Friday a.m. things
A lot of stuff today in the S-T about Nolan Ryan, with his former team coming to town...
Jeff Wilson has a piece in the S-T that includes an odd quote from Tom Hicks:
Said Hicks: "Some of the mistakes J.D. made in trades we wouldn't have made had Nolan been at the table. I don't think we'll have to worry about that again."
Here's what I don't get...why? We have this cryptic statement from Hicks, saying Nolan would have prevented mistakes...but how? It is as if Hicks is viewing Nolan as some sort of baseball savior, for whatever reason...
And that Hicks quote seems to show a distinct lack of confidence in Jon Daniels...
Gil LeBreton, meanwhile, seems to be taking a veiled shot at some of his colleagues at the S-T:
Ryan's playing career spanned 27 seasons. He understands the big picture.
I can't imagine that he'd let a botched trade, a misjudged draft choice or a rash in-game decision from the dugout persuade him to fire someone. That game is best left to the newspaper columnists and talk-show callers.
Some of them apparently are disappointed by that. Good. Let Ryan's patience be the enduring lesson of these first 100 days.
He came back to Arlington, after all, with no apparent agenda, other than to learn the new job and undertake the daunting challenge. His neutrality is refreshing.
Still, it seems clear that Ron Washington was close to losing his job. Evan Grant has a lengthy piece about an April 25 meeting among some team leaders that led to the team's turnaround, and how the Rangers have been more efficient both on the mound and at the plate during this streak.
There's also a piece in the S-T about Scott Feldman's progress, and his incorporation of a four-seam fastball that breaks away from righthanders into his repertoire, to go with a two-seamer that breaks in to righties.
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Positive Spin
I guess the only way to put some positive spin on the Hicks quote is to assume that Ryan would provide a “checks and balance” system over the moves Daniels wants to make. Of course Ryan is not infalible.
by Excel Hearts Choi on May 16, 2008 8:51 AM CDT 0 recs
I don't think...
...Hicks ever thinks before he opens his mouth, and as a result, even the best spin on his ridiculous comments at times do no good. He really loves to throw people under the bus. Just go ask anyone in Liverpool.
by FuturePants on
May 16, 2008 9:39 AM CDT
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Ryan
I think its more along the lines of Ryan would provide a buffer zone between Hicks and Daniels so when Hicks says he wants to win now Ryan can talk some sense into him before he forces his GM, brand new at the time, to make a bad move
by bigsteve on
May 16, 2008 9:41 AM CDT
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A baseball man
is what they needed all along. Now they have one. Everyone should be happy.
It’ll be better now.
All Aboard Von Ryan's Express!
by Clueless on
May 16, 2008 12:40 PM CDT
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I've come to be very wary of those who are called "baseball men."
Especially when it comes to front office things.
by philkid3 on
May 16, 2008 12:57 PM CDT
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To be fair
JD has had some bad moves, mostly because he wasn’t strong enough to stand up to his manager’s (i.e., Buck).
I still say that Nolan’s presence empowers JD as much as it weakens him.
by JBImaknee on
May 16, 2008 10:19 AM CDT
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I don't think anyone disagrees that JD has made some bad moves.
The problem for me, and I think others, is that Hicks basically threw him under the bus publicly, and he also said something that deserves more explination than it would seem to have been given.
by philkid3 on
May 16, 2008 10:20 AM CDT
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hicks
and its not the first, nor will it be the last time hicks does this.
the man needs to realize he should stay out of the press and keep his mouth shut. as someone said, look at the mess he’s created in liverpool by putting his foot in his mouth
"When we're mad we'll use our words. Then the rest of the world will play nice with us. And the only boom-booms will be in our pants." - Ralph Wiggum
by rentz on
May 16, 2008 10:22 AM CDT
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Is there
any proof that JD wasn’t willing to stand up to Buck or this just speculation?
Not the only black poster on LSB.
by sprite on
May 16, 2008 10:26 AM CDT
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While he hasn't said it
He has said that he had the wrong people in his ear when making, for example, the San Diego trade.
by venturafearsnolan on
May 16, 2008 10:58 AM CDT
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Of course....
there seems to be a similar problem in the Broussard trade.
At least, we only gave up Hulett for him….
R
by Requiem on
May 16, 2008 2:39 PM CDT
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I wonder
If that is a hint that talent evaluation problems are with one or two MLB or amateur scouts, notably on the West Coast? Probably not, and there may be only a weak coincidental connection. NM.
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang (1844-1912)
by Ed Coffin on
May 16, 2008 4:29 PM CDT
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I wonder
how many “insiders” were involved with the San Diego trade? In my opinion, Jon was a little intiminated by the baseball guys or perhaps thought they knew more than they really did. I think now that with a trade of that magnitude, after all the talking was done, Nolan would get with Jon by himself and asked what Jon wanted to do and why? I may be naive but I really don’t think Nolan is trying to elbow Jon aside but rather help him where he can to make the Rangers a better team.
by Jea103 on
May 16, 2008 5:30 PM CDT
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+1
I think it was meant as a PR confidence builder in Ryan than a slam on JD, but it was worded horribly. Hicks has no talent for words.
by rooster on
May 16, 2008 11:40 AM CDT
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Hicks
I’ve tried to stay neutral on the guy, but for me, that has to be one of the most ass comments I’ve seen from him in a while. Dunno, I think I officially hate Hicks now.
by rcreative on May 16, 2008 8:54 AM CDT 0 recs
Hicks
these are the types of things that make me really wish he’d sell the team. He just doesn’t know when to keep his mouth shut. There is no reason at all to say such a thing, and guys like norm hitzges need to get as upset about these statements as they did about jd saying washingtons job was secure until the asb (another poor thing to say).
This is an indication to me that daniels is either on his way out, or is losing a large majority of any power he had.
"When we're mad we'll use our words. Then the rest of the world will play nice with us. And the only boom-booms will be in our pants." - Ralph Wiggum
by rentz on
May 16, 2008 9:01 AM CDT
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I've pretty much given up
On the notion that Hicks might sell the team. And I’m too poor to go make him an offer he can’t refuse :) That said, there is also no way to keep his malaprops out of the news unless reporters just stop asking him questions. It’s gotten to the point where his credibility is threatened by that other great spokesperson Anonymous Source.
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang (1844-1912)
by Ed Coffin on
May 16, 2008 11:33 AM CDT
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Anyone have a ballpark figure
on how much the total package would cost?
by cmkelly29 on
May 16, 2008 11:38 AM CDT
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Ballpark $
Just guesswork, and done a little over a year ago. $333 million (although that’s below the Forbes asset evaluation) directly to Hicks, plus pick up about $120 million in contractual obligations outside salaries, plus about $90 million for future obligations to keep the MLB asset/debt valuation ratio in line. Throw in about $100 million for ongoing operations cover until revenue surpasses debt and a new buyer should come to the table with $640 million.
Not pocket change.
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang (1844-1912)
by Ed Coffin on
May 16, 2008 12:05 PM CDT
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hmmm
can we start passing a boot around at ranger games to collect money to buy the team?
"When we're mad we'll use our words. Then the rest of the world will play nice with us. And the only boom-booms will be in our pants." - Ralph Wiggum
by rentz on
May 16, 2008 2:17 PM CDT
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Alright so...
IOU’s just aren’t going to cut it.
Looks like long hours with the think-tank (again) tonight. They’re not going to be happy.
by cmkelly29 on
May 16, 2008 2:30 PM CDT
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Welcome to the club!!
The "Electrician" was born 7/16/07 11:53 PM EDT
http://www.lonestarball.com/2007/7/16/213154/893
by LAMuscleFag on
May 16, 2008 11:27 AM CDT
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"Some of the mistakes J.D. made in trades we wouldn't have made had Nolan been at the table. I don't think we'll have to worry about that again."
Oh man. That bugs me. A ton. The owner publicly coming out and basically saying he’s had to hire a baby sitter to keep tabs on the active GM does not smack to me of an organization that’s got its sh** together.
And, as Adam said: how, exactly?
by philkid3 on May 16, 2008 9:06 AM CDT 0 recs
I think it's pretty simple actually
JD is young, sometimes you don’t want to say no in your first year or 2 on the job to someone who’s been in the league for a long time and is respected, for the most part, around the league. But, Nolan would have said, “Buck, just shut the fuck up and let JD do his job!”...
"Popularity is fleeting. … Principles are forever." - George W. Bush
by Longhorn on
May 16, 2008 9:22 AM CDT
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agreed
I think this is an example of a quote that needs more context than we are being gven. I think Hicks is merely saying that Nolan would have provided JD a better opportunity to learn on the job by providing guidance. It doesn’t sound great but I think it is all much ado about nothing.
by spliffy on
May 16, 2008 9:28 AM CDT
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Haha...
Hicks is always trying to brew controversy…
What an idiot.
Say your sorry to Ron Washington
by miles on May 16, 2008 9:20 AM CDT 0 recs
You know
I truly think he tries to say something either complimentary or prideful, and it just comes out with garbled meaning.
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang (1844-1912)
by Ed Coffin on
May 16, 2008 4:31 PM CDT
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yeah
it’s hard to say something complimentary when you have a foot in your mouth
"When we're mad we'll use our words. Then the rest of the world will play nice with us. And the only boom-booms will be in our pants." - Ralph Wiggum
by rentz on
May 16, 2008 5:57 PM CDT
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This is why I knew I'd hate the Nolan hire
This guy is going to take credit for everything that’s positive while receiving none of the blame. It’s not just Hicks either. This morning on the Ticket George Dunham was talking about what Nolan has done and had the nerve to say: “I think it’s Nolan that had the patience to keep Washington on.” I was so mad I turned off my radio. Nolan is the one who was fighting to fire him! It was JD that was fighting for Wash, since it was his hire. We know that it was Nolan who wanted him gone since Hicks said “Wash was very close to being fired.” We know anything that comes out of Hicks’ mouth is what is being whispered in his ear by Nolan.
No one is perfect (even Nolan), and every GM is expected to make at least one mistake. Especially when he is the youngest GM ever. That’s part of the growing pains that you should have expected to endure when you hired him. Can we please chalk up Young/AGon as a mistake and stop talking about it. Please, cut this bull about Nolan wouldn’t have done the trade. We don’t know if he would have or not. It’s irrelevant. I AM PISSED
Picking a random blog comment and wielding it as a club to bash "blogs" is like picking a random romance novel off an airport bookstore shelf and saying, "This book sucks. Fuck you, Tolstoy -- your medium is worthless!" - Ken Tremendous
by TheBZA on May 16, 2008 9:37 AM CDT 0 recs
Had to get it out of my system
I feel much better now, haha.
Picking a random blog comment and wielding it as a club to bash "blogs" is like picking a random romance novel off an airport bookstore shelf and saying, "This book sucks. Fuck you, Tolstoy -- your medium is worthless!" - Ken Tremendous
by TheBZA on
May 16, 2008 10:39 AM CDT
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Maybe I should try that then.
Because I sure don’t.
by philkid3 on
May 16, 2008 11:06 AM CDT
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It's Friday
you could start drinking …
"I hope it's a special dumb person hell so that I don’t have to meet up with you after I die."
- The D-tron
by Chase Irwin on
May 16, 2008 12:36 PM CDT
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Party-Time
All the Time!!!
...it's the weekend, so why the hell not?
by Rodney on
May 16, 2008 4:55 PM CDT
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I don't care who gets the credit...
...if they can win a world series. I really could not care. I just want the title.
by FuturePants on
May 16, 2008 9:43 AM CDT
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I agree
I just don’t want to see JD fired for the wrong reasons due to a power struggle.
Picking a random blog comment and wielding it as a club to bash "blogs" is like picking a random romance novel off an airport bookstore shelf and saying, "This book sucks. Fuck you, Tolstoy -- your medium is worthless!" - Ken Tremendous
by TheBZA on
May 16, 2008 10:39 AM CDT
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Multiple Opinions
I think it is good to have multiple, intelligent opinions surrounding the GM. I really don’t know what Ryan’s baseball IQ is, but it sounds like he won’t be dragging this team down. Levine seems to be a bright guy as well. San Diego has done a good job of this, having Sandy Alderson, Grady Fuson, and Paul DePodesta around Kevin Towers. However, you never see a Padres article portraying Alderson will a disproportionate amount of authority. Hard to believe that Towers is the longest tenured GM in baseball. I wonder how much a role guys like Fuson and DePodesta play in his success?
by Excel Hearts Choi on
May 16, 2008 9:49 AM CDT
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I think if Nolan
had wanted Washington gone, he would have been gone. Not saying this would have been good, bad or whatever, just the way things would have been..
by Jea103 on
May 16, 2008 10:40 AM CDT
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+1
I can’t stand listening to the morning guys “talk” baseball. Neither of them seem to know anything insightful about the game. At least Rhyner followed baseball enough that he has some decent knowledge. He comes across as stereotypical sports media sometimes (I say this due to a rant he went on about sports bloggers when they were doing the compound), but for the most part he’s pretty sharp. I think he overreacts to the team a lot, but that’s to be expected of a major media market personality.
It just bugs the hell out of me when the morning show guys pretend to be baseball fans.
by jwiscarson on
May 16, 2008 10:53 AM CDT
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it's their job to create negative spin...
...it keeps them working.
just like Jeff Wilson printing this useless dialogue.
i’m surprised people still care what Tom Hicks has to say.
Vicente Padilla is... EL TORO!
by oc on
May 16, 2008 2:14 PM CDT
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Washington
was going to be fired by JD, a move that would’ve added to his portfolio of mistakes, and Nolan stopped him. Ryan probably saved JD’s job.
And just because he’s the youngest GM doesn’t give him a license to screw up at-will…that’s just wrong
I just want to watch a contender.
So why the unconditional defense of Daniels by everyone here? I don’t get it?
Don’t you guys want to watch a contender, too…or just be proud of having the youngest GM in the majors? Any trophies for that?
All Aboard Von Ryan's Express!
by Clueless on
May 16, 2008 12:47 PM CDT
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Huh?
Washington was going to be fired by JD, a move that would’ve added to his portfolio of mistakes, and Nolan stopped him.
What is that statement based on?
by Adam J. Morris on
May 16, 2008 1:08 PM CDT
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if anything
the quotes ive seent that 2 of the top brass wanted to have wash fired and JD saying he is a wash man would seem to indicate it was nolan/hicks that wanted wash gone and JD trying to keep him.
Gerald Laird is my hero.
by DSheppard on
May 16, 2008 1:37 PM CDT
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Nice
screen name…
...it's the weekend, so why the hell not?
by Rodney on
May 16, 2008 5:14 PM CDT
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jd
in my opinion, Jon Daniels is a Fantasy League GM that got lucky.
¡yo soy Horsedooty!
I soloed in the mile high club.
by Sr Horsedooty on May 16, 2008 9:45 AM CDT 0 recs
Lucky?
He’s made mistakes - and owned up to them. He followed his owner’s (and his staff’s) desire to go for it early one to disastrous results - and didn’t duck any blame. He rebuilt the farm system in dramatic fashion—and gave most of the credit to his scouting and draft teams. He has an owner that continually throws him under the bus, and he’s in a no-win situation with a TX legend above him in Ryan who will get all the credit if the Rangers turn into a winner. How exactly is he lucky?
Unlike most fans, I do not have ridiculously unrealistic expectations of my GM. I expect him to take risks and make mistakes while adhering to a plan. Daniels is doing that while acting like a man in accepting responsibility for mistakes and liberally doling out credit to his underlings when things go well. This is the kind of leader you want.
...and curse Sir Walter Raleigh, he was such a stupid git.
by t ball on
May 16, 2008 9:55 AM CDT
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Just my interpretation
but he means lucky that he got the job in the first place. On other words, he just happened to be at the right place at the right time kind of thing.
I disagree, but that is my take on Sr Horsedooty comments.
I think that he has learned a lot and the one year turn around in the farm system and especially the outfield should not be overlooked.
Danks, Volquez, Galarraga and Young are GONE! GET OVER IT! Endless whining will not bring them back!
by LBBRangerFan on
May 16, 2008 10:33 AM CDT
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If that's his point
then I agree, lucky to have the opportunity. If that’s the case I guess my rant will just serve a different purpose: rebutting the inevitable Josey Wales post saying Hicks is right.
...and curse Sir Walter Raleigh, he was such a stupid git.
by t ball on
May 16, 2008 10:41 AM CDT
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Allow me!
Hicks may not be right, but he is clearly saying that he realizes that when he hired him, JD was in over his head. He was unqualified for the job AT THE TIME, but Hicks was playing it on-the-cheap and was training him for the GM position. Nobody would admit that or say it out. As a matter of fact, everytime that I stated such here (or anyone else), I was lambasted as a JD-hater.
Never the case…I was just stating what Hicks has now confirmed publicly.
I’ve always contended that, instead of constantly defending Daniels for his every move, his proponents should be willing to accept criticism and admit that he is an “intern” that was foisted on the Rangers at a critical time, and that Hicks’s move set the progress of the on-field Rangers back at least two years.
I think he’s done a good job rebuilding the farm system, and I think that he’s probably NOW serviceable, so it’s a little too late to keep bombarding him…but it wasn’t before.
All Aboard Von Ryan's Express!
by Clueless on
May 16, 2008 12:37 PM CDT
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Ever stop to think that...
...maybe Hicks comments were not bashing JD but admitting he made a mistake. I know its hard to believe but thats how I read them. Going back to when the trade was made JD was brand new, was left with a horrendous pitching staff, and was told, by Hicks, his goal was to put a contender on the field. Buck had Hicks’ ear and used his power to push for the trade of Young. The way I read that statement is that had a guy like Nolan been in place the pressure may not have gotten to JD and we may not have made that trade.
Part of this line of thinking is I can’t believe Nolan is actually doing any hands on work in terms of roster management. He may be throwing out ideas and giving suggestions, which may or may not be acted upon, but I have a hard time believing he is sitting there telling JD what to do.
by bigsteve on
May 16, 2008 12:56 PM CDT
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Methinks you protest too much.
I don’t hate JD…Why do you hate Nolan?
Admitting he made a mistake…in hiring JD?
You’re talking about “a” trade? A trade?
He’s not telling JD what to do…he’s helping him better understand baseball and baseball talent…which encompasses more than statistics.
I thi9nk it’s great…and long overdue.
All Aboard Von Ryan's Express!
by Clueless on
May 16, 2008 7:42 PM CDT
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Lambasted
If all of your posts were this long and reasoned you would not be “lambasted”. I might agree that Daniels was hired too early in his career for the job, but:
1. It’s still a bad idea for Hicks to publicly say, not in so many words, that his GM now has a minder to keep him honest.
2. Nolan Ryan is just as capable of making bad decisions as anyone else and we have ZERO proof of his ability to judge a trade proposal or evaluate talent.
3. A lot of your posts are pretty short and sweet and often say little more than “JD sucks and everyone hates me because I say so”.
I do not defend Daniels’ every move and I can’t think of anyone here who does. Why do you feel that anyone who tries to have a nuanced opinion of Daniels is doing so?
Daniels has problems with roster management, had some early problems with confidence in trade discussions and dealing with his manager and owner, and may have some problems with trying too hard to catch lightning in a bottle with signings like Broussard and Jennings. See? I think he has weaknesses. But all in all I think he has a better chance of any GM since Grieve to load this organization with the talent necessary to contend long term.
...and curse Sir Walter Raleigh, he was such a stupid git.
by t ball on
May 16, 2008 1:00 PM CDT
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Logical & Well Reasoned, t ball
OMG….you aren’t another lawyer are you??!
;)
...it's the weekend, so why the hell not?
by Rodney on
May 16, 2008 5:22 PM CDT
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Fair enough, t ball.
All Aboard Von Ryan's Express!
by Clueless on
May 16, 2008 7:27 PM CDT
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As soon as I'm well-reasoned,
All Aboard Von Ryan's Express!
by Clueless on
May 16, 2008 7:29 PM CDT
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WTF
It keeps posting prematurely…
t ball…agree with #1 and #2, but I rarely just say “JD sucks”, unless it’s in reply to someone saying “JD does no wrong”....and, contrary to your statement that nobody here says that, I say that many, many here say that. He is viewed as a ‘wunderkind”, and any criticism is met with fierce and demeaning resistance. I don’t react well to such…same as you…and I counter. Anyway, I don’t hate the guy, and I think he has done some…some…things well. But he is very expendable. And to emphasize my position, read above the post that displays anger at the fact that Nolan might now get credit for turning things around…and how that pisses him off. I think that is the majority opinion.
I just want to finally watch a contender in Arlington, and I don’t care how it happens.
All Aboard Von Ryan's Express!
by Clueless on
May 16, 2008 7:38 PM CDT
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interpretation
LBBRangerFan,
yep, thanks for the comment and that is exactly what I meant and I stand by that comment.
¡yo soy Horsedooty!
I soloed in the mile high club.
by Sr Horsedooty on
May 16, 2008 11:22 AM CDT
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tball
Might want to save that to a .doc file and paste it whenever you see a “Daniels Sucks” post.
Picking a random blog comment and wielding it as a club to bash "blogs" is like picking a random romance novel off an airport bookstore shelf and saying, "This book sucks. Fuck you, Tolstoy -- your medium is worthless!" - Ken Tremendous
by TheBZA on
May 16, 2008 10:41 AM CDT
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+ rec
Couldn’t put it better.
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on
May 16, 2008 11:30 AM CDT
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nice article on Feldman
If he develops into a back of the rotation starter, it would be a great success story.
by Randy Richardson on May 16, 2008 9:50 AM CDT 0 recs
+1
I really don’t like hearing comparisons of Scott Feldman to Roy Halladay, but the nuts and bolts baseball aspects of that article were very insightful.
Also, I loved seeing Josh and Tom interview Mark Connor during the game a few days ago. I can’t remember when that was, but I really wish they would do more stuff like that. It was funny to hear Connor’s nicknames for everyone end in a y: Milly, Vinny, Feldy, Gabby, etc. At least that’s better than all the basketball players whose nicknames are their initials.
by jwiscarson on
May 16, 2008 10:58 AM CDT
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Astros
I didn’t realize how well they have been playing lately (Sharky hasn’t been around to tell us about them).
They are 11-2 in May, the Rangers are 10-4 this month. This Silver Boot is actually worth playing for this year.
by JBImaknee on May 16, 2008 10:17 AM CDT 0 recs
Disastros
I have an insufferable Houston friend who tells me about them All. The. Time. My response: “It’s easy to do well in the NL, and especially the NL central. That is why you never have the silver boot.” He gets really steamed at that.
by FuturePants on
May 16, 2008 11:00 AM CDT
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"That is why you never have the silver boot."
That’s awesome. Nothing like rubbing a meaningless trophy in people’s faces.
Everyone here should use their universal login over at the Crawford Boxes and start saying that…
by JBImaknee on
May 16, 2008 11:08 AM CDT
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Totally
Because in the end, that’s really all the Rangers got over them. I’m not certain, but I’m pretty sure only one of those clubs has been to the World Series.
by FuturePants on
May 16, 2008 12:51 PM CDT
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yeah
how’d that work out for them. In the end they were like all the rest of the teams in the major leagues. Losers. And since then what have they done. At least if you are going to be a one year wonder you better at least win the damn thing
by bigsteve on
May 16, 2008 12:58 PM CDT
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I'd rather win a pennant and lose the series than not even get that far.
But, then, I’d also rather be a Rangers fan.
Paradox.
by philkid3 on
May 16, 2008 1:00 PM CDT
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I'm glad you've started drinking
A drunk man’s words are a sober man’s thoughts.
/ Internet Bar
"I hope it's a special dumb person hell so that I don’t have to meet up with you after I die."
- The D-tron
by Chase Irwin on
May 16, 2008 1:06 PM CDT
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