Tuesday late morning stuff
by Adam J. Morris on Sep 16, 2008 11:50 AM CDT
75 comments
Delays this morning, the result of internet hiccups at the office stemming from the hurricane...
The win was nice, and puts the Rangers 4 games ahead of Oakland and 3 games below .500, but Brandon McCarthy coming out with a strained flexor tendon is just one more frustrating, maddening event vis-a-vis the ongoing pitching problems. Richard Durrett says McCarthy likely will need surgery and will probably not pitch again this season.
Taylor Teagarden continues to impress. Sample size and all that, but I have to think he's positioning himself to make a claim on the starting catching job next season.
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Teagarden
He should be the starting catcher next season, but not because of his bat. His offensive output is the gravy on an already delicious chicken fried steak.
by jparks77 on Sep 16, 2008 11:56 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
And his Texas roots are the Pecan Pie on the side.
I think Teagarden may already be my favorite Ranger of all time. I have both Pudge at the top and Sunberg in the top 5. Teagarden is not in Pudge’s league with his arm and possibly his bat but the Texas roots trumps all that.
Go Rangers!
by rooster on Sep 16, 2008 12:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Possibly his bat?
Dude, his bat is a major, major question mark right now. Pudge was a quality hitter for years and years. I know he’s doing great over a couple of weeks, but I just can’t see how we ignore his entire minor league season and assume that it was the fluke and not the couple of weeks in the majors.
Offense doesn't doubt me, but my first and primemost thing is defense and punt return and kickoff return
by Brett Perryman on Sep 16, 2008 5:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re-read
Rooster said that Teagarden “is not in Pudge’s league”.
by rcreative on Sep 16, 2008 6:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re-read my response
He said he’s not in his league with his arm and he said he’s possibly not in his league with his bat. I said “possibly his bat?” My meaning is that there is very little reason to think that Teagarden’s bat is in Pudge’s league, so I don’t see the need for the “possibly” in there.
Offense doesn't doubt me, but my first and primemost thing is defense and punt return and kickoff return
by Brett Perryman on Sep 16, 2008 7:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
why are u guys putting tt in the hof with no more games he has caught in the majors
by bullfighter20032000 on Sep 17, 2008 9:49 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This comment makes no sense
as a reply to zywica’s post.
Don't you know it's gonna be alright?
by t ball on Sep 17, 2008 12:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Max Ramirez > Taylor Teagarden.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Sep 16, 2008 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm tired of putting the offense first
by jparks77 on Sep 16, 2008 12:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I know Z has felt like he can't tell which of Max, T2, Salt E, will have a better career,
but I hope the Rangers hang onto Max and T2. I’m more willing to take a bet on the combination of their skill sets than any other combination of the ML and ML-ready catchers.
Go Rangers!
by rooster on Sep 16, 2008 12:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So am I
But I still think the difference between Max’s bat and Tea’s bat will ultimately be much more significant than the gap between their respective D’s.
Plus I think catcher defense is one of the more overrated aspects of baseball, right up there with which hand throw with, giving up outs to move runners over and the ability to switch hit.
I want better defenders at SS and CF. Catcher I think we’re fine with either of the sexy 4 operating back there.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Sep 16, 2008 12:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
There is more to catching than just defense
I think Teagarden’s ability to call a game and work with pitchers outweighs any potential offensive liability that might take place. I’m ready to give our pitchers every possible advantage.
I really like Max as well, and I’d like to see him in our line-up every day. Just not behind the plate.
by jparks77 on Sep 16, 2008 12:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The whole ability to call a game line of thinking makes me go a big rubbery one
I readily admit I might be wrong, seeing as how I’ve never pitched above the high school level so I have no first hand experience to call upon here… but I tend to believe the catcher has very, very little impact on the pitcher. (Unless the catcher is just an abject disaster back there, which I don’t think Max is.) IMO, catching defense is one of those things baseball guys tend to overrate along the same lines as grit and bunting and “clutchness”. Good pitchers tend to pitch well no matter who’s calling the game and bad pitchers tend to suck no matter how well the game is called.
I’d rather give our pitchers the advantage of the extra runs Max will create than anything Tea will give them with his good faceness behind the plate.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Sep 16, 2008 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Catching
Has about eleven elements in its’ goodness profile. Check the OPS+ of all division winners over the past ten years, and include postseason batting if you wish. The eleven magic tools are:
- receiving skill, including blocking dirtballs
- pitch framing skill, getting strikes called on marginal pitches
- positioning skill, for in/out/high/low pitches
- throwing skill, including accuracy, velocity, footwork/timing
- plate defense skill, including plate blocking and converting throws to tags
- pitch calling skill, including assessment of what the pitcher can throw effectively
- runner management skill, including steal anticipation and pickoff throwing
- pitcher mindset skill, e.g. confidence in his stuff and his receiver
- communication skill, including coaching mound visits re what’s going on
- coverage skill, on bunts and foul flies and popups
- batting contribution
See which one ranks eleventh?
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang (1844-1912)
by Ed Coffin on Sep 16, 2008 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who made this list? Is it your own personal creation?
Physician: Primum non nocere
Batter: First, make no out
by Chad Crudup on Sep 16, 2008 2:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes
I look at defense in terms of cumulative skills. The list could be consolidated to defensive value, and offensive value. Then weight the two accorsing to position. Give extra weight to defense up the middle (C, SS, 2B, CF) and in the case of RBiA, also give extra weight to LF defensively. Gotta have offense to win games, gotta have defense to prevent losses. Each to his own bias.
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang (1844-1912)
by Ed Coffin on Sep 16, 2008 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If you look at the teams from the AL
that are going to make the playoffs (between Boston, TBay, Angels, White Sox, Twins) none of them have given up more than 676 runs.
As of September 16, 2008 the 74-77 Texas Rangers lead all of baseball in errors and have given up 893 runs. It would seem to reason that this team would do well to mix a little more defense to prevent losses.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on Sep 16, 2008 3:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
A lot of that should take care of itself
Like 30-something percent of this team’s errors came from pitchers and catchers. Most of the catcher errors came from Laird and Saltalamacchia, who most here seem to think won’t be around much longer. And I think we all agree that a lot of spots on the pitching staff need to change.
Offense doesn't doubt me, but my first and primemost thing is defense and punt return and kickoff return
by Brett Perryman on Sep 16, 2008 5:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like Ed's list
I think dirk is underrating what Teagarden could contribute. And I am really all for doing anything and everything possible to help the pitching staff succeed.
I’d put batting contribution somewhere in the bottom third of that list for catcher. Throwing out runners wouldn’t rank much higher in my book. Get the batter out and the runner doesn’t matter.
Don't you know it's gonna be alright?
by t ball on Sep 16, 2008 6:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sincere question
How much different of a player do you expect Teagarden to be from a Rod Barajas or Yorvit Torrealba? He’s got a little extra juice defensively, but these guys are very nice defensive catchers. They’re 250/300/400 type hitters, and he’ll probably walk enough to be more of a 310-320 OBP guy.
I’m a Teagarden fan, but I’ve begun to wonder two things: if people would be nearly as excited about the idea of having a guy like him if the guy were like 31, and if people are way overboard on what they think he is offensively because of this fluky couple of weeks.
Offense doesn't doubt me, but my first and primemost thing is defense and punt return and kickoff return
by Brett Perryman on Sep 16, 2008 8:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't expect him
to hit very well, and if he’s in the big leagues next year we’d have to be prepared for like 230/320/400 and be happy if we got that. But I think defensively he’s a notch above Laird and Barajas or Yorvit. I may be expecting too much out of that kind of player, but my hopeful nature gets excited when I hear about Ranger arms rave about throwing to him. I want them to be confident. And to me he has more value than those guys you listed simply because he’s younger and cheaper for the next several years.
To me, the plus OBP and purportedly plus plus defense is the reason I want him around. I could care less what he’s doing in 30 at bats this week, though it’s nice I suppose. The only reason I like it, is I think it makes it easier for the Rangers brass and most fans to visualize him in the starting role and makes trading away any of the others easier. That’s not an important consideration, just makes it less annoying to read comments afterward. :)
People were way overboard on his bat after 2007, way "under"board on that same bat this year, and now way overboard again. He’s not Piazza and he’s not Brad Ausmus, he’s probably somewhere in between.
Don't you know it's gonna be alright?
by t ball on Sep 16, 2008 8:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t really expect plus OBP, though it might help to define what we consider that to be. I don’t think that his batting average will be high enough, and it’s not like he’ll walk once every four PA or anything. If I did think that he would have a 350ish OBP, I’d sign up for him as the long term starter right now.
My biggest issue, though, is that it seems strange to me that we’re all getting wrapped up in the intangible aspects with Teagarden after moaning about how Buck overrated them with Barajas. The Red Sox pitchers love pitching to Varitek, and Houston pitchers love pitching to Ausmus. I get the feeling that it’s Teagarden’s age and misplaced hopes for his offense that have people juiced up about him.
I like him and from day one have talked about how I enjoyed watching him play defense at UT. But if he were 33 and locked up for four years, something tells me that the notion of lots of extra offense from one of these other guys would seem a lot more intriguing to people.
I guess I have a fear that Laird is held onto and later dealt for pennies when he’s close to FA, Saltalamacchia is dealt for someone who turns out to be Brian Bannister, Max Ramirez is moved to a utility role and possibly dealt himself, you go with Teagarden and a Melhuse backing him up, and Teagarden is a 250/310/400 hitter who battles some arm problems on and off. And five years from now Josey Wales will taunt everyone with how dumb everyone was to think that the Rangers had a good catching situation, and how he’d just as soon have Rod Barajas as anything Junior wond up with out of it.
by Brett Perryman on Sep 16, 2008 8:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That last paragraph
is my nightmare, because it’s a real possibility even if at the time the deals are well thought of. Using the bite in the ass theory, I’d rather deal Laird than any of the other 3. I would be comfortable carrying the other three until at least next July to find out more about them. But that depends largely on other teams’ interest, of course.
I wish Teagarden’s minors numbers weren’t the epitome of a roller coaster. And it’s a bit scary that the most consistent stat among all his stops is a K rate of 1 or more every 4 at bats.
Don't you know it's gonna be alright?
by t ball on Sep 16, 2008 10:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's also why
I am pretty deliberate about committing to one or two of these guys unless it’s really made worth my while. They don’t have to be in as much of a rush as some think, imo.
by Brett Perryman on Sep 16, 2008 11:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree with that, although I think you pretty much have to try to deal one of them soon (Cough, LAIRD, Cough, Cough)
Really with your whole train of thought here. I like Teagarden. I really do. And I like the idea of having a plus defensive catcher. But I like the idea of having a decent glove/great bat catcher like Max back there. Getting .300/.400/.500 from the catcher slot is a dream. That’s obviously a lot to expect from Max, but it’s not totally unreasonable as a ceiling I don’t think.
And, fwiw, Max really impressed me with his non-sucking behind the plate earlier in the season. Maybe it’s just cause my expectations were so low that he couldn’t help but exceed them, but I was pleasantly surprised by what I saw from him back there.
I stick by saying that a great offensive catcher with average defensive skills is more valuable than a great defensive catcher with average offensive skills.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Sep 16, 2008 11:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Max's defense
I think that if he can be passable at defense his offense would obviously be a big plus. But if the organization is going to stress defense they can’t continue to sacrifice defense for offense at key defensive positions. I think we can agree that Kinsler is not going to be a plus 2B glove. SS is going to be a minus the next couple of years if it is Young and then Andrus (who will need time to come into his own even if he is a plus defender in the long run.) CF is not a plus if it’s Hamilton out there next year. We hope Borbon is good and ready soon, but he will make mistakes early on as well even if he is.
So where is defense a plus? Teagarden will of course make mistakes, too. But far fewer than Ramirez might, and his defense is already the best of the four. Defense has to happen somewhere.
Don't you know it's gonna be alright?
by t ball on Sep 17, 2008 9:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
2 things:
1. I still think Kinsler can be a plus defender at second. He has the tools and the work ethic to be one and I can totally see him surprising everyone and being a plus defender next year.
2. You shouldn’t force dfense to happen. Just because you have a poor defender at SS and in CF for the time being doesn’t mean you should shoehorn an inferior overall player into the catcher position just so you can say, “Yay, defense!” Plus the fact I think catcher defense influences a team far less than, say, CF defense… which I put an absolute premium on.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Sep 17, 2008 3:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I disagree
that catcher defense influences a team less. It influences it in less obvious ways perhaps, but getting the most out of a pitcher certainly influences the outcome of a game. If he really is good at calling games in addition to framing, etc., that has value on every single pitch.
And I really don’t think that choosing anyone of the four catchers could be called shoehorning at this point. All of them have question marks and strengths. It’s more like choose your focus to me.
Don't you know it's gonna be alright?
by t ball on Sep 17, 2008 11:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
We really, really disagree then
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Sep 16, 2008 11:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
my reading was that
they’re not sure if McCarthy’ll need surgery.
by jcAustin on Sep 16, 2008 1:22 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Me too...
…is there something else out there that makes it appear that surgery is likely?
Physician: Primum non nocere
Batter: First, make no out
by Chad Crudup on Sep 16, 2008 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Anybody want to still argue
with me that Brandon McCarthy’s body is not rejecting the notion that he’s a starting pitcher in The Show?
Helluva trade, Boy Blunder.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on Sep 16, 2008 2:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You try to
make getting injured into some kind of willful sin.
by mcgee48c on Sep 16, 2008 2:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He still has yet to explain
why McCarthy was able to make each start in the minors and even got around 190 IP in 05 between the minors and Majors. I guess throwing a ball in the Majors puts a whole different kind of strain than throwing the same ball in the exact same way in the minors.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
-The Outlaw
by Gdawg on Sep 16, 2008 2:49 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ron Washington would probably say it does...
…since he thinks things like a 4-hole hitter will see more breaking balls than other spots in the lineup.
Physician: Primum non nocere
Batter: First, make no out
by Chad Crudup on Sep 16, 2008 3:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You know...
I’m at the point where I’m ready for Daniels to be fired so I can quit reading crap like “Boy Blunder” and “Jon Boy” every time the Rangers are discussed.
by Adam J. Morris on Sep 16, 2008 3:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Whoops...
…I continue to have reply button issues.
Physician: Primum non nocere
Batter: First, make no out
by Chad Crudup on Sep 16, 2008 3:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I got another way you could stop reading that.
IP Ban!
IP Ban!
IP Ban!
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
by DJCahill on Sep 16, 2008 3:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So I'd be in better standing in here
if I treated JD like how a parent treats a four year old playing soccer for the first time?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on Sep 16, 2008 3:45 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No...
You would be in better standing if you stopped using the same old tired lines over and over again.
No one will argue that was a bad trade now. However some of us can accept that and move on while others have to dwell on it for eternity and bring it up every chance they get. Of course I’m sure you have never made a mistake at your job so you have plenty of room to criticize JD.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
by slc ranger on Sep 16, 2008 6:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm also ready for Daniels to be fired
because his job performance as GM of the Rangers has been cloaked in incompetency and a colossal failure.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on Sep 16, 2008 3:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
And this is why you're largely written off
While you may have some good points, you point out only negative (from what I’ve seen). No one will argue, including JD himself, that he’s really screwed the pooch on certain moves, but you cannot deny that he’s also done a lot of good for our system.
by rcreative on Sep 16, 2008 7:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
but, but, but!
Then Galloway and other perpetual detractors would have to find other schtick to hide behind.
What's the rumpus?
by Hypo-Luxa on Sep 16, 2008 3:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wonder what JD's cheerleaders
are hiding behind because his record as the GM of this team is awful.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on Sep 16, 2008 3:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Did I hit a nerve?
His record is not God awful and if you would get your head out of the sand you’d realize it. Does he have some weaknesses? of freaking course, as any GM does. And if I said I wasn’t scared at the prospect of him dealing away prospects for major league ready talent, I’d be lying. But saying that, I also see how JD has done some great things for this franchise.
I know your arguments already, as you’ve beaten them into everyone’s brain past the point of redundancy, and I’m not trying to open up a debate. i know how those end. However, to say his record is “God awful” is evidence that you will always subscribe to your inherent bias and refuse to observe anything that might skew that bias.
What's the rumpus?
by Hypo-Luxa on Sep 16, 2008 4:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
We have a pretty decent minor league system but
talent up and down the system has not been the problem the last 5-6 years.
JD’s biggest problem (along with not knowing how to hire a good major league manager) has come in not being able to identify ready to play major league talent, most specifically pitching.
Our organization is at the point where it’s time to begin building a winning team at the major league level.
Nothing in JD’s tenure as GM of the Texas Rangers suggests he is the man for that job.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on Sep 16, 2008 4:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
While I don't necessarily agree with you...
…I can understand where that argument is coming from, and quite honestly, I won’t be surprised if Daniels is fired after the season, and that is the reason that is given by Ryan for Daniels being fired.
by Adam J. Morris on Sep 16, 2008 4:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Adam, what makes you
think JD is gone?
I’m thinking overall job performance and the fact that this organization is going to have a very difficult time building up their season ticket base with JD & Washington still aboard.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on Sep 16, 2008 4:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think he's gone
I just wouldn’t be all that surprised if he was.
I’d put it at about 60/40, in favor of him staying, right now. Maybe 50/50.
by Adam J. Morris on Sep 16, 2008 5:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's pretty hard to guess along with someone with zero track record
Pretty much all we have to go off of is how he’s handled the manager and pitching coach situations, as well as his actual comments.
But taking the personality of Nolan out of it a little, it makes ZERO sense to fire Daniels now if you wouldn’t have 12 or 18 months ago. All of his mistakes took place then, and anyone who was surprised by much this year is a fool. Unless you go crazy over Galarraga or can’t take McCarthy’s injuries, there is nothing that Daniels has done in the last 18 months that warrants even considering firing him. And for all of the gnashing of teeth that went on over losing Chris Young, how much would he have helped this team this year with his two digit IP and 4.43 ERA? (could have used Adrian Gonzalez in the first half, though)
To say that you’re going to give Daniels a year and then fire him after what he’s done for the last year or so just doesn’t make sense. And they seem to work together okay.
Anyway, I think that next year is the year to fire him if he isn’t showing the ability to put together a contending roster, not this year.
Offense doesn't doubt me, but my first and primemost thing is defense and punt return and kickoff return
by Brett Perryman on Sep 16, 2008 5:30 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Indeed
I love it when people write the shit I’m thinking so I don’t have to.
Rec.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
by thedirkatron on Sep 16, 2008 11:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You think
someone would refuse to buy season tickets because JD and Wash are still around?
You mean, “random fair weather Ranger fan” would shell out money if Hunsicker was the GM and Hargrove was the manager?
That’s just stupid.
I'm undefeated in fights. Have I been in any? No. Thats because people know my f'ing status. Don't mess with the elite. - Miles
by Dirk Diggler on Sep 16, 2008 10:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Did you see the attendance in 2008?
Apparently season tix sales were waaaaaay down.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on Sep 17, 2008 8:13 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Of course they are
the team has been losing for years. Season tickets would have been down if Jesus was GM.
Don't you know it's gonna be alright?
by t ball on Sep 17, 2008 9:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't know why but here goes...
Talent has very much been an issue in the minors the last 5-6 years. Before DVD trio who the heck were our Golden Boys? A pretty sparse collection of fringe talents. After the Tex-Blalock class we had a pretty severe dip in talent in the system. To say our system is decent is glossing over one of JD’s major accomplishments and an accomplishment that cannot and should not be ignored. Drafting and acquiring minor league talent is his strong suit and he deserves recommendation for that, not an off-hand dismissal.
Identifying major league talent is my biggest concern with him too. However, I see how this hasn’t been an all-out fail as well. He identified Josh Hamilton, Milton bradley, Padilla, and maybe even Cruz as worthwhile major league talents. And so far he’s identified Harrison, MaxRam and even Nippert as ML ready talents. McCarthy is an unfortunate step backward in JD’s progress, however one step back should not detract from the many steps forward he has made for the Rangers.
Note: I am not including the CYoung/AGon trade in the above post because everyone knows he screwed up and as a first major trade of his career it’s unfortunate but something that happens to the best of them.
What's the rumpus?
by Hypo-Luxa on Sep 16, 2008 4:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't know of anybody who ever
questioned the physical talents of Hamilton, Bradley and Padilla. All three of them were available because of off the field behaviors.
Harrison is still in the “we’ll see” category. Max Ram had a nice year but is not ready for The Show and we’re f’d (hello 900 more runs allowed) if Nippert is in our rotation next year.
There are many more steps backward than just BMac. JJennings/Galarraga was an epic screw-up and so was Broussard. Nearly $ 10 million of the money JD budgeted for free agency was spent on players who weren’t on the team in early May.
I don’t really mind the contract but how does most of this place feel about JD giving MYoung a 5 year / $ 80 million extension? Does that sound like something a team operating with a small market payroll should do?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on Sep 16, 2008 4:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Really?
Jennings/Galarraga was an “epic screwup”? Broussard was an “epic screwup”?
Come on…
by Adam J. Morris on Sep 16, 2008 4:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
$ 10 million from a small market payroll
wasted on that crap (both done in early May) along with DFA’ing Galarraga in January may not be epic (I’ll save that description for the Danks & CYoung/AGonzo trades) but it was a pair of really dumb moves.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on Sep 16, 2008 4:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dumb moves
yeah they were. But again, that doesn’t trump the fact that in JD’s tenure he has brought in some of the most exciting talent the Rangers have seen in a VERY long time.
not only are their bonafide prospects in the farm, but there are guys on the team worth paying $20 to see. Josh, Milty, Davis, and guys like Murphy, Teagarden and cruz are worth the price. of admission.
Then you add in the wonderful assortment of prospects and I can overlook a few dumb moves if it is accompanied by the likes of Feliz, Holland, MaxRam, Andrus, Beltre, etc
What's the rumpus?
by Hypo-Luxa on Sep 16, 2008 5:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Broussard
I never really got that — I wasn’t sure why we couldn’t just go with Frank the Cat at 1B instead.
Jennings I thought was a reasonable gamble, even at the cost of Galarraga (who wasn’t who I wanted to see axed to make room for Jennings), because I figured that there was a better than 50% chance he’d bounce back this year, and if he did, he either helps you make a playoff push, or you can trade him for a prospect better than Galarraga.
They made a combined $7.85 million. I don’t know that there were a lot of guys out there who made that much this year, on one year deals, who were free agents last offseason, who would have contributed significantly more.
The Rangers rolled the dice on a handful of guys on cheap one year deals. Bradley and Guardado worked out. Jennings and Broussard didn’t.
by Adam J. Morris on Sep 16, 2008 5:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Talent up and down the system
has been a problem with this team since the Latin connection dried up in the late 80s early 90s.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
by DJCahill on Sep 16, 2008 6:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yep
to suggest that the system is in the same shape now that it was 2-4 years ago exposes a huge lack of understanding of the situation.
Offense doesn't doubt me, but my first and primemost thing is defense and punt return and kickoff return
by Brett Perryman on Sep 16, 2008 7:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
How many other organizations in 2005
coughed up three All-Stars from their minor league system for the 2008 AS Game?
Go back to 2004 and the Rangers coughed up 4 All Stars (Chris Young made it in 2007).
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on Sep 17, 2008 8:17 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
all star selections
are not a valid measurement of anything. No one in baseball (except you, apparently) thinks the Rangers minor league talent was anywhere close then to what it is now.
Don't you know it's gonna be alright?
by t ball on Sep 17, 2008 9:06 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
"The system" is in nowhere near as good a shape as
it was 2-4 years ago.
In 2004, the Rangers had four All-Stars (three of them 29 or younger) on the team and some 24 year old kid named Teixeira (38 HR / 112 RBI) didn’t make that team.
At the beginning of the 2004 season, the Ranger minor league system was deep enough to cough up another four All-Stars (CYoung, AG, Kinsler, Eddy V) within the next four years. Also within the minor league system at that time was John Danks, CJ Wilson, Frank X, Thomas Diamond, Eric Hurley, JArias, Masset, Rupe, Loe.
After Hart was fired the owner then decided to bump up the payroll more than 20% but screwed up when he hired the colossal failure human wrecking ball to the organization’s future that is JD.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on Sep 18, 2008 9:36 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Again stupid...
You don’t judge a system by all-stars, and while you’re at it take Arias, Masset, and Loe off that list. Are you kidding me? Do you really think your little list is even close to this:
Feliz
Holland
Main
Beavan
Perez
Ramirez
Kiker
Font
Hunter
Ross
Poveda
Boscan
Smoak
Andrus
MaxRam
Teagarden
Borbon
Lemon
Vallejo
Beltre
Santana
Oh and Kinsler, BGL, Fx2, and Rupe are all still here. And Volquez was turned into some Hamilton guy.
You even trying to argue this point is just flat out asisine. You sound like some ignorant, whiny, bitchy, little kid. You find me one source that thinks the 2004 Rangers system is in better shape than where it is now, or shut the fuck up.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
by slc ranger on Sep 18, 2008 10:34 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Shutting the fuck up
is probably not going to happen.
As an aside, intimidation tactics don’t really work well for you.
I don’t need a source to know how good the immediate future looked for the 2004 Rangers because of the incredible talent they had at all levels, top to bottom. Just look at the top shelf young players they had on the major league team, their record (89-73), their financial flexibility, how much talent they had knocking at the door and how much talent was in the lower levels of this system.
Are there four players on your little list that are going to make the AS Game in the next four years? I don’t think so.
This thing was primed to do great things until somebody named Jon Daniels became Hart’s right hand man.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on Sep 18, 2008 10:51 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Since you insist...
being a all star is how to judge the system then yes. Davis, Feliz, Holland, Smoak, one of the catchers and at least one of the other pitchers will all go to at least one all star game.
And again you don’t back up anything you say with anything other than your complaining little opinion. I wasn’t trying to intimidate you dipshit. How can you even intimidate someone on the internet anyway?
I can’t say I’ve been here longer than many, but I’’ve been here long enough to know you won’t shutup. It’s just wishful thinking because so many are sick and tired of listening to you bitch and coplain about JD and the Rangers in general.
And now I’m done feeding you.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
by slc ranger on Sep 18, 2008 11:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
slc, are there going to be
four players on that list that make the AS Game in the next four years? That’s the question, hot shot and the answer is no.
If you want me to quit bitching about JD, he needs to quit being so freaking incompetent.
He has been a one man wrecking ball to the future of this team and the evidence is the product (that he built by himself) we see on the field and the tsunami of indifference (credit Mike Rhyner description) that fans in this area now have towards this mess.
Lots of people love to runaround this place saying things are so much better than they were in the past when that’s nothing but self delusional bullshit.
A lot of usable pieces have been assembled but now we need somebody to not only put it together but also manage the team as well.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on Sep 18, 2008 11:20 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don't worry, he'll figure something out...
…he has managed to stay employed in this market for a looooooooong time.
Physician: Primum non nocere
Batter: First, make no out
by Chad Crudup on Sep 16, 2008 3:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1...
…it’s moved beyond the point of cliche.
Physician: Primum non nocere
Batter: First, make no out
by Chad Crudup on Sep 16, 2008 3:37 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
-1
Did Ben survive the hurricane?
by Chase Irwin on Sep 16, 2008 8:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
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