Obama/Biden ticket it is....
http://news.yahoo.com/story//ap/veepstakes
CNN is covering the story as well on the tube.... seems to balance the ticket somewhat providing in areas Obama maybe lacking in terms of foreign policy experience as well as tenure in in the senate. If he keeps from sticking his foot in his mouth, he may be able to gain some of those moderate democrates that perhaps are on the fence. I like biden, im not sure i want him as being a lunatic away from being leader of the freeworld, but present me with a better option i say.
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Comments
So, I know not everyone
is going to agree with the “theory” that its important to “balance the ticket”… but does a relatively liberal US senator from Delaware really do much for Obama? I guess he adds a little foreign policy credibility to a democrat ticket, and a lot of experience. I’m a Conservative, so I’m curious to those that are leaning towards voting for Obama…
How much does Biden do for you?
"that suzuki guy should go back to making cars" - My girlfriend after C.J.'s close in game 2
by tdi1985 on Aug 23, 2008 1:21 AM CDT 0 recs
Well, for me...
…I like the pick. I think it’s the “safe” pick, if there is such a thing. He’s an excellent debater, putting the onus on McCain to find someone who can match up with him in the VP debates. He’s got tons and tons of foreign policy experience, which is where McCain was really attacking. And beyond that, he should be an excellent attack dog for Obama. If his “The only things that come out of Rudy Giuliani’s mouth are noun, verb and 9-11” is any indication, the Obama campaign is about to hit back and hit back hard.
I think it’s a good choice. I think it also shows the confidence that Obama has in his chances to carry Indiana and Virginia. It would have been easy to say “We’ll take Tim Kaine so Virginia goes blue” or Evan Bayh with Indiana. He didn’t do that, which is an interesting move. It also reminds me of the ’92 election, the last time the Dems won big, when they abandoned the idea of balancing the ticket regionally and ended up picking two Southerners (Clinton from Arkansas, Gore from Tennessee).
All I know is that with Biden in the race, there is going to be a lot more attacking of McCain coming soon.
Overall, though, I like the choice.
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
by ghtd36 on
Aug 23, 2008 1:27 AM CDT
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Yep...
I love it. I’m a big Biden guy and I think the experience he brings is what Obama needed the most. As you said, Joe isn’t afraid to pull punces either. I love how straight forward he is.
Great dem ticket in my opinion. I would have loved to flip them with Biden as the nominee and Obama the VP but it was clear in the beginning that Joe had no chance to win the nomination. Now if they can just show that they have a pair and not let the republican smear machine run them through the wringer during the campaign I will be a happy man.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
by slc ranger on
Aug 23, 2008 1:46 AM CDT
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But the way our country is...
don’t you think a regionally unbalanced ticket from the south, for democrats is a lot more effective than a regionally unbalanced ticket from the north? I mean, a lot of the north-eastern states are still a foregone conclusion for the democrats, no matter how you look at it.
"that suzuki guy should go back to making cars" - My girlfriend after C.J.'s close in game 2
by tdi1985 on
Aug 23, 2008 8:48 AM CDT
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well i'm guessing it'll be
“noun, verb, pow”
it was really lame and mysterious why the mccain campaign dude, while hitting back at obama for attacking mccain for not knowing how many houses he had, said, “mccain lived in 1 hourse for 5 years…in vietnam”
um, okay?
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
by gossamer on
Aug 23, 2008 1:31 PM CDT
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I have mixed feelings about it
He’s one of my favorite Democrats, but the guy is a little on the volatile side. They seem like completely different personalities to me, which I guess could be either a good or bad thing. I guess the thinking is he’d be good for campaigning, like ghtd said, and also good as part of the government.
I suppose I don’t really have a problem with it.
by Black Francis on Aug 23, 2008 1:42 AM CDT 0 recs
Obama/Biden
How can Obama honestly claim he’s some sort of agent for change and that he can break the partisan gridlock of Washington, and pick one of the longest-serving, most liberal senators? Obama is a hypocrite like all the rest of them.
by Randy Richardson on Aug 23, 2008 1:51 AM CDT 0 recs
I'd hardly call
Biden a “Washington Insider.”
It doesn’t sound like you’re much interested, though.
by brettgardner on
Aug 23, 2008 2:11 AM CDT
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well,
I don’t know what your definition of Washington insider is, but Biden is pretty clearly a liberal democrat who doesn’t have much of a record of working across party lines for change.
by Randy Richardson on
Aug 23, 2008 2:53 AM CDT
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Wrong.
He worked with a diverse group last year, including Sam Brownback, who’s about as far on the other side of the aisle as it gets, to include his Federal Iraq amendment to the Defense Authorization bill.
This year he’s worked with Dick Lugar to provide additional Pakistani aid in order to alleviate some of the major procedural problems there.
Last year he also co-sponsored a bill with Orrin Hatch to strengthen cyber-crime laws. Personally, I thought it was a mediocre attempt at a good idea, but that’s really beside the point.
Those are just a few examples off the top of my head. I would never argue that he’s a DINO, but to say that he’s some mindless puppet who never values the input or ideas of others seems, to me, to be incorrect.
by brettgardner on
Aug 23, 2008 3:18 AM CDT
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Biden
Come on, I didn’t say he never worked with Republicans. Those are fairly politically neutral examples.
I don’t think he’s a mindless puppet either, he’s obviously an intelligent guy who is a solid senator. I just don’t think Obama, “change”, and Biden go together. I think Kaine would have been a better choice. Who cares that Biden has Nat Sec experience? That’s what a Sec of State, NSA, etc are for.
by Randy Richardson on
Aug 23, 2008 8:37 AM CDT
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Not working with republicans = change
Since the nations horrendous mistake of electing Reagan in 1980, the GOP has totally screwed up the country. For 30 years. The party has no good ideas at all. I’d much rather not have someone with much experience working with the immoral GOP.
by PatrickWalz on
Aug 23, 2008 9:11 AM CDT
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I'm not going to argue with you about Reagan
because it doesn’t seem like there is anything that can be said to deter you from that stream of thought…
But you just completely discount the Contract with America in 1994? The Republicans have no ideas? I’d agree with that about today’s party… but that’s sort of the case with both parties right now. But you think the 1994 Republicans had no ideas?
"that suzuki guy should go back to making cars" - My girlfriend after C.J.'s close in game 2
by tdi1985 on
Aug 23, 2008 9:15 AM CDT
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I'm referring to good ideas.
From the time Reagan took down the solar panels, to the time he supported Islamic terrorists unnecessarily against a dying Soviet Union, to the time he unnecessarily plunged us a couple of extra trillion into debt to unnecessarily bring down the dying Soviet Union slightly quicker, to the politics of personal destruction they perfected over 8 Clinton years, to the USA Patriot Act, Iraq War, and finally “drill everywhere but for gods sakes don’t support conservation!”, they are a party opposed to everything I stand for.
by PatrickWalz on
Aug 23, 2008 9:20 AM CDT
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you said for 30 years...
and no good ideas… I wasn’t arguing whether or not they had bad ideas…
everyone in the history of the earth has had bad ideas. I was saying that it is unreasonable for you to say that they have had no good ideas.
"that suzuki guy should go back to making cars" - My girlfriend after C.J.'s close in game 2
by tdi1985 on
Aug 23, 2008 9:24 AM CDT
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30 years goes back to Reagan.
Should I have said 98% bad ideas?
I agree with the GOP on virtually no issues that are of dispute.
I used to be closer to them on a few issues, but the Dem’s have since moved right on most of those (guns, trade) but that’s about it.
Nuclear power is probably the ONLY issue I’ll agree with the GOP more on.
by PatrickWalz on
Aug 23, 2008 9:51 AM CDT
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Drill everywhere
Yeah, the GOP ALWAYS wants more drilling, less conservation, and no other alternatives.
"Over the last 15 months, we’ve traveled to every corner of the United States. I’ve now been in 57 states" - Barack Obama
by DaheelzCM on
Aug 23, 2008 10:21 AM CDT
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I agree
With your last sentiment, but I just think you’re falling into the easiest rhetorical trap out there.
It’s seemed that whenever ANYTHING happens in the Obama campaign, somebody pipes in with the obligatory, “I thought you were about ‘change’.”
The fact is, Obama had to pick a vice-president, he has to play the game of getting elected, and I honestly don’t think eitherof those things are exclusive of “changing” the political climate. Now, I don’t think that it’s a very likely event, but I can’t place the blame for that at Obama’s feet.
by brettgardner on
Aug 23, 2008 9:36 AM CDT
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when it came down to it...
he needed someone with experience because he has so little.
"that suzuki guy should go back to making cars" - My girlfriend after C.J.'s close in game 2
by tdi1985 on
Aug 23, 2008 9:39 AM CDT
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For the most part.
But I expressed below what I feel about that.
by brettgardner on
Aug 23, 2008 9:44 AM CDT
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I must have missed the Reagan memo
where ‘liberal’ became a go-to term for ‘bad political leader.’ It’s funny how a word for such a benign set of collective political beliefs has become borderline slanderous to use in any context. It certainly shouldn’t be any more ‘dirty’ a word than ‘conservative’ is. It’s a bland, over-simplified way of writing off an entire politician with one word, rather than analyzing the individual. It’s why I hate both of the words.
by Caseys Kiss of Death on
Aug 23, 2008 3:19 AM CDT
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liberal
I used the word to describe Biden as being to the left of the average Democrat. Nothing derogatory about that.
by Randy Richardson on
Aug 23, 2008 8:39 AM CDT
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I hate to boil it down to words too...
but you have to acknowledge the usefulness of labels. I don’t mean to cause any problems, but is it just me, or do left-leaning people tend to hate labels more than right-leaning people? Maybe its the result of right-leaning people working towards making the word “liberal” a dirty word, but if you don’t like the use of the word then to some degree, you’re accommodating the connotation!
He obviously doesn’t like liberal-democrats, that is clear in his connotation, but why do you have to hate the phrase? Why should liberal-democrat make you feel any worse than conservative-republican makes me feel? (that’s how I label myself).
"that suzuki guy should go back to making cars" - My girlfriend after C.J.'s close in game 2
by tdi1985 on
Aug 23, 2008 8:56 AM CDT
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I have no idea
but it seems like someone on this blog objected to me calling Bush a fascist conservative. Don’t see that as being any worse than calling liberals socialists.
What's the secret to a long life? "I masturbate a lot"-Ernest Borgnine. http://www.bestweekever.tv/2008/08/14/icymi-ernest-borgnine-reveals-his-secret-for-everlasting-youth/#onepage
by DJCahill on
Aug 23, 2008 9:04 AM CDT
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well, no one called Biden a socialist
in this discussion, but I suppose you’re talking about people calling Obama a socialist.
My point in this discussion was more that people seem more sensitive to the phrase “liberal-democrat” than to the phrase “conservative-republican”
and the most interesting thing to add to that… is that it is so unpopular to be a republican right now.
"that suzuki guy should go back to making cars" - My girlfriend after C.J.'s close in game 2
by tdi1985 on
Aug 23, 2008 9:11 AM CDT
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Dems need to work on marketing
and find a way to spend “Big Borrowing” conservatives the same way “Big Spending” is tied to Democrats.
After all, the Repubs proved in 2000-2006 that they don’t spend less than the Dems. They just piss it away on different things. Bridges to Nowhere, Giveaways to Agribusiness, more Medicare entitlements. Republicans are every bit as fond of bloated government as Democrats, they just want their friends getting the kickbacks.
What's the secret to a long life? "I masturbate a lot"-Ernest Borgnine. http://www.bestweekever.tv/2008/08/14/icymi-ernest-borgnine-reveals-his-secret-for-everlasting-youth/#onepage
by DJCahill on
Aug 23, 2008 9:15 AM CDT
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hah...
well I have no arguments with your statements there… there is a virus in Washington, and there are very few prescriptions for it. Obama isn’t going to be any better than McCain when it comes to spending/borrowing… if anything, McCain should be appealing in that he thought the Bush Tax Cuts were irresponsible with increased spending, and that he is a pretty strong and consistent opponent of pork spending!
"that suzuki guy should go back to making cars" - My girlfriend after C.J.'s close in game 2
by tdi1985 on
Aug 23, 2008 9:18 AM CDT
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McCain
has been saying there won’t be new taxes. There is a lot of blasting of Obama for his new taxes.
Personally, I’d rather see one of the candidates come out with the spending they plan on cutting, but both are mum about that because realistically both candidates are going to spend like drunk sailors on shore leave.
I think McCain has the easier message to sell. After all, a lot of Americans are Dumb enough to believe you can spend money without assessing taxes, and it all works out. It’s easy to sell Santa Claus and the Tooth fairy in this country.
What's the secret to a long life? "I masturbate a lot"-Ernest Borgnine. http://www.bestweekever.tv/2008/08/14/icymi-ernest-borgnine-reveals-his-secret-for-everlasting-youth/#onepage
by DJCahill on
Aug 23, 2008 9:21 AM CDT
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if anyone
had the nerve to cut spending, I’d be excited, republican or democrat. Neither will do it, but I think you’re more likely to see spending controlled by McCain than Obama. Of course… you are right, Obama might do more to cut the gap…. but it’s a matter of perspective on how you want to get there.
"that suzuki guy should go back to making cars" - My girlfriend after C.J.'s close in game 2
by tdi1985 on
Aug 23, 2008 9:29 AM CDT
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Well,
I used to be able to buy that, til 2000-2006. Now im voting Dem because at least there will be offsetting taxes to the spending.
If McCain wants my vote, he could make a list of where he is going to cut $50-$100 billion annually.
Barring that, I’ll go with the more sane fiscal approach of paying for what you spend.
What's the secret to a long life? "I masturbate a lot"-Ernest Borgnine. http://www.bestweekever.tv/2008/08/14/icymi-ernest-borgnine-reveals-his-secret-for-everlasting-youth/#onepage
by DJCahill on
Aug 23, 2008 9:44 AM CDT
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mccains...
…vison on money isn’t lucid… he can’t go three days without sticking his foot in his mouth regarding something with finance… either his homes, the 5million in income makes you middle class, the i-don’t-know-how-the-economy works thing… besides his tak plan would save his family $370K… and my family $300…
i just don’t think he has a firm grasp on real world financial workings…
I blame it not on Ron Washington, but on society. Society is to blame. And Ron Washington. ~Ken Tremendous on Ron Washington sac bunting in the 11th vs LAA
by ivysafety39 on
Aug 23, 2008 9:47 AM CDT
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I just don't see
How raising the capital gains tax is going to help do anything but discourage growth.
Now, the top Bush bracket? I’m willing to listen.
by brettgardner on
Aug 23, 2008 9:48 AM CDT
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Id rather they go after income
or even better consumption, but the few percentage points for capital gains aren’t gonna drag the economy to a screeching halt.
I just have the wacky notion that a balanced budget should be the norm, rather than the aberration it currently is.
What's the secret to a long life? "I masturbate a lot"-Ernest Borgnine. http://www.bestweekever.tv/2008/08/14/icymi-ernest-borgnine-reveals-his-secret-for-everlasting-youth/#onepage
by DJCahill on
Aug 23, 2008 9:51 AM CDT
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x
Using resources to stimulate the economy is a critical feature of modern government. That’d be nearly impossible with a strict balanced budget requirement, especially when you consider that increased taxes in other growth areas will make the currency sluggish already.
Also, a consumption tax is such a bad idea.
by brettgardner on
Aug 23, 2008 9:59 AM CDT
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I never said
that there should be a strict balanced budge requirement, however, there should be as many years of surplus as there are deficit. The only way consistend deficits are sustainable is through devaluation of the currency.
There is nothing wrong with consumption taxes. They are used all over the world, and in most states in this country.
What's the secret to a long life? "I masturbate a lot"-Ernest Borgnine. http://www.bestweekever.tv/2008/08/14/icymi-ernest-borgnine-reveals-his-secret-for-everlasting-youth/#onepage
by DJCahill on
Aug 23, 2008 10:14 AM CDT
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Right...
And a national consumption tax would be placed on top of those state taxes, only adding to their regressive nature and making it more difficult for lower-income families to survive.
What other taxes would levy upon all of us in the name of fiscal responsibility? Energy? Internet? Gas?
by brettgardner on
Aug 23, 2008 10:36 AM CDT
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yep!
sales taxes are very regressive. most people that engage in the argument understand it, but for those of you that don’t get it… low-income households spend a higher percentage of their income on taxable sales goods, relative to high-income households. And it makes sense if you think about it, a household that makes 30k is going to spend say… 10-15k just on consumption? so nearly 50%… A household that makes 200k isn’t going to spend 100k on consumption goods. There is only so much you can spend on clothing and cars in a year.
"that suzuki guy should go back to making cars" - My girlfriend after C.J.'s close in game 2
by tdi1985 on
Aug 23, 2008 11:00 AM CDT
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on a lighter note...
I’m watching the Olympic Women’s Basketball Final… don’t ask why… And they showed the Men’s team in the stands watching, and one of the players was wearing a Texas Rangers hat! I don’t really watch basketball, so I don’t know who he is… maybe someone here can identify him:


"that suzuki guy should go back to making cars" - My girlfriend after C.J.'s close in game 2
by tdi1985 on
Aug 23, 2008 9:37 AM CDT
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Yep
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
by Agreen07 on
Aug 23, 2008 9:46 AM CDT
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I hope the guy seated next to Deron catches the fuck on fire
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on
Aug 23, 2008 1:02 PM CDT
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I label myself
a conservative leftist moderately liberal progressive. Seems to fit me to a T.
by robert_d_wilfong on
Aug 23, 2008 2:10 PM CDT
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I don't hate the label
I hate people the people of U.C. Santa Cruz who have hijacked the label for themselves, so that they could appropriate it as a label for themselves, despite the fact that their practices and ideals are anything but.
by Caseys Kiss of Death on
Aug 23, 2008 3:29 PM CDT
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In the presidency
Change is going liberal. Unless you want to call Bush and Satan Cheney liberals.
What's the secret to a long life? "I masturbate a lot"-Ernest Borgnine. http://www.bestweekever.tv/2008/08/14/icymi-ernest-borgnine-reveals-his-secret-for-everlasting-youth/#onepage
by DJCahill on
Aug 23, 2008 9:02 AM CDT
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Change is going liberal
My impression was that Obama aspired to more than that.
by Randy Richardson on
Aug 23, 2008 9:15 AM CDT
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Has Obama
been hiding his liberalism? If you think he has, you haven’t been paying attention very well.
What's the secret to a long life? "I masturbate a lot"-Ernest Borgnine. http://www.bestweekever.tv/2008/08/14/icymi-ernest-borgnine-reveals-his-secret-for-everlasting-youth/#onepage
by DJCahill on
Aug 23, 2008 9:16 AM CDT
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Why would you include "most liberal"
seems to me if you want change, you’d go from a jesus freak conservative like Bush to a liberal.
What's the secret to a long life? "I masturbate a lot"-Ernest Borgnine. http://www.bestweekever.tv/2008/08/14/icymi-ernest-borgnine-reveals-his-secret-for-everlasting-youth/#onepage
by DJCahill on
Aug 23, 2008 9:00 AM CDT
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As a Republican,
please let me say thank you.
Joe Fucking Biden???
Do you boys from the left really wonder why you don’t win elections?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on Aug 23, 2008 1:56 AM CDT 0 recs
Says the guy...
who supports the party that just nominated a 72 year old man who is about to name Mormon Mitt as his VP…… no, thank you.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
by slc ranger on
Aug 23, 2008 1:58 AM CDT
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here we go again...
to me, abortion is not a religious issue, it's a common sense one...
by Longhorn on
Aug 23, 2008 2:08 AM CDT
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Have you added...
anything to the discussion in any political thread other than one of two word smarky responses?
Do you know enough to discuss a topic with someone or do you just plan on agreeing with the far right comments and blasting those to the left?
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
by slc ranger on
Aug 23, 2008 2:22 AM CDT
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Longhorn
isn’t capable of much more.
What's the secret to a long life? "I masturbate a lot"-Ernest Borgnine. http://www.bestweekever.tv/2008/08/14/icymi-ernest-borgnine-reveals-his-secret-for-everlasting-youth/#onepage
by DJCahill on
Aug 23, 2008 9:04 AM CDT
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Since when was knowing something about the subject
a pre-requisite to discussing it on this board?
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
by Agreen07 on
Aug 23, 2008 9:47 AM CDT
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can't argue with liberals
like djc, ‘cause all he does is make up stuff…so, what’s the point?
to me, abortion is not a religious issue, it's a common sense one...
by Longhorn on
Aug 23, 2008 1:17 PM CDT
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glad GOP dont make stuff up
/ignores war in iraq
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
by Jayslick on
Aug 23, 2008 1:26 PM CDT
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What stuff did the GOp make up?
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
by Agreen07 on
Aug 23, 2008 2:09 PM CDT
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Difference
between making stuff up and having bad intel. Did everyone else that said there were WMDs make it up either?
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
by Agreen07 on
Aug 23, 2008 2:22 PM CDT
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They were all too willing
to believe that bad intel, despite the fact that many hid misgivings. Those who questioned the intel were shouted down, ignored, or called unpatriotic.
Time you enjoy wasting was not wasted.
by t ball on
Aug 23, 2008 2:43 PM CDT
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Hardly anyone
questioned …..look at what percentage of congress approved the War.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
by Agreen07 on
Aug 23, 2008 2:53 PM CDT
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Oh, there were some who were against it from the start.
Like that Senator from Illinois…his name escapes me.
"One man, five scoops." -- shroomer
by ghtd36 on
Aug 23, 2008 2:54 PM CDT
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THat has nothing to do with what we are talking
about…but yes he voted against it. That is the only reason why he is the Dem’s candidate, because he certainly doesn’t have anything else to his name.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
by Agreen07 on
Aug 23, 2008 2:58 PM CDT
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CIA gave them intel that said no WMD's were there before the war even started
the head of intel for iraq defected and was our man. he said as much right then. a new book just came out. the guy is a pulitzer winner. read it.
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
by Jayslick on
Aug 23, 2008 3:05 PM CDT
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We also had intel that said tehre were weapons
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
by Agreen07 on
Aug 23, 2008 4:20 PM CDT
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it's cherry picking
oh, we got these 99 pieces of evidence that say NO WMD.
but we got this 1 that says yes. let’s ignore the 99 and keep it secret.
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
by gossamer on
Aug 23, 2008 4:25 PM CDT
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That wasn't the case at all
stop over exaggerating your points it makes you look silly and when you do that people don’t take you seriously.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
by Agreen07 on
Aug 23, 2008 4:50 PM CDT
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Bottom line
There weren’t. So regardless it was a huge mistake on the part of a blood-thirsty administration.
by robert_d_wilfong on
Aug 23, 2008 4:54 PM CDT
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Jesus Christ
blood-thirsty administration? How is anybody supposed to debate with you when you talk like that?
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
by Agreen07 on
Aug 23, 2008 5:00 PM CDT
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