The unpleasant truth about the Ranger offense
by Adam J. Morris on Jun 15, 2009 10:30 AM CDT
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PrintSo, driving back to Houston after yesterday's game, I listened to Mike Ogulnick talk about the need to "shake things up" by re-arranging the lineup, and dropping Ian Kinsler out of the leadoff spot, to be replaced by either David Murphy or Elvis Andrus.
This seems like making a change for the sake of making a change, rather than making a change that is going to improve the team.
There's also talk from Michael Young about the team needing to improve its approach, and Ron Washington saying that the team is still confident, and all of that.
But the reality may simply be that, with Josh Hamilton out, this offense isn't very good.
You have two guys who I think are empirically good hitters -- Ian Kinsler and Nelson Cruz. They are also both streaky hitters in slumps.
You have Michael Young, who is Michael Young...he got off to a great start, has cooled off some, but is probably good for a 775 OPS.
You've got Marlon Byrd, a career 4th outfielder, and David Murphy, a guy who should be a career 4th outfielder (regardless of how much Rangers fans want him to be something different), both starting in the outfield. (And as a side note...if you want the offense to improve, playing Brandon Boggs against lefties would probably be a good start. Murphy doesn't hit lefties, and this ongoing refusal to acknowledge that is costing the team runs).
You've got the Hank Blalock/Andruw Jones platoon at DH. Blalock is an enigma, a guy with a sub-.300 OBP who seems to be trying to yank every pitch into the Home Run Porch. Jones was a bust last season, had a great April, but is hitting .226/.295/.429 since May 1.
You've got Elvis at shortstop. He's probably exceed some expectations with the bat, but he's still a 9th place hitter and not much of an offensive force.
And then we've got first base and catcher. Coming into the season, I think the expectation was that the Rangers would get above-average production offensively from Chris Davis and Jarrod Saltalamacchia. Davis, we've discussed ad nauseum. But Saltalamacchia has been terrible at the plate as well...the excuse last season was that he couldn't get in a groove because he was splitting time with Gerald Laird. So far this season, he's been starting about as often as any catcher in baseball, and he's gone backwards, posting a .250/.299/.384 line so far this year, and is apparently going to start losing playing time to Taylor Teagarden.
Those two positions are going to be critical for this offense going forward. Everyone else is what they are...Kinsler is going to snap out of his funk, Cruz is going to hit, Byrd and Murphy and going to have spurts of production that get everyone worked up for a while before reverting to 4th outfielderness, Young is going to be Young, but as a whole, this lineup is not going to be very good while Hamilton is out.
Unless things turn around at first base and catcher.
If Davis and Salty start hitting, or if Teagarden starts playing and hitting while the Rangers go find another first baseman who can hit or something, then the offense should be fine until Hamilton returns.
But if not, then we could be looking at a team that risks squandering its early-season divisional lead because it can't get runs on the board.
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Very well said, ajm
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
My thoughts exactly about 1B and Catcher. We could also improve at DH.
I was a Ranger fan when being a Rangers fan wasn't cool.
Remember before the season started
And we were all amazed at how low PECOTA and others were projecting the Rangers offense? Maybe they were right…. Although I still don’t believe it.
I remember the national media
Going on and on how this team would hit but would be in trouble with its pitching.
2009 Texas Rangers: Why The Hell Not Us?--ghtd36 on May 13, 2009
I remember both
because most of the national media pays very little attention to things like ZIPS and PECOTA, except to miss the point entirely by using single instances of the systems being right or wrong.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
The best in-house offensive boost
Max.
When he’s healthy he hits. I’ve heard him described as a mistake hitter, but the stats don’t bear it out.
It would require Hank playing himself out of his starting job.
And it would require Washington’s faith, if you believe Ron didn’t play him last year by choice.
But he’s the best sparkplug available now, not to mention a guy who needs ML ABs to determine his 2010 role.
"[Font} doesn't turn 19 until the end of May and his heater can already hit 99 on the gun. That's baseball porn." - Jason Parks
by hightowersmith on Jun 15, 2009 10:39 AM CDT reply actions
Max is hardly a sparkplug right now
the guy is not hitting very well in AAA
A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings.
He hasn't been healthy
As I say, when he’s healthy he hits.
"[Font} doesn't turn 19 until the end of May and his heater can already hit 99 on the gun. That's baseball porn." - Jason Parks
by hightowersmith on Jun 15, 2009 11:03 AM CDT up reply actions
Yep.
Yep.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 11:21 AM CDT up reply actions
Max has been hitting
since returning from the DL. Let’s check back on him at the end of the month.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
wow
we could be looking at a team that risks squandering its early-season divisional lead because it can’t get runs on the board
When has that ever been said about the Rangers?
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
Mitch Moreland - 2009 Rangers Minor League POY
I was thinking the same thing.
It’s a scary sentence to read (ironic, too), but it’s absolutely the truth.
This Rangers team is from somewhere in the Twilight Zone, or perhaps the Bermuda Triangle.
"Either we need to re-calibrate our rectangle, or Alfonzo Marquez is not having a good night." - Josh Lewin
by utlonghorn24 on Jun 15, 2009 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions
FWIW
The 1983 team led the American League in least runs allowed, the only time the Rangers have ever done that. And they finished 77-85, despite scoring more runs than they allowed.
This year’s team is in the middle of the pack in both runs scored and allowed.
"I dont care to debate with a troll." - Sharky
Did the '83
team ever lead thier division?
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
Mitch Moreland - 2009 Rangers Minor League POY
Yep
wanna say they were leading at or seriously contending at the AS Break.
It was Doug Rader’s first year and they (with Odell Jones closing) weren’t bad early on but couldn’t sustain it. That was the year the White Sox were (courtesy of Rader) accused of “winning ugly” and they embraced that mantra.
Wanna say that was also the year they had a chance to get Orel Hershiser for Sundberg at the deadline but didn’t pull the trigger.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on Jun 15, 2009 11:10 AM CDT up reply actions
Sundberg
He had 10-and-5 rights, and invoked them, IIRC. The Rangers would have also gotten Dave Stewart and Burt Hooton (both of whom did later pitch here) in that trade.
"I dont care to debate with a troll." - Sharky
Forgot about Sunny's 10 & 5 rights...
Rader didn’t like him before that deal was proposed and shot down.
Not sure if you remember but he really rode his ass outta here on a rail the rest of that year and nobody was a bigger Ned Yost fan the following year than Rader.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on Jun 15, 2009 11:40 AM CDT up reply actions
Sunny
Yeah, I hated Rader for a long time after that.
Yost was so terrible that me and my group of friends at the time would call each other “yost” as an insult for several years after the trade was made.
"I dont care to debate with a troll." - Sharky
Sundberg
I hated him for a long time after that.
by Darrell McKown on Jun 15, 2009 10:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Yep. This is the main reason I've been thinking the Rangers need to trade for a hitter.... soon.
They don’t need a bullpen arm, because their bullpen isn’t going to cause their season to fall apart. The starters are going to go 6-7 innings, and the bullpen can be patched together.
They don’t need a starter, at least not a middling starter.
Their pitching might be insufficient to allow them to advance in the playoffs, but the hitting might be too poor to even get them there.
So…. Nick Johnson. Would the Nats trade him now? If they do, they may get a bit more in return since the team obtaining Nick would have him for a month before the trade deadline. BUT, if they wait, maybe more teams would emerge in the trade market for him, causing a bidding war.
Anyone have other hitters they’d like to see the Rangers acquire, besides Nick Johnson? Probably needs to be a DH type; definitely needs to hit well against lefties.
Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D
A note about the comment on "pitching might insufficient to allow them to advance..."
Nate Silver found three things moderately correlated with postseason success: K/9, shutdown closer, sterling defense.
The Rangers have 1 of 3. They could trade for a shutdown closer, but even if they did their offense may short circuit that trade. So…. yes, the Rangers could use a trade for a closer to help them in the offseason, but they’re expensive and a bat is a more immediate need.
Nick+McGeary would require what kind of package? Maybe something like Hunter, Vallejo, Beltre?
Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D
Seriously
why the hell does Brandon Boggs (.405 obp at OKC) stay stapled to the bench when this offense has so many problems getting runners on base?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
same reason that a 900 OPS catcher can't get more than one start a week
"He's old school in that he give up his groin like that. It hurt me when he do that" -- Worsh on Chris Davis' stretch at first base to end the game vs. the Angels on 5/16
Tricer
Washington just doesn’t like Boggs and I’m starting to think he feels the same way about Teagarden.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales on Jun 15, 2009 11:11 AM CDT up reply actions
"Washington just doesn't like Boggs..."
Now how in the hell would you know that?
Wash is a racist 'cause he won't play Boggs! Oh, wait...
Perhaps Wash and the coaches are not too impressed with Boggs’ approach in BP. Or maybe he is nursing an injury, but not anything significant enough to DL him, and he is the best option in an emergency.
The point is, not one person here knows why he is not playing more, and any and all conjecture is futile.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
Heh
I believe he’s referring to Teagarden.
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 15, 2009 12:07 PM CDT up reply actions
Thats what I thought he meant
Maybe he meant 600 OPS catcher. Small sample size nontheless.
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒE
well hes right at 900 for his mlb career with the hot streak last year
but i certainly don’t think hes a 900 ops catcher heh.
the preceding post was a great success.
If we had one
they would be the everyday starter I’m sure.
However, it seems to be the Rangers place in the world to get 250/300/400 catchers. Thats about what we’ve been getting from the position since Pudge left.
"He (Padilla) shouldve gone back to Venezuela and watched on his Direct TV waiting to find out who his new team would be!!. ." - crops.mlblogs.com
Welcome to MLB?
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
We do have one
Teagarden has a 899 OPS for his major league career and the exact same for his minor league career. I know about the small sample and all, but the point is that he has posted that number and it warrrants additional playing time.
I’d give him a month or two of steady playing time and see what he does, because the only time he’s been afforded that opportunity – he freaking raked.
"He's old school in that he give up his groin like that. It hurt me when he do that" -- Worsh on Chris Davis' stretch at first base to end the game vs. the Angels on 5/16
No
I can throw out the fact that he has a 630 OPS this year and it is equally as viable
this goes for Parman below as well, if salty is your “starting” catcher you have to give him the job and the chance and ride it out. Furthermore, if you sit there and tell him to improve his d, you cant subsequently punish him when he does do that and then another part of his game obviously drops slightly. I am confident that salty will become a good offensive player but it also isnt going to happen overnight.
More importantly, anyone who thinks TT will hit any better if he plays everyday is simply being dense.
and the presented OPS numbers are a joke anyways….A ball is what those are from
in AA & AAA he posted far lower numbers…728 in AAA….
I love TT as a former horn, but he is never going to be a big time hitter
are you going to play Boggs in CF?
if not, Murphy’s bat is too hot to sit right now, and Cruz shouldn’t ever sit. There’s just no room for Brandon to play more. Especially with Hank and Andruw on this team.
"Hang-Dai, Wu...Hang-Fu$&ing-Dai"
by Walter Sobchak on Jun 15, 2009 5:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Murphy
He’s not hot against lefthanders.
by Darrell McKown on Jun 15, 2009 10:33 PM CDT up reply actions
actually he is
something like 2 for his last 3 against them. and don’t give me “sample size” – I don’t buy into such arguments
"Hang-Dai, Wu...Hang-Fu$&ing-Dai"
by Walter Sobchak on Jun 16, 2009 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions
Bothers me greatly
to not see shortened swings with two strikes. This is a simple concept that should be learned at the little league level. I find myself genuinely surprised when Davis or Salty shortens up and slaps a ball opposite field for a 2 strike base hit.
hitters don't shorten up their swings with 2 strikes like they used to
that goes for all of MLB
A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings.
Very pronounced on our squad though
Boston hitters in particular guard the plate well with 2 strikes and it is no accident that they’ve been tough to beat in the last few years. If nothing else it drives up the pitch count of the starter to slap a few borderline pitches foul.
the big thing with Boston and clubs like that
they make pitchers throw more strikes because they don’t chase bad pitches. Our team chases so many bad pitches to get to 2 strikes it’s ridiculous. Our plate discipline is the worst, and that doesn’t look like it is going to change anytime soon
A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings.
I agree with everything...
besides the part about David Murphy as just a 4th outfielder.
Of course, I may be bias. He’s probably my favorite player on this team.
I doubt you have anything to offer
that says otherwise, statistically.
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 15, 2009 12:09 PM CDT up reply actions
All they got
is how good he looks when he is on a hot streak.
He is a decent enough platoon OF I think.
"He (Padilla) shouldve gone back to Venezuela and watched on his Direct TV waiting to find out who his new team would be!!. ." - crops.mlblogs.com
indeed
Murph isn’t the glamorous option, but you could do much worse as an every day LF
"Hang-Dai, Wu...Hang-Fu$&ing-Dai"
by Walter Sobchak on Jun 15, 2009 5:17 PM CDT up reply actions
if we had a healthy Hamilton and Cruz
you don’t think Murphy being an every day starter would still equal one of the best outfields around?
"Hang-Dai, Wu...Hang-Fu$&ing-Dai"
by Walter Sobchak on Jun 15, 2009 5:18 PM CDT up reply actions
It probably would.
That doesn’t mean Boggs should be benched against LHP.
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 16, 2009 12:23 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm certain
they’ll score runs. The number of runs is the question.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
They'll come in bursts
because the team can still hit HRs, they just can’t sustain offenses with high obp.
"He (Padilla) shouldve gone back to Venezuela and watched on his Direct TV waiting to find out who his new team would be!!. ." - crops.mlblogs.com
When does some blame fall on Rudy?
I am not saying it’s 100% on him; it isn’t. But why is he impervious to any criticism?
by j-r-d on Jun 15, 2009 10:59 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
blasphemy!
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
Mitch Moreland - 2009 Rangers Minor League POY
by RangerMad on Jun 15, 2009 11:04 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
I know he's not a Greek God of Walks,
but I wouldn’t mind a little Borbon trial run.
"I saw your act, just didn't make it for me. Just a lot of fluff."
What would he give you that Boggs cannot
Offensively?
Kanye, you want to be the voice of this generation? Get in line! It goes me, Obamagirl, the Freecreditreport.com guys, then It's a tie between you-and Crocs.
-Stephen Colbert
by Conjunction on Jun 15, 2009 11:06 AM CDT up reply actions
Not sure
That’s what I’d like to see. The OBP would probably be similar, but Boggs is a lifetime .225 hitter in the bigs. I think Borbon could make stuff happen on the bases, maybe provide more of a spark.
"I saw your act, just didn't make it for me. Just a lot of fluff."
Not a real big sample size on Boggs, though.
I love Bourbon long term, but I’d rather see Boggs right now cause his track record at the plate shows a very patient hitter with a little bit of pop.
At the very least in a platoon role with Murphy, maybe even everyday.
Versus LHP: Murph sits, Boggs in LF, Byrd in CF.
Versus RHP: Byrd Sits, Murph in LF, Boggs in CF.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 11:24 AM CDT up reply actions
This just seems so obvious
I don’t understand why it isn’t happening.
"He will not coddle them. Nolan Ryan doesn’t coddle." - Jeff Passan
by Dirk Diggler on Jun 15, 2009 11:31 AM CDT up reply actions
i definitely agree with murphy sitting against lefties
but im not so sure id sit byrd against righties. byrd has actually been much better against righties than lefties this year. Yeah it’s a small sample so far, but as a Ranger, his OPS is pretty much the same from both sides of the plate. i dont think you can reliably get better production from boggs in lieu of byrd there.
by Smoakin in the Boys Room on Jun 15, 2009 11:44 AM CDT up reply actions
Id call 280+ ABs on a pretty regular basis a decent enough sample size
And coupled with his minor league history I wouldn’t expect him to all of a sudden start hitting .300.
He can get on base by walking but if hes gonna be hitting at the bottom of the lineup in front of guys like Davis and Salty who are struggling I think all him playing will do is lead to more “men left on base”
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
why are we still killing Davis?
he’s been one of our BETTER hitters over the past 2 weeks
"Hang-Dai, Wu...Hang-Fu$&ing-Dai"
by Walter Sobchak on Jun 15, 2009 5:20 PM CDT up reply actions
Those two weeks are bouyed by two games
The 5-8 he went in the last game in NY and first game in Boston really inflate his June numbers. Take those two games out and his June line looks like this
.172/ .250/ .241
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
lol
Take out 3 games out of what, 10 or 11 total? That’s just bull shit to take away 1/3 of the games he’s played in and just leave the bad ones in.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
Only took out two
And those two games counted for 20% of this months PAs so those numbers are for the other 80% of the month. Hes looked better but lets not proclaim him recovered yet
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
thought you took out the Boston game too
Anyways, do you not see anything wrong with what you did? He went 0-4 twice in June. Lets keep the 2 NY games and toss out those 2 0-4 games. This is his line:
.345/.406/.517
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
let's just eliminate every at bat that he struck out
I bet that would help his numbers quite a bit. LOL.
"He's old school in that he give up his groin like that. It hurt me when he do that" -- Worsh on Chris Davis' stretch at first base to end the game vs. the Angels on 5/16
hahaha
nice.
"Hang-Dai, Wu...Hang-Fu$&ing-Dai"
by Walter Sobchak on Jun 16, 2009 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions
I took out the last game of the NY series where he went 2-4 with 2 doubles
And the first of the Boston series where he went 3-4 with one double.
You don’t take out games that go with the trends of the entire season. If he was a .300 hitter this year then you would leave those in. But since he is a .200 hitter a couple good games are the anomaly rather than the norm.
I think hes getting better but hes gonna have to have more 2 hit games for me to not look at those as anomalies. He has only 8 multi hit games this year. Thats not good.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
I think he's been improving a lot over the past couple of weeks
He’s making contact with the ball and showing a lot more patience at the plate. He’s still not fully there, but he’s improved a lot over where he was a few weeks ago. Since we’re talking about a recent development, its stupid to cut down the sample size even more. Its even dumber to cut down that sample size by taking out 2 games where he was great in.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
I completely agree hes been improving
And if you want me to take away his two worst games as well then his line looks like this
.238/ .333/ .333
My original point was that Boggs getting on base in front of Davis and Salty right now wouldn’t exactly mean we start scoring 6 runs a game. Because even if Boggs walked alot like he normally does he would most likely be stranded.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
And taking away his 2 worst starts in addition to his 2 best starts gets you...
7 games!!! That’s why you don’t trim down a small sample into something smaller.
As for the Boggs part of that argument, well that’s to someone else. My whole thing was the Davis chopping of numbers.,
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
OK
Well then don’t try and tell me hes been one of our better hitters the last two weeks when in reality he had two really good games and then a bunch of mediocre stuff
Hes looked alot better of late I am not arguing that. But hes still struggling pretty bad
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
Except he has been one of our better hitters over the last 2 weeks
He didn’t have to be anything but mediocre to do that.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
don't take shit out
just tell me what he’s done lately and be done with it. don’t pick and choose. he’s one of the only bat that showed up in a couple of those games
"Hang-Dai, Wu...Hang-Fu$&ing-Dai"
by Walter Sobchak on Jun 16, 2009 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm convinced
its the backup QB syndrome. No one is more loved than the player on the farm who hasn’t sucked in the majors yet.
"He (Padilla) shouldve gone back to Venezuela and watched on his Direct TV waiting to find out who his new team would be!!. ." - crops.mlblogs.com
well you can't prove that point
until he actually plays. I think at some point in the next 2 weeks if the offense doesn’t pick it up, it’s worth a look
"Hang-Dai, Wu...Hang-Fu$&ing-Dai"
by Walter Sobchak on Jun 15, 2009 5:20 PM CDT up reply actions
He's only 22.
In his second year at Western Oklahoma, a small school in Altus – about 140 miles southwest of Oklahoma City – Almonte has posted impressive numbers, helping his team to the Junior College Division II World Series, which begins today.
In 58 games, Almonte has hit 17 home runs, driven in 75 runs and hit 22 doubles and five triples while posting a .485 batting average.
Though primarily an outfielder, Almonte is still dominant when he takes the mound. In 12 starts this season, he is 8-0 with a 4.07 ERA. In 48-2/3 innings, he has fanned 62 batters.
But the lefthander whose 70mph Little League fastball was the equivalent of a 92 mph big-league heater is no longer a flamethrower. His fastball has rarely reached the 90s, more often hitting the mid-to-upper 80s. He also throws a curveball and a changeup but doesn’t have the eye-opening “stuff” that scouts are looking for.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
This team can produce runs against crappy pitching
we’ll probably score about 20-25 runs against Wandy Rodriguez, Russ Ortiz, and Mike Hampton this week.
It’s Zito, Cain, and Randy Johnson this weekend that I’m worried about.
Greatest Inventions Ever? 1. TiVO, 2. Boobs, 3. Baseball
Wandy Rodriguez
Having a pretty fabulous year, actually.
"[Font} doesn't turn 19 until the end of May and his heater can already hit 99 on the gun. That's baseball porn." - Jason Parks
by hightowersmith on Jun 15, 2009 11:18 AM CDT up reply actions
at least we're not facing him in Houston
He’s been awesome at home and good on the road.
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/7552/splits;_ylt=AuryUsJ92zNGJZaikG1nnAeFCLcF
Assuming we sit Murphy and one of Davis/Blalock, we should go into those matchups with only one LHH.
But, still.
Yah, it scares me a bit, too.
Do we get Lincecum, btw? I haven’t checked. I watched his last start and OH MY GOD is he good right now. He was throwing some straight up Nintendo breaking balls. Guys would just watch them go by and then get this comical look on their faces. It was great. I could watch him pitch all day… just hopefully never against us. Ever.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 11:27 AM CDT up reply actions
I think we miss Lincecum
"He's old school in that he give up his groin like that. It hurt me when he do that" -- Worsh on Chris Davis' stretch at first base to end the game vs. the Angels on 5/16
Phew...
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 11:28 AM CDT up reply actions
double the good luck
he pitches against the Halos Wednesday.
"He's old school in that he give up his groin like that. It hurt me when he do that" -- Worsh on Chris Davis' stretch at first base to end the game vs. the Angels on 5/16
Oh, man. That's gonna be a fun game to watch.
My favorite pitcher to watch ever versus the team I want to lose the most ever.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 11:35 AM CDT up reply actions
Haha...the perfectness of it.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
Part of me says, "Damn, I wanna watch him"
The bigger part says, “Phew”
"I saw your act, just didn't make it for me. Just a lot of fluff."
We've proven that we suck against all pitching..
crappy or otherwise.
Dontrelle Willis, for starters.
The offense is better than this, with or without Hamilton
Davis and Salty have had their share of problems this season and have been a big part of why this team hasn’t scored many runs this season. They are still very young players though and could improve a lot as the season goes on. Outside of that though, you’ve also got Blalock and Byrd who were going to be two key offensive forces in the lineup and they have just hacked away at everything this season. They’ve got 17 walks between them in 411 PAs. David Murphy has more walks than that in his 153 PAs. Those two need to stop hacking away if the offense is going to do something.
The rest of this team will go through their slumps like any other player in the league, but those two guys are the veteran bats who we expect more out of. Byrd needs to take a pitch or two and Blalock has to learn that not every pitch is a perfect HR pitch. I can deal with the young players struggling and finding out who is part of the team’s core group of players vs. those that are not. The veterans who are supposed to perform better are the ones that I have a problem with.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
Agreed.
I don’t think Hamilton’s OBP is so fantastic that his DL stint ruins this team.
The Rangers strike out 4% more often than the average team (this could be Davis by himself, since he has 92 strikeouts), and walk 1.5% less often. If we walked more often, the offense wouldn’t be quite so streaky.
it's not his OBP
it’s the threat of his bat. it’s not having him on base that scares or hurts opposing pitchers…
"Hang-Dai, Wu...Hang-Fu$&ing-Dai"
by Walter Sobchak on Jun 15, 2009 5:22 PM CDT up reply actions
How many pitches per at bat
for Elvis right now?
Moving Kinsler down into the 3 spot might not be bad.
There might be some sense in moving Kins out of the leadoff spot.
Just checking his splits, and he’s been very bad when leading off an inning (.188/.278/ .375—96 ABs) or when hitting with nobody on base (.200/.284/.394—170 ABs). By contrast, when hitting with runners on, Ian’s line is .388/.452/.750—80 ABs. Why not move him down to 3rd? Even with his horrid April, Murph has a .340 OBP and has been better than Ian when leading off an inning or batting with nobody on base. Ideally, you would see Boggs get a shot, but until Wash decides that Jones really is as bad as he’s shown the last couple of seasons, I just don’t see that happening.
You're still crazy
Look at those numbers again, he’s talking about a small sample, a long slump. This team does not currently have anyone better than Kinsler as a leadoff option.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
If that's a small sample, then any stats from the season are meaningless ...
when used to judge a player’s current performance—which doesn’t make any sense at all. That’s the player’s performance to date. I don’t think you can discount the numbers over 96 ABs and 170 ABs and almost 2 and a half months of time in the batting slot.
Kinsler
is the best leadoff hitter this team has right now. Period. I don’t care what the sample size is. Talk of Andrus or Murphy at leadoff is insane. Elvis is a #9 hitter who needs to be left there in his rookie year at age freakin’ 20. Murphy is a platoon player.
I totally agree Boggs needs more playing time.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
Fine....
he’s the best leadoff hitter. Would the lineup be better off with him as the 3 hitter is the question.
No, not right now at least.
Because you would then have an inferior leadoff hitter.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
You definitely can.
And one season’s worth of data can be a small sample as well. You could argue that Milton’s season last year was a statistical aberration, or GMJ’s 2005.
Not sure we disagree
I don’t think anyone in the current lineup is a better hitter than Kinsler. So in that sense he is the best hitter in the leadoff spot.
What I do wonder about is whether or not he’s the best guy to lead off. Notice I didn’t say anything about his slump. I simply said getting him to the three spot might be nice. If his slump was the problem I wouldn’t advocate his move to an equally important position in the lineup. I wouldn’t mind seeing Elvis or someone else get a shot there in the hopes that Kinsler can be even more productive in the lineup. Has nothing to do with his slump or my concern with his hitting overall.
A nice side benefit might be the occasional early walk and the extra pitches if you get someone that is more adept at being patient, which we all know Kins is not.
I agree that someday
it might be nice to have Kinsler move down, but not this year. There is no one on the club right now who should be there except Kinsler. Andrus is the #9 hitter, period. The lineup is not the problem, the execution is the problem.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
Well I don't know how to argue with.....
“period”.
I just don’t see how you justify that.
Andrus
is a 20 year old rookie doing very well — for a 20 year old rookie SS. He is not, by any stretch of the imagination a leadoff hitter. I simply cannot understand why anyone would think he’s a good option there right now. Hello, his OBP is .321. How on earth is that good for the leadoff spot? Just because some of the other hitters in the lineup are stinking up the joint doesn’t mean you mess around with Andrus. Leave him alone, that part is not broken, don’t fix it, please.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
I don't care if he's 12....
stop using his age as a crutch. I don’t buy into the theory that young, unproven guys should hit lower in the lineup as if a spot higher than 5th would somehow scar them. It’s pretty ridiculous to me actually.
His OBP is too low for that spot but not that much lower than the guy that’s been hitting their for 2.5 months.
In 2008 the lineup included Milton Bradly and Josh Hamilton in the 3 and 4 spots so they didn’t need Kinsler there. Now they might since neither of them is there.
I’m not suggesting this is THE answer. Just wondering if it might help. Your complete dismissal based on the 2008 lineup (below) and Andrus being fine in the 9 hole is odd. I’ll give you that Andrus isn’t putting up the best OBP and I wouldn’t advocate such a move on just any team. I’m not even really advocating it here.
bah....
their = there. I hate when I do that.
Err...
Lots of players will tell you that there’s more stress on them from batting at a certain part of the order because expectations are higher.
We’ve already asked this kid to skip AA and be our starting shortstop, which he has done without so much as blinking. You don’t think we should give him a break and just allow him some time to adjust to major league pitching without the added pressure of being in a crucial lineup spot?
I know..
the prevailing logic is that very young guys should be treated with kid gloves at times. I just disagree.
I don't think you have to worry about that.
The Rangers have been very aggressive with their young players. Holland has been thrown against tough teams in tough situations at 22, and for Andrus to be the every day SS at 20 is pretty aggressive no matter where in the lineup he hits.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
I don't think Andrus
will ever be a leadoff hitter, it’s not just his age and all that. Until and unless the team gets a better option, it’s best lineup has Kinsler at the top. Andrus is probably an 8 or 9 hitter, maybe a 2 hitter in the long term. He’s doing a good job there and I’d leave him alone.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
I would be happy with him hitting nine, honestly.
If you’ve read some of those lineup optimizer posts at BTB, they say that the nine hitter matters more than most people think because he frequently ends up batting in the same inning as your #1 and #2 hitters.
Andrus may never walk a lot (I’d be satisfied with a 5-6% walk rate), but as long as he maintains a decent contact rate, I’ll live with it.
So no matter how bad Kins is at doing things a leadoff hitter has to do ...
like get on base to lead off innings and when nobody is on, he should stay in that spot instead of moving down and taking advantage of hitting with more men on base in front of him? That’s an excellent idea if your goal is to keep the offense where it currently sits. If your goal is something else, then leaving Kins in a situation where he’s not having success seems futile.
In 2008
Kinsler had a .377 OBP as the leadoff hitter. He’s been bad LATELY. And so has the rest of the lineup. You’re just rearranging the deck chairs, it’s not going to “fix” the lineup. I repeat, there is no hitter in the current Rangers lineup who is a better option for the leadoff spot. Just because Kinsler is slumping doesn’t mean you put an inferior hitter there.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
I'd really be interested in throwing Murph out there
at 1 and Kinsler down to 3 for a week just to shake IAN up…
"Hang-Dai, Wu...Hang-Fu$&ing-Dai"
by Walter Sobchak on Jun 15, 2009 5:25 PM CDT up reply actions
Actually, MY might be your best leadoff option.
Leading off an inning: .450/.463/.625—40 ABs
Nobody on: .361/.397/.544—1547ABs
Meh
He doesn’t have a walk spread in either of those lines and he’s not going to hit .350+.
Seems like a lot of hand-wringing is going on here. I’m fine with moving Kinsler down, but not because he is in a slump. I think you move him down if you think he is ready to hit in the middle of the order, but I don’t think he has shown that.
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 15, 2009 12:22 PM CDT up reply actions
Why not move him down to 3rd?
If you take out the 3 months of Ian’s career (Apr ’07, Jun ’08, Apr ’09) when he has gone Albert Pujols on everybody, he has never had a month with an ops above .900. (I am ignoring Apr/May ’06 due to sample size.) Ian is a very good 2B, not an #3 hitter on a good offensive team.
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
Mitch Moreland - 2009 Rangers Minor League POY
Those stats are really useless
Do you really think the same guy who is a .200 hitter with bases empty can reasonably be a .388 hitter with man on base? I mean, we are talking about the same guy here, not some Ted Williams doppelganger brother who lives inside his body and comes out only with man on base. Stats like this are like pinch hitting stats, or batting average against pitchers who wear size 10 hats. They don’t mean a whole lot, but people gladly take them and run with it in attempt to justify their point of view.
I buy the argument that there may be a difference in approach for some players depending on where they hit in the order, but I doubt the differences even in those cases are going to be very large.
RIght.
The rule of all stats seems to be that the ones you don’t like are useless; or they are too small a sample size; or any other reason that sounds plausible. Like it or not, in 2009 Ian has performed substantially better in situations where he has people on base in front of him. It may just be a mental thing with Ian or it may be a coincidence, but I seriously doubt his psyche is going to be wounded by moving him from leadoff to the spot in the lineup usually reserved for your best hitter. Further, almost anybody on the team could do a better job in the leadoff spot RIGHT NOW, and given the team’s need of an offensive boost, perhaps a few games of letting hitters hit in situations where they’ve been the most successful this season would provide such a boost.
All of this changes when Hamilton comes back anyway as he probably steps back into the 3rd spot, but until then, can moving the order around really make this offense produce any worse than it is right now?
Stats reflect reality, no doubt about it, but they don't care about the conclusions you make off them.
Has he hit better with man on base so far this year? Certainly. The better question is: is there any plausible reason to believe that he is a .200 hitter with bases empty and .388 hitter otherwise? This is what you have suggested right? He is a much better hitter with man on base than with bases empty. Is this a trend that will be maintained or simply an abnormality? I don’t care about psyche or any of that crap – I don’t think that matters much either, but the argument still doesn’t make any sense. He has sucked the last few weeks hitting lead-off, so he should stop hitting lead-off, but the problem is that he has sucked the last few weeks – as a hitter. Maybe we should just bench him, I am sure almost anybody on the team could do a better job hitting RIGHT NOW. Why does it matter where he hits? By your logic, he shouldn’t be hitting at all because he sucks at the present. What about this, he has an OPS of .572 in the month of June. Clearly he is not a June hitter, so every June, we should sit him. Also, he has an OPS of .616 in away games. Clearly he is not an away hitter, we should only play him in home games. Don’t like these stats and the conclusions that I draw from them? Why don’t you look at your own argument?
By my logic he shouldn’t be playing? Really?
It has always fascinated me how when you are debating somebody they like to tell you what your argument really is, and they straw-man it so they can easily dismiss it. Naturally, if you insist on ignoring the human elements of the game like psyche, then what I have suggested probably doesn’t make much sense. Here’s the problem: the game is played by real flesh and blood human beings, and not by random number generators on computer simulators. Like it or not, there is a very strong human element in this game and a hitter is not going to produce the exact same numbers year in and year out. Sometimes hitters respond after they’ve been given an off day. Sometimes they hit better when they are in their natural defensive position. Any number of seemingly random things can affect a hitter’s performance. Kins is in an extended slump. Is making a change—even a temporary change—really doomed to failure, even though the statistics to date seem to support taking the chance? That is basically what you are arguing.
Am I wrong?
You argue that he has hit poorly with nobody on base, but well with man on base. Therefore, your conclusion is that he is a poor hitter without man on base, but a good hitter with man on base. Therefore, we should take him out of a position that he is not good at (hitting with nobody on base), and put him in a position that he is good at (hitting with man on base). I argue that while this is logical, the stats you quoted does not necessarily prove your assumption that he is indeed bad when hitting with nobody on base.
Of course, you qualify your statement by saying that this is probably temporary, so a move like this would only be short-term one for the best of the team, because anybody else on the team would likely perform better at the lead-off spot that he would. I point out that he has been hitting poorly, period, and in the same sense, anybody would likely hit better at any spot that he would. Therefore, as a short-term solution, for the best of the team, he should not be playing by this argument.
You can of course, contend that this is not what you meant. You want to put him in the 3rd spot because you believe that he will be much better there, therefore it is not necessary to take him out of the lineup altogether. You mean that he is ONLY POOR in the leadoff spot, supported by the stats you have quoted. I then give you the other splits, like his monthly splits and home/road splits, and say that you can’t treat the man-on-base split any differently than any of the other splits. Unless there is convincing evidence and makes sense logically, there is no reason any one of these splits should be treated differently than another.
Yes, I do believe that there is a human elements in the game, but its effects are too greatly exaggerated. However, that’s not the point of my argument, but merely a passing remark. The main issue here is that I don’t think, and have not suggested that the changes you’ve suggested are doomed for failure, but rather, I think it will make very little difference. The stat you quoted may suggest your point of view may be correct, but it does not have enough weight to be more convincing than similar arguments constructed based on other splits like home/road, and monthly ones.
Sigh ...
My conclusions based upon his stats for this season apply only to the present. I’m not making any blanket statements regarding Kinsler’s overall abilities as a hitter. So yes, in your over-generalization of my argument you are wrong. He has been bad when hitting with the bases empty this season. Any at bats he gets this year will affect the outcome of games in this season only, so yes, it makes sense to pay attention to statistical trends and make adjustments, particularly where a hitter is struggling. It happens all of the time. That’s why we argue that certain players need to sit against righties or lefties. That’s why we talk about limiting a reliever’s appearance to pitching to like-handed hitters.
Your “you’re REALLY saying he shouldn’t be playing” is a mischaracterization of my my argument. If your solution to his slump is to sit him, that’s fine. Mine is to keep him in but give him a change of scenery and do that based upon where he has shown strength over the course of the season. I really can’t say it any plainer than that. If you try to change my argument to say anything else, then you’re bastardizing the debate. It really is that simple.
Your response seems to boil down to, “Kins is sucking. Just live with it.” That’s fine. I understand the notion of leaving players alone in hopes they get their heads straight and I’m sure Kins will eventually. My point is that there is some statistical support for moving him to the third spot to see if he’s more comfortable there. If you disagree, that’s fine, but you can say that without the straw man bullshit to back up your point.
Stat trends
What you are looking at has little to no significant correlation with anything. Kinsler failing to hit while leading off innings or hitting better with men on base just doesn’t have much significance with anything. Yes, he hasn’t hit well while leading off the inning this season, but that doesn’t mean that its anything more than a statistical fluke.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
Fine.
The stats could be a fluke. Then again, maybe they’re not. Stats are what they are, a simple source of information showing how a player is performing in given situations over the long or short term. A leadoff hitter is going to lead off more innings and bat more often with nobody on base. The oddities of Kinsler’s 2009 performance may simply be flukish as you assert. Then again, maybe there’s a reason he’s performed poorly in those situations. Either way, is he really going to get any worse if you make a move based upon his 2009 stats? All I’ve been saying is that making a move based upon his current trends might be a catalyst to getting him back on track. Nothing more. It really is baffling to me that such an idea is attacked with such vitriol because I had the temerity to cite a few stats which supported the idea.
What do you think those reasons are?
What are the reasons that a guy like Kinsler would hit so dramatically different based on if someone is on base or not or if he’s leading off the inning or not. There is no “attacking with such vitriol” going on here. You just can’t point to some split that has little significance and use that as any kind of proof unless you have some other reasoning behind it. Its the same basic argument against the whole clutch theory only the stats are even less significant since you have less of a reason to see any difference in the stats.
And like it or not, Kinsler is still one of the best hitters on the team even if he is in a slump now. Go ahead and make a move to shake things up, but that is far from any guarantee when 6 or 7 of the other guys in the lineup aren’t doing any better than Kinsler in the leadoff spot. Kinsler is still the best leadoff hitter we have.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
I'm not sure about the reasoning
but I agree with 100% in that what he’s doing right now isn’t working and making a change in his spot in the lineup could hardly hurt.
The lineup as is seems broken, why not try to fix it?
"He's old school in that he give up his groin like that. It hurt me when he do that" -- Worsh on Chris Davis' stretch at first base to end the game vs. the Angels on 5/16
How do you fix it?
You think re-arranging the names on the lineup card is going to make everyone hit better?
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
do you think it will make them hit worse?
If not, then why not give it a try?
"He's old school in that he give up his groin like that. It hurt me when he do that" -- Worsh on Chris Davis' stretch at first base to end the game vs. the Angels on 5/16
you act like switching up the lineup is something radical and unheard of
Actually managers do it all the time to try and get a slumping player or team going. Maybe it helps, maybe it has no effect – but if it has no effect, then there is no harm done, right?
"He's old school in that he give up his groin like that. It hurt me when he do that" -- Worsh on Chris Davis' stretch at first base to end the game vs. the Angels on 5/16
I think that right now
There are too many players playing poorly for one move to make any kind of a difference. I like the lineup as is right now. You have the best hitters hitting 1st, 2nd, and 4th in Kinsler, Young, and Cruz. This lineup is missing Hamilton in the 3 spot and just making sure Blalock never hits there is the only thing I would change in the lineup. Otherwise, you’re just moving around crappy hitters hoping that they’ll pick things up.
And if Wash had a lineup where Kinsler was 4th, Andrus leading off, Blalock in the number 3 spot, and whatever other changes you want to make, I wouldn’t be pissed. I just think its pointless and that the Rangers would end up keeping the lineup mostly the same soon afterward. I don’t think the sky is falling though and think that we’ll see these hitters get out of their slumps soon since they (for the most part) seem aware of their problems. If you want to try a line-up change, fine. Just don’t expect too much and think that there is some stastical reasoning behind it.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
Agree with AJM about Boggs
But don’t really agree about Hamilton’s absence being the problem. Adding Hambone would be adding yet another impatient hitter to a lineup full of them. (That’s not to say I don’t want him back, of course I want him back,) but any opposing pitcher who’s seen any tape of this lineup knows that all they have to do is throw 1 strike per at bat. Then they can count on our guys to hack at just about anything.
I think the problem is that we need someone like Milton Bradley who can show these young hitters what a patient approach looks like. The vets that should be leading the way with this, Young and Blalock and Jones, are failiing. And Rudy has never seemed to be hip to this aspect of hitting.
well I'm sure the Cubbies wouln't mind getting rid of Bradley
He’s been awful this year, when he’s actually healthy, and he’s proving pretty quickly that he should never play in the field.
Can we trade Blalock and AJones for Milton?
I was a Ranger fan when being a Rangers fan wasn't cool.
And his three year contract?
A guy who admitted to dogging it while with the Rangers?
by NorCalRangersFan on Jun 15, 2009 11:40 AM CDT up reply actions
Well
If he is dogging it and lifting his skirt everyother day what kind of production is that?
2009 Texas Rangers: Why The Hell Not Us?--ghtd36 on May 13, 2009
more than what we're getting.
we miss his presence. I’m not saying I want him back, at that contract, but we miss his presence. A Nick Johnson trade would do some reversing of those trends that we developed when we let Milton go
"Hang-Dai, Wu...Hang-Fu$&ing-Dai"
by Walter Sobchak on Jun 15, 2009 5:27 PM CDT up reply actions
Now I'm more depressed
I had been thinking all those things that Adam wrote, but seeing them written down seems to validate them more and give them more weight. They are very heavy words. Let some other team carry them for a while.
by NorCalRangersFan on Jun 15, 2009 11:28 AM CDT reply actions
Like it or not this years offense is missing 2 primary
hitters that were at their best last season Hamilton and Bradley, they did not replace Milts bat in the off season and we all know of Hammy’s problems, until they bring in a veteran bat (like Bradley last year and Sammy the year before) this offense will not be very good
Larry Parrish Was Da Man!
That's what this team is missing
A veteran bat like Sammy’s.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
Sammy?!
Really? That’s what we need?
by NorCalRangersFan on Jun 15, 2009 11:29 AM CDT up reply actions
I wanted us to go after Moises Alou or Gary Sheffield this off season.
Is Alou still out there?
He can still rape lefties in the face.
And, yah, I’d take Bonds in a second, though I don’t know how that’d work with all his legal troubles.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 11:32 AM CDT up reply actions
I know no one else is talking about this, but
hell yes, I’d take Bonds in a second, too.
Don’t know what we’d give up for Holliday, but I’d be open to that option too.
You don't want Bonds' baggage.
But I seriously doubt you’d refuse the bat if he wasn’t a distraction.
Even at 42.
I despise Bonds
I would be tempted to root against the rangers if they signed bonds
he is a perfect example of a horrible human being and what is wrong with the game
absolute scum
LOL
Yeah, Bonds would be great. Nothing like a 42 year old broken down body who hasn’t played in 2 years.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
and
who OPS’d 1.045 in almost 500 pa’s as a 40 year old with a broken down body. What a disaster that OPS+ of 170 would be for our struggling lineup.
"You'll meet them again on their long journey to the middle." -Lester Bangs
And I'm sure he'd be able to do just that
at 42 when he hasn’t played in 2 full years. The guy had enough injury concerns before his “forced” retirement, you think he’s in better game shape now?
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
Take into account...
He was 40, playing the field in AT&T Park with no DH, and did that.
I think the guy, with a few weeks in the minors maybe?, could come back and play and have the potential to OPS .850-900, or better.
Similar to another NRI
It wouldn’t hurt to kick the tires around it.
I still don’t get the opposition to trying players out on an NRI.
It doesn’t hurt much if at all and the potential payout could be very good.
There’s very little downside (basically the Sosa case IS the downside, and we’ve been able to survive that), and right now we have a black hole at essentially 1B AND DH.
Since we’re actually in a race, it makes sense from a baseball standpoint to perhaps think of potential alternatives to what we currently have at 1B and DH.
It might not make sense from a business standpoint, but that’s a separate beast.
R
There's a difference between an NRI and Barry Bonds
First of all, this will never happen because no one here wants Bonds and it wouldn’t be worth it for the team to piss off fans by bringing him in.
Second, unless Bonds is on a new batch of roids, he won’t do much at this point.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
It seems I heard similar talk about a NRI earlier this year
How’s Andruw Jones doing?
For my money, a league minimum is close enough to an NRI, that there isn’t that much of a significant difference.
The whole point may be moot, though, because of your first point.
R
Answering your question.
How’s Andruw Jones doing?
He’s got a 903 OPS atm.
"He (Padilla) shouldve gone back to Venezuela and watched on his Direct TV waiting to find out who his new team would be!!. ." - crops.mlblogs.com
How's Andruw Jones doing?
Lets check in at the end of the season. Even with the HRs against the Dodgers, Jones still only has a .704 OPS in his last 28 days (50 PAs).
Anyways, I’m sure you’re right about Bonds. I’m sure the 44 (45 in July) year old Bonds still is feared by pitchers everywhere. If we picked him up now, he’d probably have 100 intentional walks by the AS Break.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
I'm fine
with checking at the end of the season.
Even with the only 704 OPS in the last 28 days, he STILL has a 903 OPS.
Would you say he’s been a worthwhile sign so far?
Would you still say he has 0% chance of being a helpful contributor for the full year?
I’m not really sure why you’re bringing up straw men. Bonds doesn’t haven’t to necessarily be feared to be effective. He doesn’t have to draw 100 intentional walks by the AS break (or for the whole season – he only had ONE season where he was IBB > 100 times) to be effective.
You seem to want to take this all or nothing approach where INSERT PICKUP NAME HERE is an uber-god or worthless.
The real world is not that black and white.
R
I'd say he's worth the signing so far
And has been a helpful contributor to the team up to now.
Bonds at this point in time isn’t the power threat he once was. He’s not going to get intentionally walked every time he comes up to the plate or pitched around to give him that .480 OBP. There’s no straw man argument here. Do you think he’s pitchers are going to walk a 44/45 year old guy 150 or more times like he was in the past?
And sorry for being so dismissive about something that will never happen in a million years. I’m sorry I don’t think a 44/45 year old broken down body off of steroids who hasn’t played in a real game since September 26, 2007 isn’t any type of solution to this team’s problems.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
My point was
that you said the exact same things about the Andruw Jones signing, and that’s turned out into a scenario which YOU COULDN’T ENVISION.
There’s no straw man argument here. Do you think he’s pitchers are going to walk a 44/45 year old guy 150 or more times like he was in the past?
That is completely a straw man argument, since nobody said they expect him to walk 150 times or more.
They think there’s a decent possibility even at age 44/45 that he’ll be better than what we currently have at 1B and DH (OBPs of .266 and .294).
He possibly doesn’t even need more than 50 walks for the rest of the season to match what Davis and Blalock are likely to provide over the rest of the season.
The point is that there’s a decent possibility that if we signed him, he would be useful.
Yet like the Andruw Jones signing, you’ve already made up your mind that it would never be possible in 1000 years.
R
I never said I couldn't envision him being productive
My argument against Jones making the team (nothing against bringing him in as an NRI) was that I believed he wouldn’t hit well and was just going to be another DH who can’t (or at least shouldn’t) play on the field who could take away playing time from players who need it more. I didn’t say it was a 100% lock that he wouldn’t hit, I said that I didn’t think he would. I even said at the time that if I was wrong on that, the question should then be how much better than our other options would he be. I also said that we weren’t getting any draft pick compensation for him no matter what and that he wouldn’t be bringing back much in a trade. And all of this was said with the expectation that this team wasn’t going to do this great this year. A 1st place team looking to make a strong playoff run has a use for a platoon DH.
The straw man argument…Really? Okay, not 150 times. How about 100 times? You’re paying so much attention to that number of walks. The number doesn’t matter, but you’re bringing Bonds in because of his on-base skills and that is what you keep missing in my posts or just decide to call it a straw man argument and move on.
Here’s a question for you, do you think we are going to continue getting a .270 and .310 OBP from our 1B and DH from here on out (that’s what they have done, which includes Jones)? If Jones is the real deal like you have been pointing out, he’s going to get more playing time at DH while Blalock sits a lot more. Davis has shown signs of life in the past couple of weeks and is still a 23 year old who has dominated the minors in his time there. He also has the support of the same guy who said Jones wasn’t done. So you tell me, do you think our 1B and DH production from this point forward is going to be that bad that we need to make a move for a guy in his mid 40s who hasn’t played in 2 years?
Also, if you want to start bringing back past arguments where I was wrong at, have fun with that. That’s about as relevant to this as me saying you’re an idiot for posting an R at the end of every single one of your posts. And seriously, are you arguing about going out to sign Bonds? Might as well argue that this team needs to go trade for Pujols since that has a much better chance of happening. So yes, my mind has been made up that this would never be possible in a 1000 years.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
by Gdawg on Jun 15, 2009 9:58 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Ok
You didn’t say you couldn’t envision him being productive.
You just said this:
Not if that 32 year old
Has been terrible the past 2 years. There are no negative numbers here. There is a 0% chance that Jones rebounds that much just like there was a 0% chance that Sosa rebounded
nothing against bringing him in as an NRI
What’s the point of bringing him in the first place if you’re “never want to see him making this team’s 40 man roster and definitely not its 25 man roster?”
I’m curious as to why you would bring a player in on an NRI without ever wanting to see him on the 40 man.
The straw man argument…Really? Okay, not 150 times. How about 100 times? You’re paying so much attention to that number of walks. The number doesn’t matter, but you’re bringing Bonds in because of his on-base skills and that is what you keep missing in my posts or just decide to call it a straw man argument and move on.
You’re bringing in Bonds because of TWO things, his OBP AND potential power. It’s not like he’s Juan Pierre or something. And yes, it’s a straw man because nobody was saying that’s he’s going to be intentionally walked 100 times.
Even without the intentional walking, Bonds has had a very good batting eye throughout his career. So he doesn’t NEED the intentional walking or fear of pitchers to still have a decent-good OBP. That’s where the straw man comes in. He still has the potential to be a good source of OBP and power.
Here’s a question for you, do you think we are going to continue getting a .270 and .310 OBP from our 1B and DH from here on out (that’s what they have done, which includes Jones)?
I wouldn’t be surprised if we got around .280-.325 OBP from both. Washington seems to stick with his vets (hence the whole Jones-Sosa worry).
If Jones is the real deal like you have been pointing out, he’s going to get more playing time at DH while Blalock sits a lot more. Davis has shown signs of life in the past couple of weeks and is still a 23 year old who has dominated the minors in his time there.
I don’t think it will be Blalock who sits. After all, Jones has been a better fielder, this year and historically except for last year, than your boy, Byrd ,and Murphy.
Though I’m not convinced that Jones will be able to sustain a 800+ OPS, I’ve been open to the possibility especially if used the right way.
I’m not that big of a Davis fan, which might be why I don’t hold much hope that the OBP will rise to average. Also, considering that his OBP has been very BA-dependent and he strikes out a TON, I don’t see where how he’ll improve to average OBP.
So you tell me, do you think our 1B and DH production from this point forward is going to be that bad that we need to make a move for a guy in his mid 40s who hasn’t played in 2 years?
Yes, I think it might possibly benefit from a player who posted season of 999 OPS/.454 OBP and 1045 OPS/.480 OBP in his last two seasons. Granted he might be rusty and/or bad now. But I’m OPEN TO THE POSSIBILITY.
Also, if you want to start bringing back past arguments where I was wrong at, have fun with that.
You’re doing something similar with the Bonds argument AS YOU DID WITH THE JONES argument.
THAT’S why I brought it up.
I don’t close my mind to any possibility that might help the Rangers. I don’t presume to know that some player “has no chance of helping a team” or “has no chance of rebounding or going back to his previous production levels.”
Can you say the same?
R
by Requiem on Jun 16, 2009 12:47 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
OT: I know we have a lot of soccer knowledgable dudes on this board.
What is this tournament thing that’s going on right now?
World Cup qualifier or something else? (Please tell me the US is gonna qualify for South Africa.)
USA vs. Italy in like 2 hours and I don’t know if it’s a big deal or just an exhibition or what.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
World Cup Qualifiers are going on
But US would not be playing Italy for that. They are not in our region. It is probably just an international friendly.
by NorCalRangersFan on Jun 15, 2009 11:32 AM CDT up reply actions
Yah, I figured it prolly wasn't a WCQ, but it looks like some sort of tournament.
We usually play shitty teams from Central America and the Carribean in WCQ’s I thought.
I should probably just go look it up, but I figured there’s usually tons of soccer fans here.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 11:34 AM CDT up reply actions
Its the FIFA Confederations Cup (in South Africa)
by NorCalRangersFan on Jun 15, 2009 11:34 AM CDT up reply actions
Confederations Cup
It’s a tournament which involves the winners of the various regional federation tournaments. The USA is there because they won the Gold Cup in 2007, which is a tournament between all the teams of CONCACAF (the soccer region for North America, Central America, and the Caribbean).
Europe, Asia, South America, Africa, and Oceania (basically all those Pacific Islands plus New Zealand) also sent their champions. In addition, Italy, who won the last World Cup, and South Africa, who are hosting the next world cup, got to send their national teams.
The Confederations Cup isn’t a big tournament like the regional tournaments or the World Cup, but it’s still entertaining for soccer junkies like myself.
"I dont care to debate with a troll." - Sharky
Brazil with a scare this morning. Surprising.
Does Zach Phillips have to choke a bitch to get to Frisco?
is it possible
to get out of this group and lose to spain in the semis of this tournament?
or to beat mexico in mexico city?
exploding highfive
More importantly for the US...
…it’s a great chance to develop your players against some of the best teams in the world when they are actually trying. They won’t be throwing their blood, sweat, and tears into it, but it’s probably similar to the Olympics as far as how much they care about it. Definitely under the World Cup.
I think most US fans aren’t expecting to get out of the group, but would like to see the team give good performances for all 3 games and come out with at least 2, preferably 4 points.
by GhettoBear04 on Jun 15, 2009 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions
Will the US have their best players available?
Will the other countries?
by NorCalRangersFan on Jun 15, 2009 12:11 PM CDT up reply actions
I saw Kaka for Brazil this morning, so that's a good sign in terms of good players playing.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 12:14 PM CDT up reply actions
Kaka belongs to my lawn guy
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
US team
I looked at their roster yesterday, and it looks like they sent their “A” squad for the most part.
Brazil does have a few of their stars playing, but mostly sent their “B” team. Granted, their “B” team is better than most nations’ “A” teams…
"I dont care to debate with a troll." - Sharky
Confederations Cup is what its called
Its basically a FIFA organized trial run for South Africa 2010 World Cup. It is a chance for South Africa to run security on a slightly less scale to get their bearings. it will be the first games matches at some of the nations new stadiums so that will get trial runs. Infrastructure tests etc. and a good way to lay the groundwork with a tourney featuring some of the better nations to get the world excited about 2010, so there is a marketing aspect to is as well. Here’s how its set up, what they have is 2 groups of 4 nations. 8 teams total. you play every1 in your group 2 times and top 2 from each group go to the knockout round which is basically a quarterfinal up playoff. but in the end, the Confederations Cup isnt that big a deal, but with italy spain usa and a bunch of other nations there it should be fun to watch.
spain is awesome to watch catch them.
the striker for italy Giuseppe Rossi, is born in new jersey and didnt even speak italian when he “returned” to italy to play for italy instead of the USA where he was developed.
brasil has kaka who real madrid just bought for 90M bucks and then they had to sign him to a contract for another 60M i figure. might wanna check him out.
good stuff, although im a club before country kinda guy
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
no i said a veteran bat, i did not say bring sammy back
he was the one year wonder like milton was last year, each year they brought in someone, they thought Jones was the guy this year, they were wrong
Larry Parrish Was Da Man!
Scott Shileds out for the season?
Bad for him, great for the Rangers!
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
Not really
He’s sucked this year.
I think JD’s doing this to spite all the "when we gon’ get sum pitchin’ in here" idiots.
JD’s like, "you want some fucking pitching? Here’s all the pitching you can stand. Now choke on it, bitches!"~ RCCook.
by Kinslerhomer on Jun 15, 2009 11:50 AM CDT up reply actions
In reflection, you are correct.
Shields, who had a 6.62 ERA and 1.75 WHIP in 17 2/3 innings.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
But if he'd gotten healthy it woulda been bad for us.
He’s pretty good when he’s right.
So having him go out for the year is infinitely better than having him go on the DL for two weeks and coming back fully healthy.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 12:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah, but that's meaningless. Only his career stats matter.
At least, that’s what they are saying to me above.
No, we're saying that your conclusions aren't necessarily valid.
Scot Shields may be in a decline phase, or it may be that his BABIP on grounders is high (it actually isn’t — both his BABIP on grounders and fly balls is lower than his career rates, but his line drive rate is around 200 points higher than normal, which tells me that he’s been a bit unlucky), or it may be that his K/BB ratio is at a career low (which it is…by a longshot).
In any case, you can also look at Kinsler’s BABIP and see that his groundball and flyball BABIP are both ridiculously low. He isn’t going to continue to hit .145 on grounders, and have a BABIP of 0.097 on fly balls. I would say that his average with the bases empty is more indicative of bad luck in than him having some sort of mental predisposition to sucking in the leadoff spot.
What veteran bats (outside of Nick Johnson) are actually avaliable?
Would any of these names makes sense…..
Mark Teahen (career .334 OBP)
Jermaine Dye (career .338 OBP)
Dye is a beast, ~.330 obp or not.
The guy would look wonderful as our DH.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 12:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Indeed.
I don’t think he’s a realistic target cause of the dollars, but I was just saying he’s a beast who’s bat would fit in here, mediocre OBP considered.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 12:27 PM CDT up reply actions
Well, it depends on the next month.
Even Dye and Teahen might not yet be available if those teams think they have a shot at the wildcard. The list of potentially available bats probably includes
Nick Johnson, Mark Teahen, Jermaine Dye, Jim Thome, Brad Hawpe, Russell Branyon, Prince Fielder, Victor Martinez, Nick Swisher, Todd Helton, Miguel Tejeda, Adam LaRoche
I’m probably not getting everyone. Johnson is the only one obviously available at the moment.
Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D
And LaRoche
Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D
Looking at the standings, LaRoche probably isn't available.
I was discriminating against historically-bad franchises, I guess, without judging them by their current performance.
Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D
I'd agree with you (they're only3 games under and 4 games out of first), but they're in fincancial trouble and have already shown they're willing to sell (McLouth).
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 12:26 PM CDT up reply actions
Good list.
Though I don’t think Prince Fielder belongs on there given how well the Brewers are playing, and I don’t think Helton’s going anywhere with that contract or that the Yanks are gonna deal a valuable part of their offense as they try to win a playoff spot.
I don’t see us as real contenders for V-Mart if they do decide to deal him, which I doubt they will. But he’d certainly look good here.
Tejada wouldn’t fit well here cause his value is really depressed if he has DH.
Andy Laroche might be interesting, though I’d prefer a RHH. He’d be a great fit for this ballpark with that Palmiero-esque easy upper cut lefty swing of his.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 12:24 PM CDT up reply actions
LaRoche...
Notorious for big second halves, too…
Nope.
Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D
I think I would
don’t they have him under control until ’12 or so?
You’re giving up the defense for a known masher who would rake at RBIA. I think Smoak will be a good all-around player, but I don’t think he’ll ever hit like Fielder.
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 15, 2009 12:37 PM CDT up reply actions
His contract ends after 2010, when he will become a FA.
I put Fielder on there because this is the time for them to move him for a Teixeira-type haul. I’m not going to be happy if the Rangers do that. I hope the Rangers save Smoak for a trade for a young TORP, like Josh Johnson; otherwise, I hope they don’t even consider trading Smoak.
Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D
Ok, well that changes things a bit, then.
Smoak isn’t worth 1.5 years of Fielder, unless they could work out an extension. (I’m not holding my breath.)
Josh Johnson — his avg. fastball was 96.4 on 80 of them that he threw to Toronto(?) yesterday. Peter Gammons even said that: “I think it’s pretty safe to say that Mr. Johnson and Mr. Cain will be due for a Cy Young one day.” Why can’t we get him? Florida is 6.0 GB, below .500, not a chance in hell they catch NYM or Philly.
Smoak, Max, Kiker, and Melo — would you? We would have Johnson until 2012 is my understanding.
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 15, 2009 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions
Smoak, Max, Kiker, and Melo — would you?
absolutely, without hesitation.
"He's old school in that he give up his groin like that. It hurt me when he do that" -- Worsh on Chris Davis' stretch at first base to end the game vs. the Angels on 5/16
You know i think that is a realistic package too
They may want Main (despite his season so far this year) instead.
by Michael Cave on Jun 15, 2009 1:37 PM CDT up reply actions
They would want more pitching upside
but yeah, I don’t think it is too far off.
"He's old school in that he give up his groin like that. It hurt me when he do that" -- Worsh on Chris Davis' stretch at first base to end the game vs. the Angels on 5/16
Right
but they also don’t need pitching per se. I think if you swap Main for Melo the Rangers wouldn’t do it. Who could we part with? NeRam?
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 15, 2009 1:45 PM CDT up reply actions
I wouldnt be too hurt
if we dealt those 4. Smoak was a blessing falling to us last year. I honestly dont think Kiker will be a rotation guy for us with what else we have coming down the pipe. I think that Chase is right about them needing another hitter instead of melo.
by Michael Cave on Jun 15, 2009 1:47 PM CDT up reply actions
It'll take something better than that
might have to include Feliz. Still interested?
That's why they call them business sox
yes
I’d try to get some bullpen help added to their side of the deal. But yes, for Josh Johnson I’d entertain the thought of giving up both Smoak and Feliz.
"He's old school in that he give up his groin like that. It hurt me when he do that" -- Worsh on Chris Davis' stretch at first base to end the game vs. the Angels on 5/16
JJ
he’s under team control through 2011.
"He's old school in that he give up his groin like that. It hurt me when he do that" -- Worsh on Chris Davis' stretch at first base to end the game vs. the Angels on 5/16
Can't do Feliz then.
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 15, 2009 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions
jesus guys...
give up the farm much?
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
Josh Johnson
Call me crazy, but I’m with you on this one.
Johnson has a great arm, but he had TJ surgery two years ago, and still hasn’t pitched more than 157 innings in any one season, majors or minors.
If I’m giving up Smoak and another top 10-15 prospect or two, I’d much rather give them up for a pitcher who’s proven he can throw 180-200 innings a few times in his career.
"I dont care to debate with a troll." - Sharky
Crazy man, siding with that "footy loving liberal".
Oh, wait…
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
Yeah
I am a footy-loving liberal.
Well, sort of- I do believe in gun rights and capital punishment, so I’m not sure where that puts me on the “liberal” scale.
"I dont care to debate with a troll." - Sharky
I was just calling you out :)
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
I see your point
but the thing is by the time a guy has thrown 180-200 innings a few times, he is either near free agency, or on a bloated contract.
And some would say that those type pitchers are MORE likely to get injured than a young guy with TJS in his rearview mirror and limited innings on his arm.
Lots to consider.
"He's old school in that he give up his groin like that. It hurt me when he do that" -- Worsh on Chris Davis' stretch at first base to end the game vs. the Angels on 5/16
If you throw Smoak and Feliz
the package stops there.
But damn, would that be a coup to have that guy in the rotation.
He makes the entire staff look better.
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 15, 2009 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions
I totally agree
his little injury issue bothers me a little though.
That's why they call them business sox
I would not,
Id start off with Smoak. Give them their choice of MaxRam, Teagarden and Salty. Choose any pitcher not named Holland, Feliz, Boscan, or Font. Plus another pitcher or bat (I still wouldnt like to give up beltre) excluding the pitchers above. I think the Rangers are at a point to start dealing from strength. That strength is their farm system.
by Michael Cave on Jun 15, 2009 1:52 PM CDT up reply actions
Bat - Blalock
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 15, 2009 1:56 PM CDT up reply actions
I wouldn't throw Perez in there either
2009 Texas Rangers: Why The Hell Not Us?--ghtd36 on May 13, 2009
That's crazy
Johnson isn’t worth 2 of the top prospects in baseball. Feliz and Smoak may never pan out in the Majors, but Johnson isn’t any guaranteed ace either (in fact, he’s pretty far from it).
If you want to get an ace into this rotation, you keep the guys like Feliz and Holland and try to develop your own.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
Why wouldn't they do it?
They’re dealing from a position of strength.
Here’s a list of names: Johnson, Volstad, Nolasco, Miller, Sanchez.
Then they also have some guy named Sean West who has come up dealing in just 30 IP. This is a team with a stable of controllable pitching, but rocks a .585 OPS from the 3B position (Bonifacio). They need to reorganize their assets badly.
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 15, 2009 1:38 PM CDT up reply actions
Dominguez struggling in high-A (.657 OPS)
granted only 19. I wonder if they’d have any use for Blalock.
If you’re sporting Bonifacio over there, I’d have to think you would because Dominguez is gonna take a minute.
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 15, 2009 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions
something else to remember guys
the marlins defense is horrid. they are everything we were and everthing we arent now on the defensive end.
i could see them being interested in a guy like vallejo for example
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
Smoak is one of the top prospects in baseball
so I think we can headline a package with him, but would probably have to defer to their needs after that. Their pick of catcher, MIF prospect, and high-ceiling young player.
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 15, 2009 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions
they have a top rate 1b prospect no?
and isnt he at the same dev phase as smoak pretty much?
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
Logan Morrison
And yes, he’s considered a pretty good prospect. Not quite in Smoak’s class, but fairly close.
"I dont care to debate with a troll." - Sharky
didn't he break his leg?
I guess that doesn’t mean he isn’t a prospect anymore, but losing a year of development and recovering from that injury kinda leaves his future cloudy – if I’m remembering right.
"He's old school in that he give up his groin like that. It hurt me when he do that" -- Worsh on Chris Davis' stretch at first base to end the game vs. the Angels on 5/16
broken wrist
not leg, my bad.
"He's old school in that he give up his groin like that. It hurt me when he do that" -- Worsh on Chris Davis' stretch at first base to end the game vs. the Angels on 5/16
With your defensive note
They may have a lot of use for Mendonca, actually. Perhaps he should be included as a PTBNL.
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 15, 2009 1:59 PM CDT up reply actions
Mendonca
Can’t do that- the player to be named has to be dealt within six months of the initial trade, and Mendonca can’t be traded until a year to the day after he signs with Texas.
"I dont care to debate with a troll." - Sharky
Ah, thanks.
Send them Matt West!!
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 15, 2009 2:11 PM CDT up reply actions
I would hate to give up Smoak
with how Davis is playing but yes I would do that.
by Michael Cave on Jun 15, 2009 1:34 PM CDT up reply actions
Rangers Current Roster + Johnson still isnt a playoff team
thats my fear, we still arent a well balanced solid 25 man roster worth selling the farm to compete at this moment. This time next season i think we are. When we have our next run of prospects on the 25 man roster.
Borbon, Smoak, Feliz, will all be on our 25 man.
Beaven if he blows the doors off frisco might get a cup of coffee in AAA, giving him a decent shot of showing up in the show post AS break.
Thats when you go for next years Johnson, right now, i just dont see us as a team built for a real run and we just have to be patient and realize this is our last season of Blalocks and Byrds and Padillas, next year is the season we gotta see what we have who can fill those roles within the org. and see where it truly is that we will best fit our needs going forward and then to put together the right package and pull the trigger.
mid june of 09 isnt my ideal, pull the trigger moment for this developing clubs timeline going forward towards our WS title.
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
Well
if the package was those 4 guys I wouldnt think that would be selling the farm. I understand about the timing but Josh Johnson is not a rent a player nor is he a guy that has even reached his prime. He is under team control until 2011 i believe. He is young and on his was up.
by Michael Cave on Jun 15, 2009 2:07 PM CDT up reply actions
if you need an ace for next year
that doesn’t mean that you have to wait until next year to trade for an ace. I think it would really help the players on this team to play in a pennant race this year, and you never know…if Hamilton is hot and JJ is lights out, anything could happen.
"He's old school in that he give up his groin like that. It hurt me when he do that" -- Worsh on Chris Davis' stretch at first base to end the game vs. the Angels on 5/16
I agree with this.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
I think it would take
a package that included both Smoak and Feliz for a top of the rotation guy like that. I might still do Smoak, Feliz, Max
That's why they call them business sox
See for me
i wouldnt want to include Feliz AND Smoak in any package unless it is for Greinke or Felix Hernandez which i know will NOT happen
by Michael Cave on Jun 15, 2009 2:00 PM CDT up reply actions
Yep
Those two or Tim Lincecum. I’m not sure I’d give up those two for Cain, and I really like Cain.
"I dont care to debate with a troll." - Sharky
Im starting to
put Perez in that camp as well.
by Michael Cave on Jun 15, 2009 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions
Let's see...
The Nationals guys… Willingham, Milledge, Kearns,etc.
Brian Giles, who’s struggled early but is usually a really high OBP guy if you can overlook the pregnant girl shoving.
Matt Holliday? (And, yes, I think Beane would trade with us if he thought he was improving his own club… I think he’s the kind of guy who would love that sort of thing if he thought he was winning the deal, ie, the Mario Ramos trade.)
Travis Hafner?
Aubrey Huff?
Hermida and/or Uggla?
Aaron Rowand?
Brad Hawpe has been discussed ad naseum.
Jim Thome and Paul Konerko.
Probably others I’m not thinking of right now.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 12:20 PM CDT up reply actions
Giambi too.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
The more I think about it, the more I really, really, REALLY want Josh Willingham.
I’ve always liked him a lot.
The Nats have a glut of mediocre/bad fielding COF’s and Willingham and his great patience at the plate are exactly what we need.
.246/.374/.516 so far this year, and he’s not real good in the OF, but he can play LF better than, say, Brad Hawpe.
He trounces lefties (.235/.395/.618, though only 34 AB’s in ‘09, so SSS ), but isn’t bad against RHP’s either (.250/.365/.477 in 88 AB’s) so we wouldn’t have to platoon him.
This is the guy I want.
Go get him now, JD.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions
You going low/cheap there?
Setting the bar low, cheap in prospects…Career against LHP, 406 ABs:
.256 .378 .480 .858
Meh.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
A .378 obp with good power is "Meh"???
Willingham is exactly the kind of bat we need, and he wouldn’t be that expensive I wouldn’t think.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 2:31 PM CDT up reply actions
I mean meh as in compared to this season, that's all.
And i would love the OBP here.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
That's nothing to sneeze at.
And, as Dirkie says, the price wouldn’t be unreasonable.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
You know that walk rate is real
when he smacks the crap out of pitches he likes. We wouldn’t have to re-up until ’12.
Think we could throw them Max +?
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 15, 2009 1:18 PM CDT up reply actions
I'd maybe do that, I suppose.
Though I like Max more than most and think he could do a pretty decent Willingham impersonation at the plate while giving you league average defense behind the plate once he gets healthy, so I’d rather not deal him.
I’d try to put together a Tommy Hunter/Jose Vallejo or Warner Madrigal/Namirez kind of package and see if that’d get it done.
I wouldn’t go too high on Willingham.
I’d have to think long and hard about it if they wanted Max or Kiker or Borbon or someone like that.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 2:34 PM CDT up reply actions
Why LF?
I’d put him in at DH and keep our OF as is for the most part.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
Yah, me too.
But I was just saying that if you needed to get his bat in the lineup he could play some LF.
And mainly I just meant to comp his defense to Hawpe’s, who is much worse in the field, and who if we did acquire would probably be run out there by Wash cause he’s a vet and he’s always played the OF, so why DH him? That’d be disrespectful.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 2:29 PM CDT up reply actions
Willingham
I mentioned him the other day.
I think trading for Nick Johnson and Willingham would go a long way towards making the offense respectable. Make Johnson the DH or 1B (depending on how Davis and Blalock are hitting) and platoon Willingham with Murphy in LF.
If Johnson costs too much, I’d still go after Willingham with the idea of platooning him with Blalock at DH and ultimately Byrd and Murphy in LF.
by Darrell McKown on Jun 15, 2009 10:45 PM CDT up reply actions
+1
If you can't watch Holland and see that he's going to be awesome, you probably shouldn’t be watching baseball. - Section 339
As old as he is...
I wouldn’t mind seeing a half-season of Jim Thome in a Ranger uni.
He scares the bejesus out of me whenever we pitch to him.
Adam, I could not agree more. It is sickening watching these guys try to hit right now. Honestly, I don’t why anyone even throws us strikes, as we can’t seem to take a pitch. The thing that made crush so good last season was going the other way, and making in-game adjustments. Same thing with Hank…early in his career he was a plus hitter, because he loved taking pitches the opposite way. Until Davis, Kinsler, and Blalock stop trying to pull every pitch out of the park, this offense is screwed.
but, but, but.....
that’s not the way of the “greatest hitting coach in mlb history!”!! Be aggressive, drive it is the way of the Rudy.
Definiton of insanity-doing the same thing and expecting different results
"Introducing your 2009 Texas Rangers-Built for Insanity!"
Big Foot?
He could take a red wood to the plate and mash the hell out of the ball!
2009 Texas Rangers: Why The Hell Not Us?--ghtd36 on May 13, 2009
The Mavs will own his rights, after selecting him in the 2nd in the upcoming draft.
Oh too bad.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
Could be a tough sign, ..
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 15, 2009 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions
But you'll never see him do it
like how Salty was going to be a 20-30 Hr hitter
YOU SPEAK LIES AJM!!!
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
Against Lefties
Byrd: 214/247/400 with a 647 OPS (foe those who can’t add), Murphy: 148/200/185 with a 385 OPS. I like Murphy’s approach better, and I like Byrds defense in center. But, it’s clear to me the answer is not on the roster right now.
That's why they call them business sox
Byrd's
defense is not that good in center. -2.9 UZR, -8.3 UZR/150. He is not playing that good in center
Hamilton’s defense is being missed more than we realize i think
by Michael Cave on Jun 15, 2009 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Last year
Byrd was exceptional in CF. i dont know what is going on this year.
by Michael Cave on Jun 15, 2009 1:24 PM CDT up reply actions
Regression
Byrd has been about an average defensive CF throughout his career. There was a very significant chance that he was going to regress back toward his career stats despite what some people were professing before the season.
R
By like
I mean historically. But I wouldn’t cry if he wasn’t out there anymore.
That's why they call them business sox
Gotcha
I went and checked the numbers and it just hurt so much to look at Michael Young’s defensive stats at third. Ive come to the conclusion he is the worst defensive player in MLB history to win a GG. He is a DH right now.
by Michael Cave on Jun 15, 2009 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions
I couldn't agree more
watching Casey Blake that last series made me cry a little. Decent glove, patient approach. Would have been a good pick-up. MY would make a huge stink about being DH, but it’s worth the PR issues.
That's why they call them business sox
I know we didnt have the money this off season
but look at this:
Crede 34.7 UZR/150, 10.7 so far
Young -25.3UZR/150, -10.3 so far
And I realize that Crede’s OPS is about 100 pts lower right now. His BABIP is also .227. I would think that would go up as the season progresses.
by Michael Cave on Jun 15, 2009 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions
David Murphy
I really dont see him as a 4th OF. I think he would be a solid LF both offensively defensively. His career OPS right now is .796. From 06-08 his OPS was .725 against lefties and .847 against righties. Among OFers with at least 200 at bats his OPS was 57th in MLB. There are 30 teams in MLB so just using very rough numbers i would think he would have to be outside the top 90 to be a 4th OFer. Even with his 0-23 start he is 87th right now amongst OFers with at least 75 at bats. He OPSed .784 in May and is at .771 so far in June after a .496 OPS in April.
While I believe that he will never be an All-Star I really dont think he is a 4th outfielder either. I will agree that if we have to put him in the leadoff spot we are in trouble.
his arm is a noodle fwiw
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
Yep
and it’s almost never accurate.
I think JD’s doing this to spite all the "when we gon’ get sum pitchin’ in here" idiots.
JD’s like, "you want some fucking pitching? Here’s all the pitching you can stand. Now choke on it, bitches!"~ RCCook.
by Kinslerhomer on Jun 15, 2009 1:26 PM CDT up reply actions
I would characterize
it as average. I do think that Boggs has a good arm in left though.
by Michael Cave on Jun 15, 2009 1:27 PM CDT up reply actions
come on
i have buddies with better arms than his
(of course he was all city i think so…)
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
He cannot play against LHP.
That, by definition, makes him a 4th outfielder / platoon type. He is more valuable than say, Boggs, because he is the productive side of the platoon. But he can’t play CF and Boggs can, fwiw.
He’s an ideal 4th OF’er or a mediocre 3rd OF’er.
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 15, 2009 1:29 PM CDT up reply actions
IMO, it makes no sense
to combine all outfielders together.
CF are significantly worse offensively than corner outfielders. So, if you’re going to compare players offensively, it make sense to rank corner outfielders separately from CF.
Even then, to me Murphy might be within the top 60 corner outfielders, but the point that is being made is that he’s not a starting outfielder type for a PLAYOFF contender.
Sure, he could get a job in the outfield starting, but if you expect to be a playoff contender, you ought to have better options to platoon him with to make your outfield a source of strength.
R
EG weighs in on the lineups issues
What if I told you that everything you think about the Rangers’ hitting problems is not as it seems? What if I told you that the problem is not the short at-bats; it’s the long ones?
Would that blow your mind?
It blew mine, but the statistics I looked at clearly indicate the Rangers are most dangerous early in at-bats and that the problems mount when pitches pile up in plate appearances. And the biggest problem is that there are far more longish at-bats than there are short ones.
Consider these stats (through Saturday):
• The Rangers lead the AL in batting average on the first pitch at .389.
• In quick at-bats, which take two or fewer pitches, the Rangers are hitting .356, second in the AL to Cleveland (.365).
• The rest of the AL is hitting .327 in one- or two-pitch at-bats, putting the Rangers nearly 30 points above average.
But here is where it gets all tricky: Brief at-bats account for only 30 percent of the Rangers’ plate appearances. The other 70 percent of the time, when they get deeper into counts, they are well below the league average. The Rangers are hitting .222 in at-bats of three or more pitches. The rest of the league: .238. We’re talking about a total of more than 19,000 at-bats, so a 16-point difference is huge.
"He will not coddle them. Nolan Ryan doesn’t coddle." - Jeff Passan
What this tells me is.....
The Rangers have no eye at the plate. The pitches that they jump on early in the count are most likely fastballs from pitchers trying to get ahead in the count.
The reason we struggle late in the count is that we swing at bad pitches….with 2 strikes no ranger should ever see a strike, just breaking balls in the dirt and high fastballs.
We need to fix this either this season or iat the least in the offseason….even if it means dealing a few popular players.
by death of the cool on Jun 15, 2009 1:54 PM CDT up reply actions
What this tells me is.....
that maybe Rudy’s approach is correct; Swing like hell at the first good pitch you get. That, and most of us here are misguided in our bitching about the players not taking enough pitches.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
There have been a lot of surfacy, cheap shots here
at Jaramillo lately. It’s not that simple, folks. Rudy does not advocate swinging at every pitch.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
This tells me exactly what I already knew..
As soon as Rangers hitters get to a 1-2 count, or a 2-2 count they simply guess. They looks as though they determine whether they will swing or not before the next pitch is even thrown.
To me, this is an example of using statistics poorly.
What is the magical thing that happens after 2 pitches?
That’s right, a STRIKEOUT can occur.
Now, this isn’t to say that the Rangers AREN’T bad when the count goes deeper. They just might well be.
But this BA when you have three or more pitches basically is biased data and doesn’t really tell you much of anything. If you strike out a lot more than average (and the Rangers have the 5th most strikeouts) and you don’t walk a lot (Rangers have the 3rd least walks), you’re going to do pretty poorly in the “BA with three or more pitches.”
I generally like Evan Grant, but he’s using a statistic which doesn’t really tell us much of anything.
R
I agree with this.
All due respect to EG, but how many first pitch swings have the Rangers taken where they failed to make contact or fouled one off? That doesn’t show up in the statistics. How many first pitch balls have the Rangers swung at and missed? The team’s approach has been terrible. They swing early, often at poor pitches, get into trouble with the count early, then underperform with two strikes on them, often ending the at bat swinging at more balls.
Far from affirming any kind of genius on Rudy’s part, these stats are actually pretty meaningless because they don’t evaluate all of the data they need to in order to give a true picture.
Yeah, Evan really needs to clarify based on pitch count.
If we’re seeing three pitches and the counts are more often 1-2 because we’ve swung through pitches we should take…then that makes sense to me. I would like to see him break this out by 0-2 counts, 1-1 counts, etc.
I don’t honestly think taking pitches is a bad idea, and I hope Evan isn’t espousing that idea either, but is saying that we’ve been unlucky going deeper into counts.
Needs sortation
I have an impression similar to what Evan is trying to point out. But the data needs to be assigned to the individual players, then checked against each of their ML histories (even those with SSS). There are times in the course of a game when you can ask what the count is blindfolded, and tell the other person on your couch “next pitch is a slider down and away” if a RH better is up, or “slider down and in”. And sure enough the next pitch when the count is 3—2 or 2-2 is a K or a topped grounder. Anecdotal to be sure, but if it happens enough to make you look smart in front of the TV, isn’t it happening too much? Ditto with autoerotic seings at 2-0 pitches wherever thay are. And I’d bet the balance of my life income those tendencies can be assigned to particular playaers.
You can’t correct what isn’t wrong sucessfully, and you shouldn’t spend effort time and money trying to fix players tendencies that don’t or won’t change.
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang (1844-1912) also -
"Telephone, n. An invention of the devil which abrogates some of the advantages of making a disagreeable person keep his distance."
~Ambrose Bierce
by Ed Coffin on Jun 15, 2009 3:13 PM CDT up reply actions
But batting average is the only stat you can use for this though
Because its impossible to walk on less than 4 pitches so you can’t use OBP. If the Rangers average is .356 in two or fewer pitches their OBP is the same or a fraction different (accounting for HBPs).
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
What are you talking about?
My problem is with “BA for when 3 pitches have been thrown” NOT with BA.
You probably don’t try to do this on purpose, but I feel that you tend to misread what I’m trying to say quite often.
R
Its not on purpose
To be honest I was mostly skimming alot of the comments which is why I misunderstood you.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
Brandon Boggs
I must admit that I don’t think he’s the solution to the Rangers’ current offensive woes.
"Was this really necsarry?" - cowpoke/hurler hurley
But he would be a massive upgrade against LHP.
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 15, 2009 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions
With all of this trade talk
coming up and obvious chinks in the Rangers armor. I think the simple question can be asked. Will the Rangers make a deal of consequence?
Chinks in the armor?
Man, what’s with all this racist crap lately? :)
"I dont care to debate with a troll." - Sharky
I think they'll make at least one deal of consequence.
I’d be disappointed if they didn’t. You don’t round out the roster at the last second and there are visible holes.
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 15, 2009 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions
I hate the idea
of giving up young players and watching them flourish in another place, so i will lose no sleep if we dont make a trade
Prepare yourself for emotional upheaval.
If not this year or in the offseason, next year.
¡Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!
"Anyone who hangs themself during autoerotic asphyxiation is free game." - Curmudgeon
Colloquially, a person engaging in the activity is sometimes called a gasper.
by inactive lsb user on Jun 16, 2009 12:55 AM CDT up reply actions
USA-Italy update
1-0 US at the half on a penalty kick from Landycakes (Landon Donovan to all you non-soccer people)
US is down to 10 men- Ricardo Clark got a red card in the 32nd minute for a bad foul, per Soccernet.
Go USA!
"I dont care to debate with a troll." - Sharky
The Clark red card was BS.
Stupid play on his part, but no need to go red there by the refs.
I guess not total BS now that I think about it, but I hate it when refs let calls like that change the game.
The 19 year old big tall black kid we have (I forget his name) is gonna be good.
I hate Onweyhu or however you spell it. I don’t know why. Apparently he’s good since he always seems to start for us, but everytime I watch him he gets abused my quicker smarter players. I think the coaches get enamored with his size, but what do I know. I’m a casual soccer fan if ever there was one.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 2:38 PM CDT up reply actions
Onyewu
He’s a big dude, but no, I’m not terribly impressed with his ability either.
I’ll have to see the replay of the match tonight to look at the red card.
Damn Italians just tied it, 1-1, though the goal shouldn’t count since an American scored for Italy. What the hell’s wrong with Rossi? Traitor!
"I dont care to debate with a troll." - Sharky
Ugh Rossi.
Could there have been a more painful way for them to equalize?
by GhettoBear04 on Jun 15, 2009 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions
I have strong feelings regarding Rossi.
Without delving to deeply into them, suffice it to say I’m anti.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 6:11 PM CDT up reply actions
I abhor soccer, but I still concur.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
I hope he gets hit by a bus
that traitorous douche
"You'll meet them again on their long journey to the middle." -Lester Bangs
is that game of any particular importance?
i have no idea how soccer works or where they are in whatever they do =)
the preceding post was a great success.
not really
its the trial run make sure south african infrastructure doesnt melt when the WC2010 happens next summer. the teams are basically willing victims who will all get some good cash out of it
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
And better experience for their players...
..than from friendlies.
by GhettoBear04 on Jun 15, 2009 2:56 PM CDT up reply actions
Technically-
No. 14 in the world. Realistically, they are probably in a third tier behind the contenders (8ish teams) and the dark horses (another 10ish teams). Still young and they have a fair number of players in Europe (though true playing time is sparse for some).
by GhettoBear04 on Jun 15, 2009 3:01 PM CDT up reply actions
US
They have a handful of truly world class players (Altidore, Bradley, and Donovan) and some solid role players (Ching, Bocanegra), but overall I don’t think they have the depth to compete with the Spains, Argentina, Englands, and Brazils of the world.
"Was this really necsarry?" - cowpoke/hurler hurley
LOL
I have no idea what kind of crazy loose definition of world-class you’re using, but the US has exactly 0 world class players.
meh
My guess is that you don’t know what you are talking about.
"Was this really necsarry?" - cowpoke/hurler hurley
ummm
El Nino is world class, CR7 is world class, Messi, world class.
Donovan is a backup for a german club when he went there, Jozy cant get on the field for yellowsubmarine and they loaned his to a 2nd division club where he still never got on the pitch. Dempsey is my favorite american and i think one of their best and he wouldnt start for a single knockout round club in the champions league.
it sucks, but its just the way it is.
mormons stole me and held me against my will with Oklahoma beer and 12+ hour work days.
Wow
Absolutely no defense offered as to why a kid who can’t get a match with Villareal, a guy who’s bombed twice in two attempts in Europe, and Bradley, who is promising but plays for Munchengladbach are considered world class.
Yup, when I think of world class, the names that come to mind are Ronaldo, Ribery, Torres, Villa and Altidore (he was on the cover of FIFA!)
Tim Howard on form is arguably at the cusp of world class, and that’s being generous.
Zywica is big time
From MLBtraderumors.com
Brett Perryman of the Dallas Morning News says the Rangers’ number one priority should be to prepare players within the organization to carry the Rangers to the playoffs in “2010 and on.”
What a dumbass that Perryman is.
:)
Wonderboy, what is the secret of your power? Wonderboy, won't you take me far away from the mucky-muck now. -- Tenacious D
Test of another man's genius is the degree to which ...
he agrees with you. Zebra-cakes is a friggin’ Einstein on this one.
Now I know why he's always rocking those awesome shades.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jun 15, 2009 6:55 PM CDT up reply actions
Nick Johnson and maybe a cheap reliever
call it a day, and play the season out as is.
"Hang-Dai, Wu...Hang-Fu$&ing-Dai"
Does it seem a bit too quiet as far as JD and Nolan are concerned right now?
Only reaction to team’s current plight was to sign a released Rockie reliever. My hope is that they’re busy trying to get a player or two, but my fear is that they want to just ride this out. I’m not sure we can ride this out…the Halos will pass us by and never look back.
Ephesians 3:20-21...and I can only imagine
Isn't JD always working on something?
A move or two will be ade, of that I am sure. Perhaps very similar to what Walter describes above.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
Yes we can! November 04, 2008
Its also possible that they see it as just a bad slump against some great teams
And aren’t reading nearly as much into their struggles as we are.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
and if they are still
struggling after the next 12 games thye had better get reading glasses.
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
Mitch Moreland - 2009 Rangers Minor League POY
if you need someone to platoon at DH...
how about Matt Holliday? he could also be an upgrade if you believe Murph is a 4th OF, which I personally don’t, but Holliday’s bat could help
"I hope a bartender appears, with a shot and a beer everytime ya holler, cause yeah man, that's lucky"-Pat Green
"I want to be wearing the red, blue and white."-Matt Purke
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