot of history of places like Virginia and Ohio voting for the conservative.
My long way of saying that I don’t know what will happen. Which added to my rational 95% confidence looking at the polls, averages out to a lower probability.
Well
I think one of the big undersells among the younger than 25 crowd is the sudden disappearance of land lines. Cell phones are rarely added to the call lists. What’s more, polls generally ask for the oldest male/female at the residence.
I don’t think the youth vote is going to be as huge as some others might, but a 10-15% increase is certainly possible.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 3:55 PM CDT up reply actions
Polling
All these polls are using the rolls from 2004 and only call land lines. Considering the # of new voters the Dem’s have registered , and that at least 60-70% of the non-land line folks are probably going Obama…There is a real chance Obama could outperform the polls.
"Jesus was a community organizer. Pontius Pilate was a governor"
yeah
That is a real possibility. But there are ten other hypotheticals that anyone can throw out there also.
That's why I don't get too worked up on polls..
There’s a mountain of evidence that political polling can be wildly inaccurate, yet we fixate on it every four years.
28.34%
"Colt mccoy sucks, mack brown needs to be fired." - Longhorn
by LSBUser on Oct 29, 2008 3:03 PM CDT up reply actions
you think McCain has a 72% chance of winning
just want to clarify why
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
I have no reason
Ben is my hero.
"Colt mccoy sucks, mack brown needs to be fired." - Longhorn
by LSBUser on Oct 29, 2008 9:11 PM CDT up reply actions
You're a good man.
I’m still waiting for our date at the Frisco game.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
95%
There is always the 5% chance that Obama comes out, yells “Where’s the white women at” and humps Katie Couric on Network TV.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
She'd go for it...
Her lust for him has been transparent from the jump. Only thing is she may have to knock Charles Gibson out of the way to get to his crotch. :D
I'm not sure she wouldn't just
let him at her freshly scoped colon.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
Dear god.
Meaning of life? The aggregate collection of moments that you allow to enter into your consciousness, imo, fwiw, etc. (etc.)
by inactive lsb user on Oct 29, 2008 4:15 PM CDT up reply actions
again with the dead people jokes
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
McCain?
or Couric?
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
couric
i mean, it’s indirect but she got a colonoscopy because of her dead husband
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
Ah,
I thought you were talking about her dead career.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
haha
Meaning of life? The aggregate collection of moments that you allow to enter into your consciousness, imo, fwiw, etc. (etc.)
by inactive lsb user on Oct 29, 2008 8:35 PM CDT up reply actions
98.5%
I can’t see McCain winning 95% of the tossups or Penn plus 80% of the tossups. Obama has a 28-17 lead with 2 minutes left and the ball inside the redzone.
"Jesus was a community organizer. Pontius Pilate was a governor"
90%
i worry about any state where its close enough for a recount… republicans have shown they are much better at those kinda political gambits…
and in the spirit enut’s analogy, i think its much more like obama has the ball inside the mccain 20 with 2 minutes left but the score is 23-14… a screw up and a hail mary and its a whole nother ball game…
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
Like I said before
Obama victory 5%.
"Obama is a Christian - He's always been a Christian...But.........what if he is[a Muslim]? Is there something wrong with being a Muslim in this country? The answer is no, that's not America." Colin Powell on Obama/Muslim assertions.
that's one thing i'm looking forward to in this election
restoration of voter confidence. There are too many people like you who think " a black man will never get elected" or even “a liberal will never get elected.”
of course, if mccain wins, there will be a whole generation of disillusionment
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
That is my biggest fear about a McCain win
Although there are plenty of rational reasons for people to support McCain over Obama, it will quickly be assumed both here and throughout the world that America didn’t elect Obama since we are a racist nation. Heck, people will probably look at the red states in the South and attribute that entirely to racism.
Of course, the irony is that no major country in Europe or Asia would ever come nearly as close as we will in electing a minority president (imagine someone of Algerian descent elected president of France – not going to happen…).
well
if it had happened that mccain led pretty much since the convention or since the begininning of october not a big deal.
if mccain manages to close it out a bit before winning, probably not a big deal but eyebrows would be raised
if polls look the way they do now and he wins…
Also, technically India elected a minority Prime Minister (sikh) and came really close to having an Italian Prime Minister.
In Bolivia they elected a Native American
I’m sure there are other examples
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
Fujimori in Peru is the only one in the western world
Those who would sacrifice liberty for safety deserve neither.
by Brian Thomas on Oct 30, 2008 12:27 PM CDT up reply actions
why don't you count the bolivian guy (Evo Morales)
he is Aymaran – indigenous to South America and a very small minority group
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
Sorry, meant to type only OTHER one
Those who would sacrifice liberty for safety deserve neither.
by Brian Thomas on Oct 30, 2008 6:52 PM CDT up reply actions
Yep.
Like I said, he’s got my vote. I just don’t see it.
"Obama is a Christian - He's always been a Christian...But.........what if he is[a Muslim]? Is there something wrong with being a Muslim in this country? The answer is no, that's not America." Colin Powell on Obama/Muslim assertions.
85-90%
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Oct 30, 2008 8:04 AM CDT up reply actions
I love what conservatives are doing with this old Chicago Public Radio interview.
Quoth Obama, 2001:
African-Americans were not — first of all they weren’t African-Americans — the Africans at the time were not considered as part of the polity that was of concern to the Framers. I think that as Richard said it was a ‘nagging problem’ in the same way that these days we might think of environmental issues, or some other problem where you have to balance cost-benefits, as opposed to seeing it as a moral problem involving persons of moral worth.
And in that sense, I think we can say that the Constitution reflected an enormous blind spot in this culture that carries on until this day, and that the Framers had that same blind spot. I don’t think the two views are contradictory, to say that it was a remarkable political document that paved the way for where we are now, and to say that it also reflected the fundamental flaw of this country that continues to this day.
Sean Hannity/Rush Limbaugh/Bill O’Reilly/Michelle Malkin/Ann Coulter: “BWAHH! HE THINKS THE CONSTITUTION IS FLAWED! HE HATES AMERICA! BWAHH!”
Except for, you know, he was talking about…the whole slavery thing…
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
I should clarify.
By “conservative”, I mean right-wing pundits, not necessarily all conservatives. For example, I happen to like RangerMad.
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
Can't we just start calling those folks what they are?
Rush and Hannity are just propagandists, pure and simple. They make a very good living doing it, but they are really not pundits.
Pundit connotes that someone actually knows something.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
never understood the argument
that if i think this country have some severe flaws that it makes me less american than someone else who thinks its perfect as is…
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
Me either
It’s the same way I feel when I or Cahill get called out for being too negative when we say something bad about the Rangers.
"Colt mccoy sucks, mack brown needs to be fired." - Longhorn
by LSBUser on Oct 29, 2008 3:34 PM CDT up reply actions
well, you are pretty anti-ranger...
maybe you should move/root for some team in canada if you don’t like the rangers so much.
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
Blow Jays
"Colt mccoy sucks, mack brown needs to be fired." - Longhorn
by LSBUser on Oct 29, 2008 3:39 PM CDT up reply actions
It's always funny to me
when I get called out on a prediction that I hit almost perfectly.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
Well...
If it was still 2000 and we were fresh off 3 playoff years out of 4 I could understand why people would get touchy about it. But after 9 years of suckitude you would think that more folks would agree that this team has a few issues.
"Colt mccoy sucks, mack brown needs to be fired." - Longhorn
by LSBUser on Oct 29, 2008 3:43 PM CDT up reply actions
trying to figure out which one of you is the most pessimistic is difficult
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
No it's not
it’s Cahill. Pessimism has been a good stance on the Rangers for a while.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
you weren't around for the ESPN Boards
I bring this up a lot at DaheelzCM probably doesn’t liek ti but I think he predicted the 2005 Rangers to be 15 games out of 1st by June
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
Wasn't around, then
but not too long after. I started lurking on Adam’s old blog.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
Those were good times
"Colt mccoy sucks, mack brown needs to be fired." - Longhorn
by LSBUser on Oct 29, 2008 9:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Personally
I don’t think either one of us is very pessimistic. It’s the rest of you people with your head in the clouds that are the problem. :)
"Colt mccoy sucks, mack brown needs to be fired." - Longhorn
by LSBUser on Oct 29, 2008 9:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Head where?
I think it’s optimistic to assume that’s where most of the heads are.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
we have no pitching
and must only sign/draft pitchers for the next 7-8 years
/stealhome
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Oct 30, 2008 8:09 AM CDT up reply actions
Sean Hannity/Rush Limbaugh/Bill O’Reilly/Michelle Malkin/Ann Coulter
im telling you, theres one name that doesnt belong in that group
yes, coulter/hannity/rush/malkin are pretty cleraly “out there” – hence i pay 0 attention to them
but o’reilly is not as bad (he does get a bad rap because he used to be the only “outspokeN” guy) but come on…
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Oct 30, 2008 8:08 AM CDT up reply actions
Nah,
he’s pretty much a propaganda blowing douchebag too. George Will wouldn’t belong in a group like that though.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
heres a question though
what do you think about guys like chris wallace, fred barnes, bill kristol, etc
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Oct 30, 2008 8:58 AM CDT up reply actions
A lot of them
are propaganda blowing douchebags.
Here is my test.
A Democrat congressman is found with a dead hooker in his office, and a Republican congressman is found with a dead hooker in their office. A guy like Fred Barnes will apply a different set of standards to those events based on party affiliation, as will O’Reilly, as will Eleanor Clift, etc.
I prefer guys who try to set a common standard to both.
O’Reilly’s take on Lynne Spears and her daughters out of wedlock baby and Palin and her daughter’s out of wedlock baby was classic. That moved him firmly in the propaganda spewing douchebag category.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
ok
so do you like any of the three i listed or are they all in the same category as rush to you?
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Oct 30, 2008 9:22 AM CDT up reply actions
also who are some MSM guys you do like
may have to look into paying more attention to them
one more name for you: charles krauthammer
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Oct 30, 2008 9:22 AM CDT up reply actions
I don't like
Krauthammer or Carl Thomas as op ed writers. I always feel like I know exactly what they’re going to say in response to any issue before they say it. Reflexively blaming Democrats for every problem. That’s a bit more perception than reality perhaps, I’m sure they don’t do that in every article, but a large number. George Will is by far my favorite conservative writer. He’s someone who, if I don’t agree with what he says (and I often do), I at least respect how he’s thought through it and presented his argument. He’s a bit smarmy, but still more balanced and consistent than a lot of writers on either side.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
Yeah
Will is easily my favorite. He doesn’t seem to shift with the breeze and actually has some substance to his position. I still disagree with him, but I’d put him in the pundit category rather than just the propagandist category of Rush, Coulter, etc.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
Krauthammer: rarely an honest framer of the facts
Those who would sacrifice liberty for safety deserve neither.
by Brian Thomas on Oct 30, 2008 2:44 PM CDT up reply actions
A better question is
What does he think about Dee Dee Meyers, Brazille and Begala?
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
Most political pundits
wear me out. I don’t listen to the CNBC or Fox news guys much anymore. I read straight news, and watch the ABC sunday morning show. For the record, on that show I like Will, and can’t stand Donaldson, who really may be one of the dumbest commentators out there.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
George Will is great
Sam Donaldson is getting too old and senile. There were a few awkward moments in the primaries when he’d say things about Hillary and Obama that made me cringe. I was certain he was about to blurt out “how can they elect this muslim guy?”
Donaldson
was never good. He made a name for himself during the Reagan administration by being able to yell louder than the helicopters, and that was his claim to fame. He has completely irrational and illogical trains of thought, and he kind of looks like an alien.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
Brazile sucks, Begala is really funny
Dee Dee: meh. Boring.
Those who would sacrifice liberty for safety deserve neither.
by Brian Thomas on Oct 30, 2008 2:45 PM CDT up reply actions
Brazille is the smartest one of the bunch by far
Begala is alright but he is way too biased – and lost a ton of luster this cycle.
i don’t know who dee dee myers is
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
I agree
but you could and Levine, Savage and Ingraham.
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
Ingraham is one angryass woman
Put her on a show with someone she disagrees with and it becomes unwatchable. Just angry interruptions and shouting down and grating attempts to bully and browbeat.. So obnoxious.
I have never listened to her radio show, but I find it hard to believe it would be much different.
Those who would sacrifice liberty for safety deserve neither.
by Brian Thomas on Oct 30, 2008 2:50 PM CDT up reply actions
bet mccain campaign is pissed
that broward county is busing senior students that are registered to vote to the polls.
"At least I don't plaster on the makeup like a trollop, you c*nt."
-John McCain to his wife, in front of reporters
The freshest of fresh polls.
Straight from CNN:
Colorado: Obama 53, McCain 45
Florida: Obama 51, McCain 47
Georgia McCain 52, Obama 47
Missouri: McCain 50, Obama 48
Virginia: Obama 53, McCain 44
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
does anyone really think obama wins georgia?
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Oct 30, 2008 8:10 AM CDT up reply actions
No.
Those who would sacrifice liberty for safety deserve neither.
by Brian Thomas on Oct 30, 2008 2:51 PM CDT up reply actions
which way are these states going?
best guess:
florida-
missouri-
virginia-
north carolina-
indiana-
ohio-
pennsylvania-
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
All go to Obama
Except Indiana and possibly Missouri and/or Florida.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 3:52 PM CDT up reply actions
My gueses.
Florida- McCain. The base comes home for the Republican.
Missouri- McCain. Call me cynical about a state I called my own, but I just don’t see it happening for Obama in Mo.
Virginia- Obama, maybe by double digits.
North Carolina- Gun to my head, I say McCain, but it wouldn’t surprise me if Obama won it.
Indiana- McCain. No surprise.
Ohio- Obama. Too many voters in Cleveland, Cincinnati and other places that relate to Obama.
Pennsylvania- Obama. Big.
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
All that could happen
And McCain could win NH, CO, and NV, and Obama would still win.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 3:59 PM CDT up reply actions
North Carolina
This state will say a ton about how the night will go I think.
If Obama wins with 52% we will be looking at a landslide
if McCain wins in a 50+1 type deal, Obama will probably win with a solid 290-300EV victory.
If McCain wins easily 53-54%+, It could get pretty close.
"Jesus was a community organizer. Pontius Pilate was a governor"
I agree with all of that
except Obama big in Penn. Obama by 5 points.
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
so you are buying into
the big secretive mccain internal polling?
or into the murtha thing? either has statements about racist western PA or a backlash.
i just don’t see mccain within 7 or 8 pts in PA.
"At least I don't plaster on the makeup like a trollop, you c*nt."
-John McCain to his wife, in front of reporters
florida- mccain
missouri- mccain
virginia- obama (but will be closer than some think)
north carolina-mccain
indiana- mccain
ohio- mccain (verrrrrrry close)
pennsylvania- obama (not very close)
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Oct 30, 2008 8:11 AM CDT up reply actions
Add Florida for Obama to that map and that’s my prediction. Florida’s real estate market is so screwed up, I don’t see how McCain can win it.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
by DerekSTheRed on Oct 29, 2008 4:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Sure makes it clear...
that we’re pretty well split into 3 countries politically. The Northeast and rust belt, Middle America, and the pacific coast. This same general map seems to appear over and over.
democrat party made strong inroads into the SW
SE a little but that might be exclusively because of the AA vote. However, NC is starting to turn irrespective of the AA vote
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
That is a gross
oversimplification. Even withing the DFW area you’ll see wide variances in percentages between the two. In many cases the differences are a few points from Red to Blue, and people are always talking about it as if it’s two different universes.
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Texas
Since we’re doing predictions, what does everyone think Texas’ results will be? I say Obama gets to within single digits and only loses by 9%.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
it woudl be interesting...
…but even with dramatic turnout in houston and dallas… just not enough votes for obama to get that close… mccain by 15%
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
Agree.
But Dems have to be drooling over the possibility of turning Texas blue for the forseeable future. And if the Hispanic population continues to increase, it is at least a possibility.
Think about that: if you have California, Texas and New York every year, that’s 120 EVs right there. That’s enormous.
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
+1
I think if Obama is still worth a shit in 2012, the state goes blue. I thought it could even happen this year until Palin got tapped and gave rep’s a much needed buzz.
by corbsclinton on Oct 29, 2008 4:38 PM CDT up reply actions
CNN's Roland Martin
Says the same thing.
Texas is a prime example. What used to be a blue dog Democratic state now has Republicans holding every statewide office.
But things are looking up. In Dallas County, all of the county positions except for a handful were in the hands of the GOP, especially the judges. That changed four years ago, and now the party could solidify itself this time around.
The same thing in Harris County. The state’s most populous county saw Republicans take everything in sight. This time around, Democrats are poised to take back Houston and surrounding cities.
Texas Democratic leaders used to cry the blues when an election was near, but after seeing the massive turnout during the primary, they have been able to build their voter database and cultivate a new generation of politicians to run for office.
Will the state go red? Sure. But with a rock solid black vote, the ability to attract more Hispanic voters and a growing appeal to whites, Democrats may soon make Texas a competitive two-party state.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
by DerekSTheRed on Oct 29, 2008 4:48 PM CDT up reply actions
Media machine
I noticed the other day that Fox News’ ratings were decreasing while MSNBC’s and CNN’s were increasing.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/28/arts/television/28rati.html
Not sure how Limbaugh is doing overall, but a while back I saw where his ratings are highest during his commercials (yes – know it’s the NY Times).
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/07/business/media/07drill.html
Then you have the internet having a far larger influence than during the 2004 elections.
http://www.pewinternet.org/PPF/r/234/report_display.asp
My question is whether the republican machine falling apart? I’ve said before (as a Democrat) that the republican media machine was incredible. You constantly have publicans say that the media is all a bunch of liberals and at the same time have Fox News hammer into people’s brain that they’re the only “fair and balanced” source of news.
Given the changes in the likely changes to the political landscape, are the republicans behind the curve now? I wonder if the internet and it’s wildly varying viewpoints diluting the ’publicans media machine?
Nothing pithy here. Please move long.
The Obama campaign
had a lot of enthusiastic volunteers and a very well organized ground effort, the McCain campaign did not. That has a lot to do with where they are right now, and why Obama is challenging in states that had been no brainers for the GOP recently.
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I think the whole party is in disarray
And make no mistake about it, FOX News is a GOP organization founded and ran by active members of the Republican Party.
But beyond them, I think people are tired of hearing the same old shit. That simple.
by Black Francis on Oct 29, 2008 7:08 PM CDT up reply actions
Disarray
I feel the GOP will not learn a thing from this. They’ll blame McCain for not being extreme enough and run behind Palin in 2012. They’ll say that Obama is fiscally irresponsible, even though the sensible thing to do right now is run up the deficit with targeted government spending to get the country out of economic crisis.
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i think they'll be fine
they’re just screwed for 2 or 4 years.
the republicans are very strong at local levels. they can raise money like crazy. the dems lucked out with obama.
RNC>DNC
OBAMA> RNC
"At least I don't plaster on the makeup like a trollop, you c*nt."
-John McCain to his wife, in front of reporters
Not Luck
It started with Dean. Obama’s smart and is like-minded when it comes to organization, but the DNC themselves have been working on this for a while.
by Black Francis on Oct 29, 2008 8:04 PM CDT up reply actions
i'm a big dean fan
for some reason until the past few months he had been taking a TON of flack from his party for his 50 state strategy. obama is the big money machine. they lucked out with getting him. w/o him? maybe small gains, but nothing like what we may see. dean has improved the party, but he was helped.
"At least I don't plaster on the makeup like a trollop, you c*nt."
-John McCain to his wife, in front of reporters
yes and no on the luck
would they have raised this much money with anyone other than obama or MAYBE clinton? no way. not with edwards or anyone else
dean has been good…but he will never overcome the shreak heh ;)
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Oct 30, 2008 8:15 AM CDT up reply actions
Dean
…and the scream. Well, that was proved to be a little less than an honest depiction of what happened that day. Either way, though, he doesn’t spend very much time in the public eye; it’s what he’s doing behind the scenes (his job) that’s impressive.
by Black Francis on Oct 30, 2008 9:31 AM CDT up reply actions
no no i agree with you completely on the fact that hes done a VERY impressive job
dont think im saying that at all
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDwODbl3muE&feature=related
remixes:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBGR2I6pFYk
yahh bitch, yahh!: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2PEj3aMZ9A&feature=related
and my fav one: chappelle’s black howard dean
http://www.milkandcookies.com/link/48544/detail/
the chappellle show clip is EPIC! lol
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Oct 30, 2008 10:12 AM CDT up reply actions
please
you have every elite network and newspaper…quit crying about it.
"He wants to double the capital gains tax, or almost double it," Huizenga said. "I'd rather give it to charity than to him."
Exactly...
I’m glad we agree that FOX and the Wall Street Journal aren’t elite.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
I'm not crying about it
Wyo brought up FOX and I just commented that it is part of the GOP machine and that’s probably why it’s taking a small hit right now. I don’t give two shits about them…they could own the ratings or go under and it wouldn’t matter to me either way.
by Black Francis on Oct 29, 2008 8:03 PM CDT up reply actions
it's about time
for some bill clinton and obama together
in
3
2
1
"At least I don't plaster on the makeup like a trollop, you c*nt."
-John McCain to his wife, in front of reporters
i thought bill would be there
oh well
"At least I don't plaster on the makeup like a trollop, you c*nt."
-John McCain to his wife, in front of reporters
Agree.
That was outstanding. Sure, it was a lot of the same lines we have heard before, but that was a really well made ad.
by Stephen Rushin on Oct 29, 2008 7:38 PM CDT up reply actions
Precisely.
I thought it was very polished, and an excellent use of 30 minutes.
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
I didn't watch.
I suppose it’ll be on his website or something.
by Black Francis on Oct 29, 2008 8:05 PM CDT up reply actions
here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GtREqAmLsoA
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
boring
nothing new…only simple minds will get all excited about an empty suit.
"He wants to double the capital gains tax, or almost double it," Huizenga said. "I'd rather give it to charity than to him."
boring to you
because you are a mccain guy.
ghtd36 thinks it’s awesome because he’s an obama supporter.
what matter is what undecideds think. and we probably won’t know for about 2 or 3 days for the polls to catch up.
"At least I don't plaster on the makeup like a trollop, you c*nt."
-John McCain to his wife, in front of reporters
Dude
I wouldn’t be calling anyone a simple mind if I were you. Your contribution to these threads has consisted of being the village idiot.
I am the motherfucking shore patrol, motherfucker! I am the motherfucking shore patrol! Give this man a beer.
by TheBZA on Oct 29, 2008 7:38 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
as an Obama supporter
I thought it was schmaltzy and over the top and it doesn’t change my opinion that it was unnecessary.
but i don’t think it did any harm
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
if anything
it needed more cowbell
"At least I don't plaster on the makeup like a trollop, you c*nt."
-John McCain to his wife, in front of reporters
But he did
go right to Drudge Report to find out what he’s supposed to think about it. Then tomorrow he’ll listen to Rush and get some more things to parrot.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
you do realize
that not all conservatives do that…or were you just talking to longhorn?
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Oct 30, 2008 8:16 AM CDT up reply actions
ah ok
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Oct 30, 2008 9:22 AM CDT up reply actions
Nobody thinks that about all conservatives. However,
Everybody thinks that about Longhorn…
Those who would sacrifice liberty for safety deserve neither.
by Brian Thomas on Oct 30, 2008 2:57 PM CDT up reply actions
+1
No one brings less to the table.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
Amen.
Meaning of life? The aggregate collection of moments that you allow to enter into your consciousness, imo, fwiw, etc. (etc.)
by inactive lsb user on Oct 30, 2008 8:36 PM CDT up reply actions
So
from 300K, to 250, to 200, now to 150K and above…
and both voted to raise taxes for those earning 42K just last year.
Unbelievable….lazy people getting someone else’s hard earned money….yeah, that’s not ‘redistribution of wealth’ at all…
"He wants to double the capital gains tax, or almost double it," Huizenga said. "I'd rather give it to charity than to him."
i know
money trickles up damn it. we give our money to the wealthy. they screw it up then we BAIL THEM OUT.
it’s not like if the poor and middle class had more money, they’d spend it or anything. it’s not like that money would trickle up.
"At least I don't plaster on the makeup like a trollop, you c*nt."
-John McCain to his wife, in front of reporters
not 150K
Biden was just giving an example.
I don’t think it was ever at 300
250K for families; 200K for individuals. My republican friends manage to get this right (mainly because they acutally earn that much and maybe pay attention more). still, get it right.
and news flash: rich people get taxed higher in this country. there is no flat tax.
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
re:flat tax
it bugs me that so many people actually support a flat tax. that’s scary. i’m just so happy steve forbes and jackasses like him won’t be president. at least for another 4+years
"At least I don't plaster on the makeup like a trollop, you c*nt."
-John McCain to his wife, in front of reporters
i think i said in another thread
that I don’t know enough about the flat tax to choose sides and I think theoretically there is a possibility it would be fine.
but, to call a graduated tax system socialist and act like it’s never been done is just strange.
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
how would a flat tax work?
in order to bring in the same money after cutting taxes for the wealthy, you have to raise taxes on the poor and middle class.
while 10% of a guy that makes $2million a year is technically the same percent and a larger amount than 10% of a guy making $40,000 a year.
but 4,000 is worth more to that middle class guy than 200,000 is to the millionaire.
besides, poor and middle class people put more money BACK into the economy because the spend more of their income than the rich. and that money trickles up. it’s redistributing their wealth UPWARDS. that’s okay.
"At least I don't plaster on the makeup like a trollop, you c*nt."
-John McCain to his wife, in front of reporters
The dream
Is that a flat tax would lower all ships, but that is just a dream. It would lower taxes for the upper brackets and raise them for the lower ones.
Unfortunately, it’s simply wishful thinking to hope that a flat tax would be joined with spending cuts.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 10:01 PM CDT up reply actions
It depends
on if you cut all the deductions other than 1 per person. A flat tax at 25% on both interest and dividends with a 30000 per person deduction would likely increase the taxes on the very wealthy from what they are paying now. I think Buffett ends up paying around 17%,
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
That seems
To run against the point, doesn’t it?
by brettgardner on Oct 30, 2008 7:12 AM CDT up reply actions
depends on what you think the point is
A lot of the FlatTaxers believe the point is simplification of our insane tax system, and reallocation of all the current tax lawyers and accountants to something productive.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
Hmm.
Well perhaps that’s the more intellectual view. I’ve heard more of the populist one that everyone should be paying the same because it’s only “fair”.
I’m just not sure that it would significantly accomplish the goal you laid out.
by brettgardner on Oct 30, 2008 8:01 AM CDT up reply actions
Depends on your definition of "Fair"
We could charge every man, woman and child $8560. That would work for me. That also doesn’t take much paperwork. While we are at it, we can charge every man, woman and child, around 34,000 and we could clean up the debt.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
bah
i apologize for my snottiness because I actually got it wrong.
between 250 and 200 there is no change. under 200 gets a cut.
I guess they aren’t completely clear on this but apparently they have been consistent (just from what I’ve found on the internet)
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
btw
are you one of the lazy people or are you making over 200K?
I probably won’t make 200K for at least a few years but I wouldn’t’ fancy myself lazy
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
my point being
i don’t think many hardworking people would welcome someone else’s hard earned money, but, there are THOSE people who would absolutely love getting it…
i’m not one of them. i, like you, will work hard for what i want to do…
i just don’t get how ‘distribution of wealth’ helps anything…
also, a flat tax would be the absolute best system, imho.
"He wants to double the capital gains tax, or almost double it," Huizenga said. "I'd rather give it to charity than to him."
*'redistribution'
"He wants to double the capital gains tax, or almost double it," Huizenga said. "I'd rather give it to charity than to him."
yeah i understand your side's position
and i don’t have anything wrong with you buying into it, I just don’t agree with it.
I guess I have this problem of characterizing as the lazy person getting free money for doing nothing. Sure, there are some people like that but the main aim of the program is not to give them money and there are other reasons why someone would be out of work – not just that they are lazy
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
Hello
ALL taxes are wealth redistribution. What about McCain’s idea to buy up mortgages?
The only difference is a small matter of degree, not of substance. A flat tax would reward those who simply inherit money and live of it’s passive income streams. Now that’s lazy, not working people. It would also be regressive in the extreme. Do you really think that someone who makes $10,000 should give up, say, $1,000 of that while someone who makes 1 million should give up $100,000? The rich guy gave up 100 times as much money, but the poor man is the only one who will miss it.
You’re awesome in your ability to repeat talking points without really thinking. Go, dittohead.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
ALL taxes are wealth redistribution
Huh? Care to explain?
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
Seriously?
What do you think taxes are for?
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 9:37 PM CDT up reply actions
No shit...
this point of view absolutely baffles me.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
Well,
you collect money from people, and then spend it on government programs, many of which give money to things like welfare, investment credits for any number of things, farm subsidies…these are all wealth redistribution, right?
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
Not ALL taxes
are redistributed. Govt does actually buy goods, pay employees, provide services for its citizens, sponsor NASCAR drivers, etc, etc, etc.
http://www.cagw.org/site/PageServer?pagename=news_porkerofthemonth
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
semantics
fine, my main point was that McCain and Obama are both going to redistribute wealth. They’re just going to do it in slightly different ways.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
and to different groups...
rich people hate it when you fuck with their money.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
Poor people like it when you fuck with their money?
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Obviously not...
which would explain why McCain is about to lose this election.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
What did McCain do to fuck with poor people's money?
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Nothing yet...
but if elected he would keep the Bush tax cuts and the wealth will just trickle down…blah blah blah.
And the rich will just get richer and continue to create more $7 an hour jobs for their employees. That would be great also.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
See, but that's what I don't understand...
if the wealthy get wealthier, why does that bother anyone?
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Because...
they are doing it at the expense of the non-wealthy.
For every corporate CEO that walks away with millions how many of their workers lose their pension or retirement because the compnay folds or is bought out?
Come on Ben, you really don’t think they are just printing the money off and keeping it do you? It has to come from somewhere or someone.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
You really think...
that the wealthy are wealthy at the expense (and, I’m assuming, to the detriment) of the poor?
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
In many
cases I do, absolutely. Of course there are cases where that is not true, but I find it hard to believe that you would think otherwise as well.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
I do think otherwise.
My current state, with which I’m completely satisfied, is mostly as a result of actions of my own choosing. I certainly don’t have an axe to grind with people that make more money than I do.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
And I'm sure
You started off life in the gutter.
by brettgardner on Oct 30, 2008 12:07 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm sure...
you are where you are as a result of your actions. That’s not what I’m saying. I too am happy where I am, but I do feel for other that are less fortunate.
I do have a axe to gring with all these CEO’s walking away with millions however.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
Err...
why? What did they do to you?
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Again...
It’s not what they have done to me personally. It’s just ethics, or the lack thereof.
Come one Ben you are better than this.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
If you're not a shareholder...
of the company, or the CEO’s ex-wife, I don’t see how it makes any difference to you what he makes. It doesn’t affect your life.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Well it has...
it has effected the economy enough to trickle down…
Agree to disagree on the subject Ben.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
Grind your axe
against your Congressmen in Wash. Tell them to pass a shareholder bill of rights so they have some say so in executive compensation.
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
But you have to realize
that in times like this people resent those getting rich, especially when there is some evidence that banks and lenders knowingly pushed loans on people who couldn’t afford them. It’s guilt by association, resentment, and anger. It’s not right, but it’s part of why McCain is losing.
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It was government policy...
apparently, to push loans on people that couldn’t afford them. It’s been government policy for some time to promote home ownership, and, despite all evidence to the contrary, many people still see home-ownership as a “path to wealth,” when it’s hard to see how anything that you ultimately pay 3 times the purchase price for is a path to wealth.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Heh.
“Push loans on people that couldn’t afford them.”
I love this paternalistic line of thinking. Yeah, those poor fools had no choice but to accept whichever bullshit line came their way first.
by brettgardner on Oct 30, 2008 12:03 AM CDT up reply actions
Is it the borrowers
fault that they were approved for a mortgage that they could not afford?
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
Yes.
Of course it is. They were under no obligation to apply.
by brettgardner on Oct 30, 2008 12:10 AM CDT up reply actions
shouldnt have been approved in the first place
+1 on that
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Oct 30, 2008 8:25 AM CDT up reply actions
Baloney
Blame it on the government. The lack of regulation did play a part, and people associate small government with the GOP because of the party’s continuous lip service of it. But individual and corporate greed is even more culpable.
It doesn’t help when we’ve been reading about gigantic golden parachutes for a few years for CEOs that were in some cases indicted. That kind of vulgarity in compensation draws a lot of resentment.
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I honestly...
can’t relate to that way of thinking.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
I don't resent
rich people getting richer personally, but try to put yourself in the position of someone who was just laid off, even though they’ve worked hard and done a good job. They see their own CEO get millions of dollars in severance, or even gets to keep his job and gets a bonus when hundreds have been laid off. How could that kind of thing NOT generate resentment.
People in great economic distress are not prone to see the larger picture philosophically. They’re desparate, scared and angry. You’re expecting them to think locigally at a time like that? And there are thousands who still have their jobs but know they could lose them soon. I could lose my job if things get bad enough. I don’t resent others for it, but then I’m a lot more philosophical about such things than most.
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Did you or slc ranger...
get fired from a company and have a similar experience to what you’re describing?
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Not I...
but I do work for Citi so perhaps it’s in my future.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
Well...
I’m asking why people hate rich people so much. The answer I was given is because they’ve been laid off and the CEO gets a golden parachute or gets to keep his job. That’s not an answer.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
So because...
it hasn’t happened to me means that it hasn’t happened at all?
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
I'm asking...
why you hate rich people, or why you would care how much they make.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
I've already...
given you my answer, because I feel like it’s at the expense of the less fortunate at times.
I don’t hate all rich people obviously. Only when it comes at the expense of others. I gave you the CEO example because that is one that I feel is completely unethical.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
I have never lost my job
but I have known many who have. Is it really hard to imagine what I just described? Most people do not spend much time thinking about public policy or economics. They only know they had a job, now they don’t, but their CEO got a bonus. That’s offensive to many folks.
I understand why that CEO might get a bonus in some circumstances, or a golden parachute, but how many people do think really read about how CEO compensation is figured?
I might lose my job because I work for a church. If people don’t have money, the church doesn’t have money. Many churches have already laid off staff. I am not in any imminent danger, but I have friends on staff who are. Luckily, more than half of my income is from students, and even if some of them drop lessons I have a long waiting list.
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The lack of regulation is the biggest problem
Nobody on Wall Street knew how volatile these securities were. If they were more transparent, the problem would’ve been caught a lot sooner. But people were making money off it and the government was three or four steps behind.
by Black Francis on Oct 30, 2008 12:18 AM CDT up reply actions
I don't think...
more regulation is the answer here. And even that doesn’t explain why people here hate rich people so much.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Regulation
Smart regulation is part of the answer. I think people should know what they’re investing in. Aren’t you a stock broker? Looks like you’d understand that.
I’m not going to get into hating rich people. I don’t hate them…I don’t even have anything against lobbyists. Hey, if you can make a buck go for it.
by Black Francis on Oct 30, 2008 12:24 AM CDT up reply actions
I don't think regulation...
is the answer because that’s the fundamental nature of risk pricing. People were making nice returns on these securities. But high returns carry greater risk. These people just learned a lesson about risk pricing that they’ll never forget. Don’t think regulation is going to help any.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
I don't think I'm confusing anything here...
The language being used here seems to me to indicate a deep dislike of the wealthy. That’s why I’m asking about it.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
I didn't mean you
necessarily, or you only. I think the defense of the candidate causes some of this angst. I’m merely arguing a point and giving examples.
I do have a different story from someone in my church, though. After a company vote, this manager and his cohorts took by far the largest pay cuts by percentage, gave the lower paid employees much smaller paycuts and everyone kept their job. Those employees are loyal and happy now. That’s leadership to me. The management owned up to the decisions that had gotten the company in trouble, gave the employees a choice between layoffs or pay cuts and took the hardest hit.
Another company makes bad lending decisions, then lays off the bottom of the food chain; people who did not set the policies and standards that caused the problem, then management gives themselves raises. Do you not see why this stuff causes resentment?
You’ve been advocating smart decision making and paying for your mistakes. In many cases management makes their employees pay for their mistakes. How can you not see that this could cause resentment?
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But we're still talking in the hypothetical here.
I’m asking why you, t-ball, would care if the wealthy got wealthier, if you, basically, had a decent life with most of the things you’ve wanted in life.
Maybe I have low expectations… I’ve got most of the things I’ve ever wanted. So why should I care if Paris Hilton has more?
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
As I tried to say above
I don’t personally care if the wealthy get wealthier. I too am happy with the things I have. I’m just trying to give examples of why I understand why others might feel that way.
And I think that in good times most people are fine with others getting rich. But you’re discounting psychology and fear way too much. Most people do not make economic decisions rationally and most people certainly do not think rationally when they are filled with fear. This is why we have witch burnings in our past. This is why the religious right is afraid a gay person might touch them or, God forbid, try to go to their church. Fear.
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Anytime
You take from one and give to another, that’s redistribution. All taxes do that. Be it direct or indirect, that’s the entire point of taxation.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 11:39 PM CDT up reply actions
Point of Taxation
Collect revenue to run the government’s activities. Not all of it those activities are redistributive, though much of it seems to be. But a lot is spent on public goods like defense, transportation, education, and shit like that.
by Black Francis on Oct 29, 2008 11:57 PM CDT up reply actions
Those are
Redistributive. Collective goods are still redistributive.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 11:59 PM CDT up reply actions
Are you pulling
your definition of redistribution from some college economics class? If you are, it is going right over this unedgumakated schmoes head.
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
No.
It’s really just an elementary fact. If the government takes money from me in order to run itself (to put what government does in the broadest possible sense), then that’s per se redistribution because government has no other purpose than to provide public services (i.e. other people), whether you want to classify those as domestic or foreign, social or military. Doesn’t matter. It’s all redistribution.
by brettgardner on Oct 30, 2008 12:06 AM CDT up reply actions
I'll ask my
son to explain it to me. He is in elementary school. :)
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
I don't think they are
Public Education benefits the rich because they then have an educated workforce, for example. The Interstate Highway system allows their employees to get to work and back and provides a network to deliver goods and services. These things benefit everyone.
by Black Francis on Oct 30, 2008 12:05 AM CDT up reply actions
Right...
Like I said, collective goods are redistribution. Just because taking my taxes benefits everyone (including me) doesn’t make it any less redistributive.
by brettgardner on Oct 30, 2008 12:08 AM CDT up reply actions
semantics, I think
Redistribution to me implies that you’re taxing one group to fund a program than benefits another disproportionally.
by Black Francis on Oct 30, 2008 12:15 AM CDT up reply actions
Well
That’s just not an accurate definition, in my opinion.
by brettgardner on Oct 30, 2008 12:16 AM CDT up reply actions
I'll go with this definition
Income Redistribution
Economics. the theory, policy, or practice of lessening or reducing inequalities in income through such measures as progressive income taxation and antipoverty programs.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/redistribution?r=14
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
Fair enough
And I’ll go with this one from your same link:
Any process, such as inflation or taxation or the provision of social services, that reallocates household income.
by brettgardner on Oct 30, 2008 1:01 AM CDT up reply actions
Wow...
sponsor NASCAR drivers. Really?
as far as everything else you point out, those too are forms or redistribution.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
couple of points
1. I believe Obama’s plan gives tax cuts and rebates to people that actually work. I wouldn’t classify them as lazy.
2. I would venture to say that the middleclass will still be paying taxes. A tax cut just means that they get to keep more of their hard earned money. I don’t think any money will be going from the wealthy to the middleclass.
3. It is only redistribution when someone gets back more from the govt. then they paid in taxes.
I do share your concerns about Obama’s definition of wealthy creeping down into the middleclass. We will see what happens when he gets into office and realizes the number wealthy have shrunk due to the financial crisis.
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
on point 3
I guess it’s possible that some will get back more than they pay in if they are low income but benefit from some of the education credits, foreclosure relief, etc. that he’s proposing.
But what the Republicans won’t admit is that deficit spending and bailouts are exactly what you need to do in the sort of situation the economy is in right now. Most economists are suggesting huge investments in infrastructure, some kind of mortgage relief, investment credits, etc. to get out of this mess. You worry about the deficit later.
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Instead of give a family
a $1000 in March, how about using all of this “redistributed” money for job training programs, underperforming schools, preschool education, etc. Programs that will provide a longterm benefit.
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
but ... but ... but ...
that wouldnt be popular! lol
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Oct 30, 2008 8:27 AM CDT up reply actions
Tom DeLay on Hardball
…calling Obama a Marxist, anti-American, and so forth. And admits his party is in disarray, saying he’s told members to “get over it”.
Right...
because anything this guy says after ’05 has about as much cred as a steal home post does here.
I believe “get over it” is what he said or thought to himself after he was indicted.
He should just shut up and disappear.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
The reason his party is in disarray
is because his dumb ass was more interested in “redistributing wealth” to Republican congressman than he was in governing. He was given a blank check to govern the country, and he spent it on kickbacks.
After Delay, it was clear the choices were redistribute wealth to the poorer Americans, or Redistribute wealth to kickbacks and corruption. He certainly did nothing to make government smaller.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
Just watched the Obama video
I thought it was well done, and clever to have the story vignettes based in battleground states like MO, OH, and NM. Before I watched the video I thought the idea of it was overkill. But this was like a concise platform speech, and very well done. Anyone watching can’t say they don’t know who he is or what he’ll try to do. Very slick.
I don’t like every idea, but I’ve got to hand it to the Obama campaign people. They have pwned McCain’s handlers.
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I agree.
Obama’s going for 2-point conversion when he’s up by 50 in the 4th quarter. A completely Obama-driven day with the video, Daily Show (which showed me that he was also on some shit show with Mario Lopez), and the Florida rally with Clinton.
He’s not coasting. McCain, by contrast, has disappeared since Sunday, and it’s been all about Palin.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 11:46 PM CDT up reply actions
You have to...
run up the score to make it to the BCS.
Well at least around here you do.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
McCain Campaign
I don’t think I’ve ever seen such a mess. It’s totally unfocused. Undisciplined. So unrepublican-like. They have a hundred different attacks and have skipped around from day to day.
Sigh...
http://www.columbusdispatch.com/live/content/local_news/stories/2008/10/29/joe30.html?sid=101
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Hard to
Feel sorry for a guy who never saw a camera he didn’t love, or a wacky unsuportable position he wouldn’t spout to anyone in range.
by brettgardner on Oct 29, 2008 11:57 PM CDT up reply actions
Yep...
Joe the fraud.
Laughed my ass off at the Obama line tonight in Florida with Clinton when he said “99.99% of plumbers make 250K a year or less”.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
But it's okay...
for state employees to try to dig up dirt on him?
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
He has...
put himself in the public eye now by going on these campaigns and trying to suck every penny out of this thing that he can. If he didn’t want dirt dug up on him he should have stayed at home.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
Wow.
And I guess you think Palin was in the wrong in Troopergate?
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
But you don't see any parallels...
in the two situations?
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
You're right
Palin was wrong AND the guy digging on Joe is wrong. Joe is a major tool and a media whore, but it’s still weak to purposely dig up dirt on him.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
But
If he is campaigning for McCain isn’t he putting himself in the limelight? Granted, when this was going on he hadn’t really started campaigning.
I am the motherfucking shore patrol, motherfucker! I am the motherfucking shore patrol! Give this man a beer.
Borderline
The guy is saying things stupid enough that I don’t think the digging is warranted. Just destroy his statements.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
See his comments
About Obama and Israel?
I am the motherfucking shore patrol, motherfucker! I am the motherfucking shore patrol! Give this man a beer.
So...
it’s okay to use state resources to dig for dirt on someone if they participate in a campaign?
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
I assume
that the state uses resources to check to see if lottery winners owe the state anything. I can imagine they want to know if a guy with a quarter million burning a hole in his pocket owes the state anything.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
That's naive.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Not trying to say that.
But I’m also not surprised. I should have been more clear. This type of thing should be expected. You know there’s someone in that office with strong political leanings. I think you’d see that same action if his affiliation were reversed.
I am the motherfucking shore patrol, motherfucker! I am the motherfucking shore patrol! Give this man a beer.
You think...
this woman would have been poking around if he was an Obama supporter?
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Yes I do...
I will concede the point to you on that one.
i’m just sick and tired of this jerk-off.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
Even a journeyman
plumber wouldn’t make that much I don’t think, unless he’s running a company. This guy’s not even certified.
by Black Francis on Oct 30, 2008 12:12 AM CDT up reply actions
He said...
that whe wanted to buy the company.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Yeah
…but he wasn’t even a licensed plumber, much less a journeyman, so how in the hell could he possibly afford to buy a company?
by Black Francis on Oct 30, 2008 12:21 AM CDT up reply actions
What difference does that make?
Maybe he has a money tree in his backyard. So what?
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
So he's a political prop
He’s some dude who has dreams about buying the company he works for, and is somehow thrust into the political universe. None of his story makes any sense…he’s just a prop. Sick of hearing about him. In every debate both candidates would mention [name] the [occupation] in [location]. Why this guy has so much traction I’ll never know, but I’m sick of it.
by Black Francis on Oct 30, 2008 12:30 AM CDT up reply actions
Why it has traction...
because it’s fundamentally an optimistic story as opposed to a sad sack can’t afford medicine story.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
I hate the
Poor [typical American name maybe of Eastern European descent] from [convenient swing state] who is worried about what my opponent will do to their job in the [typical 20th century industry that we should let fail]
by JBImaknee on Oct 30, 2008 11:26 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I wouldn't say he was trying...
he did. The reason that he’s been a fixture in the campaign since then is that it’s a message that does resonate with a significant segment of the population. Not you, obviously.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
My beef with him
is he tried to pretend that he was undecided, but it seems plain that he was a McCain supporter from the get go. I think he did a good job getting Obama to paint himself into a bit of a corner, kudos to him for that. But then he tried to say he was sick of all the media attention, and the next day says he might run for congress. If all he ever did was that moment with Obama he looks smart, sincere, and his point is stronger. The more he talks the more he looks like a tool, the weaker his point becomes to any who are not already McCain supporters.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
I don't know.
I think he’s probably a regular guy. He zinged Obama. He gets a lot of attention. I’m sure he probably has a lot of conflicting emotions about it, as anyone would.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Probably true
and if I were him I might be thinking “how can I cash in on this?”
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
he absolutely did not zing obama
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
it doesn't resonate with anybody important
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
I know...
just thought it was a funny line.
McCain has been beating us over the head with this “Joe the Plumber” shit. It was nice to see Obama strike back.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
I've never been so sick of anything in my life
Joe the fucking plumber.
by Black Francis on Oct 30, 2008 12:11 AM CDT up reply actions
Seriously
I feel like puking over and over again like the dude from Team America whenever I hear that.
Meaning of life? The aggregate collection of moments that you allow to enter into your consciousness, imo, fwiw, etc. (etc.)
by inactive lsb user on Oct 30, 2008 1:43 AM CDT up reply actions
Olberman on Joe
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cXqB-1H7fv0&feature=related
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
Good to see
the one day old Politics thread has more posts than the 3 day old politics thread :)
It’ll be good when we have some Rangers news to talk about.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
Normally LSB dies during the playoffs
politics has kept us all tuned in through the most boring month for a Rangers fan. I even read Adam’s daily post this AM.
interesting note
I spoke to my dad this morning and he went last weekend to Richardson to help out his friend Rep Tony Goolsby at the polls. He said that he and my mom were the only ones there supporting a republican candidate. Obama had 30 volunteers out there. So , who ever above made the comment about Obama having enthusiastic volunteers and well organized ground force is completely correct. I’m seeing the same thing in Austin at the grocery store by the house. most interesting:
So the Obama volunteers, when voters approached the location would say “Are you familiar with the new voting machine?” then proceed to explain how to vote a straight democratic ticket.
I just returned from Nevada.
It was interesting being in a battleground state. They are blasted with political ads 24/7. For what it is worth, it sounded like the residents of Vegas were pro-Obama while the visitors were pro-McCain.
I'm in San Diego
and all the college students here are basically planning a huge Vegas trip on election day to GOTV for Obama.
I’m still not convinced that some hippie student from California is going to get a gruffy old Nevadan to go out and vote for Obama, but I guess it can’t hurt too much.
October Surprise...
Well, there goes Obama’s chances at being the first black president…
http://www.weeklyworldnews.com/election-08/october-surprise-alien-endorses-mccain/
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
McCain kind of looks like an alien
the only reason I know he isn’t is that Aliens would probably have to be pretty good pilots, and McCain spend most of his naval career crashing perfectly good planes.
I think you buried the lede though, http://www.weeklyworldnews.com/celebs/sarah-palin-heals-child/
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
Now that's funny
Well done…
Those who would sacrifice liberty for safety deserve neither.
by Brian Thomas on Oct 30, 2008 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions
This is my favorite part
What impact this news will have on the election has yet to be determined. Swing state voters, who will decide this election, have the highest rate of alien abductions and UFO sightings and are known to vote in accordance with supernatural forces.
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