OT:Avery Fired
by Escher on Apr 30, 2008 1:13 PM CDT
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PrintApparently it just happened, I can't find any official confirmation anywhere though.
Edit: Now being reported.
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Stupid having to get to the 75 work limit limit limit limit limit limit lim lim lim lim lim lim lim lim lim lim lim lim lim lim word word word word word word word word word word word word word word word word word word work a a a a a a a a a a a a word word word word word
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It's official
Ticket, quoting Stein is reporting it.
The writing was on the wall, but man—it doesn’t seem like ‘06 was that long ago.
Window for this group’s closed, though. That’s basketball, and that’s why Bob rightfully calls the NBA title the hardest to get in all sports.
NBA title hardest one to get?
It seems to me that most franchises are one Michael Jordan, or Tim Duncan, or one Kobe Bryant away from a ring. Its the sport thats most reliant on the one star player. One player isn’t going to put a baseball or football team over the top, but if you happen to be the horrible team with the ping pong ball in the right year, you can go from bad team to dynasty.
"Before I leave, I once again condemn the despicable buffoonery of D.J. Cahill." - Huck
Right.
You name Jordan, Duncan and Bryant. That’s fine.
Thing is, those are 3 of the greatest NBA players of all time. Those don’t come every year.
What—you think Bargnani or Bogut are going to lead their teams to titles?
by brettgardner on Apr 30, 2008 2:02 PM CDT up reply actions
Which
Does nothing to disprove my point.
The greatest players can dominate and it’s incredibly difficult for anyone else to win.
by brettgardner on Apr 30, 2008 2:42 PM CDT up reply actions
But any franchise
with a ping pong ball can get a great player. For all I know, Cleveland will be the next dominant franchise.
"Before I leave, I once again condemn the despicable buffoonery of D.J. Cahill." - Huck
You keep saying that
But it’s not borne out by the facts.
Who are the best players taken in the draft since Duncan?
Lebron? Didn’t win when he had a chance. Still time.
Wade? Lightning in a bottle. Penny Jr.
Anthony? Decent player, but Denver’s looking for a way to get rid of him.
Dirk? No explanation needed.
My point is, it does, despite popular belief, take more than a superstar. It’s not sufficient.
by brettgardner on Apr 30, 2008 2:54 PM CDT up reply actions
at which point
one has to ask what the point is of a sport that the team with the best player always wins is? Why even have 30 teams?
Also, great NBA players are obvious. There is no hard work involved in determining that your team should draft LeBron James or Tim Duncan first. Getting a superstar in the first pick requires being really bad (not hard), lucky in the lottery (not the same thing as hard), and lucky that there is a dynasty guy available (just luck, not hard).
Anyway Brett – just add the conditional “if you don’t have one of the premier players” to your statement and it’ll probably be accurate – because it isn’t easy to build a well balanced champion from scratch. Otherwise while its a very hard ring to come by if you , its a very, very easy ring to come by if you do have one of the great ones.
OK
Well why didn’t Kobe win without Shaq and the other great role players? How come Duncan hasn’t won every year? Dirk? Lebron? How do you explain Detroit?
There are plenty of examples in the NBA of the best players not winning rings. Barkley, Malone, Stockton and Payton all come to mind immediately.
Why not ask Malone and Payton if it’s easy? They latched onto the greatest player in the game to win their ring, and they couldn’t do it.
by brettgardner on Apr 30, 2008 3:01 PM CDT up reply actions
this is such a weird argument
why didn’t shaq win every year – because the other superstar won that year. obviously the rule isn’t that being a sueprstar = win because if there’s more than one superstar, something’s gotta give.
but besides detroit, superstars have dominated the league.
of course, you could make a strong case that SA isn’t so much a one superstar team.
Rare Gnats Sex
I don't think you understood my point.
I’m not saying that superstars don’t win, just that they’re only the necessary condition.
You need other guys around them to win, and that’s the hard part.
by brettgardner on Apr 30, 2008 3:09 PM CDT up reply actions
Obviously it isn't as easy
as just having a superstar and then you win. You’re right that a lot of great players go ring-less.
But having one of the top two or three players in the game makes it a lot easier to win than not (more so than other sports). And my argument is that getting one of the top two or three players is mostly luck.
And my point was that luck is not the same thing as hard. My only issue is with saying that it is harder to win an NBA title than any other title. Its a weak claim because yuo can make that argument about any championship for any number of reasons.
didnt the celtics just build a well balanced contender in a single day?
thats seems pretty easy.
.500 or bust!
Bad Vibes Kill Rallies!
"Well, we are one of the cheapest teams in Major League Baseball"
-Tom Hicks 4/8/2008
"NBA title the hardest to get in all sports."
this comment makes no sense.
Why is it harder? Because you can build a team of stars that dominates the regular season and lose in the playoffs? What about the Eagles with McNabb? Or the Indians in the ‘90s or Mariners in the early 2000s? Because you only get 2 or 3 years to win after you build a team? Football is even more like that now than basketball is.
One can say baseball is harder because only 8 teams make the playoffs any given year. No sneaking into the playoffs on a sub-500 record there.
One can say football is the hardest because a single off game in the playoffs knocks you out. You can have a bad game in basketball or baseball and come back and win
One can say hockey is the hardest because it is almost impossible to keep your entire team healthy in pursuit of the Cup
Small Sample Size
I think the fact that only a handful of teams have won the NBA Championship over the last 20+ years has something to do with the premise. Same teams seem to repeat with their basic core group.
I'd rather be Blind, Crippled, & Crazy
hardest
That would be either English Premier League title the Spanish la Liga, if we’re not excluding international soccer.
But that river of tears has dried for all of us.
No
Sorry I wasn’t clear. I meant, you know, sports that were actually interesting and good. Sorry again. I mean, I’m sure the bowling championship is difficult to get as well, but…well, who’s watching?
by brettgardner on Apr 30, 2008 2:06 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
-1
get some culture brett. Single table balanced schedule no playoffs best record wins it all.
nothing is harder in pro sports….
.500 or bust!
Bad Vibes Kill Rallies!
"Well, we are one of the cheapest teams in Major League Baseball"
-Tom Hicks 4/8/2008
-1
Winning a golf major is the hardest thing in pro sports. Get some culter Jay :)
by Dirk Diggler on Apr 30, 2008 2:13 PM CDT up reply actions
shes a mule
.500 or bust!
Bad Vibes Kill Rallies!
"Well, we are one of the cheapest teams in Major League Baseball"
-Tom Hicks 4/8/2008
She doesn't get raped
nearly enough.
"Before I leave, I once again condemn the despicable buffoonery of D.J. Cahill." - Huck
Wow!
And people are upset about what was said to Gordon’s wife?
I'd rather be Blind, Crippled, & Crazy
the difference is
that cahill probably isn’t expecting coulter’s husband not to be mad
Rare Gnats Sex
Yep,
I won’t be crying like a bitch if she has me banned from all of her media events.
"Before I leave, I once again condemn the despicable buffoonery of D.J. Cahill." - Huck
I have no idea
who that is. I guess my cultural references are getting outdated.
"Before I leave, I once again condemn the despicable buffoonery of D.J. Cahill." - Huck
very clayton williams of you
.500 or bust!
Bad Vibes Kill Rallies!
"Well, we are one of the cheapest teams in Major League Baseball"
-Tom Hicks 4/8/2008
Thanks, Cahill
I now have a new sig line.
re: Ann Coulter - "She doesn't get raped nearly enough." - DJ Cahill
Got me Longhorn...
I’m a far left liberal, and proud of it.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
L O L
"I hope it's a special dumb person hell so that I don’t have to meet up with you after I die."
- The D-tron
by inactive lsb user on Apr 30, 2008 8:49 PM CDT up reply actions
Culture?
So latching on to a team that you have no affiliation with across the ocean, seemingly for the express purpose of being the badass in your group of friends who cares about soccer is culture?
Oh OK. Well I’ll just visit Europe. You can pretend to be European if that’s your thing. Either way, neither of us are “cultured”.
by brettgardner on Apr 30, 2008 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions
i support my local (see my avatar)
i watch the best athletes in the world, whether its deion or tom brady, or MJ or Magic or Arod or whatever. ignorance just for sake of continent is sweet.
take a big drink full!
.500 or bust!
Bad Vibes Kill Rallies!
"Well, we are one of the cheapest teams in Major League Baseball"
-Tom Hicks 4/8/2008
You know
I’ve been calling for his head since the trade, but actually reading it makes me feel bad for the guy.
Still, it had to be done. He’ll get another coaching job and hopefully this experience has humbled him some.
Picking a random blog comment and wielding it as a club to bash "blogs" is like picking a random romance novel off an airport bookstore shelf and saying, "This book sucks. Fuck you, Tolstoy -- your medium is worthless!" - Ken Tremendous
haha + 1
They can get in some old batalack and do the Thelma and Louise thing across country.
The "Electrician" was born 7/16/07 11:53 PM EDT
http://www.lonestarball.com/2007/7/16/213154/893
happy/scared
I have been wanting this to happen for two months. But now that Cuban has done it, I’m worried about what’s going to happen.
Speculation Time...
Now that Avery is officially gone, it’s time to start speculating on who the next coach of the Mavs will be…..
I’ll say Jeff Van Gundy
Thoughts?
The more I think about it
I’m against Van Gundy, for many of the reasons proffered by Adam in another thread. Too similar. I honestly think Carlisle is the right guy.
My other candidates:
Hubie (ancient)
Lowe (probably not going anywhere)
Johnny Davis
Iavaroni (when he gets fired)
by brettgardner on Apr 30, 2008 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions
adam said that jeff van gundy was controlling
and said little else. controlling in a vaccum is not a bad quality to have. controlling and not being a very good coach is a bad quality to have
Rare Gnats Sex
Look
I want a real coach in here in the worst way. No more Averys or Jacksons. So from that standpoint, he’d be good.
Being controlling is not necessarily a bad thing. You’re absolutely right about that. But when it gets to the point of alienating your players, it is most definitely a bad thing. That’s what Avery has done, and that’s what Van Gundy has done.
That being said, if he ends up the guy, I certainly won’t cry myself to sleep.
by brettgardner on Apr 30, 2008 3:05 PM CDT up reply actions
alienating players
i guess I don’t know the specific allegations against him but I dont’ think this mavericks teams is all that susceptible to that. I think Avery was a really really extreme case. read this. Avery comes off as a lunatic
Rare Gnats Sex
Fill me in.
"I hope it's a special dumb person hell so that I don’t have to meet up with you after I die."
- The D-tron
by inactive lsb user on Apr 30, 2008 8:52 PM CDT up reply actions
hah
i actually don’t know. but my point is that there must be a reason he hasn’t landed a head coaching job in a long time. i just think it’s weird for someoen like him to have such long gaps in between head coaching positions
Rare Gnats Sex
It looks like...
Cronos, father of Zeus in ancient Greek mythology. Hard to tell though. Can’t see the whole pic.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
Ahh...
for some reason when I read your post I saw Satan, not Saturn…
You are correct sir, but I refuse to call any of the Gods by their Roman or Latin names. Bastards should have some up with their own religion in antiquity instead of just stealing the Greeks. :)
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
every1 on espn is saying
dantoni or however you spell it is out in PHX and thats the guy we’ll go after.
.500 or bust!
Bad Vibes Kill Rallies!
"Well, we are one of the cheapest teams in Major League Baseball"
-Tom Hicks 4/8/2008
Nope.
Why would we do that? We’ve already had Nellie-ball here. Didn’t work.
by brettgardner on Apr 30, 2008 2:38 PM CDT up reply actions
change of pace
from the point guard over controlling, every play dictating moron of a coach we just fired…
but dont ask me ask the NBA Pundits who are saying it, according to espn when it was announced d’antoni was the guy they go after if PHX fired him
.500 or bust!
Bad Vibes Kill Rallies!
"Well, we are one of the cheapest teams in Major League Baseball"
-Tom Hicks 4/8/2008
D'antoni
Was a PG too, and rumors have been blowing about in Phoenix for years that he and Nash don’t see eye to eye, to put it nicely.
I can think of maybe 2-3 basketball guys at ESPN who have respectable opinions.
by brettgardner on Apr 30, 2008 2:44 PM CDT up reply actions
He does.
He seems like the kind of guy who’s miserable when he’s doing what he loves, but even more miserable when he’s not.
by brettgardner on Apr 30, 2008 3:37 PM CDT up reply actions
now
if he can just undo the jkidd trade
and get rid of howard for a bag of shit
That trade kills
because the most likely way to build a winner, is to have ping pong balls in a year where a stud comes out.
"Before I leave, I once again condemn the despicable buffoonery of D.J. Cahill." - Huck
Not necessarily true any more
See: Lakers and Celtics.
It’s become a FA league.
I'd rather be Blind, Crippled, & Crazy
if you happen to be a celtics or lakers
oh by the way ignore the fact that both teams were given “gift trades” that 20 other teams woulda done in a second but for some reason the NBA and its perennial franchises end up with them…
naw its not fixed… nothing to look at, move along. just a coincidence…
hey look its koby or garnett holding up the trophy…
.500 or bust!
Bad Vibes Kill Rallies!
"Well, we are one of the cheapest teams in Major League Baseball"
-Tom Hicks 4/8/2008
Sorry
But just dumb, inaccurate, “drive-by” NBA stuff right there.
by brettgardner on Apr 30, 2008 3:02 PM CDT up reply actions
ummm
you really believe that 2 teams that happen to be the biggest franchises in the sport and also happened to not stand a chance in hell in making the playoffs before the the draft and before this season, and are now the favorites to win the title is simply coincidence?
give me some of what ur smoking…
.500 or bust!
Bad Vibes Kill Rallies!
"Well, we are one of the cheapest teams in Major League Baseball"
-Tom Hicks 4/8/2008
they still might not
giving up Al and Jeff Green is definitely going to hurt them in the long run…
They are having huge problems with the Hawks right now, terrible matchup problems…
just got ownaged
Hawks...
have really impressed me, but I think the Celtics will be ok and still take it in 6.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
Thing is
You can’t evaluate those things in a vacuum. You have to look at what Boston gave up. Look at what Minnesota got. Not bad, Nicholas—not bad.
by brettgardner on Apr 30, 2008 3:11 PM CDT up reply actions
control+Z cuban
Every loss is one step closer to the top of the draft in 2009!
by knockoutking on Apr 30, 2008 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions
Hilarious!
I couldn’t have thought of that if I tried!
"I hope it's a special dumb person hell so that I don’t have to meet up with you after I die."
- The D-tron
by inactive lsb user on Apr 30, 2008 8:55 PM CDT up reply actions
Sam Vincent
Anyone? Was a Mavs assistant so the players may like him and know him. I think either he or DAntoni should be the ones.
Well
Apparently he started butting heads with players and management from the very beginning with Charlotte. Maybe there’s a lot more to the story, but do we really need that again?
by brettgardner on Apr 30, 2008 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions
Interesting
Bayless and Chadia both seem to think that Avery wanted Devin Harris to stay and he did not want Kidd…
just got ownaged
yeah
Bayless (i hate the dood but he knows Dallas sports) said that AJ was trying to mold Harris the way he was and he hated when they brought Kidd in because he thought that undermined his authority…
I guess i always assumed it was AJ who wanted Kidd, was that ever confirmed by DFW media?
just got ownaged
and really
this doesn’t make sense at all. even harris seemed to be happy that he was out from under AJ’s thumb
Rare Gnats Sex
Avery said
after the playoffs.
"He’s relentless, he’s strong, he’s intelligent, he has a bright future," Johnson said of Paul. "He and his coach have great chemistry. And he seems like he’s very coachable and he pretty much dominated us this series."
I would infer that he is talking about someone on the team thats not coachable who he has bad chemistry with.
"Before I leave, I once again condemn the despicable buffoonery of D.J. Cahill." - Huck
I wouldn't
You’re reading too much into that. He’s just complimenting the new flavor-of-the-month because everybody is asking about him. Hold on, I think I hear Dwyane Wade calling…
by brettgardner on Apr 30, 2008 3:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Just one?
or 15 of them; so says Avery.
by robert_d_wilfong on Apr 30, 2008 3:15 PM CDT up reply actions
I guess this means
that JD/Nolan won’t fire Wash today. Oh well.
by robert_d_wilfong on Apr 30, 2008 3:20 PM CDT reply actions
Who was behind the Kidd trade?
Avery is on ESPN Radio a calling Devin Harris “his son” Also said he was a borderline all-star this year. Then admitted that he should have handed the team to Devin much earlier. Is Avery trying to deflect all the attention off of him from being the bad guy and blame it on Cuban or is he telling the truth?
Yeah,
Avery admitted that he screwed up with Harris, basically said that the Kidd trade was bad.
Also said that he told the players no partying during the playoffs, and Josh Howard handed out party flyers.
Howard the next guy to go?
I love Miley Cyrus.
that's what i would like to know
especially after this morning when Chadia and Bayless were saying that Avery didn’t want Kidd…
just got ownaged
He didn't trust
Harris running the team, he wanted Kidd.
Don’t need a link for that.
I love Miley Cyrus.
yup
definitely remember the whole deal where at the beginning of the season he was all high on harris, then like less than a month into the season he took away all his play calling and made sure that he (the lil general) called every play as it went down the court. it was a big deal and im sure there is a link somewhere to that stuff.
if u dont have faith in your play calling of your point guard, he might as well be gone.
funny thing is, he did the exact same thing with kid. i just think he is terrible awful awful at coaching point guards on the court.
.500 or bust!
Bad Vibes Kill Rallies!
"Well, we are one of the cheapest teams in Major League Baseball"
-Tom Hicks 4/8/2008
good to get the MS take
.500 or bust!
Bad Vibes Kill Rallies!
"Well, we are one of the cheapest teams in Major League Baseball"
-Tom Hicks 4/8/2008
But
Do you want to see him suffer?
He’s my favorite athlete. I want him here, but I also want him to win, if for no other reason than to shut up all the soft commentary.
by brettgardner on Apr 30, 2008 5:02 PM CDT up reply actions
If the best
Dirk is able to get is the trades you posted last night, I want him here. I see no place to trade Dirk where the return would justify trading him. You retool and see what happens next year. You can’t blow this thing up by trading Dirk.
im pretty sure
the only possible way to blow this up is to trade dirk.
.500 or bust!
Bad Vibes Kill Rallies!
"Well, we are one of the cheapest teams in Major League Baseball"
-Tom Hicks 4/8/2008
You
Can, but unless you’re getting back an Al Jefferson or Aldridge or some other quality young player, in addition to picks and cap relief, then I’d save him as the last chip.
Any team that wants him is probably not going to have great picks, may or may not have a young stud, but probably can provide relief, so that’s what you’ll take. Of all the trades I thought of, the GS one is the one I’d like to do the most, even if it means we keep him in the West. Getting back Belinelli and Wright is a good way to get this thing on the right track.
Like it or not, though, if this thing blows, there’s not going to be a whole lot left standing. Josh is as good as gone. Terry too, as a salary match probably. Doubtful Kidd is, but who knows? Damp certainly isn’t unless he’s forced into a trade for a similarly gigantic contract with maybe a year less on it.
Dirk with 4 college guys isn’t all that great for anyone.
by brettgardner on Apr 30, 2008 5:43 PM CDT up reply actions
Also
For what it’s worth, I really appreciate Stack’s loyalty to Avery and his refusal to lay the blame at his feet.
MacMahon’s recent post really paints it well. Also, I have no doubt that Stackhouse will be a coach very soon.
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