Sunday morning things
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 9:33 AM CST
315 comments
Not much out there today on the Rangers front. The big story in the D/FW sports world is that Terrell Owens is being a jackass, but then, that's not really news...
Phil Rogers says that Nolan Ryan is eliminating pitch counts at the higher levels of the minors, something that I believe is probably not entirely accurate. He also says that he wants Ron Washington to make fewer pitching changes and let his relievers face more batters, something that I think makes sense. I've said before, one of the problems that you run into when you change relievers every few batters is that every time you take out a pitcher going well, you increase the possibility of bringing in a pitcher who doesn't have it that particular day.
Jeff Wilson offers the winners and losers from the winter meetings, and says that the Rangers are in wait and see mode.
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BoSox
Boston Red Sox
They discovered they aren’t the only ones in the deep end of the free-agent pool. Even the Washington Nationals have a chance at Mark Teixeira, and the rival Yankees added CC Sabathia and A.J. Burnett and could get Derek Lowe, too.
I find it hard to believe that the Red Sox are in the “loser” category because they have yet to sign Teixeira. It is not as if Teixeira is the key to them making the playoffs or winning a WS. What they need is a healthy Ortiz, something you cannot trade for or buy.
by Excel Hearts Choi on Dec 14, 2008 9:47 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
+1
imo they’re the best team in the AL
In reference to how good the Steelers have been in their history: "No one is even close to them."- Steal Home
by hinduplaya on Dec 14, 2008 9:51 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
at least ortiz actually had a down year this year
it amazed me when some people were saying he had a down year in 2007 because he only hit 35 homeruns.. yeah with a 1.066 ops.
the preceding post was a great success.
by DSheppard on Dec 14, 2008 10:32 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I read that NYY are not in on Lowe
with all the money they have comitted (mlbtraderumors). I bet Boston signs him.
by Goyogringo on Dec 14, 2008 10:33 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
hope the rangers don't wait too long
and Sheets signs elsewhere
Wait 'til the year after next
by NothinG on Dec 14, 2008 10:07 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
I just can't imagine Sheets signing with Texas
After Lowe signs, I think someone will give him more years and money than TExas
by Goyogringo on Dec 14, 2008 10:32 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
If it happens...
It will be soon, the longer he’s on the market, the less chance Texas gets him IMO.
Don't believe the hype about sloppy seconds. They ain't bad.
by tricer on Dec 14, 2008 10:46 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yah, that's my thought too
When a top tier pitcher like Sheets shows legitimate interest in coming here, it’s not just a newsflash it’s almost a windfall. And you shouldn’t fuck around with windfalls.
"I´d like to apologize in advance for anything that I may say or do that could be construed as offensive as I slowly go NUTS."
by lonestarJon on Dec 14, 2008 10:48 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
heh
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 10:52 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Haha
New sig, anyone?
LMAO, for some reason…
you shouldn’t fuck around with windfalls(you see that, Chase?)
"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
by Rodney on Dec 14, 2008 12:52 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
see what?
"You shouldn't fuck around with windfalls"
LoneStarJon
by LAMuscleFag on Dec 14, 2008 1:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
reference
http://www.lonestarball.com/2008/12/13/691483/sickels-ranger-top-20-comi#10688599
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 1:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
hahahaha
that’s FUNNY… leave it to Chase and Rodney to be in the middle of all the cleverness.
"You shouldn't fuck around with windfalls"
LoneStarJon
by LAMuscleFag on Dec 14, 2008 1:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Different font.
LSB 2.0 majics.
"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
by Rodney on Dec 14, 2008 1:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I just realized that it is possible
he was making a joke above both our heads.
Evidently, he found a new sig =)
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 1:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Hmm, good idea.
But LAMF grabbed it 1st.
"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
by Rodney on Dec 14, 2008 1:33 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
OT: Sean Avery
looks like he and the stars are parting ways and another team can pickup the stars sloppy seconds.
"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it." - Mitch Hedberg
by rentz on Dec 14, 2008 10:29 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
Zing!!
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 10:52 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Avery
Nice move, Hull…
"I dont care to debate with a troll." - Sharky
by RCCook on Dec 14, 2008 11:39 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I liked it at the time
in hindsight, it backfired. But at what cost? This team has tanked and lost its captain for the year.
I thought it was a worthwhile gamble at the time.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 12:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It's going to be his legacy.
And it might cost him his job.
"Please. What the hell do you know about starting a sports-related website and then deciding to leave it to work on other things and then? How dare you, sir." -- Michael Schur, aka FireJoeMorgan's Ken Tremendous, to Will Leitch
by ghtd36 on Dec 14, 2008 12:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Amazing development.
Hicks haters have to sympathize with a story like that, just as far as player contract risk goes…
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on Dec 14, 2008 11:50 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
contract risks
yeah he’ll shell out for a player like avery but wont spend money on a pitcher? and the nhl has a salary cap mlb doesnt
"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it." - Mitch Hedberg
by rentz on Dec 14, 2008 11:56 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Umm
They have a hard cap, and he’s basically guaranteed to have a cash cow with the Stars as long as they continue to draw okay. No gamble for Hicks.
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 3:31 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Geez they're having to just cut him?
That sucks.
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 3:30 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
avery
from what i read he just wont be returning with the team, i havent seen a straight answer on if hes being paid but they will be working to find him another home is the gist.
"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it." - Mitch Hedberg
by rentz on Dec 14, 2008 3:35 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Well I guess most of the Dallas defense
are jackasses for siding with TO, huh?
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
by Agreen07 on Dec 14, 2008 11:02 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
I hadn't seen that they were...
However, it is certainly encouraging that, much like in Philly and in San Fran, we have a TO situation that has the rest of the team picking sides.
Awesome. I’m so glad Jerry insisted on bringing him here.
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 11:14 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Link
The source told Werder that the majority of defensive players on the team supports Owens’ contention that Romo is overly reliant on Witten and often throws into coverage trying to get him the ball while ignoring Owens in a situation where he could make a play.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3764732
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
by Agreen07 on Dec 14, 2008 11:20 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Players agreeing with him?
Whatever. If they are also making an issue of it and causing problems, then yes, they are jackasses too.
It gets back to the lack of leadership, and the fact that Jerry has purposely put a structure in place where the head coach is emasculated and Jerry is the only one in the organization who has any power.
If Parcells is here, this isn’t happening. But because Wade is only a figurehead and can’t do anything about any of this, the problems fester.
Philly suspended TO when he started pulling this stuff there. You think there’s any chance Jerry does that? Of course not, because he’s a coddler and enables this sort of behavior.
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 11:29 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
if Parcells wasn’t here this wouldn’t be happening. Maybe Jerry thought this when considering if he wanted to sign TO in the first place. I’m confused though, what did TO even do? When he had his meeting about getting WR the ball more, Roy Williams and Patrick Crayton were also in the meeting too.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
by Agreen07 on Dec 14, 2008 11:31 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Do you have any idea
what a poison he is for this team and how identical it is to both situations he’s been in before, or are you that oblivious? Defensive players in Philly supported him too. Why do you think this issue follows him around, but doesn’t anyone else? I guess it’s pretty telling who can see Owens’ side on things like this.
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 3:35 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 11:21 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Honestly...
We all knew TO was a baby and we all knew as long as TO was getting his everything would be fine. As soon as TO stops getting his, things get bad. So if we want a chance to go to the Super Bowl we better start throwing the ball to the baby.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
by Agreen07 on Dec 14, 2008 11:22 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Personally...
…I think part of the reason behind the Roy Williams trade is to allow the team to TO loose after the season.
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 11:23 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
although I think a WR unit of Williams, Crayton and Austin is just average. Would love to trade up and get Crabtree but that isn’t realistic.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
by Agreen07 on Dec 14, 2008 11:28 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You need a #2 receiver...
…but with a strong running game, and a weapon at TE and WR, I think you are fine.
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 11:30 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah with Felix Jones back
and Bennett improving, WR becomes less important. I would still like to upgrade that are somehow…I think Crayton is overrated.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
by Agreen07 on Dec 14, 2008 11:34 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I would have cut Crayton after the playoff game last year
I hate average players, who talk shit, then don’t make plays.
"My mother always taught me that if the only thing you have to say is,
‘(Expletive) Dave Samson,’ then don’t say anything at all.
So I’m not going to say anything at all.
Is my mother the greatest or what?"
- Mariners GM Bill Bavasi, after signing Ichiro to a $90 million contract
by tyd3311 on Dec 14, 2008 11:43 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
but replaceable.
"My mother always taught me that if the only thing you have to say is,
‘(Expletive) Dave Samson,’ then don’t say anything at all.
So I’m not going to say anything at all.
Is my mother the greatest or what?"
- Mariners GM Bill Bavasi, after signing Ichiro to a $90 million contract
by tyd3311 on Dec 14, 2008 11:50 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think
It’s as easy as you do.
by brettgardner on Dec 14, 2008 11:51 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
1,3,3,1,4,0,2,2
"My mother always taught me that if the only thing you have to say is,
‘(Expletive) Dave Samson,’ then don’t say anything at all.
So I’m not going to say anything at all.
Is my mother the greatest or what?"
- Mariners GM Bill Bavasi, after signing Ichiro to a $90 million contract
by tyd3311 on Dec 14, 2008 11:53 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That's not
Really proof of anything, except that he doesn’t get a lot of passes thrown his way.
by brettgardner on Dec 14, 2008 11:57 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
His production is replaceable
There are always a couple of good slot receivers available. My point is, I don’t like players who talk shit, then go out and drop ball in the biggest game of the season. Patrick Crayton and Jeramy Stevens, 2 guys I would never have on my football team.
"My mother always taught me that if the only thing you have to say is,
‘(Expletive) Dave Samson,’ then don’t say anything at all.
So I’m not going to say anything at all.
Is my mother the greatest or what?"
- Mariners GM Bill Bavasi, after signing Ichiro to a $90 million contract
by tyd3311 on Dec 14, 2008 12:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
And you can throw Anthony Smith in there as well.
"My mother always taught me that if the only thing you have to say is,
‘(Expletive) Dave Samson,’ then don’t say anything at all.
So I’m not going to say anything at all.
Is my mother the greatest or what?"
- Mariners GM Bill Bavasi, after signing Ichiro to a $90 million contract
by tyd3311 on Dec 14, 2008 12:17 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Ha
don’t kill yourself out on that limb there
I'm undefeated in fights. Have I been in any? No. Thats because people know my f'ing status. Don't mess with the elite. - Miles
by Dirk Diggler on Dec 14, 2008 11:29 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
im definitely
in this camp, i really think that will be the case.
by blalock84 on Dec 14, 2008 3:36 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Right
since he’s only been thrown to more than anyone else on the team.
Just because he is double covered, runs half-assed routes, and god forbid, drops the ball, does not imply that efforts are being made to avoid his production.
The whole situation is pretty simple, really. Witten is a high-percentage target, Owens isn’t. The numbers bear that out.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 11:25 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah you are right
but can you win the super bowl with a TO like this? I don’t think you can. I think you have to make the baby happy and get him the ball a lot.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
by Agreen07 on Dec 14, 2008 11:26 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Wade is too much of a pansy
but I’d like to see Garrett or someone put their foot down. Handling egos is part of managing your team, imo.
The problem is, I’m not sure if issuing an ultimatum will have any effect.
As Adam suggested, I think the writing is on the wall here. One of Wade or T.O. will be gone, if not both.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 11:29 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No one can put their foot down but Jerry
That’s how he’s set up this organization…he’s the only one who has the power to do anything.
And he’s not going to do it.
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 11:30 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, that's fairly stupid
One ego deserves another, I suppose.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 11:32 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Bill Cowher?
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
by Agreen07 on Dec 14, 2008 11:35 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Dream on.
"My mother always taught me that if the only thing you have to say is,
‘(Expletive) Dave Samson,’ then don’t say anything at all.
So I’m not going to say anything at all.
Is my mother the greatest or what?"
- Mariners GM Bill Bavasi, after signing Ichiro to a $90 million contract
by tyd3311 on Dec 14, 2008 11:44 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Are you saying that BP had no real power when Jerry signed him?
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 12:36 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm saying Jerry was the g.m.
And what Bill wanted, at that point, wasn’t quite as relevant as what Jerry wanted.
I don’t think it is just coincidence that Bill left after that season.
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 12:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I thought he left because he wanted to be a GM
and not coach anymore. Just like he was trying to get the Giants GM job in season…
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 12:41 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
maybe it was the flawed Carpenter and Spears picks
and lack of winning a playoff game that also did him in…?
"Hang-Dai, Wu...Hang-Fu$&ing-Dai"
by Walter Sobchak on Dec 14, 2008 11:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Developing Tony Romo
probably didn’t trump those 2 picks…
He left because he felt like it was time, he did all he could do, it was up to the players to do the rest.
"My mother always taught me that if the only thing you have to say is,
‘(Expletive) Dave Samson,’ then don’t say anything at all.
So I’m not going to say anything at all.
Is my mother the greatest or what?"
- Mariners GM Bill Bavasi, after signing Ichiro to a $90 million contract
by tyd3311 on Dec 14, 2008 11:31 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
no they don't
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 12:30 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
lol, nah, but the funny part on this supposed last incident
is that Witten went up to Owens and engaged in a war of words. But, he’s the All American TE, can’t touch him…can’t say anything bad about him.
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 12:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
x
Witten went up to Owens and engaged in a war of words.
He did?
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 12:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
According to Mort
on SC last night
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 12:40 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Sort of sounds like Owens turned the conversation heated.
Team sources confirmed to ESPN’s Chris Mortensen that an incident occurred at the Cowboys’ training facility when Witten tried to engage Owens in a conversation about a pass route. Owens told Witten to stay away from him and called him a name. The two exchanged words before being separated.
"Please. What the hell do you know about starting a sports-related website and then deciding to leave it to work on other things and then? How dare you, sir." -- Michael Schur, aka FireJoeMorgan's Ken Tremendous, to Will Leitch
by ghtd36 on Dec 14, 2008 12:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
x
Team sources confirmed to ESPN’s Chris Mortensen that an incident occurred at the Cowboys’ training facility when Witten tried to engage Owens in a conversation about a pass route. Owens told Witten to stay away from him and called him a name. The two exchanged words before being separated.
I don’t know, maybe the D/FW media is all just covering up Witten’s culpability and trying to make Owens look like the bad guy…but even that doesn’t say Mortenson says Witten engaged in a “war of words” with Owens.
Owens has had these issues everywhere he goes. I’m not buying the “he’s a misunderstood guy being persecuted by the media” bit, even if the BTB posters do.
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 12:47 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
let me ask you this then
is he wrong? Is he getting the same quality of passes? Are any of the WRs? Does the offense look bad? Is involving TO a must for winning?
(Well, I think you know my thing, I think JG is a bad OC, but we can’t do anything there for the rest of the year, so…)
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 12:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
They showed a deal earlier today...
…that indicated that Romo had directed more passes to Owens than to Witten.
Is he getting the same quality of passes? I don’t know. But do you really think Romo just isn’t trying to get Owens the ball, or is not throwing the ball more accurately to Owens because he likes Witten better?
I think Romo is more comfortable throwing the ball to Witten than to Owens, and I think that, particularly when he’s under pressure, that’s who he tends to look to (along with the fact that he’s going to generally be on a short route, and you aren’t going to throw downfield when you are under a heavy rush).
And I think Owens throwing tantrums and deciding he’s not going to talk to Witten and accusing Witten and Romo of freezing him out is not a good thing.
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 1:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe if he'd run a route like Witten
he’d get more quality balls in coverage, even down the field.
What’s amazing to me is that Owens has, in fact, been targeted more. It’s simply a matter of him being a more vertical receiver than Witten — who is an absolute artist between the hashes. You’re not going to complete every home run to Owens, but you’ll complete 90% of those dinks and dunks to Witten.
Ugh … patience.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 1:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You can throw his way all day
But if you are doing it when hes double covered its not a quality look. Witten runs mainly short routes which are easier to throw. The problem is when TO is in an advantageous coverage matchup Romo doesn’t let the play develop and give himself and TO a chance to make a big play. He will dump it to Witten before TO is able to complete his route and that little 4-6 yard hitch route that Witten runs could be a 15-20 yard dig route that TO takes to the house. Part of that is on JG for not designing and calling plays that get TO in those good coverage matchups. But part is also on Tony for settling and appearing to play favorites with Witten.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 1:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You take what the defense gives you
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 1:29 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
you can't be serious
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 1:30 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Hmm?
I’m dead serious.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 1:31 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
And if they give you one on one with TO...
You let him complete his route before dumping it off to Witten. And if hes double covered you don’t throw it in his direction and then try and say “well we threw it to him X amount of times”
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 1:32 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
But why should Romo have to think about that?
Why should Romo have to say, “Well, I’m under pressure, and it would be easy to dump it off to an open Witten for a 6-yard gain, but instead I’m going to risk taking a sack to keep Owens happy.”?
"Please. What the hell do you know about starting a sports-related website and then deciding to leave it to work on other things and then? How dare you, sir." -- Michael Schur, aka FireJoeMorgan's Ken Tremendous, to Will Leitch
by ghtd36 on Dec 14, 2008 1:34 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Theres always exceptions
Pressure is one of them. But there have been plenty of times where Romo has gone straight to Witten and when they go back and show the replay TO is in single coverage and hasn’t had a chance to get out of his break by the time Romos thrown the ball. I understand Romo is more comfortable with Witten but when this offense was going good we were stretching the field and getting TO the ball. That hasn’t been happening alot lately and it has shown
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 1:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Stretching the field involves risk
if your defense is playing well and you can run the ball, you make high-percentage plays and shorten the game. All the things that have to go right for T.O. to catch a deep ball should not cause Romo to hold his breath EVER.
Whether Owens could make that play or not is irrelevant.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 1:41 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
A 15 yard in route is not stretching the field IMO
But it has a much higher chance to turn into a big play than a little 5 yard hitch to Witten. If you decide so far ahead of time that you are throwing to Witten and don’t allow your playmakers to make plays you are not going to go far in this league. Witten is not a playmaker. TO is. Witten is an amazing TE who I wouldn’t trade for any other TE in this league. But he doesn’t have the chance to turn that little 5 yard route into a 60 yard gain. TO does. If TO has a good matchup we should try and exploit that. Now if there is pressure or hes double covered then fine, take the 5 yards to Witten. But if TO has those favorable matchups you have to try and get him the ball at that time and let him make a play. Thats the reason we have been trying to do the sweeps and end arounds to him. Because he is a playmaker and even though most of the time those don’t break a big gain there is always the possibility.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 1:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think you're understanding my point.
And you have a bizarre fetish for the big play.
It’s not about winning some tiny battle, but shaping the war. I’ve said everything I can say on this subject.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 1:48 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Big plays
I remember when this offense was running smoothly and we were scoring alot of points and scaring defenses. It involved the big play. We were getting the ball downfield. That doesn’t mean fly routes 50 yards down the field. But a 15 yard cross that the receiver can run after the catch has the potential for a big play. A 5 yard curl to your TE doesn’t. Those plays are great when you need 3 yards in a critical situation but those shouldn’t be the first reads all the time. And the QB shouldn’t be settling for that all the time when he has big play receivers on both sides.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 1:51 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Let me know
how the Saints do in the playoffs.
PTS
27.9
(3rd)
YDS
401.6
(1st)
PASS YDS
304.2
(1st)
RUSH YDS
97.4
(27th)
Are you finding any correlation?
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 1:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Hows there defense?
I don’t see your point here
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 1:57 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
lol
They make big plays, bigsteve.
Check their record, though — it might speak to their defense.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 1:59 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
OK
They make big plays and their offense is ranked really high. You have to have a somewhat competant defense even with a great offense. If they had one they would be doing much better. So your point was NO makes big plays. Very good.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 2:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No
my point has managed to sail over your head throughout this entire thread. I’ve tried to couche it, rephrase it, consider it from all angles, but it ain’t happening. So I won’t force it into your skull.
My point is that big plays don’t guarantee wins, or anything, really. New Orleans is the quintessential example for this year.
Running the ball and stopping the run has worked effectively for longer than we’ve been alive. If the Cowboys do that, they will win in the playoffs.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 2:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
When did I say big plays won games?
Big plays help you score points. Having a good defense helps you win games. We have a good running game but when our offense was really humming along last year and early this year we also were having big plays in the passing game. Last year it led to a 13-3 record. I don’t know where I came off as we need to get TO the ball in order to win but that isn’t my point at all. Getting him the ball helps our entire offense much more than Witten does. It makes the defense respect the pass which opens the run game. And if they start doubling TO it will open up the middle for Witten to get downfield. But to bring up New Orleans makes no sense to me. Their defense couldn’t hold our defenses jocks. Thats why they are where they are
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 2:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Playoffs.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 2:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
OK
TO didn’t lose us the playoff game. Our running back being exhausted hurt us far more than TO. Also maybe the fact we ran into the hottest team in the league at the time didn’t help. Oh and they went on to win the Super Bowl so its not like we lost to a really inferior team
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 2:28 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm just saying
don’t quote me regular season records as if they’re some kind of evidence.
The only thing a regular season record tells you is whether you’ll make the playoffs or not.
The reason you’re being dense is because you think offense equates with good football. You don’t see the relationship between offense and defense — amidst the bigger picture of winning championships — that much is clear. My last hail mary for you is the 2008 Tennessee Titans.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 2:33 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I completely understand how important defense is
But this conversation wasn’t about defense. And unless your defense shuts everyone out you will have to score points to win. When the Cowboys were scoring points how were they doing that? They were doing that with big plays in the passing game. Not with little dump offs to Jason Witten. Thats the crux of this discussion. Our defense has been playing very well the last few weeks. Playoff caliber if I may say. But our offense hasn’t. Part of that is the complete lack of big plays in the passing game which looks to be a direct result of Tony Romo constantly looking to his security blanket instead of allowing the playmakers to make plays.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 2:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 3:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Heh
everything doesn’t happen in a vacuum, bigsteve.
You do the best you can to target your primary weapons, but the defensive alignment, circumstances in the game, and pass rush always dictate what will happen. If the defense doesn’t give you time to throw, you won’t be able to complete a pass to Owens no matter how well he completed the route. Think about this — it’s about winning, something much bigger than Owens, in other words. T.O. used to be my favorite player too, fwiw.
Do you honestly think the Cowboys don’t want a touchdown on every play? Are they trying to not score points?
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 1:35 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Cowboys
I understand the object of the game thank you very much. And I understand you don’t always have time to sit back and wait all day. But as I posted above I have seen numerous times this year on replay where TO is in single coverage and isn’t able to complete his route before Tony has dumped it off to Witten for a little 4 yard gain. Those are fine don’t get me wrong. If thats all the defense is giving you then take it all day. But that hasn’t been all they have been giving us. Alot of times thats all we’ve been taking.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 1:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Two sides to every coin
how about the times when a big play is handed to Owens on a silver platter?
And he flat out drops it. This happens — not so infrequently, either.
You don’t put all your eggs in Owens’ basket. He should be the first read, sure, but I wouldn’t hardly force it.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 1:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly
You don’t force it. Which we have been doing way too much. And then you get the people who say “wells he was thrown to more than anyone else” That doesn’t mean shit. You can’t deny that Owens has dropped easy balls. I don’t know if alot is the right word but definitely his fare share. But hes also caught alot of big plays. And there is no denying that between he and Witten, TO has by far the bigger big play potential. If its there you go for it thats all im saying. But we haven’t been going for it. We’ve been settling for 4 and 5 yards when we could have had 15-20
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 1:57 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
These "thrown to" stats are very misleading too
as are the drops one. That deep out to Owens on the first series counts as a drop, even though he barely got his fingers on it.
Personally, I think the problem is that Romo isn’t comfy (yet?) in the ball control offense. His tendency toward the higher risk play is being muted this year, and the result is a tendency to lock in on (or check down to) Witten too quickly and too often.
by bking on Dec 15, 2008 12:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That was a drop and im sure TO would tell you so
But yes the “targets” stat is very misleading.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 15, 2008 4:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'll agree with you there
Owens was in fact the one that shot himself in the foot in the Pitt game – failing to finish a few routes that probably ended up costing interceptions, and if not, still caused Romo to focus elsewhere (Witten) for the rest of the game.
"Hang-Dai, Wu...Hang-Fu$&ing-Dai"
by Walter Sobchak on Dec 14, 2008 11:30 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
dude
this objectively shown – romo doesn’t go through his reads in the correct order. he looks for witten first on a lot of those throws – especially third downs.
i think in general, romo doesn’t really go through his reads correctly. he tries to force the ball to T.O. on a first read or he tries to airmail it to T.O. on the last read. I don’t think he looks at Roy Williams at all sometimes (who is open a lot).
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 1:25 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'll agree with that.
As an objective non-Cowboy fan.
"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
by Rodney on Dec 14, 2008 1:34 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You guys need to stick to baseball
cuz you don’t know crap about football…except Chase, who’s played a little.
I'm just killing time until I'm reincarnated.
by Clueless on Dec 15, 2008 12:51 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Nice qualifier.
meet me at the mawwl... it's goin dowwn...
by oc on Dec 15, 2008 1:37 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He's right
I’m not sure how he knew that, but he’s right.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 15, 2008 11:51 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Adam...
What was the “love is a nose” thing?
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on Dec 14, 2008 11:52 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
cowboys will win tonight,
adam will have to keep quiet for a few more weeks, life goes on…
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 11:53 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
I'm as big a
Romo backer as anyone, but don’t you think a lot this controversy stems from the frustration the players are feeling in the loss in Pittsburgh? I think one way they’re voicing this is indirectly criticizing Romo for throwing that 40 ish passing rating out there Sunday while throwing the ball at Witten’s back in game deciding situations. Romo does just enough crazy mistakes that there can be a misguided feeling of “oh no, not that stuff again” from the other players.
I know that the players should take the good with the bad, but when it comes down to the nutcuttin, people are not always rational or overly loyal. But, since they also want self-protection from looking silly when Romo has his next great game, they beat around the bush voicing their frustrations, giving goofy reasons like perceived favoritism.
by mcgee48c on Dec 14, 2008 12:07 PM CST reply actions 2 recs
No
Ed Werder is a jackass.
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 12:22 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
For reporting?
"Please. What the hell do you know about starting a sports-related website and then deciding to leave it to work on other things and then? How dare you, sir." -- Michael Schur, aka FireJoeMorgan's Ken Tremendous, to Will Leitch
by ghtd36 on Dec 14, 2008 12:30 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No
for being Ed Werder.
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 12:31 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Why do you hate gingers, Longhorn?
They’re people, too.
"Please. What the hell do you know about starting a sports-related website and then deciding to leave it to work on other things and then? How dare you, sir." -- Michael Schur, aka FireJoeMorgan's Ken Tremendous, to Will Leitch
by ghtd36 on Dec 14, 2008 12:33 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It is all the media's fault
They are manufacturing things to bring the Cowboys down.
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 12:40 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
there's only one reporter that's started all these reports
somehow all of the local cowboys beat reporters missed it all
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 1:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
lol
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 1:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
what would have happened to the 90's cowboys
if reporters reported everything that happened then?
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 12:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Like the scissors incident?
Oh, wait, they did report that…Jeff Pearlman is the only one who thought that no one reported that…
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 12:40 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
sex planes
irvin’s career as a porno director
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 12:59 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think that's a little different...
…than conflicts within the team.
Didn’t the media report it when John Blake was saying Aikman was racist? Don’t you remember that whole flap?
I don’t see how you can compare that to having sex on a plane.
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 1:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
really?
in terms of interest for the fans, I think i would have cared a lot more about sex planes than who called who a racist.
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 1:04 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The difference is...
…that, for most part, what players do on their time generally isn’t discussed, if it isn’t going to impact what goes on on the field.
Which is what was so bizarre about the NY Post deciding to write about ARod and the stripper.
Players’ sex lives don’t get written about. Players having conflict in the locker room because a coach is calling the QB racist is.
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 1:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Sex boat was.
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 1:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
how about Charles Haley going "Charles Haley" on the guys
in the locker room…I never heard of that until recently
"Hang-Dai, Wu...Hang-Fu$&ing-Dai"
by Walter Sobchak on Dec 14, 2008 11:31 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Look, it's not my argument that ESPN doesn't want a story.
They do. Stories sell.
But I find it very hard to believe that a seasoned NFL reporter like Werder simply made these things up for a story. That doesn’t add up.
"Please. What the hell do you know about starting a sports-related website and then deciding to leave it to work on other things and then? How dare you, sir." -- Michael Schur, aka FireJoeMorgan's Ken Tremendous, to Will Leitch
by ghtd36 on Dec 14, 2008 12:43 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think they are saying he made it up
I think they are saying he should have just not reported it.
Sort of like everyone here thought that the media shouldn’t have covered the Drese/Barajas scrap. And everyone here thought that the tension between Ron Washington and Gerald Laird shouldn’t have been covered.
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 1:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
these types of things
if not reported would probably fizzle and die.
the media in general has a pretty good idea about what types of things are really a big deal and what types of things will only become a big deal if shown to the public.
i find it interesting that nobody else in cowboys journalism thought about reporting grumblings but ed werder – someone who pas a public dispute with owens – decides to report it. something very unethical about that.
as a journalist, he is just as much about making the news at that point as he is reporting it. Maybe if it was gosselin reporting it or somebody who at least had a longer (good) history with the cowboys, i wouldnt’ mind. But when it’s a reporter who has a public feud with a player reporting dirt about the player, i don’t like it one bit.
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 1:12 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Longer history with the Cowboys?
Werder was covering them back in the 80s.
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 1:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
is that your only response?
i remember reading ed werder as a beat reporter. but he’s not that anymore and the last 2 years he’s been reporting one story.
main point still stands
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 1:18 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No
I just don’t get the whole idea that this is some media creation by someone with an ax to grind.
And sure, if they weren’t reported in the media, they would fizzle and die in the public’s mind, since they wouldn’t be there anyway.
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 1:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
what i meant was fizzle and die in the locker room
and ed werder does have a history. perhaps i’d more convinced if it wasn’t werder who was reporting – someone that TO publicly disrespects at every press conference.
if i was running a credible news source, i wouldn’t have that guy cover the cowboys anymore.
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 1:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
he does
TO hates Werder. Doesn’t even acknowledge him during after game interviews or at press conferences. Werder asks him questions, and TO just keeps saying “next question”…hmm, i wonder why.
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 1:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
adam
do you think that espn hasnt been trying to make TO the story from the second he signed w/the cowboys? this isnt some new thing, but it sure has picked up the last couple weeks in there “coverage”
for christ sakes they’ve covered this more then the plaxico thing
by studcrackers on Dec 14, 2008 6:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
So you're telling me...
…that if Chris Mortensen reported this story, you wouldn’t be crying foul against the media?
"Please. What the hell do you know about starting a sports-related website and then deciding to leave it to work on other things and then? How dare you, sir." -- Michael Schur, aka FireJoeMorgan's Ken Tremendous, to Will Leitch
by ghtd36 on Dec 14, 2008 1:20 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i would be less suspicious
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 1:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
If Mortensen reported it...
…everyone would be crying about how Mortensen is unreliable and never gets anything right.
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 1:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Amazing how that works.
"Please. What the hell do you know about starting a sports-related website and then deciding to leave it to work on other things and then? How dare you, sir." -- Michael Schur, aka FireJoeMorgan's Ken Tremendous, to Will Leitch
by ghtd36 on Dec 14, 2008 1:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
if miles reported it
adam would be saying, “i told you so”
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 1:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
really?
proof?
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 1:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
actually
you are probably right.
I’m not a big fan of anyone over at ESPN.
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 1:34 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i mean
this is a story with unnamed sources. while i have no problem with unnamed sources, they better be coming from someone with some apparent credibility
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 1:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Name your sources!!!
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 1:40 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That dude needs some help.
"Please. What the hell do you know about starting a sports-related website and then deciding to leave it to work on other things and then? How dare you, sir." -- Michael Schur, aka FireJoeMorgan's Ken Tremendous, to Will Leitch
by ghtd36 on Dec 14, 2008 1:40 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i sure hope this is all made up
sounds fishy (no pun intended) to begin with anyway…
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 1:05 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
wouldnt surprise me
witten bitches to his agent, agent then leaks story to werder.
"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it." - Mitch Hedberg
by rentz on Dec 14, 2008 2:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Holy crap
"My mother always taught me that if the only thing you have to say is,
‘(Expletive) Dave Samson,’ then don’t say anything at all.
So I’m not going to say anything at all.
Is my mother the greatest or what?"
- Mariners GM Bill Bavasi, after signing Ichiro to a $90 million contract
by tyd3311 on Dec 14, 2008 1:44 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
One legged people who were forced to buy a pair?
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 1:47 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I see this image in my head and it is a funny one.
meet me at the mawwl... it's goin dowwn...
by oc on Dec 14, 2008 2:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
+1
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 2:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Call me a cynic...
…but I don’t think Bush is the most popular guy in the world right now.
"Please. What the hell do you know about starting a sports-related website and then deciding to leave it to work on other things and then? How dare you, sir." -- Michael Schur, aka FireJoeMorgan's Ken Tremendous, to Will Leitch
by ghtd36 on Dec 14, 2008 1:48 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
hahahaha
who knew Red Shoe Ranger was in Iraq?
"You shouldn't fuck around with windfalls"
LoneStarJon
by LAMuscleFag on Dec 14, 2008 1:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
LOL
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 2:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think that in
some cultures anything having to do with shoes or the bottom of the feet is a grave insult. Of course, I can’t really imagine a culture where having a shoe thrown at you is a good thing. Never mind.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
by t ball on Dec 14, 2008 1:51 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yep
Showing the soles of your feet to someone is a serious insult in Arab culture.
"I dont care to debate with a troll." - Sharky
by RCCook on Dec 14, 2008 2:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That's what I was thinking of
thanks.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
by t ball on Dec 14, 2008 2:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
hmm...another media member
shocking.
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 2:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
that is amazing
but as an outgoing president, bush needs to grab those shoes and do some serious ass whooping with them.
what are they going to do, fire him?
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 2:28 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
he dodged them pretty well
pretty good reaction for such a beaten down guy…
"Hang-Dai, Wu...Hang-Fu$&ing-Dai"
by Walter Sobchak on Dec 14, 2008 11:33 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Don't you
Think that Kerry would have size 10 clodhopper marks all over his gigantic forehead right now? I don’t think he could have parasailed out of the way of those things.
by brettgardner on Dec 15, 2008 12:06 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You know...
if Saddam was still in power, his family would all be having the bottoms of their feet beaten by iron rods right now. Isn’t free speech grand! You’re welcome, Iraq.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
by benmor78 on Dec 15, 2008 12:44 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
+1
"I´d like to apologize in advance for anything that I may say or do that could be construed as offensive as I slowly go NUTS."
by lonestarJon on Dec 15, 2008 12:47 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Joe Nelson
Does anyone know how much he would cost? His stats are pretty good. He had a 1.37 ERA, .599 OPS on the road in 2008. Overall, he had a 2.00 ERA, .616 OPS in 2008 and he can get out both lefties (.619 OPS) and righties (.612 OPS). His minor league stats have been solid as well over the last few years after converting from a starter to a reliever.
by coolrangersfan on Dec 14, 2008 2:14 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Eyre is taking up space in the 40-man roster
I wonder why Daniels tendered him when he could had just non-tendered him and resigned him to a minor league deal to free up one spot on the roster.
by coolrangersfan on Dec 14, 2008 2:23 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Terrell Owens
is in the right.
Bobby Jindal '12
by dstar442005 on Dec 14, 2008 2:33 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
TO
is a completely dilusional…The guy has gotten more balls forced into him than anyone i’ve ever seen. His selfishness is so blinding that he cant even see that.
If you think TO is right, you just arent seeing very clearly.
by blalock84 on Dec 14, 2008 3:40 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
2nd best receiver
EVER. He can say whatever he wants.
Bobby Jindal '12
by dstar442005 on Dec 14, 2008 3:45 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
What does being a great player have to do with being right?
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 3:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
basically
I think he is above the game… he supersedes it…. whatever he says goes…. for the most part.
hahaha oh man am I about to get attacked.
and because I said that… y’all will not say anything.
Bobby Jindal '12
by dstar442005 on Dec 14, 2008 4:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Huh?
Are you trying to make sense or just rambling?
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 5:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Forced is the key word there
Mostly when hes double covered which is not the situation to get him the ball in. His grpe is that when he is in a favorable matchup Tony is settling for Witten on the short little dumpoffs instead of letting TO complete his route and be in a position to make a big play. Thats completely valid gripe. Because when the Cowboys were winning and doing well the offense was clicking and scoring and had the element of the big play in their passing game. We haven’t had that the last several weeks and look what we have done. Our defense is playing at a playoff caliber right now but our offense isn’t. Dumping it off to Witten isn’t going to get it back to a playoff caliber offense
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 3:57 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
So let's see
We have Agreen, Longhorn and dstar supporting Owens, do I have that right? Shocking I tell you, shocking.
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 3:42 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Me too
I think it could absolutely have been handled differently but his gripe is legit IMO.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 3:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Okay
I’ll lump you in with the genius squad.
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 3:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Im just saying his gripe is valid
How he goes about it can be debated till we are out of breath. But the points to his argument are valid but because its TO people don’t seem to be able to comprehend that.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 3:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
don't waste your time
he is always right, and whenever he gets a chance he will let everyone know.
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 4:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The point is that
it doesn’t matter whether he’s right or not. The very fact that he’s splitting up the team into sides, right at the critical juncture of the season, when the chips are down, is the point.
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 4:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
OK
But why is it TO who is the one splitting up the team? Couldn’t you just as easily say its Romo splitting up the team by playing favorites even if its a detriment to the team?
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 4:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Is it about plaing favorites or trust?
"My mother always taught me that if the only thing you have to say is,
‘(Expletive) Dave Samson,’ then don’t say anything at all.
So I’m not going to say anything at all.
Is my mother the greatest or what?"
- Mariners GM Bill Bavasi, after signing Ichiro to a $90 million contract
by tyd3311 on Dec 14, 2008 4:43 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Probably a bit of both
But whatever it is it is hurting the offense as a whole.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 4:44 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Does your knee jerk both ways?
Or do you just fantasize about a perfect offense?
You’re acting like a DMN reporter because you’re blowing this farther out of proportion than they have. Seriously, think about what you’re saying. You’re implying that Romo is playing favorites when he is forced to make split-second decisions.
Whiskey-Tango-Foxtrot.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 4:47 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Do you know how quarterbacking works?
Each play has a set progression of reads. I have already said when you are under pressure its understandable to find your safety valve. Usually thats the TE or RB for all teams. But what I have seen from Romo on quite a few occasions this year is when he doesn’t have pressure on him he will forget about the progressions and simply settle for Witten when TO or Roy have favorable matchups on the outsides. That is inexcusable. Its not something a QB of Romos talent level should do. And it has shown in our offense looking like pure dogshit the last several weeks. Some of the blame goes to LG as well for his playcalling and designs. And some blame goes to TO and the other receivers also. Its not purely on Romo but what TO is bitching about here is a valid argument. But the TO haters who have blinders on and can’t see that he has a point want to jump on and try and use it to show he hasn’t changed and its the TO of old. Could it have been handled better….absolutely. But does he have a point in his argument……absolutely.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 4:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No
I really don’t think that you can. Even if you presume that he’s in the wrong with his decision making, which is very, very dicey in this case, considering how hard they’ve tried to get Owens the ball in some of their losses (umm, Washington). That is just an on-field mistake that needs to be corrected. It’s not the wide receiver’s place to provide input on pass targets anyway, but even if you have to say something, you say it to the QB and the OC, and that’s that. It doesn’t become a team issue until someone pushes it, smacks everyone in the face with it, and asks them to decide whether they agree with him or not. If Owens hadn’t done EXACTLY this sort of thing before, I wouldn’t quite see it that way. But he has the unfortunate instinct to take this sort of conflict to another level. It can’t just be something that the principals work out. It has to be something that involves the whole team, and that’s where the real distractions start.
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 4:49 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
As a point of reference...
…Michael Irvin used to yell about wanting the ball more, used to call up to the booth and tell Norv or Zampese he wanted the ball more…
But he never, ever get into it with Aikman over that.
In fact, I remember a game a few years ago when Irvin was still doing TV commentary, and they showed some run in between someone (it may have been Keyshawn) and, I think, Vinny Testeverde with the Cowboys.
And Michael said, “As a WR, you never call out your QB. You never do that. Whatever happens, he’s the man, and you follow him.”
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 4:52 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
+1
Excellent example of a star that is a team player.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 4:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
how do you know he didn't call out aikman
in private?
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 4:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
How is that relevant?
I don’t think anyone would imagine that Aikman and Irvin’s relationship was perfect all of those years, but apparently they handled personal matters like men.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 4:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
or
there wasn’t a divisive media to bring it into the public
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 4:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Some of these media members
were not reporting on the same team 10 years ago?
The media thing is a cop-out.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 4:59 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
if you read perlman's book
it is pretty obvious that the media did not cover the team the same back then as they do now.
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
All you have to do is listen to Troy Aikman
talk about Michael Irvin to know the type of relationship they had.
"My mother always taught me that if the only thing you have to say is,
‘(Expletive) Dave Samson,’ then don’t say anything at all.
So I’m not going to say anything at all.
Is my mother the greatest or what?"
- Mariners GM Bill Bavasi, after signing Ichiro to a $90 million contract
by tyd3311 on Dec 14, 2008 5:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
what do you think their relationship is?
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Outside of football
I have no idea.. but as teammates, I don’t think Aikman would have traded Irvin for anybody.
"My mother always taught me that if the only thing you have to say is,
‘(Expletive) Dave Samson,’ then don’t say anything at all.
So I’m not going to say anything at all.
Is my mother the greatest or what?"
- Mariners GM Bill Bavasi, after signing Ichiro to a $90 million contract
by tyd3311 on Dec 14, 2008 5:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah
it’s real easy for him to say that Irvin was a good receiver 10 years after the fact. Truth is, I dont’ think he would have minded if they traded Irvin for Chris Carter
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
What leads you to beleive that?
"My mother always taught me that if the only thing you have to say is,
‘(Expletive) Dave Samson,’ then don’t say anything at all.
So I’m not going to say anything at all.
Is my mother the greatest or what?"
- Mariners GM Bill Bavasi, after signing Ichiro to a $90 million contract
by tyd3311 on Dec 14, 2008 5:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
oddly enough
the way he talks about Irvin in public
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Not at the time.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 5:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Even if he did believe that
he certainly didn’t carry himself that way.
So it’s irrelevant speculation.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 5:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
who didn't carry himself that way?
who is carrying themselves now in a way that suggests that a WR doens’t get along with a QB?
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Aikman
did not behave as if Irvin was replaceable. I’m surprised you extracted from his rhetoric that he believes otherwise. I’d prefer for you to cite something for a claim like that.
I don’t know how well Romo is getting along with Owens. All I know is that Owens isn’t spending much effort in keeping personal matters private. That can’t be disputed.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 6:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
yes it can
i don’t remember him going to the media to complain ever about romo
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 6:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Send that memo to the Cowboys locker room
in case they are not aware.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 5:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
it's hard to operate under those conditions
just all i’m saying. just because someone is “failing” doesn’t mean they are at fault. I’m not sure how TO is any better or worse at handling a “get me the ball” situation than Irvin – at least in Dallas.
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The question is why would you care?
They’ve tried like hell to win with Owens and put up with the circus. This bubble of egos was bound to pop eventually. It starts with Jerry and the power structure.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 5:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah
it sure did pop. win today and the cowboys are probably going to the playoffs three straight years.
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It's only popped if you and bigsteve
think it has.
I’m fine with the situation so long as they keep winning, which is probably the same mindset as the front office.
You’re selling yourself short if you don’t think changes will be made this offseason, though.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 5:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
that's not what selling yourself short means either
and i have no idea what your first sentence means.
adam and others are making a point that TO has ruined this team – completely incorrect thing to say since the team is still in the playoff hunt and probably one of the best teams in the NFC still
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:14 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Please ab
I’m not lazy enough to avoid typing with capitalized words. Your punctuation also leaves a lot to be desired. Now that we’ve cleared up the semantics, I’ll indulge.
Let me explain my first sentence. It’s is a contraction. It refers to the bubble: “It [is] only popped if you and bigsteve think it has.” You are the people who believe this is an issue. Whether they play like professionals and execute on the field is all that matters. If they cannot, let your speculation begin. Personally, I don’t see Owens and Phillips coming back together.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 5:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
just be precise with your language
otherwise i can’t understand what you are saying. if my capitalization and punctuation make it hard for you to understand me, say so without throwing a fit.
and, you are incorrect. I don’t think it is an issue. adam does.
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:20 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Pardon me
it is justifiable for you to falsely question my diction, but I am incorrect for misinterpreting yours because it lacks punctuation?
By the way, you were wrong.
Diction, in its original, primary meaning, refers to the writer’s or the speaker’s distinctive vocabulary choices and style of expression.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 6:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
wrong about what?
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 6:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Claiming knowledge
of my use of “crying wolf.”
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 9:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
How about the way Owens acted toward Romo this year versus last? He’s been as good of a soldier and teammate this year as he was last year?
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 5:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
what are you talking about exactly?
when did he call out Romo in public?
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
When he said the offense sucked...
…and needed to quit making turnovers?
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 5:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
when was that?
i missed it
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
oh
after Pitt game.
fine. he called out his QB by saying “the offense was bad and the defense played well and we need to quit turning the ball over.”
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Look at his stats and the teams performance
Last year he had great stats and the team was winning. This year he doesn’t and the team isn’t. If you are complaining about him wanting to win and being pissed then I guess you are right. But thats a good problem to have in my opinion.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 5:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
still doesn't answer what exactly Owens did
“toward Romo”
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:14 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Well
Last year TO, at least on the outside, seemed to have Romos back vocally and would stand up for him. This year he hasn’t been as vocal in support of Romo and im sure alot of that has to do with his and the teams performance
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 5:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Wow
You honestly think whether TO has good stats or not decides the outcome of the game.
Please — what more gold do you have to share? This is mind-blowing shit.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 5:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Good reading comprehension
I said last year TO was more friendly toward Romo at least publicly and it probably had alot to do with his personal stats and the teams success (13-3 record). This year he hasn’t been as vocally friendly and I think that has alot to do with his and the teams performance (8-5 record).
Try and follow the conversation next time big guy
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 5:18 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Ugh
if you’re involved in any capacity, remind me to stay out of the conversation.
You’re truly as dumb as I think you are.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 5:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
easy
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
OK
How about the way Owens acted toward Romo this year versus last? He’s been as good of a soldier and teammate this year as he was last year?
Then I responded with this
Last year he had great stats and the team was winning. This year he doesn’t and the team isn’t. If you are complaining about him wanting to win and being pissed then I guess you are right. But thats a good problem to have in my opinion.
Tell me oh wise one where did I mention anything about TOs stats being the deciding outcome of the game? I simply said he treated Romo better last year because he had good stats and the team was winning. No reason for him to be unhappy. This year is different and we are seeing a different TO. Now take your head out of your ass and read that a couple times to let it all sink in and then try and tell me where I said TOs stats determine the outcome of games.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 5:25 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Again...
…I’m not sure if you remember how the team was covered in the early 90s…
But the idea that Werder and Gosselin and Galloway and that crew protected that era’s Cowboys, but that same courtesy isn’t being shown to the current Cowboy team, is, I think, erroneous.
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 5:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i'm sure they were looking for the story then as well
but even if it was providence, i’m saying those cowboys got away with a lot that these cowboys aren’t getting away with in terms of inter team squabbles.
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
but
i also think werder has a special axe to grind with owens that he might not have had with anybody from the old team
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
and
i don’t remember TO yelling at Romo. In fact, TO went to great lengths not to do specifically that, going to Garrett instead (which is apparently what Irvin did).
your hypocrisy is ridiculous
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 4:57 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Owens
From all accounts this was initially handled in private. TO and the other receivers had a meeting with Garrett to vent their frustration. But some “team source” goes and runs to ESPN and whoever and shit gets all twisted and then its a full blown media frenzy. TO can’t do anything in private because he has no privacy with the media. During the games a camera is on him every second of the game. On the sidelines and on the field. If he goes to the QB one on one all of a sudden the cameras cut to it and everyone jumps to conclusions that TO is bitching to the QB. Earlier this year people were calling for someone on this team to step up and be a vocal leader. Do you not think TO could be that vocal leader? I do. But due to the fact whenever he opens his mouth in any capacity it makes front age headlines if TO tried to fire up his teammates ESPN would be camped out at Valley Ranch with stories of TO yelling at teammates and such.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 5:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i don't see how anybody can dispute this
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Cry me a river
this persecution complex is unreal.
TO can’t do anything in private because he has no privacy with the media.
I wonder what could be done about that. Media attention is what he wants. You can’t have it both ways. If you want the spotlight on you, play accordingly and behave accordingly whenever you’re doing your job that pays you a fat living. If you choose otherwise, can’t cry wolf.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 5:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
when did TO complain about the media?
he’s handling it.
I’m complaining about your perception of TO. that’s a little different
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He was my favorite player in the league
since he played in San Francisco.
I’m fairly confident that I have a decent grip of what he is about.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 5:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
so he was your favorite player when he was stomping on the star?
what are you an f’n commie too?
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
by Jayslick on Dec 14, 2008 6:25 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
and that is not what crying wolf means
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Heh
if that’s all you have to offer, then you need to increase your hours on patrol.
I’ll make sure to dissect your posts as I deem fit.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 5:28 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
As a matter of fact
I’ll use a metaphor as loosely as I can. It clearly must have resonated for you to arrogantly attempt to correct it.
How would you know what my meaning of it is in context? You crack me up, dude.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 5:30 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
what?
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:31 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You are not in a position
to decide whether a metaphor was applicable in a certain context or not.
If you understood it, which you did, then I have accomplished what I intended. If it wasn’t as crisp as it could have been, I’m not fearing your literary criticism.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 5:32 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think i know what you meant
I don’t think it was correct because I know what crying wolf means and nobody is crying wolf here. Owens hasn’t cried at all.
But I think you mean that Owens wants media attention and then complains about media attention? I think you just meant “can’t cry about it.” right?
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:36 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
My issue, at its core
is with the fact that this came to involve the entire team. If you believe that TO never brought anyone into this, was an equal part in the group that set up meetings with Garrett and not a ringleader, and kept his mouth shut otherwise, I don’t think that I can disprove that. Logic, to me, would clearly dicate otherwise, but okay.
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 5:04 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
so going to JG by himself is fine
but going to JG with other WR’s is wrong?
yeah, that’s not splitting hairs
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks for completely misrepresenting my point
I said that I don’t believe that he wasn’t the ringleader or that he never pushed the subject with other players outside his position, but if bigsteve does believe that, then operating under that assumption, I don’t have nearly the issue with him.
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 5:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
you didn't say the "outside his position" part the first time
so, just so we agree, if it is just him and the WR’s (even if he is a ring leader – or others might call “leader” or "captain"), then it is fine?
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No
If he instigated the WRs revolting, that’s step one. If he then involved others outside their position group, that’s step two. The last one is worse, but the first one would be wrong too, imo. He is the one his position group look to, clearly. Roy Williams said it immediately upon coming here, and it doesn’t take but about five minutes of hard knocks to see the dynamic in the position on the team. His role in distracting those players from their business and pushing this issue – if you believe he had one – is very bad.
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 5:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah
we just disagree about step one.
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:49 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No
I absolutely believe Owens was the ringleader of the WRs going to Garrett. But is that wrong? Or would you rather have a few guys like Roy and Crayton keeping everything inside and not voicing their opinions and you can’t fix anything because you don’t know somethings broke.
I don’t however think Owens is a guy who is going around the lockerroom asking guys to be on his side of the argument like a high school student council election. “Pick me pick me”.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 5:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah
he didn’t “recruit” anybody. This was a WR problem and he collected the other WR’s to handle it. The only other people involved seem to be team captains (Bradie James, etc.)
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think it’s wrong. But we’re past finding any sort of middle ground on this, I think.
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 5:14 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
seriously Z
everything you are asking Owens to do – HE DID. do people not understand that? If you think it is ok for Owens to complain to the OC about getting the ball, then he is completely in the clear on this. There’s nothing else to it.
whoever leaked (if there was a real team source that leaked) is the one that is in the wrong.
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
My issue is with involving others.
If you think that leading a revolt among the receivers against the QB is a good way to behave on a team and within an organization, we’re way past finding any agreement. I’ll leave my part at that.
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 5:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
"revolt" "ringleader"
i saw a bunch of WR’s (even if instigated by Owens) having a discussion with the OC about getting the ball more to the WR’s (without necessarily implicating the QB more than the OC in terms of fault).
yeah, i’m cool with that. i think a team can survive that. I think it can be beneficial. i think you’re naive if you think things like that have never happened.
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It wasn't a revolt
It was a group of players (WRs) who felt they were not being used the right way and they went to the coaches to voice their displeasure. Im sure Crayton and Roy had some frustration as well but they weren’t going to be the ring leader. Not with TO in the group.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Dec 14, 2008 5:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Are they all black?
I don’t see the tie-in.
"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
by Rodney on Dec 14, 2008 3:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Get off my lawn!
I'm undefeated in fights. Have I been in any? No. Thats because people know my f'ing status. Don't mess with the elite. - Miles
by Dirk Diggler on Dec 14, 2008 3:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The tie-in is...
…z has butted heads with all 3 of those guys, I believe.
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 4:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
so?
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 4:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Huh?
Rodney was asking what the commonality that was implied in the original post was. I responded.
by Adam J. Morris on Dec 14, 2008 4:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
okay
well, that’s rather childish on his part if what you said is true.
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 4:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think I've really butted heads with Longhorn
but all three are guys who naturally seem to go against the grain. It makes sense that people who find themselves disagreeing with the mainstream opinion would tend to side with Owens, I’d think.
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 4:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
come on man
that is a gross over generalization of this situation.
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 4:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I guess I just can't
see how anyone can come to the conclusion that Owens is doing the right thing (assuming what we’ve heard is true) by pressing this issue now. Usually I can at least relate to both sides of something on some level. But here, I can’t figure out what would lead anyone to think that pushing this issue now and apparently involving the entire team to the point that guys are picking sides is a good thing for the team, unless it’s that your instinct is to kind of say, wait a minute, everyone thinks A, which makes me suspect it’s B. As I’ve said before, my sister has this trait, which is why I tend to notice it. It’s not bad or anything, it just amuses me because it reminds me of her.
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 4:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: pressing this issue now
The team is in real danger of missing the playoffs. I think he had the right idea, but maybe it got blown out of proportion with the media catching wind of it. Honestly, the NFL is all about stars, and he is one, and a very productive one. I think he needs to be the focal point of the offense, not Whitten, for this team to go far in the playoffs.
Anyway, JMO, I’m not a Cowboys homer, or anything.
"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
by Rodney on Dec 14, 2008 4:48 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Playoffs
You don’t think running the ball and playing good defense should be the focus?
Satisfying “stars” can’t be that high on your list of “how to win.” Running the ball becomes more important in the playoffs because every team has a legit offense. Your focus becomes running the ball in order to limit turnovers, but also to keep prolific opposing offenses from gashing you. Field position, special teams, clock management, etc.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 4:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Are you, like, 100?
Or is this really Bill Parcells?
;)
"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
by Rodney on Dec 14, 2008 4:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Heh, definitely channeling him
but he’s a championship coach, so …
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 4:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Just look at Miami this year.
"My mother always taught me that if the only thing you have to say is,
‘(Expletive) Dave Samson,’ then don’t say anything at all.
So I’m not going to say anything at all.
Is my mother the greatest or what?"
- Mariners GM Bill Bavasi, after signing Ichiro to a $90 million contract
by tyd3311 on Dec 14, 2008 4:57 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
They've been effing amazing
"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
by Rodney on Dec 14, 2008 4:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
so many trophies on his wall
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Was there something you disagreed with, specifically?
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 5:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
the idea that his philosophy will win a championship
definitely nothing wrong with a strong running, strong defense team but more than one way to skin a cat and not every playoff team needs to focus on running the ball if they have a good WR corps.
but, if they wanted to be a running team first, they probably didn’t need to sign owens and trade for roy williams and they probably have to change their offense again (new OC)
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:41 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
See: Jones, Jerry.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 6:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
to which i'm saying
you don’t need to do all of that. you can work with what you have and still win a super bowl.
you are acting like we need to go into rebuilding mode
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 6:14 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Did you watch the Washington game?
The one they lost? Did they need to feature him more in that game?
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 4:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't have a dog in this fight,
and obviously you can pick out one game as an example of almost anything. However, I really don’t feel the OC has Romo going through his reads correctly.
Do I think Romo can get a little lazy in his reads/progressions/play selection? Yep, and that’s on the OC to correct.
"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
by Rodney on Dec 14, 2008 4:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Well they've lost three games with Romo
I’m only picking one of the three. Isn’t picking Pittsburgh and saying that they need to make him more of a focal point after that game doing the same thing?
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 4:59 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
what's your problem?
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 4:04 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I just think it is utterly amazing
that anyone can look at Owens’ history and conclude that this isn’t just more of the same from him, probing for something to cause conflict about when things are going bad. Who cares if he’s right? The point is that doing this sort of thing is poison to a team – maybe the only real kind of poison there is – and he just does it over and over. Why stand up for that?
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 4:14 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
well, my problem is, even if this happend
we don’t know what really happened ‘cause we don’t know who the ‘sources’ are, but if they are teammates leaking this, then those people have their own issues.
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 14, 2008 4:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
My gut reaction
is to roll my eyes and let it play out, so I agree with you there. It’s very possible that there really isn’t anything to it and it will blow over. But why look for whoever else can be blamed, besides Owens? He’s the guy who has caused this sort of rift in the past and who would naturally be the leader out of Williams and Clayton. Either there’s not much to it or he’s the one that instigated this distraction at the most critical point. I agree that the group should keep this internal and that there shouldn’t be leaks. But you and I don’t know what it’s like to have Owens for a teammate. It seems to drive some people nuts (including both of his previous coaches).
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 4:20 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
nope
I don’t think TO was wrong in Philly either. just saying… TO was treated wrong there too… Mcnabb was at fault.
Bobby Jindal '12
by dstar442005 on Dec 14, 2008 4:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Amd in SF?
They wronged him there as well?
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 4:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
no TO was wrong there
but I can afford a guy a mistake…
I think the media took SF and ran with it.
Bobby Jindal '12
by dstar442005 on Dec 14, 2008 4:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
A side from calling his quarterback gay?
"My mother always taught me that if the only thing you have to say is,
‘(Expletive) Dave Samson,’ then don’t say anything at all.
So I’m not going to say anything at all.
Is my mother the greatest or what?"
- Mariners GM Bill Bavasi, after signing Ichiro to a $90 million contract
by tyd3311 on Dec 14, 2008 4:59 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, aside from that
I was hoping to let dstar work this out, but thanks.
by Brett Perryman on Dec 14, 2008 5:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Wait
but aren’t gays bad?
He’s a martyr, if anything.
This is an exciting time in my life.
The LSB CPP's are in full bloom.
by Chase Irwin on Dec 14, 2008 5:40 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Think someone would do this to Tom Hicks at a press conference for being cheap?
by coolrangersfan on Dec 14, 2008 4:27 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
What a c-word.
He throws the shoe and then is whinning like a little girl when he is laying on the ground…and they weren’t even beating on him.
I hope he gets his junk cut off in jail.
"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
by Rodney on Dec 14, 2008 4:43 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
lol
yea and his aiming is bad…maybe he should tryout for the rangers
by coolrangersfan on Dec 14, 2008 4:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Interesting article on Ben Sheets
“I would not bet so much as a penny on the Yankees acquiring Manny Ramirez, Ben Sheets or Mark Teixeira. Andy Pettitte can come back, and Mike Cameron will come aboard if the Brewers take Kei Igawa. If deals involving those two guys can’t happen, then maybe a starting pitcher/centerfielder in those price ranges (one-year investments for about $10 million) will wind up in the Bronx. But that’s about it.”
http://blogs.trb.com/sports/baseball/blog/2008/12/sunday_reading_and_day_10_of_t.html
Hopefully, the Yanks can resign Pettitte and acquire Cameron so that way we won’t have to worry about them stealing Sheets away from us.
by coolrangersfan on Dec 14, 2008 5:33 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I think only Petitte is relevant.
If they don’t get Cameron, Marlon Byrd may be an alternative, which I like.
"My mother always taught me that if the only thing you have to say is,
‘(Expletive) Dave Samson,’ then don’t say anything at all.
So I’m not going to say anything at all.
Is my mother the greatest or what?"
- Mariners GM Bill Bavasi, after signing Ichiro to a $90 million contract
by tyd3311 on Dec 14, 2008 5:44 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Byrd and others for Kennedy?
It seems like the Yankees are currently down on Kennedy. They plan on going with an all-veteran rotation and don’t have much room for him (especially with Hughes and probably Aceves ahead of him in the depth chart as the probable sixth starter). He struggled at the major league level (due to pressure and inexperience) but pitched well at AAA this year. Who would we have to add to the deal along with Byrd to get the Yanks to trade him? It would be ideal for us. Kennedy has a career minor league record of 18-6 with a 1.99 ERA, 248 K’s and only 150 hits, 10 HR’s and 70 BB’s in 226 IP and turns just 24 this month.
by coolrangersfan on Dec 14, 2008 6:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No Byrd trades please
- Plus defense in center
- Perfect one year stopgap for Borbon
- Middle-of-the-order right-handed bat to break up the lefties
- Handsome
meet me at the mawwl... it's goin dowwn...
by oc on Dec 15, 2008 1:43 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
you forgot
Likely Type A FA
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
-The Outlaw
by Gdawg on Dec 15, 2008 2:56 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I love having Byrd on the team
I know he brings a lot to the team, but you have to give up something good in order to get something valuable back. Also, he doesnt fit our long-term plans given that he will become expensive after he tests the market in the winter of 2009. I actually prefer Byrd over Murphy, but we have Murphy under control for five more years. We cant afford to spend our limited resources on an outfielder when we have Murphy, Hamilton, Cruz and eventually Borbon for the future. Also, are you sure you wouldnt trade one year of Byrd and other players for six years of a starting pitcher (Kennedy) with amazing minor league numbers? I’m pretty sure you know what’s the biggest need of this team.
by coolrangersfan on Dec 15, 2008 8:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Trade Cruz. He's about as valuable as Byrd.
by oc on Dec 15, 2008 9:30 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I would rather trade Murphy than Cruz
Cruz has more upside than Murphy. His minor league numbers are clearly superior. Murphy is useful as a platoon LF, but at least Cruz hits well against both lefties and righties (in the minors) and has enough speed to steal about 15-20 bases. Cruz is a better defender and has a better arm as well. But remember this is the Texas Rangers and we are working under a budget and with a long-term plan. Therefore, we must keep the younger and cheaper OFs, so I doubt Murphy or Cruz would get dealt. I understand that you want to keep Byrd (I would too if it wasnt for that salary cap) but I am just going by what is likely to happen and not just what I wish would happen. Would other teams really give up quality pitching for Cruz? I doubt it, given that he has yet prove himself at the big league level. Byrd is more of a proven commodity and would bring leadership and experience to a win-now mode ballclub. I guess we should just agree to disagree and leave it at that.
by coolrangersfan on Dec 15, 2008 11:45 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
+1
Although I’m not sure Cruz has the baserunning chops to steal 15-20 bags a year in the majors. Maybe if Wash actually ran with him a few times we could find out though.
"I´d like to apologize in advance for anything that I may say or do that could be construed as offensive as I slowly go NUTS."
by lonestarJon on Dec 16, 2008 12:15 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You are right
He only has 6 SB in 176 games in his brief major league career. But since he stole 24 bases in 103 games at AAA last year (and has 105 in 707 career minor league games, which is roughly 1 in every 7 games), I figured he has the potential to steal 15-20 if given the chance. Of course, the minors and the majors are two completely different levels so you are right, that number should probably be lower (10-15 instead). Also, if Washington has him hitting cleanup, then Cruz wont be running at all.
by coolrangersfan on Dec 16, 2008 12:57 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Sheets
I really feel like he’s very scared right now at the prospect of having to pitch in TX for two years trying to get a good contract. I think he’s probably waiting for a pitcher friendly team to show itself and offer anything comparable.
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 5:44 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
its good to have hope though
According to Nolan Ryan, Sheets did seem interested in pitching for the Rangers. Also, he had a house in Dallas up for sale and took it off the market. I wonder if he values pitching close to home and with the best offensive club in the majors. The only problems I envision are money and time. It seems as if though the Rangers have to get rid of Millwood and/or Padilla in order to make him an offer. Sheets won’t be available for long so the Rangers better hurry up and make a trade.
by coolrangersfan on Dec 14, 2008 5:51 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Oh and I forgot the Mike Maddux factor
Mike Maddux is partly responsible for Sheets’ turnaround in 2004 and since. I hope Sheets would think about that when the time comes to weigh offers (if the Rangers even make one). I hope the Rangers trade both Millwood and Padilla and sign both Sheets and Johnson to give the Rangers a real 1-2 punch (which they haven’t had in a while). Trading Salty+ for Buchholz would be sweet too but is that asking for too much? Well, assuming that happens too, a rotation of Sheets, Johnson, McCarthy, Buchholz and Harrison/Feldman/Hurley/Nippert/etc. would make the Rangers competitve this year as long as they can add to the bullpen as well.
by coolrangersfan on Dec 14, 2008 6:32 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
OT: Chuck E Cheese Violence
Apparently it is a very common occurrence
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122878081364889613.html
Mandatory reading before suggesting a trade
by ab03 on Dec 14, 2008 6:01 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
a lie = name calling.
nice.
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
by Longhorn on Dec 15, 2008 12:29 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
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