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Around SBN: The Most Dangerous Division in Sports

Some Friday noon-ish linkaliciousness

Think the 132 pitches Edwin Jackson threw yesterday was a lot?  It was...the last Tiger pitcher to throw that many pitches in a game was knuckleballer Steve Sparks, in 2002.  The last non-knuckleballing Tiger to throw that many pitches was Felipe Lira, in 1996.

People are starting to pay attention to the Rangers.  Yahoo's Stan McNeal says that the Rangers aren't going to wilt this summer, and emphasizes the Rangers improvement in their pitching and defense.

Jeff Passan says that Jake Peavy made the smart move in rejecting a trade to the ChiSox, a team with an aging offense that doesn't appear well positioned to contend long-term.  Passan also says that Texas would be a perfect fit for a trade, if Peavy would just waive his no-trade to come here.

Buster Olney calls Peavy's contract an "albatross," which is surprising, given that not long ago his contract was one of the things that made Peavy such an attractive trade target.

There is more of a trade market right now than you normally see before Memorial Day, although Peter Gammons says that makes sense, given the players.

Over at FanGraphs, R.J. Anderson has a preview of Derek Holland's start today.

Yahoo's Power Rankings have the Rangers at #11 in the majors.

BP's Hit List has the Rangers coming in at #7.

Joe Sheehan did a chat session yesterday, and suggested that Justin Smoak and Neftali Feliz could both be in the top 5 prospects in baseball this offseason.  I'm starting to think that we'll see Feliz up by early July, and he may get enough innings to wipe out his eligibility this year.

Edinson Volquez is on the d.l., and Will Carroll says he has a back strain, not back spasms, that will likely keep him out more than the 15 day minimum.  Carroll also found John Lackey's return (his five inning out, not the aborted start against Texas) underwhelming.

Jayson Stark says the players don't enjoy interleague play.  I don't care for it, either.  I think it exists so that MLB can have Mets/Yanks and ChiSox/Cubs two weekends a year...everything else is basically filler.

In the latest blogs vs. MSM dustup, blogger Big Blue Shoe from SBN's own Colts blog acquits himself very well in this radio interview where he's being scolded and mocked by a radio host and an Indianapolis columnist because...well, as best as I can tell, they are offended he blogs under the name "Big Blue Shoe" (because if you don't put your real name on what you write, you can't be held accountable, apparently) and doesn't spend any time in the locker room. 

 

 

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Feliz, aggressive promotions

The Rangers have certainly not been shy about promoting guys the last couple of years. Like with Andrus and Holland, I think they see Feliz as a possible key contributor in 2010 and want him up in the big leagues sometime this summer so he’s already acclimated next spring. If he helps the team contend this fall, that’s just a bonus.

G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....

by t ball on May 22, 2009 12:03 PM CDT reply actions  

59 innings

isnt that what you have to get to not be considered a rookie the next season? if he shows up in july in the BP and gets more the 59 IP we had a meltdown

mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.

by Jayslick on May 22, 2009 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

He might make a few spot starts too

By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
-The Outlaw

by Gdawg on May 22, 2009 1:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

Rookie eligibility

is a combination of IP and days on the roster.

I believe that if you satisfy either, you no longer have rookie eligibility.

I forget what the number of days on the roster is, but if Feliz is brought up in July and stays with the club, he’s no longer a rookie from number of days at least.

R

by Requiem on May 22, 2009 5:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

To clarify

Sheehan made the point that Davis would DH if Smoak was called up.

by LiamP on May 22, 2009 12:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

The problem is that Smoak when drafted was considered a potential GG 1st baseman

No one ever said anything that great about Davis’ defense at 1st so everyone just kind of glosses over what Davis has done and how Smoak might actually look in the minors (hard to track him defensively there).

By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
-The Outlaw

by Gdawg on May 22, 2009 12:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

Davis may be an actual GG 1st baseman.

Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D

by rooster on May 22, 2009 1:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

He has definitely showed some amazing defense skills so far this season.

The stretch splits and the catch-the-ball-in-the-air-and-tag-the-runner-out-as-gravity-does-its-thing stuff is pretty impressive.

As I’ve stated before, I don’t see what would be so damn wrong with a platoon there @ 1st.

She say she are the manager.

by rockin_rangers on May 22, 2009 2:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think the reason

you don’t want a platoon, is you want both of them playing at the same time.

"I'd praised catcher Max Ramirez two weeks ago, but after his continued struggles I'm increasingly convinced he's not going to pan out." - crops.mlblogs.com

by DJCahill on May 22, 2009 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think he means one at 1B the other DHing

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on May 22, 2009 2:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'd rather have the better player

playing there everyday. Right now, I believe that is Davis. You can still give Smoak some time at 1B to give Davis a bit of a rest (though 1B doesn’t really need that), but unless they are both equally good then it doesn’t make sense to platoon them there.

By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
-The Outlaw

by Gdawg on May 22, 2009 2:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

I would imagine that by the beginning of 2010, you will see one of them in right field. Assuming Davis has the better arm, it would probably be him.

by Athos on May 22, 2009 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

You don't think

the OF next year looks like Hamilton-Borbon-Cruz?

"I'd praised catcher Max Ramirez two weeks ago, but after his continued struggles I'm increasingly convinced he's not going to pan out." - crops.mlblogs.com

by DJCahill on May 22, 2009 12:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think they’re going to have to find places to play Davis, Smoak, and MaxRam in 2010. I would imagine you see Cruz get dealt or go into a rotation between OF, DH, and the bench. No question though that your outfield would be much better defensively.

by Athos on May 22, 2009 12:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think I'd rather see

one of Davis/Smoak/MaxRam traded. I think we’ve seen in the past what putting defensive hacks out there does, and I suspect any C or 1B is likely to be range deficient in the OF.

"I'd praised catcher Max Ramirez two weeks ago, but after his continued struggles I'm increasingly convinced he's not going to pan out." - crops.mlblogs.com

by DJCahill on May 22, 2009 12:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

Who would you want to trade

Davis for?

2009 Texas Rangers: Why The Hell Not Us?--ghtd36 on May 13, 2009

by boomer1 on May 22, 2009 12:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

Greinke's

contract would almost be up, and I suppose we could see if we could flip him for anything.

"I'd praised catcher Max Ramirez two weeks ago, but after his continued struggles I'm increasingly convinced he's not going to pan out." - crops.mlblogs.com

by DJCahill on May 22, 2009 12:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

You would have added

more than just Davis to get Greinke.

2009 Texas Rangers: Why The Hell Not Us?--ghtd36 on May 13, 2009

by boomer1 on May 22, 2009 12:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

What I wouldn't give to go back in time and do that deal.

Provided the Royals would go for it, of course. It sure would’ve sucked for them to get Hurley and have him undergo rotator cuff surgery during the offseason.

by jwiscarson on May 22, 2009 1:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

I have heard rumors that the Royals and Rangers had talks at the trade deadline

Obviously, they would have asked for Feliz or Holland.

I would have been fine parting with one. But if you were going to protect them, this package would have been Plan B.

People were critical of giving up that much control time. Fact is, Greinke isn’t a starry-eyed athlete looking for a pay-day. He’s a pretty level-headed person. And I think two years of competitive baseball in Arlington would have been enough to have gotten him to extend here.

by oc on May 22, 2009 2:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah.

I’ve read enough Joe Posnanski now that I have a better perspective on Greinke than I did then. I really thought he was a good number three, maybe a number two starter. Mind you, I don’t think he’s quite as otherworldly as his current stats indicate, but I would gladly trade Harrison away in lieu of Hurley, even.

That would be one hell of a deal for the Royals, I have to think. Although I think Salty’s come quite a way this year, I still dislike the catching situation even considering that Max hasn’t done a ton to back up his 2008 campaign in the minors.

by jwiscarson on May 22, 2009 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Supposedly, they wanted Andrus

Evan Grant was a big advocate of using Andrus and Salty as part of a package to get Greinke, I think.

by Adam J. Morris on May 22, 2009 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah...

On one hand, I think, “SS is the second-most important defensive position, and Andrus can play every day.”

On the other hand, I think, “Greinke’s had two rough outings, and his ERA+ is 552. He’s striking out ten batters per nine, and walking 1.6.”

So, you’re talking about a more-or-less guaranteed win every five days versus the potential for a game-changing play every day. Seriously tough call.

by jwiscarson on May 22, 2009 2:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah

Elvis can help every pitcher every night while Greinke would help the defense once every 5 days. Tough call

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on May 22, 2009 2:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

What's the most important defensive position?

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Catcher.

At least by positional adjustment in WAR

by jwiscarson on May 22, 2009 3:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

There was a KC Star report (print edition) that said

Moore preferred to not trade Greinke for a prospect package. I took that to mean players a year away.

He just decided to run with the talent he already had rather than wait on a new generation to mature.

Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D

by rooster on May 22, 2009 2:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

I wouldn't have done that at the time. I would looking back, of course.

But they wouldn’t have done it, so what’s the point?

They knew what they had.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

Very clever.

Obviously I wasn’t.

I just don’t think they were as keen to deal a young ace as you seem to think they were.

How many pitcher’s of his ilk, age and contract situation have been dealt over the past 10 years? And how many of those guys have been dealt from teams that could afford to lock the pitcher up if they wanted to?

(And, no, I know I wasn’t in the room for any of those other deals either, lol!!!)

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

How many losing seasons has Kansas City had in the last 10 years?

How many of their highly touted prospects have played below expectations?

by oc on May 22, 2009 3:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

Can I answer questions with questons, too?

Or, no?

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:38 PM CDT up reply actions  

Are you cereal?

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

Also, Moore had competing on his mind

He wasn’t looking to rebuild for the next year or two. He wanted to start winning in 09.

By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
-The Outlaw

by Gdawg on May 22, 2009 3:44 PM CDT up reply actions  

Not really.

He always stated his preference was to compete now.

His FA signings and trades all seem to point to this fact.

But don’t let all these facts stand in the way of a good old fashioned OC Keep Shouting Until You Win-Athon.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah

He came out and made that pretty clear this past offseason and I think even before last season ended.

By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
-The Outlaw

by Gdawg on May 22, 2009 3:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

Didn't JD try making a trade at the deadline last year

for Greinke?

By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
-The Outlaw

by Gdawg on May 22, 2009 4:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

Thats the rumor

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on May 22, 2009 4:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

is that a yes or are you asking why

By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
-The Outlaw

by Gdawg on May 22, 2009 4:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

Or the high ones

¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!

I came here to split hairs. And you?

by inactive lsb user on May 22, 2009 5:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

I can't see myself

having pulled the trigger last year without an extension being part of the deal. Practically, that makes the deal real difficult to get done.

I just think giving up some prime prospects and some good prospects and hoping to extend later is just too risky.

"I'd praised catcher Max Ramirez two weeks ago, but after his continued struggles I'm increasingly convinced he's not going to pan out." - crops.mlblogs.com

by DJCahill on May 22, 2009 2:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah. Two big-league mashers and a potential replacement in the rotation.

I was thinking either Cruz-Davis-Hurley or Cruz-Salt-Hurley. I heard alot of folks, not just LSBers, think that seemed like quite a bit for the Rangers to give up.

Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D

by rooster on May 22, 2009 2:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

Who would kyou go after right now for Davis?

2009 Texas Rangers: Why The Hell Not Us?--ghtd36 on May 13, 2009

by boomer1 on May 22, 2009 12:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

The best solution is to trade Davis

The team has to trade Davis or Smoak. Smoak has too much value to use him as a DH. You either make him the 1b, or you make him the key piece in a major deal this offseason (or at the deadline for an extendable front rotation guy). Since Davis’s only value right now is in the field, it doesn’t make sense to go forward with him as a DH.

The team blew their chance to deal Davis this past winter. I think now we just have to hope that he can rebound, or at least put up a gaudy HR total that will shield his pathetic OBP and ridiculous K rate. Maybe if he hits 35 homers this season while looking good in the field someone will pony up something pretty nice for him despite his .280 OBP and 215 K’s.

And I’d trade him for whoever the team can get. I think Davis’s best case scenario is to be an Adam Dunn type player, which will require serious improvement in his on base ability. I’m willing to give up that base case scenario in lots of possible deals.

PhD

by JBImaknee on May 22, 2009 5:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

So, basically...

…you’ve made up your mind that Davis is likely crap. Or Mike Jacobs, which is basically the same thing.

by Adam J. Morris on May 22, 2009 5:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

I've made up my mind

that Davis has to improve substantially to not be crap, and that improvement is not a sure thing.

Adam Dunn has been a very valuable player – far more valuable than many in baseball appreciate. But Davis isn’t there yet, and it isn’t as obvious to me that he will be as it apparently is to other people.

PhD

by JBImaknee on May 22, 2009 5:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

Okay

He’s not going to be Adam Dunn. Adam Dunn draws 100+ walks per year. Davis isn’t going to be that guy.

And that, I guess, is my point…if your position is that he’s got to get to that level for him to not be crap, then it is tantamount to the same thing.

Here’s the thing:

2007 at high A as a 21 year old: .298/.340/.573
2007 at AA as a 21 year old: .294/.371/.688
2008 at AA as a 22 year old: .333/.376/.618
2008 at AAA as a 22 year old: .333/.402/.685
2008 in the majors as a 22 year old: .285/.331/.549

That’s an incredible offensive performance over a 2 year period for a guy who was young for his level at each stop.

If he still in AAA for a couple more months last season, he would have been a top 10-20 prospect this past offseason.

And yet, 7 weeks of struggling seemingly has people willing to write off the previous two years of dominant offensive performance and decide that he’s crap.

I don’t get it.

by Adam J. Morris on May 22, 2009 5:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

I guess the question is whether Davis is just cold or whether he's been figured out

I think without the threat of him taking a walk, pitching to guys like Davis becomes easy. If you just make sure not to throw him anything he can drive, then you’ll be fine. Since he’ll swing at things way out of the strike zone, why pitch him anything he can hit? I’m worried that is the opposing pitchers’ plan on Davis this year, and that it is working to a tee.

If Davis can learn to walk, especially in this lineup, he’ll force the opposing pitchers to give him good pitches. Then I think he can maintain that high-.200s batting average. But if he can’t hit in the high .200s, and he doesn’t walk much, then his OBP is going to be sub-.300. And unless you’re slugging .600 (also hard to do when batting .250), you’re not all that useful.

PhD

by JBImaknee on May 22, 2009 6:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

x
I think without the threat of him taking a walk, pitching to guys like Davis becomes easy. If you just make sure not to throw him anything he can drive, then you’ll be fine. Since he’ll swing at things way out of the strike zone, why pitch him anything he can hit? I’m worried that is the opposing pitchers’ plan on Davis this year, and that it is working to a tee.

Except that’s not what is happening. Davis is swinging at a lower percentage of balls out of the zone than last year, and pitchers are throwing him only slightly more pitches out of the zone than last year.

And he’s making contact on more pitches out of the zone than last year.

His problem is that, when pitchers threw him a pitch in the strike zone last year and he swung, he made contact 79% of the time. This year, it is 62% of the time.

In a nutshell, he’s swinging and missing at strikes, not pitchers suddenly giving him nothing to hit.

by Adam J. Morris on May 22, 2009 6:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

Question

Who are the best examples of successful slugging guys who are not high average hitters and have low walks? I can think of mid-’90s Sammy Sosa as a good example, and obviously he worked out pretty well.

PhD

by JBImaknee on May 22, 2009 6:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

some others I found off the active lifetime K leaders

Mike Cameron (without the steals)
Andruw Jones
Richie Sexson
Geoff Jenkins

There is a pretty big selection bias here, because to be on the active K list you need to have had some talent with lasting power. All these guys were good to have on a team through their first few years, but none were super stars (with the exception of Jones, but that was for his stellar defense as well). Of the guys who K a whole lot, the ability to take a walk is a pretty good discriminator for the great hitters and the good/okay ones.

PhD

by JBImaknee on May 22, 2009 6:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

I've said all along one of the best comps for the kind of hitter he'l end up being is Juando the Condo.

The K’s will liekly be a bit higher, but no comp is perfect.

The guy is young, came super fast, and has hit at every single level.

To sour on him so completely after a slow start to his Sophomore campaign is pure craziness.

I don’t understand one single bit.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 9:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

also

I don’t have a problem if Davis become Mike Jacobs. I don’t think Mike Jacobs is a bad player to have a first base – he’s not great, but he isn’t hurting you there. But I think Smoak will almost certainly be a far better player to have at first base. And my hope is that MaxRam will probably be a better hitter to have at DH.

My hope is that the 2010-2013 Texas Rangers have a lineup that wouldn’t have a place for Mike Jacobs.

PhD

by JBImaknee on May 22, 2009 5:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

I would think so.

"I'd praised catcher Max Ramirez two weeks ago, but after his continued struggles I'm increasingly convinced he's not going to pan out." - crops.mlblogs.com

by DJCahill on May 22, 2009 12:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

Why?

Do you really what Ramirez as the DH?

Go Rangers...don't suck...

by Kinslerhomer on May 22, 2009 12:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

Assuming he can hit enough there

I haven’t heard much about his catching ability improving.

"I'd praised catcher Max Ramirez two weeks ago, but after his continued struggles I'm increasingly convinced he's not going to pan out." - crops.mlblogs.com

by DJCahill on May 22, 2009 12:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

That's what I assumed

DH and maybe 2nd/3rd catcher.

"I'd praised catcher Max Ramirez two weeks ago, but after his continued struggles I'm increasingly convinced he's not going to pan out." - crops.mlblogs.com

by DJCahill on May 22, 2009 12:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think as a well rounded hitter

who can catch in emergencies and spot start at first base, MaxRam will have a great career as a professional DH.

I’d much rather have a guy who is supposedly more uniform in his approach at the plate than Davis or Blalock, whose approach to hitting is to swing at every pitch as if they are moving golf balls.

PhD

by JBImaknee on May 22, 2009 5:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

Assuming somebody is willing to give good value, sure.

Given how the trade market worked out last winter, I’m not convinced good value will be out there.

by Athos on May 22, 2009 12:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

Granted.

But what do you expect to get for him?

by Athos on May 22, 2009 12:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

What else do you include in the package and which starter do you target?

by Athos on May 22, 2009 12:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

name one who might be available who u like

mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.

by Jayslick on May 22, 2009 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

why would the sawks ever remotely think of moving him?

besides, they gave up Hanley to get him like 2 or 3 seasons ago, now they are gonna flip him for a vallejo, TT, and kiker deal? or move him for smoak when they have lars?

the sawks arent sellers, and they wont ever think about that

mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.

by Jayslick on May 22, 2009 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

They'll listen to offers on Beckett.

Why wouldn’t they? If there evaluation is that the drop off from Beckett to Buccholz is not significant, then why not sure Beckett to fill other weaknesses?

by octoberty on May 22, 2009 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Question: Why would they do that?

Answer: They wouldn’t.

Seriously. Dreaming on them dealing Beckett is silly.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah

I’ve never really understood the love of Beckett by some. He’s probably still not overpriced after looking at that contract, but still he’s not going to get healthier with age and he still hasn’t been the ace we need on a year-year basis. I wouldn’t give up any of our top prospects to get him.

By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
-The Outlaw

by Gdawg on May 22, 2009 3:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

Boston doesn't normally hang on too long with their pitchers

I’m telling you, everyone mentions Buchholz when talking about Boston trading a pitcher. I would bet if it comes down to those 2, Beckett is who gets traded.

by octoberty on May 22, 2009 3:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

They're not trading either.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

Definitely what?

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hans

He glanced at the directory when John McClane looked away briefly, and saw the name “W. Clay.”

"I dont care to debate with a troll." - Sharky

by RCCook on May 22, 2009 4:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

PLEEEEASE GOOOOD NOOOOO...

YOU’RE ONE OF THEM AREN’T YOU?!…YOU’RE ONE OF THEM!!!

DON’T KILL ME-DON’T KILL ME-PLEASE-PLEASE!!!

by oc on May 22, 2009 5:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think it comes down to who could be the better RF. I understand Smoak’s D is supposed to be very good, but Davis has been playing excellent D at first this season. Surely something will shake loose and make the decision unnecessary, but assuming nobody gets traded, I think they take the fastest of the two or whoever has the better arm and they stick them out there to make sure their bat is in the lineup.

by Athos on May 22, 2009 12:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

Normally

guys get stuck at 1B because they don’t have much range and they don’t have much arm. I’m used to seeing OFs move to 1B, not the other way around.

"I'd praised catcher Max Ramirez two weeks ago, but after his continued struggles I'm increasingly convinced he's not going to pan out." - crops.mlblogs.com

by DJCahill on May 22, 2009 12:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I agree. But if both have the kind of bats we think they’re going to have, they’re going to have to find ways to get them in the lineup, especially if you have MaxRam up as well. There’s really no place else to move one of them. It’s a nice dilemma to have.

by Athos on May 22, 2009 12:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

You put Smoak at DH...

…and trade Max.

Or you leave Max in AAA next season, if he doesn’t get his bat going in the next few months.

by Adam J. Morris on May 22, 2009 12:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think we've seen

that making too many compromises on defense can cost pitchers half a run to a run in ERA.

I believe we have Cruz under control til 2013, but I may be off a year.

I think you bring up one of Smoak/Max as DH, and hide the other in AAA til you run out of options or you get a good trade.

"I'd praised catcher Max Ramirez two weeks ago, but after his continued struggles I'm increasingly convinced he's not going to pan out." - crops.mlblogs.com

by DJCahill on May 22, 2009 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed.

Considering we have Boggs and Borbon in the minors, not to mention the OF talent we already have in the majors, I’m not sure it makes much sense to push an infielder out there.

by jwiscarson on May 22, 2009 2:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

Cruz is such a good RF.

He’s struggled for periods this year but I haven’t really gotten too frustrated with him cause he’s a plus in RF even when he suffers the occasional week long slip back into the land of the suck.

A Hamilton-Borbon-Cruz OF (l-r) seems really good to me.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

Neither will ever play RF

That’s just dumb when you have the OF candidates the Rangers currently have. The defense is just too good from all of them and the offense is pretty good too. Unless some trades happen, Davis stays at 1B or DH

By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
-The Outlaw

by Gdawg on May 22, 2009 12:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

If only we could've left Davis at 3b :(

I wonder if he’d’ve been able to become passable there?

He’s proven he’s willing to work on his defense and he certainly had the arm for it. I don’t think he’d’ve ever been “good” at 3rd, but I wonder…

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

Then what do you do with the current

incumbent at 3B, because you have him til 2013 pretty much.

"I'd praised catcher Max Ramirez two weeks ago, but after his continued struggles I'm increasingly convinced he's not going to pan out." - crops.mlblogs.com

by DJCahill on May 22, 2009 3:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yah, that's what I meant by wish we could've. We didn't have a choice. FFace had to go to third. No way around that.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

That move has worked pretty well so far.

Mikey’s even hitting like a good third baseman. It’s karma.

by Athos on May 22, 2009 3:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

He's hitting again.

His fielding is still pretty bad, though I’m willing to give him some time there cause position switches are difficult.

But, wow… It’s crazy to watch him move on defense and realize we were using this stiff at freaking SS last year.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

No way he's movable.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:52 PM CDT up reply actions  

Heh, fair enough.

That contract is still ridiculous, plus I think there’d be a full on player revolt if we dealt the uber-beloved Face in a salary dump.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

OT - I

have tickets for the whole NYY – TEX series , early forecast is calling for rain all 3 days. It’s going to be a big buzzkill if it does and a waste of a week of vacation.

by icouldusesomebaseball on May 22, 2009 12:28 PM CDT reply actions  

don't worry, the field drains extremely well

it would have to be solid thunderstorms for a long portion of the day and game.

If a woman has to choose between catching a fly ball and saving an infant's life, she will choose to save the infant's life without even considering if there are men on base. ~Dave Barry

by NothinG on May 22, 2009 12:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

I assumed

the whoosh of all the balls flying out of that bandbox would dry the field fairly quickly.

"I'd praised catcher Max Ramirez two weeks ago, but after his continued struggles I'm increasingly convinced he's not going to pan out." - crops.mlblogs.com

by DJCahill on May 22, 2009 12:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

Big Blue Shoe

did a really nice job in the interview. He made his points well.

Part of the radio guy "Bob"’s argument involved him not being in the lockerroom, and is it Blue’s fault that he isn’t given a credential due to the Colts rules about bloggers? Bob, is a blowhard and was called out rightly about how columnists don’t have the same accountability (disconnect) from the readers and how his industry is in turmoil.

If a woman has to choose between catching a fly ball and saving an infant's life, she will choose to save the infant's life without even considering if there are men on base. ~Dave Barry

by NothinG on May 22, 2009 12:31 PM CDT reply actions  

Who cares

What his real name is. He keeps talking about credibility, but “Big Blue Shoe” gains or loses credibility under that name as opposed to “Joe Smith”. It’s just an alias, it’s not really a big issue. I don’t really care if Adam J. Morris is actually Adam J. Morris or just a huge Saved by the Bell fan.

I had a paper route when I was a kid. I was supposed to go to 2,000 houses. Or two dumpsters.

by TheBZA on May 22, 2009 12:44 PM CDT up reply actions  

mmmm

Kelly Kapowski ….

"I'd praised catcher Max Ramirez two weeks ago, but after his continued struggles I'm increasingly convinced he's not going to pan out." - crops.mlblogs.com

by DJCahill on May 22, 2009 12:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

Silly Interview

The newspaper guy/talk show host just wants to make it clear who’s top dog. I’m new to blogs but it seems to me like most of them just aggregate sports news from the media and offer commentary. Why do you need to be accountable to do that? And if say Adam calls Daniels out and Daniels takes issue with it, he can respond in a number of different ways to it if he chooses to do so.

Columnists aren’t any more accountable to the people they write about. I bet John Daniels hates Randy Galloway, but that doesn’t matter to Galloway because he’s accountable to his editor, and his editor wants to sell papers. Most blogs aren’t selling anything. Some do, I guess, but most just have some advertising and a lot of them don’t even have that.

What I have a problem with transcends the media/blog line. I have trouble with anyone who writes about players they’ve never seen and yet act like they have seen them. I think you know what I’m talking about. “I don’t think this guy in A ball is ever going to be anything”. Chances are nobody from the newspaper or a blog has ever seen the kid play and they’re just looking at box scores and third-hand hearsay. I mean I have no problem writing about a player, but don’t try to give me something that looks like a scouting report. I come from the world of real baseball, and in the low minors it’s all about development. Some kid might have all the talent in the world, but is instructed to use his new curve or change at a certain time during a game instead of his best pitch. Looking at their numbers is less informative than looking at spring training stats.

by BoogPowell on May 22, 2009 1:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

If Peavy waives his no-trade clause to come to Texas

(and I know that’s a big if) what kind of package would it be? Obiviously it would have to include a catcher (like Teagarden) and a future starting pitcher (like Kiker). But would they demand a MIF like Vallejo or perhaps Lemon?

Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!

by DerekSTheRed on May 22, 2009 12:40 PM CDT reply actions  

From Keith Law in his chat session today:

Josh Chicago: Thoughts on the supposed players involved in the Peavy deal- Richard and Poreda? Obviously tough to judge without the other names but are these guys you thought would be good enough to land Peavy?

SportsNation Keith Law: (1:32 PM ET ) Right now, both of those guys project as relievers in the majors, so I don’t think it was a great package for San Diego, nor would I be real keen to acquire pitchers from the White Sox. Sirotka, Garcia, McCarthy, de los Santos … who was the last pitcher they dealt who stayed healthy for his new club? Gio Gonzalez hasn’t been hurt but he hasn’t exactly been good, either.

by Adam J. Morris on May 22, 2009 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

interesting

Peavy won’t come here, or to the AL for that matter, but what would our package be to acquire him, hypothetically?

If a woman has to choose between catching a fly ball and saving an infant's life, she will choose to save the infant's life without even considering if there are men on base. ~Dave Barry

by NothinG on May 22, 2009 12:44 PM CDT up reply actions  

Kiker-Harrison beats Peroda-Richard

Not saying I want to trade Harrison, though. So, Kiker-CJ Wilson might be about the same offer.

Probably could throw in the use of Hick’s corporate jet a few times per season to get him back to SD as an incentive for Peavy to drop his no-trade clause.

Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D

by rooster on May 22, 2009 1:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'd pull the trigger on that trade

I’m a huge Harrison fan and love Kiker too, but if it gets you Peavy, you do that deal.

By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
-The Outlaw

by Gdawg on May 22, 2009 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

I really like Poreda... I guess it comes down to how real you think Harrison is in terms of comparing those deals.

Seems to me like they really need a long term CF’er who can cover their vast expanses of OF grass. (Tony Gwynn Jr. is not that guy, imo.)

And they could use a catcher, too.

 Something like Tea, Borbon and Kiker + some filler for Peavy and Bell might be interesting if we could get him to waive his no-trade to come here, which I don’t think we could.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

I love lefties with big arms and all

and I understand the financial issues surrounding Peavy, but that deal is crap. Yes, the closest approximation to Poreda is probably Holland, but Holland and Harrison are both more valuable than the guys in that deal, and I suspect that we could match or top that offer another way if he’d come here.

by Brett Perryman on May 22, 2009 1:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

The recent potential deals for Peavy

From Atlanta and the Chicago teams seem pretty underwhelming. I’m not a big Peavy fan, but it doesn’t look like the price tag is that high for him.

By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
-The Outlaw

by Gdawg on May 22, 2009 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, kind of a shame

he doesn’t want to come here. With the prospects being asked not looking that horrible, and his salary, while high wouldn’t seem to be a huge problem after losing Pad’s and Blalock’s next year.

I certainly like Peavy’s chances of contributing more than Sheets.

"I'd praised catcher Max Ramirez two weeks ago, but after his continued struggles I'm increasingly convinced he's not going to pan out." - crops.mlblogs.com

by DJCahill on May 22, 2009 12:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

Except

that all Sheets will cost is money. I’d rather spend money than prospects if given the choice.

G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....

by t ball on May 22, 2009 1:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

And

Sheets would presumably be open to a shorter contract as well.

G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....

by t ball on May 22, 2009 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

And Sheets

will likely be able to pitch 15 games a year,

"I'd praised catcher Max Ramirez two weeks ago, but after his continued struggles I'm increasingly convinced he's not going to pan out." - crops.mlblogs.com

by DJCahill on May 22, 2009 1:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

Peavy’s hardly a paragon of health either.

by LiamP on May 22, 2009 1:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

and Peavy's splits aren't very encouraging

he is pretty avg away from the friendly confines of Petco Park.

If a woman has to choose between catching a fly ball and saving an infant's life, she will choose to save the infant's life without even considering if there are men on base. ~Dave Barry

by NothinG on May 22, 2009 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

Peavy's health

He has posted 32, 27, 30, 32, 34, 27 starts the last 6 years. I don’t see the big health concerns that everybody keeps bringing up.

"He's old school in that he give up his groin like that. It hurt me when he do that" -- Worsh on Chris Davis' stretch at first base to end the game vs. the Angels on 5/16

by tricer on May 22, 2009 3:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

The reports about many people in baseball being afraid of his shoulder make me nervous.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm ok with that

if the money is right. For Peavy, you have to give up some prospects you like, pay him a bazillion dollars the final year of his contract, and hope he stays healthy (I’m not too confident he’ll remain in the pink.) Sheets might not pitch full seasons, but he most definitely will not be an albatross a couple of years from now.

G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....

by t ball on May 22, 2009 1:38 PM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed.

Echoing what NothinG said above, Sky Kalkman recently did an article on Peavy over at BTB.

His contract’s pretty high, and he pitches in a far friendlier run environment (not just Petco Park, but the NL as well). Consider this: Peavy’s lifetime FB% is 38.6%, and he has a career 9.8% HR/FB ratio. Playing at Petco Park 81 times a year.

No thanks.

by jwiscarson on May 22, 2009 2:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'd be more interested in interleague

if they would play the DH in the NL parks, and let us see NL style ball in our park… just from a going-to-the-game perspective. On the whole, that doesn’t make much difference.

by bhudson on May 22, 2009 12:43 PM CDT reply actions  

That's a good idea.

I like interleague play but not the “forced” rivalries, although it’s going to be pretty nice playing Houston for 6 games a year for the next few years.

by jcAustin on May 22, 2009 2:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

If i didnt know any better

I might think Jeff Wilson is a new name for our friend Josey Whales. In the question about who to give credit to, he gave it everyone accept Jon boy. Now i agree that all those mentioned in the mailbag do deserve credit, but how can you not give ANY to Jon Daniels for how this team is constructed now? We have 3 starters (2 position and 1 SP) from a trade JD made and 3 other starters that were drafted by JD. Not opening up this fight again but doesnt JD deserve part of the credit as well?

Elvis has "shook up" Arlington!!

by thad728 on May 22, 2009 12:59 PM CDT reply actions  

Michael Ian Black's latest twitter update:
Today is my daughter’s kindergarten recital: BOOOORING!!!

I’m looking forward to him being back on TV.

by Brett Perryman on May 22, 2009 1:21 PM CDT reply actions  

he and Showalter did a stint in the booth for the Mets recently.

I would love to get my hands on a recording of that..!

Grieve: The Yanks have struggled so far. - Lewin: Yeah, cry me a bag of money.
Dykstra has all the money!
ElectricOkra.com

by WhipSmart on May 22, 2009 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

Does anyone else...

…have concerns about Feliz coming up by June? I like the early-August-just-a-reliever schedule better.

by GhettoBear04 on May 22, 2009 1:24 PM CDT reply actions  

I don't if it's in the pen

I do if it’s in the rotation and they plan on using him all year.

by Brett Perryman on May 22, 2009 1:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I could handle that.

I’m just concerned that they view him as a better starting option than Kris Benson (which, let’s be honest, may be the case) for the next time an injury comes around.

by GhettoBear04 on May 22, 2009 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yah, I want him in the 'pen pretty soon.

We’ve already gone well past the point of Longoria’ing him.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

Heyman says Rangers would listen to offers for Blalock

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writers/jon_heyman/05/22/peavy.trade/1.html

• The Rangers would listen to offers for Hank Blalock, since they have plenty of hitters (Andruw Jones, Max Ramirez, Justin Smoak). They would want relief in return.

"He will not coddle them. Nolan Ryan doesn’t coddle." - Jeff Passan

by Dirk Diggler on May 22, 2009 2:37 PM CDT reply actions  

suckiness relief?

"He will not coddle them. Nolan Ryan doesn’t coddle." - Jeff Passan

by Dirk Diggler on May 22, 2009 2:39 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

A lethal combo of both.

I’d love to see them deal Blalock for anything and call up Smoak.

Smoak’s gotten to the point where we may as well call him up now, cause there’s no way we’re gonna be able to risk the temptation and keep him down long enough to Longoria him and get that extra year of arb-control.

May as well get him up here and let him start playing.

Neffy, too.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm hoping that the plan...

..with the 1B/DH situation is to ‘feature’ Blalock as much as possible and then trade him for whatever you can possibly get (I would take a solid relief prospect who’s not on the 40), then use Andruw Jones at DH until August or so.

I’d at least like to keep Smoak’s rookie status for next year, which is apparently is 130 ABs.

Then again, I’d also be interested in using that 40 spot on Julio Borbon if he can develop more at the plate over the next couple months. An OF of Cruz-Borbon-Hamilton with Murphy/Jones backing up would make me very happy.

by GhettoBear04 on May 22, 2009 3:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

Why do you want to keep his rookie status?

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

So?

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 9:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

keep his rookie status?

That should not at all be a reason to keep him down in the minors. The only legit reason to keep him down is his FA/arbitration eligibility which I don’t think we will be able to Longoria him next year because hes just too good.

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on May 22, 2009 3:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

Look at us agreeing on something, Large Guy Steven!!!

Could a pajama party + tickle fight be next?

I think… YES.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 4:40 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Hmm...

…I was under the impression that if he didn’t hit 130 ABs that the Rangers would get another year of control? Is that not right? A way to have his bat for August/September and get him acclimated to the majors but not having it count as a year against his eligibility?

by GhettoBear04 on May 22, 2009 5:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

Year of control = solely dependent on service time

Actual rookie eligibility has no bearing on how long a team has control over a player.

R

by Requiem on May 22, 2009 5:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

ABs have nothing to do with years of control

A player is under team control until they finish a season with more than 6 years of service time. Derek Holland for instance was called up late enough this year where he will finish the season with less than a full season of team control thus making him our property for 6 more seasons after this one.

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on May 22, 2009 5:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ahhhh...

I see, I didn’t understand that. So, there’s no difference in calling a guy up right now compared to September compared to the offseason?

I didn’t know that, thanks for clearing that up for me.

by GhettoBear04 on May 22, 2009 5:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

There IS a difference

A player called up right now gets more service time (since he’s on the team for the amount of time from May to September).

A player called up in September would only get about 30 day of service time (and a year is around 180 days).

Once a player has accumulated 6 full years of service time, he’s eligible to be a free agent.

So, a player brought up now would be closer to getting to free agency.

It doesn’t matter how he is used (heck, he could be on the DL for all 6 years), he would be eligible for free agency after 6 years of being on the roster (including DL stints).

R

by Requiem on May 22, 2009 6:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

No

You can only get 175 (I believe thats the number) days of service time in a year even though the season is like 190 or so. The extra days don’t rollover. So no matter if they are called up now or September they will still have 6 full years of team control after this season.

The difference being if its a player you plan on optioning next season then waiting till September could buy you an extra year of control. For instance if they are called up in September and accumulate 30 days of service time. Then to start next season they are optioned to AAA and stay there until say June 1st they would probably end the season still under 1 full year of service time meaning they still have 6 years until free agency.

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on May 22, 2009 6:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

Sorry, Steve, you're wrong

If only in saying I’m wrong.

Every portion of time that they are on the ACTIVE ROSTER or the DL they accumulate service time.

If they get sent down, they do NOT accumulate service time (with the exception of being sent down for 20 days or less).

So, if a player is on the 25, then gets optioned on May and doesn’t get recalled until September, he DOES NOT GET A FULL SEASON OF SERVICE TIME.

He gets however many days that he is on the 25 man roster.

An example would be that if a player is optioned today, he would get 47 days of service time for this year. Assuming, he doesn’t get called back up, he does not necessarily have only 6 years until free agency, he has 5 years and 125 days of service time he needs to accumulate before he’s eligible for free agency. The amount of days constituting a full season of service time is 172 days not 175.

If they accumulate 5 years and 171 days of service time, they are STILL NOT ELIGIBLE for free agency.

Now the problem might be that you’re misinterpreting what I’m saying, but well, I’m tired of people who won’t admit they’re wrong trying to say that I’m wrong when I’m essentially not wrong.

You don’t accept this on your posts. Don’t be going around misinterpreting my posts and then saying “No” when you misinterpret my posts.

I can accept your not wanting to respond when you’re not completely correct.

I won’t accept your telling me I’m wrong when I’m not.

R

by Requiem on May 22, 2009 7:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

Im not wrong on this

You said and I quote

So, a player brought up now would be closer to getting to free agency.

That is wrong. Whether its 6 years and 1 day or 6 years and 171 days they are the exact same in terms of free agency eligibility. A player called up today would be eligible for free agency at the same time as a player called up in September if neither is optioned back to the minors.

That is why I included the example of a player who is called up in September but optioned the next year and not called up till June or so. That player would earn roughly 30 days in this year and then only 130 days or so next season and would still be shy of a full season of service time.

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on May 22, 2009 7:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

You're wrong

because of this:

if neither is optioned back to the minors.

You can’t make that assumption. And there was no assumption about it whatsoever at least on my part. And if you’re going to tell me I’m wrong, then, no, you do not get to dictate my assumptions.

So, therefore a player called up now is still technically closer to getting to free agency.

Or are you really going to argue that a player with 136 days of service time is NOT closer to free agency than a player with 34 days of service time?

And no, it’s not correct to assume that they’re not going to be optioned (cf., Halladay, Volquez, Ankiel, Billy Butler, Sosa, Schilling, etc.)

R

by Requiem on May 22, 2009 7:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

The original example GhettoBear used was assuming there would be no option used

Thats what I based my answer on which was correct. You were also correct however you didn’t mention anything about optioning the player back down next year which is why I put that example in my response.

I know very well how service time works and all that. If you think im attacking you you are wrong. And I am not going to say I was wrong when I was not. You jumped into a discussion trying to prove me wrong and failed. Try again if you want but until you do prove me wrong I will not admit I am.

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on May 22, 2009 8:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

Bull

Take a look at it again.

There’s NO, ZERO, ZILCH talk of no options being used. Search through the whole frigging thread for option in GhettoBear’s posts and you only see GhettoBear talking about the option of using Kris Benson in the starting rotation.

YOU are the one making the assumption about no option. It is not at all clear that GhettoBear is. AND there’s no statement on his part that he’s making that assumption.

I did not at all try to prove you wrong until you jumped on me with your “No.” In fact, if you’re talking about the post that I think you’re talking about, I was responding to GhettoBear’s post NOT yours. I was trying to help GhettoBear with some information NOT EVEN TALKING TO YOU.

So, not only are you wrong about what I was saying. You’re even wrong about what I was trying to do in this thread. Unless you magically somehow know exactly what my modus operandi is.

When did you become psychic, bigsteve?

I won’t hold my breath that you’ll ever admit you’re wrong. You haven’t done it in ALL the post that I’ve seen from you (and that’s quite a few), and that leaves an extremely unlikely chance that you’ll admit you’re wrong here when your weird need to be right where others are “wrong” has reared its ugly head yet again.

But I think hell will freeze over before you even admit that you might have even possibly been wrong about something.

R

by Requiem on May 22, 2009 9:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes lets go look back at this jackass

GhettoBear was talking about Justin Smoak as referenced here

I’d at least like to keep Smoak’s rookie status for next year, which is apparently is 130 ABs

If you bring up Smoak this year you are not going to option him down next year. Its not gonna happen. So there wasn’t a stretch in my mind to think he was referring to Smoak staying up all season.

After a little back and forth it was clear until you chimed in, which you were correct in a way.

We went back and forth and I even put out the example of a guy being optioned down.

I have no problem admitting when im wrong. Absolutely none at all. But you have to prove to me im wrong. And you can’t change my opinion on things very easily. So when I say stuff like I don’t think walks make a player valuable simply replying with yes they do doesn’t change my mind and thus im not gonna admit to being wrong. (Im not talking about you specifically in this example by the way)

So if you want to prove where I was wrong I will be more than happy to bow to your superior knowledge. But as far as I can tell in this exchange I haven’t been. Apparently since you assumed options were going to be used then you haven’t either so we both win

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on May 22, 2009 9:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

There's no guarantee

that you’re not going to option him.

What if he has problems? What if doesn’t cut it? Sure you don’t PLAN on optioning him, but the vagaries of life aren’t going to bow to your whim just because you don’t want it to happen.

And it doesn’t seem like GhettoBear even knew of options or no options (hence rookie eligibility), so I’m not sure how anyone could assume that he was assuming no options.

But either way, there’s no “No” about it. Everything I said was factually correct. A player with more service time is closer to free agency. He may eventually be granted free agency the same YEAR, but he’s still closer mainly because of teams have the ability to option and/or, Heaven forfend, a strike/lockout might occur.

R

by Requiem on May 23, 2009 4:01 AM CDT up reply actions  

Understatement of the fucking year.

The only reason he’s playing regularly is because they’re hoping he’ll get into a groove so they can ship his ass out for something halfway decent to patch up the pen.

by behindthebag on May 22, 2009 2:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

It's too bad Hank is struggling with the OBP

With Boston talking about acquiring Nick Johnson for Del Carmen, that’d be nice.

by octoberty on May 22, 2009 2:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm shocked!

Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year

by RangerMad on May 22, 2009 3:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

But whatever will we do

without Blalock!

"I'd praised catcher Max Ramirez two weeks ago, but after his continued struggles I'm increasingly convinced he's not going to pan out." - crops.mlblogs.com

by DJCahill on May 22, 2009 3:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

well I think

there would be about a 50% reduction in the GDTs. That would please my little netbook.

Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year

by RangerMad on May 22, 2009 3:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

Trades.... WOOHOO!

In a Peavy deal, I think Kiker-CJ is a similar set of headliners to what White Sox offered.

Since KW wasn’t able to get Peavy, might he consider blowing it up and trading Danks or Buerhle or both for a couple of packages of near ML-ready prospects, like MaxRam and Cruz?

How about Cruz, MaxRam as headliners for Danks?

Hank to the Giants for an interesting prospect would be a deal I would be actively trying to get done. Hank for Henry Sosa?

Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D

by rooster on May 22, 2009 2:49 PM CDT reply actions  

Heck I'd still take

Hank for Jonathan Sanchez, high walk total and all. Too bad the Giants wouldn’t even sniff at it.

by behindthebag on May 22, 2009 2:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

Danks is not getting traded back to TX.

Please drop this idea, no one is on the island with you…

"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008

by Rodney on May 22, 2009 3:12 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

+1

Go Rangers...don't suck...

by Kinslerhomer on May 22, 2009 3:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

This.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

thedirkatron, Rodney

Who would be at the top of your list of young TORP that you wished JD could obtain via trade?

Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D

by rooster on May 22, 2009 3:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

danks has been getting hit pretty hard

Volquez is now on the DL, and Galarraga may be getting forced out of the starting rotation in Detroit.

and although the question isn’t directed towards me, in regards to a TORP, would Arizona be likely to trade Webb or Haren when they are completely out of it. I think they would be more likely to trade Webb since it cost them a pretty penny to get Haren.

If a woman has to choose between catching a fly ball and saving an infant's life, she will choose to save the infant's life without even considering if there are men on base. ~Dave Barry

by NothinG on May 22, 2009 3:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

Not that hard.

Danks has given up 2 or fewer runs in 5 of his outings and 5 or more in 3 outings. Inconsistent.

Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D

by rooster on May 22, 2009 4:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

Cliff Lee.

Okay, he’s not really young.

And really I just want us to stay the course and not trade for anyone. Certainly not anyone big.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 3:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeppers.

Trade for a BP arm, yes, they sure could use that right now.

But trying to get a TORG during the season is an automatic overpay. Plus, I really don’t see Chicago blowing things up.

"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008

by Rodney on May 22, 2009 3:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm always scared of how expensive and how short-lived ASB trades for relievers are.

A couple of the names I like are Heath Bell and Houston Street. I can’t think of others that would be around this year and next, who would could be on the market right now or soon.

Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D

by rooster on May 22, 2009 4:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't think the offer for Peavy was an overpay, but that is a really unusual (and badly managed) circumstance.

Still, I think the Rangers get the most value out of getting a young TORP ASAP, even if it costs more than a reliever or than it would during the offseason.

Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D

by rooster on May 22, 2009 4:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't think the Peavy deal is cost prohibitive,

I just don’t think he would be that good at RBiA.

"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008

by Rodney on May 22, 2009 4:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

I can dream, can't I?

Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D

by rooster on May 22, 2009 3:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

nope

That was outlawed back in June of 06.

By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
-The Outlaw

by Gdawg on May 22, 2009 3:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

Oookay...

"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008

by Rodney on May 22, 2009 4:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

This visual creeps me out in this context.

Actually, any context now that I think about it.

Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D

by rooster on May 22, 2009 4:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

And why do I remember that song...?

"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008

by Rodney on May 22, 2009 4:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

afternoon update

from TR

* Every single Rangers position player except Omar Vizquel is on the field for early batting practice. Michael Young is among them. He doesn’t often come out for early BP

* Josh Hamilton is running sprints in the outfield. No word yet if he’s in the lineup.

* They are closing the roof at Minute Maid Park.

Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year

by RangerMad on May 22, 2009 3:02 PM CDT reply actions  

how does the park play with a closed roof

vs an open roof?

If a woman has to choose between catching a fly ball and saving an infant's life, she will choose to save the infant's life without even considering if there are men on base. ~Dave Barry

by NothinG on May 22, 2009 3:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

Favorite trade option

Davis and Teagarden for Buckholtz. Helps solve Boston’s 1st base issue with Ortiz sucking and their longterm catcher situation. Buck for us is an obvious win.

by Hull Fan on May 22, 2009 4:26 PM CDT reply actions  

Buchholz

Except the Red Sox aren’t going to bench Ortiz for Davis. They’re just not, for a number of reasons.

"I dont care to debate with a troll." - Sharky

by RCCook on May 22, 2009 4:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

Isn't Ortiz their DH?

Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.

by bigsteve on May 22, 2009 4:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

They also have

Lars Anderson in the minors that will be their DH/1B of the future.

Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year

by RangerMad on May 22, 2009 4:38 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yep

And they’ve got Youkilis at first currently, and Lowell at third, besides Ortiz at DH.

The Rangers, Red Sox, and Indians are all pretty stacked with corner infield bats- I don’t know that any of them would be good trade partners for the other if that’s what is being dangled as bait.

Boston could still use a catcher, though.

"I dont care to debate with a troll." - Sharky

by RCCook on May 22, 2009 4:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

Lars isn't doing well in AA

but he can still rebound. Grab Davis now and if Lars proves to be better Davis can be traded again or Lars could be dealt. Either way Davis helps now, when they want to win and Lars is a separate issue till he is major league ready.

by Hull Fan on May 22, 2009 5:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

Buchholz isn't getting traded.

This is from a week or so ago, so he’s prolly made a start or two, but…

in his last four starts, he’s given up 10 hits over 26 1/3 innings while striking out 32 and walking four.

He’s been incredibly good.

Whatever was wrong with him has seemingly been fixed.

He’s. Not. Getting. Traded.

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 4:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

Buchholz

Nope he’s not going anywhere, he really should be in their starting rotation now but it’s all full up.
Realistically they need to ditch penny and bring him up

"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it." - Mitch Hedberg

by rentz on May 22, 2009 4:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yah.

Especially since you traded him to me ;)

The 40 Trumps All!!!

I think movies where it turns out the British guy did it are probably pretty accurate.

by thedirkatron on May 22, 2009 4:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

i hated to do it

but i wanted to keep lil dutch boy

"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it." - Mitch Hedberg

by rentz on May 22, 2009 5:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

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