Mike Gonzalez

by AirJordan on Jul 22, 2008 11:12 PM CDT

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/unfiltered/?p=955

The Rangers were clear winners at last year’s deadline, already seeing a payoff from last year’s deals. They might try again, making smaller deals focused on 2009. They might again have a match with the Braves, dealing one of their extra OF bats — Frank Catalanotto, Marlon Byrd, or even Milton Bradley — for Mike Gonzalez. There hasn’t been much interest in Hank Blalock, but he’s another name that could clear waivers.

Not a rental.... still has one more year on his deal, could probably step right in for Eddie when he's traded, has a 2.84 era and a dazzling .63 whip. Has closed before, just in case the CJ experiment goes awry.... Hell, trade Byrd and Cat for him.

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Trading for Relief Pitching...

No comprendo.

by hiafex on Jul 22, 2008 11:18 PM CDT 0 recs

I comprehend

if we can control them long-term.

"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005

by Agreen07 on Jul 22, 2008 11:20 PM CDT up 0 recs

ok green repeat after me, "I will check a pitcher's medical history and take it into account while discussing acquisitions"

“I will check a pitcher’s medical history and take it into account while discussing acquisitions”

say it 3 times and give me 3 hail mary’s.

"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM

by Jayslick on Jul 22, 2008 11:41 PM CDT up 0 recs

I didn't say anything about Mike Gonzalez

I said I comprehend why the Rangers would trade for Relief Pitching….go kick a soccer ball or something :)

"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005

by Agreen07 on Jul 22, 2008 11:54 PM CDT up 0 recs

Ill take a chance on a pitcher like gonzalez

for byrd or catalanotto. Kind of odd lumping those two with bradley, they are not even in the same stratosphere which makes me question the validity of this statement, cause thats what it sounds like, a statement of pure speculation with no links to merit it as a rumor.

Agreen is right though, the rays did this last year turning ty wigginton into dan wheeler and that worked out pretty well for them. You cant get a guy like feliz in every deal and we obviously need pitching so why not get a guy you know can pitch for you right now in one of your perceived weaknesses, the bullpen, who will still be around for more than one year. It would be a great deal to get him for one of byrd, or preferably cat.

I'm sorry my parents never had me sarcamsized.

by rchawk12 on Jul 23, 2008 12:12 AM CDT up 0 recs

Braves

Why would they do that?

by JBImaknee on Jul 22, 2008 11:21 PM CDT 0 recs

JD's got naked pictures of someone high up in their hierarchy?

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Stuff-You-Need-Brett-Favre-action-figure-bench?urn=nfl,93739

by BudLight on Jul 22, 2008 11:43 PM CDT up 0 recs

no sense

Why trade your closer for Byrd or Catalanotto. Maybe Bradley, but there is no DH in the NL.

"An effortless 98" - Scott Gardner after Neftali Feliz's first AA pitch

by RangerMad on Jul 23, 2008 12:46 AM CDT up 0 recs

Ted Turner?

by oc on Jul 23, 2008 2:17 AM CDT up 0 recs

Maybe

Ted Turner with Seabreeze?

"Will the Rangers ever win...past July?" - Peter Schmidt

by TheJeezus on Jul 23, 2008 12:20 PM CDT up 2 recs

ya we got got some good hitters at the deadline

but once again we have absolutely no pitching.

it doesnt help to have all good hitters in the minors then just be blocked by our already good hitters

Feliz and Hurley. The 1-2 punch of the future

by Steal Home on Jul 23, 2008 12:05 AM CDT 0 recs

Mike Gonzalez is a pitcher...

"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005

by Agreen07 on Jul 23, 2008 1:10 AM CDT up 0 recs

Are you sure he's not a hitter? have you checked out his career line?

.500/.500/1.000 27OPS+!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Physician: Primum non nocere

Batter: First, make no out

by Chad Crudup on Jul 23, 2008 9:05 AM CDT up 0 recs

Whoops, that's 276 OPS+

Physician: Primum non nocere

Batter: First, make no out

by Chad Crudup on Jul 23, 2008 9:18 AM CDT up 0 recs

Money Money Money

Any savings we might possibly get in dealing Cat, Byrd, or both would be taken by acquiring a reliever entering his final arbitration year. Mike Gonzalez, injury history notwithstanding, is a very good pitcher, but getting him now is at least a year too early, as the Rangers should not be planning on being a wire-to-wire contender in 2009. If they want to contend next year, they should be looking more at starters and less at relievers.

Texas Rangers Analyst

by Andy Seiler on Jul 23, 2008 1:12 AM CDT 0 recs

if gonzalez is effective

theres no reason we couldnt flip him around to some other contender at next year’s deadline, and recoup some talent, provided that we’re not competing.

by Smoakin in the Boys Room on Jul 23, 2008 1:14 AM CDT up 0 recs

Health

If we have that for a backup plan, the pitcher needs to be at least a year removed from major arm troubles. Mike Gonzalez has recovered well from TJS, but I don’t see him being a reliable guy you can count on trading at the deadline 12 months from now if we’re not contending.

Texas Rangers Analyst

by Andy Seiler on Jul 23, 2008 1:18 AM CDT up 0 recs

Well, we flipped Kenny Lofton last year for Max Ramirez

I know that Byrd and Catalanotto might not be on that same level… But I feel like we could get something a little better for them than a relief pitcher for a year where we wont be contending. Well, not unless we put a decent rotation together at least.

by hiafex on Jul 23, 2008 1:19 AM CDT 0 recs

Value

I think getting Gonzalez for either Byrd or Cat on a one-for-one basis would be a steal for the Rangers. However, it’s the idea that Gonzalez is someone that fits the “team-controllable” that is wrong. With just one year on his FA clock left, he’s not the guy you want to be fishing for when dealing away guys that will be both be Rangers with comparable FA compensation returns after next season.

Texas Rangers Analyst

by Andy Seiler on Jul 23, 2008 1:22 AM CDT up 0 recs

thats what tampa did last year with wheeler

once he was on the team and they saw reason to back up their initial liking to him, he was almost immediately signed to an extension. Same exact situation, wheeler was a year away from free agency and was flipped a utility guy with some ops skills, sound similar to this proposed deal/rumor.

As for flipping those players for prospects, there are two problems, 1. you have to find a sucker for a trade partner that will give you an intriguing prospect with a fair amount of upside and 2. said prospect has to make adjustments to take his game to the next level like max did.

The fact of the matter there is a reason these trades stand out, because they rarely happen. Even more infrequently does the returning prospect take that next leap into an upper tier type prospect. JD hit a home run with maxram, but dont expect those kinds of trades every time out or you will be disappointed.

I'm sorry my parents never had me sarcamsized.

by rchawk12 on Jul 23, 2008 1:51 AM CDT up 0 recs

Gonalez

I could see the Braves moving him to make room for Soriano once he comes off the DL. If he were made available, he would immediately become the top left handed reliever on the market. All though half the league is interested in Fuentes, with Gonzalez’s contract, age, and upside I see lots of potential suitors. So having said that, I think that the price starts with Byrd or Boggs and one of Ramirez, Font, or Diamond. After last years bounty I think that’d probably want another “make-up” prospect too.

I personally think that it would be worth it. Gonzales immediately becomes the top closer on our roster. Wilson would probably keep the job for the time being but, he’d be on a short leash and might benefit from the competition.

by HITX on Jul 23, 2008 1:57 AM CDT 0 recs

"Make-up" Prospect

After last years bounty I think that’d probably want another "make-up" prospect too.

John Schuerholz pulled the trigger on last year’s deal for Atlanta. Since Frank Wren has taken over, I don’t see him trying to make the Rangers make up for last year’s trade, since he potentially wants the Rangers as trading partners down the road.

Texas Rangers Analyst

by Andy Seiler on Jul 23, 2008 2:07 AM CDT up 0 recs

Good Point

But none the less, Wren was still in the picture when the deal was made last year and Schuerholz is currently an adviser. Not saying that they wouldn’t like to have Texas as trading partners, I think that all parties involved know that we came out on top.

What are your thoughts on Gonzalez’s value?

by HITX on Jul 23, 2008 2:22 AM CDT up 0 recs

Relatively High

I think the Braves have to be quite pleased with the way Gonzalez has come back from TJS. The most striking stat is the zero walks in 12.2 innings at the Majors. Control is usually the last thing to come back for a TJS survivor, and Gonzalez came back with relative quickness, as well. That said, his value will probably be higher after the season when he’s had more innings under his belt. More teams will be thinking they can contend, opening up the market for him. It’s interesting that the Braves are even thinking of moving him now. There must be some belief in their organization that he will suffer some of the usual TJS effects between now and October, which would move his value down. Overall, to a contending team, Gonzalez is very valuable, but to a team like the Rangers, his value is negligible, since his price will be high (free agent closer money) during contending years.

Texas Rangers Analyst

by Andy Seiler on Jul 23, 2008 2:35 AM CDT up 0 recs

Thats all good and maybe true

but the conversation started with byrd/cat for gonzalez, if you want to speculate on throw ins they would be the beau jones types who havent become guys like beau jones, not font, diamond, etc. Unless you are talking about a different deal, which it seems that you are, a lot of opinions would change most likely. Gonzalez has a long list of injuries and the benefit of the trade is the low cost. At the price of ramirez i would say no way.

I'm sorry my parents never had me sarcamsized.

by rchawk12 on Jul 23, 2008 3:18 AM CDT up 0 recs

Maybe....

That’s where it started but, Byrd/Cat for Gonzales is a f’n pipe dream. Injuries or not, Gonzales won’t come cheap. The latest Newberg Report actually says the asking price would be 2 top tier prospects. Why would Atlanta trade us their starting closer for our 4th or 5th outfielder?? I’m trying to be realistic. It’s not happening.

by HITX on Jul 23, 2008 2:04 PM CDT up 0 recs

technically

gonzalez was their third option at best at closer behind rafael soriano and smoltz. They even tried a few other no name guys like boyer and acosta before they felt confident in gonzalez’s health (he might have been injured though). Soriano is and was their closer but has had bad health problems this year, have him on my fantasy team unfortunately.

I know the proposed trade is a pipe dream and I wouldnt trade two top tier prospects for him, let alone one with his injury history, I was just responding to the unexpected turn in conversation.

I'm sorry my parents never had me sarcamsized.

by rchawk12 on Jul 23, 2008 2:38 PM CDT up 0 recs

If we trade Milton Bradley for Mike Gonzalez

I will drive out to Texas and set fire to the RBiA.

A Lonestar in California

by lonestarJon on Jul 23, 2008 3:56 AM CDT 0 recs

at this point...

....i’m starting to believe that we aren’t going to do anything in the market this year… we only have a few commodities and it doesn’t look like we are really shopping them… cat, nellie, byrd and guardado should be shipped and i’m starting to think so should milton and vincente… but the closer it gets to the deadline the less and less possible i think ANY deal is… i think the edict has come down, “we will win next year, keep these guys around…”... which has nolan ryan sweat all over it…

I blame it not on Ron Washington, but on society. Society is to blame. And Ron Washington. ~Ken Tremendous on Ron Washington sac bunting in the 11th vs LAA

by ivysafety39 on Jul 23, 2008 6:55 AM CDT 0 recs

its way too early to think that

theres still plenty of time.. a lot of the deals dont even happen until the last couple days or right at the deadline..

there will be at least one deal, thats inevitable. probably a couple.

the preceding post is not nearly as negative or insulting as you think it is

by DSheppard on Jul 23, 2008 8:27 AM CDT up 0 recs

[cross my fingers]

I blame it not on Ron Washington, but on society. Society is to blame. And Ron Washington. ~Ken Tremendous on Ron Washington sac bunting in the 11th vs LAA

by ivysafety39 on Jul 23, 2008 8:30 AM CDT up 0 recs

wilson

What if acquiring Gonzalez is a precursor to trading CJ Wilson?

"An effortless 98" - Scott Gardner after Neftali Feliz's first AA pitch

by RangerMad on Jul 23, 2008 7:22 AM CDT 0 recs

Hypothetical

Do you trade the Murph for him?

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Stuff-You-Need-Brett-Favre-action-figure-bench?urn=nfl,93739

by BudLight on Jul 23, 2008 9:33 AM CDT 0 recs

tough call

Who replaces Murphy? Boggs? Do you still try to trade Byrd? I think I would do it. Murphy is a 4th OFer. He can be replaced next spring.

"An effortless 98" - Scott Gardner after Neftali Feliz's first AA pitch

by RangerMad on Jul 23, 2008 9:45 AM CDT up 0 recs

I think

if we see Murph to the Cardinals, Texas will call up JMJ put him in right and put Boggs in left.

The Eagle has landed....

by Lonerangers on Jul 23, 2008 12:24 PM CDT up 0 recs

4th Outfielder??

You must spend more time on message boards than you do watching games or looking at the numbers. Murphy is not a 4th OF. The guy is second in the AL Rookie of the Year race behind All-Star Evan Longoria. Murphy has been consistent at the plate and in the field since he was brought up last year. What more does he need to do to shake that label?

by HITX on Jul 23, 2008 2:08 PM CDT up 0 recs

Murphy

is a nice defensive OF who doesn’t hit lefties well and has a VERY unimpressive walk rate with a little power. He may be the best 4th outfielder around, but he’s a 4th OF that probably needs a platoon partner. He’s been more than nice, but that doesn’t mean there aren’t better.

And to call him 2nd in the AL ROTY race is to wear homey blinders.

Time you enjoy wasting was not wasted.

by t ball on Jul 23, 2008 2:35 PM CDT up 0 recs

yet ironically

today in his first two at bats against a lefty he walked and hit an rbi single, scoring both times.

I know he is not good against lefties, but you have to love the timing of your statement.

I'm sorry my parents never had me sarcamsized.

by rchawk12 on Jul 23, 2008 2:39 PM CDT up 0 recs

Heh,

indeed.

Time you enjoy wasting was not wasted.

by t ball on Jul 23, 2008 2:46 PM CDT up 0 recs

nah

5 years of a 4th OF > 1.3 years of a oft injured reliever

Warner Madrigal makes Ezequiel Astacio look downright handsome.

by tricer on Jul 23, 2008 10:15 AM CDT up 0 recs

i think its pretty close

and would do it if i were more confident in our OF depth.

weve given up on cruz, byrd isnt long term, bradley needs to stay at DH most of the time, boggs is ok but not exactly rock solid yet, JMJ has fallen off and is still highly questionable, etc….

the preceding post is not nearly as negative or insulting as you think it is

by DSheppard on Jul 23, 2008 10:38 AM CDT up 0 recs

OF depth

Moving forward from this year, our OF depth consists of Hambone and a bunch of question marks.

I’m higher on Boggs than most, but giving up 5 years of Murphy for a lefty reliever with huge injury issues just doesn’t seem to fit in with the plan. If we were going to move Murphy, I’d rather target a really talented A/AA starter than someone like Gonzalez.

Warner Madrigal makes Ezequiel Astacio look downright handsome.

by tricer on Jul 23, 2008 10:46 AM CDT up 0 recs

OF depth

I don’t think its as dire as you make it out to be. Hamilton is a lock we all know that. But then we have the trio of JMJ, Murphy, and Boggs who put together should make for a nice 3rd outfielder. If Murphy continues to develop, not saying he will, he would be one by himself. Then we have Borbon coming in about a year and he should be able to lock down one spot at least defensively. Plus the possibility of Bradley being able to play an above average OF if needed although I would like to just keep him as a DH.

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on Jul 23, 2008 11:45 AM CDT up 0 recs

Crazy talk

see tricer’s comment above. Spot on.

As for Cat: I can’t see him fetching anything of consequence. If he goes anywhere I believe it will be for that PTBNL that is never actually named. Complete salary dump. And I don’t really have a problem with that.

Byrd: Why wouldn’t you trade Byrd for Gonzalez? Does he really factor into your plans for next year at the ~ $2mm that it will take to keep him around?

by robert_d_wilfong on Jul 23, 2008 10:50 AM CDT up 0 recs