Tom Hicks with last ditch effort to keep the Rangers
by Adam J. Morris on Nov 18, 2009 4:27 PM CST
154 comments
Richard Durrett writes that Tom Hicks is putting together a group in a last-ditch effort to keep from selling the Texas Rangers:
Texas Rangers owner Tom Hicks said Wednesday that he's putting together his own group of mainly local investors, including team president Nolan Ryan and former Dallas Cowboys quarterback Roger Staubach, in an effort to maintain majority ownership in the club.Hicks expects at least five groups, including his own, to submit proposals by Friday's deadline. At that point, Hicks and his staff will analyze the proposals and decide which one makes the most sense to pay down or eliminate debt accrued by Hicks Sports Group.
So we have Chuck Greenberg, who is supposedly putting together a local group with Nolan Ryan, and now we have Tom Hicks, who is putting together his own group that includes Ryan (and Roger Staubach).
I get the sense that, after what has gone on here lately, MLB wants to be rid of Hicks, and thus I'd be shocked if Hicks was able to do something that will result in him retaining control. I also find it bizarre that he's part of a group that is going to submit bids to, in essence, himself.
Durrett's story has a lot of quotes from Staubach, as well.
This is weird. But then, everything involving the Rangers always seems to be weird.
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I swear
that Tom Hicks hates Ranger fans and it just makes him sick to think that he might not be able to torture us in the near future.
Favorite bumper sticker of all time, seen on a VW bus:
"Gas, Grass, or Ass. Nobody rides for free"
by tricer on Nov 18, 2009 4:32 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Where's the Benny Hill theme as we open the thread?
"BIg whoop, wanna fight about it?"
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
by lost in space on Nov 18, 2009 4:35 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
href=“http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gpc5_3B5xdk” target="new">
"Dying ain't hard. It’s living in the wake of a thorough public humiliation that’s hard.--JDT217
Internet greatness http://www.lonestarball.com/2009/11/10/1125340/will-carroll-calls-out-josey-wales
by WestTxAg06 on Nov 18, 2009 7:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Well I screwed that up
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gpc5_3B5xdk
"Dying ain't hard. It’s living in the wake of a thorough public humiliation that’s hard.--JDT217
Internet greatness http://www.lonestarball.com/2009/11/10/1125340/will-carroll-calls-out-josey-wales
by WestTxAg06 on Nov 18, 2009 7:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The negotiations might go something like this...
Tom Hicks: “Mr. Hicks, I’ll give you $500 million for the Rangers.”
Tom Hicks: “That’s an outrage!”
Tom Hicks: “Okay, I’ll give you $550 million. But I insist that Tom Hicks can’t be part of the ownership group.”
Tom Hicks: “Sold!”
"It's not a good strategy, but it's my strategy." -- Courtney Lucas
by Lucas on Nov 18, 2009 4:38 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
It does seem awfully like bidding on your own item on ebay
In fact, it may be that they’ve figured out that Greenberg is willing to put up something close to $600 million, but no one else is close to $550. So Hicks just introduces the “I’ll just buy it from myself at $550” threat, and Greenberg has to go over the top.
Whatever. I really don’t care. I almost prefer Hicks to the uncertainty that may come from some of the groups; at least with Hicks or Greenberg, Ryan and Daniels appear safe.
Go Rice Owls!
by JBImaknee on Nov 18, 2009 4:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think he should try to buy the Longhorns
and go screw over that team. I’m sick of him in Arlington.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
by willamos2 on Nov 18, 2009 4:38 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
thank god the longhorns have bigger donors than him....
Fuck Mike Estabrook
by Horns130 on Nov 18, 2009 4:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Just go please!!! Haven't we suffered enough?!?!?
fat ass
Good help doesn't come cheap.
- Gil LeBreton
by BigGuns on Nov 18, 2009 4:38 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Isn't the reason he has to sell the team
because he had too much borrowed money in the first place? Now he wants to buy the team from himself with a bunch more borrowed money so that he can pay off his old creditors while bringing on board a bunch of new ones?
Favorite bumper sticker of all time, seen on a VW bus:
"Gas, Grass, or Ass. Nobody rides for free"
by tricer on Nov 18, 2009 4:44 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Since that is how almost all big business works
I have no problem with that. Companies take out giant loans, and then take out new giant loans from other people to pay off the first creditor all the time. That is just how the business world works. That Hicks was able to stall the process until the credit markets loosened up is more a testament to him than anything else.
Go Rice Owls!
by JBImaknee on Nov 18, 2009 4:47 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Didn't Bernie Madoff do pretty much the same thing?
by Inkara1 on Nov 18, 2009 4:48 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Not even close
It would be like Hick’s selling 100 more tickets than existed. Then when those 100 didn’t have seats and bitched, he’d sell 200 more tickets to pay back the 100. And so on.
It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone. You count on it, rely on it to buffer the passage of time, to keep the memory of sunshine and high skies alive, and then just when the days are all twilight, when you need it most, it stops.
by WyoRanger on Nov 18, 2009 7:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
yes that is how business works...
isnt that also how much of this current credit crisis began though….
Fuck Mike Estabrook
by Horns130 on Nov 18, 2009 4:59 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No. One this is certain...
…the lenders are not going to let Hicks become over-extended again on how much he leverages his assets.
by RyanBlueThunder on Nov 19, 2009 5:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No
90% of the time you have to re-fi with the original creditor, especially if you are in trouble
by thedudeabides on Nov 18, 2009 6:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Basically...
…it is no different than the 0% balance transfer shell game I was doing the past 3-4 years, until credit card companies quit letting you do that.
by Adam J. Morris on Nov 18, 2009 7:29 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I did that a couple times too...
it really helped me pay off my credit card debt from my marriage, honeymoon, et al.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
by slc ranger on Nov 18, 2009 9:40 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
explain please?
TCU AD/PR Student: I Need A Job
by PM Productions on Nov 18, 2009 10:34 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
0%
A credit card company would send you an offer to have 0% interest for 9 months, so you would transfer your debt to that card, then 9 months later another company would send another offer for 0% interest, so you would transfer again.
A few years ago, the big thing was to lock in 4.9% for the life of the loan… and that’s what I did the last time… just in time for the 0% offers to go away. Yay Me!
by JShoe on Nov 19, 2009 8:01 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Happens often
Company goes to Chap 7 bankruptcy, former principals/investors in the company are the ones that put together the biggest bid to purchase the assets because they think they’re the ones that “really” know how much the assets are worth.
It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone. You count on it, rely on it to buffer the passage of time, to keep the memory of sunshine and high skies alive, and then just when the days are all twilight, when you need it most, it stops.
by WyoRanger on Nov 18, 2009 5:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
my head hurts
someone OWN this team so we can get our offseason started.
This is going to get old real quick…
usa
by Longhorn on Nov 18, 2009 4:46 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
i get a sense that his stubborness will help drag this thing out
A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings.
by NothinG on Nov 18, 2009 6:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
sigh
Sometimes I really question why I’m a Rangers fan.
by bdavison94 on Nov 18, 2009 4:47 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I knew this would happen
I told my friend Shawn about a month ago that Hicks at the last second would come forward with a group and keep the team… This is what will happen…
- Hicks will have a group of 15-20 guys, will have a bid for like $525 mill, Hicks wont have a large amount of contribution in this but will be the head of the group, maybe will be a ex-officio director of the board… He can use the money to get out of debt, and then the other guys on the board will recieve a different portion of revenue payments, like 8-10% while Hicks doesnt get much, or a majority of it will be put back into the team. I think thats how he could get this done, from MLB and the investors perspective…
- The others groups may have bigger total bids, like $550mill-$600mill, but I have a feeling that some may be wanting to bring in their own people, so maybe Hicks motivation is to keep part of ownership AND keep Jon and Thad in power…
In the end, MLB wants the team to have a ownership group that will grow the team and try and take advantage of the DFW market… They also want to see a high selling price… I think that Hicks will try to keep the team, so in the end this will happen…
- Chuck’s group, with Nolan on the board, will buy 80% of the team, totalling $475 million plus more money to the team in the form of ballpark improvements and the development of a media network, and Hicks group will buy 20% of the team, giving Hicks the power to control that 20% while giving those investors a good amount of revenue as owners… The total reported amount will be in the $550mill range, although I expect Hicks to only get about $500 mill in cash out of this..
My other point is that dont underestimate what Hicks has done for other DFW and Texas business guys, and how much they feel like they need to repay him for his help, thus helping him out in this circumstance… This more than anything will play a big role in whether Hicks maintains any ownership or not.
TCU AD/PR Student: I Need A Job
by PM Productions on Nov 18, 2009 5:13 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Noooooo...
please just sell the team and move to Europe.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
by slc ranger on Nov 18, 2009 5:16 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
But the Liverpool fans hate his guts too...
by JBP on Nov 18, 2009 6:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Even better.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
by GhettoBear04 on Nov 19, 2009 8:58 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Every Single Time
I see that photo of Jones and HIcks, I kinda freaked out. Hicks looks like a normal enough person in it but Jones looks like some Hollywood special effect gone wrong.
by Black Francis on Nov 18, 2009 5:18 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Jerry Jones
In that picture, he looks like the ghost of Bill Murray’s old boss in “Scrooged.”
by Adam J. Morris on Nov 18, 2009 5:29 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Holy shit...
That is pretty much spot on.
He’s only missing a golf ball falling out of his head.
by JBP on Nov 18, 2009 6:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Jones
looks like he’s melting.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
by t ball on Nov 18, 2009 5:32 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
seems like
Someone got a skull and started sticking skin onto it using Elmer’s Glue All.
by Black Francis on Nov 18, 2009 6:25 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
In an odd way this isn't shocking
Since it’s apparently HSG thats in debt and trouble and not Hicks himself.
"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it." - Mitch Hedberg
by rentz on Nov 18, 2009 5:19 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Interesting that Nolan has hitched himself to more than one horse.
That goes against the “my word is my contract and my word is good” type of agreement one would expect a good true Texan like Nolan to have made with Greenberg. Methinks there’s more to this story.
by 3hacks on Nov 18, 2009 5:38 PM CST via mobile reply actions 0 recs
Oh, glad you cleared it up
"He will not coddle them. Nolan Ryan doesn’t coddle." - Jeff Passan
by Dirk Diggler on Nov 18, 2009 6:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think it's just Nolan not playing favorites.
He’s basically saying whoever buys it, I’ll be involved and throw some of my money into the deal.
by MikeEl on Nov 18, 2009 11:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
According to Hicks
We have our plan. We have to live within our means. We think signing long-term contracts with 30-something pitchers are the riskiest you can make in baseball. We’re not going to do it. But we will be opportunistic and see what’s out there.
That paragraph just makes me sick for some reason. “We have to live within our means” – “means” YOU created, fucko. I just hate the thought of Hicks being involved in any manner whatsoever with free agent signing or janitorial services.
It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone. You count on it, rely on it to buffer the passage of time, to keep the memory of sunshine and high skies alive, and then just when the days are all twilight, when you need it most, it stops.
by WyoRanger on Nov 18, 2009 6:01 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Heh
Whenever I see the word “fucko,” it makes me think of Kinky Kelly & The Sexy Stud in Clerks II.
“Interspecies erotica, fucko!”
"I cannot believe how fucking off base I was about Tiny E before this season. The Kid is great and is going to become a star."
- Wails
by RCCook on Nov 18, 2009 6:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It makes me think of Kevin Pollack in The Usual Suspects
by Adam J. Morris on Nov 18, 2009 6:37 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Kelly can be a guys name too
"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it." - Mitch Hedberg
by rentz on Nov 18, 2009 7:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I am always amazed
that his lenders haven’t aggressively moved to be rid of him.
"I don't condone steroids or any other type of growth hormones or anything else, but I could care less, and, for the most part, I don't think the fans give a (bleep). The people that care about it are the people that probably don't like baseball," - Jim Leyland
by DJCahill on Nov 18, 2009 6:11 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I'm sure they all play golf together.
Nobody would want that kind of unpleasantness.
by Black Francis on Nov 18, 2009 6:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
For what?
I’m guessing the security HSG offered for the loans was the team. A lender can’t just say “well, you defaulted on your loan and we’re foreclosing on the team.” This isn’t a house that you can just turn around and sell.
It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone. You count on it, rely on it to buffer the passage of time, to keep the memory of sunshine and high skies alive, and then just when the days are all twilight, when you need it most, it stops.
by WyoRanger on Nov 18, 2009 6:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Certainly MLB could transfer the team to the lenders
and I’m not really sure it is in their interest to side with Hicks over the Banks.
"I don't condone steroids or any other type of growth hormones or anything else, but I could care less, and, for the most part, I don't think the fans give a (bleep). The people that care about it are the people that probably don't like baseball," - Jim Leyland
by DJCahill on Nov 18, 2009 6:37 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
MLB would never do that
In this instance, the outstanding loans are less than the market value of the team or else Hicks wouldn’t be trying to buy it back. So if MLB transferred the team they’d do it for less than market value which hurts all of the owners. They want all their teams to be valued as highly as possible.
It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone. You count on it, rely on it to buffer the passage of time, to keep the memory of sunshine and high skies alive, and then just when the days are all twilight, when you need it most, it stops.
by WyoRanger on Nov 18, 2009 7:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
On the other hand
if they say that baseball teams aren’t really collateral on loans because you can’t take possession, it will dry up the market for loans for MLB which will also drop the price of teams.
"I don't condone steroids or any other type of growth hormones or anything else, but I could care less, and, for the most part, I don't think the fans give a (bleep). The people that care about it are the people that probably don't like baseball," - Jim Leyland
by DJCahill on Nov 18, 2009 9:49 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Do the majority of MLB owners
use borrowed money to purchase? Or is it a case by case basis ..
"Nothing we do here has a point" - Czar Morris
by Chase Irwin on Nov 19, 2009 2:52 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The majority of everthing borrows money to purchase
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Nov 19, 2009 3:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Damnit cut off too soon
Not many people can simply write a check for hundreds of millions of dollars and it come out of their checking account.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
by bigsteve on Nov 19, 2009 3:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, I understand that.
That’s why I asked the question.
I figured that anybody who owns an MLB franchise:
A) Is rich enough to use “cash” exclusively
B) Is rich enough to borrow significant amounts of money cheaply, without a line of credit extending to the other hemisphere.
I guess to answer my own question, there are more Jeffrey Lorias than George Steinbrenners. Another thing you could do is simply look at the transaction logs of the franchises and see how long it took each team to have the debt paid off. It makes more sense for teams to be sold to people who either got Dykstra Cheddar or to people who could amortize debt quickly. I’m fairly certain that wasn’t the case when the team was sold to Tom Hicks. Maybe he was just opportunistic.
"Nothing we do here has a point" - Czar Morris
by Chase Irwin on Nov 19, 2009 3:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
According to Galloway
Hicks put a request in with Robert Murdoch (Can’t remember if Galloway said “Of FoxNews” or to have FoxNews own it as a corporation) to invest as much as $250 million, and of course he would retain majority ownership.
IMO, this reminds me an awful lot of what Hart did in 2004, before the magical season he was ready to jump ship and move on. When they had success he changed his mind and put himself back in front of the camera as the man ready to ride the good times.
"Losers assemble in little groups and bitch about the coaches and the system and other players in other little groups. Winners assemble as a team."
- Bill Parcells
by Taylor on Nov 18, 2009 6:19 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
It's "Rupert" and...
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
Seriously, if this happens, I’m a Rockies fan.
by JDT217 on Nov 18, 2009 6:28 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Sorry about that
I’m doing three things at once, my bad.
"Losers assemble in little groups and bitch about the coaches and the system and other players in other little groups. Winners assemble as a team."
- Bill Parcells
by Taylor on Nov 18, 2009 6:32 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Murdoch?
Is he nuts?
I know Hicks is politically conservative, but if he’s still planning on keeping that ownership stake in Liverpool, he should know better than to get into bed with the owner of The Sun.
If he thinks he has problems with the Scousers now, just wait.
"I cannot believe how fucking off base I was about Tiny E before this season. The Kid is great and is going to become a star."
- Wails
by RCCook on Nov 18, 2009 6:29 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
the Sousers can all bluster, sputter, question, and cavil...
…they can threaten to form “fan unions” and make their feeble attempts to have a “fan purchase” of LFC. They attempted their “protests” but soon realized that they did nothing but harm their club on the pitch.
One thing is constant: they will support their club.
by RyanBlueThunder on Nov 19, 2009 5:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think I just involuntarily shuddered...
Murdoch is as close to the devil as reality will allow.
by JBP on Nov 18, 2009 6:37 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Wow
"More than likely JW never played sports above the youth level. It amazes me that he seems to have no concept on the common reactions of an adult athlete or their normal interactions between each other." - laxonto
by Michael Cave on Nov 18, 2009 10:36 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You know
Hitler, Stalin, Musolini (sp?), shall I keep going?
"More than likely JW never played sports above the youth level. It amazes me that he seems to have no concept on the common reactions of an adult athlete or their normal interactions between each other." - laxonto
by Michael Cave on Nov 19, 2009 9:10 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Well those guys are all dead and I'm pretty sure Satan is alive and well
by oc on Nov 19, 2009 10:32 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He's an octogenarian.
So maybe not for long.
by JBP on Nov 19, 2009 10:41 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You said reality and
all of the aforementioned guys were real. Im sure we can use the cartesian model to prove their existence if you want to get philosophical.
"More than likely JW never played sports above the youth level. It amazes me that he seems to have no concept on the common reactions of an adult athlete or their normal interactions between each other." - laxonto
by Michael Cave on Nov 19, 2009 10:48 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Wow!
Sarah Palin gives Oprah her biggest audience in two years.
http://www.thrfeed.com/2009/11/sarah-palin-oprah-ratings-.html
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
by Josey Wales on Nov 19, 2009 10:52 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I just hope she tries to run for president.
And I mean that in all sincerity.
by JBP on Nov 19, 2009 11:30 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think she can be Prez.
She cashed that chip when she resigned as Guv however she has always moved the needle for the GOP and scares the living shit out of Liberal Pukes so there is definite use for her, what that exact place is needs to be determined.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
by Josey Wales on Nov 19, 2009 11:35 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yep
I think she is just like Hillary Clinton. Beloved by her base, and doesn’t stand a chance in hell of winning in the general election.
"I don't condone steroids or any other type of growth hormones or anything else, but I could care less, and, for the most part, I don't think the fans give a (bleep). The people that care about it are the people that probably don't like baseball," - Jim Leyland
by DJCahill on Nov 19, 2009 11:56 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Which is precisely why I want her to run for president.
But yeah, I think Josey is right in that she mostly killed that opportunity when she resigned as governor.
Now she’s just a fuckable Rush Limbaugh.
by JBP on Nov 19, 2009 12:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I also think she can be the GOP attack dog
on Obama.
It looks much worse when a 50 something year old white guy is highly critical of the prez perceived to be black (although he is half white) than it does when a woman is critical of him.
She won the heart of the GOP forever when she mocked his duty as a “Community Organizer.” Love, love, love that woman for having the stones to say it.
Somebody like Palin can mobilize the base, give a great speech (the prick Olbermann even admitted it) and help bring in the highly coveted women vote.
There’s definitely a place for her in the GOP.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
by Josey Wales on Nov 19, 2009 12:18 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Community Organizer
There are people on the left and right who are active in the community who took offense to Palin’s remark.
Besides, Jesus was a community organizer. Don’t you like Jesus?
by Black Francis on Nov 19, 2009 3:29 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Well granted, liberals see Obama > Jesus
I guess those of us who wearied of Obama’s “community organizer” B.S. enjoyed Palin’s remark because we see people all the time who make a difference in their community, bring people together, etc. Only they have actual jobs too. They don’t just run around all day trying to stir people up.
"Dying ain't hard. It’s living in the wake of a thorough public humiliation that’s hard.--JDT217
Internet greatness http://www.lonestarball.com/2009/11/10/1125340/will-carroll-calls-out-josey-wales
by WestTxAg06 on Nov 19, 2009 6:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Community organizers
do some pretty thankless work for low pay. And it is most certainly not just running around “stirring people up”.
I’d say any random community organizer works harder than Palin did as Alaska’s governor. She insulted an entire profession just to take a cheap shot at Obama. It got some laughs, but that’s pretty callous. I wouldn’t vote for Palin as PTA president.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
by t ball on Nov 19, 2009 8:25 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not going to say that there aren't good people doing good work as "community organizers"
But lots of the same people who knocked Palin’s qualifications used Obama’s time as a community organizer as some sort of impressive qualification for president. It’s not.
To Palin’s point, serving as mayor of a smallish town doesn’t qualify a person to be president, it’s more qualification than time as a community organizer.
"Dying ain't hard. It’s living in the wake of a thorough public humiliation that’s hard.--JDT217
Internet greatness http://www.lonestarball.com/2009/11/10/1125340/will-carroll-calls-out-josey-wales
by WestTxAg06 on Nov 19, 2009 8:48 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
More than
being a congressman? My problem with her is not her resume, but her apparent lack of even a cursory understanding of the major issues the country is facing.
Look, Palin is not the problem here. The McCain campaign made a calculated move that backfired. They chose someone way before her time and threw her to the wolves without doing their homework. Give Palin a few years to work her way up to the national stage and she might have been formidable. As it was, she just came off as extremely uninformed, merely a caricature of the soccer mom become governor. That is unfair to her, and definitely unfair to anyone who ever considered voting for McCain on his merits, including me.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
by t ball on Nov 20, 2009 12:26 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
All good points about Palin and McCain
Problem is, I think McCain realized he had to take a home run swing knowing there was a good chance it would swing and miss, but what he was doing had even less chance of success than the home run swing.
Sure, Obama had the resume as a legislator, but he hadn’t been around very long so it’s not like we knew all that much about him from that service. People were using the community organizer thing as some sort of amazing qualification when I failed to see how it in any way qualified him for the presidency.
As an aside, I’m not a fan of senators running for president anyway. Very few senators have become effective presidents.
"Dying ain't hard. It’s living in the wake of a thorough public humiliation that’s hard.--JDT217
Internet greatness http://www.lonestarball.com/2009/11/10/1125340/will-carroll-calls-out-josey-wales
by WestTxAg06 on Nov 20, 2009 9:57 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't recall
a lot of people using the community organizer thing as some sort of “amazing qualification”. I do recall a lot of the opposition using as a negative talking point and then supporters defending it.
I think I agree with you on the senator point. I would have voted for McCain in 2000. But after his own party shoved a sharp stick up his ass in the SC primary that year, I guess he came to the conclusion that he needed to sell his soul to win the nomination.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
by t ball on Nov 20, 2009 10:26 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
And Jesus was NOT a community organizer
I’m not sure I’d look to Donna Brazile as an authority on what Jesus did or didn’t do.
"Dying ain't hard. It’s living in the wake of a thorough public humiliation that’s hard.--JDT217
Internet greatness http://www.lonestarball.com/2009/11/10/1125340/will-carroll-calls-out-josey-wales
by WestTxAg06 on Nov 19, 2009 6:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
um
That came from my head, not hers. I can’t stand her to be honest.
Are you saying that Jesus didn’t organize people in his community?
And where did I say ANYTHING like Obama>Jesus? You’re a giant cock for putting words in my mouth like that.
by Black Francis on Nov 20, 2009 12:32 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That statement was made multiple times, she probably most famously made it
I didn’t intend to put those words in your mouth, but plenty of liberals think along those lines. They’ve got a messiah and his name is Barack.
To use the opening line from Wikipedia which is probably as good a definition as you’ll find, community organizing “is a process by which people living in proximity to each other are brought together in an organization to act in their shared self-interest.” Jesus did not unite people in an organization to act in their shared self-interest. He brought the message of salvation from God.
"Dying ain't hard. It’s living in the wake of a thorough public humiliation that’s hard.--JDT217
Internet greatness http://www.lonestarball.com/2009/11/10/1125340/will-carroll-calls-out-josey-wales
by WestTxAg06 on Nov 20, 2009 10:00 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Come on...
no intelligent liberal thinks Barrack is the messiah anymore than any intelligent conservative thinks Bush or Reagan were. Knock that shit off. Try leaving Jesus out of just one thing.
You can’t blame a large majority of the country for being excited about getting Bush out of office. That’s a large part of why so many were/are excited about Obama.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
by slc ranger on Nov 20, 2009 10:06 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
*Barack*. It would help if I at least spelled his name correct.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
by slc ranger on Nov 20, 2009 10:17 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Intelligent liberals may not, but there seemed to be a whole host of Obama maniacs who thought that way
If they didn’t actually think it, it certainly came across like they found him to be the savior for all our problems.
"Dying ain't hard. It’s living in the wake of a thorough public humiliation that’s hard.--JDT217
Internet greatness http://www.lonestarball.com/2009/11/10/1125340/will-carroll-calls-out-josey-wales
by WestTxAg06 on Nov 20, 2009 10:57 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
She doesn't scare liberals
Liberals want her to run because she’s unelectable.
That's why they call them business sox
by egriffey on Nov 19, 2009 1:48 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Palin
She doesn’t have to run to help liberals. The woman has a very high profile and comes off as stupid to a lot of people.
by Black Francis on Nov 19, 2009 3:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Palin
The woman has a very high profile and comes off as stupid to educated people.
FTFY.
by JBP on Nov 19, 2009 3:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
My grandmother...
…didn’t graduate high school and thinks Sarah Palin is a dumbass. So ya don’t gotta be educated.
Do not know what “FTFY” means.
by Black Francis on Nov 19, 2009 3:41 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, get off your high horse
Sure, all educated people are liberals and only morons vote conservative. That’s a highly educated opinion you have.
"Dying ain't hard. It’s living in the wake of a thorough public humiliation that’s hard.--JDT217
Internet greatness http://www.lonestarball.com/2009/11/10/1125340/will-carroll-calls-out-josey-wales
by WestTxAg06 on Nov 19, 2009 6:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
My dad is very conservative and intelligent
and he was completely disgusted by her and her nomination as vp candidate. She had no business being there. I suspect many of her supporters just hated liberals saying bad things about one of their own and they rushed to her defense. I really can’t allow myself to believe they thought she was qualified to run the country.
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by t ball on Nov 19, 2009 8:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Palin was more qualified to run the country
than Obama last year.
Give me the Guv over the ahem… “Community Organizer.”
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"Business as usual." - Tom Hicks on the Ranger off-season 11/19/09
by Josey Wales on Nov 19, 2009 10:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, brother.
Palin has some of the same talents Obama has, so it’s pretty funny how desperate some right wingers are to paint him as an empty sport coat. Palin was most definitely not more qualified than my mom to run the country.
Palin:Obama::Gilligan:the Professor. Both are stranded on an island, but I know who I’m listening to about getting home again. Gilligan will get more applause lines but after the Professor gets us home he’ll get both Maryanne and Ginger.
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by t ball on Nov 20, 2009 12:32 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That's not what I said.
I said that educated people recognize that she’s stupid. It’s not something I’m making up when I say the more educated and reasoned you are (liberals AND conservatives alike), the more Palin’s ineptitude and lack of intelligent becomes glaringly apparent.
Trying to defend her as otherwise makes you sound like you’re using Josey logic.
by JBP on Nov 20, 2009 3:23 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You're just proof that Murdoch may be evil,
but he’s damn good at his job.
by JBP on Nov 19, 2009 11:29 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
How am i proof of that?
I rarely if ever watch fox news (my dad does), take the WSJ with a grain of salt. I make my own opinions through my collegiate sudy of The Enlightenment and the founding America. Perhaps you should look into it. I can recommend some excellent books if you would like.
"More than likely JW never played sports above the youth level. It amazes me that he seems to have no concept on the common reactions of an adult athlete or their normal interactions between each other." - laxonto
by Michael Cave on Nov 19, 2009 12:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Founding of*
"More than likely JW never played sports above the youth level. It amazes me that he seems to have no concept on the common reactions of an adult athlete or their normal interactions between each other." - laxonto
by Michael Cave on Nov 19, 2009 12:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Sorry.
I actually had you confused with Arlington Stadium Legend. I sincerely apologize for that.
And I’m a big fan of the Enlightenment. A book list would be nice, yes.
by JBP on Nov 19, 2009 12:30 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No worries
I think we have definitely come to a political impasse though. There is no magic bullet that either of us posses that would cause the other to change their views.
Two Treatises of Government, A Letter Concerning Toleration – John Locke – Two of the most seminal works in the history of democracy in modernity
The Wealth of Nations – Adam Smith – No free lunch haha
Du Contrat Social – Rousseau – An interesting take on The Enlightenment by someone in the midst of it.
Leviathan – Thomas Hobbes – Read this one first, then Locke, then Rousseau then Smith. That should give you the proper context. Also, some academics espouse that Hobbes was an atheist which is an interesting tidbit for you.
I dont know everything about The Enlightenment but 4 of the History classes I took in college were taught by a professor whose specific expertise was The Enlightenment. One course was actually specifically on The Enlightement while the other courses involved The Enlightenment exhaustively.
I do believe that politicians (BOTH parties) today either dont have a sense of where the founders got their ideas or simply refuse to acknowledge it. They seem to have almost no understanding of the history behind our government which is quite unfortunate.
"More than likely JW never played sports above the youth level. It amazes me that he seems to have no concept on the common reactions of an adult athlete or their normal interactions between each other." - laxonto
by Michael Cave on Nov 19, 2009 12:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Thank you for the reasoned response.
I do agree on the political impasse. It’s something that my father and I have had to agree on, before we kill my mother with our “discussions.”
I’ll try and pick up one or more of those books (especially those by Locke) and give them a read. I did go buy Wealth of Nations a couple of weeks ago, but I haven’t had the strength to dive into it yet.
I completely agree with both parties not really having a clue about the founding of our nation. I think that one aspect to the Republican party (and to an extent, the Democrats) that irks me so much lately is that they insist on the U.S. being a “Christian” nation when the FF intended for it to be anything but. Freedom of religion (or lack thereof in my case) seems to be something that is completely lost with our modern parties.
by JBP on Nov 19, 2009 3:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think you're right about this
I do believe that politicians (BOTH parties) today either dont have a sense of where the founders got their ideas or simply refuse to acknowledge it. They seem to have almost no understanding of the history behind our government which is quite unfortunate.
That may be true for some, but the bigger problem is election cycles being basically nonstop now. Every move is made calculating the political implications. Right now moderate democrats are probably considering whether or not to vote for health care reform not based on what they think of the program, but on how seriously they’ll be challenged by a conservative in their district in their next election. The GOP knows this and is smartly demonizing the health care bills to pressure swing districts. At least, that’s part of it.
The system doesn’t really work so well anymore in some ways. The constant pressure to appease the electorate and the people who pay for your election campaigns means reps who don’t vote what they actually think, just what they think they need to do to stay alive.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
by t ball on Nov 19, 2009 5:20 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Thought you were an atheist?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
by Josey Wales on Nov 18, 2009 10:41 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I can reference other fairy tale beings like the Easter Bunny or unicorns
when I’m describing something.
Being an atheist doesn’t change that.
by JBP on Nov 19, 2009 3:23 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
This is bit isn't really funny...
…why keep it going?
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
by GhettoBear04 on Nov 19, 2009 9:01 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Watching paint dry, grass grow or a getting an new owner
seem to all fall under the same category at this point. This is dreadful watching an off-season slip away without hope of a new regime soon.
"BIg whoop, wanna fight about it?"
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
by lost in space on Nov 18, 2009 6:46 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
Feldman
Scott Feldman is on SiriusXM Home Plate right now. He is not saying anything we don’t already know (impact of Andrus and Nolan Ryan on the pitchers, etc.).
by Excel Hearts Choi on Nov 18, 2009 7:08 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Ownership
Says the team realizes they are close to being a good team, so the ownership situation is on the team’s mind. However, he says there is nothing they (the players) can do, so it is not really worth worrying about.
by Excel Hearts Choi on Nov 18, 2009 7:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I just flipped on Mythbusters
You know what is hotter than Kari Byron?
Pregnant Kari Byron.
by Adam J. Morris on Nov 18, 2009 7:20 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I've never understood that
I’ve always heard that pregnant women have a “glow,” but I interpret that to mean “fat.”
That's why they call them business sox
by egriffey on Nov 18, 2009 8:03 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Yup.
"It's kind of a new stat that's in vogue" - Joe Buck on OPS
"...he wasn’t a good hitter, just a good middle of the order bat that hit a lot of homers." - NYTXFAN on Mark McGwire
by lonestarJon on Nov 18, 2009 8:47 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
nope
2009 Texas Rangers: Why The Hell Not Us?--ghtd36 on May 13, 2009
In the interest of quicker games Ron should just tell the ump he's pulling the Feliz card and the ump should rule the inning over.--Sherman McCoy on Sept. 4, 2009
by boomer1 on Nov 18, 2009 8:48 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
This
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
by GhostofSteveFoucault on Nov 18, 2009 9:04 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
I don't know...
who was it that posed in Playboy pregnant a while back? Lisa Rena? She was really hot.
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
by benmor78 on Nov 19, 2009 2:36 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
first kid...
I was scared… afraid the kid was going to come out with a black eye or something. 2nd kid… it’s on.
I think there are some women who are absolutely beautiful pregnant. Others, not so much.
by JShoe on Nov 19, 2009 8:08 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah...that's where I'm at.
I don’t know if it’s that some women look better pregnant necessarily…but it definitely does more for some women than others. I think it’s the difference between “I put on a little weight and have a big belly” and “This is my excuse to start my OBESITY NOW Plan”
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
by GhettoBear04 on Nov 19, 2009 9:39 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Ewwwww
Someone tapped that? Gross.
LoneStarBall....You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy.
by DaheelzCM on Nov 18, 2009 9:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Her photo spread in Maxim...
wasn’t very good.
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
by benmor78 on Nov 19, 2009 2:36 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
What are the odds the MLB approves of this?
"Blister please, with those wings in your spine.
Love to be with a brother of mine.
How he'd love to find your tongue in his teeth,
In a struggle to find secret songs that you keep,
Wrapped in boxes so tight, sounding only at night as you sleep." ~Jeff Mangum; Neutral Milk Hotel
by jdh90 on Nov 18, 2009 8:08 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Hopefully none...Hicks has to go for the good of this team.
but MLB doesn’t look at that aspect. Unfortunately, neither does Hicks.
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
by GhostofSteveFoucault on Nov 18, 2009 9:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Best News of the Offseason
Apparently, the chances that the Rangers will resign Byrd are getting smaller and smaller.
From Sullivan via MLBTR:
“We’ve had a decent amount of conversation,” Daniels told MLB.com. “I expect them to test the market. Based on what they’re looking for…we’re not in a position to do that right now. We expect them to talk to other clubs and see what’s out there. We’re going to be looking at alternatives.”
by Excel Hearts Choi on Nov 18, 2009 8:18 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Thank God
"It's kind of a new stat that's in vogue" - Joe Buck on OPS
"...he wasn’t a good hitter, just a good middle of the order bat that hit a lot of homers." - NYTXFAN on Mark McGwire
by lonestarJon on Nov 18, 2009 8:47 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That's good and it's bad
Compare JD’s quote to Hicks’ quote above. Apparently the team is running on a pretty tight damn budget. It seems to me that even if they wanted to sign Byrd they couldn’t which means they can’t sign anyone else unless it’s “within their means” but they’ll be “opportunistic” (i.e. Sosa-ish).
It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone. You count on it, rely on it to buffer the passage of time, to keep the memory of sunshine and high skies alive, and then just when the days are all twilight, when you need it most, it stops.
by WyoRanger on Nov 18, 2009 9:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
Although, thinking in the long term I’d say being forced into doing nothing this offseason >>> wasting money and years on Marlon Byrd.
But yeah, that’s pretty discouraging news for anyone like me who hopes to sign a decent FA hitter.
"It's kind of a new stat that's in vogue" - Joe Buck on OPS
"...he wasn’t a good hitter, just a good middle of the order bat that hit a lot of homers." - NYTXFAN on Mark McGwire
by lonestarJon on Nov 18, 2009 9:04 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
like you said, it's not so much about not signign Byrd
but that we can’t sign anybody else. Damn, even the Nationals are apparently interested in pursuing Lackey and spending that kind of money. Of course, I want no part of that kind of contract. The fact that we can’t afford a 7M dollar contract is disconcerting, especially when you consider that we were 22nd in payroll last year. How can we trade for anyone of value either when we can’t afford that. argh!
Hicks needs to go!
A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings.
by NothinG on Nov 18, 2009 9:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, signing The Sosa was such a good idea
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
by Josey Wales on Nov 18, 2009 9:04 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Signing him
wasnt a bad idea but the usage of him certainly was bad.
"More than likely JW never played sports above the youth level. It amazes me that he seems to have no concept on the common reactions of an adult athlete or their normal interactions between each other." - laxonto
by Michael Cave on Nov 19, 2009 12:18 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
This
"Dying ain't hard. It’s living in the wake of a thorough public humiliation that’s hard.--JDT217
Internet greatness http://www.lonestarball.com/2009/11/10/1125340/will-carroll-calls-out-josey-wales
by WestTxAg06 on Nov 19, 2009 6:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe
Barry Bonds on a one-year deal? (That’s a joke, folks)
That's why they call them business sox
by egriffey on Nov 18, 2009 9:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You know what...
If that old bastard could still hit…….nevermind…..
2009 Texas Rangers: Why The Hell Not Us?--ghtd36 on May 13, 2009
In the interest of quicker games Ron should just tell the ump he's pulling the Feliz card and the ump should rule the inning over.--Sherman McCoy on Sept. 4, 2009
by boomer1 on Nov 18, 2009 9:30 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Tom Hicks
is a douche.
What is this, Horseville? Because I'm surrounded by naysayers.
by clark on Nov 18, 2009 11:18 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I motion for this to be nominated
for ‘Comment Of The Year’
by oc on Nov 19, 2009 1:27 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
What about the 1000 others that are just like it?
"Blister please, with those wings in your spine.
Love to be with a brother of mine.
How he'd love to find your tongue in his teeth,
In a struggle to find secret songs that you keep,
Wrapped in boxes so tight, sounding only at night as you sleep." ~Jeff Mangum; Neutral Milk Hotel
by jdh90 on Nov 19, 2009 2:09 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Has Hick's "Business as Usual" come to mean
we don’t sign decent free agents anymore? Only NRIs?
by SanDiegoKev on Nov 19, 2009 8:42 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
Reminds me of...
…Hicks bidding against himself to get A-Rod.
We all know how that worked out.
defeatist pussy lives here
by sam in so cal on Nov 19, 2009 8:42 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
…
"Nothing we do here has a point" - Czar Morris
by Chase Irwin on Nov 19, 2009 6:37 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Well said.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
by t ball on Nov 19, 2009 8:28 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
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