Neftali Feliz is pretty good
by Adam J. Morris on Jun 14, 2008 1:43 PM CDT
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PrintToday's line for Neftali Feliz...
5 1/3 IP, 1 hit, 3 walks, 11 Ks, 1 ER.
He's now got a 2.24 ERA on the season, 83 Ks in 61 1/3 IP, and just 24 walks and 1 -- ONE -- home run allowed.
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so
does this finally convince people that he should be a starter?
"I am a Doug Mathis believer." -dstar442005 on 6-9-08
I think he's got great potential
but the only thing that will convince me for a fact that he is a future ace is if he is doing this using his secondary pitches.
It's not only his fastball
HIs fastball is a legit plus pitch and is obviously too good for the league but his secondary pitches have improved. He isn’t just throwing 90 fastballs a game.
I understand
but the only real test IMO is to challenge him in the upper levels with those pitches. Its easier to make it look like his secondary pitches are good against weaker competition. I’d love to see him get tested in Bakersfield already.
Secondary Pitches
Does anyone know what he throws? Probably a changeup and slider pitcher, but i was just wondering.
baseBALLIN!
#1
Our prospect ranking polls are going to be extremely enjoyable this summer.
...and curse Sir Sidney Ponson, he was such a stupid git.
serious case can be made
for so many people. That is an awesome problem to have.
Go Vote for Kinsler, Young, Hamilton, Bradley and write in Murphy. http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/events/all_star/y2008/ballot_reg.html - Vote up to 25 times on as many email accounts as you can think of!
Last year
thedirkatron (our semi-official poller on this subject) started the mid-season poll on July 4. I’m sure we’ll do it again.
...and curse Sir Sidney Ponson, he was such a stupid git.
+1
"Typical woman. 'Give me' 'Give me' 'Give me'
I’ll give ya something.
1. A backhand
2. A stuffing
3. $500 if you promise never to post here again"
~ The Immortal, BG
by inactive lsb user on Jun 14, 2008 5:07 PM CDT up reply actions
Somebody did a poll for top pitching prospect
Either before the season or during April sometime, didn’t they?
heh
The D-tron takes it back to the lab!
"Typical woman. 'Give me' 'Give me' 'Give me'
I’ll give ya something.
1. A backhand
2. A stuffing
3. $500 if you promise never to post here again"
~ The Immortal, BG
by inactive lsb user on Jun 14, 2008 8:46 PM CDT up reply actions
Good grief
1.35 strikeouts per inning is strong stuff. 0.39 walks per inning is pretty OK as well. About 3.5 to 1 K to BB.
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang (1844-1912)
by Ed Coffin on Jun 14, 2008 1:53 PM CDT reply actions
I want to see him in Bakersfield after the break,
Hopefully he can get close to that strikeout total in a higher league.
Pitch count
Does anyone know if he’s on a pitch count limit? He never seems to go beyond 6 innings. Are we holding him back or is he just throwing a lot of pitches?
Well, last year he threw 49 innings, and 29 the year before.
He’s already up to 63 innings this year.
IP
How long do you think they will let him pitch this year?
This is the Texas Rangers, professional destroyers of hope, we're talking about. - BAC
whoever it was that had him at #1 in the offseason was on to something
with this many guys at A ball… dont the odds finally have to be in our favor that a copule will pan out
Bring up Justin Smoak
Goldstein
is regarded for his time at BA and all, but I’m not sure that any prospect “guru” in recent years has had his reputation so attached with a prospect…or has picked such a good person with whom to attach his rep. At least this last year others were at least ranking him well. The year before that, Goldstein had him as a top three (with guys like Salty, Andrus, Escobar and Harrison prominent in the system)in the Braves system and a top 100 guy. BA ranked him 18th in Atlanta’s system.
by Brett Perryman on Jun 14, 2008 4:46 PM CDT up reply actions
lol
Rhyner also thought that Hurley was 24 and a 3rd round pick.
And yet
the other guys on that station think he’s the go-to guy for info. Embarrassing situation.
by Brett Perryman on Jun 14, 2008 4:46 PM CDT up reply actions
+1
"Typical woman. 'Give me' 'Give me' 'Give me'
I’ll give ya something.
1. A backhand
2. A stuffing
3. $500 if you promise never to post here again"
~ The Immortal, BG
by inactive lsb user on Jun 14, 2008 5:11 PM CDT up reply actions
To be fair
On THAT station he probably is when it comes to baseball. I guess Norm might be but I haven’t been able to stomach listening to him in about 5 years so I don’t know.
Let me have a diablo sandwich, a Dr. Pepper, and make it fast I'm in a God damned hurry!
by LSBUser on Jun 14, 2008 5:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Norm
is the prototypical type who has the information but not the sense to interpret it correctly. He fools people who don’t have nuanced understanding with facts, but can’t use them to draw the logical, appropriate conclusion. Chuck Cooperstein has a little of that problem as well.
But you’re right, if someone said “Neftali Feliz (or Perez)” those two and Sturm would be the only ones who could tell you who he is, and Mike could probably tell you more (if you could filter through the false info) than the other two.
At least Sturm reads these boards, so he has some shot at having a little better idea of getting the whole picture.
by Brett Perryman on Jun 14, 2008 5:46 PM CDT up reply actions
No way Sturm knows who he is
Not a knock on Bob but he is too busy watching soccer, Kige Ramsey videos, and MMA to have any idea who a 20 year old in A ball is.
Let me have a diablo sandwich, a Dr. Pepper, and make it fast I'm in a God damned hurry!
by LSBUser on Jun 14, 2008 5:51 PM CDT up reply actions
Hah
I bet he does. Maybe someone should email him and see if he knows who Feliz is off hand just out of curiosity.
by Brett Perryman on Jun 14, 2008 5:57 PM CDT up reply actions
I'll do it
what email address
"Typical woman. 'Give me' 'Give me' 'Give me'
I’ll give ya something.
1. A backhand
2. A stuffing
3. $500 if you promise never to post here again"
~ The Immortal, BG
by inactive lsb user on Jun 14, 2008 8:47 PM CDT up reply actions
Done
I’ll reply to this spot in this thread if I get a response.
"Typical woman. 'Give me' 'Give me' 'Give me'
I’ll give ya something.
1. A backhand
2. A stuffing
3. $500 if you promise never to post here again"
~ The Immortal, BG
by inactive lsb user on Jun 14, 2008 9:13 PM CDT up reply actions
If I'm not mistaken...
Thats 68 1/3 IP, just 44 hits. I’m thinkin he is in Bak after the AS game.
Yeah
.188 oppoenents BA
That’s great.
by Brett Perryman on Jun 14, 2008 4:50 PM CDT up reply actions
Can we go ahead and enact some kind of no trade clause
in his agreement? It’s for JD’s own good. I don’t want to be grooming another potential young star for another team.
There is no such thing as global warming. David Murphy was cold, so he turned the sun up.
+1
but I dont think we’ve ever had a pitching prospect like this.
I disagree.
Volquez and Danks of the DVD posse show we clearly did. They had the minor league hype and have had the major league results so far.
There is no such thing as global warming. David Murphy was cold, so he turned the sun up.
by SarasotaRanger on Jun 14, 2008 2:43 PM CDT up reply actions
I disagree too
I don’t think Danks or Volquez ever had the potential that Feliz does. Volquez had the stuff, but I don’t think he was as advanced as Feliz was at the same age and level. The walks were both a bit higher than you would like, but Feliz is showing an absolute hatred for giving up the long ball and is barely allowing any hits against him. Volquez didn’t show the same as a 20, going on 21 year old in Clinton (remember that Feliz turned 20 in May). Danks isn’t even in the discussion as having the same potential as either of them. He’s a great pitcher, but he doesn’t have the same dominating stuff that Volquez and potentially Feliz can have.
You are right that Danks didn't have the potential
or electric stuff of the other two, but Volquez did. Volquez had a 2.5 BB/K ratio; 1.2 WHIP; 3.69 ERA and gave up 37 HR in 556 minor league innings. That may not be quite what Feliz has done in a short time, but its pretty electric in itself, especially since that includes AA and AAA work.
There is no such thing as global warming. David Murphy was cold, so he turned the sun up.
by SarasotaRanger on Jun 14, 2008 3:45 PM CDT up reply actions
This wasnt meant to be a slight
on previous rangers pitching prospects. I think its hard to argue any other rangers pitching prospect in recent memory when stacked up against feliz’s stuff and production combined with his age.
I agree very few could stack up
but Volquez did. Control problems?... yea, some. Electric stuff?... yep.
I hope Feliz develops into a star, and hopefully he will. He’s gonna have some growing pains and tough times, too.
There is no such thing as global warming. David Murphy was cold, so he turned the sun up.
by SarasotaRanger on Jun 14, 2008 3:52 PM CDT up reply actions
But
you can look at what Volquez did and at what age in Clinton and compare it what Feliz has done in Clinton so far and before now as well. I don’t know what the future holds for Feliz, but so far, I think he projects to be better than Volquez did around the same time.
Perhaps....
...but I don’t think it can be said that there never has been a pitching prospect like this guy. It’s not that far and away clear. He’s only in low level ball. Let’s wait and see.
There is no such thing as global warming. David Murphy was cold, so he turned the sun up.
by SarasotaRanger on Jun 14, 2008 4:29 PM CDT up reply actions
The guy has the top potential
of just any prospect in recent Rangers history outside of maybe Volquez, and again when you compare what the two did at Clinton (not even taking into account Volquez being about a year older than Feliz at the time), Feliz has the stats hands down over Volquez. The stuff might be as good though I think Feliz’s fastball gives him the edge.
I understand your point about the comparison and Feliz's favorable stats.
I’m saying comparing A ball pitching stats and annointing someone the best prospect ever is too early. Again, we’ll see how he handles the increased competition. Let’s hold off on the annointing oil for now, but things are on the up for him so far….
There is no such thing as global warming. David Murphy was cold, so he turned the sun up.
by SarasotaRanger on Jun 14, 2008 9:43 PM CDT up reply actions
why are
you slighting Cobra Lewis????
:)
Please forgive any and all typos, mispellings, etc.
Your kindess in this matter is appreciated.
by red shoe ranger on Jun 14, 2008 9:48 PM CDT up reply actions
exactly
volquez was not as advanced as feliz at such a young age, plus he gave up a lot of walks. Control was always an issue with him until this year and he still gives up more walks than you would like. Plus nationally DVD was not ranked all that highly, whereas Feliz could easily be a top 25 prospect as soon as next year, maybe even higher.
It's All Just Potential
until they arrive to the Bigs.
Danks, Young, Volquez, et al: A lot of good signs in the minors, but not enough to make certain that they’d be major-league successes. Currently, they are. Tomorrow?
Hurley, Feliz, et al: Showed/have shown good signs in the minors. Hurley looked solid in debut, but gave up homers. May crash here, and succeed elsewhere. Who knows?
My point: Until they get to the majors and get their feet wet for a year or two, you really only have indicators, not evidence. Some guys take to it; others choke. Hugely mental.
A pitcher’s future success is an educated guess, at best.
A pitcher’s continued and consistent success is a rarity.
"lol " - CI
+1
There is no such thing as global warming. David Murphy was cold, so he turned the sun up.
by SarasotaRanger on Jun 14, 2008 9:49 PM CDT up reply actions
I'll say this
We haven’t had a prospect with a fastball like his. He doesn’t have a second pitch like Volquez’ change, and he hasn’t had the time to develop the overall package that Danks did, but just in terms of that absolutely dominant fastball with every component of velocity, movement, etc., we haven’t had one like this. Maybe Robb Nen is the closest in the last 20 or so years?
by Brett Perryman on Jun 14, 2008 5:09 PM CDT up reply actions
he'd have to be
Great power potential, appears to have significantly improved his plate discipline, and is already in AAA so there is less flame out potential.
It all depends on whether
his AAA numbers hold up, but if they do I think he belongs in the 20s somewhere.
by Brett Perryman on Jun 14, 2008 4:48 PM CDT up reply actions
feliz
he’s got to be due for a promotion soon right?
if his slider has progressed and he can even develop an average change, thats devastating mixed with his fastball
"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it." - Mitch Hedberg
My goodness...
All I see is potentail ace when this kid pitches. As others have stated he needs to work on his secondary pitches, but what 20 year old doesn’t. He needs to be in A+ ball by July 1st imo.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
cruz just left the game with an injury...
hope hes ok… he still needs one more shot. potential is just too high.
Bring up Justin Smoak
That's like betting on
a two legged man to beat a one legged fattie in a footrace.
There is no such thing as global warming. David Murphy was cold, so he turned the sun up.
by SarasotaRanger on Jun 14, 2008 4:14 PM CDT up reply actions
volquez is dominating the sox
2 unearned runs through 5 though. or at least they should both be unearned runs, i dont know how you give a wild pitch on a perfectly catchable low changeup.
Bring up Justin Smoak
I saw that
... ridiculous scoring from the home crew.
There is no such thing as global warming. David Murphy was cold, so he turned the sun up.
by SarasotaRanger on Jun 14, 2008 4:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Wakefield dominating the Reds more though
54 pitches through 5 innings, one run allowed, and 3 hits and 2 BBs.
his final line should have been
7 ip 1 era 9 ks. pretty sweet.
the one legit earned run involved an infield single and slow roller between short and 3rd.
im only bringing him up since he happened to be on national tv today though and i was watching, not harping on the trade.
Bring up Justin Smoak
I think its
sad that people feel like they have to qualify Volquez observations and discussion….
Please forgive any and all typos, mispellings, etc.
Your kindess in this matter is appreciated.
by red shoe ranger on Jun 14, 2008 9:51 PM CDT up reply actions
+1
"Typical woman. 'Give me' 'Give me' 'Give me'
I’ll give ya something.
1. A backhand
2. A stuffing
3. $500 if you promise never to post here again"
~ The Immortal, BG
by inactive lsb user on Jun 14, 2008 9:58 PM CDT up reply actions
the best part of his line.....
1 walk!
Please forgive any and all typos, mispellings, etc.
Your kindess in this matter is appreciated.
by red shoe ranger on Jun 14, 2008 10:44 PM CDT up reply actions
Mid season top 100 lists
He’ll be on them, but if KG does one, how high will Feliz be on his?Surely top 20, higher?
Right now
I think that Feliz has to be our #1 prospect. He’s way down the ladder, yes, but he looks special, and Smoak and Davis have things to prove themselves. But I think that’s how I’d go, 1. Feliz 2. Smoak 3. Davis with Ramirez, Main, Beavan, Hurley, Andrus, Kiker next and all solid top 100 candidates. Teagarden, Beltre, Mayberry, etc., yeah it will be fun to go through and rank them this summer.
So...
With Feliz, Smoak, and Davis, we’ve got 3 top 30 prospects, you think?
by Adam J. Morris on Jun 14, 2008 4:57 PM CDT up reply actions
If I were predicting
I’d say that, at least in BA, we won’t see 3 of the top 30 next spring, but I think that Smoak will be top 30, and I think that as we stand now Feliz and Davis both have the opportunity to be ranked that high if they have similar 2nd halfs.
The least likely is probably Feliz. For all of the claims that BA favors lower level guys, I don’t really find it to be true these days (like in the case with Feliz that I mentioned). I think for him to rank that high he’d have to promote to HA and continue to dominate. Could happen though.
by Brett Perryman on Jun 14, 2008 5:03 PM CDT up reply actions
Why wouldn't
you put Ramirez at 2?
He is way more proven than a college hitter who hasn’t seen an AB in the minors yet.
"No bear or disco for Juan" - Mr. Santos
That's a legitimate question
I love his bat, but the reason that you probably won’t see him there is that scouts probably still won’t project his bat to be as good as the 1Bs.
by Brett Perryman on Jun 14, 2008 5:01 PM CDT up reply actions
Zywica...
no concerns about Beavan’s lack of velo so far?
I’d go Feliz, Smoak, Max, Andrus, Davis
by groundingout on Jun 14, 2008 5:45 PM CDT up reply actions
Sure
Just relative, as he’s only nine starts into his season and has been working on mechanics. I think we just have to see how things go over more time.
by Brett Perryman on Jun 14, 2008 5:48 PM CDT up reply actions
High 80s with the occasional low 90s
I think at this point he needs to continue to learn how to pitch and not just to throw it past people like he was able to get away with in HS. His velocity should increase as he becomes more comfortable with his motion.
Do we have a shot at being considered the #1 farm system?
Another good draft, so far a lot of guys are elevating their status, etc..
Maybe if we get a good return on a couple deadline deals?
Bring up Justin Smoak
Davis, Brignac…
I having studied their system lately, but I wonder if we don’t at least have the depth advantage now. But yeah we’re right there for #2 with, I don’t know, probably Boston (though they’re seeing Buccholz, Ellsbury, Masterson and probably Lowrie promote). I don’t think that the Yankees have enough bats, and they lost their super stud Joba (and IPK). The top of Baltimore’s system has really improved, but I don’t think their depth compares with ours.
by Brett Perryman on Jun 14, 2008 5:53 PM CDT up reply actions
i said the overall depth is better in our system a while back
and got flamed for it.
Stats don't lie
I don't think that was ever an outrageous statement to make.
Every analysis of our farm system noted that we had the deepest farm system but were hurt by the lack of elite prospects.
Yep. I know I’ve been saying since the fall of 2006 that you could see that developing. The bigger positive development to me is that some of these guys like Davis have really become elite types. A year ago in, say, May you couldn’t really point to anyone as an elite prospect.
by Brett Perryman on Jun 14, 2008 7:13 PM CDT up reply actions
We have the depth
but I still think they have the quality advantage. Price is probably the player that puts them over the top.
To be honest I’m not sure that we stack up real well across the top 7-8. If you took two or three away from them, we’d look good. But I’d have a hard time picking any of our prospects over Beckham either, and maybe Davis (and maybe McGee). They just look better at the top than Texas to me, which is nothing to be ashamed of.
by Brett Perryman on Jun 14, 2008 7:17 PM CDT up reply actions
McGee’s concerns me more (not that I’m completely sure why). If you take out his next to most recent start, Davis has actually been just fine this year. With McGee, he seems to be really struggling mixing three pitches and commanding them. He has that FB from the left side, so he’s still exciting, but he would worry me some right now, just from his stat lines and the few quotes I’ve found.
Davis hasn’t necessarily stepped up and become a top ten prospect and a pretty quick promotion like he seemed on the way to doing last year, but I just don’t find myself being disturbed by his results yet.
by Brett Perryman on Jun 14, 2008 7:30 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm a sucker for
McGee’s particular kind of upside. I’d still take him personally.
by Brett Perryman on Jun 14, 2008 8:41 PM CDT up reply actions
I'd take Andrus over Beckham
But you have a point. I really like out top 25 compared to the league but our top 10 isn’t on the same level as the Rays.
Just wait until Boscan, Font and Pimentel explode onto the prospect landscape. Seriously, if Font’s secondary offerings start to show improvement, we could be looking at a top of the rotation prospect who could become the Feliz of ‘08 in ‘09.
How many other SP's
in the minors, who are atleast age appropriate and were considered good prospects comming into the season are putting up better numbers than Feliz? Cahill for sure, Price but in a small sample size so far, and maybe Hellickson, though he has given up nearly a hit per inning (walked so few though). Those come to mind, any others?
Chacin is comparable maybe but not better number-wise.
Charlie Morton was pretty amazing in AAA.
by Brett Perryman on Jun 14, 2008 5:54 PM CDT up reply actions
The Colorado Chacin?
on a not-so-much related note, I wonder what happend to the Dr. Evil Chacin?
He’s pitching again in the minors…poorly:
Team League W L ERA G GS CG SHO SV IP H R ER HR BB SO GO/AO AVG
DUN FSL 1 7 7.88 11 11 0 0 0 45.2 72 43 40 9 12 22 0.71 .367
by Brett Perryman on Jun 14, 2008 7:14 PM CDT up reply actions
He was DFA'd a couple of weeks ago
To clear a 40 man spot for the Blue Jays.
I don’t think anyone claimed.
by Adam J. Morris on Jun 14, 2008 8:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Daily OKC
also has a feature of Mile’s favorite player, Joaquin Arias.
http://newsok.com/arias-working-toward-regaining-defensive-flash/article/3256843/?tm=1213357800
neffy
i saw him shut down the beloit snappers a few weeks ago,
i was very impressed.
he seems like he will continue to get a good amount of grounders.
something like only 2 balls left the infield.
only ben revere did anything,
and he was immediately picked off after one of the hits.
thats a nasty rotation in clinton,
gomey, neffy, beavan
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