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The disappearance of Mad Max

The Rangers called up Max Ramirez on September 15.  He started that day, going 0 for 1 with two walks and a HBP, and was lifted for a pinch runner in the 8th.

That's the last start he's made.  He came in late in yesterday's game and on September 17, to fill in during garbage time, and that's been it as far as playing time goes since rosters expanded.

Which continues a trend dating back to when he was here earlier in the season.  Ramirez started on July 13, and went 3 for 5.  That was the last time he hasn't had a hit...but then, he's only had 6 official ABs since then.  He wasn't sent back to AAA until July 28, but in that two week stretch between start and being sent down, he started just one game, and came into another as a pinch hitter for Frank Catalanotto.

So, in a span of roughly a month on the major league roster, he has a pinch hitting appearance, a couple of late-inning garbage-time stints behind the plate, and 2 starts.

This, to me, suggests that those of us hoping that Max can be a DH/backup C next season are probably out of luck.  If Ron Washington really viewed Max as a legit option to be a contributor next season, Max would probably have gotten a little more time, at least a few more starts at DH. 

My guess at this point is that the DH next year will be a vet, either Milton Bradley, Hank Blalock, or Frank Catalanotto.  If Milton comes back, Blalock could be dealt or see his option declined, with Travis Metcalf playing third base and Chris Davis playing first base, or Blalock could come back at first with Davis struggling at third for another year.

If Milton doesn't come back, you probably are looking at a semi-platoon with Cat DHing against righties and Travis Metcalf playing third base against lefties, with Davis playing third base against righties and some 1B or DH against lefties.

But either way, my guess is that Max isn't in that particular picture right now.

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Display:

"...with Davis struggling at third for another year."

I don’t get to watch a whole lot since I work nights, but I was under the impression that CD was adjusting nicely to 3B…..

"Does this effectively hide my thunder?"

by Bob Loblaw on Sep 27, 2008 11:36 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

davis

id’s say he’s adequate at third. he’s not a butcher but he’s not a gold glove third baseman.

i’d much rather see him there than vazquez.

"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it." - Mitch Hedberg

by rentz on Sep 27, 2008 11:49 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

isn't it something

that CD would get better at with enough time and practice? It seems to me that if you can leave him at 3rd, that opens up more options as far as 1B and DH are concerned.

"Does this effectively hide my thunder?"

by Bob Loblaw on Sep 27, 2008 11:54 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Id say

he’s much closer to a butcher than a Gold Glover.

Then again, so is Vazquez.

"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky

by DJCahill on Sep 27, 2008 12:08 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'd say

he’s somewhere in the middle. but he’s an improvement over vazquez in my eyes.

"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it." - Mitch Hedberg

by rentz on Sep 27, 2008 12:09 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well

Not a huge sample size, but both RZR and +/- say he’s awful.

by Adam J. Morris on Sep 27, 2008 12:14 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

defensive ratings

do they have any of those stats for when he was in the minors?

"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it." - Mitch Hedberg

by rentz on Sep 27, 2008 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think most fans

cut their young players a lot more slack than I do. I tend to compare players to average major leaguers, and they grade on a curve based on expected improvement.

I’ve noticed most fans of even fairly average, young infields tend to rate them as great infields.

"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky

by DJCahill on Sep 27, 2008 12:52 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Catchers

It’s not just max getting the shaft late in the season either. What happened to that platoon of laird and teagarden?

I guess laird bitched enough to get the majority of the playing time.

"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it." - Mitch Hedberg

by rentz on Sep 27, 2008 11:50 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Cat using a 40 spot again this year

WIth the 40 man crunch the Rangers are going to have….how can we justify keeping Cat on the roster? He’s had 75 at bats since July 1st. Obviously, he is not in the long term plans of the team.

I have loved Daniels as GM, but his roster management has been something of question…if he’s still around, keeping a 40 man roster is going to be pivotal, especially when you have “the top farm team in baseball.” We can’t lose players in the Rule V because we keep a roster filler such as Cat on the team.

by Doc Mabee on Sep 27, 2008 11:56 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Cat

If a team will take him and his contract I think he would be gone. I also think that if we absolutely need the roster spot he will be cut. But until we absolutely need the roster spot, which we won’t this winter most likely, then I think he stays around. Hes not blocking any young players unless you want to have a young player sit the bench. He doesn’t complain about his lack of playing time. His contract aside he is the perfect type of player for the 25th man on the roster.

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on Sep 27, 2008 2:39 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Proven

Teagarden, Max, and Boggs have shown enough… I think all three will be key parts of our team next year.

by tyd3311 on Sep 27, 2008 11:58 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

With your track record,

prolly all three will be traded…

;)

"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2

by Rodney on Sep 27, 2008 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

What has Max proven?

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on Sep 27, 2008 2:39 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

that he is among the handful of minor league players

that could lay claim to “best hitter in the minors”?

"So he tore it up in AA. Yippee. ...Max Ramirez be damned." - bigsteve

by tricer on Sep 27, 2008 2:46 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'll wait until he does it in AAA before saying that

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on Sep 27, 2008 3:50 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

considering alot of prospects dont even go to AAA

I don’t think he needs to prove anything more hitting wise.

by tyd3311 on Sep 27, 2008 3:55 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

We don't know

how much work Max was getting in before games. I think it is quite possible he was getting “coached up” by Walbeck, and the team saw that time as more productive than him playing at OKC.

Also, Laird is being showcased, especially after his injury. Don’t worry, he will soon be off to another destination.

"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2

by Rodney on Sep 27, 2008 12:02 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Well...

Even then, you’ve got three catchers. Laird getting dealt still leaves you with a logjam.

by Adam J. Morris on Sep 27, 2008 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

True.

But, I didn’t think this post had anything to do with the “logjam”.

"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2

by Rodney on Sep 27, 2008 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

OKC

the odd man out goes down to AAA and plays everyday. Easy solution

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on Sep 27, 2008 2:40 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I have no problem at all

in having 3 good young catchers next year (one in AAA); you don’t have to trade 2…

by Goyogringo on Sep 27, 2008 4:17 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

none of that will happen.

"Popularity is fleeting. Principles are forever."
"Maybe congress should take more vacations, whenever these people leave town, things just seem to get better..." - Jay Leno

by Longhorn on Sep 27, 2008 12:24 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

What's ironic

In a way. Max is the star of the “Rangers are tough” promotional video on TV.

"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang (1844-1912)

by Ed Coffin on Sep 27, 2008 12:26 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

If Milton doesn’t come back, you probably are looking at a semi-platoon with Cat DHing against righties and Travis Metcalf playing third base against lefties, with Davis playing third base against righties and some 1B or DH against lefties.

There is no way we go into the season with that as our plan.

by tyd3311 on Sep 27, 2008 12:28 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

+1

I see Davis at 3rd, Blalock at 1st, and Max/Bradley DHing w/ the other one gone…

"You can't reason with your heart; it has its own laws, and thumps about things which the intellect scorns." - from A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court, by Mark Twain

by dstar442005 on Sep 27, 2008 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I see...

Blalock being traded to the Giants and Davis at 1st, with Metcalf, Young, or maybe someone like Crede(If healthy) playing 3rd… because I do think improving our defense will be a priority going into next season… Davis at 3rd won’t allow that to happen.

by tyd3311 on Sep 27, 2008 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Can't trade Blalock

without picking up his option, and his option makes him untradeable.

"Oh well, McCain is pretty communist anyway,... we can be 70% communist with McCain,"-Sharky

by DJCahill on Sep 27, 2008 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

$6 million for one year

untradeable for an offensively starved team such as the Giants? Surely that wouldn’t be a terrible gamble.

by chase182 on Sep 27, 2008 2:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

A team like the Giants

would be the worst solution for Blalock. He needs a team where he can take days off as the DH and minimize the injury risk.

by venturafearsnolan on Sep 27, 2008 10:05 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think so..

Playing 1st base, he should be fine.

by tyd3311 on Sep 28, 2008 10:33 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

September

1142 OPS, 8 HRs (87 ABs)

Some team in the league will pay $6.2m for more of that from a 28-year-old.

Go Strangers.

by hightowersmith on Sep 27, 2008 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

His production has been good this month...

But I think the injury question makes him fall a lot in people’s eyes.

I COULD see him taking a deal like Milton’s, a 1 year, $5M or so type of thing… but don’t see him being offered more than that, late season surge or not.

by venturafearsnolan on Sep 27, 2008 10:05 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

If thats what he would get on the open market

Then we have to pick up his option since its only for 6 million.

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on Sep 27, 2008 10:17 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I still think the plan of action should be...

You buy him out and see if he’s willing to come in under a less risky deal.

Not that 6 mil in MLB terms is necessarily a huge risk, but you don’t overpay for the sake of overpaying.

by venturafearsnolan on Sep 27, 2008 10:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Why buy him out

if you are guaranteed to keep him for basically what he would get on the open market. Buying him out would bring in alot of teams into the bidding process. That would only increase his price.

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on Sep 27, 2008 11:25 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I haven't read all the comments yet

But it is my view that Ron Washington absolutely doesn’t play young players unless JD forces him too, or he doesn’t have any other options.

"So he tore it up in AA. Yippee. ...Max Ramirez be damned." - bigsteve

by tricer on Sep 27, 2008 1:07 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

same problem buck had

"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it." - Mitch Hedberg

by rentz on Sep 27, 2008 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

buck didn't play them even when JD basically told him too

Tricer could be right, but at least Wash does play the young guys at one point.

By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
-The Outlaw

by Gdawg on Sep 27, 2008 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah I think so

with wash using the tired " that we have to win every game" logic, which means, inexplicably, that we can’t do that with young talented players. It has been disappointing to watch…

by Goyogringo on Sep 27, 2008 4:20 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think

it has more to do with Milton’s chase for the Batting Title than a lack of trust in Mad Max.

by FirebatM3 on Sep 27, 2008 2:14 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

or...

more of Washington’s awesome managing…

"For those booing me. Take that, beeep." - Ramon Vazquez

by 8legs2fangs on Sep 27, 2008 2:31 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

or just that they want Bradley to get the batting title

because it’s a bit more likely than Washington being retarded.

by FirebatM3 on Sep 27, 2008 2:41 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

curious about everyone's opinion

Fast forward to this time next year and say that Kevin Millwood has a 5.25 ERA and 175 ip, and his turn in the rotation is up on the last day of the season.

Do you give him the ball and let him get his 180 ip, so that the option in his contract vests? Or do you pass him up and let him go?

"So he tore it up in AA. Yippee. ...Max Ramirez be damned." - bigsteve

by tricer on Sep 27, 2008 2:51 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Lots of things to consider

Whats our record
How have our young players developed
What does 2010 look like

Just based on your question I would say no. But I can see a scenario where the Rangers would want to keep Millwood and $12 million is not a big price to pay for a veteran starting pitcher.

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on Sep 27, 2008 3:53 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

oops, meant to include the team's record

is within a couple games of where we are this year, which is about what I’d say is realistic.

"So he tore it up in AA. Yippee. ...Max Ramirez be damned." - bigsteve

by tricer on Sep 27, 2008 5:42 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

In that case

You sit him and start one of your younger players.

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on Sep 27, 2008 5:45 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Board Game...

I can’t see him coming back next year now. Given his recent rant I just can’t see JD offering him a long term deal given his injury history and the number of games he has missed this year.

I think that these last few weeks has convinced JD to pick up Hank’s option.

So my guess heading into next year is that Hank is the DH, CD moves back to first, MY moves to 3rd (ok that’s wishful thinking), and Cat is traded with the Rangers eating some of his salary. OMFT is also dealt, TT and Salty are the catchers and Max is catching everyday at OKC.

"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates

by slc ranger on Sep 27, 2008 3:00 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

who plays SS

Andrus?

something like AJM’s proposed trade for Hardy?

1 year stopgap?

"So he tore it up in AA. Yippee. ...Max Ramirez be damned." - bigsteve

by tricer on Sep 27, 2008 3:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'd go with a...

defensive stop gap at SS.

If I’m giving up a package like AJM suggests for Hardy I want pitching in return. You are giving up some of that talent because of the offensive player Hardy is as well as his defense. The Rangers don’t need that offense and can sign sign a defensive guy on the market without giving up tha talent in the minors. Of course I also don’t think MY will move to 3rd next year, I think it will be in ‘10 at the earliest when Andrus is ready. So it’s kind of a moot point anyway.

"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates

by slc ranger on Sep 27, 2008 3:11 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Young

He won’t be moved for a stopgap.

Hardy would displace him, Elvis, some longer-term fix. Not a defensive specialist, though.

Go Strangers.

by hightowersmith on Sep 27, 2008 4:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You don't give him a choice...

He’s already got his big contract. Next thing should be that if he wants to win he needs to be a team player, something he has always been anyway. I don’t believe the Rangers would move him for a stop gap, but if approached about it and explained the right way I think he may be ok with it.

"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates

by slc ranger on Sep 27, 2008 11:54 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Bradley will be offered arb and

Hank’s option will be picked up, IMO.

Where it could get sticky is if Milty ends up here on a 1 year deal. Then Hank could be traded, and Bradley DH…or Bradley could be part OF/part DH with Hank part DH/1B…but then where do you put Cruz, or Davis?

Very interesting, to me.

"...my balls are really like a veiny flesh color" blueballlefty on Jun 4, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2

by Rodney on Sep 27, 2008 3:17 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I bet

Milton will want to sign as an outfielder, not DH.

by tyd3311 on Sep 27, 2008 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Milton won't sign a one year deal and he'll get more years than that for sure

Milton was a good defensive outfielder before his knee injury and should be again next year with his knee 100% so why would that be a problem. In addition Wash has stated as much, if he comes back it will be as an OF.

by Goyogringo on Sep 27, 2008 4:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

He will never be 100 percent if he has to play the outfield

He can barely run to first base without hurting himself. If he has to play the outfield, he will be missing 7-10 games a month with minor injuries.

by uthornfan on Sep 27, 2008 5:49 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You realize he is one year removed from a major knee injury right?

And that year wasn’t spent doing rehab and sitting around. He was playing after 6 months. Those leg injuries are a result of compensation for that knee. If he has a full offseason to continue to rehab and recover I don’t expect him to have the same type of injuries as he has had this year. Thats not to say he won’t get injured just these nagging leg injuries shouldn’t be an issue

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on Sep 27, 2008 5:58 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yep

and I also realize that if it isn’t his leg that is injured, it will be something else. This year was only the second time in his career that he has played over 101 games. He is just one of those players that never stays healthy.

by uthornfan on Sep 27, 2008 11:18 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Like I said I don't expect him to go injury free

But I do think it is encouraging that in a year when he theoretically shouldn’t have even been playing until June or July he played and played at a very high level. Any kind of contract you would give him would have to have plate appearance incentives but I would like to have Milton back, even if it is with the knowledge that he will probably only play about 100-120 games a year.

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on Sep 27, 2008 11:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Problem is...

most of the games he has missed this year were for different injuries and had nothing to do with his knee.

"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates

by slc ranger on Sep 27, 2008 11:55 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I know

But thats from compensating for his knee. Either he is too worried about his knee and neglects other parts of his leg during stretching or lifting or what but compensation injuries are very common. Especially when you come back early from an injury the way Milton did.

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on Sep 28, 2008 12:53 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think it's...

from overcomensating for his knee at all. Look at every season he has played in, even before his knee injury he has always mised numerous games due to injury.

This is only the 3rd season in 8 years that he has played in at leat 100 games. Plus he has only reached 140 games once in his career. That has nothing do to with him overcompensating for anything or not stretching right. The guy just can’t stay on the field.

"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates

by slc ranger on Sep 28, 2008 10:38 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Nor do I...

if they do it every year.

So do you sign Board Game to a long term deal then if you’re GM?

"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates

by slc ranger on Sep 30, 2008 12:32 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Not thrilled, but...

…how can you get mad at the organization for not pushing MaxRam when you consider how many other prospects have been on an accelerated track this year? Granted, some of that was due to injury, but not all of it was.

I’m not sure if there is a message here or not from the Rangers. For example, they like him so they are not going to show him off too much and want to develop him safely. Or, they don’t like him and they’re going to trade him in the offseason so why waste at bats? Who knows…

by GhettoBear04 on Sep 27, 2008 4:47 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I'm so glad that

Washington was gracious enough to give Ramirez one at bat in a blowout in the last game of the year.

by Brett Perryman on Sep 28, 2008 5:49 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

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