Julio Borbon comparison
by 8legs2fangs on Jun 14, 2008 12:19 PM CDT
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PrintThanks to Hindman for this...it's an interesting look.
Borbon = Carl Crawford (possibly) ? I'll talke it! Doesn't strike out much, tons of speed to steal 50 bases, incredible CF defense, a little pop. If he can just work on his BB ratio a little...he'd be a nice piece in 2010.
I'll pass on Corey Patterson though...
LF - Murphy/Boggs, CF - Borbon, RF - Hamilton (Byrd/JMJ in there somewhere)...
http://rangersfarmreport.mlblogs.com/archives/2008/06/run_dont_walk_projecting_julio.html
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Somewhere in between
I think. He’s having an encouraging year, but I’m not going to let myself get too excited just yet. Still, the fact that he is putting up a .745 OPS right now is good. We talk a lot about how the Cal league is a hitters paradise, but the league OPS is .736 right now, down from .770 last year. Above average offense from a strong defensive CF is a very nice thing.
...and curse Sir Sidney Ponson, he was such a stupid git.
don't think
that byrd is still on the team by then. and hopefully if murphy is platooning in outfield with boggs both players are gone. if the team is gonna be a contender by 2010, i’d hope they have full time players at all positions. lefty pitcher or not.
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
Borbon's defense
Pet peeve of mine is calling an OF w/ a horrible throwing arm a plus defender. A rangy fly-catcher in CF isn’t the worst thing in the world, but a guy that can’t throw is NOT a plus defender IMO.
Pedro: "I wasn't cockfighting, I just have a wide stance."
Borbon
Who says he has a “horrible throwing arm”?
by Adam J. Morris on Jun 14, 2008 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Sure
But it is a long way from below-average to horrible.
by Adam J. Morris on Jun 14, 2008 1:35 PM CDT up reply actions
Also,
it was suggested that his arm could eventually play as average depending on his glove to hand transfer.
and with his speed
and given his position as CF and not RF, he doesn’t really need a cannon of an arm to be a plus defender.
not really
If a 55 arm is average, then everything from 54 down to zero is “below average”.
It is pretty much common knowledge that Borbon has a very weak throwing arm, are you saying that he doesn’t?
Pedro: "I wasn't cockfighting, I just have a wide stance."
I am saying...
...that I haven’t read anything that indicates he has a “horrible throwing arm.”
by Adam J. Morris on Jun 15, 2008 9:17 PM CDT up reply actions
Borbon
At draft time that was all I heard, over and over, noodle arm.
I wonder if the criticism was in the context of the high first rounder the team had. IOW, Borbon’s arm was too flawed for 17 overall.
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on Jun 14, 2008 1:28 PM CDT up reply actions
Good range and reads
Coupled with even a less than average arm sort of read LF at RBIA. Especially if CF and RF are manned by power hitters with big arms. And to be repetitive, LF is the defensive focus field here, the best place to shut down runs against potential action.
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang (1844-1912)
by Ed Coffin on Jun 14, 2008 1:57 PM CDT up reply actions
I've seen him play
his arm is fine. It’s not Josh’s cannon, but it’s solid-average. Plus, when you get to balls as fast as he does, that makes up for a lot. You won’t see many guys taking the extra base on Julio.
Good to know
thanks
"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"If you ain't got no money, ain't nobody calls you honey," Bo Diddley
I just cannot stand
a player, at any position, who cannot throw a ball on a line with some velocity.
I certainly have no idea how strong am arm Bourbon has but I know I love the outfield arms on this team (Catalanatto does not count)That is not me in the photo, so relax.
Creepy
"Typical woman. 'Give me' 'Give me' 'Give me'
I’ll give ya something.
1. A backhand
2. A stuffing
3. $500 if you promise never to post here again"
~ The Immortal, BG
by inactive lsb user on Jun 14, 2008 8:15 PM CDT up reply actions
If Borbon = Carl Crawford
He’d get significantly more attention than he gets right now.
Crawford, although he hasn’t really developed it, has more power potential than Borbon IMO.
Also
Crawford plays LF not CF.
This is the Texas Rangers, professional destroyers of hope, we're talking about. - BAC
Crawford
Probably not as good defensively as Borbon.
by Adam J. Morris on Jun 14, 2008 3:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Offensively?
Crawford probably represents a good best-case scenario for Borbon.
by Adam J. Morris on Jun 14, 2008 4:26 PM CDT up reply actions
Could he?
I think Tampa pretty much ruled that out.
They had real trouble filling their CF slot over the last few year, and never once did they even think of moving CC over there. From watching him a little bit when I lived in FLA, he’s fast, but he doesn’t get great jumps, and his routs are almost never a straight line.
He’s a LF for a reason.
A fist bump? A pound? A terrorist fist jab?
by thedirkatron on Jun 14, 2008 4:07 PM CDT up reply actions
that's not exactly accurate
he’s played CF there at least a few games a year. they’ve at least considered it and he’s an adequate backup.
Rare Gnats Sex
Sure, then I guess it's safe to say that
He’s a CF like OMFT is a 3b :)
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2008 8:10 AM CDT up reply actions
Two things that we need to see from Borbon, along with the good things he's doing
Both are relative to what he’s doing now. He needs to get his walk rate up from once every 20 ABs to once every 10. He’s well capable of it, just has to work on his approach. He doesn’t have any problem at all making contact, so I think it’s quite doable, plus he has done it before over stretches. Second, he needs to start showing just a little bit of HR power at some point. It doesn’t have to be now, though it would be nice if he could utilize the good hitters conditions in his league to exhibit a little of the pop that Callis, et al saw in him. He has to be a 10+ HR guy to be effective in the manner that his biggest comp Johnny Damon has been in his career.
I believe both of those issues
are interconnected. As he hits for more power, I think you’ll see the walks increase as a result. I’m not sure about the crawford comparison because Crawford struck out quite a bit in his career. Borbon, to me, seems to be a guy that will be a real good player if his power comes, and a decent 4th OF if it doesn’t. This year and next are very important for him.
Also on Borbon
I was someone who thought it might be a good idea to give him a month or so in Low A to get him off to a rolling start. Considering that, the fact that he adjusted almost immediately to HA and has people talking about bumping him to AA (though I tend to think that talk is premature as well) is really good to see.
i don't know if adam answered this in another thread
but why would borbon not be a september call up?
Rare Gnats Sex
I don't think he would be...
...primarily because the Rangers haven’t made a habit of calling up everyone on their 40 man roster at season’s end. Rather, they tend to call up high level guys they want to take a look at, and will give semi-regular time to.
by Adam J. Morris on Jun 14, 2008 5:52 PM CDT up reply actions
true
But when have we had this amount of talent to call up?
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
That works against him, not for him
They will still be wanting to get guys like Boggs and Murphy playing time, they might be giving Cruz a look, and Mayberry figures to get one if he keeps hitting. The chance of moving one of those guys or Hamilton (or Bradley if he’s still here) to DH to open up a spot isn’t helped by having Davis and Ramirez (and Botts) around. And ALL of those guys will have spent the majority of the year in AAA at the lowest. Borbon is hurt by all of the guys in front of him, not helped.
by Brett Perryman on Jun 14, 2008 6:14 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't know
Most of the guys you just mentioned are not on the 40 man roster so to give them a look in September will mean there has to be room. Now if we trade away Guardado, MB, Cat, and Byrd and get rid of Shelton then there would be room for all of them, assuming we don’t acquire anyone who goes on it, but Borbon is already on it and the only thing that would have to be done is a simple call up. Ive argued plenty on this subject but I just think even if its to be a late game pinch runner and defensive replacement you have to do it. You gave the guy a ML contract out of college mainly because you thought he would be ready in that timeframe so when given a chance to look at him I think you gotta take it.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
I can see both sides
of the argument.
I would think, based on the rest of his season trending upwards, that having him up may be a good idea. This would help get him acclimated to MLB, and he would most likely learn a few important habits/skills from the other MLB players. Also, it would give him more drive/desire to succeed, and get back up asap.
"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"If you ain't got no money, ain't nobody calls you honey," Bo Diddley
Here's the thing
The 40 man roster shouldn’t be an issue at that point. You are going to have room to add guys like Taylor Teagarden and John Mayberry Jr., who have to be added. So saying that Borbon should be called up instead of them because of the 40 man situation doesn’t really make sense to me.
Moreover, if you are going to call up Borbon, don’t you also have to call up Matt Harrison, Thomas Diamond, Max Ramirez, Joaquin Arias, Warner Madrigal, along with Teagarden, Mayberry, Jose Vallejo, and whomever else you are going to add this offseason?
by Adam J. Morris on Jun 14, 2008 8:16 PM CDT up reply actions
But, but
The 40 man roster shouldn’t be an issue at that point.
The 40 is always an issue. The 40 trumps all!!
"Typical woman. 'Give me' 'Give me' 'Give me'
I’ll give ya something.
1. A backhand
2. A stuffing
3. $500 if you promise never to post here again"
~ The Immortal, BG
by inactive lsb user on Jun 14, 2008 8:20 PM CDT up reply actions
+ 1 Billion!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
A fist bump? A pound? A terrorist fist jab?
by thedirkatron on Jun 14, 2008 10:27 PM CDT up reply actions
yeah
Not Vallejo but if all those guys are not playing in the minor league playoffs and are healthy then why not? Harrison can get some valuable experience, Arias can provide another utility aspect, Madrigal can showcase his stuff out of the pen, Teagarden can be a backup. Im not saying these guys have to get consistant playing time. But if we are out of the playoff picture and are looking toward next year why not? To have all those guys up here would mean alot of guys that are here currently would be gone. Guys like MB, Guardado, Shelton, Cat, Byrd, possibly Laird. Im sure you could find a place in the lineup a few times over that couple weeks to a month for these guys to play a little bit.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
Also
I don’t think you ever explained how he has 4 options instead of 3. Is that a new rule or something?
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
If they have
less than 5 years of pro ball experience, a 4th option can be used on them. So since Borbon will be at 3+ years by the time his 3rd option is up, he’ll have a 4th option.
From what I've been told here
they don’t matter because they aren’t key guys for the future and don’t need that taste of baserunning in the majors to continue their development.
by Brett Perryman on Jun 14, 2008 11:11 PM CDT up reply actions
who told you that?
I think you are referring to me. I never said that. I am in favor of bringing up any and all young players on the 40 in September. Position players are the easiest because you can put them in a position to use the tools that are best suited at that time. For Borbon you would want him using his speed and defense. You wouldn’t pinch hit him for say Murphy because his bat isn’t ML caliber yet. But his speed and defense is so use it.
Now pitchers are a little different. If they aren’t ready then I would rather leave them be. You can hurt a pitchers confidence by putting them in situations that is impossble for the to succeed at. But of that list that was posted of guys Harrison will be ready to at least taste the bigs by September and Madrigal would seem to be if he stays on the path hes currently on. I wouldn’t advocate adding a guy who wasn’t ready simply because you can. But if you have guys already on it and using an option what does it hurt? Thats the question you still haven’t answered for me yet. What would it hurt to bring up Borbon and let him pinch run or play defense late in games.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
I'm being a little facetious
I was referring to the comment that it was worth the trouble for Borbon to “get acclimated” because he figures to be a part of the lineup in the future, while some others may not be.
by Brett Perryman on Jun 15, 2008 2:03 AM CDT up reply actions
Along with what bigsteve said
He’s already on the 40, his minor league team won’t be playing during that time, why not call him up and give him very little playing time, but let him pinch run and play defense?
Ha!
Never let it die, Miles.
Never let it die.
A fist bump? A pound? A terrorist fist jab?
by thedirkatron on Jun 14, 2008 10:35 PM CDT up reply actions
Bakersfield
I’ve been watching this guy for awhile. He is about as steady as they come. Daily he performs the single, stolen base, run trick…like Jose Reyes. He has been at .309 for nearly the entire season. So….why is he still at Bakersfield??!
Carlos Gomez comp?
How does Borbon compare to Gomez of the Twins?
Brandon Boggs 2008 Texas Rangers ROY
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