New Politics Discussion
by Black Francis on Sep 2, 2008 7:16 PM CDT
Email
PrintThe last political "fan post" has been replied to over a thousand times, so it was only a matter of time before a new one came up anyway. Don't yell at me for posting this.
If I may suggest avoiding certain topics when possible:
1. Experience as it applies to either Obama or Palin. Unless someone has something new to say, it seems to me it's been beaten to death.
2. Palin as a grandma-to-be, or at least attacks on that. I'd think that commenting on news coverage of it is cool, but no "drunken slut" posts.
3. Unions and their alleged role in the downfall of the Big Three automakers.
4. Evolution, Creationism, Intelligent Design.
I'd like to see a discussion that had no one or two word posts. I'd like like to see a thoughtful discussion focused on real policy instead of wedge issues.
Of course the Republican National Convention is cranking up as I type, so that would be good to talk about. I'm not particularly fond of the current speech (is this St Paul's mayor?). He just said they'd paint the Mississippi river "John McCain red" from St. Paul to the Gulf. I'm not sure that's very good imagery, given McCain's hawkish leanings.
Anyway, so here's a new political discussion if you want.
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Comments
In regards to the Palin situation (her daughter),
I think Obama said it best in that this shouldn’t be what politics is based on in this election. Teen pregnancy is somewhat of a problem in the country and the best that can be done by the media is to give the family privacy.
Also, I was watching ABC News last night, and Steponopolis was on there and he was talking to some past strategists, and they were saying that in the beginning, most of the Rep delegates were praising McCain for selecting Palin, but now, some have the mindset of “What was he thinking??” Its just something interesting to think about….
"Well, the Dallas Mavericks got beat by the New Orleans Hornets last night ending their season. Word is that someone on the team is dating Jessica Simpson." - Jay Leno
LSB facebook group ---->>> http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=33345329288
abc guys
throwing out blind assertions, again…who are these people with that ‘mindset’?
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
Well they didnt exactly reveal that
I guess they couldnt reveal the certain delegates because of the problems it would create within the party, but still pretty interesting if it is true.
"Well, the Dallas Mavericks got beat by the New Orleans Hornets last night ending their season. Word is that someone on the team is dating Jessica Simpson." - Jay Leno
LSB facebook group ---->>> http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=33345329288
how many posts did the last one get to?
i gave up b/c it was retarded to load and it turned to the discussion of evolution which i find to be insulting to my intelligence to listen to people belittle. and i dont wanna get into it, so save your energy.
there were some interesting discussions though before it got to 750+ posts and with the ’Pub Convention goin on it figures another was bound to show up.
so here’s my Question:
What’s your opinion of Joe Lieberman? He is speaking at the convention tonight so i figured id ask b/c democrats are familiar with him and now he seems to be lining up with republicans. What do you think of the guy?
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
Lieberman
It would’ve been a disaster if McCain picked him. It may have picked up some independents, but no Democrats and a lot of Republicans wouldn’t have been on board with it.
As a Democrat, I don’t like the way he lost his party primary and then ran as an independent, so that pretty much soured me on him for good. Don’t like his stance on Iraq. Don’t like the fact that he would speak at Republican National Convention. If the Democrats didn’t need him they’d kick him out of the caucus for sure.
I’d say he’s getting ready to switch parties but he still votes with the Democrats on social stuff.
by Black Francis on Sep 2, 2008 8:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Agree
from an ideological standpoint I would have preferred Lieberman, however that selection would not have united and fired up the Republican base. I don’t think a McCain-Lieberman ticket had a chance to win. Bottom line, a lot of hardcore conservatives that perhaps were put off by McCain’s moderate views will be back in the thick of things given Palin’s very conservative positions and are more likely to come out in big numbers on election day and vote.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
re:
dems release Sarah Palin’s SSN and home addresses.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
source?
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
http://digg.com/2008_us_elections/Democrats_Release_Sarah_Palin_s_Social_Security_Number
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
Leaked Opposition Research
It’s not at all uncommon for campaigns to have that kind of information on their opponents and then some. I think it’s important to say that this came from the state party apparatus in Alaska, and is wholly inconsistent with how the Obama campaign has run things to this point. There’s no political advantage to be gained from it anyway. All you can get is blowback. I think it’s a safe assumption that one or two idiots decided to do this on their own.
by Black Francis on Sep 2, 2008 8:23 PM CDT up reply actions
i agree ...
That Obama has been handling the Palin situation (regarding her family) perfectly…
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
Yep
he doesn’t have to attack her because the liberal media does it for him….Not his fault the media is liberal. Works out perfect for him as long as he doesn’t say anything.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
I get so tired of republicans using
the term ‘liberal media.’ It so easy, so pat and so dismissive. What an easy way to discount anything that’s reported by saying it’s coming from the ‘liberal media.’ Sure the NYT has a liberal bent just like Fox and the Wall Street Journal have a conservative one. Try forming an argument for a change. Are you saying that Republicans don’t have attack mechanisms at their disposal? Tell the John McCain in South Carolina in 2000 that.
first off
if you deny that the media is liberal I dont want to bother talking with you. Second off all I stated was that the liberal media allows obama to not attack her while the media does it for her. Do you actually disagree with taht statement? You’re talking about attack mechanisms by the Republicans…I have no idea what you’re talking about. I made a simple statement and you’re talking about something entirely different.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
"liberal" media
is a very limited way of looking at it. I think newspapers are mostly liberal, but tv is more balanced. Radio is downright conservative.
I don’t see the media attacking Palin at all. Do you expect them not to report this stuff? Was the media going light on Obama when all they talked about for a couple weeks was the not-so-reverend J. Wright?
The liberal media label is an outdated half truth.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
out of curiosity.....
which of the major anchors(Brian Williams, Brokaw, Couric, etc) do you think might vote for McCain?
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 2, 2008 11:59 PM CDT up reply actions
No idea.
I don’t watch news show very often. I read most of my news online at various sites and flip around the radio a lot when I’m in the car. I don’t even know who Brian Williams is.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
Then you're out of your element Donnie!
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
No, not really
I’ve been following the news for 30 years, since before middle school. I’ve seen plenty of tv news shows. I still watch sometimes, but I really don’t pay much attention to the anchors’ names unless they seem really obnoxious. And since I also read a lot online bias isn’t hard to spot. I get my news from many sources and read op eds from both sides of the aisle.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
And who in the hell
is Donnie?
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
not entirely different....
Do you think Bush had to do anything but sit back and watch when the Swift-boaters attacked Kerry? Do you deny that Fox News and all Rupert Murdoch owned media is Conservative? If so I don’t want to bother talking to you either. All I’m saying is it’s easy to say the ‘media’ is liberal, it’s totally unprovable because it depends on your point of view, and every time a conservative says that little pat phrase I just shut down.
who has attacked her because of the family thing?
would like to see a link to this
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
Uh
yeah, that’s a respectable news source. Is this the bias you spoke of? I hope you’re joking. Supermarket checkout fodder just doesn’t count for much and probably isn’t being counted on by the McCain campaign to sway Hilary supporters.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
It was a joke....
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
ummm
you do know the guy who owns that mag is a big time contributor to Obama, right?
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
Of course he is
the liberals control all media.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
atleast you aknowledge this.
that’s good.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
lame.
I blame it not on Ron Washington, but on society. Society is to blame. And Ron Washington. ~Ken Tremendous on Ron Washington sac bunting in the 11th vs LAA
Magazines don't normally go to press this quickly
It doesn’t look like a daily and I don’t even think a weekly would have that yet. Where did you get it?
by Black Francis on Sep 3, 2008 1:33 AM CDT up reply actions
It's Us Weekly.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
For Real...
CNN – John Roberts
“The role of Vice President, it seems to me, would take up an awful lot of her time, and it raises the issue of how much time will she have to dedicate to her newborn child.”
http://newsbusters.org/blogs/matthew-balan/2008/08/29/cnn-s-john-roberts-palin-might-neglect-her-disabled-infant
Washington Post – Sally Quinn
“Is she prepared for the all-consuming nature of the job? She is the mother of five children, one of them a four-month-old with Down Syndrome. Her first priority has to be her children. When the phone rings at three in the morning and one of her children is really sick what choice will she make?”
http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/sally_quinn/2008/08/sarah_polin.html
Good Morning America – Bill Weir
“Adding to the brutality of a national campaign, the Palin family also has an infant with special needs. What leads you, the Senator, and the Governor to believe that one won’t affect the other in the next couple of months?”
http://newsbusters.org/blogs/rich-noyes/2008/08/30/abc-anchor-impugns-sarah-palin-neglectful-mother
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
I think
You are exaggerating with “attacked”. None of those are vicious statements, but genuine points that are being raised. Do I agree with all of them? Not particularly, but then again I don’t have to churn out article after article on the same four subjects.
Old war wound. Acts up around morons.
I don't see this as much different
as the circus that surrounded Obama and Rev Wright.
The media isn’t particularly biased, they just want to go 24/7 with any story they think has legs, for ratings and money. Gotta fill the column inches and burn the segments somehow.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
"I just hope enough dumb oversexed over self-esteemed American public educated female liberals (yeah, you know the type) vote for a woman because she has a vagina, to swing some things."- Sharky.
"JD is a great GM if you ignore the giving away pitching and handing out horrible contract stuff."-Tricer
Are you kidding?
These people are questioning her leadership skills because she has children. Why don’t we ever hear that about male candidates? It’s a pathetic double-standard that the liberal media is resorting to. It’s embarrassing.
This isn’t anything like Rev Wright at all. Are you joking or serious about that? I honesty hope you’re joking.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
Well
I thought Edwards was showing horrible judgment by running for President when his wife had cancer and he had little children at home.
by brettgardner on Sep 3, 2008 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Who was the last Presidential or Vice Presidential candidate
to have a newborn? Granted, its probably her grandkid, but if they are gonna go with the story that its her kid, its open for speculation.
Believe it or not, its kind of a new deal, and kind of newsworthy.
There is already reason to question her parenting, with her apparently out of control teenager.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
"I just hope enough dumb oversexed over self-esteemed American public educated female liberals (yeah, you know the type) vote for a woman because she has a vagina, to swing some things."- Sharky.
"JD is a great GM if you ignore the giving away pitching and handing out horrible contract stuff."-Tricer
"Granted, its probably her grandkid"
We don’t want or need any of your Dailykos liberal bullshit around here.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
amen to that
its a terrible day when that sewage cooked up over at Daily Kooks has begun to spread to other parts of the interweb.
how fucking retarded do you have to be to cook up a conspiracy theory that her newborn son is actually her daughter’s child and she’s covering up for her. Seriously? So its just a vast right wing conspiracy that managed to pay off the doctors and forge a birth certificate and fake her pregnancy at the National Governor’s Association meeting.
You lose all credibility, not that you had any to begin with, when you come spouting garbage conspiracy theories like that. What a fucking nut you are.
Seriously..DJCahill… get off your knees and take Keith Olberman’s meat out of your mouth.
its not politics
that make me angry. its the continuous revelation that there exist people in this world that are incapable of logical and rational thought.
seriously, to think that humankind has sunk to such a level that there are individuals that are unable to distinguish between delusion and reality is sadly frustrating.
i dont mind opposing viewpoints. I gladly welcome dialogue from both sides, liberal or conservative. but extremism on either side, especially to the point of complete and utter fantasy for the pure purpose of propaganda, is despicable and should be derided as such whenever present.
id argue
that it affects us all. extremism is good for no one. extremist viewpoints are not founded on rational thought. the idea that my daily life can be affected, through actions taken by the federal government, based irrational thoughts is frightening to me.
if someone’s delusional propaganda, such as that of the Kos’ cooked up idea regarding Mrs. Palin’s newborn son, were to potentially have a serious impact on the election, leading to the election of one candidate over another, Id argue that my life could be very much affected.
Explain how this is comparable to Rev Wright
at all?
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
Completely unacceptable
Your comment, “Granted, its probably her grandkid, but if they are gonna go with the story that its her kid, its open for speculation.” Falls off the scale of acceptability IMO. That horrible lie demeans parents everywhere and should NOT be open for speculation.
I believe that hate filled lie about Palin is what really gets decent people upset about the media coverage of her to date.
Rev Wright
was not covered by abc, cbs, nbc, msnbc…
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
Were you not paying attention?
Probably not.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
"I just hope enough dumb oversexed over self-esteemed American public educated female liberals (yeah, you know the type) vote for a woman because she has a vagina, to swing some things."- Sharky.
"JD is a great GM if you ignore the giving away pitching and handing out horrible contract stuff."-Tricer
yes
where you? I’m guessing you were watching only fox news…because it was not covered on all the networks.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
Yes, it was.
The talked about Wright on ABC, NBC, CBS, and even CNN, you dolt.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
"I just hope enough dumb oversexed over self-esteemed American public educated female liberals (yeah, you know the type) vote for a woman because she has a vagina, to swing some things."- Sharky.
"JD is a great GM if you ignore the giving away pitching and handing out horrible contract stuff."-Tricer
wow
you really said this..
Granted, its probably her grandkid, but if they are gonna go with the story that its her kid, its open for speculation.
Well, atleast you know that you are one of those far left extremists.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
yeah
he’s nuttier than bat shit. he’s one of the Daily Kooks army. just a mouthpiece for the spread of Markos’ delusions
definitely not in the way they’re covering Gov. Palin.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
wrong.
I blame it not on Ron Washington, but on society. Society is to blame. And Ron Washington. ~Ken Tremendous on Ron Washington sac bunting in the 11th vs LAA
Wow
you’re completely blinded by your partisanship. Even National Public Radio talked about Wright endlessly, and their shows bleed granola.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
Bleed Granola???
What the fuck are you talking about? I’ll grant you that they slant to the left but they’re one of the few media outfits that take journalism seriously, and will give time to the other side.
by Black Francis on Sep 3, 2008 3:42 PM CDT up reply actions
I should have said
“and most conservatives accuse them of bleeding granola.”
I’ve been listening to their convention coverage on the way home some nights since I usually work until 8 or 9, and I often catch a bit of news in the morning on the way to work and flip over to CBS radio sometimes. Both seem fair to me.
I think the only major media networks you can really say have much bias are Fox and MSNBC.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
Oh brother ...
http://abcnews.go.com/video/playerIndex?id=4745985
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/24371963#24374092
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/24371963#24374093
http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=4053980n%3fsource=search_video
http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=3942740n%3fsource=search_video
by robert_d_wilfong on Sep 3, 2008 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions
I guess I haven't paid much attention to these threads...
When did the Union/Big Three discussion come up?
I think that
was in the Obama-Biden thread.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
Not quite
I found the discussion buried in miles’ last fanpost.
how that discussion turned that way is beyond me...
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
Palin
The Dems, woman libs and far left are afraid of a strong, independent, conservative woman. This election could be won or lost on the speech she give tomorrow night.
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
so sure she is independent, strong, conservative?
Every pitch thrown to Josh Hamilton is recorded as an E1. -- clark
Yes.
So far the biggest trump card is that she didn’t abort a baby who’s destined to have an exceedingly difficult and probably terrible life. I’m not sure what that makes someone, or what it qualifies her for.
do you do research on candidates
or wait to hear their views on the issues via television?
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
Huh?
Where did I say anything about her “issues”? I know you think you’re hot political shit, but you’re not the only person in the world enlightened enough to read about this.
...destined to have an exceedingly difficult and probably terrible life
What?
Sure many teen pregnancies lead to problems for the child… but in this case the kid will be the grandchild of at minimum the governor of Alaska and possibly the vice president. I think with that support system even if her daughter didn’t get married the child will have a nice life.
That’s not to say that teen pregnancies are a good thing, but let’s just be realistic.
he or she
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
definately 1 of those 2.
you are correct.
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
Palin's baby...
not the teenagers.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
I believe...
…he was talking about Sarah Palin’s baby, the one she had after she was 40 and he/she ended up with Down’s Syndrome (there’s a greater risk for Downs when “older” women have children).
by Black Francis on Sep 2, 2008 8:45 PM CDT up reply actions
It makes her a mother
who loves her child unconditionally.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
Yeah, I feel pretty
safe in saying that Palin loves all her children unconditionally.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
Again
Why? Because she didn’t abort them? I’m not saying she does or doesn’t, but how do you know?
by brettgardner on Sep 2, 2008 11:29 PM CDT up reply actions
Go chase your own tail, liberal puke.
Palin loves all her children, end of story.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
every time
I visit LSB you’ve found a new chew toy……or are recycling an old one.
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 2, 2008 11:41 PM CDT up reply actions
x
“she didn’t abort a baby who’s destined to have an exceedingly difficult and probably terrible life.”
Why would you assume that his life would probably be terrible?
by Randy Richardson on Sep 2, 2008 10:46 PM CDT up reply actions
He has
Down’s syndrome, a mother who’s running to become even busier than she already is, and a father who races snowmobiles. You really think that’s the life of luxury?
by brettgardner on Sep 2, 2008 10:49 PM CDT up reply actions
I never said he would live a life of luxury . . .
just asked why you would assume that a child with Down Syndrome would automatically “probably (have a) terrible life”. Feel free to answer the question.
by Randy Richardson on Sep 2, 2008 11:15 PM CDT up reply actions
I believe I did.
Down’s syndrome is a terrible condition, in case you weren’t aware. I can only imagine how one gets through life with that condition with “normal” parents (i.e. ones who are there to provide you with the tremendous amount of attention required).
It makes me shudder to think of the selfishness of a woman who would not only have a baby in her forties, when risks for conditions such as Down’s syndrome multiply tremendously, but then abandon the baby to an infanthood of “half-mothering”, where she campaigns day and night, and if she gets what she wants, works a long-hour, high-stress job, which doubtless pays less than she could get elsewhere.
Yes, I’ve met and dealt with several people who have Down’s syndrome. Some of them were better than others, but it’s a heartbreaking condition, I assure you. Nobody I’ve met is “happy”. It’s a constant struggle, and it requires the constant attention and care of loving parents. I fail to see how this baby will get that.
by brettgardner on Sep 2, 2008 11:28 PM CDT up reply actions
you clearly
have something personal against Palin. That’s fine, I don’t really care what you think about her. Down Syndrome is a terrible condition, but it doesn’t follow that people with Down Syndrome lead terrible lives. It’s difficult, it’s a challenge, and it’s not “normal” or “perfect”, but I would never call their lives universally terrible.
by Randy Richardson on Sep 3, 2008 12:00 AM CDT up reply actions
I don't
Have anything “personal” against her. Don’t know her at all. I just know what she’s doing, and I have some idea of the needs of children with Down’s syndrome.
I never called their lives universally terrible, but I feel safe saying that it’s probable.
It seems you have nothing to base your opinion off of except your opposition to me. That’s pretty weak.
by brettgardner on Sep 3, 2008 12:03 AM CDT up reply actions
x
Well, that’s my point, you shouldn’t feel safe saying their lives are “terrible” and that they are not “happy”. Besides your anecdotal evidence, there is nothing out there that suggests they lead “terrible” lives. Anyway, how exactly do you measure terrible and happy? Compared to you? Compared to a slum child in India?
by Randy Richardson on Sep 3, 2008 12:10 AM CDT up reply actions
Compared to
People without Down’s syndrome. Your relativism falls very flat here.
I’m not sure I see the difference between the agony of needing 24 hour care just to stave off death, and 24 hour struggle to feed yourself in a less-developed country.
What’s more, you’ve missed a key point I made regarding this specific baby, not a universal proclamation of all children with the condition.
I said THIS baby is going to have it bad because of the tragic circumstances of his family.
by brettgardner on Sep 3, 2008 12:15 AM CDT up reply actions
you should
limit yourself to two sentences or less…..
anymore than that and your fraudulent intellectualism becomes painfully obvious.
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 3, 2008 12:20 AM CDT up reply actions
Well
I’ve never claimed to be an intellectual, so I’ll stick with my method. Thanks, though.
by brettgardner on Sep 3, 2008 12:21 AM CDT up reply actions
I actually prefer him
when he posts more than two sentences.
Then, I can try and understand where he’s coming from.
But then again, I like to listen to other’s people opinions and try to understand them.
Especially, if they have some depth as Brett seems to offer here. I don’t necessarily agree with his opinion, but it’s nice to at least discuss it.
It’s better than the utter banality of going “You’re stupid”, “No, you’re stupid”, “No, YOU’RE stupid!”
R
"Tragic circumstances of his family?"
It’s not like he fucked up Bill Richardson’s bid to be the Democratic nominee.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
x
what are you referring to when you say “the agony of needing 24 hour care just to stave off death”?
Also, I fail to see anything tragic about the circumstances of this family.
by Randy Richardson on Sep 3, 2008 12:22 AM CDT up reply actions
Then I
Feel sorry for you. The mother is going to be away from home for large amounts of time. If she wins, she’ll be all across the country and all across the world. That’s pretty sad to me.
Still, you’ve produced nothing to prove your point. Doubt does not make a valid claim by itself.
by brettgardner on Sep 3, 2008 12:23 AM CDT up reply actions
do you
believe that those with Down Syndrome wish to have never been born?
On a broader scale do most people leading downtrodden lives wish they had not been born?
Have you ever heard an adult who grew up in “tragic” circumstances declare that they wish their mother would have aborted them?
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 3, 2008 12:31 AM CDT up reply actions
I know
On your first question, I’ve heard it myself. It’s admittedly anecdotal evidence, but there’s your answer.
To quickly dismiss with the rest of your gibberish, “downtrodden” is not the same thing as “severally disabled”. We’re not talking about poverty or race issues here.
by brettgardner on Sep 3, 2008 12:33 AM CDT up reply actions
Huh?
Are you able to read?
I just said that I’m not an intellectual because I misspelled a basic word.
Jesus.
by brettgardner on Sep 3, 2008 10:31 AM CDT up reply actions
Also
How pathetic is the school swipe? Don’t you have anything better than that?
by brettgardner on Sep 3, 2008 10:35 AM CDT up reply actions
are they incappable
of suicide? It seems you are suggesting that it would be warranted given their condition.
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 3, 2008 12:37 AM CDT up reply actions
Now I don't feel
Quite so bad after that little gem.
Anyway, the sad truth is many are incapable of forming those kinds of thoughts. Some have a lot of functionability and are capable of a surprising amount, but I’ve suggested nowhere that I think suicide is the best solution. The best solution is good and dedicated parenting.
I know you love to hound me, but you should try a little understanding in this case.
by brettgardner on Sep 3, 2008 12:40 AM CDT up reply actions
harsh as it
sounded it was a serious question. There are many things that I see others have to go through that I think to myself I would never have the strength for….yet it seems if the only alternative is death most choose life(even if us “healthy” ones wouldn’t consider what they are doing as "living").
……and I do love to hound you, although “the worst poster here” bit still kinda hurts.
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 3, 2008 12:46 AM CDT up reply actions
If it
Makes you feel any better, you’ve moved up on my depth chart.
I’ve got mai holding the clipboard now.
by brettgardner on Sep 3, 2008 12:48 AM CDT up reply actions
I haven't come
across any of mai’s work……I’ll be on the lookout.
He/she better at least be a faux intellect with a spare degree from a state school with the gravitas to take on the uber-intelligent lawyers on this board.
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 3, 2008 12:54 AM CDT up reply actions
I was
“characterizing” my role in these arguments…..me the faux intellect with the spare degree…..you the uber-intelligent lawyer.
Bottom line: I’m generally in over my head from the get go, but I sincerely enjoy the sport of arguing and so I engage in it even when it may be to my detriment.
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 3, 2008 1:05 AM CDT up reply actions
Oh
I thought you were talking about me.
I have a spare degree from a state school, too. Wait—didn’t you go to Tech? We should be embracing, not bickering.
TT
of course I always grew up wanting to go to UT but followed my highschool girlfriend to school…..always a smart move.
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 3, 2008 1:16 AM CDT up reply actions
Also
I’m in law school myself, so does that give me any additional gravitas to take on the “uber-intelligent” lawyers?
Half the time
I think you’re just arguing to practice being a lawyer. The other half I think your argumentative nature makes you a natural lawyer.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
The problem...
is that arguing doesn’t make one an effective lawyer, it’s just makes you a pain the ass. Lawyers don’t want to work with people who are contentious pricks.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Well
I find this forum to be a natural place for debate. I certainly don’t start arguments all the time in “real life”. In fact, I don’t even talk very much.
In any case, I don’t “practice” anything here. I just have fun, which is something I think a lot of people could stand to have more of on here.
pLuS
OnE
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 3, 2008 7:10 AM CDT up reply actions
coach is proud of you.....
last one to leave, first to arrive….
Is 4 hours of sleep the norm?
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 3, 2008 7:11 AM CDT up reply actions
Arguing
I enjoy the debate here very much, myself, and think most people get a little too uptight about it. Including you and myself on occasion.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
Don't feel sorry for me.
I think as you get older you’ll find that you’ll judge people less for the personal and life decisions that they make. It’s her life, not yours.
As to proving my point, I’m not trying to prove anything. Although, I dare you to go into a maternity ward in some hospital and tell the parents of a newborn with Down Syndrome that his/her life will “probably be terrible.” Once again, their lives are difficult and not full of the opportunities that you may have in life, but “terrible” was a very poor choice of words.
by Randy Richardson on Sep 3, 2008 12:32 AM CDT up reply actions
x
No, it wasn’t. It seems that with your vast amount of life experience, you’ve still got a lot to learn yourself. It IS a terrible condition, and I don’t think I need to shelter some hypothetical mother from my opinion.
But of course, there are a lot of aggressive actions I wouldn’t take to get my opinion heard. That’s a silly thing to say.
by brettgardner on Sep 3, 2008 12:36 AM CDT up reply actions
I don't understand about this...
We don’t know what the circumstances of the conception were. She very possibly had an unplanned pregnancy in her 40’s leading to a child with Down’s syndrome. But even still, I don’t think that to say that someone with a handicap is likely to lead a “terrible” life is a bit much.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
ask nate silver
http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2008/09/sarah-palin-compassionate-conservative.html
about her views…
Every pitch thrown to Josh Hamilton is recorded as an E1. -- clark
Here's a way to be less partisan.
Try to put the shoe on the other foot once in a while. If you find out a piece of information, or hear a quote, or read about a policy proposal, from one candidate — pretend it came from the other candidate and check your baggage.
We are all guilty of confirmation bias to a certain degree and react differently based solely on party affiliation. Taking my suggestion gives you a quick way to see if you’re merely reacting out of bias or if you really feel that way about the issue. This requires you to be brutally honest with yourself, difficult.
Example: If one of the candidates gave a speech tomorrow saying they would have the troops out of Iraq by 2010, would you feel differently if it came from McCain instead of Obama?
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
Are you addressing me or the group?
I do try to do that. Being a PSCI major at my school with my professors, I absolutely had to look at things from all possible angles. It was good training. When I worked on the Bradley campaign part of my job for a time was opposition research, and part of it was actually to try to dig up stuff on Bradley himself in case Gore or Bush got to it first. When you work on the losing end of a primary run, it’s a pretty big wake up call. You get disillusioned with your own party and the whole process in general. It would force any intelligent person’s mind wide open if it wasn’t already.
That said, there is a time for partisan politics. There’s strength in numbers, after all. However I wish there weren’t so many one-liners and vitriol in general.
I like to believe I can disagree with anyone and be civil, and I like to believe that other people can and will, too.
by Black Francis on Sep 2, 2008 8:36 PM CDT up reply actions
North Texas
Some of the professors in my department were really amazing. I had two favorites who were complete opposites: one hardcore Democratic activist, and a Libertarian who used to work the Mediterranean desk at CIA, oddly enough.
by Black Francis on Sep 2, 2008 9:04 PM CDT up reply actions
I forgot to say
I also spent a quarter at Cal State LA, and it wasn’t all that enlightening.
by Black Francis on Sep 2, 2008 9:05 PM CDT up reply actions
OT: UNT
I went to UNT and took a PSCI class as an elective. Political Theory from Socrates to Machievelli if I remember correctly. I had to take it twice (the first time I failed it and other classes due to personal reasons) and I had two extremely different professors for the same class.
The first one (Berry?) was extremely confrontational who really dug Tocqueville and the second was your typical absent minded professor who really loved the books he was teaching. I learned a lot more the second time because I responded better to the absent minded professor better then the other guy.
From what I could tell, there was a pretty good amount of diversity amongst the faculty, at least in the PSCI department.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
i really wish Bradley had won that primary
I probably would have voted for him. I’ve seen him speak in person…went in skeptical and came out a believer. I have and read “The New American Story”…pretty good read.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
He had a lot of money
…but I guess when you hire people like me you’re begging to lose an election.
In reality he was running against an incumbent and most (not all) of the Democratic establishment lined up behind Gore. Bradley’s a very good man, though, and would’ve made a much better President than either Gore or Bush, in my opinion. Not particularly telegenic, not an energetic speaker…lots of stuff went against him. Funny thing is, money was never a problem in that campaign, even when running against an anointed successor. I guess there were more than a few people who liked him.
by Black Francis on Sep 2, 2008 10:35 PM CDT up reply actions
agree wholeheartedly about Gore/Bush
Bradley just came across as if he understood the issues and solutions that were out there, rather than memorizing angles around the issues.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
Not addressing you, BF
Just commenting on how easy it is to tell someone’s leanings from how they react/defend/attack an issue. The right wing nuts are saying Palin is the best thing since sliced bread, the lefty commies say she is less qualified than hurlerhurley, for example. The truth is usually somewhere in between.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
i think it's becoming more and more clear
that the mccain campaign didn’t research palin before choosing her, and really kind of blew it.
some points with no clear reason or order:
we know mccain picked her because she’s a woman. but why not somebody more qualified like elizabeth dole? even kay baily hutchison (though i guess she’s not pro-life enough).
i think as time goes by women will be more and more insulted by this pick.
he met her once.
he lost his best argument against obama. by picking her as VP he is saying that she’s ready to be president. if he died a month into his presidency, she is capable to be president. bullshit. obama has more experience than her, mccain can no longer bash obama.
obama’s campaign sent people to look at newspaper archives in alaska (not available online) the newspaper (or is it library) say that they are the only ones to do this. what does this mean? mccain didn’t look into her.
did he really know that her daughter is pregnant? palin preaches abstinence only education, did it work?
i hope that there isn’t a big push by conservatives, or hypocritical liberals to say that she has a daughter that needs her more than ever and a handicapped kid, she needs to stay at home.
this whole thing about her allegedly fireing her head of public safety for not doing her personal bidding and then citing executive priviledge in the face of subpeonas reeks of more of the same bushism.
let’s hope that the 20 year old DUI for her husband doesn’t get lotsa national attention, becuase that’s old and doesn’t matter.
biden will destroy her in the debate. the question i have about the debates is this: will he be seen as picking on an innocent weak woman? or if she’s strong will she be called a “bitch” like hillary was?
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
where did you get this information from?
please don’t say you saw it on tv…
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
What information?
And most people have to rely on news sources of some kind. We can’t all be snoopy reporters.
yes
but watching and listening to bias news sources skews your opinion.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
it’s just amazing how many facts are out there on these candidates. Too bad they are cherrypicked by the media for their personal agendas…
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
How about that Google Chrome...
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
That doesn't make sense.
Google is a search engine. It doesn’t have any information itself.
"You’re the only here who contributes schtick only." - brettgardner
So Google
only gives you unbiased results?
And you’re not smart enough to watch a tv report and take it with a grain of salt? Fox is right, MSNBC is left, watch either with a salt shaker.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
stats don't lie
look it up, and quit getting brainwashed.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
Who is brainwashed?
I have criticized both candidates and try to be objective. You’re just a shill.
And stats don’t lie? That’s patently ridiculous. Stats can be massaged to show just about anything.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
speaking of it
did we ever find out who miles cincy source was?
Every pitch thrown to Josh Hamilton is recorded as an E1. -- clark
what information
are you specifically asking about?
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
The problem with KBH
is that she is a bush loyalist, which really doesn’t help with McCain’s image as I’m not like this guy.
There's that
…and supposedly she and McCain do not get along very well at all.
by Black Francis on Sep 2, 2008 8:42 PM CDT up reply actions
and evidently she wants to be be texas gov as well
Every pitch thrown to Josh Hamilton is recorded as an E1. -- clark
which she should be in line to get at the next term
"Well, the Dallas Mavericks got beat by the New Orleans Hornets last night ending their season. Word is that someone on the team is dating Jessica Simpson." - Jay Leno
LSB facebook group ---->>> http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=33345329288
Abstinence only education...
No more or less effective than birth control education…
http://meganmcardle.theatlantic.com/archives/2008/09/abstinence_only_education_no_b.php
I don’t see the daughter’s pregnancy as particularly damaging.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
the NY times reported today
that the mccain campaign folks arrived on thursday to for the final part of the vetting process. the announcement had to come friday morning. that doesnt sound very thorough to me. the whole thing felt rushed which i found surprising b/c both candidates had so long to narrow and vet their choices.
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
You don't think
that running for, and winning, the Governors seat in Alaska was a vetting process?
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
agreed
its nothing like the vetting process of an uncontested Senate seat……
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 3, 2008 12:08 AM CDT up reply actions
You're right.
And I know that wasn’t your intention.
by brettgardner on Sep 3, 2008 12:08 AM CDT up reply actions
Sarcasm
was intended……AND I was right.
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 3, 2008 12:34 AM CDT up reply actions
Prediction:
Sarah Eagleton steps aside within 2 weeks for Pawlenty. And McCain-Pawlenty get landslided in November.
Dreaming of 2009
Wow
Now that’s a gutsy prediction! And these days a pretty obscure McGovern reference.
by Black Francis on Sep 2, 2008 8:44 PM CDT up reply actions
at this point...
…in comparison to all of the things that are coming to light, it would almost be a positive development if it were revealed that she underwent electroshock therapy. At least it would give the GOP a way out of this debacle they created by not vetting Palin. I almost feel sorry for them. Almost.
Dreaming of 2009
Hmm...
I still don’t really see anything terribly damaging, here.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
really? hahahaha. ok
It has now been only three (THREE!!!) days since McCain nominated her to be his veep. In those scant 72 hours, it has been unearthed that she advocates Alaska seceding from the union, she is involved in an abuse of power scandal, she has only been a governor for 18 months, before that she was the part-time mayor of a 6,700 person town named Wasilla, while she was mayor of Wasilla she absolutely botched an eminent domain deal that ended up costing the town $1,375,000 more than it should have, she has Abramoff ties (wow, THAT just screams “reformer”, doesn’t it?), she doesn’t know what the Vice President actually does every day, her 17 year old daughter is now 5 months pregnant and is keeping the baby with the shotgunned father, she supported windfall taxes on oil companies before she was against them, she supports censoring library books, promoting creationism is one of her major passions, she knows nothing about the war in Iraq (hey, at least this is something she and McCain have in common), and she and her husband were cited by the state government for not operating their business within the law. If this is what has surfaced with the national spotlight on her and her family in just 3 short days, can you imagine what will be discovered over the course of the next 63?
Dreaming of 2009
Probably not much to really...
do a whole lot to the election.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
this lack of a proper vetting...
…speaks directly to McCain’s inability to stray from his cavalier approach to politics.
He’s not a maverick, he’s a reckless gambler.
Whether or not it affects the outcome of the election is yet to be seen, but I’m of the opinion that the bounce you’re seeing in the polls today is a direct result of Palin’s nomination.
Dreaming of 2009
I guess we'll see...
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Eagleton Reference
I don’t think what you posted above is enough, but like you say it’s only been a few days. Now if things get a lot worse then I think your Eagleton comparison might have legs.
The GOP argument against McGovern was that because he couldn’t even select a VP, there was no way he himself was qualified to be President.
by Black Francis on Sep 2, 2008 9:01 PM CDT up reply actions
yeah, that was just all around stupid.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
well
are you concerned that there is a presidential candidate with associations with radicals like Rev. Wright, Ayers, Rezko, Meeks?
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
since...
…you’re not going to dispute the facts about Palin, I’ll answer your question.
I’m concerned about his ties to Rezko. But nobody has proven that Obama got any sort of sweetheart deal. Obama paid market price for his portion of the land.
The Wright connections were tenuous and silly from the start—people don’t just leave a church because they don’t agree with their preachers.
And the Meeks tie is even less relevant than Wright.
The Ayers connection is tenuous at best as well. Obama met Ayers 30 years after Ayers’s bombings: http://www.startribune.com/politics/national/27300424.html?elr=KArks7PYDiaK7DUvDE7aL_V_BD77:DiiUiD3aPc:_Yyc:aUU
Their association is tenuous at best.
Dreaming of 2009
What?!
“The Wright connections were tenuous and silly from the start—people don’t just leave a church because they don’t agree with their preachers.”
Yes, they do.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Obama could have gone two ways in the Rev Wright issue: He could have admitted that he wasn’t really active in the church and was only there because that is where influential black community activists meet. Or he could have renounced his affiliation with Wright.
He chose the later and that was probably the wiser move based on the primary polls at the time the issue surfaced.
by robert_d_wilfong on Sep 2, 2008 10:24 PM CDT up reply actions
Don't bother asking Longhorn
to refute anything. He can only parrot GOP bullet points, not actually engage in a reasoned debate.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
right
mr. subjectivity over here who has no idea what he’s talking about.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
We're still waiting
For anything of substance from you. I’d love to see you pick an issue and write out your specific opinion on it.
Old war wound. Acts up around morons.
He only has one opinion
Anyone who disagrees with him is an idiot.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
obama?
Every pitch thrown to Josh Hamilton is recorded as an E1. -- clark
by knockoutking on Sep 3, 2008 11:16 AM CDT up reply actions
Rants don't count
If he as a particular issue with Obama’s platform,with a well thought out argument against it, sure. I’d be thrilled to hear it.
Old war wound. Acts up around morons.
it's not hard really
weak against defense, no experience, pro-abortion, associations with known terrorists and the biggest morons in the world…
i mean, that’s fact. if you want explanations on what each issue is, look it up…
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
Lame, pathetic
You just make a list as if that is a well thought out argument. You really are incapable of presenting details on WHY you think he’s weak against defense (should he be strong against defense?), for example.
What specific Obama policy proposals regarding defense are you against? He wants to give veterans a lot more help when they return home, is that bad? He wants to reenergize the Afghanistan effort, is that bad? He wants to pull the troops out of Iraq — which is in accordance with the Iraqi government’s request, is that bad?
What specific policy proposals of McCain’s do you support and why?
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
I think some things to consider are
that even knowing what he knows now, he still wouldn’t support the surge. That’s something that bothers me a lot.
I also don’t think his stance in regard to diplomacy with Iran is a good one. I don’t think he should add legitimacy to a leader who calls for the destruction of Israel, an American ally.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
I would stand and applaud
if Longhorn would post something like that just once. Imagine, an entire paragraph without once resorting to demagoguery.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
I don't think this is a one-sided thing
though, I think it works both ways. As a Republican I encounter it a lot.
As a Republican I have noticed that a lot of people just don’t know anything about politics yet still hold political views. On several occasions I have had discussions with people who claim to dislike Bush and they usually resort to saying “he’s stupid”. I understand why people would dislike Bush but I find it amazing just to listen to people sometimes who have opinions and can’t back them up at all. It makes them look so ridiculous.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
I agree wholeheartedly
I pick on Longhorn just because he rarely posts more than 10 words no matter the topic, yet he is so insistent that he’s right. He’s like a doll with a string, no matter what you say, the doll only has a few short phrases to reply.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
Dude,
Don’t feed the trolls.
I started ignoring Longhorn (like Sharky) back when we were on the ESPN boards.
I’ve never seen him post one coherent argument that defends his point.
And there have been times I agreed with him, but he STILL didn’t post any substantive reason or support for his arguments.
The essence of a troll.
R
He's not smart enough
to be a troll. He’s just lame.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
Since when
have trolls been smart?
Have they evolved since I last talked to one?
though
he supported a surge in Afghanistan long ago, when McCain was already calling that war a major success. Obama has consistently called Iraq a distraction in the real war on terror, since his famous speech in 2002. he has said he would go into Pakistan to go after bin laden. and whether you think that’s a good idea or not, i can’t see how he could be considered “soft” on defense. there’re only so many resources to go around.
Why are you pro-life? Why is his defense policy weak?
I know the issues, I’m trying to get you to elaborate on your opinion. You’re no better than Sharky, spouting off repetitive one liners and refuse to follow up on genuine inquiries.
Old war wound. Acts up around morons.
but you forgot her pork-barrel connnection
in which as mayor of Wasila pop. around 5000, she hired a lobbying group to win $26M in federal funds for the town.
what kinda big government low tax shit is that?
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
and how she was for the bridge to nowhere before she was against it.
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
yeah...
…those pale in comparison to the other things. And my fingers were getting tired from all the typing. :)
Dreaming of 2009
GOP a way out of this debacle they created by not vetting Palin
Are you paid by the Dems or do you just pass along their talking points for free?
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
by RangerMad on Sep 2, 2008 8:48 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I am an ardent Obama supporter...
…who sees things for what they are. I’m clearly not objective, but I’m not stating anything that isn’t clear as day in front of everyone to see for themselves.
Dreaming of 2009
If you were truly objective
you would see that your statement is very contradictory.
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
a few things
You are mixing in commentary with your links yet you claim to be objective. Do you believe everything you read? Really, the Huffington Post. It would be nice if Obama had undergone the same scrutiny as Palin.
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
really?
you think obama has undergone less scrutiny?
i guess you believe in a burbank moon landing as well
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
So you are
saying that the press is not biased towards Obama?
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
I believe the inference above is that
Obama was vetted by the Clinton machine which is very similar in its tactics to the Republican machine.
by robert_d_wilfong on Sep 2, 2008 10:28 PM CDT up reply actions
How is the press biased
towards Obama? The press talked about Wright for weeks, and dutifully reported Michelle Obama’s supposed lack of patriotism.
People need to stop pretending the media favors either candidate. Any dirt that comes out about either one is going to be breaking news on every news channel, newspaper website, political blog, and talk radio show. Every stupid detail gets analyzed to death by the ten million talking heads out there trying to shout each other down in favor of their own party.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
HRC makes me puke every time I see her
but it was clear to me that she didn’t get a fair shake from the media during the primarys.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
The sexism
in the coverage of both her and Palin amazes me. I think you could make a much better argument that the media treated Obama better than they did Clinton than you can for them treating Obama differently from McCain.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
re: "It would be nice if Obama had undergone the same scrutiny as Palin."
He’s been under some heavy-ass scrutiny since at least December or January. The heaviest.
Are you somehow unaware of this?
Last week I took a pleasure trip. I drove my wife to the airport.
my whackjob inlaws
are always emailing me crap about how Obama is a Muslim intent on destroying the US, that his brith certificate is fake, and how he’s the anti Christ (my fav, by the way). you mean that kind of scrutiny?
Yeah, I get that
from my brother. At least a half dozen defamatory EMails a day on Obama.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
"I just hope enough dumb oversexed over self-esteemed American public educated female liberals (yeah, you know the type) vote for a woman because she has a vagina, to swing some things."- Sharky.
"JD is a great GM if you ignore the giving away pitching and handing out horrible contract stuff."-Tricer
the problem is that multiple news reports are supporting his claims
and even though he sounds like a democratic strategist, the news reports are numerous.
PS: Shouldnt All the Right WIngers Be Watching the RNC instead of arguing details with liberals? this is the moment of platforms being placed out for public consumption, for seeing the future party leaders. for seeing great moments in party history, not arguing (without merit or source) with opposition.
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
Which one are you?
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
Which one is you, Moto?
Anyway, this whole “Obama makes my naughty parts go tingly” mystique is baffling to me.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Regardless of the reason
the bottom line is that it does. Now the question is, will all of these new individuals involved in politics (who support Obama) go and vote on election day? If so, the GOP might be in big trouble.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
exactly
Last I checked, elections are essentially popularity contests. Whether that popularity is borne out of political agreement or simply fandom is largely irrelevant
Dreaming of 2009
I disagree
I think most of the time a lot of people hop onto a political bandwagon but don’t actually vote for them. I feel like this time might be different for Obama.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
this race (before the Palin announcement)...
…in my opinion, was going to come down the ground game (advantage Obama), the youth vote and making sure they do just that (advantage Obama) and the debates (advantage McCain, unless his age/senility are apparent).
This hilarious VP pick just blew all that out of the water.
Dreaming of 2009
the youth vote?
…that is if they actually show up.
since we never have before
Every pitch thrown to Josh Hamilton is recorded as an E1. -- clark
Reminds me of The Simpsons...
when Homer organized the political rally to legalize pot and they all forgot to vote.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
They did have...
a better showing in ’04, but you are correct they still have a ways to go.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
Why is the VP pick hilarious?
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
Question
Before Friday, if you could scour the country for a potential President, would you really have picked Palin?
I get wanting your side to win, but there’s just not much there on this pick.
I disagree
I think there is a lot there with the pick.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
I think Obama is the clear favorite right now
I don’t think adding someone like Romney would have done much for McCain. Won’t create that spark in the conservative base, a base which originally wasn’t that thrilled with McCain. Palin’s positions connects with the base. If the base doesn’t come out bigtime voting for Mccain on election I don’t think he has a chance. This gives him a chance in my opinion.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
But
Are you really giving enough credit to “the base”? Are they really so gullible as to believe that the VP has any substantive say on any of these issues, other than the slimmest of chances that her vote could break a tie that could get something done (not likely, given the way the Senate works.)?
as some would say
so cheneys views didnt matter at all?
Every pitch thrown to Josh Hamilton is recorded as an E1. -- clark
Not really.
The only thing he’s had an impact on are issues of process and procedure, which are, perhaps, more important.
I don't think it's about
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
As for would I be happy if she were president?
I’m not sure because I don’t know enough about her but I’ll have an opinion on that in about 2-3 weeks. Do I think her resume is equitable with Obama’s? Absolutely. But until I hear her speak and debate I can’t say how I would feel about her as a president. We will find out soon though.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
Well
What if you come to the conclusion that you’re not happy with her potentially being the President?
Then I won't be happy with the selection
obviously.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
resulting in?
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
Resulting in me
thinking that if I feel that way most Americans will feel that way and McCain won’t win.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
I actually think...
the VP pick is pretty shrewd. The pregnancy thing, for instance, doesn’t hurt Palin any more than Cheney’s gay daughter hurt him.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
+1
I thought it was an odd selection, but I agree.
-- Micah
Baseball Is My Boyfriend
"Football is like having a fling once a week. Baseball is a relationship." - oc
by The Best Micah on Sep 2, 2008 9:09 PM CDT up reply actions
if she doesnt have the baggage it appears
it would be shrewed.
given how little people know about her though, every reporter on earth will be trying to find stuff about her, good or bad, every little detail. if she dated a hippy draft dodger as a 16 year old we will know about it, and if that process of digging dirt last for 2 months, its not good for mccain.
my only issue with criticizing the choice is what other decent options did they have? but then that approach doesnt win elections. for me there just wasnt a bunch of options and this was the result.
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
if he were steadfastly going the female route...
…why not Kay Bailey or Olympia Snowe or Carly Fiorina or Meg Whitman or Christine Todd Whitman or Jodi Rell
Dreaming of 2009
none of them are as hot as Palin
except for KBH, and she wasn’t interested
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
You find Kay Bailey hot??
Wow.
One man’s Bigfoot is another man’s Beyonce, I guess…
Last week I took a pleasure trip. I drove my wife to the airport.
it's kind of an inside joke
with a person who doesn’t even visit these boards. Probably shouldn’t have said anything, but I thought it’d be funny still.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
Plenty of women I think are hot, my friends look at me w/ horror
Last week I took a pleasure trip. I drove my wife to the airport.
she's a huge...
W supporter and didn’t want to be selected for VP because she didn’t wanna have to disagree with her leader…
I blame it not on Ron Washington, but on society. Society is to blame. And Ron Washington. ~Ken Tremendous on Ron Washington sac bunting in the 11th vs LAA
Picking a woman for VP
Does anyone really think deep down that if Palin was a man McCain makes the same pick? No, it would not have happened, no way. That said, I agree with Ben that the pick is pretty shrewd, and these things that have come out the last couple days are not going to hurt the campaign much, if at all.
For some reason it is not ok to criticize her. I think this is patronizing, but Biden or anyone else criticizing her too much will face a backlash. She is practically immune in the debate. If she makes a good speech tomorrow night she becomes an asset.
The religious right was not too excited about McCain, but he has pandered to them relentlessly for many months now, and this was the biggest bone he could have thrown them. It practically screams “I am so not a maverick, I am just the whore of the GOP base.”
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
and does anyone
really think deep down that if Obama were a “white” man he would be so popular? and don’t tell me his “blackness” has been an obstacle in “white” America…
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 3, 2008 12:24 AM CDT up reply actions
Could very well
be the case. That has a lot to do with his appeal and how that initial speech was received.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
No, of course not...
He would be popular still, not as popular though.
I suppose “Change” is a pretty good slogan for Obama then, huh?
sadly
experience has become a dirty word in politics. It is now more important to be “fresh” and “different”. Never mind that your speech could have been lifted from any democratic speech in the last 20 years. For a “change” candidate its amazing how he toes the party line.
So……McCain votes with Bush 90% of the time.
how often does Barack vote with his party? Dare I suggest MORE than 90%.(that is of course when he makes the time to vote)
If your interested in intellectual honesty I think its safe to say that McCain breaks with his party more often than Obama does his….(although t ball stated that he thinks Barack would be more bi-partisan?)
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 3, 2008 1:13 AM CDT up reply actions
interestingly
no GOP’er was/is thought to hate Bush more than McCain.
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 3, 2008 1:19 AM CDT up reply actions
Obama probably votes 90% with Bush too
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
I can't prove it
But the majority of the votes are in regard to silly things that don’t have anything to do with politics, like congratulating a team on winning the world series. So my point is that the 90% statistic is skewed or at least not an accurate representation of what is going on.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
Which Bush?
You’d be better off using some measure of voting liberal, I’m sure he scores high on that.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
since when does Bush even get a vote in Congress?
did I miss some special legislation that gave the President the power to vote?
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
I may be wrong
but McCain definitely has a reputation of being pretty nasty sometimes, though I suppose you could say he is nasty to members of both parties and, therefore, bipartisan.
I’m very disappointed, though not really surprised, at how much both candidates have pandered to their bases.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
thats the
think with inexperienced candidates…..we are lest guessing how they will govern. They have no record to plow through in order to decipher how they would govern. Of course Bush’s record in Texas wasn’t really indicative of the kind of Pres he would become. As Texas Gov. he was seen as a uniter and one who could work with Dems and get things done.
I still like my candidates to have a track record……it means a lot more to me than “just words”, as it were…..
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 3, 2008 1:31 AM CDT up reply actions
Ugh, how old are you?
To answer your first question, obviously it has helped.
To answer your second assertion, you are either naive, stupid, or a racist to think that “blackness,” as you so crassly put it, does not remain an obstacle to a person of color in white america ( and why did you capitalize white? WTF does that even mean, white quotation mark america?)
Last week I took a pleasure trip. I drove my wife to the airport.
too bad our VP pick is a better candidate for pres than your Presidential pick.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
Welcome to Longhorn's world.
"The question of how we came to be is a philosophical one." - 4HIM
by inactive lsb user on Sep 2, 2008 11:21 PM CDT up reply actions
reach arounds
for everyone…….. or just for bg?
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 2, 2008 11:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Hey
Don’t you have any Ticket drops you can quote to accentuate your point a little bit?
by brettgardner on Sep 2, 2008 11:43 PM CDT up reply actions
um........
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 2, 2008 11:48 PM CDT up reply actions
5
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 2, 2008 11:48 PM CDT up reply actions
4
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 2, 2008 11:48 PM CDT up reply actions
3
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 2, 2008 11:48 PM CDT up reply actions
2
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 2, 2008 11:49 PM CDT up reply actions
1
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 2, 2008 11:49 PM CDT up reply actions
and......
you’re done.
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 2, 2008 11:49 PM CDT up reply actions
You
Could have done better. A good “I’m sorry, that’s it!” would have done. Now you’ve just cluttered up this thread even more.
by brettgardner on Sep 2, 2008 11:50 PM CDT up reply actions
"I'm sorry, thats it!"
isn’t a Ticket drop and what my master wants…..he gets.
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 2, 2008 11:55 PM CDT up reply actions
That
Absolutely is a Ticket drop, you dolt. Classic Norm. Get your shit together.
by brettgardner on Sep 3, 2008 12:04 AM CDT up reply actions
ahhhh yessss
and then Norman hangs up the phone(ends the call, ringing tone) emphatically.
you win again…..
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 3, 2008 12:10 AM CDT up reply actions
is that all you could come up with?
no wonder you’re like that.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
Are you
talking to yourself? Still waiting for detailed, reasoned thought from you on anything. Pick a topic.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
same from you
other than copying and pasting the libs talking points…
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
Uh, no.
You are doing well in glossing over anything negative I say about Obama while noticing any little thing I say negative about McCain.
I have listed my reservations about Obama several times here in the last week, including in replies to you. But you’re not interested in actual debate or actually talking about policies and issues. You’d rather just post “liberals suck” in 50 different ways.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
dude...
…definition of talking to a brick wall… longhorn is a great conservative… he doesn’t listen and attacks constantly…
I blame it not on Ron Washington, but on society. Society is to blame. And Ron Washington. ~Ken Tremendous on Ron Washington sac bunting in the 11th vs LAA
What is this?
An example of informed debate? Taking the position that your “side” always takes the high road and the other “side” doesn’t? Come on…
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
nothing to do...
…with my “side” vs his “side” or the high road…i’ve seen the same lame crap from conservatives and liberals alike… the bury your face in the sand tactic where you merely restate talking points and don’t have a give and take discussion… though i do tend to see more ardent arguements without constructive conversation coming from longhorn… which makes him a solid conservative since he’ll probably never disagree with his party… and though you deduced i mean all conservatives are that way, and thats my bad for being so nondescript… i was speaking more directly about longhorn’s lack of give and take in an arguement, and yes, i feel like he isn’t exactly taking the high ground… sorry to have hurt your feelings…
I blame it not on Ron Washington, but on society. Society is to blame. And Ron Washington. ~Ken Tremendous on Ron Washington sac bunting in the 11th vs LAA
i havent seen a lot of we and our and your in the politcal threads weve run
and when its happened its been called out.
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
maybe...
…because I’ve completely avoided political discussions on LSB until today (what the hell am I thinking?), little things like this seem petty
Dreaming of 2009
Moto
you’re discounting the Palin pick politically. The religious right is psyched that McCain threw them such a big bone. Think volunteers, phone banks and donations. This pick is odd, but it will help him in organizational ways.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
I am a moderate Republican
who has a healthy dislike for the Pat Robertsons of the political world but I am stoked about the Palin pick because it is the Republican Party thinking outside the box about one of their candidates for the first time….ever?
Picking another old white guy would have been boring.
Palin may have been a genius pick and watching liberals squirm is a lot of fun!!
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
I am looking forward
to her speech tomorrow night. If she does well, it would be a big boon ( at least temporarily) for the McCain campaign and might make much of the gossip in the news fade quickly.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
not every...
…Obama supporter sees him as the chosen one, ya know. Some of us are actually supporting him for his courage to stand up and speak out against the Iraq war from the beginning, work for compromise bills when he was in the Illinois Senate, lead the charge for a comprehensive ethics reform bill in the US Senate, etc.
Dreaming of 2009
But you don't like...
Palin’s corruption reforms in Alaska?
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
what?
She herself is under investigation in an abuse of power scandal. And she pushed hard for earmarks for her town when she was governor. How is that indicative of a reformer?
Dreaming of 2009
The same can be said of Obama...
that he played the game with the political machine in Chicago.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Ayers
Wright
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
Annenberg Papers
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
link?
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
Link to what?
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
Well...
we’re talking about “the appearance of impropriety” here. I don’t think even the most partisan person can say that Palin is overtly corrupt. But there are “appearance” issues with Obama, as well… Rezko, for instance.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
What's
Really baffling is that you said the identity of the President doesn’t really matter. So why the Obama hate?
Got it.
Well, I guess the only benefit is that I don’t have to hear any more age-related platitudes.
Kinda sad that you can’t grow up.
by brettgardner on Sep 2, 2008 8:56 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
REC
well done, ben’s busted out a “how old are you?” a few times if i remember.
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
most of the time...
…Ben seems to take an objective approach to these types of things. I’m still willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. Mostly because he’s sometimes hilarious.
Dreaming of 2009
i havent seen that over the last couple threads.
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
Why?
I’m not some kind of McCain / Bush partisan. I just don’t get the Obama “rock-star” stuff.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
He
Excites people because he’s different than the typical candidate (in appearance, if nothing else). I don’t get what’s so hard to understand about it.
"in appearance, if nothing else"
sad, but true.
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 2, 2008 10:31 PM CDT up reply actions
He really is a good public speaker
Dazzling even. I think that’s actually one of the key factors in this election. You have Bush who’s one of the worst public speakers I’ve ever heard and McCain who used to be a good speaker but now has a creepy old man vibe about him that makes it hard to like him.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
i havent seen you take an opposing position from the republican party line yet
but your independent, it gets ppretty confusing, or my definition of an independent isnt the same as yours.
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
If the Repubs held Congress...
I would vote for Obama. I’m not a Republican partisan, though I’d say I’m more sympathetic to their views than, say, Obama’s.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
So
If the Republicans win back control of Congress this year, you’re going to have egg all over your face.
kind of moot
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
If the polls look like they're favoring...
Republican takeover of Congress, I’ll certainly vote for Obama.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Why?
Are you aware that control of Congress and the Presidency doesn’t negate a dissent?
by brettgardner on Sep 2, 2008 10:01 PM CDT up reply actions
(rolls eyes)
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Well he hasn't wished death on someone
of the opposing party…more independent than you.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
you got me.
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
there are a LOT of people who pretend to be independents
on this board…doesn’t make them independent.
I’ve seen a lot of self-titled “leaners” when their comments come across as radicals (from both sides).
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
I didn't say I was independent.
I said I wasn’t a McCain or Bush partisan.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
radicals and independents.
Everyone’s definition of radical depends on who they support. I’ve stated my thoughts — and my reservations about both candidates — several times. I am leaning Obama, but there are a lot of things about him I don’t like. But I realize I can’t expect to like everything about a candidate.
I wish Obama had more experience, and had stuck his neck out a bit more in the Illinois state senate. I wish I didn’t have the feeling that the Dems nominated a guy just because he gave a great speech in 2004. But right now he scares me less than McCain, and I feel like he’s a little more likely to be bipartisan when in office. I get that feeling from comments I’ve seen from his colleagues in Washington. Meanwhile the same people think McCain has a serious temper problem.
I can’t stand it when someone is so partisan they pretend that there is NOTHING wrong with their party’s ticker and EVERYTHING wrong with the other side. Ridiculous.
Realize this people: Both men are very serious, intelligent men who have dedicated their lives to serving their country. Politics and competing in elections turns our leaders into self aggrandizing caricatures. But the vast majority of them really do want to do a good job.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
Please point me to a comment you've made that contradicts a pro-McCain commenter
B/c we could all point to 50 that does the opposite…
Last week I took a pleasure trip. I drove my wife to the airport.
Are the conversations in these threads actually normal?
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
Yeah I guess political discussions
in real life end up like this also.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
its the same as republicans and reagan
you dont have to relate, just try to understand whats drawing the masses. thats whats to try to figure out.
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
No it wasn't
Sharky himself said the whole thing went flat. Now who am I going to believe? haha
So you were there huh? Pretty awesome.
by Black Francis on Sep 2, 2008 8:51 PM CDT up reply actions
yes, it was awesome
still hasn’t fully sunk in yet. I’m lucky to have friends in high places.
I watched the speech again after the fact and the TV didn’t even remotely convey the raucousness and electricity of that stadium. Way more energy and rowdiness than any sporting event I’ve ever been to. And I’ve been to a ton. Concerts get much crazier though.
Dreaming of 2009
Well...
he is a rock star. :)
Nolan Ryan should be the Rangers president, GM, manager and pitching coach.
He's an amazing speaker
Several of the candidates came through my dinky Iowa town last year before the caucuses. As our town’s only reporter, I, of cours had to cover them all. Sometimes I hated it, because their events were at weird times (Romney’s was a Sunday morning. WTF? I guess as a Mormon he didn’t worry about that…??). But now that I look back, I realize how fortunate I was to be so close to all these candidates (whether I agreed with their views or not). Obama was by far the best speaker I saw. Hillary was second. Tom Tancredo was DEAD LAST. He only had one issue and he beat it to death. Of all the Repubs, I was most impressed with Bill Huckabee.
-- Micah
Baseball Is My Boyfriend
"Football is like having a fling once a week. Baseball is a relationship." - oc
by The Best Micah on Sep 2, 2008 9:13 PM CDT up reply actions
Doh
Why do I keep calling him BILL Huckabee? It’s Mike. And I know that. I have this blind spot in my head though, apparently.
-- Micah
Baseball Is My Boyfriend
"Football is like having a fling once a week. Baseball is a relationship." - oc
by The Best Micah on Sep 2, 2008 9:18 PM CDT up reply actions
I think in the end, it'll fizzle out...
“Americans prefer their populism in small doses, and, preferably, from an elitist.”
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Well...
from what I’ve seen of Obama’s national service proposals, they really wouldn’t help the economy much.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
and...
…what about his proposals to cut taxes for all but the richest Americans?
Besides, we’re not talking about what will actually help the economy. We’re talking about how well a populism platform and rhetoric will help get a politician elected.
Dreaming of 2009
he's adding $1,000 tax credits for families making under $75,000...
…and he’s providing a $4,000 education tuition credit in exchange for 100 hours of community service.
Dreaming of 2009
and cutting Capital Gains tax
for smalll businesses and high tech businesses
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
I love the tuition credit idea
college is becoming outrageous
-- Micah
Baseball Is My Boyfriend
"Football is like having a fling once a week. Baseball is a relationship." - oc
by The Best Micah on Sep 2, 2008 9:33 PM CDT up reply actions
Well
Credits are actually the worst way to deal with it. More money to defray the cost just makes prices rise over time.
What's a better way?
It’s getting to be that some families can’t afford to send their kids to college.
-- Micah
Baseball Is My Boyfriend
"Football is like having a fling once a week. Baseball is a relationship." - oc
by The Best Micah on Sep 2, 2008 9:39 PM CDT up reply actions
A better way
Is to predicate state funding upon a condition that tuition is more heavily regulated in some way.
Of course, that has its problems, too. The best way would be for people to realize that the 4-year college route isn’t for everyone.
Why is that a good thing?
I’m not a class warrior.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
it sounds great in a populist election
and when the economy is in the shitter like it is now.
Dreaming of 2009
I don't find it great.
I also find tax credits and exemptions to be a horribly inefficient way to do things. “If the government is paying you to do something that you wouldn’t do on your own, they’re usually paying you to do something stupid.”
For instance, the tuition credits for community service. Creates perversive incentives, and moves the workforce from (most likely) higher production to lower.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
The entire tax code
seems to exist far more as a collection of “elect me” throw ins than any serious attempt to actually collect taxes.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
It's not about being a class warrior
Consumption drives this economy, and if you give the teeming middle class a break, they will spend more. It’s the opposite of Reaganomics, and actually more suited to a market economy in my opinion.
Even if you raised taxes on people with high incomes, wouldn’t middle class spending help make up for that? These are the people who own stocks, businesses, etc. They’d benefit if more people had more money, it would seem.
by Black Francis on Sep 2, 2008 9:41 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't agree with that at all...
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
America as a whole, no?
Japan certainly saves, though I haven’t looked at data for B.R.I.C. yet.
"The question of how we came to be is a philosophical one." - 4HIM
by inactive lsb user on Sep 2, 2008 11:26 PM CDT up reply actions
ben
You are so cool. counter counter culture, family ties style.
by enut21 on Sep 2, 2008 9:27 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
and another rec
well done as well
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
Obama Tee Shirt: 17 dollars.
Fancy Store-Bought Haircut: 85 dollars.
Invesco Field Press Pass Registration Fee: 25 dollars.
Bringing Your Filipino Man-Slave With You to Hear Obama’s Big Speech: Priceless.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
whoaaaaaa
lol
1) T-shirt was free from some volunteering I did earlier this year
2) Haircut: $25
3) Unfortch, no press pass
4) He’s Puerto Rican and Princeton-educated. And I asked him to be my man slave, but he said “that’s not something you’re supposed to ask. You make Slave do that”
Dreaming of 2009
for another view on politics...
The 5 Most Badass Presidents of All-Time
6 Great US Presidents and Their Crimes Against Humanity
Every pitch thrown to Josh Hamilton is recorded as an E1. -- clark
i would've had Andrew Jackson
higher than #4
"Well, the Dallas Mavericks got beat by the New Orleans Hornets last night ending their season. Word is that someone on the team is dating Jessica Simpson." - Jay Leno
LSB facebook group ---->>> http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=33345329288
Before I read it...
on which list? I could see him on both.
Ok, reading now, yep, seems like he qualifies for both.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
Yeah
I was saying the Badass list
"Well, the Dallas Mavericks got beat by the New Orleans Hornets last night ending their season. Word is that someone on the team is dating Jessica Simpson." - Jay Leno
LSB facebook group ---->>> http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=33345329288
This is great
all the big networks are showing different parts of the RNC at the same time…
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
Fred Thompson
now, he’s funny.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
remember when he was
gonna be the savior of the republicans? he was about as empty a candidate as wesley clark was
http://www.buchanan4pres2008.org/
NIXON: NOW MORE THAN EVER
heres a question
who had a worse campaign?
rudy or fred thompson?
Every pitch thrown to Josh Hamilton is recorded as an E1. -- clark
Tough call
Fred talked a lot, but had nothing good to say.
Rudy didn’t say a whole lot.
-- Micah
Baseball Is My Boyfriend
"Football is like having a fling once a week. Baseball is a relationship." - oc
by The Best Micah on Sep 2, 2008 9:14 PM CDT up reply actions
Rudy obviously
Thompson was never a favorite…Rudy was the hands-down favorite at the beginning and his “wait until Florida” strategy was awful and failed miserably.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
True story.
When I was in Iowa, Rudy campaign workers accidentally got on a Thompson bus. A bus with the words “THOMPSON” written in such disgustingly large font that I could see the bus across town.
You came to Iowa?
For the caucuses?
-- Micah
Baseball Is My Boyfriend
"Football is like having a fling once a week. Baseball is a relationship." - oc
by The Best Micah on Sep 2, 2008 9:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Nice
I enjoyed his two visits to my town. He seems like a good guy. I really liked what he had to say and how he said it. I hoped he would get the VP nod.
-- Micah
Baseball Is My Boyfriend
"Football is like having a fling once a week. Baseball is a relationship." - oc
by The Best Micah on Sep 2, 2008 9:18 PM CDT up reply actions
you should
call him ASAP and ask him to shave the goatee, it is quite unbecoming.
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 2, 2008 10:36 PM CDT up reply actions
that's a toughie
Rudy squandered huge advantages in name recognition and money, but I never considered him a viable candidate. The current Republican party is not going to nominate a divorced, pro-choice, pro-gay rights moderate to be its nominee. Thompson actually had a shot, he was just lazy. You can’t win the nomination if you are lazy. They both ran terrble campaigns. I think it’s a tie.
"You’re the only here who contributes schtick only." - brettgardner
Good question.
Seems like yesterday that Rudy was a shoe in, or Thompson was just going to sweep in a take over. And McCain was on the ropes.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
Thompson is doing amazing
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
he's ripping the media and the libs a new one
greatness.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
You know
Watching Thompson give this boring, cold speech, I’m reminded of a Volokh commentator recalling his experiences many years ago as opposing counsel to Thompson. He remembered him being incredibly vibrant and warm, and incredibly accommodating. Now a guy like that could have gotten somewhere.
4. (from the OP)
Who made up the term Darwinism? This is not the sams as theScientology thing. It is a scientific theory, and should not be treated as a religion.
LMAO
Thompson is a freaking beast….this is awesome.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
Man
I wish Thompson wouldn’t have botched his campaign so badly, he did awesome….. I’m a Dem but am not really sold on Obama…. Surprise! I’m like the only black guy who might not vote for him anyways…. Was considering voting for McCain but his shaky VP choice is swaying me back to vote Dem… Just me talking can’t say if it’ll have any effect on the election, just how it affected me.
his problem wasnt memerizing lines, it was debating and discussing political issues with experts in their field
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
Pay grade comment
that was awesome.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
nice music
man, i wish Jindal would make a speech…
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
Jindal will be the nominee in 4 or 8 years
IMO.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
Could be
he seems to be a rising star.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
its very trendy
to NOT be a white male….
although many will say its about time he(whitey) forked over the keys.
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 3, 2008 12:57 AM CDT up reply actions
Yup
I hope that by the time I can vote in 2012, he’ll be on the ballot. Of course, if Obama wins this year, than thats going to be a tough decision for me personally
"Well, the Dallas Mavericks got beat by the New Orleans Hornets last night ending their season. Word is that someone on the team is dating Jessica Simpson." - Jay Leno
LSB facebook group ---->>> http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=33345329288
suggestion?
Can we change the title of this post?
I like
“LSB conservatives suck the dick of anybody who walks onto the stage”
typical lib.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
typical bg
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
do you understand there isnt a such thing as a typical (insert party affiliate here)
i think that is part of the attraction of the younger candidates who run these days, people are sick of not looking across the aisle for common purpose, the things we can all agree on. voters hope that as a younger mind they arent as jaded by longtime big party slanderous crap.
typical republicans arent always conservative and typical liberals arent all big government and weak on defense.
if you buy into the propaganda you just end up a sucker.
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
would you like to lose money to me as well?
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
huh
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
do you want to make a bet on the election
don’t be such a simpleton all the time
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
you make bets with people online about who wins an election?
ooooookay.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
are you new?
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
you must not be too bright if you have to ask that question...
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
also
there’s this thing called InTrade. nobody told people it wasn’t cool to make bets with people online about who wins an election and they made a website out of it. isn’t that weird?
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
That's very different
That’s betting against anonymous people…you’re trying to win an argument by challenging someone to a bet. That’s weird.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
what argument? i just want your money
i’m identifying people who think that mccain will win and betting them. you want in?
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
haha thank you for proving my point
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
Haha
you want to bet him? haha what a dork.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
haha, i know.
seriously…who goes around on blogs betting people on who will win an election.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
people who like money?
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
No
people who resort to that instead of using words to argue your point.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
what point?
what the hell are you talking about?
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
Do you want to bet you know
what i’m talking about?
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
nah
people with serious issues.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
who also like money?
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
sorry boss
can’t help you with your personal problems.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
Agree
Thompson was great, this is kind of deflating.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
Some lobbyists must have snuck in
by Black Francis on Sep 2, 2008 9:51 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
rec
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
sockpuppets?
heh
"I’m sure you’ve seen Kiker before but I’ll just reiterate that the kid is mean on the mound. He is only 5’10’’ but he is an intimidator. He looks like he hates hitters. He has the juice for pressure situations."
-Jason Parks on Jul 22, 2008 10:08 PM
Joe
is losing Republican votes by the second.
"Well, the Dallas Mavericks got beat by the New Orleans Hornets last night ending their season. Word is that someone on the team is dating Jessica Simpson." - Jay Leno
LSB facebook group ---->>> http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=33345329288
Cutting off funding to the troops
I’m so tired of hearing that. Very misleading.
by Black Francis on Sep 2, 2008 9:56 PM CDT up reply actions
I was talking about this to my wife this morning
Republicans say Obama voted to cut of funding for troops. Technically true, but you get images of soldiers running out of bullets in the middle of battle… not exactly what they voted on.
But this is no different from Obama’s ad saying McCain/Palin are going to make abortion illegal. The MOST McCain could do is put justices to overturn Roe v Wade, which will return decisions to the states. Which will mean that abortions will still be legal in 45 states – maybe South Dakota and Alabama will ban it in most instances, but most people in those states want that anyway. It is a scare tactic that is completely misleading.
Politics is about exaggerating the other sides positions to scare people on the fence. It is pathetic, but both sides do it. What is sad is that McCain and Obama both pledged to run a “different” type of campaign. Both are liars.
The MOST McCain could do is put justices to overturn Roe v Wade, which will return decisions to the states. Which will mean that abortions will still be legal in 45 states – maybe South Dakota and Alabama will ban it in most instances, but most people in those states want that anyway.
i am VERY pro-life…almost exactly like palin
however this is what i think should happen (up to states)
Every pitch thrown to Josh Hamilton is recorded as an E1. -- clark
by knockoutking on Sep 3, 2008 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions
I highly doubt
that anyone is going to be able to overturn Roe v Wade. Even if they do get some Justices in there, the issue seems too controversial to overturn just like that.
"Well, the Dallas Mavericks got beat by the New Orleans Hornets last night ending their season. Word is that someone on the team is dating Jessica Simpson." - Jay Leno
LSB facebook group ---->>> http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=33345329288
Thing is
It isn’t Roe v. Wade that has to be overturned, it’s an entire line of substantive due process cases which extend back over 100 years.
The most anyone can hope for is more narrowing.
It's kind of moot in some places
In some states there is very limited access to clinics or drs. for any kind of abortion procedure.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
Congress would simply not approve a Pro-Life justice
at least, not a Democratic Congress.
Bringing up the Roe v Wade is a fear tactic…nothing more.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
your bitching is getting annoying.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
i like bg
we can squabble about stuff like politics, but he has a lot of good things to say, might not agree with everything he says, but it’s interesting reading to say the least…
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
Ann Curry
instead of talking about the speech she talks about a few empty seats.
HAHA. No, no bias at all…
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
I'm watching the Uber Commie Super Liberal Socialist Extravaganza (PBS)
And they’re actually being very positive about tonight’s events.
You’ll find bias when you look for it, sure.
by Black Francis on Sep 2, 2008 10:04 PM CDT up reply actions
yes, but come on
Brokow, Brian Williams, whoever it was sends it to Ann Curry for her reaction on the speech, and she talks about empty seats? That’s a bit much, don’t you think?
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
I don't know. Didn't see it.
If there were a hell of a lot of empty seats I guess that would be something worth bringing up. I really didn’t think the speakers themselves were all that great, and I’m trying to hold back my own bias. Would you rather her say “there’s some empty seats over there” or “I was fucking bored to tears”?
by Black Francis on Sep 2, 2008 10:14 PM CDT up reply actions
just be honest
‘i hate being here, i love obama’
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
Newt Gingrich just owned MSNBC
on MSNBC>
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
+1
yes he did. I saw that. lmro
"You can't reason with your heart; it has its own laws, and thumps about things which the intellect scorns." - from A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court, by Mark Twain
damn, missed it
anywhere on the internet yet?
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
nevermind, found it
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
"palin wears glasses, obama doesn't"
“palin lived in the northern most state, obama didn’t”
""If they'd have told me you can make the team but you've got to shine the shoes, I'd have been there shining shoes." -Bradley
yeah, that was rather dense.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
new link
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yN54Fb9dLKs
Every pitch thrown to Josh Hamilton is recorded as an E1. -- clark
Good quote
That Alaska National Guard stuff is baloney, they need to stop saying that.
But the stuff about her taking on her own party has legs and should be repeated often. Obama voting “present” as many times as he did in the Illinois Senate shows someone being careful, not taking a stand. Overall, a great sound byte from Newt.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
i'm always shocked to see LSB polls that show Republican votes
even with or ahead of Democratic votes. It always seems that liberals outnumber conservatives in discussions, but maybe they are just more the type to post their thoughts.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
Probably.
The thought of discussing politics on LSB is a massive beating for some.
That's prolly because...
Their guilty consciences may force them to talk all Liberal, but deep down inside everyone secretly longs for a cold-hearted Republican to lower taxes, brutalize criminals, and rule them like a king.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
I don't think
the posts are uneven. It seems there is a pretty good mix of posts from both sides.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
all I have to say is
Fred Thompson is simply a BEAST!!! and I imagine Lieberman made an impact with Independents/Dems….
what did you guys think?
"You can't reason with your heart; it has its own laws, and thumps about things which the intellect scorns." - from A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court, by Mark Twain
I think
Your Uncle not only brainwashed you politically, he also molested you.
AJM
you should consider banning this guy.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
Meh...
enut’s harmless. He’s got an enlarged “asshole gland.”
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Oh well I just feel bad for him now
let him stay…
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
I don't know...
just by casual observation, “defectors” seemed to be treated a lot better by Repubs than Democrats. I remember Ben Campbell was lauded at the time of his defection, Lieberman speaks at the RNC. Jim Jeffords?
The thing is, Lieberman was never going to appeal to the Kos crowd. He may, however, appeal to the soft middle.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
A lot of big talk
for someone who snuck his way back into a senate seat. Ned Lamont should probably be sitting in his place (Just not at the RNC, obviously).
This kind of bitterness...
it certainly doesn’t persuade anyone.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
snuck his way in?
by winning the election?
the DNC is dumb for ousting him over the war when he voted over 90% of the time over YEARS
Every pitch thrown to Josh Hamilton is recorded as an E1. -- clark
how is that sneaking in
we are a democracy.
he won the IMPORTANT election
Every pitch thrown to Josh Hamilton is recorded as an E1. -- clark
by knockoutking on Sep 3, 2008 11:17 AM CDT up reply actions
You lose this argument
Lieberman made a shrewd move and won the election. It should not be considered a bad thing to lose the support of your (past) party but gain the support of a majority of the general population.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
He Absolutely Does Not Lose
What Lieberman did was a shitty move and everyone knows it. He just didn’t want to give up his Senate seat under any circumstances. The people who gave money to Lieberman over the years were giving to him, the Democrat. And when he lost as a Democrat he took those funds and went “independent”. Not illegal, no. But power hungry.
by Black Francis on Sep 3, 2008 3:54 PM CDT up reply actions
That just strikes me
as sour grapes. The people who voted for him obviously didn’t have a problem with it. I don’t like him, but I won’t crucify him for wanting to remain a senator and for pulling it off. The Dems should be embarrassed that they lost to him.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
Sour Grapes
On the part of Lieberman, maybe.
“Hey, I consider myself a Democrat. I’m going to run in the Democratic Primary”.
He commences to lose said primary.
“Shit, I lost!!! This sucks!!!! Well you know what, screw this. I have almost nine million bucks in my campaign coffers so I’m just going to run in the general anyway. My opponent has about half the money I have the GOP nominated some guy with gambling problems. I’m all set!”
by Black Francis on Sep 3, 2008 4:27 PM CDT up reply actions
heres my question
if the guy beat him in the primary…and joe had more money…why didnt the DNC give the guy money by the truckload?
for the DNC to support someone other than lieberman was stupid. he has voted 90-95% of the time with the DNC over his time in the senate…and they run him out over WAR? …really?
"I don’t know of a single thing Obama’s done except talk and write." - Newt Gingrich
by knockoutking on Sep 4, 2008 10:08 AM CDT up reply actions
DNC didn't run him out.
Voters in Maine did. I believe it would’ve been illegal for the DNC to give money to Lieberman because he formed a party to get on the ticket.
by Black Francis on Sep 4, 2008 6:19 PM CDT up reply actions
Gallup seemingly always had Kerry & Gore
ahead of Bush so although they’re the name brand in polling, I remember their history.
Obama had a piss-poor bounce out of the convention and with a good showing from Palin tomorrow night, McCain could sling shot 3-5 points ahead of Obama by the weekend.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
huh?
A piss-poor bounce? It was about even before the convention and now he enjoys a lead somewhere between 6-9%. Thats a slightly above average bounce.
Obama's lead going into
last week was 3 to 5 points and Gallup (usually the most optimistic liberal poll) now has him at 8 points.
Carter had an 18 point lead after his convention in ’76. Mondale was nearly even after his convention in ’84. Gore & Kerry had double digit leads after their conventions.
A 2-3 point bounce is piss poor.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
uhh..
First off I don’t know why you are claiming that Gallup is “liberal”, thats pretty silly. Also you fail to mention what the Kerry and Carter bounces were, just the leads they had after the convention, and comparing Carter ’76 to now is insane, the country was a lot less partisan as it is now. Gallup had obama up between 1-3 last week, now its 8. Anywhere between a 5-7% bounce is average if not a little above average. Other polls had this thing tied, some even had mccain with a 3 point lead a week ago, now they are all showing Obama with a 6-9 point lead.
Obama's bounce is on the small side
historically speaking.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
My recollection is that Kerry had a double digit
lead after his convention.
There may be some place that shows his lead at double digits but I’m not looking for it. I found a Newsweek site that said Kerry had a 8 point lead (Obama’s lead) after their convention so to claim they had a double digit lead in some polls is not a stretch.
I also believe the Repubs had their convention first in 2004.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
historically speaking yes
realistically it was average.
This has been the longest presidential campaign with the most media coverage in history. Add that with the fact that the country is getting more partisan every 4 years and you have a lot more people who have their minds made up and aren’t going to be wavering as they usaully do. These candidates are pretty far away on the issues compared to any presidential election we have seen in awhile, nobody is gonna go over a 10% lead unless they make a huge mistake even after the convention bounces. Unlike any of ben’s recent girlfriends, this thing is gonna be really tight.
Data
Obama’s came a little later than normal, but it is indeed about what one would expect.
by Black Francis on Sep 3, 2008 1:30 AM CDT up reply actions
Republicans in '76 had a tough go.
6 years of Nixon, 2 blah years from Ford, WIN buttons, losing Viet Nam, lots of people still pissed off about what happened to the Kennedys, a wretched economy…the country was overwhelminingly against the Repubs and much more partisan towards the Democrats. Carter had something like an 18 point lead after the convention. I think the reasons he won is because he represented change and was the govnuh of a Dixie state and not some clown from the eastern establishment..sorry for the quick history lesson.
I always thought of Gallup as being down the middle until the last couple of elections and that’s where they lost credibility with me. Given all the expectations from last week, the great speech in front of 75,000 people at Invesco with a fawning media…
an 8 point lead is it? I was seriously bracing for a 10-14 point lead.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
Some stuff on Palin...
I’ve been looking for the context of the “I don’t know what the VP does all day” quote. The clip was shown on The Daily Show, but there’s obviously additional context (the clip ends a fraction of a second after the word “day,” so she seems to have followed up that sentence with another thought. Anybody seen what the whole clip says?
As for the Alaska Independence Party, Palin has apparently been a registered Republican since 1982, though her husband was apparently a member for a couple of years in the early 90’s.
As for Troopergate, this is the McCain camp’s response:
"Of course this issue came up in the vetting, and this is what we discovered," the source said. "The man who was fired has said on the record that he was never pressured by the governor or the governor’s husband on the issue of firing Trooper Wooten. The governor had a vision for how she wanted that department to be run. The commissioner had a different vision."
"The reason that members of the Palin family were having discussions with the head of the state police about this state trooper, who was her ex-brother-in-law, was because he had made threats against the family. He threatened to kill the governor’s daughter, her father, and her sister. He tasered her 11-year-old stepson. And that is why the Palin family was concerned about this trooper."
I’m not sure that rises to the level of improper influence.
I find the arc this story has followed to be pretty interesting. I’ll be watching with interest how she handles herself on the campaign trail, interviews, and debates.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
by benmor78 on Sep 3, 2008 3:15 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Incidentally...
I had been looking for videos from Alaska’s gubernatorial debates, and here’s one:
http://gregransom.com/prestopundit/2008/09/sarah-palin-debates-tony-knowl.html
It’s Alaska-specific issues, but I guess can give you an idea of how she performs.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
This is all small stuff
that will go away quickly I think. The ‘secessionist’ stuff is way exaggerated and apparently not part of that party’s actual platform, just something some of its members occasionally discuss.
Looking forward to that speech tonight.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
Meh
I am umoved by this. Unless you can prove he was active — and that she at least tacetly supported his activism — I don’t care and I don’t think it’s relevant. Even if you can prove that I’m not sure it’s relevant, though it would at least deserve a lot more discussion then.
I have my doubts that either of them were actively fomenting for secession, and it seems the party platform does not advocate anything other than following the constitutional votes they’re entitled to. I don’t think there’s a lot to gain by pushing this issue.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
Good stuff thanks
IF he wasn’t attending anything I don’t think it is that big of a deal but to be honest I didn’t even know these kind of organizations existed. Amazing.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
Why does that matter?
It is just as silly to bring up Todd Palin’s political views as it is for Republicans to be trying to dig up Michelle Obama’s thesis to claim that she’s a black supremacist (or whatever they are looking for).
I personally think
drunken slut references are relevant to the party of “family values”. The Republicans talk the talk, much like in budget situations, but they really never walk the walk. It is the party of hypocrisy in america.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
"I just hope enough dumb oversexed over self-esteemed American public educated female liberals (yeah, you know the type) vote for a woman because she has a vagina, to swing some things."- Sharky.
"JD is a great GM if you ignore the giving away pitching and handing out horrible contract stuff."-Tricer
dumbest thing said
in the entire thread, and that’s saying something. But thank you for breaking away from the Daily Kos long enough to bring us your insight…….
"You’re the worst poster here I think."--- brettgardner
by red shoe ranger on Sep 3, 2008 7:09 AM CDT up reply actions
shouldn't surprise you
look who made the comment.
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
Yet liberal puke criticism of Palin's raising of her children and trying
to finally breakthrough the glass ceiling is not hypocritical?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
Raising her children
and her grandchildren apparently.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
"I just hope enough dumb oversexed over self-esteemed American public educated female liberals (yeah, you know the type) vote for a woman because she has a vagina, to swing some things."- Sharky.
"JD is a great GM if you ignore the giving away pitching and handing out horrible contract stuff."-Tricer
irony
I find it ironic that the leaders of the Southern Baptist Convention love the idea of Palin running instead of staying at home and taking care of her kids and soon to be born grand kid. And on the other side, feminists are wondering if she can handle the job of VP. It is just backwards from what we expect. That juxtaposition pretty much explains why McCain made her his pick.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
by DerekSTheRed on Sep 3, 2008 11:35 AM CDT up reply actions
who is criticizing Palin's raising of her children?
not me.
By the way, Ferraro already broke through this glass ceiling.
Dreaming of 2009
I have a problem with her family values as well
I have a daughter. The last thing I would do to my daughter if she were to get pregnant at a young age is draw intense national attention to that fact. I’m certain this is a difficult enough time for her, why put her on the front pages of grocery checkout stands?
If the McCain campaign knew her daughter was pregnant prior to the selection, as they say they did, then this reeks of whoring out your 17-year old child for political gain. If her mother was aware of the situation and didn’t inform the campaign, then the campaign must be very angry. If neither the mother nor campaign knew, and she’s 5-months pregnant … well … then I don’t know. I guess it seems like that would be a pretty difficult thing to conceal from a loving and present mother.
by robert_d_wilfong on Sep 3, 2008 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions
Drawing attention
Without Sarah’s admission, there would be no attention to her daughter’s pregnancy?
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on Sep 3, 2008 1:35 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah
they can’t hide it, that would just make the attention more negative when it inevitably came out. My criticism of the way they’ve handled this is they should have announced (or leaked it) immediately instead of using it as some response to rumors over the weekend. It makes it seem like they initially tried to hide it but were forced to acknowledge it.
I also think they took advantage of the hurrican coverage to limit news coverage a bit. Smart, but not sure it worked.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
I respectfully disagree
I don’t believe that they thought they could hide something like this under the rug especially when apparently in Alaska it is pretty well known.
I do believe that they were going to announce it but wanted to wait a day or two. Unfortunately DailyKos decided to start a false rumor that the 5th child was not Palin’s but her daughters. To break that absurd rumor they had to release the daughter’s pregnancy news in a reactive manner to the rumor.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
I'd be very interested in hearing a response to my post above
on Palin’s handling of the pregnancy situation. Just interested in what you think.
by robert_d_wilfong on Sep 3, 2008 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions
Labor Day
I think they intentionally waited until Labor Day to divulge all of Palin’s dirty little secrets in the hopes that no one would be paying attention during the holiday.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
But if they wanted to cover it all up
why did they pick her in the first place? That’s the part I don’t understand.
by robert_d_wilfong on Sep 3, 2008 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions
because there was no vetting done of this candidate
plain and simple.
And I would wager that we haven’t seen the last of her skeletons.
Dreaming of 2009
do you really think that?
Its a fun thing to think about, but I’m pretty sure that McCain isn’t going to hinge his candidacy on someone who is a complete mystery.
My guess is that he knows everything there is to know about her, but figured that he wasn’t going to win with a conservative white male on the ticket, so it either had to be a true moderate pick (Lieberman, Ridge) or a woman. And since Kay Bailey wasn’t biting, and the Maine senators are too moderate, and Christine Todd Whitman was old news, then it had to be Sarah Palin. She appeases the conservatives and satisfies the “non-traditional” requirement. She was vetted, and she had dirt, but McCain didn’t care.
Seems like a really desperate move
from someone who was in a virtual dead-heat when he made the pick. And I’m not being nasty to McCain, just seems like really questionable strategy by his campaign.
by robert_d_wilfong on Sep 3, 2008 4:38 PM CDT up reply actions
Electoral Map
The electoral map did not look good to McCain. The popular doesn’t matter.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
Swing States
McCain has to win all of the following states: Florida, Virginia, Ohio, Missouri, Colorado, and Nevada. If Obama wins just one, then McCain loses. Right now they are all about 50-50 with Obama leading Nevada and Colorado slightly and Virginia tied. All others are favoring McCain slightly.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
I agree that it is a desparate move
Pawlenty or Romney would have been the conservative “I don’t want to screw this up” pick (like Biden for Obama).
But that doesn’t mean that she wasn’t vetted. Heck, if you are throwing a Hail Mary pass, you don’t just pick some random receiver to run down field, you pick someone who you are confident can at least get to the end zone. She wasn’t random, but she was very risky.
Nearly any candidate
is going to have some kind of skeleton, they’re just being smart about timing.
It does kind of make the McCain campaign look unprepared, or impulsive.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
Maybe I perceive it as a bigger deal than it really is
but having a 17-year-old pregnant daughter sitting at home isn’t your average skeleton. Yes, they all have things like they smoked pot or did coke in their younger years, or had some shady business dealings. But this is an unprecedented skeleton.
by robert_d_wilfong on Sep 3, 2008 2:13 PM CDT up reply actions
maybe i'm just weird
i just don’t think it’s a big deal. A teenage pregnancy is not always an indictment of the parent, even one who preaches abstinence.
Hell, she could have been on birth control…it’s not 100% foolproof (and judging by how fertile her own mom is – it’s not out of the question).
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
scandals
I must admit that as an Obama supporter, I was delighting in Scheudenfraud of the developments. But the next day I settled down and realized, none of these revelations are really that big of a deal. At least nothing that can’t be overcome.
By putting it out on Labor Day the media has a field day but has to cover Gustav and the convention at the same time. And by Cuban’s law of 3s, these issues will all blow over after 3 weeks anyway. As much as I want this to be an embarrassment for McCain, these skeletons aren’t enough.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
They aren't that ignorant
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
How many kids
have you raised, BG?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
So you're nothing more than a student in law school (23-25 years old?)
yet feel that entitles you to judge the parenting skills of somebody you don’t know?
You also feel that Palin should have immediately had an abortion after she found out Trig was going to have Down Syndrome, correct?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
I'm
21, actually.
And yes, I do feel entitled to judge the parenting skills of someone I don’t know. Why shouldn’t I? You did the same thing yourself. Did you slip away to Alaska over the summer and have a face-to-face with Palin?
Answer to your second question is mixed, which I’m sure is very confounding to you. “Immediately” is not something I would say. It should be a decision made with her husband and done after a moral inquiry which I can hardly even imagine having to make. I’ve never said that a disability is a per se death sentence; rather, I’ve said that it requires loving and attentive parenting and treatment. Since I don’t see how Palin can provide that by running for office and hoping to be arguably the second most important person in the world, I feel “entitled” to pass judgment.
But please—tell me how you can be so sure that Obama isn’t qualified to be President or doesn’t have the necessary skills. After all, you don’t know him.
You're not qualified to judge the parenting skills
of Palin any more than I am to judge the parenting skills of Joe Biden.
Are we to believe that Biden was a good parent when he left every day to go work in the Senate (after his wife and daughter died) with two young boys left at home? Maybe he was, maybe he wasn’t. Have Biden’s sons had any problems in their lives? Just like your criticism of Palin, I would be wrong to say that if Biden had spent more time with his boys, their lives would have been better.
As for you saying that Palin should have had Trig aborted instead of raising him…what you don’t realize is that kids unwittingly provide love, a sense of purpose and direction to their parents. When you see your own kid hit a home run over the fence or get up in front of an entire school as the lead in the play, the sense of pride overwhelms you and you quickly realize what life is all about.
Go read The Boys of Summer, specifically the chapter about Carl Erskine with his son Jimmy if you need further enlightenment.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
Jesus
Are you kidding me with this? It’s like you didn’t even read one word I said.
1. Answer my question about Obama, if you want to continue this. How are you qualified to talk about his leadership skills without knowing him? This bullshit on Biden is just an attempt to sidestep an argument that you know you can’t win.
2.
As for you saying that Palin should have had Trig aborted instead of raising him
I never said that. That’s the biggest strawman I’ve ever seen. I said it should be a decision made with her husband and after a long moral inquiry. I never said she “should have done it”. I don’t really need an inarticulate, bitter old man putting words in my mouth.
So please, save me your false piety and useless anecdotes.
no "long moral inquiry" required
all life is precious and valued. to believe anything else makes you no better than Charles Manson.
its not my place to judge
i have no right as a mortal to judge the fate of another. he’ll be judged accordingly by a higher power. so yeah, in a sense, i value all life as it exists on this earth. i wasnt given the right to take life from anyone when i was born into this world.
certainly, if you want to compare the souls of a newborn and an individual who has committed great sins agains his fellow man with no wish to repent or find forgiveness…thats a whole different debate.
ol yeller
That’s an awfully extreme position. What about ole yeller moments, when the life in question is in pain and suffering with no hope of getting better?
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
So you are obviously against the death penalty, right?
Last week I took a pleasure trip. I drove my wife to the airport.
Also
I’m amused at the hypocrisy of hating extremist bullshit above and then saying something so obviously extremist and inflammatory.
But I guess it doesn’t apply when you believe it, right?
i dont know how
you can equate valuation of life as an extremist viewpoint when polls have shown that the country is very much split over the pro-choice/pro-life debate.
Except
Not everyone equates it to the acts of Charles Manson.
And presumably you also oppose abortions in the cases of incest or rape, yes? Real mainstream.
murder is murder
whether its done with a knife or whether its done through a nice little procedure in a doctor’s office.
define mainstream? 18% of americans support abortion in all cases. are 18% of americans extremists? similarly, could i not then say that the 22% that believe it should be legal in all cases are extremists? i mean, they’re on the opposite end of the spectrum.
so would you call the 60% in the middle the “maintstream”?
Yes.
But I’d also invite you to take a class on polling before you drop to your knees.
In any case, you’re not in the mainstream, and your rhetoric really makes you look like a boob. Not to mention your smug “or is that response too factual for you”, which makes me laugh in the way I laugh at a 3-year-old playing with new toys.
It is, actually.
See, I’m looking at it, and I see that only ~15-16% think it should be illegal in all cases.
Try a more skewed link or something, champ.
ha.
the most recent ABC news poll shows 18, with a +/- variation of 3. so if you want to claim 15, i could just as easily claim 21.
You can pick any one of those polls and youre going to be just about in the same area when you average it all out. I wasnt skewering anything. I was bringing factual attention to show that my viewpoint is far from extreme, and that if you wish to call me extreme, then you have to balance that out on the other end of the see-saw, chief.
I was
Guessing an average, not taking a random sample.
Ugh, it’s frustrating wasting my talents on a hack.
your
guess was rather unsupported. i could guess a random number of my liking as well and say I was just “guessing an average”
you vastly overrate your talents. but your ego and smugness is far underrated.
i didnt ask to be right
but it would be nice if you did genuinely respect someone else’s opinion.
i respect your right to disagree with my on abortion rights. you have your beliefs, I have mine. i simply sought to refute youre charge of my extremism, and I believe that the data supports that. you can choose to dismiss that if you will. makes no difference to me.
however
you are good at making personal attacks, something youve now done twice.
shrug makes no difference to my thick skin, but I find it amusing that you of such talents and intelligence have had to stoop so low in your dialogue.
Heh.
For what it’s worth, I just calculated the average.
15.86%
Gee, I guess my “15-16%” was really unsupported. What else ya got?
Good point about personal attacks
“…get off your knees and take Keith Olberman’s meat out of your mouth.”
You would never “stoop so low,” right?
Personally, I think from time to time they are warranted, but that’s just me. I don’t hold myself to such consistently high standards as yourself, evidently.
Last week I took a pleasure trip. I drove my wife to the airport.
BG, this is what you said
“It makes me shudder to think of the selfishness of a woman who would not only have a baby in her forties, when risks for conditions such as Down’s syndrome multiply tremendously…”
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
Right...
Congratulations? Is that a point? It has nothing to do with abortions. It has to do with conceptions.
So Palin should have abstained from sex
after she turned 40?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
Hmm?
Were do you get these silly leaps?
No, but she should have used birth control of some kind. There’s a reason we don’t normally have babies at those ages.
How do you know
she didn’t use birth control?
You don’t, next question.
So after finding out she was pregnant and that her baby in all likelihood would have Downs Syndrome, do you believe Palin should have still had the baby?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
Ugh.
I’ll try to draw it out in crayon.
If she were willing to give the baby the proper attention and care that it would need, then sure.
Why is this hard to understand?
Why did Biden get
a pass for leaving his kids at home without a mother?
Palin had a husband, older daughters and (I believe other family members) to help her raise Trig.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
Who's giving anybody
A pass?
And the difference between anyone else is that this is a newborn with Down’s syndrome. I know you love arguing with me, but you’ve got to think a little bit first.
BG, so do you believe that Palin
should have still had Trig after she found out he most likely was going to have Down Syndrome?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
BG, you said if she was willing to
give the baby the attention required or somesuch.
She was the governor of Alaska when she found out she was pregnant with a Down Syndrome child…do you believe she had the time to give Trig the attention required to properly raise him or should she have had an abortion?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
She
Probably wouldn’t have had the time, but it’s not my place to say that she “should have had” an abortion, and I never did.
You said the idea of a 40 something year old
woman having a baby made you shudder.
You got your ass kicked today, punk.
Heed the advice of Tball and live to fight another day.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
It does
There’s no discrepancy at all. It makes me shudder because I actually care about children, and not just a fetus.
But hey, if you say I lost enough times, it must be true.
Josey
I agree with Brett. There is another choice to abortion. She could have found a job in the private sector — where the demands of the job are not so unique.
I think she’s turning her back on her family in a time of great need. A newborn with Downs and a pregnant 17-year-old.
What happens happens. How you deal with it is a whole different story.
by robert_d_wilfong on Sep 3, 2008 4:51 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm sure...
that her husband will do a fine job taking care of Trig when she’s unavailable.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
you're sure? how so?
this whole discussion is silly because none of us know anything about who’s going to care for that child.
Dreaming of 2009
who
is going to care for Barack’s children?
who cared for Biden’s kids when he was spending all day in Washington away from them before driving home late at night?
god, i could never vote for them because i have no idea how those poor children were raised…
Well...
the whole line of reasoning seems specious. I’d argue that Trig’s and Bristol’s and Bristol’s child’s lives will all be better if Palin becomes the VP. Gore has shown us what can become of a VP after leaving the Naval Observatory.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Hmmm
Money, fame and fortune may make an adult’s life better. But I’m betting the kids have no idea what Socio-economic class mommy and daddy are in.
by robert_d_wilfong on Sep 3, 2008 5:37 PM CDT up reply actions
Riiiiiggghhhtttt....
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
So you really believe those Etrade commercials?
by robert_d_wilfong on Sep 3, 2008 5:53 PM CDT up reply actions
She probably...
will have more resources to take care of the children as VP and former VP than as governor of Alaska.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
why
isnt Barack perceived as turning his back on his 2 young daughters to pursue the presidency? If the situation were reversed, and Barack or Biden had just had a child with Downs syndrome, would there be all this fuss made about them turning their backs on their family? I think not. Its a fundamentally sexist argument to say that a woman must be constantly around her family to care for them.
based
on the fact that there hasnt been any fuss made about Biden, for one. the guy continued working in Washington even after the death of his wife and daughter, leaving 2 young sons at home every day. dont you think he could have found a job closer to home? i dont know, but seems like the argument could be made that he neglected them just as much as Sarah Palin would be neglecting her family.
And theres never been any discussion in any presidential election in the past of whether the candidate, for either position, would be neglecting their family by taking the position. You find me one single case where this concern was voiced and ill eat crow like theres no tomorrow. you wont find it. its not there.
it wasnt an issue until someone decided that a woman’s job was suppose to be raising her family, not running for VP.
Dude
picked the wrong guy. I’m a stay-at-home dad. My wife’s the bread winner and I make some “extra” money as a consultant working from home. However, my parental duties take precedence over my business.
Timing is everything. Newborns require a great deal of care. That’s why most mothers take as much time as they can afford to take after child birth.
With the two scenarios that her family is facing, it would be a good idea for her to have a job that would provide some flexibility — especially since, unlike many others, she has the ability to obtain that type of job.
by robert_d_wilfong on Sep 3, 2008 5:08 PM CDT up reply actions
Why should she take another job?
This doesn’t make sense. Why can’t her husband step in?
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
Obama did a great job of
distancing himself from all of the nutcases attacking her for family reasons.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
I dont think
its really your job to tell another individual how they should best raise their family. or to judge another family’s decisions in how they best choose to handle the raising of their family. their are plenty of people out there in much worse shape than the Palin family. I dont hear the media in an uproar about the number of single mom’s with 5+ kids out there neglecting their children on a daily basis.
5 children that, the recent pregnancy news notwithstanding, appear to be as well raised as any others in America, from what little dirt the media has been able to dig up anyway
this is a ridiculous argument. youve got no ground to stand on here.
It's not my job to tell anyone how to run their life
I’m making a decision on who I should vote for — not that it matters, really. These are the kinds of things that I factor into my decision. Therefore I do have a right to judge how she is raising her family. That’s what happens when you run for office; people make judgments on the decisions you make in your life.
And of course you’re going to think it’s a ridiculous argument and has no grounds, because you don’t feel the same way. That’s stupid discourse.
by robert_d_wilfong on Sep 3, 2008 5:45 PM CDT up reply actions
Brett is wrong about this I think, but
Biden had to work somewhere, didn’t he? He did not have a large family helping, so the kids would have been left at home whether or not he worked in Washington.
Brett, come on, just stop. Unless you’re going to say that all families should have one parent stay at home your comments on this are not only wrong, but mean spirited. You have absolutely no understanding of what it means to be a parent, and you nor anyone else should be telling Palin or anyone else whether or not they can have kids, Down syndrome or otherwise.
Pick another fight, this one is asinine.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
t ball
I never “told anyone else whether or not they can have kids”. That’s really an unfair characterization.
I said it was selfish of somebody without a lot of time to have a baby at a time in life where risks rise drastically.
I never said Palin should have an abortion, but she should have been more cautious, in my opinion. Tubes tied, birth control, vasectomy, whatever.
What I guess you’re not getting is that I’m not being “mean-spirited”. I actually genuinely care about kids, and I’d like to see a decent life for them once they actually pass the birth canal. This is not “any family”, it’s one with a mother who’s guaranteed to be gone for long periods.
So please spare me your preachiness, as well.
by brettgardner on Sep 3, 2008 4:01 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
What's behind the vehemence of my comment.
When my wife was pregnant some tests came back with ominous numbers. We spent a few agonizing weeks discussing what could potentially be choices no parent should have to contemplate. It was torture, and I’d still glaldy go through it all again if we decide to have another child.
Luckily our daughter was fine. I’m really not sure that you can truly understand those feelings unless you have a child. It’s cliche, but true nonetheless. I can absolutely understand why the Palins would be willing to take the risk, and why they would be willing and ready to love the baby no matter what.
You may think that means a life of misery for the child, but most any parent of a Down Syndrome child would strongly disagree with you. A different life with difficult challenges of course, but not an unfulfilling one. I think you’re speaking from ignorance on that point.
As to caring for the child, the vice president (or a governor, for that matter) have way more resources available to them than the average family. If anything, it may be easier for them to provide excellent care for all of their children and grandchildren, including the youngest of her children. And it may provide an excellent opportunity for the public to learn a bit more about Down Syndrome.
Any parent of a Down Syndrome child reading your comments would likely be offended, or at least disappointed that you have such a narrow view of the life their child has.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
You've
Completely missed my point if you think somebody with a Down’s syndrome child would be offended by how I feel.
It sounds like I have more experience with Down’s syndrome than you do, so be careful before you go pointing the finger of ignorance.
I don’t have a child. That’s true. But all I’m saying is that I want ALL children to have the best life they possibly can. I’ve said nothing bad about people with Down’s syndrome; on the contrary, I’ve said that they deserve the very best of their parents. My comments of “probably a terrible life” were directed to THIS baby, not all.
That’s my problem in this situation. I don’t see how Palin can straddle that line. Being able to pay for nannies isn’t the same thing as being a good parent or providing good care.
T ball, I think you’ve taken great offense to something that I haven’t said, which is silly to me. You need to grow up if you think platitudes about being a parent are the dispositive factor in having an opinion on children and healthcare.
Again, spare me your holier-than-thou attitude, and address what I actually said. Thanks.
A vicious cycle
I wasn’t offended at anything you said, just the way you say it. I understand your position better now after rereading the 7000 posts and replies we’ve all thrown up here. You have a valid point that got lost in all that shit.
In my second post I wasn’t trying to play the parent card in an “O you wouldn’t understand” tactic. I was just trying to explain how I felt and why I felt that way. I don’t like admitting I’m wrong any more than you do, but I missed much of your original point, so I admit it. That’s what I get for loosely following a thread of comments over several hours in between working.
Apparently the Down parents you know have a different view than the Down and other special needs families I know. Perhaps one or both of us has a naive or jaded view based on that. I certainly didn’t mean to imply it was all cheese and ale. My connections with that experience talk about how surprised they are at the wonderful relationship they have with their child. Challenging, yes, but rewarding and fulfilling in ways they never expected.
The VP has a staff to help with many ordinary tasks. Yes she’d have to work hard, but when they get home from work they have to take out the garbage, do laundry, cook something to eat, pay bills, etc.
As hard as the VP job is, on a daily basis I don’t think it’s much worse than the schedule of my widowed coworker single parent, working fulltime and caring for a son with MS. And I’m assuming Mr. Palin wouldn’t be working, so I don’t see how that would be very different than countless families, except in the stress level of her job.
Is it selfish to have a child over 40? My wife and I won’t take that risk, especially after our earlier scare when she was just 30 (Asian women are at a higher risk for some things apparently). But most evangelicals feel you trust God on that sort of thing. I don’t see God as being that interventionist, but that’s what they believe.
For me, the selfishness comes not in having the baby, but in accepting the VP nomination. Maybe that’s a patronizing view and would offend my acquaintances with special needs kids, but no way would I subject my already strained family life to that if it were me.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
T ball...
That’s EXACTLY my point. I think we’ve been arguing over whether “six” or “half-dozen” is the proper term.
These threads
get so damn long, I really had to look hard to find your original point.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
Or
She could have had her tubes tied like a lot of women do today. Or her husband could have had a vasectomy.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
BG, your massive backpedal
in this debate was duly noted right here.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Here" is where you broke down
above starting where it says “Jesus”
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
keep waiting...
… brett i feel your pain.
I blame it not on Ron Washington, but on society. Society is to blame. And Ron Washington. ~Ken Tremendous on Ron Washington sac bunting in the 11th vs LAA
it's probably the same reason
that Obama is not attacking her parenting while attacking her experience.
One is off-limits and one is fair-game.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
i'm sure Palin creates time to run a country and take care of her family
by having her husband help as much as possible. There’s probably a nanny involved.
Also, I doubt she spins much time on LSB in political threads.
Raising children and working in a high-stress job is one of the hardest things to do. It doesn’t mean that it’s impossible, and it certainly doesn’t mean we can say that a person in particular “shouldn’t”.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
because you really have no idea who
is/isn’t a good parent when all you see are news snippets.
It could come out later that Dr. Phil beat his kids and nobody would ever have known. Nobody ever knows how good or bad parents are behind closed doors.
Todd Palin could be holding Trig every waking second that Sarah wouldn’t be around, yet you would still demand that both parents be there. As long as one parent is there, that’s all that you can realistically ask for…otherwise, you are saying that every child who ever grew up with both parents working were neglected which could not be further from the truth. To demand that the mother have a more flexible position is ridiculous and sexist.
I’d say that an average family has both parents working with an outsider (nanny, daycare, church) providing childcare. If a child with special needs (Down’s syndrome for example) has one parent 24/7, I don’t see how you could condemn the other parent for working (even in a high-stress job).
I have to agree with T-Ball. You really have no idea what you’re talking about until you have children.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
You have
Valid points without having to resort to that stale criticism at the end. Just stick with the goods.
For one, I’ve never said that this is a “mother” issue. I was critical of Edwards for putting his own motives ahead of his wife and children’s.
If Todd Palin spends every waking second that Sarah wasn’t around, that would make me feel better for the child, but it wouldn’t really make me feel any better about Sarah Palin.
I suppose my biggest rub with the whole affair is that Palin is actively seeking a higher-stress, longer hours, more time away kind of job when she already has a newborn.
If, for instance, the child were 10, my criticism would be much less harsh. But Down’s syndrome children have extraordinarily high demands when they’re infants. I suppose I see the issue as putting personal gain ahead of family, which is antithetical to my values.
Of course, you’re free to disagree, but I don’t think that I’m some monster because I care about children deeply. Isn’t that all that you want out of a parent, anyway?
Question about Lieberman
I’ve never been a huge fan of his (I think Gore picking him lost him the 2000 election – a campaign can survive one guy with no personality on a ticket, not two), but if he had won the nomination in 2004 I’d have been a lot more likely to vote for him than John “reporting for duty” Kerry.
For the rational liberals out there (as opposed to the ones who are just snarky – you know who you are), what do you think of him now? He’s still a powerful progressive voice who I think brings credibility to many causes. Both liberalism and conservatism have been in constant danger of collapsing to their extremes, and guys like Lieberman who don’t just listen to their party leaders and can gain respect across lines are what is needed.
He got thrown under the bus for supporting a war which he truly believed in (very unfair, in my opinion), and he’s retaliating now by supporting McCain. It was a boring speech yesterday, but a powerful message nonetheless – here is the 2000 Democrat VP nominee supporting the Republican in 2008. Does this forever taint him in your minds? Do you respect him still, though probably disagree with him?
Who is Joe Lieberman to you now?
Well
I don’t doubt that he “truly believes in” the war in Iraq, I just wonder what exactly his motivation is for doing so. I suppose what I’m saying is, I’m not sure that he and McCain support the war for the same reasons.
by brettgardner on Sep 3, 2008 11:43 AM CDT up reply actions
You mean
that people can support the Iraq war and not be puppets of the Neo-Cons?
I think Lieberman supported it for pro-Israel reasons first, probably pro-humanitarian reasons second, and anti-terrorism reasons third. McCain was probably anti-terrorism first, pro-democracy second, similar to Bush.
The Neo-con justification was very different than all of these – they wanted to show the US military was powerful enough to dominate two wars simultaneously to scare other countries into deferring to us. And our military was powerful enough, up until the “now what do you do with it?” question popped up. I am convinced they fully thought the UN would step in. 9/11 gave the neo-cons an excuse to flex their muscle, and Bush was gullible enough to follow (he felt compelled to keep doing things to fight terror, the neocons gave him the perfect target on a silver platter).
Yes, that's what I mean.
But I only ask because I wonder if “neo-cons”, who are presumably the majority of the base, will listen to a guy who disagrees with them on almost everything except one big issue, and even that issue agrees with it for different reasons.
Just wondering.
by brettgardner on Sep 3, 2008 12:22 PM CDT up reply actions
Three Things not getting enough attention, IMHO
1. The McCain campaign handled the timing of the announcement of the Palin pick well. Going by many polls it seems to have stole some thunder from the Dems convention and may have limited the usual post-convention bounce. They may have kept it too secret, though, ahead of the announcement. A little trial ballooning might have gently leaked some of the revelations about Palin beforehand so it wouldn’t become as big an issue as it is now.
2. The Obama campaign is really in a bind with Palin. She is nearly immune to direct criticism. That’s not right — I think a woman should be just as much a target as a man, and let her stand on her merits — but that’s the way it seems to be. Obama, and especially Biden, have to handle her with kid gloves or they risk alienating the Hilary supporters they desparately need.
If I’m running that campaign I am either A) not agreeing to a VP debate, or B) being extremely careful with the format of the debate to limit the chances of Biden coming off as mean or condesending.
3. Iraq. Now that the Iraqi government has asked for U.S. troops to be out in a couple of years — and the Bush administration has already handed over the Anbar province — the issue of withdrawing troops has kind of become moot. Bush, McCain, and Obama are all essentially in the same place now on that. McCain should be pushing the surge as the reason for success (though the reasons are probably more complex), but I think this fades a bit in importance for voters. The issues voters want discussed are more domestic now.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
good stuff
I agree on all 3 of your points. I still think you have to have a VP debate, though. Otherwise, it looks like cowardly.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
No. 2
I think that’s overblown. While I agree that Biden can’t handle her like he would Pawlenty or the like and he’ll have to be a softer, kinder Joe, I think that’s a good thing. If Biden went into the debates in his usual boorish fashion, I don’t think it would matter who he was debating against, it would have hurt him.
I think multiple debates would be beneficial to the Dems. Let the public get used to seeing Palin attack and have Biden go on the defensive and then Palin is fair game in subsequent debates.
by robert_d_wilfong on Sep 3, 2008 1:59 PM CDT up reply actions
Usual boorish fasion
Good point. He’d look like a jerk against anyone if he did that. There is such a thing as too plain-spoken.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
#1
You’re only now seeing the post-convention bounce. But it’s obscured by the Palin bounce. That’s right: in Obama’s favor: http://www.pollster.com/polls/us/08-us-pres-ge-mvo.php
Dreaming of 2009
yep
There definitely has been a bounce for Obama. It’ll be interesting to see whether it wears off or not.
I doubt the Palin pick has had any effect on the polls yet. Her performance tonight is essential.
I’m still not convinced that such a thing exists as an “undecided independent voter” – other than the people who don’t really care / don’t pay attention until Nov. 1. And this year that’s pretty hard to be. There may be people who tell pollsters “I haven’t decided yet,” but I think most people know who they are voting for.
Interestingly, I think Obama’s stardom was enough to get people who normally don’t care about politics to at least watch his speech the other night (possibly leading to a bigger-than-normal bounce). Sarah Palin will draw a lot more viewers than any VP pick could have – not at the level as Obama, but a lot. She’s a woman VP candidate (not the first, but the first most people can remember) and a mystery to most
polls, undecideds
I’m not counting any polls until at least a couple of weeks after the GOP convention is over. Each party usually gets some kind of bounce, so I’ll wait until those pass.
I think there are a lot of undecideds right now, hell it’s two months before the election and we just found out who the VP picks were. The GOP convention isn’t over and there haven’t been any debates yet. I think the undecideds will move one way or the other in large numbers after a debate or two.
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
If that were a stock chart...
I’d say that McCain’s in a “head/shoulders bottom,” which indicates a trend reversal.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
You're a dirty man, Moto.
Tainting technical charting analysis like that. I’ve never thought to check and see if anyone has researched whether technical analysis patterns hold true in polling patterns, though, it’d be interesting to see.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
well...
…seeing how polling patterns are borne out of purely reactive movements, you can’t exactly think of them like technical analyses, right? They aren’t quantifiably discrete.
Just thinking out loud here.
Dreaming of 2009
I would think, though...
that there would be some similarities… technical analysis proponents think that all relevant data is contained in the price activity of a security, and the poll number could be a “price.” I’ll have to look on Google scholar and see if I can find anything.
"I know you're a bit dense but no, it doesn't. Obviously lying isn't a problem for me."
I think you are dead wrong about number 2
Biden doesn’t have to lay off. Man, that’s almost as cynical as the reactionaries who think the HRC supporters will just come a’runnin over just because they both have vaginas.
And on a peripheral note, I think all the hullabaloo about “if she nails the speech tonight” or how “she does in the debates is critical” rhetoric is misguided.
First off, I’d be shocked if she didn’t smoke the speech this evening. She’ll have the heaviest hitters in RNC speechwriting giving it their best punch up-she’ll get all the best zingers. Plus, she’s attractive, photogenic, reading a teleprompter, and addressing the friendliest of friendlies. She’ll kill.
Second (and all you people who say “firstly” and “secondly” are dufuses. Dufuses!), I don’t think the debates will be that critical. She’s much more likely to make a couple of big “gaffes” under the relentless scrutiny of 24 hour cable news media. That’ll be hard not to do. I know I’d fuck it up.
And that, I think, will be her biggest challenge, not the debates or this speech.
Last week I took a pleasure trip. I drove my wife to the airport.
So...
Obama is scheduled to appear on "The O’Reilly Factor" Thursday night, the same night that McCain addresses the RNC. Smart move on Obama’s part. But also smart move on the Republicans’ part, as Obama will be without a teleprompter and the audience can watch him sputter away…
sputter? that's funny you assume that.
did you see him in the last 5 or 6 debates? And on the values forum? The guy is a good, smart speaker, whether teaching constitutional law as a university professor, orating in the US Senate, speaking in front of hundreds of thousands of people, debating, or being interviewed.
Dreaming of 2009
Well, you know, my understanding is that, uh, Governor Palin’s town of Wasilly [sic] has, uh, 50 employees, uh, uh, we’ve got 2,500, uh, in this campaign. I think their budget is maybe $12 million a year. Uh, uh, we have a budget of about three times that just for the month. Uh, so I think that, uh, our ability to manage large systems, uh, and to, uh, execute, uh, I think has been made clear over the last couple of years. Uh, and certainly, in terms of, uh, the legislation that I’ve passed just dealing with this issue post-Katrina, uh, of how we handle emergency management. The fact that, uh, many of my recommendations were adopted and are being put in place, uh, as we speak indicates the extent to which we can provide the kinds of support and good service that the American people expect."
—Barack Obama
what's 'silly' is what he said...
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
that
and the obama slobberfest thats been going on around here. even Al Franken could get his knob polished around here with all the unabashed liberal felatio.
did you read the comments on this page?
i was pretty sure that brettgardner and RangerMoto were about to perform a donkey show for us.
and we have a new competitor...
in the reply to an arguement with an insert-witty-retort-not-acknowledging-your-point-or-announcing-my-disagreement-and-counter-arguement competition… congrats.
I blame it not on Ron Washington, but on society. Society is to blame. And Ron Washington. ~Ken Tremendous on Ron Washington sac bunting in the 11th vs LAA
the list...
…is long, but distinguished.
I blame it not on Ron Washington, but on society. Society is to blame. And Ron Washington. ~Ken Tremendous on Ron Washington sac bunting in the 11th vs LAA
you love Biden
i can’t see why you wouldn’t…
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
I love Biden
As a politician.
As somebody with a brain that’s not anchored to a label, I have the freedom to do that. You should try it sometime.
you love Biden as a politician
but won’t vote for him because….???
Please. Don’t go back to your habitual ways…
"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno
nobody has to presume anything
you’re not exactly Mr. Mysterious.
You are Exhibit A in my comment earlier about how a lot of self-titled “leaners” really are nothing of the sort.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
since i have no idea where you live
’06 is irrelevant.
‘04? Let’s just say that we know who you didn’t vote for, and in a 2-party system…that’s all you need to know.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
just stop
you look ridiculous trying to hint that you’re something you’re not.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
Hah.
And you don’t look ridiculous trying to tell me I’m something that I’m not?
Here’s a clue— just because I don’t like Palin doesn’t make me a Democrat.
lots of non-Democrats
work on Democratic campaigns.
Riiiight.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
I've explained
Why I did that. Not that you’re interested. Whatever—I honestly don’t understand why I’m defending myself against you.
by brettgardner on Sep 3, 2008 11:00 PM CDT up reply actions
you don't have to defend anything
i’m not getting on your case for being a Democrat.
Just be who you are and stop acting like something you’re not.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
Come on man...
why do you care what he considers himself? Maybe he’s a social liberal and fiscal conservative who voted republican last election? Maybe it’s the other way around. You can’t tell him what he his or isn’t. Not everything is always black and white. There can be some grey.
(I tried to stay out of one political thread I just couldn’t do it) =P
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
to answer your question though
it’s painfully obvious that you voted for Kerry in ’04.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
Painfully obvious?
Sure. Got me. Guilty as charged. I voted for the best of the bad options.
Does that mean that you are proud that you voted for Bush for a secod term? That my friend, would be painful.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
I would have voted for Bush
again over Kerry…jeez, look at the judgment Kerry used when he picked his VP.
What other bad judgments would he have used over the last four years?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
Would have?
You didn’t vote?
O Freunde, nicht diese Töne!
Sondern laßt uns angenehmere anstimmen,
und freudenvollere.
I voted for Bush in 2000 & 2004 and
if I was magically transported back to 2004 knowing everything I know now, I’d have no problem voting for Bush once more over Kerry.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
it was a reply to BG
he voted for Kerry in 2004.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
and i'm tired
of you lying about who you really are.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
no
i feel vindicated.
http://www.lonestarball.com/2008/6/4/545584/2008-us-presidential-poll#6564189
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
Heh.
Good job.
Doesn’t mean I’m voting for Obama, though. If you read that, it’s about how I’ve changed since then.
But who can read these days?
yeah
it’s obvious from your comments that you are a big McCain supporter.
Your comments, campaigning for Richardson, voting for Kerry, etc. all point to an irrepressible urge to support McCain/Palin.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
Uh
That was stupid. If you listen to just about anyone talk without having prepared a comment, and that’s how they’re going to speak.
by Black Francis on Sep 3, 2008 4:07 PM CDT up reply actions
right
so people can only speak without stuttering and stammering if they have prepared comments in front of them? hmmm
all im saying is that Obama is great when speaking from a script. he’s unparalled and unrivaled. but, when he speaks at town hall meetings and in debates, he’s not nearly as eloquent.
its not a dig against the guy. its just a fact. when they debate, it will be a more level playing field than if they were to both stand in front of the camera and address the nation.
ok
all im saying is that Obama is great when speaking from a script. he’s unparalled and unrivaled. but, when he speaks at town hall meetings and in debates, he’s not nearly as eloquent.
That’s pretty much what I just said. Also, if you’re reading a transcript of someone’s answer to a question, there’s probably going to be a lot of “uhs” and shit in it. And that’s going to look real bad on paper. When people say “uh” they’re thinking. That’s all it means.
At least Obama’s remarks were transcribeable. I’d hate to see a transcription of Bush’s remarks, wouldn’t you?
by Black Francis on Sep 3, 2008 7:33 PM CDT up reply actions
sputter is right
without a teleprompter he’s on an even level, if not below, McCain, in terms of oratory skills.
Which is it Obama?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vaG6s05MKeM
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
It's safe to say he's been debriefed.
He’s right both times.
If Iran was involved in a direct military confrontation with the United States, the response from the air alone would devastate them. On the other hand, they are a threat in unconventional ways.
by Black Francis on Sep 3, 2008 4:11 PM CDT up reply actions
You are very incorrect
he can’t be both right times because he says the exact opposite things.
He claims in the second speech that Iran is a serious threat because they have a nuclear program in development, deny the holocaust and are a threat to israel. Iran did all of those things when Obama first claimed that Iran is not a serious threat.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
black and white...
…there’s only one right answer at all times. everyone is a threat and we should be kicking their ass chuck norris style. awesome…
I blame it not on Ron Washington, but on society. Society is to blame. And Ron Washington. ~Ken Tremendous on Ron Washington sac bunting in the 11th vs LAA
Who said that?
You did, not me.
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
Do you really want...
the US to get into another war before the other 2 are finished?
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
He's a diehard Republican
so yeah. Wars and deficit spending are all they know. Its their economic plan.
"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky
"I just hope enough dumb oversexed over self-esteemed American public educated female liberals (yeah, you know the type) vote for a woman because she has a vagina, to swing some things."- Sharky.
"JD is a great GM if you ignore the giving away pitching and handing out horrible contract stuff."-Tricer
I'm a diehard Republican?
I’m actually socially liberal. But good try?
"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005
Really?
The way you’ve been cheering on the Republicans, it makes it hard to say you’re not hard-core Republicans, because the fiscally conservative Republicans went out with Reagan. So, I find it hard to believe that a socially liberal, fiscally conservative voter would vote Republicans, ESPECIALLY with the abuses of power the current administration has run.
How exactly are you socially liberal?
R
Social liberal, fiscal conservative
That’s me.
Haven’t been able to get behind too many GOPers the last decade or so.
Your point is spot on.
Last week I took a pleasure trip. I drove my wife to the airport.