Lone Star Ball: An SB Nation Community

Navigation: Jump to content areas:

Around SBN: Homeruns, Phillies Upend Dodgers in L.A. Bar-right-arrows

McCarthy...

Nolan_ryan_tiny by erikj07 on

Sorry guys this probably doesn't merit its own fanpost but I really want to know the CORRECT answer to this question about Brandon McCarthy... If he is activated and then immediately optioned to AAA for the rest of the year does that guarantee that the team will control him for an additional 3 years after this season allowing him not to hit free agency until after the 2011 season? I'd appreciate it if someone who knows the intricacies of how that works sheds light on the issue. If this is true, I don't see why we would not take this path, considering he has not performed well in the rehab assignments coupled with the fact that we don't need a #5 starter for a while. By the way, does anyone see Evan Grants prediction at getting sheets at 4 years, 64 million at all possible. I highly doubt you could sign him for that price. With this market a guy with his potential (even with the injury history), I bet it costs the winning bidder upwards of 5 years, 75-80 million. Thoughts?

3 recs | Comment 90 comments

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

Display:

McCarthy

He was just scratched yesterday…not sure the reason. I really would be in favor of him getting his shit together and not come up until next year.

As for Sheets….we all though Zito would get 5 years, 75 million so i think that would be a real optimistic number for Sheets. Forget 4 years, 64 million. I think it takes 5 years, 90 million minimum.

by slimshadty12 on Aug 7, 2008 4:49 PM CDT   0 recs

5yrs/90 mil would be opening offer

I’d resist going to 20mm. Don’t know why, though. I assume it’s just one of those artificial barriers my mind hesitates to allow me to cross.

Maybe 5/90 with a vesting option (based on innings) for a 6th year at 20mil?

The 40 Trumps All!!!

by thedirkatron on Aug 8, 2008 12:51 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Haren

I wonder if the Haren extension (2 years for $31 million, plus a $15.5 million option) would change how others make offers this winter.

by Excel Hearts Choi on Aug 8, 2008 7:00 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

McCarthy

Time on the 60 day DL counts toward service time. So according to cots coming into the season he had 2 years and 55 days of service time. Since he has spent over 120 days on the 60 day DL thus far he has over 3 years of service time as of right now. Which means that if he spend the next 3 years in the majors thats all we have him for. However if we start him in the minors next year and bring him up after say a month, not certain on the exact amount of days, we could delay his FA for basically another year. He will still be arbitration eligible after this year but instead of 3 arbitration years he would have 4 essentially. Hope that helps.

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on Aug 7, 2008 4:59 PM CDT   0 recs

so basically...

if he does not play at all at the major league level this season he would still have to spend roughly a month in AAA at the start of next year in order for the team to control him for an additional 4 years? He wouldn’t hit FA until after the 2012 season if that were to happen?

by erikj07 on Aug 7, 2008 5:03 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

yep

Although until the end of the year I wouldn’t know the exact amount of time he would have to spend in the minors next year. Could be a month could be a couple weeks.

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on Aug 7, 2008 5:06 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

hmm...

that sounds unrealistic assuming he is healthy out of spring training, don’t you think? I have to assume if he is healthy he will get a spot over all the rookies competing. Unless of course the organization keeps him in the minors with the intention of doing this.

by erikj07 on Aug 7, 2008 5:14 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Well

It depends on a few things. Schedule is one big one. Like this year and last when we didn’t need a 5th starter almost the entire 1st month of the season. Plus what we do in the offseason will play a big role. Going into next year we have Millwood and Padilla basically locked into rotation spots. Feldman is out of options so he will have to be kept on the 25 man roster. Theres 3. If we add a FA starter like a Sheets or a Garland that would make 4. So I think if that happens you could start out with Hurley in the majors for that first month and let him have 3 or 4 starts before swapping him out for McCarthy.

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on Aug 7, 2008 5:16 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Yeah...

not so unrealistic after all. It seems to me like he won’t be in the majors this year so at this point there are too many factors which have yet to be settled but you do make a good point in that it isn’t too unrealistic of an option. Hopefully he stays healthy, does well in AAA, and then gets the call up when we need a 5th starter next year (making him FA eligible after 2012). That would be ideal.

by erikj07 on Aug 7, 2008 5:27 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

From the DMN Blog - side session with Ryan, Hawkins, and Colborn

McCarthy apparently had a throwing session with Ryan and the 2 new pitching coaches watching, according to Richard Durrett. It’s interesting reading, I’m just going to block quote it instead of linking:

RHP Brandon McCarthy made an appearance in Arlington today because he wanted Nolan Ryan and pitching coaches Andy Hawkins and Jim Colburn to look at his mechanics. It was McCarthy’s idea and the club agreed.

Ryan said the focus was getting McCarthy to use his lower body more and make his delivery more fluid. McCarthy thinks it worked. He said it’s the best he’s felt on a mound in maybe two years. “It was like I was pitching when I went through the minors,” McCarthy said. “I am excited. I need to keep this going.”

McCarthy was supposed to start last night, so this takes the place of that. He could start for Triple-A Oklahoma again in four or five days.

I will say, McCarthy looked genuinely excited. It was like he had a break-through moment. We’ll have to see if he can replicate what he did today without the Rangers president and Hall of Famer watching.

Time you enjoy wasting was not wasted.

by t ball on Aug 7, 2008 5:01 PM CDT   0 recs

excellent revelation

but if he really wants to make significant changes to his delivery, he should scrap plans to pitch this season, and someone should really be video taping (maybe they were, i don’t know). takes time to adjust to new mechanics without reverting to your old habits under the stress of a game.

by SteveP on Aug 7, 2008 5:13 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Agree

He is better off not worrying about returning to the majors this year.

Time you enjoy wasting was not wasted.

by t ball on Aug 7, 2008 5:15 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

It would be nice to get the minor league McCarthy

ERA 3.33, 63 Games, , 0.78 HR/9, 1.71BB/9, 10.12K9, and a 1.11 Whip.
baseball cube

So, I would agree with the thought that he needs to concentrate on next year. Maybe some winter ball?

Godwin's Law Version 2.0 (Rangers Edition)
"As a Ranger discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Danks, Volquez, or Young approaches one."

by LBBRangerFan on Aug 7, 2008 5:19 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I'd sent him to instructs

and then put him somewhere you can watch him if he is to alter his delivery

by FirebatM3 on Aug 7, 2008 5:22 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Yeah

didn’t he project through the minors to be a #1 or #2 starter?

"We live, we die, and the wheels on the bus go round and round." - Tony Romo

by kentbenfer on Aug 7, 2008 9:55 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

And by the way, I am not going to get the least bit excited about that

post and McCarthy’s statements until it is supported by some consistent results. I’m glad he’s all enthused and everything, but let’s see if he can translate that into game action over time and stay healthy.

Time you enjoy wasting was not wasted.

by t ball on Aug 7, 2008 5:26 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I'm surprised it took this long.

Your lower half can take a TON of pressure off of your elbow and shoulder (based on how your body aligns itself and carries forward when the lower half is more engaged in acceleration).

Plus, he’d been here for almost two years – albeit a lot of that time has been spent on the DL – and the only person I’ve seen draw attention to his lower half was a side-by-side photo comparison of McCarthy’s stride as a White Sox player and as a Rangers player. Dramatic difference.

Have a look yourself: What have they done to Brandon McCarthy?

It's filed under 'D'... for donut.

by NoNameOnCard on Aug 7, 2008 5:29 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

yeah, he's a mess

looks like he lands on his toe as well, rather than his heel.

btw, check out the top photo as a white sock – see his heel coming up lifting off the rubber? i used to do this same exact thing. causes you to open up early, lose velocity and command. can’t drive off your toe. you have to try to keep that heel down as long as possible. he is absolutely a toe striker. i always blamed it on being a two sport athlete – basketball teaches you to always be on your toes.

by SteveP on Aug 7, 2008 5:42 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

If you land on your heel...

your hips aren’t free to open up at all. For the sake of rotating your hips, you’re much better off landing on the ball of your foot.

As for his back foot… you have to pick up your heel to finish your stride. Your coaches have been half-right. Your leg is stronger when driving from the heel, but you can’t finish the pitch without finishing your stride with a strong push from your calf. That obviously can’t be accomplished with your heel on the ground. It’s hard to say from that photo if he came up early (leading to balance and power issues), but based on how far he’s already strided (strode? stridden?), I’d say his timing looks fine.

It's filed under 'D'... for donut.

by NoNameOnCard on Aug 7, 2008 5:48 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

the heel does come off the rubber

at the end of the stride. and if you mentally try to keep the heel on as long as possble while still striding out quick and long, you’ll keep the hips closed longer harnassing more energy. pushing off with the toe will open the hips. try it.

by SteveP on Aug 7, 2008 6:09 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

That's what I just said.

Why are you trying to convince me?

It's filed under 'D'... for donut.

by NoNameOnCard on Aug 7, 2008 10:48 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

btw,

one guy’s mechanics i like even more than lincecum:

by SteveP on Aug 7, 2008 6:22 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Question...

Are you the guy who is proud to be teaching active scapular loading to young kids?

It's filed under 'D'... for donut.

by NoNameOnCard on Aug 7, 2008 10:42 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

as a matter of fact

i pointed out mccarthy as a scap loader and an injury risk.

by SteveP on Aug 8, 2008 1:10 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

K.

I just remember that there’s someone on here who’s very proud of teaching kids that they should be scap loading. I threw up a little when I read it.

It's filed under 'D'... for donut.

by NoNameOnCard on Aug 8, 2008 12:43 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

This photo shows the same...

problems as Lincecum. His legs are now only engaged in slowing his momentum down. No part of his lower body is adding to the pitch here.

On the plus side, his arm is in a much healthier position than Lincecum’s arm.

It's filed under 'D'... for donut.

by NoNameOnCard on Aug 8, 2008 12:03 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

once the front foot lands

very little else can be done to contribute to velocity. at that point you’re just transfer all of the momentum created from the “lunge” into the arm by firming up the leg. virtually all of his momentum to deliver that pitch was generated by his lower body.

by SteveP on Aug 8, 2008 12:51 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

But it's just momentum

Momentum won’t increase if there’s no active force behind it, it will only slow down. His legs can be better utilized here.

It's filed under 'D'... for donut.

by NoNameOnCard on Aug 8, 2008 12:44 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

are you some kind of pitching coach?

...you certainly like to correct people with your critiques.

by oc on Aug 8, 2008 12:52 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Your two statements don't seem to go together.

Are they separate observations or are you judging pitching coaches as a group?

It's filed under 'D'... for donut.

by NoNameOnCard on Aug 8, 2008 1:06 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Your two statements don't seem to go together.

Are they separate observations or are you judging pitching coaches as a group?

It's filed under 'D'... for donut.

by NoNameOnCard on Aug 8, 2008 1:06 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Heh.

I like your close reading, dude.

Go Strangers.

by hightowersmith on Aug 8, 2008 1:40 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Also

A firm front leg is designed to complete halt momentum. Leaving your core and arm to do most of the work, leaving lots of wasted energy in the ground under that landing foot.

Seems to me that energy would be more useful if it were transferred into the ball instead of the ground.

It's filed under 'D'... for donut.

by NoNameOnCard on Aug 8, 2008 1:02 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

it's not halting it

just transfering it. and yes a good strong core is needed to transfer the energy from the legs to the arm. the arm then just becomes a whip. it’s a very big tranformation to focusing on throwing with your arm to using it just as a whip. it goes against a lot of current teaching, but is actually pretty old school.

by SteveP on Aug 8, 2008 1:10 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

If you land on your heel...

you can’t both stay closed AND open them to finish your delivery. For the sake of rotating your hips, you’re much better off landing on the ball of your foot. if you want to maximize your hip rotation, you need to stride from the ball of your back leg to the ball of your front leg.

As for his back foot… you have to pick up your heel to finish your stride. Your coaches have been half-right. Your leg is stronger when driving from the heel, but you can’t finish the pitch without finishing your stride with a strong push from your calf. That obviously can’t be accomplished with your heel on the ground. It’s hard to say from that photo if he came up early (leading to balance and power issues), but based on how far he’s already strided (strode? stridden?), I’d say his timing looks fine.

It's filed under 'D'... for donut.

by NoNameOnCard on Aug 7, 2008 5:49 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

clarification

“open them” ... them = your hips.

It's filed under 'D'... for donut.

by NoNameOnCard on Aug 7, 2008 5:50 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

you have to have a firm base

to throw against. Tell me, what is going to create a firmer base – landing on your toe or on your heel? Toe strikers are actually not very common, especially in the majors, and can be a hard habit to break. Gotta land heel first.

by SteveP on Aug 7, 2008 6:06 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

By definition

isn’t this a balk? Ball still in hand, no contact with the rubber.

by robert_d_wilfong on Aug 7, 2008 6:30 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

If so

Then a vast majority of pitchers could be called on every pitch.

"I want to marry Chris Martin." - Miley Cyrus

by DaheelzCM on Aug 7, 2008 6:31 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I'm not saying you don't put your heel down at all.

I’m saying it’s not the first part of your foot that should hit the ground.

Lincecum’s hips open before his foot hits the ground. That should only be taught if you’ve got the core strength of a gymnast – like Lincecum. His arm, in the photo you’ve selected, shows a ridiculous load on his anterior deltoid and labrum, too.

Can we please avoid using Lincecum as an example of good mechanics? His father “designed” them by watching Sandy Koufax. Yeah, Koufax was a great pitcher, but his career ended before he was 30.

It's filed under 'D'... for donut.

by NoNameOnCard on Aug 7, 2008 10:40 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

think about it

are you going to put your toe down and then your heel? go ahead and try that out. ever see someone try to run or walk like that? it simply doesn’t work that way. the thing that bothers me though is that we’ve seen pictures of the Clinton pitchers (including Main) emphasizing that toe point on the leg kick. very discouraging.

by SteveP on Aug 8, 2008 1:07 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I don't know if you're picturing it wrong in your head or what.

It’s really not that hard to do.

Why is it discouraging that Main does it? He throws in the mid-90s, and this “flaw” isn’t an injury concern.

It's filed under 'D'... for donut.

by NoNameOnCard on Aug 8, 2008 12:47 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

it's almost a moot point

since it is very rare, it doesn’t need to be taught. pitchers usually do it (land on their heel) without realizing it because it’s natural. but pointing the foot down can cause it to happen. it concerns me b/c it’s basically teaching an unnatural movement, which seems to be a trend with our pitching development.

by SteveP on Aug 8, 2008 1:14 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

you can google

virtually any hard thrower and you’ll see the same thing. the heel lands first.

by SteveP on Aug 8, 2008 1:17 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

And you can also see that their heels have come off the rubber.

BTW, none of your photos actually show the landing. I’m betting nearly every one of the pitchers you like to cite lands on a nearly flat foot before transferring most of the weight to the ball of that foot.

It's filed under 'D'... for donut.

by NoNameOnCard on Aug 8, 2008 12:48 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

purposely showing right before landing

where it’s clear the heel hits first. the back heel comes off as the post leg straightens. watch how early bmac’s back heel comes off the rubber – before he really even strides out. there’s no drive there.

by SteveP on Aug 8, 2008 1:18 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

This photo also shows...

That Lincecum is now relying solely on momentum to keep his body moving forward. There’s no base here. His back leg is done and is even starting to drag. His front foot isn’t down yet either which means that when he lands, he’ll actually be decreasing his momentum into his release instead of increasing it.

His core and arm are left to re-accelerate the ball by themselves. His legs have done nothing more than load his core.

It's filed under 'D'... for donut.

by NoNameOnCard on Aug 7, 2008 10:56 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Also

The ball is going to be at his hip when his foot hits the ground. His arm is really going to have to work to catch back up. For him, his arm is quick enough to catch back up, but that puts a lot of stress on the arm.

"So you think the Celtics will beat Detroit? Hell will freeze over before that happens, mark my words." miles 5/20/08

by badradiorules on Aug 7, 2008 11:38 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

he's got the latest arm action i've seen

but as he says himself, his arm is just along for the ride. there’s actually very little stress on the arm.

by SteveP on Aug 8, 2008 1:02 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

There's actually a ton.

No matter how he describes it, the energy created in his lower half and core are transferred THROUGH HIS SHOULDER AND ELBOW. His arm late, violent, and pretty unclean as you can tell from the photo.

Whether or not it’s “just along for the ride” his arm deals with a lot of stress on every pitch.

It's filed under 'D'... for donut.

by NoNameOnCard on Aug 8, 2008 12:51 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

of course it's transferred through

his arm and shoulder. how else would it get to the ball. if i were to criticize lincecum, it would be for him overrotating before delivery and his arm drop thing behind the body. but he is a good model for demonstrating how to use the body to throw a baseball. still shots don’t do it justice.

by SteveP on Aug 8, 2008 1:31 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

his legs generated the momentum

which generates his velocity. puts very little stress on the arm. his arm action is late which allows the momentum to remain harnassed. the longer you can wait to break the hands the better. lincecum drops his hand rather than keeping it in the glove but it accomplishes the same thing.

by SteveP on Aug 8, 2008 12:40 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

No way.

All that does is shorten your arm action and cause it to be more violent. The only benefit of a late hand break is that it causes an extreme load in the rotator cuff – which can be achieved no matter when you break your hands.

Plus, this is a rule of physics – momentum only increases when there is a force applied. Once his legs are done, his body starts slowing down because there is no more force. As I said before, all his legs have done is load his core. As soon as he lands, he’s all core and arm, no more legs.

It's filed under 'D'... for donut.

by NoNameOnCard on Aug 8, 2008 12:56 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

exactly

the legs generate the velocity. the faster you move the torsoe with the legs, the faster the velocity. the slower the movement, the more you have to use your arm which causes more strain. once the front foot lands, nearly all the force has already been generated. just a matter of transferring it to the ball efficiently. arm action is way overcoached.

by SteveP on Aug 8, 2008 1:25 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

wow...

that is a huge difference. He looks so out of whack in the Rangers photos, no wonder he mysteriously lost all of his velocity and command. Heres to hoping they get him back to normal with the new staff and a little help from Nolan.

by erikj07 on Aug 7, 2008 5:56 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I just realized...

I failed to point out that it was Mike Hindman who posted the photos. Those who clicked the link are already aware of this, hopefully.

It was an oversight on my part…. “the only person I’ve seen draw attention to his lower half was a side-by-side photo comparison…” should have said, “the only person I’ve seen draw attention to his lower half was Mike Hindman with a side-by-side photo comparison…”

I suck at writing.

It's filed under 'D'... for donut.

by NoNameOnCard on Aug 8, 2008 12:25 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

that is the greatest use of nolan's talent. do more of that

""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley

by ab03 on Aug 7, 2008 5:45 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

So if Nolan keeps giving direct advice to the young pitchers

and they don’t improve…will Josey be screaming for his firing? Something tells me the blame would then shift to JD for not acquiring pitchers with “enough talent.”

I'm undefeated in fights. Have I been in any? No. Thats because people know my f'ing status. Don't mess with the elite. - Miles

by Dirk Diggler on Aug 7, 2008 7:01 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Stupid

I Stole The Red Finger !

by Clueless on Aug 8, 2008 1:16 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Concur

"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates

by slc ranger on Aug 7, 2008 9:36 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

More stupid

I Stole The Red Finger !

by Clueless on Aug 8, 2008 1:17 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Beat Weed! So laconic, so cogent...

Last week I took a pleasure trip. I drove my wife to the airport.

by Brian Thomas on Aug 8, 2008 11:21 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Dick Weed!

So pedestrian, so boring…

I Stole The Red Finger !

by Clueless on Aug 8, 2008 1:34 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Great point...

but “stupid” and “more stupid” are so insightful and exciting.

"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates

by slc ranger on Aug 8, 2008 3:10 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Beat weed

is on a roll!

I'm sure the Russians felt there were WMD's in Georgia, and that it was a hotbed of terrorism.

by DJCahill on Aug 8, 2008 3:50 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Nah,

he’s just beat.

Time you enjoy wasting was not wasted.

by t ball on Aug 8, 2008 4:02 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Heh. "Dick Weed."

That’s a good one, Beat Weed.

You bested us again…

Last week I took a pleasure trip. I drove my wife to the airport.

by Brian Thomas on Aug 8, 2008 6:16 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I don't know about that

A good leader hires people he believes in, and then let’s them do their job without too much interference. I am all for Nolan occasionally doing this sort of thing, but you can’t have the pitching coaches being constantly second guessed or undermined either. There’s a balance to be struck there, just like there is with the GM relationship. I’m not as worried about this as Adam is, but I do hope Ryan understands that type of leadership balance.

Time you enjoy wasting was not wasted.

by t ball on Aug 7, 2008 9:48 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I don't think so

Apparently, BMac asked if Ryan would watch to. Ryan didn’t initiate it. I don’t think that Hawkins would take that as Nolan stepping on his toes. I think in that situation, you welcome that kind of help and try to pick Nolan’s brain as well. I’m with you on it not being a regular thing, but its not bad to have a guy with that kind of experience and knowledge to step in every once in a while and help out.

"So you think the Celtics will beat Detroit? Hell will freeze over before that happens, mark my words." miles 5/20/08

by badradiorules on Aug 7, 2008 11:42 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Right

I think this particular situation was great, but I’m replying to ab03 who seems to think he should be doing this a lot. I think he should only do it if asked.

Time you enjoy wasting was not wasted.

by t ball on Aug 7, 2008 11:46 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs