Lone Star Ball: An SB Nation Community

Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Around SBN: Can Tebow Say No To Anything?

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

Display:

Selfish prima donna

What Jordan doesn’t realize, or care about, is that the $3 million probably provides a lot of scholarships for his teammates and other students at the school. Obviously, he doesn’t need the scholarship so why should he care.

Foolish consistency is the hobgobblin of little minds - Emerson

by RangerEddie on Oct 22, 2009 7:03 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Is he any good?

Not that it matters…just wondering.

"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz

by Ryin A on Oct 22, 2009 7:03 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Is he any good?

He’s attending UCF

|Space for Rent|

by RangerMad on Oct 22, 2009 9:33 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Are they any good?

Some of us don’t pay attention to baseketball.. or crappy college sportS.

Plus they’d put him on the team just cause of who he is anyways.

by Mike E on Oct 22, 2009 11:25 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Not really

They are a 2nd, maybe 3rd tier school.

|Space for Rent|

by RangerMad on Oct 22, 2009 11:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

ok, thanks.

"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz

by Ryin A on Oct 23, 2009 9:44 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't follow basketball, especially college basketball.

"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz

by Ryin A on Oct 23, 2009 9:43 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

What did you expect?

If you called MJ daddy, you’d probably be a prima donna too.

"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates

by slc ranger on Oct 22, 2009 7:05 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

MJ

Seems to be a colossal prick himself, so that probably doesn’t help.

by brettgardner on Oct 22, 2009 7:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yep. Colossal prick might be putting it lightly.

I think Luke French has a lot of potential. TORP potential.-Dstar

by sprite on Oct 22, 2009 7:09 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

But man, he sure could hit a baseball.

Scott Feldman – "The greatest Hawaiian-born Jewish baseball player to ever set foot on the mound."

by Section 339 on Oct 22, 2009 11:00 PM CDT up reply actions   2 recs

I'm not aware of any anecdotes about his dickishness

Care to share one?

Neftali Feliz says sit your 5 dollar ass down before he makes change...

Hi, Keith. Is this the year Edinson Volquez finally wins RoY?

by Brian Thomas on Oct 23, 2009 9:45 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well

See his HoF speech.

by brettgardner on Oct 23, 2009 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

are you serious?

"I just want to comment on how it’s become like a common thing in the [MLB] for guys to fall in love with [the Rangers’s] sloppy seconds." (thanks cstorm)

by ab03 on Oct 23, 2009 4:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yes

Never kept up with the dude.

All I know about him off court/diamond is that he is a big gambler, got soaked by his mooch wife in a divorce, and was really close w/ his dad.

What’s he done?

Neftali Feliz says sit your 5 dollar ass down before he makes change...

Hi, Keith. Is this the year Edinson Volquez finally wins RoY?

by Brian Thomas on Oct 23, 2009 6:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

So are you gonna gimme one or two?

I’m not taking a skeptical position here. I’m just ignorant on the subject.

Four of you say it’s a slam dunk (nyuck nyuck), but nobody has anything other than his HOF speech.

Neftali Feliz says sit your 5 dollar ass down before he makes change...

Hi, Keith. Is this the year Edinson Volquez finally wins RoY?

by Brian Thomas on Oct 23, 2009 9:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

...
Worst of all, he flew his old high school teammate, Leroy Smith, to Springfield for the induction. Remember, Smith was the upperclassman his coach, Pop Herring, kept on varsity over him as a high school sophomore. He waggled to the old coach, "I wanted to make sure you understood: You made a mistake, dude."

by tyd3311 on Oct 23, 2009 9:27 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

That's from the speech

Anything else?

Neftali Feliz says sit your 5 dollar ass down before he makes change...

Hi, Keith. Is this the year Edinson Volquez finally wins RoY?

by Brian Thomas on Oct 24, 2009 10:41 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You're gonna hate this
Michael Jordan, whos worth about $400 Million, often visits hot spots in Vegas but still doesn’t tip that well.

From TMZ:

    Sources tell us MJ frequently visits a very upscale Vegas hotspot and gets comped more often than not. But even with the free dranks, MJ isn’t opening up his wallet. Nike must not pay what it used to!

by tyd3311 on Oct 24, 2009 11:07 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm not a big fan at all

In fact, I bet on him 4 or 5 times and lost every fucking one, oddly enough.

Just wanted to hear some examples.

Neftali Feliz says sit your 5 dollar ass down before he makes change...

Hi, Keith. Is this the year Edinson Volquez finally wins RoY?

by Brian Thomas on Oct 25, 2009 7:40 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Stories

Of his competitive nature manifesting itself in extremely trivial matters are pretty prevalent.

by brettgardner on Oct 24, 2009 12:08 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

That was a good one, thanks

Neftali Feliz says sit your 5 dollar ass down before he makes change...

Hi, Keith. Is this the year Edinson Volquez finally wins RoY?

by Brian Thomas on Oct 25, 2009 7:38 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

In other news

Peppered jerky is the best kind.

by brettgardner on Oct 22, 2009 7:06 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Jerky in general...

you can’t go wrong.

"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin

by benmor78 on Oct 22, 2009 7:39 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm just now learning the virtues of a good beef jerky.

To think, 3 decades on this earth and I’m only now figuring that out…

Go Rice Owls!

by JBImaknee on Oct 22, 2009 7:59 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm about to make it my business

My wife and I are starting a jerky company, the only sellers of the product in the Argentine market.

by venturafearsnolan on Oct 22, 2009 8:46 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

About as sure as sure can be.

In the countryside they have Charqui, but it’s more likely to be horse meat than anything else.

They produce a shit ton of it, about a million pounds a month, it just all gets shipped to the US.

by venturafearsnolan on Oct 22, 2009 8:54 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ok

I thought I’d seen made in Argentina on some kind of Jerky before

by MikeEl on Oct 22, 2009 8:59 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

While this doesn't apply to Jordan's kid

the University’s abuse of its college athletes by severely restricting their sources of possible income, while making loads of money off of them is more than a little hypocritical.

by MikeEl on Oct 22, 2009 7:43 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

It isn't the university

It is the NCAA that severely restricts the kids’ sources of income.

If it were up to the schools, we’d be back to where we were in the 1980s, when schools had wealthy donors giving these kids huge amounts of money.

by Adam J. Morris on Oct 22, 2009 7:48 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Correct

Universities are, in this respect, a lot like heavily-regulated industries who seek out regulatory intervention when it suits their bottom line.

by JDT217 on Oct 22, 2009 9:50 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

That's not true in the slightest.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

Beware 2011: The Fortypocalypse is Nigh...

by thedirkatron on Oct 23, 2009 9:01 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

heh
when schools had wealthy donors giving these kids huge amounts of money

yeah, that definitely does not happen now…

usa

by Longhorn on Oct 23, 2009 8:12 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Certainly it still happens.

But it appears to be happening a lot less, and when it does it doesn’t seem to be as ridiculous and overt.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

Beware 2011: The Fortypocalypse is Nigh...

by thedirkatron on Oct 23, 2009 9:02 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Not really.

We generally treat differently-situated people differently. Students and Administrators are not in the same position. And it’s not even the universities—it’s the NCAA.

And I don’t understand why people feel students are entitled to income.

by brettgardner on Oct 22, 2009 7:51 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't have strong feelings about it, but I can certainly see the argument

When you have a group of people that generate tons of revenue and are only reimbursed with room and board, isn’t that kinda like slavery?

"You can probably stick a fork in the Rangers' playoff chances for 2009." - AJM on 7/26 with the team 4.5 games out

by tricer on Oct 22, 2009 8:07 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Room, board, tuition, books

Somewhere like Stanford, that’s $50K per year. Somewhere like UT, $15K per year.

by Adam J. Morris on Oct 22, 2009 8:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

not every athlete gets a scholarship

but everyone is faced with the same restrictions.

by MikeEl on Oct 22, 2009 8:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't see anyone forcing those kids to play sports

you walk onto a team, you can walk off…

Go Rice Owls!

by JBImaknee on Oct 22, 2009 8:31 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Exactly, they are replaceable

they have no effect on revenue

by tyd3311 on Oct 22, 2009 8:32 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

LOL. Wow, no it's not like slavery at all, even a little.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

Beware 2011: The Fortypocalypse is Nigh...

by thedirkatron on Oct 23, 2009 9:03 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

thanks for your insight

"You can probably stick a fork in the Rangers' playoff chances for 2009." - AJM on 7/26 with the team 4.5 games out

by tricer on Oct 23, 2009 9:08 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I mean... what do you want me to say?
Slavery is a form of forced labor in which people are considered to be the property of others. Slaves can be held against their will from the time of their capture, purchase or birth, and deprived of the right to leave, to refuse to work, or to receive compensation (such as wages).

I guess the last part sounds like the conditions the NCAA sets for these kids, but that’s a really fucking loose interpretation of slavery if you’re saying that simply not receiving wages makes something tantamount to slavery.

I don’t really know what else to say here.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

Beware 2011: The Fortypocalypse is Nigh...

by thedirkatron on Oct 23, 2009 9:18 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't feel student athletes are entitled to income

But if I did, it would be because they make the university a crap load of money. Same as the argument regarding salary caps in sports. Why should the owners make all the money when people are paying to see the athletes not the owners?

It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone. You count on it, rely on it to buffer the passage of time, to keep the memory of sunshine and high skies alive, and then just when the days are all twilight, when you need it most, it stops.

by WyoRanger on Oct 22, 2009 8:08 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

well

I think the real question is where does that money go?

How much “profit” does UT’s football program bring in? I don’t have any idea, but I’d have to guess that it is in the 10’s of millions a year. But what does that go to? It funds a huge athletic department bureaucracy that supports not only football but tons of other non-revenue sports. It funds tons of scholarships given to kids playing sports no one cares about. Generally speaking, I think athletic scholarships are great so long as they are actually held to academic standards (you know, go to class…). By flipping on college football, we’re subsidizing poor kids’ education all over the place.

Go Rice Owls!

by JBImaknee on Oct 22, 2009 8:20 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

True - "it funds tons of scholarships goven to kids playing sports no on cares about"

But is it particularly fair that football players are subsidizing swimmers? I didn’t play any sports well – why should someone that runs/swims fast get a free ride? I’m not saying “what’s in it for me” but… “what’s in it for me?”

Like I said orginally, I really don’t care. Yes, college athletes sort of get a screwing but they also get a free education. There’s no perfect system.

It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone. You count on it, rely on it to buffer the passage of time, to keep the memory of sunshine and high skies alive, and then just when the days are all twilight, when you need it most, it stops.

by WyoRanger on Oct 22, 2009 8:55 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Because

It benefits both the school and society in general to have those students on campus and receiving an education.

by chrisjanik on Oct 22, 2009 11:22 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions   0 recs

Likewise

it benefits the school to have a top tier athletic program to get them national attention.

If I walk into a generic company and say “I went to Rice,” half the people (or more) outside of Texas would have no idea where or what it was, much less it’s academic reputation. Whereas, if I were to say “I went to Ohio State,” everyone knows about them. Yes, you could argue that it is a shame that people associate sports with UT, Michigan, and UCLA more than they do academics (all are very well regarded academic institutions), but the bottom line is, those football and basketball players give the schools notoriety that purely academic places (outside the Ivy’s) don’t have.

Schools give good students scholarships to increase their academic reputation. Schools give good athletes scholarships to increase their name recognition at a national level. They get paid what schools are able to pay pay – scholarships – and it is silly to say they should get paid more (when anyone in academia can tell you that no one, save deans and presidents, gets paid enough at universities)

Go Rice Owls!

by JBImaknee on Oct 23, 2009 12:29 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I have audited a local big schools athletics and football makes a ton of money

But you have to look at the university’s athletics as a whole. Just about every other sport, with the exception of some schools mens basketball programs, loose a ton of money. The scholarships given to football players are the same scholarships that are given to Golf, Tennis, and track athletes, whos sport brings in little to no money. Cant really just look at it on a single sport basis for they all function together and without football, there is no way other sports would survive.

Elvis has "shook up" Arlington!!

by thad728 on Oct 23, 2009 9:22 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well

“And I don’t understand why people feel students are entitled to income.”

I imagine it is because they generate substantial income for the University.

by Agreen07 on Oct 23, 2009 3:23 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

And because

folks have conspired to keep, in the case of basketball, High School kids from going directly to the NBA. I personally wouldn’t mind so much if the Lebron’s and the Kobe’s of the world could still bypass College and had the option of making themselves eligible for the draft.

I have no problem with College baseball players and used to have no problem with basketball players not getting paid. They have/had an option to avoid college.

"I don't condone steroids or any other type of growth hormones or anything else, but I could care less, and, for the most part, I don't think the fans give a (bleep). The people that care about it are the people that probably don't like baseball," - Jim Leyland

by DJCahill on Oct 23, 2009 6:14 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Here's the thing

the NBA and NFL shut out kids coming out of high school (baseball’s system is more balanced; players have a real choice, potentially 4-5 tough years of minor league, or 3 years of paid college + 2-3 years of minor leauge). They aren’t saying that these kids have to go to college, just that they have to be 2 or 3 years out of high school (I can’t remember the exact NFL rule).

So… if these kids were being exploited by the colleges; they just want to play ball and all they’re getting is this meager degree – why aren’t there “minor leagues” popping up that pay these players more than colleges and still develop them to being NBA or NFL caliber? From what the “pay the college kids” crowd tells us, these leagues would make TONS of money, since they have all the brightest stars and wouldn’t have to subsidize other boring sports. And they could pay the kids too. Colleges could go back to teaching, and everyone would be happy (except the college golf teams)

Of course this wouldn’t work. Colleges absorb much of the unpredictability in athletes that baseball minor leagues see. Maybe the top 10 high school football players and basketball players (just like baseball players) are highly predictable, and you could “pay them” up front. But the vast majority of athletes out of high school, in any sport, are unknown. By paying them all equally with scholarships, colleges get them all into the system and allow the cream to rise to the top.

Go Rice Owls!

by JBImaknee on Oct 23, 2009 9:43 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

All students generate income for their schools.

College isn’t a employment opportunity for students. Students pay (or get scholarships) for the opportunity to go there and participate in whatever they want.

And in any case, I would imagine that it’s pretty rare for there to be many individuals who generate substantial income. Sure, people loved watching OU games to see Adrian Peterson, but is Iowa State really pulling in fans and TV ratings because of any one player? I think for the most part it’s a program that generates substantial income.

by brettgardner on Oct 23, 2009 8:29 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well

isnt the program good because of the players? I agree maybe not one player but several good players in one year or recruited throughout the yrs.

"More than likely JW never played sports above the youth level. It amazes me that he seems to have no concept on the common reactions of an adult athlete or their normal interactions between each other." - laxonto

by Michael Cave on Oct 23, 2009 9:36 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

This doesn't make him a spoiled prima donna at all...

What a moronic statement. The Air Jordan’s have great family value to him… I suppose you (AJM) don’t have anything like that in your life and is why you can’t understand.. apparently.

by Mike E on Oct 22, 2009 11:27 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Wait, huh?

Are you being sarcastic?

If not… they’re fucking shoes broseph.

by cmkelly29 on Oct 22, 2009 11:55 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

exactly

they are shoes. let the kid wear his daddy’s shoes. i’m sure daddy has given the school money to let his kid play, i’m sure daddy will give the school 10’s of thousands more. maybe air jordan will sponsor the school…

" This is the inning that propels us to the playoffs. Mark it down."
- Rohn Warshington on Jul 27, 2009 9:19 PM EDT
5th inning against the Tigers

by gossamer on Oct 23, 2009 12:09 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

absolutely!!!!!!

If my family owned/represented a company that made a product I could use, I would use it no matter what!!

UCF can go fuck themselves if they don’t understand this.

Adam…..you have lost it man.

Wash is an idiot!!

by bspate on Oct 23, 2009 8:30 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think you have all of the facts...

before Jordan’s son committed he said he wanted to wear Jordan shoes regardless of the school contract. The school said that was okay and now Jordan’s son plays for the team. Is it somewhat silly? Yes. But he asked for it and the school agreed. If anything the school should have checked with Adidas first so I’m going to go ahead and blame the school for this one…until someone tells me the facts I’ve gathered are wrong.

by Agreen07 on Oct 23, 2009 3:21 AM CDT reply actions   1 recs

interesting

I can definitely see wanting to wear your famous fathers famous shoe line. Why not? Sucks that the school didn’t check it out.

Though if it comes directly down to wear the other shoes or cost your university millions of dollars, I think you’ve got to go ahead and switch.

Weird scenario.

the preceding post was a great success.

by DSheppard on Oct 23, 2009 7:26 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

JAX

I’d be so happy if I were a fan. Now just need a better QB and you’re set. Too bad, though, cause I think Del Rio is going to lose his job because of the piss-poor run defense.

by brettgardner on Oct 23, 2009 1:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, Del Rio is a goner

Garrard can be really good sometimes, but then sometimes he sucks ass. Sims-Walker seems to be the key for him being serviceable.

by tyd3311 on Oct 23, 2009 1:59 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

On "student-athletes" and the NCAA (long)

I thought I would write to disabuse some of you of several common fallacies regarding the status of the “student-athlete” at major colleges and universities. For purposes of this argument, I limit the scope of “student-athlete” to that subset of “grant-in-aid” athletes who play one of the big two sports—football and basketball—at the D1 level.

The idea of the "student-athlete" is a pernicious fiction propagated by the NCAA and its member institutions so that they, unlike any other association of institutions or businesses in this country, can employ one type of labor without paying a competitive market wage for it. Collegiate athletics is a 60 billion dollar industry. The NCAA itself is funded principally through the revenues generated by the sports activities of its member institutions. Coaches are paid lavish salaries. Media corporations generate huge revenues from televising collegiate sporting events. Corporate sponsors (such as the shoe companies at issue in the original story) gain unparalleled exposure for their products and services.

The only actors in this bountiful enterprise the NCAA has constructed who do not receive the full financial fruits of their labor are the "student-athletes" themselves. Instead, what little (and arbitrarily devised) compensation these "student-athletes" do receive must be spent at the "company store"—the member institutions themselves. That is, these de facto employees (indeed, the most valuable employees the institutions employ) must spend their limited "wages" on books, tuition, and other institutionally-related expenses.

Student athletes are employees of the member institutions for whom they toil. Student athletes meet both components of the two-part test for employees in the university setting set forth in the NLRA. The common-law component of the NLRA test, for example, looks to the "right of control" the putative employer exercises over the putative employee (as distinguished from an independent contractor). Under this test, an employee is defined by the degree of control the putative employer exercises over the end result of the employee’s labor and the manner of achieving it. In plain terms, whether a student-athlete is, in fact, an employee-athlete, depends in large part on the amount of control that athlete’s coaches, advisors, professors, etc. exercise over the end results of his labor (i.e. athletic performance) and the means of achieving it (i.e. the rules governing the athlete’s attendance at practice, class, study halls, and the like).

The statutory test for the status of putative employee-students in the university setting is a bit more complicated. Full Disclosure: I participated in the drafting of an amicus brief in support of non-medical NYU graduate students seeking to establish employee status under the NLRA (and therefore obtain all of the attendant rights and protections conferred by that Act). The current rule is this: when a student who works for his university performs services that are not primarily educational or academic and his relationship to the university with respect to those services is an economic one, then the student may be an employee under the Act, provided that he also meets the common-law test for the term (as set forth above).

The truth is that student-athletes in the two major sports at the D1 level obviously meet the common-law and statutory tests for employees in the university setting, as established by the NLRB. They perform services for the benefit of their universities under agreements setting forth their responsibilities and "grant-in-aid" compensation; are economically dependent upon their universities; and are subject to the omnivorous control of their daily activities by their universities’ athletic departments and coaches. Moreover, the services these "student-athletes" perform are not primarily educational or academic. These folks are "students" in name only. The onerous time commitment imposed upon them by athletic departments and coaches clearly demonstrates that the primary role of the "student-athlete" in the big two sports at D1 colleges and universities is to play basketball and football, not study for their degrees.

by JDT217 on Oct 23, 2009 10:27 AM CDT reply actions   1 recs

I think your problem

is that the NCAA has a monopoly – if you want to play football or basketball, you have one choice: go to an NCAA school. Therefore, the kids have to agree to their conditions or not pursue that career path.

I think graduate school is a poor example, because even though those students don’t get paid much, they are receiving mixed compensation: both salary/stipends and an education/degree (which typically represents future income potential) – the lines are blurred where education ends and work begins. Also If you don’t like the stipend at NYU, you can apply to another school that may pay more. Now, odds are you can’t find a better stipend option out there, but those policies are set through competitive means (and in biology, often with a pay floor due to NIH). Not to mention that people pursuing advanced careers can typically opt to bypass graduate school and still get some related work.

On the other hand, the NCAA (which I’ll agree is evil in many ways), sets all the rules. There isn’t an option for basketball or football players: you have to play college. And if you play college, you really have to play for an NCAA school. While many individual schools get screwed by the NCAA in one way or another, the cost to break away is too huge. It really is a classic monopoly situation and I’m surprised that it continues to be exempt from anti-trust pursuits

Go Rice Owls!

by JBImaknee on Oct 23, 2009 12:33 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i agree to a point

but i dont think it’s a complete monopoly, at least not in the casual sense of the word. Players can participate in a foreign league or possibly some other domestic amateur/semi-pro leagues. There is also the NAIA…which yes is even less attractive to the hot recruit , but the point is HS athletes arent limited strictly to the NCAA upon graduation.

To me, the situation is similar to a master craftsman who takes on an apprentice. The apprentice enters into the arrangement voluntarily, contributing significant labor in exchange for some occupational benefit that will accrue to him over the course of the apprenticeship (experience, training, professional contacts, etc.). Not all professions incorporate this sort of system, but certain unique ones do because it makes sense. And aspiring craftsmen enter into the arrangement precisely because they know it is a near-essential avenue to success in that field.

Now maybe an athlete doesnt absolutely require X number of years of NCAA athletics to succeed as a pro, but it at least seems plausible that it this a unique occupation with a unique path to employment. And participation in college sports clearly represents some form of professional enhancement for these athletes. You’d have to think that both the NFL and NBA would be clamoring to abolish their age-restrictions if there wasnt also some benefit to them to keeping players in college longer. They get to evaluate guys based on better competition, see how they behave on and off the field with a brighter spotlight on them, and they get players who are better-trained and physically prepared for the professional game.

It seems natural for a system like this to be in place to act as a gatekeeper between aspiring pro athletes and their respective pro leagues. It may seem restrictive because it dominates the industry, but it’s not the only path.

by Smoakin in the Boys Room on Oct 23, 2009 1:27 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

well

you need a PhD to get a job as a professor, or a JD to be a lawyer, or an MD for a doctor. But those are academic requirements, and last I checked, there is no real academic standards being set by our professional athletes.

I think the balance college and minor league baseball have is a good thing: players can opt for $$$ now, or they can bet on more $$ later with the guarantee of at least getting a college degree in the process. Obviously, if all high school baseball players went to college, NCAA baseball would be a more marketable sport (notice the hit NCAA basketball took once HS kids started going straight to the NBA), but MLB clubs would lose some of their control of the development process.

Go Rice Owls!

by JBImaknee on Oct 23, 2009 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

and really

If a PhD student did research that leads to a 5 year, $1.25 million NIH grant coming to a lab (and the university will usually get an additional $1 million or so), they would see NOTHING more. Just a happy department that may let them graduate earlier. Or not, since they may be too valuable doing that research to let them leave.

Only difference is that they aren’t covered on SportsCenter, so no one writes editorials for them.

Go Rice Owls!

by JBImaknee on Oct 23, 2009 2:57 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i think that's where the

foreign leagues and things like the USBL/AFL/USFL come into play. Im not sure what the specific restrictions are in those, but obviously they are another avenue by which amateurs can ply their trade prior to joining the top leagues.

by Smoakin in the Boys Room on Oct 23, 2009 3:34 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Maybe I'm missing something

but college athletes aren’t prohibited from being gainfully employed while they’re going to school, only from being paid to play football, basketball, etc while in school. If college athletes were to be be paid for playing, they would no longer be amateurs. And if they’re going to get paid to play, making them professionals, why should they have to graduate or have their ’eligibility" limited?

by twinkilling on Oct 23, 2009 1:29 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm not advocating college athletes get paid

actually, I’m saying that since so many people want premier college football and basketball players to get paid, there should be some outlet where those 19 and 20 year old kids could play professionally that isn’t a college. As it is, these kids really are being forced to take on amateur status based on not having any real other option (by the NFL and NBA, really, who use colleges as a minor league system, and the NCAA, who knows a good thing when they have it).

Go Rice Owls!

by JBImaknee on Oct 23, 2009 2:11 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

There are places to play those sports such as AAU, independent, semi-pro and industrial leagues

But if you have any real talent, you only have to be able to write your own name to be able to walk-on or play JUCO ball. If you have the talent, somebody will find a place for you to play.

by twinkilling on Oct 23, 2009 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

"college athletes aren’t prohibited from being gainfully employed while they’re going to school"

I believe that college athletes are expressly forbidden from being gainfully employed during the school year. They can have jobs in the summer, but not during the academic year.

"You can probably stick a fork in the Rangers' playoff chances for 2009." - AJM on 7/26 with the team 4.5 games out

by tricer on Oct 23, 2009 2:38 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

yes

I was a college athlete in 1988-89, and that was the policy at that time. I seriously doubt that the NCAA has changed the rule to allow scholarship athletes to hold jobs during the school year.

"You can probably stick a fork in the Rangers' playoff chances for 2009." - AJM on 7/26 with the team 4.5 games out

by tricer on Oct 23, 2009 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

OK, I won't

"You can probably stick a fork in the Rangers' playoff chances for 2009." - AJM on 7/26 with the team 4.5 games out

by tricer on Oct 23, 2009 3:15 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Student-Athletes, or at least that subset of student-athletes which I have identified,*are* gainfully employed.

That’s the point of my post. And many of them live at or beneath the poverty line. Their “wages” are captive to the “company”—in this case, the member institution from which they’ve received their grant in aid. The notion that these employee-athletes should be expected to take on a traditional job in order to make ends meet for themselves and their families is patently absurd, especially given the tremendous obligations they already undertake as both “student” and athlete.

As for the responsive posts noting the difference between graduate students and employee athletes, that, too, is my point. While the current NLRB standards for establishing employee status for traditional graduate students are regretfully stringent, even under those standards the typical “student-athlete” playing basketball or football at a D1 university should qualify as an employee, and thus enjoy the rights and protections conferred upon such employees under the NLRA.

by JDT217 on Oct 23, 2009 3:36 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

okay, so you call them employees

what right does that grant them? Scholarship athletes are getting compensated, as Adam points out, that compensation can approach $50,000 a year at private schools. And I don’t believe they are taxed on that…

 I think all athletes get some benefits not available to other students (I remember seeing the dinner buffet spreads available to the athletes, free tutoring, etc).

Go Rice Owls!

by JBImaknee on Oct 23, 2009 4:31 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

oh, so they can go on strike?

Ah, so they can be forced to pay union dues out of their non existent salaries? That’ll solve everything.

Go Rice Owls!

by JBImaknee on Oct 23, 2009 7:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm sorry

but being forced to unionize and pay dues (extra if you want to have a vote in the system), which they did to post-docs and grad students in the UC system (somethign that will never result in any actual benefits to the researchers), is not my idea of worker rights. All it solves is a little more cash for UAW’s administration’s pockets.

Go Rice Owls!

by JBImaknee on Oct 24, 2009 11:30 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Additionally...

The fact that “student-athletes” in the subset I’ve identified may be foreclosed from obtaining competitive market wages for their skills by the rules of the NCAA cartel (rules that are formed in conjunction with the professional sports leagues that would otherwise employ these athletes) is but one more example of the injustice of the current arrangement. It is not, however, a necessary condition to establishing the employee status of the student-athletes at issue.

by JDT217 on Oct 23, 2009 3:40 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

i don't see how this makes him spoiled

it makes michael jordan a douche but not him. he’s probably just doing what his dad is telling him to do.

and the university agreed to letting play in air jordans when he agreed to go there.

"I just want to comment on how it’s become like a common thing in the [MLB] for guys to fall in love with [the Rangers’s] sloppy seconds." (thanks cstorm)

by ab03 on Oct 23, 2009 4:24 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

and lets not forget he is going to bring them in a ton of revenue they wouldnt otherwise have. in the short term it probably wont reach $3 million, but if he does anything to raise their long-term profile it could easily dwarf that.

by Smoakin in the Boys Room on Oct 23, 2009 5:55 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

Welcome to the SB Nation blog about Texas Rangers.
Start posting about the Rangers »

Join SB Nation and dive into communities focused on all your favorite teams.

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recommended FanPosts

Highfidelity_small
Rangers 2009 Top Plays/Highlights Video
Rangers_small
Adam J. Morris Facebook Fan Page
Ochomerun_small
Feliz The Cheeez
Small
If Lone Star Ball were a movie
Small
Highlights from the Mid-Winter Banquet

Recent FanPosts

110307_1802_00__small
People in my Keeper Fantasy League (and those interested in joining)
Small
Jose Vallejo out for the year
Eastwood_small
Rank the Baseball Commissioners
Th_buckykatt_small
Super Bowl Thread
39135485-59af19dbb26654095f910f34176af094_4ae8a81e-scaled_small
Predictions Group
Cj_photo_day_small
LSB Community Prospect Project: Post Season #30
110307_1802_00__small
so...
Rangersp_small
Other Rangers uni numbers that should be retired?
Sbn_ds_small
Best In The West

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >

SPONSORS


Managers

Th_buckykatt_small Adam J. Morris