Thursday a.m. Rangers stuff
by Adam J. Morris on Oct 8, 2009 11:51 AM CDT
117 comments
Evan Grant has a story talking to Goose Gossage about the Nolan Ryan plan for starting pitchers. Gossage endorses Ryan, is scornful of pitch counts, and says that modern pitchers are "babied' too much.
However, as I've mentioned before, Ryan's plan isn't nearly as radical as the media (and Gossage) makes it out to be, and the idea that Ryan toughened up Ranger pitchers and had them throw deeper into games is overblown. Evan writes:
Under the Ryan plan, Rangers pitchers worked harder and lasted longer in games in 2009. Rangers starters pitched 949 innings this season – up from 869 in 2008. It was the most innings pitched by a Rangers rotation since 1998, when the club won its second AL West title.
However, if you allow fewer baserunners, you are going to work deeper into games without throwing more pitches. And that's what happened with the Rangers in 2009. Ranger starters faced 4100 batters in 162 games in 2009. They faced 3942 batters in 162 games in 2008.
So the difference in Ranger starters working deeper into games is that in 2009, they faced an average of 25.3 batters per start, and in 2008, the faced an average of 24.3 batters per start. Ranger starters in 2009 faced one batter per game more than they did the previous year, on average.
The 2009 Rangers also were in the middle of the pack in high pitch count games. The Rangers had 72 starts where a starter went at least 100 pitches, which was 9th in the A.L. -- the league average was 76 such starts.
Moving on...Gil LeBreton has a column about the Rangers' future, and while the whole thing is worth a read, this part jumped out at me, given our recent discussions:
The club still sees Nelson Cruz as capable of starting in right field. His 33 home runs are too much to trade away.
Marlon Byrd? He was fun to watch and had a career season.
But it was all about the money, and the feeling here is that he’ll take somebody else’s free agent dollars and run. Godspeed, Marlon.
And while manager Ron Washington may not have been ready to hand the center-field reins to rookie Julio Borbon this season, the club clearly plans to do so next year.
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Hear hear, on all three points…
"[Font} doesn't turn 19 until the end of May and his heater can already hit 99 on the gun. That's baseball porn." - Jason Parks
by hightowersmith on Oct 8, 2009 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ah, sanity
Very refreshing thing to hear, in all three cases
Look at the comments under Jeff Wilson's blog post on dallasnews.com. What a bunch of rocket scientists.- Keith Law
by Keynes on Oct 8, 2009 12:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good, no reason to bring Byrd back.
Never pay for a career year, let the Cubs pay him 20 million.
I thought it be all warm and shitty, but it just tasted like normal beer. It was still cold.
by RA Dickey on Oct 8, 2009 11:57 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
While I agree on letting Byrd walk
He didn’t have a career year last season. His 2008 was his best season to date with his 07 and 09 being very good years as well. This isn’t like GMJ where he had one great offensive season while here.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
by Gdawg on Oct 8, 2009 12:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, LeBreton's characterization...
of Byrd’s 2009 is a little off. I think 2008 was his most solid year, boosted by his 10.2% walk rate.
I really hope the front office agrees with his assessment. Byrd had three seasons here playing slightly above average baseball in the outfield — we have no reason to go insane and bring him back with the hope that he continues to be that player.
by jwiscarson on Oct 8, 2009 12:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was wondering where the "career year" came from
Byrd’s 3 years here have been pretty consistent. Leave it up to those FWST guys to bend stuff around to fit their cause.
by twinkilling on Oct 8, 2009 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kind of OT
Who is arbitration eligible? CJ, Feldman, who else? I have no idea where to even find that info.
by FuturePants on Oct 8, 2009 11:59 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Scott Lucas' webpage
Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D
by rooster on Oct 8, 2009 12:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
COTS has it, too
Neftali Feliz says sit your 5 dollar ass down before he makes change...
Hi, Keith. Is this the year Edinson Volquez finally wins RoY?
by Brian Thomas on Oct 8, 2009 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's interesting that Gil has a different take on Byrd/Borbon than EG, Durrett and others.
Gil’s take seems to be conforming to the notion that it’s primarily Washington that wants Byrd back and that distrusts Borbon in CF. EG, Durrett and others didn’t really distinguish who was down on Borbon and who wasn’t, though, IIRC, JD did say they had yet to have meetings with their scouting department regarding their opinions of Rangers players.
I’m not sure how I feel about Byrd coming back. I could be supportive. I just keep thinking that if the money was such that the Rangers could only afford Byrd or someone like Dye then I would be more optimistic about the Rangers chances with Dye here rather than Byrd.
Also, if signing Byrd meant the Rangers couldn’t take a chance on Sheets, likewise, I would prefer seeing Sheets in a Rangers uniform.
My feeling is that if they do sign Byrd, they have effectively picked up their DH in that either Cruz or Hamilton or both would slide into the DH role, but that causes a problem for Wash’s wish list of getting a RH bat that mashes LHP.
Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D
by rooster on Oct 8, 2009 12:17 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
By the time I got
done reading Newberg I was almost ready to advocate the resigning of Blalock. Are we sure another hitting coach can’t return him to his former self? If the majority of Blalocks demise is his approach, can’t that be changed?
I guess it was the nostalgia that had me thinking crazy, but what if………?
Didn't anybody tell you how to gracefully disappear in a room
by red shoe ranger on Oct 8, 2009 12:33 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
He has to completely remake himself
We unfortunately aren’t in the place right now to let a player completely rework himself at the MLB level.
What do voluntary mean?
by JKolar on Oct 8, 2009 12:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
I got a little sick to my stomach reading again about what blalock was supposed to be and then what he became.
Im not sure who is to blame for the transformation into what he became, rudy or blalock himself
"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it." - Mitch Hedberg
by rentz on Oct 8, 2009 12:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think its Blalock
I don’t think you would likely have a hitting coach fundamentally change the swing of a successful hitter into something entirely different.
I think Blalock saw Teixeira hitting HRs to left and fell in love with the idea of being a power hitter, rather than being a good hitter with some power. And it ruined him.
What do voluntary mean?
by JKolar on Oct 8, 2009 12:45 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
But isnt it the hitting coaches job to point out the flaw and correct it?
"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it." - Mitch Hedberg
by rentz on Oct 8, 2009 12:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The hitting coach
can’t make a player do something he doesn’t want to do though. And I think Blalock wanted to make himself into a pull power hitter, despite the fact that his swing wasn’t built for that.
What do voluntary mean?
by JKolar on Oct 8, 2009 12:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
classis Rudy defense (and no I'm not saying that you are necessarily a Rudy-homer)
The guy get’s credit for remaking all these spares and helping them have career years but when a legit piece of talent crumbles under his tutelage, it’s simply not his fault.
Be careful....to a hammer, everything looks like a nail.
by Bezekira on Oct 8, 2009 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
In Rudy's defense..
both can be true. When a failing talent (like Vasquez for example) comes to him for help, he can help a receptive player improve. When a failing talent (Blalock comes to mind) doesn’t want to listen, he can’t make them.
The reason I’m out on Rudy is that getting them to listen when they don’t want to is a skill he doesn’t seem to possess.
The Texas Rangers have been synonymous with explosive firepower ever since they emptied 130 rounds into Bonnie Parker and Clyde Barrow in 1934. - Alyssa Milano
by bking on Oct 8, 2009 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Classic Rudy bashing
Its all his fault. It can’t be the players fault. You know the guy who actually is in the box facing the pitcher. Each player wears a earpiece and Rudy tells them when to swing and where to try and hit the ball. Its all his fault.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Oct 8, 2009 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You're right
the Hitting instructor has absolutely no impact. In fact, there is probably no reason to re-sign Rudy, that way the team saves half a million dollars. No real reason to even have a hitting instructor.
"I don't condone steroids or any other type of growth hormones or anything else, but I could care less, and, for the most part, I don't think the fans give a (bleep). The people that care about it are the people that probably don't like baseball," - Jim Leyland
by DJCahill on Oct 8, 2009 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn't say no real reason
And im not advocating bringing Rudy back necessarily. It just gets tiresome readong people spew about its all Rudys fault we sucked ass on offense this season. Like he told guys to go up to the plate and swing at balls in the dirt or at their eyes. Like he told Kins and hank to try and hit HRs every single swing. Rudy may not have been the best at getting through to guys about their approach. But hes done a damn fine job over his career fixing and fine tuning some guys and helping them turn into offensive weapons.
The Major League baseball players swing is a fragile thing. I think you need a hitting instructor so when a guy gets a little out of sync or off rhythm you can help him get it back. And the coach should be preaching better approaches at the plate
But at the end of the day its up to the players. They decide when to swing, how hard to swing, etc. And with only a couple bench players on the roster you can’t just bench everyone who plays like a retard right away.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Oct 8, 2009 2:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not Rudy bashing but there is a certain approach he takes
It’s an aggressive approach in which you commit to swing at any ball you think you can hit versus sitting back and waiting for the pitch you really want. This isn’t something I can prove but it’s just the what I see in MY, DeRo, Matthews, etc. A while back I looked at the Rangers ranking as a team in OBP over the years under Rudy to see if there was some proof to my theory and there wasn’t. The Rangers were all over the place
It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone. You count on it, rely on it to buffer the passage of time, to keep the memory of sunshine and high skies alive, and then just when the days are all twilight, when you need it most, it stops.
by WyoRanger on Oct 8, 2009 2:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hitting is that way
averages are great but do not play out in crunch time.
defense and pitching are usually more consistent and related. IMHO the best achievement of this past season was the solification of our IF defense. MY at 3B was a pleasant suprise, Elvis lived up to the opportunity and then some, Kinsler is like wine defensively (better with age.) Here is hoping that Smoak/Davis are not all bat no glove. Defense helps the pitching so much.
by Bigfan16 on Oct 8, 2009 3:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
?
averages are great but do not play out in crunch time
I’d say in “crunch time” or whatever other time, the probability of a player getting a hit falls right about in line with his batting average.
by FuturePants on Oct 9, 2009 10:00 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What about the averages within the averages?
Matchups, hot streaks, slumps, etc?
by twinkilling on Oct 9, 2009 10:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rudy on Rudy
Rudy himself has said that he doesn’t talk “approach” with the hitters. he is all about fixing the mechanics of the swing, the timing, control, and power through the zone. He doesn’t teach pitch recognition, he doesn’t teach patience, and he doesn’t teach approach or strategy.
the problem is that what this team desparately needs is someone to teach approach, patience, and strategy.
by iblum on Oct 8, 2009 4:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think
that for a player to turn it around, he has to acknowledge what he is doing isn’t working. I’m not sure that happens until he has a new environment.
"I don't condone steroids or any other type of growth hormones or anything else, but I could care less, and, for the most part, I don't think the fans give a (bleep). The people that care about it are the people that probably don't like baseball," - Jim Leyland
by DJCahill on Oct 8, 2009 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think it doesn't happen
till the player believes that he is doing something that isn’t working and becomes willing to change it. Blalock was still swinging at bad ball sand topping into the shift. Until he changes both of those hes going to be what he is, a marginal LH bat off the bench.
What do voluntary mean?
by JKolar on Oct 8, 2009 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yep
a player has to “hit bottom” a lot of times to make a change. I think that’s why NRIs can occasionally be better pickups than low dollar $3-$5 million Free Agents. There is a chance you get the rebound from a player knowing that no one will touch them as a Free Agent with their current approach.
"I don't condone steroids or any other type of growth hormones or anything else, but I could care less, and, for the most part, I don't think the fans give a (bleep). The people that care about it are the people that probably don't like baseball," - Jim Leyland
by DJCahill on Oct 8, 2009 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I honestly wouldn't be too surprised
to see Blalock be at that level right now. He was pretty much putrid over most of the year. His 1st half numbers looked acceptable because of an absurdly high homerun rate.
What do voluntary mean?
by JKolar on Oct 8, 2009 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think he has a stop
as a 3 million FA in him, before he hits rock bottom as an NRI.
"I don't condone steroids or any other type of growth hormones or anything else, but I could care less, and, for the most part, I don't think the fans give a (bleep). The people that care about it are the people that probably don't like baseball," - Jim Leyland
by DJCahill on Oct 8, 2009 1:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe but its close
He has mildly acceptable numbers for this year because his numbers are propped up by that unexpected first half power surge.
What do voluntary mean?
by JKolar on Oct 8, 2009 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bullshit Cahill
He gets 3/30 this offseason, dumbass.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"When you have a weapon on your shoulder like he has, you can be cool." RW on Perez
And the little bastard threw it for a swinging strike three in a 3-2 count. He’s blessed. And ballsy.
by Rodney on Oct 8, 2009 1:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dammit
I keep forgetting.
"I don't condone steroids or any other type of growth hormones or anything else, but I could care less, and, for the most part, I don't think the fans give a (bleep). The people that care about it are the people that probably don't like baseball," - Jim Leyland
by DJCahill on Oct 8, 2009 2:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sober, Rodney?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
by Josey Wales on Oct 8, 2009 2:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why do you have such a hard on for Rodney?
Just curious.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
by Ryin A on Oct 8, 2009 2:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
JW can't get a hard on
He’s that guy that refuses to talk to his doctor about Viagra. JW – you have to admit you have a problem before we at LSB can help you.
It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone. You count on it, rely on it to buffer the passage of time, to keep the memory of sunshine and high skies alive, and then just when the days are all twilight, when you need it most, it stops.
by WyoRanger on Oct 8, 2009 2:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The tit for tat with Rodney goes back a ways.
He sent me a pm at NMLR after he got his widdle baseball feelings hurt and asked me if I wanted to meet him to discuss whatever it was we were arguing about in person.
He really did this (and will own up to it) so I hope you can understand why I have no respect for his intelligence.
On more than one occasion he has come into this place obviously deep into the sauce looking for who knows what (he did a couple of weeks ago in a GDT where he melted down) all because he will occasionally get tossed around in here by me.
From time to time he’ll take the passive aggressive route and throw an elbow at me and he always ends up getting hit twice as hard and looking out his earhole.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
by Josey Wales on Oct 8, 2009 2:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
oh, big deal.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
by Ryin A on Oct 8, 2009 3:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You have to understand....
The internet tough guy schtick REQUIRES the ability to deflect and ridicule any offers to man up regarding your posts. Hence his hardon at being called out by Rodney.
The Texas Rangers have been synonymous with explosive firepower ever since they emptied 130 rounds into Bonnie Parker and Clyde Barrow in 1934. - Alyssa Milano
by bking on Oct 8, 2009 4:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So you think it's wise for a grown man to send a pm to another
man demanding to meet to settle things physically when you’re too stupid to do anything else?
To me, it’s the intellectual equivalent of the white flag.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
by Josey Wales on Oct 8, 2009 4:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The intellectual equivalent of the white flag is when you run and hide from direct questions.
by cstorm15 on Oct 8, 2009 4:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It depends what type of "physical" we're talking about Josey.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
by Ryin A on Oct 8, 2009 4:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Since everyone here knows you're full of shit
I’ll cover this one more time and then never again. I asked if you were going to attend Newberg Night and thought we could discuss our differing opinions there. Not once did I ever imply anything pysical. And this was before you went totally over the edge…what, 2005?
But you just keep on proving you are the largest asshole on planet earth there, Jonie Wails…day, after day, after day…
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"When you have a weapon on your shoulder like he has, you can be cool." RW on Perez
And the little bastard threw it for a swinging strike three in a 3-2 count. He’s blessed. And ballsy.
by Rodney on Oct 8, 2009 5:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, your pm had nothing whatsoever to do
with Newberg Night.
Nothing.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
by Josey Wales on Oct 8, 2009 10:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is ridiculous.
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
by benmor78 on Oct 8, 2009 11:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed.
How would you feel about somebody so overwhelmed in a baseball discussion that they would feel compelled to reach out and want to meet you to discuss further in person?
What a freak!!
Was he going to show up in a Big Dick Hidalgo Ranger jersey and a chip on his shoulder looking to throw down?
LOL!
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
by Josey Wales on Oct 8, 2009 11:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was talking about you.
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
by benmor78 on Oct 8, 2009 11:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just pull out the big ban button
already.
"I don't condone steroids or any other type of growth hormones or anything else, but I could care less, and, for the most part, I don't think the fans give a (bleep). The people that care about it are the people that probably don't like baseball," - Jim Leyland
by DJCahill on Oct 9, 2009 5:45 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
not happening
too much traffic due to the old Josey Wales
Feliz says his greatest thrill was striking out Boston Red Sox DH David Ortiz, one of his heroes. Yet, when he called to tell his parents, his mother had a request: Strike out New York Yankees third baseman Alex Rodriguez, too.
"So when I did that," Feliz says, "I told my mom, 'There you go. There's your present. Don't ask me to strike anyone else out, OK?'
by blalock84 on Oct 9, 2009 7:07 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
yet
the blog is a worse place than it was 2 years ago.
"I don't condone steroids or any other type of growth hormones or anything else, but I could care less, and, for the most part, I don't think the fans give a (bleep). The people that care about it are the people that probably don't like baseball," - Jim Leyland
by DJCahill on Oct 9, 2009 7:18 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
To change Blalock's approach
you need more than a new hitting coach. You need a lobotomy.
by twinkilling on Oct 8, 2009 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Regarding pitch counts vs. innings pitched, Adam...
your comments remind me of something Graham wrote over at Lookout Landing, regarding the relationship between defensive efficiency, K/9, and BB/9.
So, I think what Evan really needs to focus on is K%, BB%, and (at least) percentage of ground balls converted into outs. I think our outfield defense is approximately equivalent between 2008 and 2009, but Kinsler’s emergence as a top defensive 2B, Elvis’s promotion, and Young’s shift to third have really fixed the “problems” our pitching staff had last year. Not that we have the world’s greatest staff yet…
by jwiscarson on Oct 8, 2009 12:46 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
And while manager Ron Washington may not have been ready to hand the center-field reins to rookie Julio Borbon this season, the club clearly plans to do so next year.
That’s the best news I’ve heard in a while.
Be careful....to a hammer, everything looks like a nail.
by Bezekira on Oct 8, 2009 1:09 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I haven't seen or heard anything from Nolan or JD
that clearly confirms that the club plans to hand the CF job to Borbon next year. Is there a link or something else that goes beyond LeBreton saying so?
by twinkilling on Oct 8, 2009 1:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
For awhile now
Gil Lebreton has been the voice of reason in the local media concerning the Rangers and this article only further proves that. Maybe he is a LSB homer disguised under a clever pseudonym.
"Thank God for Feldman." - Ron Washington to Eric Nadel, August 2008
by kentbenfer on Oct 8, 2009 1:11 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
OT - Wow, good stuff over at RoyalsReview
Saw this mentioned in today’s KLAW chat..
http://www.royalsreview.com/2009/10/7/1075135/kansas-citys-dayton-moore-and-trey
"He will not coddle them. Nolan Ryan doesn’t coddle." - Jeff Passan
by Dirk Diggler on Oct 8, 2009 1:11 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I literally cackled at this line
“Dayton Moore’s hit rate on Major League acquisitions is somewhere south of the percentage of Victorian novels that have a sex scene”
Colorful writing and illustrates a point.
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang (1844-1912) also -
"Telephone, n. An invention of the devil which abrogates some of the advantages of making a disagreeable person keep his distance."
~Ambrose Bierce
by Ed Coffin on Oct 8, 2009 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Are you a voracious reader of Victorian novels, Big Ed?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
by Josey Wales on Oct 8, 2009 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Only the Arthur Conan Doyle variety
I’m not well read.
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang (1844-1912) also -
"Telephone, n. An invention of the devil which abrogates some of the advantages of making a disagreeable person keep his distance."
~Ambrose Bierce
by Ed Coffin on Oct 8, 2009 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who did AC Doyle play for?
:)
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
by Josey Wales on Oct 8, 2009 1:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Heh – the no shit Sherlock school of mystery and analog solutions.
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang (1844-1912) also -
"Telephone, n. An invention of the devil which abrogates some of the advantages of making a disagreeable person keep his distance."
~Ambrose Bierce
by Ed Coffin on Oct 8, 2009 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Edith Wharton and Henry James
Doesn’t get much better than those two…
Neftali Feliz says sit your 5 dollar ass down before he makes change...
Hi, Keith. Is this the year Edinson Volquez finally wins RoY?
by Brian Thomas on Oct 8, 2009 3:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ha ha
OK.
Neftali Feliz says sit your 5 dollar ass down before he makes change...
Hi, Keith. Is this the year Edinson Volquez finally wins RoY?
by Brian Thomas on Oct 8, 2009 10:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I feel sorry for KC fans
they’ve had great fans for a long time, but management has really screwed up this team with questionable decision after questionable decision.
After Fuentes blows a save and an Angels loss to the Indians:
"Angels still in first place" - UCI Halo
"Hey you know who would have gotten those 3 outs in the 9th?
Darren O’Day." - FirebatM3
LOL
by hinduplaya on Oct 8, 2009 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If only they had a good manager and a grown up GM...
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"When you have a weapon on your shoulder like he has, you can be cool." RW on Perez
And the little bastard threw it for a swinging strike three in a 3-2 count. He’s blessed. And ballsy.
by Rodney on Oct 8, 2009 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Trey Hillman
when does he get the mega bust label?
honestly, I doubt he affects games that much more than a good manager (especially given how god awful the royals are) but to also be surly to the public when your team just lost 97 games is pretty piss poor form.
Not to mention the implication that the Japanese are better than us. f him
"I just want to comment on how it’s become like a common thing in the [MLB] for guys to fall in love with [the Rangers’s] sloppy seconds." (thanks cstorm)
by ab03 on Oct 8, 2009 4:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's a great manager!
/Josey
"Feldman and Feliz and and pray for…infectious disease?"--TheJeezus on Sep 9, 2009 1:01 PM PDT
by WestTxAg06 on Oct 8, 2009 4:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I said
he did a good job in 2008 (he did)
No need to lie here or misrepresent the facts, counselor. You will have the rest of your life to do that.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
by Josey Wales on Oct 8, 2009 4:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Like you Josey?
I mean really you of all people.
Your 2009 Snow Monkey Ambassador
by Parman on Oct 8, 2009 7:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Misrepresenting facts.
Josey blatantly misrepresented Davis’ batting average in the Davis-Blalock-Josey II thread.
by FuturePants on Oct 9, 2009 10:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That Law chat was gold, as usual
Calls Leyland “Smokey McComatose” and then has these gems:
Matt (LA)
A-Rod in the playoffs so far: 2-4, 1R, 2RBI. Fail or Epic Fail?
Klaw(1:27 PM)
Unless he goes 12-for-10 in this series, it’s Epic Fail.
Joe (Cincy)
I think Joe Torre should play Juan Pierre more. It’s not just the small ball that they miss. It’s the energy that he brings every day and the threat that he brings as far as running the bases and stealing bases.
Klaw (1:30 PM)
Too obvious.
The question where he mentions Royals Review:
Dayton (KC)
Did you say “Process?” I LOVE the Process. Trading young, under-contract, cheap players, for old-contract expiring, expensive players, is how this works. It’s your fault KLaw you don’t understand this.
Klaw (1:36 PM)
Props to royalsreview.com for their post today on this, by the way. Of course, that author will promptly be added to The List.
He’s also not a big fan of his ex-boss, the now deposed Jays GM.
"Feldman and Feliz and and pray for…infectious disease?"--TheJeezus on Sep 9, 2009 1:01 PM PDT
by WestTxAg06 on Oct 8, 2009 4:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Boy, I screwed up the quote system there...
"Feldman and Feliz and and pray for…infectious disease?"--TheJeezus on Sep 9, 2009 1:01 PM PDT
by WestTxAg06 on Oct 8, 2009 4:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
genius
i absolutely love reading stuff about those two clowns. Its insane that they are in charge of such a lucrative operation.
Again, all my pity goes to Royals fans of this generation.
Feliz says his greatest thrill was striking out Boston Red Sox DH David Ortiz, one of his heroes. Yet, when he called to tell his parents, his mother had a request: Strike out New York Yankees third baseman Alex Rodriguez, too.
"So when I did that," Feliz says, "I told my mom, 'There you go. There's your present. Don't ask me to strike anyone else out, OK?'
by blalock84 on Oct 9, 2009 8:11 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Will the new owner please stand up!
I am so sick and tired of Mr. Hicks approach to payroll since his A-Rod debacle. For six years our payroll has been well below the average/median MLB team payroll. I for one bought into, albeit reluctantly, the rebuilding from through draft and trade for youthful talent. We now have a great bunch of talented youth and the GM’s hands are tied in his attempt to build a championship team. Now I am not afraid to bash JD when appropriate and there have been time I wished bad things to that man. But in order for any person to be successful at a goal you have to give him the time, talent and tools that are required. Time, six years of payrolls from $55M to $68M, talent: new manager, President. Tools = money.
IMHO it is time to add payroll appropriately. I am not advocating top 10 payroll (over $100M), but I would sure like to see what JD could do with an $80M budget for next year. It would open up the options both in free agency as well as who you could trade for.
Thannks for letting me spew again about my pet peave.
by Bigfan16 on Oct 8, 2009 2:51 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
We do need to add one or two pieces
but we also need to figure out some way to keep some money around to keep the young guys we have now into the future also.
It really sucks to not be one of the baseball elite who can keep all their young talent indefinitely by spending on them and then go and sign whom ever they wish to because they still have monies around to do it after taking care of their in house players.
What do voluntary mean?
by JKolar on Oct 8, 2009 2:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
completely agree
I believe this market does support a larger payroll than our recent history. Additionally we can not keep all the young players all of the time.
We have seen the initial positive signs of the rebuilding process this year. One could argue we have too many ready for prime time players for the available roster spots in the coming years. But why tie the GM’s hands by limiting what he can do to add the RIGHT piece or two to build upon this success?
by Bigfan16 on Oct 8, 2009 2:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Right now, the payroll level is impacted by the debt service requirements
the Rangers have. Hicks rolled the dice with the ARod and CHOP and lesser signings in the ‘01-’02 timeframe and didn’t get the return he was looking for. As a result, the Rangers are carrying a substantial debt load in comparison to most other teams.
by twinkilling on Oct 8, 2009 4:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This "Hicks spends no money" meme has got to stop.
It is quite simply a wrong claim. Since ARod, Tom Hicks has spent money on Juan Gonzalez, Chan Ho Park, Uggie Urbina, Kenny Rogers, Jeff Nelson, Richard Hidalgo, Kevin Millwood, Eric Gagne, Kenny Lofton, Frank Catalanotto, Jason Jennings, and Milton Bradley as free agents. All for a lot of money. And that isn’t counting many of the 600K bullpen and role player guys who have come through here.
The team has spent aggressively on the draft in the past 5 years.
He has resigned/extended players like Michael Young, Hank Blalock, and Vicente Padilla for a lot of money.
He has made noted efforts to resign Mark Teixeira (huge contract offer), bid on Dice-K, sign Barry Zito and Torii Hunter. There are several others who fall in this category as well.
The problem with the Rangers is not that Tom Hicks has not spent money. He certainly has. The problem is that he spent that money on bad players. That bad spending reduced payroll flexibility, jammed up the roster, and decimated the farm system due to lost draft picks.
Please, stop saying Tom Hicks doesn’t spend money.
Go Rice Owls!
by JBImaknee on Oct 8, 2009 5:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks Tom. :)
It is not how much you spend but how you spend it.
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
Mitch Moreland -Tom Grieve Rangers Minor League Player of the Year
Martin Perez - Nolan Ryan Rangers Minor League Pitcher of the Year
by RangerMad on Oct 8, 2009 5:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Tom Hicks has his faults
not being willing to spend money is not one of them.
Go Rice Owls!
by JBImaknee on Oct 8, 2009 6:02 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i think people base the spending on the payroll
our payroll is closer to the bottom than the top of the league. I think that is what people are talking about. We are pretending to be a small market team when the DFW area is a very large market. I think the fanbase here is TX is surprisingly strong considering how terrible the Rangers have been in their history. 1 playoff victory and yet we love them. It’s a strange world, but maybe it’s the misery that every Ranger fan has known that brings us together. Saying that, there is an opportunity to spend more money. Our ability to grow the farm is great but you have to supplement it with the right FAs or trades to be consistently successful.
A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings.
by NothinG on Oct 8, 2009 5:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
But what are "the right FA's"?
Who would we have signed pre-2009 to make this a better team?
First, if you say Juan Cruz, then you’re wrong and you get an F on this quiz.
But really, most of the FAs being discussed pre-season were pitchers. And guess what – this team didn’t miss the playoffs because of pitching. Giving the strength of the pitching this year, it would be a stretch to say that the marginal benefit of having a CC Sabathia or AJ Burnett on this team would’ve been worth the money and risk.
I’m pretty sure Teixeira wasn’t ever an option, regardless of money. No one seriously wanted Dunn, because everyone was happy with Davis. Burrell was mentioned, but that would have been a disaster. In retrospect, Abreu would have been great, but I don’t think money was ever mentioned as a reason the Rangers were out on him.
Go Rice Owls!
by JBImaknee on Oct 8, 2009 6:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not saying he should have signed a bunch of people
for the sake of signing them, but going forward, in order to be an ongoing success, we must be able to fork over some cash while also developing from within. All I am saying, is that in years to come, we better not be fed this small market team garbage as an excuse to not spend money. If our window is coming, we have to be prepared to spend to address weaknesses.
A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings.
by NothinG on Oct 8, 2009 6:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
well, I agree with that
I guess my point is that I don’t think this club has ever been treated (in the past 15-20 years) like it was a small market club, and I don’t get the paranoia that it is going to be
Go Rice Owls!
by JBImaknee on Oct 8, 2009 7:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
How about?
bobby abreu to play left field. instead of andruw jones.
by iblum on Oct 9, 2009 10:01 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
"No one seriously wanted Dunn, because everyone was happy with Davis."
Really? Who are these people? I want to have a word with them.
by JDT217 on Oct 9, 2009 3:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would have loved Dunn here
i thought he was a steal and that we could have gotten him on the cheap because nobody was signign him. He was the only player over the previous 4 or 5 years to have 40 HRs and 100 RBIs each year. He just missed it this year with 38 HRs.
A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings.
by NothinG on Oct 9, 2009 3:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
IIRC, everyone thought Dunn would be too expensive
I was really surprised when he signed with the Nats for that deal, and I would’ve loved to have him here to DH. Still would, really.
Hank is 7 runs below a zombie replacement at first base. Do you realize how terrible that is? Zombie’s can’t think, they’re slow, and they’re often ejected from the game for eating opposing baserunners’ brains. - Ben quantifies Hank Blalock
by lonestarJon on Oct 9, 2009 7:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Adam didn't want him
and his logic was pretty good.
On Heyman’s list, there are 5 OF/DH types that are lefties, which doesn’t help the Rangers (since, with Hamilton, Davis, and Murphy presumably playing regularly and hitting in the middle part of the lineup, you are already a bit lefty-heavy, even if Blalock is gone).
Of course, he did say
If you could add either Sheets or Burrell, that would be fine, as well. But otherwise? As far as the free agent market goes, I’d pass.
and we know how Burrell and Sheets did this year. Of course, this isn’t anything against Adam, it is against signing free agents just to be spending money.
Go Rice Owls!
by JBImaknee on Oct 9, 2009 7:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The fatal flaw in Adam's analysis
Was assuming that a guy like Murphy should be an everyday fixture in our lineup. Teams with guys like Murphy at a COF spot don’t typically go to the playoffs.
by JDT217 on Oct 9, 2009 7:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The other fatal flaw
was the assumption that Davis wouldn’t shit the bed.
In general though, I’m more upset we didn’t get Abreu than Dunn. I’d much rather get the one year rent a body type than have to sign a multiyear deal. I suspect Dunn’s numbers would also be a lot lower in the AL.
"I don't condone steroids or any other type of growth hormones or anything else, but I could care less, and, for the most part, I don't think the fans give a (bleep). The people that care about it are the people that probably don't like baseball," - Jim Leyland
by DJCahill on Oct 9, 2009 8:49 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Looking at the averages...
It just does not add up. You are correct about all your transactions listed and how Hicks overspent when he purchased the team in the 20th century. The last six years the payroll has been under $68M and well in the lower half of MLB. Attendance, despite the teams performance has been closer to the league’s average. The market is certainly in the top tier and the associated revenues from radio and televison.
Granted the $100M plus payroll of 02 & 03 required a rebuilding process. We are now 6 years into that process and still acting like we Cincinatti or KC.
The past six years have brought in a bunch of young talent and the team is showing signs of competing. Why not loosen up the purse strings to enable the GM to add the best pieces available given where the team is?
And how is our #1 draft pick doing? Oops did not sign him.
This team has potential and a little flexibility on payroll could make the difference. Not only in the FA market which is meh this year but also in the trade market which is where we may have to go to get the right pieces.
by Bigfan16 on Oct 8, 2009 8:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Where are you gonna make that big FA spend though?
If you go out and sign a big name DH type that apparently fits our one huge weakness offensively then you are blocking a young guy (Smoak) which is what we’ve been building toward. Theres not gonna be another Bobby Abreau type deal this winter I don’t believe. Any guy who you get on a one year deal is gonna have warts. Either they don’t have the history of production you need or want or they have huge question marks like injuries.
You aren’t gonna spend alot on bullpen pieces. And if you go out and spend big on a SP then it pushes one of our young guys down which, again, is what we’ve been building toward for the last couple years.
Our payroll isn’t likely to grow much over the next few years unless we start doling out extensions to some of these young kids
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Oct 8, 2009 8:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm guessing
there will be another Abreu deal this winter.
Personally, though, I’d be happy with a Bradley. Much rather see that than seeing this nonsensical betting on all of our players be healthy and productive next year, and we won’t need replacements from the farm that gave us our craptastic 1B we had this year.
"I don't condone steroids or any other type of growth hormones or anything else, but I could care less, and, for the most part, I don't think the fans give a (bleep). The people that care about it are the people that probably don't like baseball," - Jim Leyland
by DJCahill on Oct 8, 2009 8:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Long time Bigsteve...
Personally I don’t see any magic bullets in the FA market this off season.
The right player may have to come via trade. What if his salary is too much even though he would fit in perfectly in the GM opinion and the players we had to give up were acceptable. That option is already off the table due to budget constaints. Financial flexibility does include the ability to spend additional money when the time is right.
The time looks better than the past six years and we have already ruled out adding salary.
Now who would I pursue??? As always a stud starting pitcher. Millwood is here for one more year then he and $12M are gone. Already gone are Padilla, Blalock, Byrd, and a few more and their money. The rotation could be elite in 2010 and handle the departure of Millwood in 2011 even if we had to include some of our young pitchers.
by Bigfan16 on Oct 8, 2009 9:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is the reason.
Now who would I pursue??? As always a stud starting pitcher.
Why I was clamoring for signing Sabathia at the end of last season….. Of course, this was before the whole Hicks royal f-up with debt came to light.
R
by Requiem on Oct 9, 2009 12:17 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
but I guess my point
is that Hicks hasn’t always been stingy with cash like in the past 12 months. If you believe news sources, he made very strong offers for Matsuzaka, Zito, Hunter, and Teixeira (before he was traded). Of course payroll is going to drop when the guys you make huge (arguably too large) offers to end up going elsewhere.
You say there has been six years of this, but what I see is six years of moderate payrolls because they had two years in the early 2000s of signing the biggest names on the market, and then a series of years of missing out on those guys. Now, you can say they went after the wrong guys – they were never going to end up in Texas, so they should have gone after other players who they had a chance with. And I’d agree.
Hicks in the past 12 months – yeah, something is wrong there. But before that I see no evidence at all that spending was the problem.
Really, spending for spending’s sake is stupid. Blaming performance on payroll is missing the point of this last decade.
Go Rice Owls!
by JBImaknee on Oct 9, 2009 9:11 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
JBI you make a good point
Hicks did go a bit crazy with the cash for two years. Since it not my money I am certainly fine with that. For six year we have been below where the payroll should be IMHO as we have been rebuiding. Given the benefits of the rebuilding process I believe we need to loosen up the payroll to take advantage of this past season. I am not advocating a $100M payroll again as that is too soon IMO. I would like to see what JD could do with say an additional $10-$12M in the trade market this off season. Say they budget for $78M for 2010 up from $68M this year. That combined with Padilla, Byrd, Jones, Blalock, etc. not coming back gives JD significant financial flexibility. Combine the money and the talent avaiable to trade away and JD has the amunition to make a big move that could make this team great for years to come.
HYPOTHETICALLY:
Say, the Royals are willing to trade Greinke for a package of young players you would be willing to give up to get him. Say you get a chance to extend his contract but it will cost you an additional $10M per year to keep him for X years.
At $68M payroll you can’t afford him, at $78M you can and secure a piece that could make this team a contender for X years.
by Bigfan16 on Oct 9, 2009 12:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
rebuilding
This team went through a major spending spree/transaction spree after the 2005 season. Thats when they added Millwood, Padilla, Otsuka, Wilkerson, Nevin, deRosa. They also graduated Kinsler, Loe, Koronka and Tejeda to the starting lineup/Rotation.
After that it was two years of rebuiilding to get to where we are today.
My guess is that we will spend some this year. but not much. . We get ownership fixed this offseason early next season. We go on a roll next year and win the division and go to the playoffs in 2011. then spend even moreover the next 2 years in retaining /adding to the team as needed.
by iblum on Oct 9, 2009 10:49 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think our window starts next year
especially since Anaheim may lose a few guys that include Guerrero (who kills us), Figgins, Abreu and Lackey. Now Anaheim has a big payroll and they can sign guys to make up for this or resign a player or two. They also got Scott Kazmir which pisses me off. We cannot expect them to lose, we have to dethrone them. That means getting a piece or two through free agency. We don’t need to spend huge money to do this.
A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings.
by NothinG on Oct 9, 2009 12:02 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
FWIW
Below is the Rangers payroll history since 2001.
2009 $ 555,000 $ 68,178,798
2008 $ 810,000 $ 67,712,326
2007 $ 550,000 $ 68,318,675
2006 $ 750,000 $ 68,228,662
2005 $ 650,000 $ 55,849,000
2004 $ 550,000 $ 55,050,417
2003 $ 1,150,000 $ 103,491,667
2002 $ 2,000,000 $ 105,726,122
2001 $ 800,000 $ 88,633,500
I would not consider the increase from $55M to $68M an major spending spree considering the median MLB team payroll is significantly higher than $68M which is 22nd of the 30 MLB teams this past season.
Why would you guess they will spend more this year when they have already said they plan on keeping payoll about the same?
by Bigfan16 on Oct 9, 2009 12:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That looks like a team
getting a lot smarter about the talent to dollar ratio, not a team getting cheap. (at least towards the end of that time span.)
A team approaching its contention window should not yet be spending so much money. Look what that did for Detroit over the last couple years.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
by t ball on Oct 11, 2009 4:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
OT - Forgot how good "Red House" by Hendrix is...
Listening to that “Scorsese Presents the Blues” box set…
Pretty good stuff.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
by Ryin A on Oct 8, 2009 4:56 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
i really hope those highlighted points are true
because that would make me feel alot better about whether management is going to screw this thing up.
A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings.
by NothinG on Oct 8, 2009 5:16 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
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