Newberg Trade Ideas; Add your own if you like
by rooster on May 16, 2009 9:58 AM CDT
234 comments
(1a) Harrison and Justin Smoak for Matt Cain?
(1b) For Chris Volstad?
(1c) For Josh Johnson?
(2) Harrison, Michael Main, Max Ramirez, and Jose Vallejo for Jake Peavy
This is all in the context of drawing an analogy between Matt Harrison and what Beane did with Greg Smith, a pitchability lefty with a ceiling of #3/4 who Bean flipped with Carlos Gonzales and Houston Street for Matt Holliday.
One difference, IMO, is that Harrison isn't pitching much like a pitchability guy. He's acting more like a power pitcher.
Anyway, I don't even think about (1a). I quickly do (1b) or (1c). I'm not all that excited about (2), but mostly because I've thought Peavy was overused and likely to have an early decline. He hasn't shown any decline this year, though.
Houston Street is an interesting name I haven't thought about. He has one more year until FA after this one. What's the price? One ML-ready guy and a lower-level prospect? Maybe three prospects?
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Harrison
With the way he’s pitching I would not want to trade him.
TCU are going to bust through the BCS this season.......
by Monkey Brain on May 16, 2009 10:06 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I think Harrison has more value to the Rangers than he would have in trade
On another note, I think Heath Bell is a guy that would drastically improve the pen. What would it take to get him?
Doctor please. Some more of these.
by tricer on May 16, 2009 10:08 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
heath bell is a guy they NEED to move
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Matt Harrison
Most under appreciated 23 year old lefty starter in Ranger history!
Doctor please. Some more of these.
by tricer on May 16, 2009 2:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
and he was pretty highly ranked
in a great Atlanta Braves farm system until having an injury issue. It’s not like he was a throw in piece of the trade.
by ncrangerfan on May 16, 2009 9:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
he has had injury concerns though
causing the rangers to want a throw in (Beau Jones). He has shown since being up with the rangers that he is pretty durable though.
baseBALLIN!
by kevzta on May 17, 2009 8:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bah.
Still not getting NMLR at my yahoo mail. Lucas was there this morning, but not this one…
"[Font} doesn't turn 19 until the end of May and his heater can already hit 99 on the gun. That's baseball porn." - Jason Parks
by hightowersmith on May 16, 2009 10:13 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
yup i got roadrunner and i never get his stuff anymore
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
by Jayslick on May 16, 2009 1:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Odd.
Every once in a while I hear that Hotmail “unsubscribes” its users involuntarily, but have heard no issues with Yahoo or RR.
by Jamey Newberg on May 16, 2009 1:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i know, its wierd when ATT broadband got bought out by time warner i have never gotten another email from ya since
i switched on your list, never made a difference. cant explain it
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
by Jayslick on May 16, 2009 1:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well
It just comes in later.
Sometimes dramatically, like the next day.
But this most recent one was a few hours later.
Who knows…
"[Font} doesn't turn 19 until the end of May and his heater can already hit 99 on the gun. That's baseball porn." - Jason Parks
by hightowersmith on May 16, 2009 1:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
try google
ive had no issues at all getting it there
"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it." - Mitch Hedberg
by rentz on May 16, 2009 5:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
no
Are Cain, Volstad and Johnson such an improvement over Harry that it would justify losing Smoak? The PEavy deal I woul dhave to analyze a little closer before I make a decision.
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
by RangerMad on May 16, 2009 10:14 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
i like johnson a lot…more than a LOT of ppl
but even then, i wouldnt do it for cain/volstad
and i am not that big of a fan of peavy, so no on there
johnson id think about it
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cain: I don't know. He has better stuff but hasn't been dominant as his stuff would suggest he should be.
Josh Johnson: Yes, his peripheral numbers look alot like Hallady’s
Volstad: Close to better now, expected to be better as he develops
Now that I’m letting Newberg’s trade suggestions settle in my brain, I’m becoming less excited about Harrison and Smoak for Volstad, even though I think Volstad has the higher potential. I would still do that for Josh Johnson.
Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D
by rooster on May 16, 2009 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No to Cain - he doesn't seem to be getting better
Johnson and Volstad are possibilities… Johnson looks better immediately, but Volstad has more control years and can improve (he just doesn’t quite throw enough strikes for my liking yet). Tough to say… Smoak is a lot to give up.
by Telegraph on May 16, 2009 11:10 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rick Helling, Rusty Greer, and Ruben Mateo for Roger Clemens
Discuss.
by cstorm15 on May 16, 2009 10:18 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Hard to tell from your proposal if you're
pro or con on steroids. You sound conflicted.
"Evolution happened, now get over it." Michael Shermer
by rodcarew on May 16, 2009 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Josh Johnson
I love that guy and would be willing to give up Smoak and a minor league pitcher for him, but not sure about including Harry. Wonder if McCarthy has any trade value? I’d sure rather deal him than any of our other ML starters.
Doctor please. Some more of these.
by tricer on May 16, 2009 10:21 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
id rather keep mccarthy
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 10:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i really think that if hes healthy ies a pretty solid pitcher
we will see, and yes, id move him for josh johnson bt i just really think hes going to be pretty good
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 17, 2009 8:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Johnson
He’s apparently having shoulder pain again. His injury history has been troubling the past few years. You really that willing to give up Smoak + for a guy who has struggled to stay healthy?
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 11:12 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Johnson's injury history
I thought his injury problems in the past were elbow/tommy john related?
Doctor please. Some more of these.
by tricer on May 16, 2009 12:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
They were.
The shoulder pain isn’t anything serious (so far). He’s scheduled to make his next start on Tuesday.
by LiamP on May 16, 2009 12:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The proposed Cain deal
is a short-cut and one that’s not well thought out.
Short-cuts are what got this team in trouble. See John Danks. See Chris Young (and AG 15 bombs in mid-May?).
I know we have to break up the log-jams at catcher & 1B and I’m all for it but I’m not trading any young lefts who can bring it 92-94 mph.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on May 16, 2009 10:21 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
A "shortcut."
Please, Josey. Please elaborate.
by Jamey Newberg on May 16, 2009 10:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don't understand shortcut either
but I do agree that we should hang on to Harrison. Finally he gets the message to stop nibbling and locate his fastball. I remember one stretch in 07 or 08 when it was about 1.5 yrs of no complete games by Ranger pitching. Matt has two in his last two starts.
by texasdoc on May 16, 2009 10:29 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i disagree that its a "short cut"
but his point is (i think?) that trading from a position of strength for a position of weakness is something that may or may not work out (cain/volstad are, in my eyes, a level below peavy/johnson – if we offered that deal for volstad they would do it in a heartbeat)
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 10:35 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jamey, So now you're talking to me?
21-14 does crazy things to people.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on May 16, 2009 10:40 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I guess when someone can own you in 6 words
it’s worth his time
by BuckyB on May 16, 2009 11:00 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Going to the game today
and will get back to Jamey on this.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on May 16, 2009 12:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
our definition of owned is different i guess
the first trade suggestion out of Jamey’s mouth ends up being, trade the guy who is 6 months older than every1’s beloved Dutch, is just starting to mature in the rotation, and the best hitting prospect in the best system in baseball for a guy whose stuff has never matched his results, a TJ case, a guy with 1 1/12 season before FA or chris volstad…
pardon me while i happily disagree and think those are all very risky short term solutions to age old problems this club has had and like previous cases, your giving up way to much for uncertainty.
hell only one of those guys id trade for harrison straight up right now results-wise without Smoak.
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
by Jayslick on May 16, 2009 2:02 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree that I would never make those trades
But I don’t see trading for young ML pitching studs as a “shortcut,” personally
by BuckyB on May 16, 2009 2:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Short-cut?
You’d be trading a young pitcher whose talent level is hard to define for a pitcher who is somewhere between average and good. Oh and then you’re throwing in one of the best young hitters in the minors.
That’s a short-cut and a really dumb trade proposal.
What do we know about Matt Cain?
33-44 with 3.69 ERA with half of his games in a notorious pitcher’s park and doing so in the NL. Win loss records aren’t always definitive of ability and same with ERA but it is an indicator.
Cain also has Game Scores of 50+ in 14 of his last 24 starts, doing so once again in the NL in a notorious pitcher’s park.
He’s free, when 2010 or 2011? Always a consideration for a team with a small market payroll.
What do we know about TBiA?
Lefthanders tend to do much better there.
What do we know about Tom Hicks?
Says he like young players because of their “energy” but we all know it’s because they don’t make much money. We’re on a small market payroll, Jamey. We need to grow our own pitchers and hold on to them.
What do we know about Matt Harrison?
Lefthanded and tethered to the club thru 2014.
He also has Game Scores of 50+ in 9 of his first 24 major league starts (which doesn’t include the dominant U turn of a start he had in Baltimore). Within those 9 Game Scores of 50+ , you’ll see four Game Scores between 76-83. Cain has the same amount of Game Scores between 76-83 in his last 24 starts but he’s a veteran, pitching in the NL and in one of the most notorious pitcher-friendly parks in baseball.
Harrison’s young, lefthanded, cheap and has proved that his occasional dominance is not a fluke. I’m not absolutely sure I’d trade Harrison straight up for Cain and I sure as hell wouldn’t throw in Smoak.
It’s just not a very well thought out trade proposal.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on May 17, 2009 9:57 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's your argument?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on May 17, 2009 10:42 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah.
You’ve put me in my place. Mine wasn’t a very well thought out proposal.
by Jamey Newberg on May 17, 2009 10:48 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wasn't trying to put you in your place.
You asked why I thought the deal was a short-cut.
I told you why very plainly and thought the trade wasn’t very well thought out.
I really held back on my strongest language….jeeeeeeez, you’re throwing Smoak in the deal?!?!?!?
Thoughts like that happen to the best of us, Jamey, so don’t take it personally.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on May 17, 2009 10:55 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Matt Cain
scares me. While he’ll be an upgrade over Harrison giving up Smoak in a Cain deal is just not good. Save Smoak for Doc or Johnson.
Jeff Zimmerman for President.
by AirJordan on May 16, 2009 10:38 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
johnson?
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 10:39 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'll give up Smoak for him. Worth the risk
Just gotta stay healthy. Could have a little Rich Harden situation on our hands. Harden has been pretty healthy since going to the Cubbies. Maybe a change of scenery is all you need to stay healthy. Hah
Jeff Zimmerman for President.
by AirJordan on May 16, 2009 10:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i would LOVE to see them get harden
LOVE it
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 3:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Chris Young hasn't been very good the past two years
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 11:13 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Young
He’s quite effective at PetCo but utterly worthless everywhere else.
"Was this really necsarry?" - cowpoke/hurler hurley
by trza on May 16, 2009 11:30 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
has there been a pitcher in the last 10 years
that has had more help from his home park/team than chris young?
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 3:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
and any hitter
that had less help than Adrian Gonzalez? He’s been consistently 150 or so OPS better on the road.
"I'd praised catcher Max Ramirez two weeks ago, but after his continued struggles I'm increasingly convinced he's not going to pan out." - crops.mlblogs.com
by DJCahill on May 17, 2009 9:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hammy’s former-addict question marks sure makes me want to keep Smoak as insurance against a possible future Hammy health collapse.
Is it possible that the lack of WOW from Golson and Borbon coupled with Boggs’ gimpiness forces the Rangers to consider re-signing Byrd?
Sigh ... we are sooo gonna suck again next season.
Rangers Farm Probables
Rangers Video Highlights
by shroomer on May 16, 2009 10:30 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I hope we do keep
Byrd. He has earned it. I like the swagger he gives our team i.e. “Lackey needing to bring his A game”
by texasdoc on May 16, 2009 10:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
byrd is good
but i dont see the rangers going into next year with boggs, golson, byrd, hamilton, cruz, borbon, murphy next year all being mostly ready
i do like having him a lot
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 10:36 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
or is it possible
that the Rangers simply keep Hamilton in CF for the next few years until we find someone ideal for that spot.
by Goyogringo on May 16, 2009 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Byrd
What do you think Elias status is this offseason? Is he Type A yet?
"[Font} doesn't turn 19 until the end of May and his heater can already hit 99 on the gun. That's baseball porn." - Jason Parks
by hightowersmith on May 16, 2009 2:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i bet he ends up pretty close
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
McCarthy, Vallejo, Beavan, Clark Murphy
for any of those guys. Though I like Volstad and Cain more than Peavy or Cain.
by Hull Fan on May 16, 2009 10:33 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
what do you think of johnson
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 10:36 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rather have him
than any other on the list.
by texasdoc on May 16, 2009 10:38 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
same here
eom
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 10:40 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Doesn't he have past injury issues?
I’ve heard some people are really worried about his shoulder. If his arm isn’t going to fall off then I have no problem with him either.
by Hull Fan on May 16, 2009 10:42 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
McCarthy and Clark Murphy...
…have almost no trade value right now.
You are basically offering Beavan and Vallejo. That’s not going to get it done.
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 11:14 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd offer MaxRam but
don’t SF and Florida have other catcher options? I just meant I’d move a lot of guys before Harrison. And yes McCarthy doesn’t have a ton of value but if he can show to be healthy this season then his value goes up this off season which is when he’d be moved at the earliest.
by Hull Fan on May 16, 2009 11:20 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Florida doesn't
San Fran could put Max at 1B, I guess.
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
sandoval
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 3:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
he plays 3b
Doctor please. Some more of these.
by tricer on May 16, 2009 3:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
most people
think he ends up at 1b
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 3:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
play is a loose term
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
by Jayslick on May 16, 2009 4:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I could see San Diego targeting a guy like McCarthy
A fly ball pitcher who gives up alot of HR’s in our park, could find the same success Young has in Petco.
by tyd3311 on May 16, 2009 12:02 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
now all they have to do is have anything remotely valuable to trade for him
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
by Jayslick on May 16, 2009 2:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Heath Bell
would make quite an impact on our pen.
Doctor please. Some more of these.
by tricer on May 16, 2009 2:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
if mccarthy gets his value that high
he would have more impact on our team
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 3:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lots of teams are looking for bullpen arms
The Padres will get a lot for Heath Bell when they move him.
Maybe we can offer David Murphy, Kason Gabbard, and Engel Beltre.
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
By Kason Gabbard do you mean Darren O'Day?
HE’s the closest thing to a Gabbard we have.
by tyd3311 on May 16, 2009 3:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I take it you wouldn't do Beltre/Murphy for Bell?
Assuming that the team was looking strong, I’d sure consider that. If they would rather have Borbon than Beltre, I’d probably do that as well.
Doctor please. Some more of these.
by tricer on May 16, 2009 5:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
My initial reaction is that I'd do that
I’d have to think about it and look at the numbers and contract status and all that, though.
I was just making a joke. I think it would take more than Beltre and Murphy to get Bell.
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 8:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bell has 2 arb seasons left
So we’d have him for 2010 and 2011.
His gb/fb ratio consistently hovers a little over 1. Around 9 k/9 and 3 bb/9 over his career, but so far this year both those rates have improved dramatically – to 10.93 and 1.93. Almost exclusively mid 90s FB and low 80s slider.
What would you guess that it would take to land him?
Doctor please. Some more of these.
by tricer on May 16, 2009 8:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
this team would be foolish
to not trade Murphy and Beltre for Bell. But the Padres are the sort of team who would value a guy like Beltre.
If we could have Bell for that long, the Padres might bite on Murphy and Vallejo, though.
What is this, Horseville? Because I'm surrounded by naysayers.
by clark on May 17, 2009 9:38 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
there will be lots of suitors
Bell will probably be one of the most sought after deadline acquisitions, so I think the price might be higher than Murphy and Vallejo.
I don’t know much about what the Padres would want, but 1b is really the only position that they appear to be pretty strong at with AG and Blanks both limited to that position.
A rangey CF fly catcher would seem to be a pretty big priority for them, so Borbon might strike their fancy. Also seems like they need a catcher, too bad Max’s value is probably waning right now. Lemon is a guy that would make sense for them as well, but I’m not sure if the Pads are a team that would value him appropriately.
I guess the good news is, if we want Bell, which we should, and if he is on the market, which he should be, then we can get him. We have the firepower to outbid everyone else.
Doctor please. Some more of these.
by tricer on May 17, 2009 9:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lemon
He’s the type of player Grady Fuson loves…gym rat-type, great baseball instincts, despite being not the most physically gifted.
I wouldn’t be surprised if that’s a player they would target as a throw-in on a deal.
by Adam J. Morris on May 17, 2009 10:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Do you think...
2 of the 3 of Murphy/Lemon/TT would be enough to get Bell?
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
by slc ranger on May 17, 2009 10:46 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think for Bell...
…the Padres would want something like Borbon, Beltre, and Lemon.
by Adam J. Morris on May 17, 2009 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow...
pass then.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
by slc ranger on May 17, 2009 10:54 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
As a point of comparison...
…that’s not that much more than what the Rangers got for a half season of Gagne.
Borbon > Murphy, of course.
Beltre is Beltre, and his value is probably similar to what it was then, if not a little lower.
Lemon is probably similar in value to Gabbard.
San Diego is getting a limited ceiling guy who can help immediately, an interesting fringy prospect with a low ceiling but a high likelihood of being able to contribute something at the major league level, even if just in a bench role, and the high-BYITA potential guy in Beltre.
by Adam J. Morris on May 17, 2009 11:06 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
True...
but I just think that’s too much for Bell. He doesn’t have the track record Gagne had (although I understand Gagne wasn’t what he was with LA, he seemed to have found himself again in Texas). Relief pitchers could have a good season or two and then regress pretty fast. With Bell’s age that could be what we will see from him.
My biggest problem with that would be including Borbon. I think the Rangers need to hold onto him and give him a shot in CF starting next year.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
by slc ranger on May 17, 2009 11:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1
and isn’t Bell like 31?
Go Rangers...don't suck...
by Kinslerhomer on May 17, 2009 10:55 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
it's funny
i usually get pretty hyped up about trade talk, but right now i am pretty content with simply seeing how this team continues to develop this year. I could see them trying to package some players who will represent difficult 40 man roster decisions at year’s end for a lesser piece (like a reliever) but I think any rotation upgrades this year will come in the form of Holland, Feliz, or Sheets.
What is this, Horseville? Because I'm surrounded by naysayers.
by clark on May 16, 2009 10:41 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I like trade talks only in the off-season, or when the team is 10 games below .500
by Telegraph on May 16, 2009 10:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i still worry a little
about JD as a buyer. I know that is a little irrational, but he has proved wildly successful at maximizing value as a seller, and marginally successful as being a discount buyer, but his marquee buyer moves have previously gone to shit.
What is this, Horseville? Because I'm surrounded by naysayers.
by clark on May 16, 2009 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd say that Carlos Lee trade
was his 2nd best trade as a GM
by BuckyB on May 16, 2009 11:02 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I hope that
since his experiences as a major seller (most notably the 2007 deadline) have come since he last was a big buyer, he has learned enough about the seller side of the negotiations to make him more successful on the selling side.
by Brett Perryman on May 16, 2009 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
next to last word should be “buying”
by Brett Perryman on May 16, 2009 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You do realize that you can't play two 1B and 3 C's at the same time
now, Telegraph?
Making trades when your team is playing well is a good thing and good deadline deals are a nice barometer for just how good your GM is.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on May 16, 2009 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I still hope
he finds a way to deal one of these catchers for a young pitcher. That is the only area of depth that really needs to be addressed.
What is this, Horseville? Because I'm surrounded by naysayers.
by clark on May 16, 2009 10:48 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is how I'm starting to feel as well.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
by slc ranger on May 16, 2009 10:58 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You can play two 1B
when you need a DH. There is nothing wrong with playing someone who can play 1B at DH every day, when the bats are excellent.
by Brett Perryman on May 16, 2009 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
man
id rather not trade anyone right now. maybe a lower level prospect for some 7th/8th inning bullpen help. other than that, id rather not mess with anything.
by kumizi on May 16, 2009 10:49 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
I think they should see how things play out rather than make a big move. Bring in 1-2 relievers, maybe an 8th inning guy and a veteran loogy who is not as old as the veteran loogy they have. The window of contention is just now opening, there is no need to get impatient and force a deal.
by pblack on May 16, 2009 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The last thing I'd want to do...
…is give up something of value for a veteran LOOGY.
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 1:45 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
is Arias "something of value"?
giving up a combo of Arias and MadDog for a good vet reliever from a team out of it doesnt seem way out there and id hardly call that “something of value”
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
by Jayslick on May 16, 2009 2:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think maddog is part
of the ‘core’ going forward. I don’t think he get’s moved.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
by Rodney on May 16, 2009 3:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would not trade Arias and Madrigal for a veteran LOOGY
If we decided Eddie was worthless and A.J. Murray can’t help, and we could get Brian Shouse for Arias, that would be fine.
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 3:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
not for a vet loogy your right, but actual legit bp help?
im thinking more of a solid setup guy who can take some pressure off the pen, if your just looking for some depth for competing this season, i think you can get it for spare parts and it would help.
if i could do one thing to help this club win a few more games and not give up much to get it, id say adding a guy good bp arm would probably cost the least and fill a team need the most.
we’re on the same page, i just hope maybe we can give up some guys we dont really need. the arias’s and murph’s of the org in a package to a really turd-laden org. and get a better arm than a shouse, but honestly, id take jamie wright back right now. as bad as he was towards the end of the season i think on this club, without the workload he got last season, a guy like that would be a true asset
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
by Jayslick on May 16, 2009 3:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think a solid setup guy...
…is going to cost more than Arias + Madrigal.
This is sort of like the rotation situation…I’m not interested in trading for a LAIE or a middling middle reliever, unless you are getting them for basically nothing.
I’d be interested in Heath Bell, but he’s going to be expensive. I’d love to get Juan Cruz away from the Royals, but he’s going to be expensive.
Really, I would bet that our key setup reliever come August/September — if we are in a playoff race — is going to be Neftali.
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 3:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
set up reliever
I agree that Feliz will likely contribute in that role. I also think that Tommy Hunter could figure in there.
Doctor please. Some more of these.
by tricer on May 16, 2009 5:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don't trade Smoak
Especially if it costs Harrison, too
by BuckyB on May 16, 2009 11:03 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Only would be worth an unquestionably elite pitcher
by BuckyB on May 16, 2009 11:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
im not sold on that at all
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
by Jayslick on May 16, 2009 2:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd been thinking the past week or two...
…how you aren’t going into 2010 with Harrison, Feldman, and McCarthy all in the rotation.
Now, if McCarthy doesn’t get it straightened out this year, you maybe non-tender him and it alleviates some of the issues.
But you are probably going to have Millwood back next year. You are probably going to look to add a Sheets as a free agent or someone like Peavy via trade.
You are pencilling Derek Holland into the rotation next year, and you would hope to have Feliz knocking at the door.
All of the sudden, you’re looking at a Millwood/Sheets/Holland/Feliz rotation, and only one slot available for someone like Harrison, Feldman and McCarthy, nevermind Eric Hurley or Tommy Hunter or any of the other arms in the minors right now or any other guy you might target.
It made me wonder if the most value that Harrison or, in particular, Feldman might offer is as a proven young starter to offer as part of a trade for a legit TORP. Part of a Peavy package, maybe…Harrison or Feldman, Vallejo, Cruz and Beltre for Peavy, perhaps? Wouldn’t that be a hard deal for the Padres to turn down?
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 11:11 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
That's too much
San Diego can hold on to Peavy if they want but throwing them the sun and the moon seems self defeating. Volstad or Cain should be cheaper than that asking price. Just like I think offering a lot for Oswalt would be a huge mistake.
Texas can live without that kind of deal. What the heck are Peavy and San Diego going to do? Will they continue with this shotgun wedding of suckitude forever? They’ve got to rebuild and eventually Peavy is going to get tired of losing there. I don’t know that he’ll accept Texas but if he would I still wouldn’t give a king’s ransom to them for him.
by Hull Fan on May 16, 2009 11:26 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cain
He’s not a top of the rotation guy. I’m not convinced Volstad is, either.
Peavy is. I’d rather overpay to get a legit TORP than give up a more middling package for another Millwood.
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 11:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Peavy
I am not the biggest Peavy fan, but I would do that trade. I really do not think that is a lot for us to give up. Good value for the Padres and we get a #1 or 2. What is Peavy’s contract situation? I think if the Rangers keep winning then he’ll waive the no trade.
by peachygbc_1 on May 17, 2009 3:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Valid points.
Sometimes, you just hate giving up the guys you root so hard for. For a bonafide TORG, I guess you do it.
Heh, potential pitching logjam & Texas Rangers…who woulda ever thunk it???
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
by Rodney on May 16, 2009 11:35 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think you may be
a bit optimistic on Feliz. I can see him getting the Holland treatment next year. The rotation next year is probably shaping up to be MIllwood, Sheets or ?, Harrison, Holland, ?
Next year is BMac’s second arb year. He is only making $650K this year. Will he get much more than $1M next year. I can’t see them not offering him arb. At the worse they put him in the bullpen.
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
by RangerMad on May 16, 2009 11:36 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Feliz
Unless he gets hurt or tanks, he’ll be up by August.
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 11:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
At the very latest
I think we’ll see Feliz as soon as he strings together 4-5 appearances like his last one. Could be as soon as mid June.
Doctor please. Some more of these.
by tricer on May 17, 2009 9:16 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Couple thoughts
JD isn’t cutting line on McCarthy, not never. The analogy is a family who’s upside down on their house deciding to sell. Daniels will give McCarthy every bleeding last chance to succeed, the same way that family waits for the market to catch up with their mortgage.
And by the way, does McCarthy have options? The Red Sox model of stashing legit starters in AAA starts to make sense for this team (viz., Hurley, Hunter, even Kiker).
That is, unless you want to package one for a, as you put it Adam, better-than-Millwood, genuine TORP.
But for one TORPs neither Feldman nor Harrison will suffice in the outgoing package. It’d have to be one of Holland or Feliz, or maybe Perez if he keeps coming. That’s the nature of this farm system…people will hold off until JD puts one of them on the table.
"[Font} doesn't turn 19 until the end of May and his heater can already hit 99 on the gun. That's baseball porn." - Jason Parks
by hightowersmith on May 16, 2009 2:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
you make a valid point
but any decent rotation needs to be seven deep with viable starters. If the extra two are stored in AAA ball or the bullpen, it doesn’t matter. But I am far from the mentality that we have pitching to deal. I hate to say it, but I really hate the idea of trading Harrison right now, unless it is for exactly the right guy. Outside of a guy like Roy Halladay, I’m not sure who I really covet right now.
What is this, Horseville? Because I'm surrounded by naysayers.
by clark on May 16, 2009 5:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well
I figure Hurley, Hunter and Kiker are going to be in AAA to start next season are viable starters.
If you have Millwood, Mystery TORP, Holland, and Feliz, you’ve got McCarthy/Feldman/Harrison for one slot, and I don’t see that it makes a ton of sense to have Feldman and McCarthy out in AAA waiting for an injury.
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 8:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree...
that perhaps Harrison’s greatest value to this team is for him to keep pitching great and have the Rangers sell high at the trade deadline for a top-end player. But, if you’re going to offer Harrison, Vallejo, Cruz and Beltre in a trade, I’d much rather ask Toronto first what they’d be willing to accept to part ways with Halladay first. That’s a lot of talent to offer for Peavy. If you’re going to give away our best young pitcher, best 2B prospect, our clean up hitter and our highest ceiling OF prospect, you might as well throw in another piece and bring back the best pitcher in the league.
by texaschief on May 17, 2009 2:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Halladay
He’s under control for less time than Peavy, which is why I’d rather target Peavy than Halladay.
by Adam J. Morris on May 17, 2009 8:36 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
But Halladay is better and doesn't have the same arm concerns (at least if he does they're not as public).
The only real reason you’d target Peavy over Halladay is the fact that Peavy might actually be on the market, whereas Halladay just isn’t. He’s going nowhere.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
You want the mustache on or off? ... ... ... Too bad.
by thedirkatron on May 17, 2009 5:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
sorry but isn't the goal to ADD to our sp staff?
Trade for another starter to go with our 3 (entrenched and most successful starters) right now. Harrison/Padilla/Millwood are all flashing success. Trade what you can, but don’t give up any major league pitching (a la, Feliz, Holland) and I’d be hard pressed to give up on Main. Do you trade Smoak? Perhaps. But why not just go with the plan, to know what our strength and weaknesses are?
by rangersfan32 on May 16, 2009 12:04 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Because...
…if you trade for another starter to go with Millwood, Padilla and Harrison, you’ve got one slot for Harrison, McCarthy, Feldman, Holland, and Feliz.
There’s no point in saying don’t give up Holland or Feliz if you also aren’t going to give up any of the starters also in the rotation right now.
And why would you be more willing to part with Smoak than Main?
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 12:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Padilla is gone next season, Bmac is a walking MASH unit, Feldman has been dealing for all of 4 starts
and you talking how we are log jammed long-term in the rotation long term?
where do i buy that high class lawyer smoke you been vape’n, bro?
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
by Jayslick on May 16, 2009 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
proof-reading is your friend
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
by Jayslick on May 16, 2009 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gawd, another stupid link to lonestarball.com.
Oh, wait….
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
by Rodney on May 16, 2009 3:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd like to see us move this package
to the Giants. Chris Davis, Engel Beltre, and Jose Vallejo for Madison Bumgarner.
"Evolution happened, now get over it." Michael Shermer
by rodcarew on May 16, 2009 12:05 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
the only way to get madison bumgardner is to first make a move for juan pierre, dont you know?
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 3:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jon Lester. Dice K. Clay killing in the minors. Bowden. Smoltz and Penny
Bard is closer material, maybe Papelbon makes the leap to the rotation next year. Beckett has struggled.
Let’s go after Beckett.
Would Boston be more willing to talk Beckett than Buchholz?
Blalock, Teagarden, Lemon or Arias, Beltre, and one of Font, Perez, Boscan, Main, Beavan, etc…
by tyd3311 on May 16, 2009 12:10 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Why would Boston do this?
I’m not even sure if the Rangers would do this. Beckett’s FB command has completely disappeared and he’s a FA after 2010 (with a 12mm club option for 2010).
by LiamP on May 16, 2009 12:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If you're Jon Daniels and you're confident Beckett will be okay
Then Boston gets their catcher. A short term DH option since Papi is done. Lemon being in the deal would depend on whether they like him or not, but they’re struggling at SS. We know they like Beltre.
Theoretically, If Beckett were available, what would you give up?
by tyd3311 on May 16, 2009 12:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Still don't understand.
This is a perennially contending team with a smart front office…they don’t make trades like this. Why would they sell so low on Beckett when their rotation is already looking shaky? Lester/Penny have been awful (although in Lester’s case, some peripherals point to him being fairly unlucky so far) and Dice-K was terrible before he got shut down. Smoltz isn’t back for a while and even when he does return, who knows how much he has left at 42? Buchholz has always dominated the minors, so there’s nothing new there…They don’t have the embarrassment of riches at SP right now that people think they do.
by LiamP on May 16, 2009 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dice K getting back and pitching well would be key in this
Then if the FO felt the dropoff from Beckett to Buchholz isn’t significant at this point, why not trade him and get 5 players that can help the organization?
by tyd3311 on May 16, 2009 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Love the guy
Beckett was the epitome of the word ace in the 07 playoffs. Caveat emptor on him now though. The Beckett I have seen in 09 is not that guy.
by texasdoc on May 16, 2009 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
PLEASE!!!
Do not trade Smoak, for anything!
Stop caring about the color of your glove and focus on your pitching.
by Texasportsfan on May 16, 2009 12:22 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
The talk of trading Smoak this year reminds me of the talk of trading Andrus last year. Since everyone saw an apparent surplus at SS they were in a hurry to toss him in on any trade. Just because CD is at first doesn’t mean Smoak is surplus. IMO he should be untouchable.
by pblack on May 16, 2009 1:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ummm...
The talk of trading Smoak this year reminds me of the talk of trading Andrus last year. Since everyone saw an apparent surplus at SS they were in a hurry to toss him in on any trade.
What?
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
CMon, You Know, The SSurplus
That surplus was, well, one guy. And that guy was Andrus. But who’s counting.
by atlantaranger on May 16, 2009 1:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
EG
He suggested trading Andrus, this past offseason I believe.
Silly idea from the day we acquired the player.
"[Font} doesn't turn 19 until the end of May and his heater can already hit 99 on the gun. That's baseball porn." - Jason Parks
by hightowersmith on May 16, 2009 2:02 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Andrus
I specifically remember lots of people saying we should trade Andrus b/c he was blocked by Young and therefore he should be used to upgrade the pitching. Have you forgotten this? I would think not since you argued against it.
by pblack on May 16, 2009 2:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't believe...
…that there were many people arguing that we needed to trade Andrus because he was being blocked by Young.
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 2:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i remember plenty of folks who
figured he was more hype than substance and we would be best to move him before it killed his value
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
by Jayslick on May 16, 2009 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
there were lots of ppl who said that
i do remember that
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 3:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
People
There were enough for you and Jamey to both comment on it. I’m not going to go digging through the links, but Jayslick is right, there were quite a few who thought he would never hit or that he should be flipped for pitching because the FO would never move Young. That’s all I’m saying.
by pblack on May 16, 2009 3:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would really worry about Cain in Arlington and the AL
What does a 1.36 WHIP in SF turn into, what do his HR numbers turn into, and what does that do to his baseline? I think that he’s a lot like guys like Penny and Pavano early in their careers, where he has good stuff and looks like a borderline frontline guy in a really good environment, but would be exposed as decent but not great in a bad one.
I’m surprised that Volstad has performed as well as he has, but given what the Marlins typically do and the fact that they likely know exactly what they have there, I think that you would have to overpay well beyond what he’s worth, whatever that is, to get him. And that’s in marquee players, not just pure quantity.
With Johnson, you’re talking about more service time there, so maybe you’ll be more limited by competition once they’re ready to move him. I’d be pretty interested in getting in on that, but I don’t think that I’m interested in including Smoak for this kind of player. I think I’d be in on him, just with a different package.
by Brett Perryman on May 16, 2009 1:03 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Agree on Cain
I like him, but don’t think is TORP here in AL Arlington.
by texasdoc on May 16, 2009 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Since we are on the topic
of our starting rotation..if Padilla finishes the season as he has started it do you give him the 12 M option year?
by texasdoc on May 16, 2009 1:13 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
no
A better option would be to decline his option and arbitration. Then try to resign him on a 1 yr deal for less once the market gets determined.
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
by RangerMad on May 16, 2009 1:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why would he decline arb if he keeps pitching like this?
Not very likely he’d get a pay cut from the arbitrator if he plays out the season like he has already, and unless the Yankees are calling he’d accept
by Keynes on May 16, 2009 1:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I meant the team
should decline his option and decline to offer him arbitration.
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
by RangerMad on May 16, 2009 1:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Makes the most sense to let him walk to clear space, right?
Yeah, he’s been great the last two starts, but he’s also been extremely mediocre in several others…
Seems like there’s almost no sense in bringing him back next year, at any cost, given you’ve got several options internally with Feldman/Harrison/McCarthy/Holland and the several trade/FA options that can give you about the same production, likely at a fraction of the cost…
by N41D on May 16, 2009 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Haven't you said
that next year’s rotation will include Sheets or a FA/trade acquisition? A lot can happen between now and next Jan.
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
by RangerMad on May 16, 2009 1:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If he is the Padilla
of the last two years, then I let him walk. On paper, we figured to get good years in 09 out of Millwood and Padilla given their contract status. If he continues even in the neighborhood of the last few starts, then he is a tough pitcher to replace. I figured the tenor of the response to be a solid “no”, and all factors considered I would say no at this point. But if we stay in the race and Padilla helps to lead the charge, I may feel otherwise.
by texasdoc on May 16, 2009 2:02 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe
It depends on how he finishes and how our other starters finish this year. Fortunately, we don’t have to make that call until after the season.
by northtexan95 on May 16, 2009 1:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
A few weeks ago
I would have done thw deal for Volstad, Johnson, or Cain instantly. Now, I’d pass on all 3 the way Harrison’s pitching.
my sig is better than yours
by hinduplaya on May 16, 2009 1:21 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
But will he continue?
Who knows.
I'm just goofin' new boot goofin'
by iorange555 on May 16, 2009 1:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If he continues
to locate his fastball he will be a solid middle of rotation pitcher. And a lefty which is vastly preferable in our park.
by texasdoc on May 16, 2009 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
My first reaction to Jamey’s proposal was – since he’s figured out how to get righties out [FB low and inside under their hands] why would you wanna get rid of him? He kills lefties and now he’s figured out righties – let’s ride with this guy and see what’s what.
Sigh ... we are sooo gonna suck again next season.
Rangers Farm Probables
Rangers Video Highlights
by shroomer on May 16, 2009 2:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
For the first time
this century it feels like we are holding all the cards. Let’s sit back and let the game come to us. If you can’t spot the sucker at the poker table, then the sucker is you. Every other team in the league knows we are sitting on a gold mine and that pitching is the cost of trading with us.
by texasdoc on May 16, 2009 2:14 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Totally agree.
"[Font} doesn't turn 19 until the end of May and his heater can already hit 99 on the gun. That's baseball porn." - Jason Parks
by hightowersmith on May 16, 2009 2:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If there is one pattern that Harrison has established as a major leaguer
it’s that you can expect him to pitch well for a period of time and then poorly for a period of time. Hopefully he’ll continue to swing that more in the ‘pitching well’ direction with more experience, but so far, though this has been an excellent streak, it still fits in his MLB pattern.
by Brett Perryman on May 16, 2009 4:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
OT. Game delayed until at least 4 p.m.
Go Rangers...don't suck...
by Kinslerhomer on May 16, 2009 1:41 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Ben Sheets...
That’s the answer, what do I win?
Sign Ben Sheets for 2-3 years, and keep Smoak, Harrison, Main, Beavan, Salty, et al.
by Topgun22 on May 16, 2009 2:29 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I say we sign Bedard while we're at it
but I have a horrible gauge on what people go for on open markets
by BuckyB on May 16, 2009 2:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
bedard will get waaaaaaaay too much money in FA imho
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 3:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
yea this
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 3:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wet Dream Scenario
Sawks have Pappi never get goin and he retires or is out for the seasonish. Tek struggles and we can do something like blalock and TT plus some low A arm and nab buchh just b/c they really need a bat and they need a catcher for the future and they risk sliding out of the ALeast and are forced to pull the trigger.
That with a combo of a Posada blow out and we are in position to really be in a drivers seat and both those catching situations are duct tape and bailing wire, they just dont know it yet.
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
by Jayslick on May 16, 2009 3:00 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Except Blalock isn't much of a hitter
Not enough of one to justify moving Buchholz.
They can ride it out with Baldelli, or kick the tires on Matt Holliday when the A’s decide to move him, or see about getting a middling lefty bat like Dellucci or Cat or Matt Stairs or someone.
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 3:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
blalock > stairs/dellucci/catt
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 3:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sure
But not enough to warrant giving up a guy viewed as a potential legit #1 starter.
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 3:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Precisely.
If Boston does decide to go get a hitter, it’s not like we’re the only team they can deal with.
There are plenty of other options out there, many of which would cost you a lot less than Clay Buchholz.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
You want the mustache on or off? ... ... ... Too bad.
by thedirkatron on May 16, 2009 3:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
hey i dont think they should (the improvement isnt THAT much)
im just saying hes better
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 3:45 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
True. I thought you were the one who originally proposed the wet dream scenario.
I was more responding to that.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
You want the mustache on or off? ... ... ... Too bad.
by thedirkatron on May 16, 2009 3:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Have you watched Josh Beckett pitch so far this year?
He’s a shadow of his former self.
by LiamP on May 16, 2009 10:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
As an example of how bad his FB command has gotten...
He’s managed to walk Yuniesky Betancourt TWICE so far tonight, and it’s the 4th inning.
by LiamP on May 16, 2009 10:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Holliday has been worse than Hank though,
Cat is terrible, I like the Lucc but really to replace Pappi’s power? nope. Stairs? not really. You get Dave Magadan (sp?) to Hammer the Hammer on using the field (the anti Rudy) and the dude could be a real badass still.
i get what your saying though and would think hank is more of a throw in need to help move a deal along than a key piece of a puzzle, but i see other teams with real needs like hank who i think most of us are just sick of his approach and he doesnt really have a major place with the club anymore
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
by Jayslick on May 16, 2009 3:31 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Rudy and Blalock
Rudy is actually big on going the other way…you look at the guys who are the huge Rudy disciples, and they are going that use the whole field.
Blalock is better than Cat, Dellucci, et al, but he’s not likely to be better the rest of the season than Holliday, and there are other low-OBP power hitters out there than the BoSox could go after.
I think they’d be more likely to pursue Scott Hairston, for example, who is a nice DH option who is a better hitter than Blalock and would cost significantly less than Buchholz.
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 3:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
fwiw
hairston hammers lefties i believe but they have now started palying him vs righties
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 3:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Martin Perez, Joaquin Arias and Omar Poveda.
for Cliff Lee.
Or something like that anyhow. They might want something a little more.
Cliff Lee is the guy to target. Peavy’s not coming here. Buchholz, Johnson, Nolasco, Volstad, Cain, etc…. those guys aren’t getting traded. Neither is Cliff Lee, probably. But at leas there’s a shot.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
You want the mustache on or off? ... ... ... Too bad.
by thedirkatron on May 16, 2009 3:33 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Cleveland doesn't make that deal
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 3:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yah, I probably overrate Perez, at least as compared to how much Cleveland would value him as the key guy back in a Lee deal.
I was viewing him as a top 20 overall prospect comparable to what Laporta was in the CC deal, but I suppose most don’t view him as such and Laport’as proximity made him a much more attractive trade target anyhow.
What would do it?
Smoak, Font and Vallejo?
Perez, Kiker, Arias and David Murphy?
The 40 Trumps All!!!
You want the mustache on or off? ... ... ... Too bad.
by thedirkatron on May 16, 2009 3:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Perez is highly regarded
But they are going to want something more than a high-ceiling low-A pitcher and a couple of throw-ins for Lee.
Replace Arias with Kiker and they are probably very interested.
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 3:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Would you do Perez, Kiker, Madrigal and, say, Vallejo for Cliff Lee if Cleveland offered it today?
Keep in mind he’s got a reasonable 9mm option for ‘10 and has spoken publicly about how he’d love to get extended in Cleveland so he could theoretically be amenable to an extension here if he works out. At the very least that shows he doesn’t have a Tex-like obsession with FA.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
You want the mustache on or off? ... ... ... Too bad.
by thedirkatron on May 16, 2009 3:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
what about for lee/tony sipp (or other BP arm?)
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 17, 2009 8:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Por que?
The 40 Trumps All!!!
You want the mustache on or off? ... ... ... Too bad.
by thedirkatron on May 18, 2009 1:06 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I know I
wouldn’t want to use a big pitching chip like Perez for a 1.5 year rent a pitcher, unless the extension is part of the deal. The fact that he is in his 30s, and has had one monster year doesn’t help.
It would be easier for me to part with a Smoak or a Davis.
"I'd praised catcher Max Ramirez two weeks ago, but after his continued struggles I'm increasingly convinced he's not going to pan out." - crops.mlblogs.com
by DJCahill on May 18, 2009 6:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cleveland doesn't make that deal?
They took less for CC.
Cliff Lee has an extra year.
But he’s lesser than CC, and has verrrrry fishy FB/HR tendencies.
Anyway, it might take one more second-tier prospect, at least to substitute for Omar.
Come to think of it, ’tron’s package here reminds me of what Beane got for Haren.
"[Font} doesn't turn 19 until the end of May and his heater can already hit 99 on the gun. That's baseball porn." - Jason Parks
by hightowersmith on May 16, 2009 5:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
the package they got for CC was much better than what Tron proposed above
LaPorta had more value than that group combined.
Doctor please. Some more of these.
by tricer on May 16, 2009 5:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
By the end of the year I think M-Per will be a top 15 or 20 overall ML prospect.
But you’re right that Laporta was a top 10 overall guy at the time he was dealt, and was much closer to the bigs which matters in terms of trade value.
I was actually trying to mirror the CC deal with a 1 really good prospect + some meh filler deal.
But I guess M-Per doesn’t have the same value Laporta did last year.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
You want the mustache on or off? ... ... ... Too bad.
by thedirkatron on May 17, 2009 3:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
In terms of closeness to the bigs
…yeah, Laporta is better.
Might be early to say Perez has TORP ceiling.
But he’s doing everything asked of him, and might see a promo this year. With his across the board improvements so far, you have to wonder…
And a strikeout lefty TORP is more valuable than a power-hitting outfielder.
"[Font} doesn't turn 19 until the end of May and his heater can already hit 99 on the gun. That's baseball porn." - Jason Parks
by hightowersmith on May 17, 2009 8:06 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Let's go Max!
Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D
by rooster on May 17, 2009 9:21 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, I don't think they took less for C.C.
I think Matt LaPorta at the time is a more highly regarded package than the three guys that are being offered there.
by Adam J. Morris on May 16, 2009 8:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
not enough
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
Scout to KG: On Sandoval: "Man, that fat [expletive]-er can hit."
by knockoutking on May 16, 2009 3:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Engle Beltre for Juan Cruz?
That's why they call them business sox
by egriffey on May 16, 2009 11:00 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
If I'm the Rangers
I’m not trading Smoak, period. Well, unless Sabean goes on another LSD trip and calls to offer us Tim Lincecum or something. But other than that? Nuh-uh. We trade him we’ll be looking at A-Gon part duex while we complain how Davis can’t get on base in between bopping homers.
The guy I’d be interested in looking at this year would be Ricky Nolasco. The results so far this year in FLA have been pretty horrible but his K/BB rates are still pretty much intact and his BABIP is a whopping .387. It’d probably still take a big package to make a run at him, but I’d bet the Marlins would trade him before Josh Johnson at this point. I wouldn’t trade Smoak for him, but maybe Perez/Teagarden + something else would get their attention.
"Hi, I’m a fucking horsefaced moron." - John Lackey to Ian Kinsler, 5/16/09
"That start was like somebody on a deathbed suddenly jumping up and doing the Lindy Hop, then speeding away on a pogo stick while playing the fiddle." - Telegraph
by lonestarJon on May 17, 2009 2:45 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I love Smoak, but I'd rather trade him than M-Per.
Perez is so freaking awesome.
So, so awesome.
Smoak is great, but Perez is just so dreamy. Dominating in the SAL league (sub-1 WHIP, 10+ k/9) as a kid who turned 18 right before the season started? Good freaking god that’s boner inducing.
And I don’t give a crap about people complaining about Davis. The kid’ll be fine. He’s really good.
I’d obviously rather not trade either, but if you put a gun to my head I’d probably choose to let go of Smoak.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
You want the mustache on or off? ... ... ... Too bad.
by thedirkatron on May 17, 2009 4:40 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Any particular reason?
I mean about Smoak vs. Davis.
I totally get not wanting to trade Perez.
"Hi, I’m a fucking horsefaced moron." - John Lackey to Ian Kinsler, 5/16/09
"That start was like somebody on a deathbed suddenly jumping up and doing the Lindy Hop, then speeding away on a pogo stick while playing the fiddle." - Telegraph
by lonestarJon on May 17, 2009 7:31 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
General trading strategy for us
should be to do and not do several things: Keep the left handed starters. They have an advantage in TBiA. Look for top of the rotation type of guys. A team is not a championship team with a bunch of 3,4 and 5 guys. Keep the defense strong. Deal from a position of strength. We are deep at 1st base, catcher and the middle infield. I don’t agree that we are deep in center field talent since Hamilton will have to move soon and Borbon/Beltre haven’t proved a whole lot yet. I don’t think adding a late inning setup guy is totally necessary either. Feliz should be able to help us in that role before the season is over.
"Evolution happened, now get over it." Michael Shermer
by rodcarew on May 17, 2009 11:02 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Oh, and keep the left handed hitters too.
"Evolution happened, now get over it." Michael Shermer
by rodcarew on May 17, 2009 11:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Guys I would have on the trading block...
if I’m the Rangers that could be had for the right price:
Blalock
Murphy
Byrd
TT
Padilla
Jones
There may be a rare proposal that would come up that I would consider dealing CD or Cruz, but only if the Rangers could get a young top of the rotation pitcher in return who is under team control for at least a few years. Other than that I hold onto them.
I also hold onto the top prospects like Smoak, Feliz, Borbon, Perez, Font, Boscan, and Main.
Some guys like Kiker, MaxRam, Beltre, Vallejo, Poveda, and Lemon should be enough to add to another player to get a solid return without sacrificing too much of the future to win now.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
by slc ranger on May 17, 2009 11:18 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
we could use a reliever
Marlon Byrd for Manny Delcarmen maybe?
"Yeah, like I had a chance there" - Lancaster batter, after striking out against Derek Holland
by chrisR on May 17, 2009 2:28 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
BMac, Beltre, and Diamond for C. Lee
Rotation would be Lee, Millwood, Padilla, Harrison, Feldman.
by Coolbean04 on May 17, 2009 9:43 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
In 2010
Sheets, Lee, Millwood as top 3. Harrison, Feldman, and Holland fight for the last 2 spots.
by Coolbean04 on May 17, 2009 9:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Indians would laugh and laugh
And then hang up the phone.
And then call you back and laugh some more.
Then send an email out to all the cool g.m.s telling them about the proposal, and they’d be all sending “LOL!!!!” and “ROFL!!!!” emails back and forth to each other.
by Adam J. Morris on May 17, 2009 10:23 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I think it would be like when the Cooders bamboozled the Simspons out of their house.
And when Homer figured what’d happened he asked them, “But what about the Carny Code?” and they laughed at him through the mail slot, then closed the mail slot, then opened up the mail slot to laugh at him some more.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
You want the mustache on or off? ... ... ... Too bad.
by thedirkatron on May 18, 2009 1:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
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