Perrotto says Teagarden is the keeper
by Adam J. Morris on Nov 2, 2008 2:06 PM CST
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PrintOver at BP, John Perrotto has notes on each team's offseason plans/issues, and has this on the Rangers:
They would be willing to deal anyone from their catching surplus except Taylor Teagarden, meaning that Gerald Laird, Jarrod Saltalamacchia, and Max Ramirez are all available.
I've speculated before that Teagarden is the guy the Rangers would most like to hang onto, but this is the first time I've seen it stated so definitively.
My guess at this point is that Laird ends up dealt for an arm, Max Ramirez starts next season in AAA, and Taylor Teagarden gets the bulk of the catching playing time next year, with Salty backing him up and also playing some DH and maybe some first base while the Rangers see if his bat comes back to life and if Teagarden can stay healthy for a full season.
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I hope
the Yanks get into serious talks for Salty. If Yankees get involved, I really think we can package Salty and others (not major pieces) for buchholz. This is also us telling teams that Teagarden is untouchable.
Package deal with Laird for Bailey and package deal with Salty for Buchholz. That’s what I want to see.
That's exactly what I envision
in some form or another.
Meaning of life? The aggregate collection of moments that you allow to enter into your consciousness, imo, fwiw, etc. (etc.)
by inactive lsb user on Nov 2, 2008 2:40 PM CST up reply actions
Yankees
I wonder how serious talks with the Yankees would get? Cashman seems to be intent on not parting with high level prospects (Hughes and the other pitchers). Moreover, the Yankees need pitching. I don’t know if talks with the Yankees would include their high level pitching prospects.
That is not to say that a compelling case for a Buchholz – Salty trade cannot be made without the Yankees getting involved.
by Excel Hearts Choi on Nov 2, 2008 2:42 PM CST up reply actions
My hope
is that both Laird and Salty are traded. I think the rangers would be in good shape going forward with Tea as catcher, MaxRam as DH/2nd Catcher, and having a utility guy who can catch in an emergency as your 25th man.
I have trouble seeing a long-term benefit to keeping Salty. My preference is always to keep the guys who have potential to be one of the best at their position in one aspect of the game – whether it is fielding (Tea) or hitting (MaxRam). I think Salty can be good at everything, but not great at anything.
I imagine the Rangers' preference...
…would be to do that, but you have to find someone who is going to give you value for the two guys you mention.
If the best you can get for Salty is Scott Olsen, for example, you don’t move him just to move him.
by Adam J. Morris on Nov 2, 2008 2:42 PM CST up reply actions
I agree
but I think JD may be able to be creative with trades. I don’t see why you have to get a young major league ready starter for each of them. Given the depth of pitching talent in the organization now, I’m content trading one of them for position players (minor league outfielders, third basemen..) who may be a little farther away.
Sticking with a Salty to the Marlins idea, just completely throwing this out there, but could a package be built around a Salty for Matt Dominguez centerpiece?
Dominguez
I don’t think the Marlins will deal Dominguez unless it’s part of a package for a more well-known player. He’s their third baseman of the future, and they don’t even have anyone ahead of him in that spot (Dallas McPherson is their starter). You don’t trade the #5 prospect in the Sally League at age 18 for an unproven guy like Salty.
If the Rangers deal...
both Laird and Salty I think they would be better served to find a veteran backup for TT and let MaxRam catch everyday in AAA.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
Why?
He doesn’t bring much more than someone who would actually come cheap.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
Maybe Pudge could be a mentor to the young catchers...
I would rather have a World Series winning hall of famer helping out my young catchers than some spare veteran catcher even if Pudge cost a little more.
Pudge may suck now, but he is still a name ’round these parts.
i like baseball too
If Pudge is on the roster
he’d only have one young catcher – at most – to mentor. I don’t think that you’d find enough games for two of the young guys and Pudge.
by Brett Perryman on Nov 3, 2008 11:31 AM CST up reply actions
I don't see anything wrong with mentoring one guy.
A mentor usually only mentors one QB or point guard, so mentoring one catcher that might catch for you for the next 10 yrs is OK with me.
……if Pudge is the mentoring type……which he probably isn’t. sigh.
i like baseball too
Why is there a belief...
…that Pudge would be a particularly good mentor to young catchers?
by Adam J. Morris on Nov 3, 2008 11:33 AM CST up reply actions
I think
people just want an excuse to bring him back as a feel good sort of ending to his career. Of course when Pudge was first called up he said that he wanted to play for 20 or 22 years. That means that you’d have to keep him around for either two or four more years, not sure they’ve thought it through.
by Brett Perryman on Nov 3, 2008 11:37 AM CST up reply actions
i started my post with "maybe"
….as in he might be a mentor type. And that maybe would definitely depend on the thinking that he has come to the realization that he is at the end of his career…..and not a starter for another 2-4 yrs like Z mentions below.
Every player wants to play 20-22 yrs when they are starting out……..until reality kicks in years later and they begin to suck and know it.
i like baseball too
Yeah that was a joke
It’s always cracked me up that he chose 20 and 22 as his options, not consecutive numbers.
by Brett Perryman on Nov 3, 2008 11:47 AM CST up reply actions
I dunno if he would be or not.
But I think we need a veteran backup this season and it would tickle my nostalgia bone if we brought in Pudge to be that guy. I’m still bummed we let him go. He’s the kind of guy I would’ve been more than happy to overpay for if it meant keeping him in our uniform forever.
That being said… I really doubt he’d be willing to accept ~40 games a year as a backup to a guy like Tea or Salty at this point.
He likely wants to start.
And why shouldn’t he? Even with his decline he’s still right about league average and he’s got mystique, which apparently counts double for catchers cause people are talking about Jason Varitek being employed as a catcher next season.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Rule 5? No…talk to the hand.
Ugh
Varitek does not deserve employment.
Meaning of life? The aggregate collection of moments that you allow to enter into your consciousness, imo, fwiw, etc. (etc.)
by inactive lsb user on Nov 3, 2008 5:17 PM CST up reply actions
Concur...
but he has a C on his jersey!
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
I don't think it's all about being better next year, either.
I personally would be willing to stomach some set backs just to see Pudge as a Ranger again, especially in a year when I don’t expect to compete.
My prediction...
Laird and Salty are dealt, and Max goes to AAA. Teagarden is the starter and we sign a journeyman backup to play a couple times a week. I don’t see the use of keeping salty around to backup and/or DH a couple days a week. Even if his bat comes to life a bit, I don’t see that that will increase his trade value any. We’d might as well make a decision and stick with one of the youngsters and get pitching for the others. I’m sick of platooning our young catchers and limiting their development as a result. We’re rebuilding, so let’s pick one and let him be the starter.
That's the whole reason his value wouldn't increase
is a lack of consistent playing time.
Do you not remember all the discussion with his father, 525dp, about how Salty gets better with every-day playing time?
Those samples last year were so small and negligible that it is extremely unfair to make a preconceived judgment, imo.
Meaning of life? The aggregate collection of moments that you allow to enter into your consciousness, imo, fwiw, etc. (etc.)
by inactive lsb user on Nov 2, 2008 2:42 PM CST up reply actions
whats the point...
of splitting time btwn 2 catchers another year. This team needs pitching, and they have a surplus of catchers. One of the 4 need to be playing full time while we’re rebuilding. There is no reason to split time btwn salty and tea if the team believes tea is the future.
I agree
I’ve said as much that I think both need to be playing every day, in the interest of maximizing value.
But as Adam has suggested, perhaps they could find enough AB’s for Salty to shit or get off the pot. I wouldn’t mind having a V-Mart and Kelly Shoppach like tandem if that’s the way it shakes out.
Ramirez in AAA to see if he is a catcher or not. If not, he can DH. If he can catch, he or Salty gets moved.
Meaning of life? The aggregate collection of moments that you allow to enter into your consciousness, imo, fwiw, etc. (etc.)
by inactive lsb user on Nov 2, 2008 2:48 PM CST up reply actions
The only reason....
I could justify keeping salty around would be if we were intent on trading Blalock, because he needs to be the everyday DH if his option is picked up and we intend to keep him. This is also assuming Bradley is not brought back. If neither Bradley or Blalock are kept, then I could see Salty used as the primary DH and backup catcher twice a week when Tea gets the day off. Other than that, I see no reason to not deal him for pitching. And even with the DH scenario, I don’t particularly think that situation is maximizing his skills set by any means. And if the organization doesn’t think Tea can be an everyday catcher and stay healthy, then he needs to be dealt while his value is at its highest and that way salty and catch every day.
his father was on here
why’d he leave?
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Nov 3, 2008 11:33 PM CST up reply actions
He got a little too touchy
when people were discussing Salty. If you can’t take people discussing your kid playing baseball, stay away from blogs.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
Just throwing this out there...
Of course, I have no idea what he’ll get on the open market, but would anyone be opposed, especially if we deal at least two catchers, to bringing back I-Rod to mentor our younger catchers/occasionally DH/sell some tickets from the fans who are nostalgic over the 90s teams?
Pudge
I would love to bring Pudge back but I don’t think he thinks he is a backup catcher. I imagine he wants to go somewhere to be the #1 guy. Just off the top of my head I think Houston and SF would be close to the top of his list. Both teams just drafted catchers in the first round so they don’t need a long term guy. I know SF has Molina but Pudge would be an upgrade over him.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
You take Molina over Pudge any day of the week, and I don't think it's much of a contest
Molina’s three years younger and did rebound from his 2007 decline this year (back up to a 98 OPS+), whereas Pudge didn’t (87 OPS+).
"[Tim McCarver and Joe Buck] are the Gabe Gross and Ben Broussard of the broadcasting booth." - dirkatron
by LSJ on Nov 3, 2008 8:35 AM CST up reply actions
Pudge Rodriguez
is a waste of a roster spot at this point of his career. Ever since he lost that 25 pounds in an offseason, he has been underwhelming.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
He's not even close to a waste of a roster spot.
I could make the full argument, but I’ll point to Beyond the Boxscore. The 14th best catcher in the majors is not a waste of a roster spot. In my own rankings he was 10th, but that’s all about the same level of production.
Now, whether that’s worth the money is a different argument. I would only want him in Texas if he was actually signing cheap and willing to be, at best, a platoon partner for a young’n (not likely). But Pudge is still a solid to good catcher who can help at least half the teams in Major League Baseball. He’s not, at all, a waste of a roster spot.
He's below
Benji Molina, and slightly ahead of Yadier Molina and Rod Barajas by your link.
I do agree that it’s not too likely that he will sign for cheap and be a platoon partner though.
Someone is going to overpay for him for the name, I’d rather it not be the Rangers.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
yadier isnt for sure
(probably) best defensive C in the game IIRC accoring to multiple sources (fielding bible, etc0
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
"That wasn’t rain, that was a band of angels pissing on your awful city. Shut the hell up and play." - robert_d_wilfong
by knockoutking on Nov 3, 2008 11:34 PM CST up reply actions
There's a guy on GameFAQs who I've ended up blocking.
Rangers fan. He’s probably PISSED about this. He hates Teagarden and considers him the worst catcher in the organization.
Was it me? >_>
I don’t think that, but I don’t recall any Ranger fan saying that and I know you hate me. =( -Deja Blue 03
Why on Earth would we waste another year of devo time on Salty playing him twice or three times a week?
Deal two of the four catchers. Whichever two get you the best return in terms of their respective value. Then you start one of ’em in the bigs full time and one of ’em in OKC full time and sign a veteran backup to catch once or twice a week up in the bigs. Bing, bang, boom.
No more wasting good prospects as backups and certainly no more jerking Salty around the lineup. He’s not a first baseman. He’s a catcher. Either play him behind the dish full time here or in OKC or trade him.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Couldn't put it better.
Taking a catcher and DHing him, playing him at 1B or sitting him is like making him into a non-catcher.
Players like Saltalamacchia (or, as another example, Laird) have value because of their position, not because of anything else.
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on Nov 2, 2008 6:38 PM CST up reply actions
You make it sound so easy...
Hopefully we can trade two catchers and get good deals. I think everyone here would agree that trading two catchers for two young starters would be ideal. That said, if those opportunities aren’t available (despite the October trade rumors…), the backup plan would be to trade only one catcher and make the best of the situation. I’m not very optimistic that we’ll be able to trade two, in which case I agree with Adam’s prediction.
We'll probably
trade all four of them and have to go with Einar Diaz again next year.
"We live, we die, and the wheels on the bus go round and round." - Tony Romo
If you get a stud pitcher
for most of them I don’t care if the put Kevin Brown behind the dish.
A bunch of midgets with no arms could pitch better than us. -iorange555
Three
I’m really in favor of dealing Laird and keeping the other three. Ramirez can catch full-time at OKC, and Teagarden can catch full-time in Texas. Salty will never have the defensive chops to be a legitimate option as a full-time starter in the bigs, so I’d want him to catch a couple days a week, and be a DH option the rest of the week. He could easily get 400 PAs with the frailty of catchers and other injuries. Keeping him as an option for C/1B/DH is a smart move if we want his bat to develop (which is his only decent skill).
No
He’s going to be 30 in January and arbitration-eligible. Not exactly on par with the others we’ve discussed.
helllllllll no
And I’m not the biggest Salty supporter.
I am the motherfucking shore patrol, motherfucker! I am the motherfucking shore patrol! Give this man a beer.
Heyman at SI
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/jon_heyman/11/02/heyman.free.agent.rundown/index.html
5. Francisco Rodriguez, closer. Record-setting reliever lost a few mph but still figures out how to get batters out. My call: Rangers, five years, $75 million.
Umm…I’m thinking that he just mailed that one in without thinking about it.
I'm undefeated in fights. Have I been in any? No. Thats because people know my f'ing status. Don't mess with the elite. - Miles
Hmm ... Rangers need pitching
2+2 = 4 !!
Meaning of life? The aggregate collection of moments that you allow to enter into your consciousness, imo, fwiw, etc. (etc.)
by inactive lsb user on Nov 2, 2008 9:17 PM CST up reply actions
Yeah but 15 mil for 5 years is just to much,
maybe a five year 67.5 mil. I know he is in a slight decline, but he would definitely fill a major need and role on this team.
Is there other options for bullpen help? Yes. But I’m sure JD could get creative with a K-Rod signing.
The bloggerformelyknownasBigBaddBubbaJ
$10M+ per year
for a closer doesn’t do this team much good.
I'm undefeated in fights. Have I been in any? No. Thats because people know my f'ing status. Don't mess with the elite. - Miles
not just a closer
but a closer who’s delivery is pretty violent looking, i expect his arm to explode at any moment
"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it." - Mitch Hedberg
we've all been expecting that for 6 years
it annoys me that its now going to happen on a team other than the Angels.
He also states the obvious
in that no team can match the Rangers catching talent.
He’s earning his pay with this article.
I'm undefeated in fights. Have I been in any? No. Thats because people know my f'ing status. Don't mess with the elite. - Miles
If they bring that annoying idiot here...
I’ll turn every single game off after the 8th inning… Screaming and jumping and pointing… Ugh…
My one fear
JD has been outspoken about improving the bullpen.
That contract is insanity from any team in the league, though. Is he definitely not re-signing? I seem to remember some umbrage-taking new with him and Anaheim, he was burnt out on the place or monkey, something.
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on Nov 2, 2008 10:02 PM CST up reply actions
God I hope
we will be better at figuring out which catcher to keep vs. which SP to keep.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
Thank you LA!
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
Do you?
mlbtr comment:
Mets:
Gerald Laird (Veteran catcher who resembles a combo of Schneider and Castro by himself)
Rangers:
Aaron Heilman (Solid Bullpen arm… Reclamation Starter)
Go Strangers.
heh
I told you muthafuckas that Teagarden was awesome right after they drafted him. But, no, his swing was too long and a bunch of other bullshit.
Someday you will all realize my baseball genius!!!
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