Reactions to the Harden deal

by Adam J. Morris on Jul 9, 2008 2:12 PM CDT Comment 26 comments

Compiling some reactions from around the interwebs to the Harden deal...

The Transaction Oracle thinks Billy Beane blew it...he thinks Gallagher alone is fair value for Gaudin, which means Matt Murton, Eric Patterson, and Josh Donaldson -- two part-time players and a college draftee catcher who isn't hitting in low A -- was the haul for Harden.

Rob Neyer thinks it was a good deal for Beane, although part of the justification is that Murton and Patterson make the A's outfield better immediately...the A's outfield is sort of like the Ranger rotation, in that the bar for improving it is pretty low. Patterson and Murton could be a solid left field platoon, I guess, but that's about it. Neyer also compares Sean Gallagher to Dan Haren, which seems way optimistic.

Keith Law is underwhelmed by Oakland's return, seeing the package the A's got as being a collection of low-ceiling types.

Joe Sheehan sees this as a "no-brainer" for the Cubs, saying Chicago basically got Rich Harden for free. Christina Kahrl is similarly nonplussed, and even as an A's fan can't seem to find a way to put lipstick on this particular pig.

Over at Beyond the Box Score, R.J. Anderson seems more positive about the deal from Oakland's perspective.

David Pinto's initial reaction is that the A's didn't get enough, but updates later with a more positive view, largely based on him seemingly being higher on Gallagher than most folks.

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whatever makes them worse

for the next couple years is okay with me. can’t wait until the angels outfield reaches an average age of 40

http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER

by gossamer on Jul 9, 2008 2:18 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Vlad

If you use Vlad’s real age maybe it already does.

by GregoryM on Jul 9, 2008 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

not everybody

from the DR lies about their age.

wonder how old julio franco really is though

http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER

by gossamer on Jul 9, 2008 2:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Franco has 'fessed up

by Adam J. Morris on Jul 9, 2008 2:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

so his real age?

from wiki: Franco’s true birth date is always in question. Although his current reported birthdate is in 1958, many of his early bios and cards have his birthday listed in 1954, and on the roster of the Quintana Roo Tigres, his birthday is listed in 1961.

i always remembered his birthdate as being in 1958.

http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER

by gossamer on Jul 9, 2008 2:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

just saw this

“After seeing fellow countryman Miguel Tejada come clean about his age, I have decided that it was only fair to reveal the truth about myself. All those years that I was playing, I was really older than I said. Those people who told me I looked like a 50-year-old last season were right — I was 54. I never wanted to let anyone know because I felt it would jeopardize my status as a free agent. I knew I could still play, but I didn’t think teams would sign me if they knew my real age.”

that would put him at 6 years older than his BR birthdate, 2 years older than i thought

http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER

by gossamer on Jul 9, 2008 2:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

D-d-d-d-d-d-d-a-m-n ..

"I’ll say something that doesn’t need context: anyone who is a Mariner’s fan is a douchebag." - FuturePants

by Chase Irwin on Jul 9, 2008 2:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

+1

by coolaid on Jul 9, 2008 3:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

holly sachel page....

"Do they know who I am? Do they know my status? Thats what I thought."
-Miles 6/21/08

.501 or bust!

by Jayslick on Jul 9, 2008 3:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

do you have a link?

by 1man5tools on Jul 9, 2008 3:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

i'm assuming it's credible

http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER

by gossamer on Jul 9, 2008 3:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

try again

click here

http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER

by gossamer on Jul 9, 2008 3:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

wasn't questioning

Just wanted the story

by 1man5tools on Jul 9, 2008 5:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Franco

You have to read the whole article because the last line of the story is:

“Of course none of this really did happen, but I know you were probably buying it. Heck, most of it is probably true!”

by GregoryM on Jul 9, 2008 6:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Vlad is Older Than 32

...or 33 or whatever he says his age is. Just look at the dude; no way he is 32. And if so, it’s unfortunate because he if he’s not lying, he is the oldest looking 32 year old dude on the planet.

by FuturePants on Jul 9, 2008 2:45 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Crystal Meth

Google crystal meth before and after photos. amazing.

by gr7070 on Jul 9, 2008 4:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'd be excited for Gallagher for Laird or Byrd, but not for Harden.

Maybe Beane didn’t feel like he needed a top-tier prospect in return since he has Inoa.

Go Rangers!

by rooster on Jul 9, 2008 2:37 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

basically

Gallagher is going to be a certified star, and Murton helps them out this season, crazy as that sounds.

"Hey hows the playoff push coming? How about adding the AL MVP (Milton Bradley) to your lineup, would that help? Oh, your top 3 prospects? Sure, don't mind if I do." -Future Jon Daniels quote (developed by SaltyGoesYard)

by dstar442005 on Jul 9, 2008 2:45 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

It's seemed to me

That a major reason for Oakland’s success has been its ability to accurately predict and project player development—be it improvement or regression.

If they honestly feel that Harden cannot start more than 15-20 times for the next two years, then I think they made the right move.

by brettgardner on Jul 9, 2008 3:01 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I would agree with you, sure...

however, to me, the most egregious part of this whole move was putting Gaudin in the deal as well.

I’d assume Henry was like, “If Harden’s arm is going to fall off tomorrow, I can’t do this deal. I need something else.” and Beane worked with that. But still…it is take my injury prone star starter, please, and here’s a useful starter/reliever if that doesn’t entice you.

Of course, just by what you said, Beane knows more than we do and he could have determined that Gaudin and his slider are about to fall off the globe and Harden will never be healthy enough, long enough, to maximize his value, but still…I just can’t get over the package he got for Harden and that he had to throw in something extra.

by ghostofErikThompson on Jul 9, 2008 3:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think Beane did all right.

I’m one who thinks that Beane is often give far too much credit, but I think he did about as well as could be expected here. Harden is a ticking time bomb and I doubt many teams were lining up with a young pitcher of Gallagher’s potential as part of the offer. Gallagher will never match Harden’s talent, but he gives the A’s far more in terms of certainty in their rotation. They now have a good, young, and healthy rotation going forward. Patterson can play all over the field, which is important with the injuries they’ve had among the position players recently.

Murton potentially gives them a big upgrade if he can find the game he had in previous seasons, and he sure as hell is better than Emil Brown. The catcher isn’t hitting too well at the moment, but he was good in his previous minor league stops and draws walks. He has plenty of time, but as a throw in, not bad.

The Cubs did very well, though. If Harden stays healthy they have a terrific playoff rotation, and Gaudin fortifies the bullpen. It’s a very risky deal with high upside for them. Not a win for Beane, but probably not a bad deal for either club.

Time you enjoy wasting was not wasted.

by t ball on Jul 9, 2008 3:41 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

i agree

gaudin doesn’t have a long term arm, and Harden is high-risk. I’m sure Beane tried to pry a better prospect away from someone, like the Yankees, but with CC setting the trade bar fairly low, Beane probably figured that he should get what he can before Harden gets hurt again.

by JBImaknee on Jul 9, 2008 4:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Damaged Property

Was this trade made with the explicit understanding that Harden could be near a breakdown, hence the return? Or did Beane make this deal still maintaining that Harden is OK, and not damaged goods? If the latter, would the Cubs have recourse (I doubt they’d do it) if there was not full disclosure of an already sustained condition?

by mcgee48c on Jul 9, 2008 4:32 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Hardin/Gaudin for Hurley, Boggs, JMJ, and Jonathon Greene.

I’d do that.

Go Rangers!

by rooster on Jul 9, 2008 5:00 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

This is my fantasy MLB joke, but I love it

Why doesn’t Rich Harden go by Dick?

Nothing pithy here. Please move long.

by WyoRanger on Jul 9, 2008 6:07 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I think Gallagher...

could be a solid mid-rotation type guy. As the Oracle says him for Gaudin is about right.

However the rest of the deal is just junk for the A’s. A bunch of spares for Hardin. Again, I realize his health issues, but Beane should of held out longer to see if he could have got a better deal closer to the deadline imo. Not that I mind, of course.

"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates

by slc ranger on Jul 9, 2008 7:11 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs