More on the C.J. situation
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Otherwise, follow me through the jump...

Evan Grant has a blog post up about why he thinks the C.J. Wilson situation, and the related fallout, is significant, in terms of what is going on with this team and in the clubhouse, particularly as it relates to Ron Washington and the respect he commands in the clubhouse.
I don't know that it is really that big of a deal...other folks have suggesting the "everyone pulling together" factor is part of the reason that the team is able to come back from big deficits, as it has done several times this year, although I think that has more to do with the team having quality hitters.
But I do think that this provides more detail as to what is going on behind the scenes, and is worth thinking about...
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I believe
CJ made a mistake. I believe Wash caught him and did the best thing… dealt with him DIRECTLY. No rumors, no misunderstandings, no big deal in the long run. The BIG DEAL is losing your closer, losing a LHP who tosses 96 mph WITH bone spurs. I expect BGL to come out MUCH better BECAUSE of this in the long run. I am thankful that Ron took care of it so quickly and so directly.
"Purity of heart is to will one thing" - Kierkegaard
by outofnace on
Aug 6, 2008 11:02 AM CDT
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Interesting take from Evan
I think he puts the “chemistry” idea in a decent perspective. I’ve always kinda ridden the fence on believing in team chemistry, but I think he makes a valid point that a good chemistry (or rather, a good chemistry stemming from a belief that everyone works hard and at least tries their best) allows guys to relax and not press as hard.
I’d also like to say that, while some of Wash’s lineup moves have been really mind boggling this year, I’m really happy with the way he handled the situation yesterday. Maybe we should start an open letter to Ron asking him to just write names on the lineup card in order of greatest to least OBP?
by jwiscarson on
Aug 6, 2008 11:03 AM CDT
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best
thats probably one of Evan’s best Ranger’s posts ever.
by 6th street on
Aug 6, 2008 11:05 AM CDT
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I am with you AJM
I am not too sure that the main reason they are where they are is because of team chemistry. Yes, that is a big part of it but i do think that the main reason for this team winning is they do have great hitters in the lineup and they are young, so they are not scared to get out there just swing away!! I hat this for CJ. I do agree that his antics last night were disrespectful and should have been delt with. I think its more of a case that CJ is a serious competitor and has hit this “slump” and is pissed that he is not helping his team win. He needs to be taken out of the closer role, FOR NOW! Get him completely healthy, let him spend some time either comming in the 6 or 7 or even closing down in Frisco or OKC. Get him healthy and then lest see what he can do. I personally think he could be a serviceable starter but also a decent closer.
by thad728 on
Aug 6, 2008 11:07 AM CDT
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I don't get what CJ's problem is
He’s having a bad year, no doubt about it, but he’s the last guy I would have imagined to spiral out of control like this. He doesn’t strike me as the perfectionist, egocentric type of player who cracks at the first sign of being vulnerable. But maybe he is just that, and the whole well-rounded, in tune with everything in the world, confident but carefree attitude was just a facade presented to the world to hide a fear of failure. Because he’s acting like a guy terrified to face the day, not the BGL who was posting here last offseason.
Maybe I’m not good at reading people, but before this season I would never have expected that in an article about 24 of 25 guys pulling in the same direction, the 1 who wasn’t was CJ Wilson.
by JBImaknee on
Aug 6, 2008 11:21 AM CDT
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The only real problem I see in CJ is
health and maturity. He is only 27, very young IMO, and trying to step up as a leader (closer) of the team. Add some performance and health issues and I can understand his outburst last night. NOT ACCEPT IT but undersatnd why it happened. Personally I love how Wash handled the situation and believe the future still looks very bright for CJ.
by Bigfan16 on
Aug 6, 2008 11:27 AM CDT
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"He is only 27"
Which makes him, what, the 10th youngest guy on the roster? I don’t understand why he feels the need to be the leader of the team. Maybe that is where the maturity issue kicks in – he wants to be the center of attention and he isn’t good enough to be. Not on a team with some of those other guys.
by JBImaknee on
Aug 6, 2008 11:50 AM CDT
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desire to be the center of attention
there you have it.
I’ve always thought of Cj as the type of guy that needs the attention, and also needs to tell people that the attention makes him uncomfortable.
Warner Madrigal makes Ezequiel Astacio look downright handsome.
by tricer on
Aug 6, 2008 12:05 PM CDT
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How about some love for Laird too.
I thought Laird handled the CJ situation extremely well. At the beginnig of last season Laird and Wash were a little sideways in their approach to the catching role. I don’t think Wash has changed, but Laird demonstrated leadership required in a good catcher and he looked a lot like what Wash has been preaching since he arrived here.
Additionally, Laird who has excelled defensively this year has also put together a fantastic offensive season. Look at his numbers and the fact he has been hitting 2nd recently and I can only say WOW. I have been on the fence as to whom should be the Ranger C of the future. Last night, Laird took a big step toward winning that spot for me.
by Bigfan16 on
Aug 6, 2008 11:23 AM CDT
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well
he yelled at him….right before he gave up a grand slam. kudos.
by SteveP on
Aug 6, 2008 11:25 AM CDT
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Yes.
He had the huevos to confront the pitcher and friend on how to appraoch the situation. Sometimes that is needed. The slam is not relavent, what is important is Laird reflecting what the manager has been preaching since he got here.
by Bigfan16 on
Aug 6, 2008 11:31 AM CDT
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i've always been a laird fan
but last night’s meltdown has kinda put me in the Teagarden camp. Ceej threw several pitches in the zone that were called balls, partially b/c of his wildness and partially b/c of Laird’s wandering glove work.
by SteveP on
Aug 6, 2008 11:39 AM CDT
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You can't blame that on Laird
Come on. The ump last night had one of the worst strike zones I have ever seen.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on
Aug 6, 2008 11:40 AM CDT
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not blaming him
just saying, getting a call or two could have changed the whole situation.
by SteveP on
Aug 6, 2008 11:58 AM CDT
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I also don't think
Laird is very good at framing pitches, especially low in the zone. He lets borderline pitches drag his glove down and out of the strike zone on a pretty regular basis. Sticking those pitches can change at bats and games in the pitcher’s favor sometimes. I’m not really down on Laird, but that is something I always thought he could improve upon, and with our pitching staff, we need all the help we can get.
Formerly known as OKRangerFan
by B_Black on
Aug 6, 2008 1:13 PM CDT
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The slam is relevant.
It shows that whatever Laird did, it wasn’t particularly productive.
"And I stopped beating my wife just a couple of weeks ago." -John McCain
by DJCahill on
Aug 6, 2008 11:48 AM CDT
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Get over it.
There are too many people that just dont get it. Laird has BY FAR been the best, most productive, and most consistent backstop the Rangers have had since pudge left. Give me a break if you are trying to put that slam on him. Thats just stupid. CJ couldnt find the zone and when he did, it was a 94 mph right down the pipe. Sexon barily had to swing. I do believe Laird was set up about 6 inches more inside. Get over all of yalls “Salty” love. Laird is our guy and SHOULD be!! There are too many “Salty” lovers and for what reason? Thats all i want to know. What has Salty done to gain everyone’s affection? BC i sure havent seen it!!
There i said it, got it off my chest and no i can move on. Sorry for the semi rant!!
by thad728 on
Aug 6, 2008 12:40 PM CDT
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you should be
it was completely misplaced
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
by ab03 on
Aug 6, 2008 12:45 PM CDT
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How so???!!?
people are on here are trying to push some of the blame on the Laird when every bit of it should stay with CJ. It just gets old when people continue to crap on Laird and he has done nothing to deserve it. He has been great for this team on the field and in the clubhouse!!
by thad728 on
Aug 6, 2008 12:55 PM CDT
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I'm not blaming Laird
I am just pointing out the fact that obviously his yelling didn’t help anything.
"And I stopped beating my wife just a couple of weeks ago." -John McCain
by DJCahill on
Aug 6, 2008 4:57 PM CDT
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I agree
That was completely misplaced. I’m not a big Laird fun, but there’s no way that Laird’s inability to frame pitches is an excuse for the pitching struggles. Absolutely no way.
by aggierangerfan00 on
Aug 6, 2008 5:23 PM CDT
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what about his ability to call a game?
i remember a certain HOF catcher getting run out of town and on his way out many fans said his inability to call a game was a huge factor. he ended up winning a WS IIRC.
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
by Jayslick on
Aug 6, 2008 5:47 PM CDT
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Laird only yelled after CJ turned his back and stomped off the back of the mound.
That tells me his pitcher had completely lost his focus and his professionalism. As the catcher, it’s Laird’s job to direct the game. What is he supposed to do when his pitcher acts like a jackass in a critical game situation?
by Athos on
Aug 6, 2008 11:39 AM CDT
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Whatever point in the game it happened ...
Laird didn’t shout until CJ walked away from him during their mound conference. Should he have given him a sucker and a pat on the head and apologized for disturbing CJ when CJ pulled that unprofessional crap? I really don’t see how you can take issue with Laird here … unless you’re simply trying to find something, anything, to take issue with Laird about.
by Athos on
Aug 6, 2008 11:59 AM CDT
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there was a disagreement
but no resolution.
Laird wasn’t in the wrong for yelling, but he certainly didn’t help the situation. Maybe he needs to use some more kid gloves and go and tell CJ there’s nothing to get mad at and patt him on the ass or whatever the hell it would require to calm him down.
I get that CJ might have done somethign childish and was pouting but a catcher is supposed to calm a pitcher down and he didn’t do that
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
by ab03 on
Aug 6, 2008 12:02 PM CDT
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i simply disagree with
the premise that yelling at your pitcher demonstrates leadership, or that it will be effective – especially with someone as hyper as cj is on the mound.
by SteveP on
Aug 6, 2008 12:06 PM CDT
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Whats he supposed to do
The guy had just walked the first two batters then hit another to load the bases. He couldn’t find the strike zone which last time I checked was pretty important for a pitcher. Laird goes out to try and get him to throw strikes and CJ turns his back on him and starts walking away. Whats Laird supposed to do? Say “oh ok well you obviously have it under control”. Laird did exactly what he should have done. I have no problem with lairds actions last night.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on
Aug 6, 2008 12:09 PM CDT
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and yet
it led to a GS.
Maybe if he had done what you said, he would have calmed CJ down.
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
by ab03 on
Aug 6, 2008 12:15 PM CDT
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i didn't see him
turn his back on laird. i’m watching the mlb.tv feed.
by SteveP on
Aug 6, 2008 12:18 PM CDT
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He started walking away toward the back of the mound
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on
Aug 6, 2008 12:32 PM CDT
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Interesting you posted a Bull Durham reference.
Listening to Harrison being interviewed after the game last night I thought he sounded a lot like Meat early in the movie after a great performance. Can we get Crash to coach our young pitchers on the cliche’s to be used in an interview!
by Bigfan16 on
Aug 6, 2008 5:41 PM CDT
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Lairds jobs is to calm down the pitcher and get the most of every mound meeting, regardless of who is pitching
i didnt see anything remotely resembling that out of the mound meeting.
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
by Jayslick on
Aug 6, 2008 12:22 PM CDT
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Did CJ throw a strike?
Something he hadn’t done to the previous three batters.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on
Aug 6, 2008 12:31 PM CDT
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is that a joke?
it’s not even true – he had thrown strikes.
and CJ missed Laird’s glove
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
by ab03 on
Aug 6, 2008 12:46 PM CDT
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He had gotten behind the first 3 batters
Walked two and hit one. Laird wanted him to get ahead and throw strikes. Laird was set up on the inside corner and CJ grooved one down the pipe.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on
Aug 6, 2008 1:09 PM CDT
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Seriously, did you watch the game?
Unless your definition of a strike is as flimsy as the umpire from last night’s game, CJ threw several strikes that were called balls. When they showed the tracker after Derek Jeter’s at-bat, it showed that CJ struck him out (two balls halfway in the strike zone, one fully in the strike zone) that were called balls.
CJ has sucked lately, but when you have an umpire who will not give you any borderline pitches, how are you supposed to throw a strike unless it’s right down the middle?
by jwiscarson on
Aug 6, 2008 2:20 PM CDT
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Thats my point
CJ got behind in the counts. Whether the actual pitches he threw were balls or strikes they were called balls by the umpire. He walked the first two and hit the third batter. The bases were loaded. Laird tried to get him to get ahead in the count. Thats what the catcher is supposed to do. CJ threw a strike but it was right down the pipe and most ML hitters are going to crush those.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on
Aug 6, 2008 2:24 PM CDT
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What?
Laird wanted CJ to throw strikes on the inside corner because CJ had gotten behind the previous three batters by throwing outside strikes that were called balls?
by jwiscarson on
Aug 6, 2008 2:28 PM CDT
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And, for the record...
CJ’s pitch was dead on target towards Laird’s glove.
by jwiscarson on
Aug 6, 2008 2:31 PM CDT
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well he put the ball in play
instead of walking or hitting another batter…bad results, but got the ball in play.
"So you have no frame of reference here, Donny. You're like a child who wanders into the middle of a movie and wants to know... "
by Walter Sobchak on
Aug 6, 2008 3:52 PM CDT
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CJ & 2009
CJ was disrepectful…blah. Wash handled it great….blah. This team’s got great chemistry….blah.
Here’s what concerns me now: The idea was to give CJ this season to close so we’d know what we have going into the future, right? Well if he’s shut down for the season, which seems like the most logical outcome right now, what is CJ, closer, set up, situational? Can the Rangers afford to start 2009 with him as the closer and if not, who is the closer then?
by cgolden on
Aug 6, 2008 11:26 AM CDT
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This is a great point.
I have heard a few people call for Frankie Frank to move into the closer’s role. He has been much, much better lately, but I am still quite afraid of his ability (or lack thereof) to consistently throw strikes. Not that a better solution has presented itself lately…
by jwiscarson on
Aug 6, 2008 11:33 AM CDT
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If Eddie G
gets some saves to close out the season, he’ll almost certainly move into compensation pick territory.
Minor consideration, i know, but something to think about
by JBImaknee on
Aug 6, 2008 12:01 PM CDT
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I know I'm the only person who feels like this
but I have a problem with the players and manager having a problem with what CJ did. He was frustrated, he let it show. Everyone does that sometimes—forgive and forget. His teammates should understand that CJ is pissed at himself for pitching like crap.
I don’t think CJ was trying to show up Washington. I do think Washington showed up CJ by grabbing his arm. I thought it was totally unnecessary. Talk to him after the game and keep it in the clubhouse. If Washington just takes the ball the first time like it was no big deal is it a big deal to us? Do we care this morning?
Bigger than this incident, the one thing I hate about baseball is stuff like this. Joba yells after he strikes a guy out and he’s bad sport? Milledge high fives fans after a great catch and he’s a showboat? A guy runs too slow after hitting a HR and he’s showing up the pitcher? Cj Tosses the ball to his manager after he got shelled instead of handing it to him and he’s the antichrist? Sometimes I think there are people who want to watch robots play baseball… as long they aren’t on steroids. Emotion, good or bad, shouldn’t be suppressed just because you’re on a baseball diamond. I want more stuff like that in the game not less.
But I realize I’m alone here.
www.mavsmoneyball.com
by Wes Cox on
Aug 6, 2008 11:37 AM CDT
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what if
I see your point but what if he does that and no one says anything? Maybe the next time he gives up a big HR and Wash comes out to get him, he just drops the ball on the mound and walks off before Wash even gets there. There’s nothing wrong with showing emotion but there’s no point in ‘flicking’ the ball in the air. How stupid would they all have looked if Wash didn’t catch it and the ball hit the ground and rolled halfway to home plate? There’s just no need for it. Hand the ball off, walk to the dugout and then beat the hell out of a water cooler.
by cgolden on
Aug 6, 2008 11:42 AM CDT
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exactly
there is a difference between a player being cocky or emotional and a player being disrespectful.
by JBImaknee on
Aug 6, 2008 11:58 AM CDT
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You see the difference in your examples
All your examples except CJs involved one person. Joba yelling, Milledge high fiving, A batter going slow. CJs involved himself and the manager. His boss. Like golden said above if CJ had handed Wash the ball the first time and gone in the digout and beat up a cooler nobody would have said anything. But he showed a lack of respect to his boss and his teammates by just flipping the ball to Wash. And the comments by teammates and management mention that. Byrd mentioned it was bad he showed up Wash. JD said his actions on the mound being taken out were unacceptable.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on
Aug 6, 2008 11:45 AM CDT
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Yeah, good points
And I can see that obviously his teammates had a problem with it and that’s what matters. Hopefully CJ has apoligized to everyone and it’s all in the past.
Personally, I don’t think CJ should have to apoligize because I don’t think what he did should have offended anyone in the first place.
www.mavsmoneyball.com
by Wes Cox on
Aug 6, 2008 11:54 AM CDT
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so, you don't apologize to people
even though you don’t think you did anything wrong but you know that people were offended by your actions?
“I didn’t think my actions were offensive but if they were, I apologize”
Pretty standard apology that lots of people give.
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
by ab03 on
Aug 6, 2008 12:05 PM CDT
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No, misunderstood me.
CJ has to apoligize because he offended people. Has to.
I was just questioning whether people should really be offended by what he did.
www.mavsmoneyball.com
by Wes Cox on
Aug 6, 2008 12:16 PM CDT
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ok
and as to that – baseball is an old sport with old traditions and things like this get people offended. I’m not going to question the validity of it too much. at it’s base, it’s showing frustration in a kind of pouting manner. i’m not offended but it doesn’t speak highly of CJ
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
by ab03 on
Aug 6, 2008 12:18 PM CDT
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x
at its base, it’s showing…
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
by ab03 on
Aug 6, 2008 12:24 PM CDT
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I agree with you
to the extent that I don’t think I would have thought it was a big deal had Ron Washington not grabbed CJ.
But I think other people would have thought it was a big deal (people more around the sport of baseball than me).
And, I like how you and Cahill (always get the Cahill dig in when I can) want to watch grown men act like babies for your amusement. What adult pouts at work? And if they do, do you respect people like that? Would you like it if your boss threw a monitor out the window if he lost the Andrews account (I have no idea what you do)? You don’t have to act like a robot but just act like a professional. You can have a sense of humor about what you do and recognize that you are entertaining people but what CJ did is just embarrassing to himself.
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
by ab03 on
Aug 6, 2008 12:13 PM CDT
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Much ado about
not much. He’s pissed off the brass and his teammates, but he’ll apologize, get healthy and be fine. The bigger question is who is the closer next year? I think Wilson is a setup guy and if they plan to contend next year both the rotation and bullpen need some serious work. With all of the young guys they may end up ok in the bullpen, I’d target the rotation and let the depth take care of the bullpen.
Time you enjoy wasting was not wasted.
by t ball on
Aug 6, 2008 12:14 PM CDT
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I'm sorry
maybe I’m wrong, but I think if he is demoted from closer for the future, he’s going to have to start or be shipped off to another team. was he given the chance to succeed as closer this year? yes. did he? to some degree, but he failed as well. was he 100% healthy? we don’t know yet. if he was, he blew his shot. and should be demoted. but I don’t see him going from wanting to be either a starter or closer, to closing, then to being satisfied with setup duties again in a demotion, especially if he is as mentally weak as you all think he is. he will implode if that is true. now – if he hasn’t been healthy for the past 2 months, I see no reason at all why he shouldn’t close again next year if healthy.
"So you have no frame of reference here, Donny. You're like a child who wanders into the middle of a movie and wants to know... "
by Walter Sobchak on
Aug 6, 2008 3:56 PM CDT
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I don't know if Evan Grant
would be the most objective on any CJ subject, JMHO.
By the way, i love CJ, i’v defended him a lot, but what he did on the mound was unacceptable. Hopefully, he’ll get healthy and come back strong and just put this crazy season behind him…
Josh Hamilton is better than you.
by Longhorn on
Aug 6, 2008 12:16 PM CDT
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Evan Grant hates CJ
that’s pretty much a fact.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on
Aug 6, 2008 1:07 PM CDT
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hes a lousy beat writer
i still dont get how a guy who most of the time is answering half assed questions that others pose for him rather than investigating and reporting on the sport he covers in depth = strongly supported on LSB.
perhaps its b/c ppl here get their names on a news site by asking the questions?
naw!! we arent that dumb around here are we???
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
by Jayslick on
Aug 6, 2008 1:16 PM CDT
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Im pretty sure nobody in the baseball world cares what any of the writers think
Its just an outlet to get the news out. The interviews are all for PR. The media is a tool for sports management.
by Hot Stuff on
Aug 6, 2008 1:56 PM CDT
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