Friday morning
by Brett Perryman on Mar 28, 2008 8:05 AM CDT
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PrintThis morning's news primarily focuses on the lineup.
Richard Durrett talks about Hank Blalock starting out in the cleanup spot. Durrett also mentions that the final spot in the pen hasn't yet been settled.
TR Sullivan discusses some of Washington's thoughts on the order, including the middle spots and Frank Catalanotto's role.
The team is in Oklahoma City tonight; tomorrow is Frisco.
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Jim Reeves is a Ticket-head
I heard Norm do a segment Thursday morning on this same subject -
If you're keeping score, in the past two years, the Rangers have traded Alfonso Soriano, Chris Young, Adrian Gonzalez, Francisco Cordero and Teixeira and will not have a single player on their opening day 25-man roster to show for it. You have every right to wonder how much better this team would look if those five players were still here.
Quote from Norm or Jim?
It's a silly argument that's been made here several times. Soriano and Coco would be gone and Tex would be leaving after this year. So basically, the Chris Young trade was bad.
And with the 22nd overall selection the Dallas Cowboys select Jonathan Stewart.
Yeah, but
still, you'd think we'd have something at the ML level, at least on a rebuilding team from all that. Salty not being able to push past a stiff like Laird was very disappointing. The Young and Gonzalez trade was obviously one of the 5 worst trades in franchise history and may end up being the worst. The Wilkerson Debacle shows how stupid our franchise was in not getting a medical exam.
Its a pattern of poor decision making.
"Before I leave, I once again condemn the despicable buffoonery of D.J. Cahill." - Huck
If signing a guy
with a busted up shoulder was all they could get for Soriano, then that also shows bad decision making.
"Before I leave, I once again condemn the despicable buffoonery of D.J. Cahill." - Huck
Soriano
He was a flawed player here, you may not remember. The trade deadline before he got dealt the news was Minnesota wanted him for (iirc) Lohse or one of their other #3/4 starters, Romero, and some amount of minor league filler.
And that's about the market for a defensively flawed, bad road hitter getting over his peak years.
A lot of LSB posters thought they could argue against Sori's apologists in one thread, and demand some huge return in another thread. That became very tiresome, I remember.
The Wilkerson offer was the best reported offer, injury risk included. Maybe you can find an archived news report saying otherwise.
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on Mar 28, 2008 10:08 AM CDT up reply actions
Still
If that was the best offer, give me Soriano's walk year and two supplemental picks over two years of Brad Wilkerson and 8.2 innings from Armando Galarraga.
by badradiorules on Mar 28, 2008 10:13 AM CDT up reply actions
Yep.
And the chance for a mid year deal.
Wilkerson was less than nothing due to his injuries. He sucked value out of the franchise and we couldn't get picks for him when he left.
"Before I leave, I once again condemn the despicable buffoonery of D.J. Cahill." - Huck
mid-year deal
Who'll ever know how that turned out?
We know from more recent history Teixeira probably would have brought back less if he'd been dealt later.
As for reeeally wanting those supplemental picks, you may've forgot your original whine was that none of this acquired talent is playing on the ML level right now. But why let that slow the bitching, Cahill?
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on Mar 28, 2008 11:18 AM CDT up reply actions
My original whine
was that they didn't subject Wilkerson to a medical exam.
"Before I leave, I once again condemn the despicable buffoonery of D.J. Cahill." - Huck
You really believe that, though?
They didn't subject him to a medical exam.
Brad Wilkerson.
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on Mar 28, 2008 2:54 PM CDT up reply actions
It makes sense
What a waste -- the whole thing.
Next track for OC, et al:
Del tha Funkee Homosapien - Catch A Bad One
by inactive lsb user on Mar 28, 2008 3:06 PM CDT up reply actions
ML Roster
The only reason Salty isn't up is to let trade value build for Laird. I think having Laird up with the intention of trading him shows a commitment to rebuild. We know we can wait half a season on Salty if it means getting another prospect or filling a hole elsewhere. If Laird was a couple years older, he would be the backup coming out of ST.
by Jack Nicholson 1974 on Mar 28, 2008 9:48 AM CDT up reply actions
If we couldn't move Laird
in the offseason, my guess is the return for him will be a fringe minor leaguer who may not ever make the bigs, and if he does, will be full of fail.
Like a Nick Masset type.
"Before I leave, I once again condemn the despicable buffoonery of D.J. Cahill." - Huck
Not if he improves
Laird is coming off a terrible year. If he shows he can play closer to his 2006 numbers, he will have real value. If he plays like last year, you are right, he won't get much. But why not wait 2 months and see? His value can't go down in 2 months.
by Jack Nicholson 1974 on Mar 28, 2008 10:00 AM CDT up reply actions
Even if he hits like he did in the minors
he doesn't have much more value than Barajas did. If they can't work a mid year deal for him, they just need to kick him to the bench. After all, as Gerry Fraley once wisely said, he is a backup at best.
"Before I leave, I once again condemn the despicable buffoonery of D.J. Cahill." - Huck
Agreed
If he plays well, trade him as soon as possible. If he comes out flat, bench him and bring Salty up.
by Jack Nicholson 1974 on Mar 28, 2008 10:36 AM CDT up reply actions
disagree
if you can get Lastings Milledge for total crap at the backstop position, or Chris Young's potential for an Einer Diaz, or the HUUUUGE package the Twins got in return for AJ Pierzynski, there isn't a reason to be so pessimistic about a return on Laird, especially if he's packaged with Cat, Padilla, etc.
I'm not saying it WILL happen, or that I'm optimistic that it will happen, just that there's a very decent chance that it does - and that JD and co. are putting us in the best position possible by making every other organization think we have full confidence in Laird and at the same time giving him a chance to increase his value to either us for the future or another team in a trade scenario.
We know Milwaukee, Cincinnati, and Philadelphia are all interested.
Other potential suiters include Boston and Detroit in case of injury to their aging backstops on championship teams, the Cubs, Arizona, Florida, Washington, Tampa Bay...injuries could of course open the door for others
there is ALWAYS a need for a great defensive backstop that has shown ability to hit in the past. and if we don't trade Laird for a decent return, we have tons of other catching prospects that we may be able to get a huge haul for...
"No, Donny, these men are nihilists, there's nothing to be afraid of."
by Walter Sobchak on Mar 28, 2008 12:09 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree with much of your post
I don't know that Laird is "great" defensively. We know he has an arm, but his receiving skills need to improve for him to be considered great.
Next track for OC, et al:
Del tha Funkee Homosapien - Catch A Bad One
by inactive lsb user on Mar 28, 2008 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions
completely agree
and love the Jack Nicholson 1974 theme
"No, Donny, these men are nihilists, there's nothing to be afraid of."
by Walter Sobchak on Mar 28, 2008 11:51 AM CDT up reply actions
Thanks
I'm glad people get the reference.
by Jack Nicholson 1974 on Mar 28, 2008 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't get the reference...
Was that the year he made Chinatown?
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on Mar 28, 2008 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions
It is
but the name is from a line in Billy Madison. I doubt it would be funny in print, so I will just let you check out the movie, if you are interested.
Although, now that I think about it, the name is just a funny line and not my choice to the referenced hypothetical - not that there's anything wrong with that.
by Jack Nicholson 1974 on Mar 28, 2008 3:44 PM CDT up reply actions
I take it you were watching Billy Madison
Nobody punished like Earl and No one was nastier than Ryan
Quote is from Jim
But, I swear, Norm said nearly the EXACT same words Thursday morning over the air.
That is the
same rant the Galloway spews whenever he talkes about the Rangers.
I don't want to play golf. When I hit a ball, I want someone else to go chase it. ~Rogers Hornsby
Stupid comments!!!
I hate "evaluations" like that. Notice how they left out Eric Gagne. I wonder why that is? Maybe because we got *2* guys on the major league roster out of that trade, for a guy we had signed on the hope that he was healthy. The issue isn't whether the players we got directly for Alfonso Soriano, Chris Young, Adrian Gonzalez, Francisco Cordero and Teixeira are major leaguers. Its was the club improved overall. Armando Gallaraga was ok, but not great. Wilkerson was hideous and now gone, but in another sense he was "traded" for Ben Broussard. The Young deal still netted us Otsuka, who gave us a year as a closer and might still contribute this year. Cordero got us Lee, who got us draft picks when he left. and 5 years from now, the Teixeira trade could easily go down as one of the more lopsided in franchise history. We talk about the best Ranger prospects, but how many of them came from that trade and the trade of Eric Gagne?
Jarrod Saltalamacchia
Beau Jones
Elvis Andrus
Matt Harrison
Neftali Perez
Kason Gabbard
David Murphy
Engel Beltre
the 5 guys for Teixeira (and Ron Mahay) are top 10 prospects on any team. Beltre is also, and as I said earlier, Gabbard and Murphy are major leaguers.
Just to belabor the point. Here are the top 11 Ranger prospects according to BP:
1. Neftali Feliz, RHP 2. Eric Hurley, RHP 3. Elvis Andrus, SS 4. Engel Beltre, OF 5. Michael Main, RHP 6. Chris Davis, 3B 7. Taylor Teagarden, C 8. Blake Beavan, RHP 9. Matt Harrison, RHP 10. Max Ramirez,
11. German Duran, 2B
Thats 3 guys from the Teixeira trade and the lone non-major leaguer from the Gagne trade.
And here are the Rangers top players under 25 including those who've lost their eligibility:
1. Jarrod Saltalamacchia, C 2. Neftali Feliz, RHP 3. Eric Hurley, RHP 4. Elvis Andrus, SS 5. Engel Beltre, OF 6. Michael Main, RHP 7. Chris Davis, 3B 8. Taylor Teagarden, C 9. Blake Beavan, RHP 10. Brandon McCarthy, RHP 11. Matt Harrison, LHP
This list includes 4 of the 5 products from the Teixeira trade plus Engel Beltre off of the Gagne trade.
doing a straight comparison of Teixeira and salty at the same ages:
Salty:
Age Year Level PA BA/ OBA/ SLG
18 2003 Rk 162 .239/.370/.396
19 2004 A 357 .272/.342/.437
20 2005 A+ 529 .314/.394/.519
21 2006 AA 377 .230/.353/.380
22 2007 AA 94 .309/.404/.617
22 2007 Maj 329 .266/.310/.422
Big Tex:
Age Year Level PA BA/ OBA/ SLG
22 2002 A+ 171 .320/.404/.593
22 2002 AA 196 .316/.403/.591
Not that any of us believes that Salty will hit like Big Tex going forward, but I doubt that whoever signs Mark Teixeira after this year will ask him to play Catcher.
Im wondering if
ML teams will ask Salty to play catcher if he can't do better than throwing out 8 guys in 45 attempts. Teixeira might be able to do better than that.
"Before I leave, I once again condemn the despicable buffoonery of D.J. Cahill." - Huck
so what you're saying is
our gaps at 1B, DH, LF, SP and an even better bullpen would be filled and we'd be on our way to a World Series showdown with the Mets...?
only problem is, I don't know if we'd have brought Kinsler up if Soriano was still here, meaning we would have poor 2B defense (I think it took the trade to get Soriano to realize he'd have to move to the outfield), we would still have a very poor farm system as the Teixeira trade brought us some huge pieces, we would not have Murphy, Gabbard or the one considered the best piece in Engel Beltre because Gagne would not have signed here if CoCo was still closing...
as I'm sad to see Adrian not DHing for us, I think the only player from that list that I'm going to miss and keep mentally kicking JD in the shins for is Chris Young. Now - we should've gotten something better in return for Soriano - and it would've been better to have acquired Manny instead of Soriano in the first place, but that's a completely different subject
"No, Donny, these men are nihilists, there's nothing to be afraid of."
by Walter Sobchak on Mar 28, 2008 11:48 AM CDT up reply actions
Frisco
I'll be there tomorrow. Hopefully the game isn't rained out again this year.
"When we're mad we'll use our words. Then the rest of the world will play nice with us. And the only boom-booms will be in our pants." - Ralph Wiggum
Dustin Moseley wins 5th spot
Halos Heaven weighs in ...
Those thinking that Moseley will not be so important to begin the 2008 campaign have obviously not closely examined the Angels schedule. The first three off days of the season (April 10, 21 and May 8) are all spaced to prohibit skipping the 5th starter until May 12th. That would give Moseley (or his replacement should Dustin be too terrible to bear) a MINIMUM of 7 starts (April 4, 9, 15, 20, 26, May 1, 6) before the staff could be expected to each pitch on normal rest and be able to skip the turn of the 5th starter. And those are plump assignments - 1 start against both Detroit and Cleveland, 4 games against AL West rivals (2 Vs. Texas, 1 each against Oakland and Seattle) and Kansas City on the road.
Man, it'd be real nice if the Angels got off to a craptacular start. It would at least make things more interesting for a while.
I hear you
I know that the Rangers contending is a pipe dream, but if they can get me through to August with hope, that would be great.
by badradiorules on Mar 28, 2008 10:15 AM CDT up reply actions
9. 1B Ben Broussard
If he is really a 9th in the order hitter, he needs to go, I would rather have Boggs and Mench then this waste of a roster spot...The rangers sure have confidence in him to have him batting 9th!
this is misleading
first of all - their reasoning for him at 9 instead of Laird's bat and "surprising speed" is to break up a streak of what would otherwise be 4 consecutive righties in the lineup, easy to game plan with relievers for...
second - who would you put at 9 other than Laird (who actually has a LOT of value to Ron Washington's plan of producing more runs and putting runners in scoring position with his bunting prowess (ok that may be overstated) or Broussard - Cat when he's in? No... Byrd? HELL no. David Murphy? Only reason I'd do that is to bring it back around to the # 1 spot with a good OBP/doubles hitter to set Kinsler and the rest of the lineup again, and I'd rather have a strong 1 - 5 of our lineup followed by a pretty respectable 6 and 7 hitter - which I think Byrd, Cat and Murphy will combine to be.
"No, Donny, these men are nihilists, there's nothing to be afraid of."
by Walter Sobchak on Mar 28, 2008 12:37 PM CDT up reply actions
1B should be manned by someone that can hit, and has power, and is a middle of the order bat
Bascially, if this is the answer at first base, it is no answer, and the GM didn't get the job done filling the position. I think anybody else the rangers have is better there then Broussard who can go pursue is spare musical career full time. Cat, Boggs, Mench, anyone!!! And I thought Wilkerson was bad, I would take him over this guy.
So who is that
Who was available this past winter that fits that mold? Nobody. We have a guy who does fit that mold but is no ready. He could be ready by the end of the year but it may take into next year. So if nobody fits your power hitting 1B mold why not go after a good defensive 1B who will only be here for 1 year.
Don't worry, SDKev...
Chris Davis will be here next year, possibly even sooner. Until then Broussard, as much as we here at LSB like to rag on him, is actually a decent stopgap.
The only thing I really don't like about Broussard is he's one of Ron's Chosen - and that means he'll get way more playing time than he deserves, as long as he's here. But I can put up with that by closing my eyes and thinking about Chris Davis hitting long drives in 2009.
Didn't you know that already
Did you honestly think he was our choice for the future? The writing was on the wall as soon as we traded for him.
Why...
is the Frisco game not on TV somewhere...??? That sucks!
I'd love for part of the "new look" to be a return to the red uniforms of the 1990s. - Ian Kinsler
Will Carroll Audio re: Josh Hamilton
Get the room quiet and turn up the sound because Will's voice is hard to hear. He's asked if Hambone's past drug use has enhanced his physical fragility. Scroll up to about the 12:15 mark for his answer.
http://www.nobiasbaseball.com/2008/03/podcast-will-carroll-of-baseball.html
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