Thursday a.m. Rangers stuff
by Adam J. Morris on Jul 16, 2009 8:33 AM CDT
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PrintNo game yesterday, no game today...
The DMN has a story up on Elvis Andrus, and his rapid rise to the majors...
And Jim Reeves runs down things that he thinks need to or will happen for Texas in the second half...
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Tiger disappoints me.
I’m sure it devastates him to know.
I hope Elvis can rebound a bit with the bat after the break. Obviously not looking for anything spectacular.
the preceding post was a great success.
If his offense holds
at the year’s average, I’ll be pretty happy. I was expecting less. The errors are also less than I thought, but then, I think Chris Davis probably saved around a handful of errors for him.
"I saw a soldier try to dig a foxhole with his bare hands. He didn't notice that he'd torn off all his fingernails. I got him out of there quickly; not for his sake, but for ours. Fear is poison in combat...destructive, contagious." - Band of Brothers
Reeves 10 points
1) Good luck on Millwood being the same in the second half as the first. He was as lucky the first half as he was unlucky last year. I just doubt it holds up.
2) I definitely agree that either Kinsler needs a better OBP or they need to shuffle him to more the middle of the order.
3) Its definitely tough to see this thing going anywhere without Josh becoming a monster again.
4) I agree we won’t see Halladay, but I think its more because he won’t void his no trade to come here.
5) If the Rangers get a good offer for Blalock, they need to jump at it. Between streaks and injuries its tough to see him being a long term piece for the Rangers, and its tough to even consider offering him Arb. A platoon DH is just not a valuable piece. I’ll take my chances on Jones/Davis/Smoak.
6) If Blalock goes, both. If not, I think Smoak is our better long term bet, but I’d give Davis the first callup.
7) I don’t think Jones has shown a lot of consistency. Basicly he’s been a big part of the Boom and Bust problem on this team, due to his low BA. Maybe if he played fulltime, there would be more, but if we got a real solid right handed bat it would be tough to say no.
8) Whose spot does Feliz take? I can’t see him being the big Right handed Setup guy fresh out of the minors, but I suppose its possible.
9) I wouldn’t mind seeing Vizquel more this year, but not just at SS. I don’t think giving MY and Ian more days off wouldn’t be a bad idea to deal with the Texas heat.
10) God I hope Salty’s bat finds a groove. The SS, 1B, and C positions have all given the team below average offense by wRAA. In order to make the playoffs, this team’s offense really needs to bring more to the party, and C and 1B are two of the positions we should be able to expect a little more offense. I don’t think its particularly reasonable to expect much more out of a pure rookie SS.
"I saw a soldier try to dig a foxhole with his bare hands. He didn't notice that he'd torn off all his fingernails. I got him out of there quickly; not for his sake, but for ours. Fear is poison in combat...destructive, contagious." - Band of Brothers
Maybe
1) Good luck on Millwood being the same in the second half as the first. He was as lucky the first half as he was unlucky last year. I just doubt it holds up.
Historically he’s pitched better in the 2nd half. Just sayin’.
Purgatory's kind of like the in-betweeny one. You weren't really shit, but you weren't all that great either. Like Tottenham.
He can pitch a lot better in the 2nd half
and still have an ERA+ much less than 129.
"I saw a soldier try to dig a foxhole with his bare hands. He didn't notice that he'd torn off all his fingernails. I got him out of there quickly; not for his sake, but for ours. Fear is poison in combat...destructive, contagious." - Band of Brothers
Some questions to your points -
5) What is a good return for Blalock? I have no idea what would constitute one myself, but other teams are holding onto their prospects more and more these days. Despite inconsistencies, injuries, and poor play at 1B, I wonder if there really would be a fair return for Blalock. He will be a Type B free agent, which means there will be more interest in him than if the signing team had to give up a pick. Plus JD has shown the ability to get talent after the first round, so any prospects that could be had in a potential trade might very well be replaced by the compensation draft pick.
6) Aren’t there 40-man roster implications to calling up Smoak this season?
by Excel Hearts Choi on Jul 16, 2009 9:18 AM CDT up reply actions
Smoak
Probably not but unless you absolutely need him and can guarantee him everyday playing time I would just wait until a couple weeks into next season to add him to the 40 and call him up and you have given yourself an extra year of control
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
Probably
a 2nd tier prospect. I was just responding to the article that suggests what to do if someone makes a good offer, I really don’t see it coming though.
As far as Smoak goes, yes, if we play him this year we add him to the 40 man early, and it makes things that much tougher in December. The question is how hot does he get in AAA, and how likely is he to help the team out on callup. However, as I said before, all this is predicated on being made a good offer for Blalock, which I don’t see.
Smoak really adds something this team can desperately use, an ability to wait for the walks.
"I saw a soldier try to dig a foxhole with his bare hands. He didn't notice that he'd torn off all his fingernails. I got him out of there quickly; not for his sake, but for ours. Fear is poison in combat...destructive, contagious." - Band of Brothers
i would be happy with a laird-like return for him
just the moscoso part (a guy who may be a little old for his league/is old – but has good stuff) + some throw in DSL guy
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
"Call up Joaquin Arias? He had a legit spring training and seems to have cooled off a little bit in OKC but still a DH option. " -- kch tx
by knockoutking on Jul 16, 2009 9:53 AM CDT up reply actions
Bannister
Is there still hope for him? His numbers are terrible in AAA, he is 25, and has had arm troubles in the past. I would not be sad if Smoak took his 40 spot (once Smoak is ready).
Obviously this means you’d have to leave him for the Rule 5 draft so we would be able to protect one less player, which is the drawback
Someone need
to post the list again of folks eligible for the rule 5 draft if they aren’t on the 40. I just seem to recall we have a pretty good chunk of folks this year, which is why I wasn’t too worried about losing Duran Duran.
"I saw a soldier try to dig a foxhole with his bare hands. He didn't notice that he'd torn off all his fingernails. I got him out of there quickly; not for his sake, but for ours. Fear is poison in combat...destructive, contagious." - Band of Brothers
ya
I think Scott Lucas sent out an amazing e-mail about it a few months ago, I’ll see if I can find a link
Gentry and Pina
are two that could draw some Rule V interest.
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
Mitch Moreland - 2009 Rangers Minor League POY
i think zach phillips
whittleman depending on what type of 2nd half he has
kirkman
and paisano could all potentially be of interest to a team
by dustinvandeman on Jul 16, 2009 11:05 AM CDT up reply actions
ballard as well
it would not bother me too much though if we lost him…actually none of the players eligible this year would hurt too much if we lost them…we just have to realize that we are probably going to lose a player or two this year and just hope that we pick the right ones to keep
2010 is really going to be the roster crunch year
by dustinvandeman on Jul 16, 2009 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions
To your pts
1) Really dont know but I think the extra rest over the break will help him immensely
2) I think Kinsler’s gets railed on a lot here (sometimes deservedly so, sometimes not). I am very in favor of him dropping to 3rd or 5th in the lineup however I dont know who you would leadoff in his stead.
3) Totally agree. Hamilton needs to return to last yrs form. Since he has come back he has seemed more patience and his swing looks less forced. The power will come
4) I think we will have a deal that is amenable to each party however Halladay wont waive his no trade clause so i agree
5) A good offer for Blalock? He has upped his trade value A LOT in the past 3 weeks or so. I would say a B level prospect would do it for me. Someone at the bottom end of a top 100 list or on the precipice of it.
6) Agree
7) Agree as well
8) After the handling of Holland I dont have much confidence in the proper handling of Feliz. I believe he will slot in right after Frankie, ODay, and Jennings initally then end up right behind ODay when all is said and done.
9) Agree
10) I really hope Salty hits as well. Does anyone else think he sacrificed some of his offseason reps for defensive reps? If he just keeps doing his best black hole impression Id like to see more Teagarden, particularly catching Hunter/Harrison/Holland/Feldman
by Michael Cave on Jul 16, 2009 9:34 AM CDT up reply actions
Do this..
2) I think Kinsler’s gets railed on a lot here (sometimes deservedly so, sometimes not). I am very in favor of him dropping to 3rd or 5th in the lineup however I dont know who you would leadoff in his stead.
Murphy v. Righties
Elvis v. Lefties
"Thats all we got? One goddamned hit?" - Harry Doyle
"You cant say god damn on the radio."- Colorman
"Ehhh, who cares...nobody's listening!"- Harry Doyle
Blalock injuries
Why do people keep bringing up Blalock’s injuries? I don’t believe Thoracic Outlet Syndrome is a chronic condition. He been healthy this year and there is no reason to assume he won’t continue to remain healthy. And Cahill, he is now the starting firstbaseman for the Rangers which ha smore value than a platoon DH.
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
Mitch Moreland - 2009 Rangers Minor League POY
by RangerMad on Jul 16, 2009 9:42 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
People bring up Blalock's injuries
because if he has a good full year this year, it will be his first in 5 years.
I personally don’t think he is a particularly good 1B, and with Smoak and Davis, there isn’t much chance he will stay at 1B for the Rangers. All that being said, I doubt anyone offers a decent 2nd tier prospect for Blalock, so its all academic.
"I saw a soldier try to dig a foxhole with his bare hands. He didn't notice that he'd torn off all his fingernails. I got him out of there quickly; not for his sake, but for ours. Fear is poison in combat...destructive, contagious." - Band of Brothers
You say that as if Thoracic Outlet Syndrome was his only injury last year.
I recall at least 2 more.
the preceding post was a great success.
He was injured 3 times last year,
but I don’t think any of them could have been avoided on his part.
1. He was involved in a rear-end collision in Suprise and started the season on the DL with whiplash
2. While on the D:L he developed Carpel Tunnel Synd., and had closed surgery. Extending his stay on the DL
3. Then in June (?) he was diagnosed with TOS and was for 2.5 months on the DL
Not really sure he could have avoided #1 & 3. And depending on the cause of #2, he may have avoided that.
"Thats all we got? One goddamned hit?" - Harry Doyle
"You cant say god damn on the radio."- Colorman
"Ehhh, who cares...nobody's listening!"- Harry Doyle
TOS was 2007
Hamstring injury to begin 2008, CTS when he was expected to come off the DL and play 1B,
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
2007 was the shoulder/rotator cuff injury.
"Thats all we got? One goddamned hit?" - Harry Doyle
"You cant say god damn on the radio."- Colorman
"Ehhh, who cares...nobody's listening!"- Harry Doyle
...
IIRC, he had the shoulder thing throughout the 2006 season and then had surgery on it in the offseason after that year.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
I corrected myself, with an explanation, below
"Thats all we got? One goddamned hit?" - Harry Doyle
"You cant say god damn on the radio."- Colorman
"Ehhh, who cares...nobody's listening!"- Harry Doyle
well now I see that and feel like a bit of a tool
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
Well are,
but a well respected tool
"Thats all we got? One goddamned hit?" - Harry Doyle
"You cant say god damn on the radio."- Colorman
"Ehhh, who cares...nobody's listening!"- Harry Doyle
sorry just looked it up and you are correct on the TOS
2007/2008 just tend to blur together. The shoulder injury was 2006.
"Thats all we got? One goddamned hit?" - Harry Doyle
"You cant say god damn on the radio."- Colorman
"Ehhh, who cares...nobody's listening!"- Harry Doyle
He's also had a whole lot of shoulder problems
I wouldn’t doubt that those could pop back up again. Plus the whole CTS thing could be an issue. And a guy that gets TOS followed by CTS, well, I’m not too optimistic about him never getting hurt again if he’s playing the field.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
thoughts
1) say millwood finishes with about a 115 ERA+ — is that ok/good enough?
2) i agree w/ kinsler moving down (one way or another) — but RW will never do it
3) hamilton needs to be helathy and be good for this team to make the playoffs IMO
4) halladay i think would void his no trade, to come here — but i dont think the rangers give enough to get him and beyond that i dont think hes traded at all
6) i hope to see CD back here soon…
8) i hope they (kind of) ease feliz into this whole bullpen thing, let him be a middle reliever for a few appearences then let him be a guy you trust (if RW does)
9) im all for seeing more vizquel as well, giving FOTF some days off isnt going to be a bad thing (with his defense — and you can always DH him if his bat plays like it has so far, if need be) — having him more rested is good — with IK i think that he will get more days off if he keeps hitting so badly
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
"Call up Joaquin Arias? He had a legit spring training and seems to have cooled off a little bit in OKC but still a DH option. " -- kch tx
by knockoutking on Jul 16, 2009 9:51 AM CDT up reply actions
Micheal Young isn't going to have any days off unless he asks for one
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
that reasoning is somewhat foolish to me
i would love to see omar get to play more (SS/3b/2b simply because lets be serious, this team isnt going to run away with the divisonal title and be home free for the last month. this is a team that is going to need a well rested FOTF, kinsler and andrus vs having 2 of the 3 (or all 3) be tired and wear down during the last month of the year
the flip side of that is that you dont want tto overrest them (ride your horses hard to get to the championship vs saving them for the championship) - the problem is that there is a very thin line between the two and im not 100% sure i have the faith RW will not mess that up
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
"Call up Joaquin Arias? He had a legit spring training and seems to have cooled off a little bit in OKC but still a DH option. " -- kch tx
by knockoutking on Jul 16, 2009 9:56 AM CDT up reply actions
There are some guys in the league who play the field everyday unless they ask off
It just happens. Whether it be because of their talent, veteran status, whatever they go to the ballpark everyday knowing they will be at a certain position. Micheal Young is one of those guys. Unless he is injured or goes to Washington and asks to sit a day I highly highly doubt he is going to.
Now Wash may go and ask Young if he would like to have a day off from the field but I also think that wouldn’t work because Micheal is a very strong willed and prideful person who loves being on the field.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
I agree
I don’t think Wash will go to war with MY just to give him a day off.
"I saw a soldier try to dig a foxhole with his bare hands. He didn't notice that he'd torn off all his fingernails. I got him out of there quickly; not for his sake, but for ours. Fear is poison in combat...destructive, contagious." - Band of Brothers
which is unfortunate.
understandable, but unfortunate.
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
"Call up Joaquin Arias? He had a legit spring training and seems to have cooled off a little bit in OKC but still a DH option. " -- kch tx
by knockoutking on Jul 16, 2009 10:41 AM CDT up reply actions
hey i agree with you
that said, we are talking about a guy who has hit .295+ in every month (per his splits) other than August (.280)
the rangers sked in aug-end of the year
2 vs SEA
4 @ OAK
3 @ LAA
3 @ CLE
3 vs BOS
4 vs MIN
3 @ TB
3 @ NYY
3 @ MIN
-
3 vs TOR
3 @ BALT
3 @ CLE
3 vs SEA
3 vs OAK
3 vs LAA
4 @ OAK
3 vs TB
4 @ LAA
3 @ SEA
already looks quite tough. the rangers will need a .300 hitting FOTF to compete and to possibly win this division.
having michael young in a funk in august is something this team simply cant afford to have happen.
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
"Call up Joaquin Arias? He had a legit spring training and seems to have cooled off a little bit in OKC but still a DH option. " -- kch tx
by knockoutking on Jul 16, 2009 10:40 AM CDT up reply actions
Definitely agree on 1 and 2.
3- I’m kind of concerned Hamilton’s power stroke didn’t seem to come off the DL with him, but I don’t think he’s really an offensive key. Not that he can’t be a beast, but he seems more like the type of guy who needs other beasts around him in the lineup (like Bradley last year) to truly peak.
5&6- I’d like to see Blalock traded too, but unless Smoak comes on bigtime in the next couple weeks in AAA, he’s not going anywhere. Davis might get the first callup between him and Smoak, but the Rangers don’t seem to want to Blalock until one of the two proves they can hit MLB pitching.
7- I don’t think it matters whether Jones plays full time or not, the approach he had in April has dissapeared. He has just 8 BB’s since May 22nd, after having 18 before that date and 11 in April. He’s nice to have around when he’s bopping home runs, but that’s about all the value he brings.
8- Eddie? Lefties have smoked Guardado this year, so it shouldn’t really matter if we replace him with a RHP, especially is the Rangers insist on letting Dutch sit in the bullpen.
10. Agree.
"You know, I’m playing entirely too much." - Andruw Jones
"After intense analysis, I have come to the conclusion that Neftali Feliz throws fucking hard." - John Sickels
about Josh
Not many are right back to form right off of the DL, it will come and we need it to, If he can get back to form it will make everyone else better.
Can’t wait to see Feliz
"We play to win the game" - Herm Edwards
by nicholas.rodriguez on Jul 16, 2009 10:11 AM CDT up reply actions
yep re Blalock
I don’t see the Rangers moving him unless the team falls out of the race or in August if Smoak or Davis has torn apart AAA (more than a 30 AB streak with only 5 Ks), has come up and is doing well. I do think Blalock and Padilla are both prime August trade candidates. But if Blalock is hitting well, there is no reason to rush Davis back or Smoak. And if Blalock isn’t hitting well, he’ll have no trade value anyway so it is a moot point.
Go Rice Owls!
revo
dunno who’s writing i dislike more, revo or pops urine.
"Anyone that isn't pro-choice never met you" ~Brian Thomas on Seth...
Maybe
If by “writing style” you mean the one sentence paragraphs, yes. If by content the two aren’t even comparable. This column by Reeves wasn’t insightful but it also didn’t piss me off.
If I was newspaper writer covering the Rangers, I would just read LSB and the comments, get the Newburg email updates and steal all of my content from those sources.
Remember Red, hope is a good thing. Maybe the best of things. And no good thing ever dies.
So Crops on the Farm style?
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
JJT?
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
"Call up Joaquin Arias? He had a legit spring training and seems to have cooled off a little bit in OKC but still a DH option. " -- kch tx
by knockoutking on Jul 16, 2009 9:53 AM CDT up reply actions
Cowlishaw?
I think most of the DMN columnists are dogshit though.
"I saw a soldier try to dig a foxhole with his bare hands. He didn't notice that he'd torn off all his fingernails. I got him out of there quickly; not for his sake, but for ours. Fear is poison in combat...destructive, contagious." - Band of Brothers
Evan Grant is my favorite writer...
Not because of his content or prose, but because of his leering pedophile eyes
"Support the Dutch Oven"
by RangerFloppy on Jul 16, 2009 9:58 AM CDT up reply actions
Uncle Fester
get that man a fur coat and a light bulb.
Grieve: The Yanks have struggled so far. - Lewin: Yeah, cry me a bag of money.
Dykstra has all the money!
ElectricOkra.com
I think Evan has made that comp himself before
I'm Matt mutha-effing Bush, bitches, and mutha-eff East County.
"I'm as passionate and knowlegeable as any fan out there." Josey Wales
by Brian Thomas on Jul 16, 2009 3:46 PM CDT up reply actions
Still making Saltalamacchia jokes?
seriously?
Grieve: The Yanks have struggled so far. - Lewin: Yeah, cry me a bag of money.
Dykstra has all the money!
ElectricOkra.com
Besides being dated
It’s unbelievably unfunny.
by brettgardner on Jul 16, 2009 9:38 AM CDT up reply actions
Dis-gagree
"Support the Dutch Oven" - Me
by RangerFloppy on Jul 16, 2009 9:44 AM CDT up reply actions
on which part
being dated or being unfunny?
Grieve: The Yanks have struggled so far. - Lewin: Yeah, cry me a bag of money.
Dykstra has all the money!
ElectricOkra.com
Ahhhh...
The double negative un-s got me…I change my vote to Gagree…I thought Z pandering to Revo…
"Support the Dutch Oven"
by RangerFloppy on Jul 16, 2009 9:48 AM CDT up reply actions
Evan Ranks the 40
The 40 starts getting more important this year, as a lot of new players will need to be added at the end of the year.
And you know, people love lists.
"I saw a soldier try to dig a foxhole with his bare hands. He didn't notice that he'd torn off all his fingernails. I got him out of there quickly; not for his sake, but for ours. Fear is poison in combat...destructive, contagious." - Band of Brothers
this is great
38. C Max Ramirez: Up only two days without playing. Why is he more valuable than Arias? Cost the cash-strapped Rangers about $2,300 less in pro-rated salary.
1. 3B Michael Young: Maintains excellent approach at the plate. Smoothly transitioned to third different infield position. Continues to be a quiet, low-key example of how to do things professionally and correctly. His influence on young players is seen from Ian Kinsler to Elvis Andrus.
smooth transition?
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
"Call up Joaquin Arias? He had a legit spring training and seems to have cooled off a little bit in OKC but still a DH option. " -- kch tx
by knockoutking on Jul 16, 2009 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions
smooth on the field
Grieve: The Yanks have struggled so far. - Lewin: Yeah, cry me a bag of money.
Dykstra has all the money!
ElectricOkra.com
lol, what were you expecting then?
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
I was expecting bad
Not bad in the “still doesn’t have much range, so shows up bad in defensive metrics” (which I still haven’t satisfactorily been convinced that the low scores aren’t influenced by him positioning more to the line because of Andrus’s range)
But bad in the “unable to handle 3b and looking like Matt Kata out there” sort of way.
I’m a stat guy, and appreciate the value of quantifying defense. But the fact that Matt Kata’s UZR/150 at 3b is -21 and Young’s is -17 somehow fails to capture the simple observation that one of the two players had no idea how to play the position.
Go Rice Owls!
I'm not really sold that Young knows how to play the position
Or at least that he puts that knowledge to use. The range is still terrible, but he’s just let too many grounders go right by him or slip through his glove since he refuses to get in front of a ball.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
"Smoothly transitioned to third different infield position."
Sure, if you consider throwing a hissy fit and demanding to be traded when he heard the news, then not practicing at 3B over the offseason and performing like shit at the position during the season smooth…
"You know, I’m playing entirely too much." - Andruw Jones
"After intense analysis, I have come to the conclusion that Neftali Feliz throws fucking hard." - John Sickels
Nice
Nothing like a hissy fit to punctuate how willing a person is to accept change.
Remember Red, hope is a good thing. Maybe the best of things. And no good thing ever dies.
Ah shit
Now LSJ and I are thinking the same.
Remember Red, hope is a good thing. Maybe the best of things. And no good thing ever dies.
Hey, great minds, ya know?
"You know, I’m playing entirely too much." - Andruw Jones
"After intense analysis, I have come to the conclusion that Neftali Feliz throws fucking hard." - John Sickels
Is that supposed to be a compliment to you
or a slam against me? :)
Remember Red, hope is a good thing. Maybe the best of things. And no good thing ever dies.
Bill Jones with a nice Mike Young HOF Argument over on the CBS11tv blogs
Halfway to Hall of Fame?
Posted by CBS11
Bill Jones
While watching Michael Young in his 6th straight All Star game last night, it dawned on me what former player he reminds me of. Happens to be a Hall of Famer, one elected in his first year of eligibility. A Hall of Famer whose career seemed to fly under the radar for twenty years, much like Young’s has for nearly a decade now. A Hall of Famer who, like Michael, was a righthanded hitter and at 6-0, 185, was about the same size as Young (6-1, 190). A Hall of Famer who started out his career as a middle infielder, before moving to 3rd base and, eventually, designated hitter. A Hall of Famer who was known to be a model of quiet consistency and leadership as well as aggressive, instinctual baseball savvy.
Ronald Martinez/Getty Images
Michael Young reminds me a lot of Paul Molitor. And, with one more All Star Game, he will match Molitor’s 7 appearances in the Mid-Summer Classic. Young needs another 10 years, though, to match Molitor’s career numbers, which include ranking 8th all-time with 3319 career hits. Here’s a look at the numbers:
All Star Yrs G BA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB/CS
Young 6 10 1300 .301 5304 791 1594 302 42 126 689 74/23
Molitor 7 21 2683 .305 10835 1782 3319 605 114 234 1307 504/131
42 games from now, Young will be halfway to Molitor’s total of 2683 games played. At his current pace this season, here’s a projection of how Young compares to Molitor if he can do the next decade what he’s done the past decade:
Yrs G BA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB/CS
Young 20 2684 .301 10952 1630 3294 630 86 262 1414 152/48
Molitor 21 2683 .305 10835 1782 3319 605 114 234 1307 504/131
The most glaring difference is the number of stolen bases Molitor had which, perhaps, was a product of the era he played in from 1978-98. But that is offset by the fact that Young is a far superior fielder than Molitor was. In fact, Molitor spent the final 8 years of his career primarily as a DH.
Of course, Young won a Gold Glove last year at shortstop. In 1278 career games playing 2B, SS, and 3B, Young has just 114 errors in 5671 total chances – a .980 fielding percentage. On the other hand, in Molitor’s 1248 career games at 2B, SS, and 3B, he had 187 errors in 5136 total chances – a .963 fielding percentage.
So, there you have it – the case for Michael Young being a first ballot Hall of Famer. Now, he just has to do the same things the next decade he’s done the past decade! Oh, and he may want to mix in a World Series MVP honor – like Molitor did in 1993.
Finally, how’s this for a recommendation from none other than Paul Molitor himself, when asked at the Hall of Fame ceremonies last year what current player he likes to watch the most: “I’m a Jeter fan and a Michael Young fan. Guys who see the big picture when they play. They can play in any era.”
Bill Jones – http://twitter.com/cbsdollarbill
Ridiculous
All he has to do is keep playing at the same level for another 10 years? Yeah, that’s likely. Everyone does that into their 40s.
G G G E-flat_______ F F F D__________....
Most similar by age 31 (from B-R)
Carlos Baerga (937)
Thurman Munson (936)
Barry Larkin (929)
Jose Vidro (923)
Red Kress (921)
Craig Biggio (920)
Julio Franco (910)
Tony Cuccinello (910)
Ray Durham (908)
Travis Jackson (908) *
"I saw a soldier try to dig a foxhole with his bare hands. He didn't notice that he'd torn off all his fingernails. I got him out of there quickly; not for his sake, but for ours. Fear is poison in combat...destructive, contagious." - Band of Brothers
Of those
I think Larkin makes the HOF. Biggio does. Franco makes the hall of very good. Larkin has an MVP and 3 GGs (when they seemed to matter more). I think MY will make the hall of very good. I dont know who wrote it last year but I like the idea of comparing how good players were in their time.
I dont think MY gets in if he keeps hitting like he has for his whole career. Biggio is automatic because of his 3K hits. Interesting that Franco and Biggio have the same OPS+
MY – 104
BL – 116
CB – 111
JF – 111
by Michael Cave on Jul 16, 2009 10:32 AM CDT up reply actions
I think Young would have to be
one of those rare players who has productive years in his 40s to make it.
If he cranks out 200 hits a year until he is 39, I guess he can make the 3K hits that probably gets him in. However, keeping that up in the late 30s would be doing some. He’d definitely have to remain injury free.
"I saw a soldier try to dig a foxhole with his bare hands. He didn't notice that he'd torn off all his fingernails. I got him out of there quickly; not for his sake, but for ours. Fear is poison in combat...destructive, contagious." - Band of Brothers
He needs to shoot up some more roids if he wants to get in the HOF
"He will not coddle them. Nolan Ryan doesn’t coddle." - Jeff Passan
by Dirk Diggler on Jul 16, 2009 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions
That list
is pretty interesting.
Like you say, Larkin, Biggio and Franco all had very long, productive careers (aged well category)
A couple of the guy guys, like Baerga, were pretty much washed up before age 31 – he’s kind of an odd similarity, Baerga’s last good season was at 26.
Obviously Thurmon Munson is a special case, since he died at 32 while still a good ballplayer.
There are several there who began to fade after Young’s age, but certainly that doesn’t appear any more likely than maintaining a decent level of production.
My perspective is that Young is the type of player who won’t decline all that fast. Contact hitters who don’t rely on their speed or power to get their hits can age well. I don’t think he’ll be great anymore, but he hasn’t really been great for several years.
I’d put him at 30% shot of playing well until 40; which gets him close enough to 3000 hits that he’ll make the threshold and be a HOFer. 30% shot at HOF at 31 – not bad.
Go Rice Owls!
well yea, its redic
but if he keeps playing this well for 10 more years, then he has an arguement
but what are the odds that he does keep playing @this level for 10 years?
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
"Call up Joaquin Arias? He had a legit spring training and seems to have cooled off a little bit in OKC but still a DH option. " -- kch tx
by knockoutking on Jul 16, 2009 10:42 AM CDT up reply actions
Through age 31
Molitor was a 120 OPS+ and Young a 101 OPS+.
Although their hitting was fairly similar, Young has been doing it during a time of more inflated offense, which probably hurts him.
"I saw a soldier try to dig a foxhole with his bare hands. He didn't notice that he'd torn off all his fingernails. I got him out of there quickly; not for his sake, but for ours. Fear is poison in combat...destructive, contagious." - Band of Brothers
True
but I don’t think it matters.
If Young gets to 3000 hits – and he very well may or he may not, who knows – and he manages to get some post-season ABs to his ledger (which very much matter for the HOF), then he’ll be a HOFer. The era’s are certainly different, but Young also will benefit from being a predominantly contact hitter in a era of tainted slugging – fair or not, people may well look back on the Michael Youngs and Ichiro’s and say “see, those were the guys not on PEDs”
And while most of us roll our eyes when we hear the defense argument, he does have a gold glove (matters to this discussion, fair or not), and he has played mostly at low-offense positions. That 101 OPS+ came mostly at 2b and SS – 101+ is a great number up the middle
Go Rice Owls!
Yeah,
I can agree with that. It probably comes down to the 3K hits. At a 200 hit rate, thats 39, but most likely, he has to go into his 40s.
"I saw a soldier try to dig a foxhole with his bare hands. He didn't notice that he'd torn off all his fingernails. I got him out of there quickly; not for his sake, but for ours. Fear is poison in combat...destructive, contagious." - Band of Brothers
Plus he's likeable
The writers’ association loves good guys. Not saying that gets him in without the counting numbers but it’s something they consider.
Remember Red, hope is a good thing. Maybe the best of things. And no good thing ever dies.
Yep
There very well may be a big hole in the HOF of players from the ’90s and ’00s. I think Young may look like a very appealing candidate.
As the article says, guys like Molitor and Biggio tend to get into the HOF if they play long enough.
Go Rice Owls!
Good point
I’m sure the writers’ association thinks there are a lot of low character guys in the 90s and 00s despite their stats. Stupid writers.
Remember Red, hope is a good thing. Maybe the best of things. And no good thing ever dies.
I hate MLB's scheduling
I survive Black Wednesday, again, but no one’s playing today. At least they could give me a day game.
Remember Red, hope is a good thing. Maybe the best of things. And no good thing ever dies.
OT: What would Heath Bell cost?
If we could trade someone like a Blake Beavan or Kasey Kiker plus someone like Marcus Lemon for Heath Bell, I’d be all for that, personally.
Under control for a few years and a very solid bullpen arm.
But RPs seem to always draw differing amounts, so I could be way off with what it would take
How about
BB/KK + Manny Pina? Seemed that SD needs a good C.
"Thats all we got? One goddamned hit?" - Harry Doyle
"You cant say god damn on the radio."- Colorman
"Ehhh, who cares...nobody's listening!"- Harry Doyle
I don't think they're looking to trade Bell
and if they were, I suspect that his intangible value to the team (clubhouse guy, fan popularity) would carry a higher price tag than he’s actually worth.
Also, I thought this story was funny.
Purgatory's kind of like the in-betweeny one. You weren't really shit, but you weren't all that great either. Like Tottenham.
I don't think it'd be worth it
I don’t think Heath Bell > Feliz by that much to be worth giving up a top pitching prospect for. Plus, RPs are the worst in risk when you trade for them. So if the Rangers want to shore up their bullpen some more, I think they need to bring Feliz to the pen and probably bring up Murray to be a true LOOGY on the team.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
I don't see the need for a LOOGY at all
We’ve made it this far without one, and our bullpen has been solid. Adding Feliz AND Bell would make our bullpen incredible.
9th Frank
8th Bell/C.J.
7th C.J./Feliz/O’Day
6th Grilli/Jennings
LR Tons of options
Give the bullpen the lead in the 6th, and I would be very confident, personally
Who is the long man?
Grilli and/or Jennings?
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
Mitch Moreland - 2009 Rangers Minor League POY
OT:
Is there a good free website, that gives a player’s injury history?
"Thats all we got? One goddamned hit?" - Harry Doyle
"You cant say god damn on the radio."- Colorman
"Ehhh, who cares...nobody's listening!"- Harry Doyle
meatspin.com
NSFW!!!
Purgatory's kind of like the in-betweeny one. You weren't really shit, but you weren't all that great either. Like Tottenham.
Well that was rather gruesome.
JACKASS!!
"Thats all we got? One goddamned hit?" - Harry Doyle
"You cant say god damn on the radio."- Colorman
"Ehhh, who cares...nobody's listening!"- Harry Doyle
Yeah
my bad. My. Bad.
Purgatory's kind of like the in-betweeny one. You weren't really shit, but you weren't all that great either. Like Tottenham.
Couple of options
You can go to the player’s wikipedia page and hope that they have info on most of their injuries. Or you can go to kffl.com and read through all the little bits of news for those players to see when they went on the DL and for what or when they had some minor tweaks that kept them out of games.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
OT - KLaw Chat
There is a KLaw chat at 1:00 Eastern if you want to submit some Ranger questions.
by Excel Hearts Choi on Jul 16, 2009 11:35 AM CDT reply actions
So...
I’m babysitting a friends 1 year old daughter this morning, and what does she bring with her? A pink Halos rally monkey! I told her that damn thing isn’t allowed in my house and she just laughed. I guess they went to Disneyland a month ago and caught an Angels game while down there. She isn’t a sports fan so I didn’t hold it against her that much. She just got the damn thing because it’s pink and she calls her baby “little monkey”.
My only dilemma is what to do with this abomination. I’m now taking suggestions from LSBers.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
Fire
Grieve: The Yanks have struggled so far. - Lewin: Yeah, cry me a bag of money.
Dykstra has all the money!
ElectricOkra.com
Head on a stake
Post the photo please (including said 1 yr old crying in the background, if possible)
by BuckyB on Jul 16, 2009 11:40 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Toilet paper
monkey?
Purgatory's kind of like the in-betweeny one. You weren't really shit, but you weren't all that great either. Like Tottenham.
M-80
Those things still legal? I also have a good recipe for napalm. Diesel fuel, nitrogen based fertilizer and delicate cooking.
I’m now on the FBI list aren’t I?
Remember Red, hope is a good thing. Maybe the best of things. And no good thing ever dies.
read somewhere that you can make it with
styrofoam and gas – let the gas dissolve the styrofoam
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
-
"Call up Joaquin Arias? He had a legit spring training and seems to have cooled off a little bit in OKC but still a DH option. " -- kch tx
by knockoutking on Jul 16, 2009 6:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Soak. In. Urine.
Then punt the shit out of that baby.
I don’t care if the baby isn’t a sports fan, you have to hold it against her.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jul 16, 2009 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Do you have a dog?
If so, new chew toy.
If not, new chew toy for neighbors dog.
"You know, I’m playing entirely too much." - Andruw Jones
"After intense analysis, I have come to the conclusion that Neftali Feliz throws fucking hard." - John Sickels
I know we need to stop rec'ing them
we all know where to find em, and none of us is going to go post on #7 again
The people who recced ed the old ones
Just need to uncrec them. Get them below 6 recs and they’ll drop off.
"You know, I’m playing entirely too much." - Andruw Jones
"After intense analysis, I have come to the conclusion that Neftali Feliz throws fucking hard." - John Sickels
Why rec to begin with
We rarely if ever have more than 10 new fanposts in a single day so they shouldn’t drop off the front page for anyone.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
It's a sneak attack of well below average looking white boyocity!!!
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jul 16, 2009 11:42 AM CDT up reply actions
Who looks like...
…he’s taking one in the tailpipe…but likes it because he’s imagining it as M-Per
by GhettoBear04 on Jul 16, 2009 11:51 AM CDT up reply actions
I don't know what dudes look like when they're taking it "in the tailpipe", but I'll take your word for it.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jul 16, 2009 11:52 AM CDT up reply actions
Thats what
meth and Amyl nitrate will do to you.
"I saw a soldier try to dig a foxhole with his bare hands. He didn't notice that he'd torn off all his fingernails. I got him out of there quickly; not for his sake, but for ours. Fear is poison in combat...destructive, contagious." - Band of Brothers
Still better than the Carrot Top look
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
And I keep meaning to change it, by the way.
Last year I changed it to an action shot of Derek Jeter doing one of his (probably) cancer-curing jump throws.
No one needs to see a collection of Dirk-a-faces when they sign on to a baseball site.
No one deserves that.
Well…. maybe Cahill.
But to the rest of you I apologize.
The 40 Trumps All!!!
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, even the very tall. This was the largest auto I could afford. Should I therefore be made the subject of fun?
by thedirkatron on Jul 16, 2009 11:54 AM CDT up reply actions
I just changed mine
for the first time ever
Purgatory's kind of like the in-betweeny one. You weren't really shit, but you weren't all that great either. Like Tottenham.
Actually, the Jeter shot was way worse than any possible dirkaface, IMO.
"You know, I’m playing entirely too much." - Andruw Jones
"After intense analysis, I have come to the conclusion that Neftali Feliz throws fucking hard." - John Sickels
OT: Props to Newberg
Dallas Top 50 most powerful people in Metroplex sports
Jamey at #45…
And Tony Romo at #2? Really?
"Thats all we got? One goddamned hit?" - Harry Doyle
"You cant say god damn on the radio."- Colorman
"Ehhh, who cares...nobody's listening!"- Harry Doyle
shouldn't miles be on this list somewhere
Everything he post gets “rec” ed
by death of the cool on Jul 16, 2009 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions
I know I shouldn't read lists like this
But Matt Doherty of SMU basketball – does anyone care about SMU basketball???? And no Gary Patterson from TCU football but June Jones shows up – I’m thinking that Patterson being able to recruit any player he wants from under SMU’s nose should count for something.
Fort Worth should sue them for use of the word Metroplex there – 4 SMU people when probably 10 people in DFW care about the Mustangs?
Go Rice Owls!
Where's Newy?
Purgatory's kind of like the in-betweeny one. You weren't really shit, but you weren't all that great either. Like Tottenham.
reply fail
@awillis111
Purgatory's kind of like the in-betweeny one. You weren't really shit, but you weren't all that great either. Like Tottenham.
No Newy
Dale Hansen at #14 is the only local broadcaster
"Thats all we got? One goddamned hit?" - Harry Doyle
"You cant say god damn on the radio."- Colorman
"Ehhh, who cares...nobody's listening!"- Harry Doyle
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