Holland's Velocity
by Parman on Feb 2, 2009 7:42 PM CST
36 comments
I'm puzzled on Derek Holland's jump in velocity. It seems strange that he would gain ~10 mph once hitting the pros. Most everyone here is famaliar with his background; 25th round draft and follow pick who seems to improve with each month. I'm excited as they come for his success, but I have concerns about the stamina of this jump. I would love to have some explanation to how it has come about. Could it be a correction in mechanics? Weights? Running a lot? All I can think of involve animal sacrifices, PEDS or a deal with Jumping Jack Flash. As 1 and 3 don't work in reality and 2 does, I begin to wonder if it's possible.
Is this kind of jump in velocity a common occurence? If so, could you give me some examples? If this isn't Fanpost worthy, I apologize in advance.
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Holland himself can't explain it
It just happened. That said, a combination of strength, improved mechanics, and a late growth spurt could be partial explanations.
"There's a bailout coming but it's not for you." -- Neil Young
citing Clemens
as an example here is ironic, no?
"If you have a problem with me, you're probably a doucher."
by red shoe ranger on Feb 2, 2009 9:48 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Baseball Intellect
just had a post on Jake Arrieta that talked about his increased velocity. A change in mechanics that sped up Arrieta’s delivery goosed his velocity a bit. With Holland, I think growth, strength, and more consistent and efficient mechanics caused a similar increase in velocity.
The change in velocity took place over a couple of years, though, IIRC, not just a sudden jump last year. When they first drafted him I think he was in the 89-90 range (at work, not much time to look this up), that was a bit faster already by the time he actually signed just before the following draft. During 2007 his velo rose a tad, and then took a bit of a jump for 2008.
If anyone has more details on that velocity over time, I’d love to read it.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
I attended UT Austin in aroung '80
and saw Clemens pitch many times. I don’t ever remember him hitting 90 on the gun. I think he started roids much earlier than most people think. He wasn’t even a strike-out pitcher in college. Schraldi was more highly thought of than Clemens at the time. Clemens’ body also changed after college. Much more hefty. I have always been very suspicious of his velocity gain.
"Evolution happened, now get over it." Michael Shermer
That's ridiculous.
You think he was an average pitcher who took steroids and became one of the most dominant pitchers ever? I seriously doubt it.
Also, most people don’t weigh the same at 25 or 26 as they did at 18 or 19.
by brettgardner on Feb 2, 2009 10:35 PM CST up reply actions
Where does it say average above?
Being just behind Schraldi is not average. hehe
"Evolution happened, now get over it." Michael Shermer
You know who did hit 90's
Calvin Fucking Schiraldi
What a bad ass
This is our year.
http://www.lonestarball.com/2009/1/29/739765/the-socket-joint-rotator-c
by PM Productions on Feb 3, 2009 11:58 AM CST up reply actions
Holland article
hometown paper from dec. 23rd
"My mother always taught me that if the only thing you have to say is,
‘(Expletive) Dave Samson,’ then don’t say anything at all.
So I’m not going to say anything at all.
Is my mother the greatest or what?"
- Mariners GM Bill Bavasi, after signing Ichiro to a $90 million contract
This is what is so mysterious to me
Players don’t increase their velo 10 % in a season, do they? I can see a jump of 2-3 mph due to mechanics, but 7-9 mph seems impossible. Hard work is done by them all. I’m just saying. I’m skeptical. OK I’ve admitted it.
Your 2009 Snow Monkey Ambassador
not 10%
Holland was throwing 90-92 early in the year at Clinton, but over the last couple of months that has increased well into the mid-90s
He might occasionally hit the upper 90s but that is not where he is “pitching” at. I think his increase in velocity is due mainly to tweaks in his delivery. He basically went from 91 to 95 which I don’t think is out of order.
http://www.minorleagueball.com/2008/8/27/602324/where-did-this-guy-come-fr
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
if he keeps it up
he should be throwing baseballs through millwoods stomach fat by mid june
by dustinvandeman on Feb 2, 2009 10:57 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
This was his first full season.
Throwing every day can add a lot of velocity, especially when a pitcher has anatomically sound mechanics.
Now that is an answer I can sink my teeth into.
I can see a player, even well touted player, not throwing all the time in high school and college.
Your 2009 Snow Monkey Ambassador
Beavan
was undergoing a change in mechanics. It wouldn’t surprise me to see his velocity go up in 2009 as that change settles in and becomes consistent. I don’t know about his velocity, but his peripherals improved late in the season last year, something I take as a sign he was getting comfortable with the changes.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
there's this
for what it’s worth:
MJH: Derek Holland: What do you think accounts for his remarkable breakthrough this year?
Adair: There’s a lot that goes into that. He was 88-92 when he came to Spokane. We thought maybe he’d turn into a 92-93 mph guy eventually. We certainly never thought we’d see anything like 98. But everything we did with Derek worked and that’s really a credit to him. He’s got tremendous baseball intelligence. He understood from the very beginning what he was doing. You’d ask him a question and he’d give you a good answer. He understands pitching and his own body extremely well. He’s very consistent not only in his approach to pitching and his preparation, but in his delivery. Every pitch, every game, in every situation, he looks the same. He worked extremely hard. He’s extremely competitive….. Every now and then, somebody just comes along…. [long pause] Actually, I’ve never seen somebody improve so much, so fast in my time coaching. How do you not get fired up about a guy like that?
http://rangersblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2008/10/q-a-with-rick-adair.html
Thanks MJH
I missed that interview with Adair. A nice fat interview with my coffee.
Your 2009 Snow Monkey Ambassador
I remember shroomer telling us about his make-up. Some kind of story where Holland didn't need to be told to do something because he already knew to do it.
You just don't know when to keep your mouth shut, do you Saxy boy?
by oc on Feb 3, 2009 10:12 AM CST up reply actions
Feliz throws harder, but Holland’s polish sold me. Also, the the daggers he was shooting into the chirpy SA dugout after giving up a HR gave me tingles. Our choir boy has no back down in him. Awesome athlete. Bigger than you’d think up close. Lezotte befriended him during the long Clinton roadtrips and said he was an absolutely awesome human bean. I noticed Andrus was mindful to lean into Feliz whenever he had a chance and encourage him. Nobody needed to support Holland that way.
You just don't know when to keep your mouth shut, do you Saxy boy?
by oc on Feb 3, 2009 10:16 AM CST up reply actions
Kid is special
What happens when he comes down with elbow soreness next year?
"My mother always taught me that if the only thing you have to say is,
‘(Expletive) Dave Samson,’ then don’t say anything at all.
So I’m not going to say anything at all.
Is my mother the greatest or what?"
- Mariners GM Bill Bavasi, after signing Ichiro to a $90 million contract
We'll still have Feliz as we will Andrus to support him.
You just don't know when to keep your mouth shut, do you Saxy boy?
by oc on Feb 3, 2009 10:33 AM CST up reply actions
We have quantity
But I’ll still feel sick.
"My mother always taught me that if the only thing you have to say is,
‘(Expletive) Dave Samson,’ then don’t say anything at all.
So I’m not going to say anything at all.
Is my mother the greatest or what?"
- Mariners GM Bill Bavasi, after signing Ichiro to a $90 million contract
joel zumaya
a high 80’s guy when drafted, fast forward five years and he’s hitting triple digits on major league stadium radars.
It happens.
The fact is
no one really knows why his velocity went up so much. There are a number of possible contributors, but I’m still going to be holding my breath a little this spring to see if he starts throwing 95-96 again.
Hypothetically, what happens to his ceiling if he doesn't?
Yeah. Spies. They're little guys with beady eyes and long fingernails. They plant bugs that can pick up the hush of a man's heartbeat - or the whisper of a falling hair.
I think you’d have to say that if he can’t reach the mid 90s his ceiling goes down, unless his secondary stuff really comes on to compensate. This is the reason that I’ve hesitated more than some to bump him past Feliz. Holland is further along, sure, but they both have shown some level of aptitude to command their pitches (Holland more in that regard) and improve their second and third pitches in a short time (Holland is further along, but Feliz’s improvement curve is probably steaper). Holland is left-handed and that’s sweet, but Feliz has that easy gas that ain’t going anywhere unless the unspeakable happens.
by Brett Perryman on Feb 4, 2009 10:52 PM CST up reply actions
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