A Roy Halladay trade poll
by Adam J. Morris on Jul 27, 2009 12:00 PM CDT
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PrintIn reading the tea leaves, based on reports that are out there, it sounds like the package that the Rangers would have to part with to get Roy Halladay would be something along the lines of Justin Smoak, Derek Holland, Blake Beavan, and Julio Borbon.
If you are the Rangers, do you make that deal? Cast your vote below...
(And you will note that "only if an extension is agreed to ahead of time" is not an option. That's not going to happen. If you would only make that deal if Halladay agrees to an extension, then your answer is "no.")
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No,and Ricciardi can go fuck himself.
by TooLegitToQuit on Jul 27, 2009 12:03 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
No major trades this year.
It is a year too early.
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
Mitch Moreland - 2009 Rangers Minor League POY
ha
I’m the only yes vote so far.
I would try to trade out feliz for holland and try to do substitute someone else for borbon but I would do it.
I know that smoak is a big loss but this is roy halladay
"I just want to comment on how it’s become like a common thing in the [MLB] for guys to fall in love with [the Rangers’s] sloppy seconds." (thanks cstorm)
I voted yes but only barely
I would however do your substitute trade of feliz/smoak/beaven/somebody else. Feliz is looking more and more like a reliever to me.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
by DerekSTheRed on Jul 27, 2009 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions
er I meant I voted no but only barely.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
by DerekSTheRed on Jul 27, 2009 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions
Why is Feliz looking more and more like a reliever to you?
He shouldn’t.
by Brett Perryman on Jul 27, 2009 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm not sold on his secondary stuff
but I admit I’m probably not the best judge of pitches.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
by DerekSTheRed on Jul 27, 2009 2:05 PM CDT up reply actions
Ill ask this
Do we win the WS with Halladay
if the answer is no, you dont forfeit the future of the franchise
no way
There's one word that describes baseball - `You never know.' - Joaquin Andujar
by jbooth17 on Jul 27, 2009 12:05 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
I think we could get him for less than that
For my thoughts on that specific proposal ……. click!
"You can probably stick a fork in the Rangers' playoff chances for 2009." - AJM on 7/26 with the team 4.5 games out
by tricer on Jul 27, 2009 12:05 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Good Lord
What an outstanding song. I gotta rebuild my collection.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
And the little bastard threw it for a swinging strike three in a 3-2 count. He’s blessed. And ballsy.
But then where will the Rangers put Michael Young?
/lights fuse, runs
"I love winning." - rockin_rangers, on May 16, 2009
by ghtd36 on Jul 27, 2009 12:09 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
lol
Yeah, I wonder if Rolen could play 1st?
by corbsclinton on Jul 27, 2009 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions
I said no because I wouldn't give up Holland in that deal
I’d think long and hard if I could swap out Feliz for Holland.
No.
Smoak, Borbon. Holland. No way. That is ludacris. A huge loss for us considering we might not even sign him.
It would remind me of the Teixeira trade. Atlanta gave up a lot for a guy to only be there a year. It is not worth it at all.
Smoak, Borbon and Holland..
for Ludacris? No way I would do that deal – he would be a cancer in the clubhouse.
"Everybody wants the most they can possibly get for the least they can possibly do." - Todd Snider
by henryfinkel on Jul 27, 2009 12:24 PM CDT up reply actions
No way
To me, it’s simple: Smoak, Feliz, Holland, and Perez are 100% off the table. If there is ANY way to make an acceptable package that doesn’t include them, then I’m very interested and willing to get creative.
Why????
So the Blue Jays could have Texas fans following them?
Tell me you don’t peek at the White Sox (Danks), Padres (Gonzalez), Reds (Volquez, L Nix), Royals (everbody)……
by MoonlightGraham on Jul 27, 2009 12:20 PM CDT reply actions
yeah me either
why would I do that?
"He will not coddle them. Nolan Ryan doesn’t coddle." - Jeff Passan
by Dirk Diggler on Jul 27, 2009 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions
haha
ya that made me laugh too
'Howard makes me fear the NKoreans less... If they shot anything at us, he’d be there to block it." - Aquaman56
"Also Ian’s season is following the same pattern as Ricky Martins Career. Both needed another hit, bad." - SaltyGoesYard
look
if you want greatness then you have to give up something and not just a goody bag of just good prospects. This guy would give us the best chance to win everytime he took the mound. how does Halladay, Millwood, Padilla sound in a series against the Angels?
by meatbonelefty on Jul 27, 2009 12:23 PM CDT up reply actions
Nix? Maybe Chris Young. Not Nix.
I’m surprised he is even in the league still. Thought for sure he was on roids.
Not good strategy
In “investment” terms, to swap 20% of your future (at minimum) for a guy who increases your 2009 chances from 12% to maybe 18%. Winning a division now would be nice, but might cost dearly over the next 4-5 years.
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang (1844-1912) also -
"Telephone, n. An invention of the devil which abrogates some of the advantages of making a disagreeable person keep his distance."
~Ambrose Bierce
by Ed Coffin on Jul 27, 2009 12:21 PM CDT reply actions
I think your percentages are a little high
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
Mitch Moreland - 2009 Rangers Minor League POY
Probably
In terms of WAR etc but the comparative ratio of give up at least a fifth more than you get back is what I was after.
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang (1844-1912) also -
"Telephone, n. An invention of the devil which abrogates some of the advantages of making a disagreeable person keep his distance."
~Ambrose Bierce
by Ed Coffin on Jul 27, 2009 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions
F'in' NO.
Suddenly, there are some who want to make it all about this year. I’d much rather see the Rangers keep on the development track. Now, if a younger pitcher similar to Halladay (Greinke/Cain) were available, I’d go for that.
I think
that there is no way I would include any 2 of Smoak, Feliz, Perez, or Holland. I’d make a trade with Feliz as the centerpiece maybe, but thats about it.
I’m just not to gungho about what Halladay can do for this team, given its offense, and most of these trades seem to work out better for the team getting the prospects.
"I saw a soldier try to dig a foxhole with his bare hands. He didn't notice that he'd torn off all his fingernails. I got him out of there quickly; not for his sake, but for ours. Fear is poison in combat...destructive, contagious." - Band of Brothers
agreed....
I only include 1 of our 4 bluechip prospects…and then 2 or 3 of anybody else in our system. That is as far as I go.
by death of the cool on Jul 27, 2009 12:24 PM CDT up reply actions
I go back and forth on Holland
Young pitchers need a little bit of time to come into their own. I think it’s best to be patient with Derek.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
by DerekSTheRed on Jul 27, 2009 12:28 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree
Next year Feliz, Holland, Davis, Borbon and possibly Smoak will all be up here for at least half the yr. Patience will be something that we will need next yr as well
You are obsessed with bodily wastes A turd being held under my nose, this team being a steaming pile, Jonny Donuts having a stinky diaper, the front office pissing themselves, the team crapping the bed…
I think you should seek counselling.
(AJM to Josey Donuts)
by Michael Cave on Jul 27, 2009 12:39 PM CDT up reply actions
It's a mute point!
With our offense….we could have Nolan Ryan, Sandy Koufax, Roger Clemens, Bob Gibson and Roy Halladay and it just wouldn’t matter. We could not get enough men on base to make another playoff quality team even wince. Just wait another year and get some on base types of players to augment our sluggers and then see how this plays out.
"We could not get enough men on base to make another playoff quality team even wince"
Is Boston a playoff caliber team? Because we just swept their asses.
Are the Angels a playoff caliber team? Because we are 7-2 against them.
What about Tampa Bay, cause we just swept them also.
We finally have a good team here, a team 12 games over .500 and right in the thick of a playoff race and people here have no idea how to act. I’m not in favor of this deal as proposed, but damn this defeatist attitude is starting to get sickening.
"You can probably stick a fork in the Rangers' playoff chances for 2009." - AJM on 7/26 with the team 4.5 games out
by tricer on Jul 27, 2009 12:35 PM CDT up reply actions 10 recs
The only AL playoff team we haven't beaten consistently
is Detroit and New York. And even New York, we were pretty damn close to taking a series from them.
I’m a white boy who doesn’t think a black man is good enough to manage my baseball team. - LSJ
"I really think that" - LSJ, on being asked by AirJordan
no shit
If we were the NY Yankees, then I understand the attitude, but we are the Texas Rangers.
Don’t just insist on being unhappy about the team’s performance
And after teams like the Phillies
and the Cardinals won the WS, you’d think people would realize how big of a fucking crap shoot it is. Just get in, that’s all we need to do.
I’m a white boy who doesn’t think a black man is good enough to manage my baseball team. - LSJ
"I really think that" - LSJ, on being asked by AirJordan
I understand the Cards but the Phillies
had the second best record in the NL last yr at 92-70 plus an ace in Hamels .
You are obsessed with bodily wastes A turd being held under my nose, this team being a steaming pile, Jonny Donuts having a stinky diaper, the front office pissing themselves, the team crapping the bed…
I think you should seek counselling.
(AJM to Josey Donuts)
by Michael Cave on Jul 27, 2009 1:45 PM CDT up reply actions
They were an extremely hot team
they weren’t even going to make the playoffs before the Mets collapsed.
I’m a white boy who doesn’t think a black man is good enough to manage my baseball team. - LSJ
"I really think that" - LSJ, on being asked by AirJordan
Ahhh, a man after my own heart.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
And the little bastard threw it for a swinging strike three in a 3-2 count. He’s blessed. And ballsy.
I know he has a piece of meat as his avatar
but I didn’t know he was a cannibal
"moot"
“Mute” is what I’m doing to your comment.
Remember Red, hope is a good thing. Maybe the best of things. And no good thing ever dies.
I wasn't gonna be 'that guy'...
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
And the little bastard threw it for a swinging strike three in a 3-2 count. He’s blessed. And ballsy.
That's what I'm hear four
Remember Red, hope is a good thing. Maybe the best of things. And no good thing ever dies.
"For"
“Four” is a number.
Gracchus (about Obama): I think he knows what America is. America is the mob. Conjure money for them and they'll be distracted. Take away their freedom and still they'll roar. The beating heart of America is not the paper of the Constitution, it's the power of the media. He'll bring them debt - and they will love him for it.
by Aquaman, Esq. on Jul 27, 2009 3:36 PM CDT up reply actions
That went right over your head
"He will not coddle them. Nolan Ryan doesn’t coddle." - Jeff Passan
by Dirk Diggler on Jul 27, 2009 3:37 PM CDT up reply actions
Apparently so.
Gracchus (about Obama): I think he knows what America is. America is the mob. Conjure money for them and they'll be distracted. Take away their freedom and still they'll roar. The beating heart of America is not the paper of the Constitution, it's the power of the media. He'll bring them debt - and they will love him for it.
by Aquaman, Esq. on Jul 27, 2009 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions
I vote no friggen way in hell
but at the same time, if the trade went down, I’d be pretty excited to watch Rangers baseball for the next 2 years
If traded, he could opt out of his contract during the offseason
since he’s on multi-year contract.
Alma para conquistarte, corazón para quererte, y vida para vivirla junto a ti.
Of course the answer to this question should be "NO"
The BlueJays first offer is going to be way over the top, and our counter will be Feliz and borbon
then by Friday it will be something like Feliz, Borbon, Font, Beltre
I still get the feeling that Toronto is just trying to keep us in it to gain leverage with Philly.
by death of the cool on Jul 27, 2009 12:29 PM CDT reply actions
If we do trade for Halladay
management will likely ask Young (possibly others) to defer some of his salary one year to make room.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
And they would do it, except
Roy won’t come to Texas (linked elsewhere attributed to T.R.)
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang (1844-1912) also -
"Telephone, n. An invention of the devil which abrogates some of the advantages of making a disagreeable person keep his distance."
~Ambrose Bierce
by Ed Coffin on Jul 27, 2009 12:44 PM CDT up reply actions
Evan Grant seems to think he'll come here.
Evan Grant: Jamey, I reported earlier in the week in the live blog, that I’ve been told Halladay would not reject a trade here.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
by DerekSTheRed on Jul 27, 2009 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions
They could both be right if say Halladay changed his mind in the last couple of days.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
by DerekSTheRed on Jul 27, 2009 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions
And yet somehow
Josey would find someway to bitch about this
Bill Simmons: "I will tell you right now, if the Boston Red Sox traded Clay Buchholz for Justin Smoak, I will run around my neighborhood naked...celebrating for an hour. I love Justin Smoak"
fwiw
If we were up 3.5 games, rather than 3.5 games back, I’d have to think a lot longer and harder about that deal.
by Adam J. Morris on Jul 27, 2009 12:43 PM CDT reply actions
Yeah, I agree
"He will not coddle them. Nolan Ryan doesn’t coddle." - Jeff Passan
by Dirk Diggler on Jul 27, 2009 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions
Same here
I think acquiring an ace like Halladay is much more of a “we’re in good shape, we don’t want to blow it” sort of move.
3.5 back doesn’t sound like a lot, but if the plan to make up that much by acquiring one pitcher, regardless of how good he is, is kind of crazy. He’ll have 13 starts or so. Odds are, the Rangers would have gone something like 6-7 or 7-6 in those starts anyway. You’d be asking Halladay to go 10-3 or 9-4, at the worst, to catch up to LAA himself, assuming the team doesn’t fall any further back in the non-Halladay games (and 3.5 out after 4 months is roughly 5 or 6 over a full season, extrapolated). Yeah, he could do that, but do you want to bet Holland, Smoak, Borbon, and Beavan on that? Yeah, I didn’t think so.
Now, if you’re saying “The Rangers are a better team than the Angels, they’ve just been lucky” – then you may as well just say that the team should go it alone as is right now. Which is a fair argument. But that again is a big assumption to bet 4 of the top 10 prospects in this organization.
Go Rice Owls!
The Rangers would go 7-6/6-7 in Halladay's starts?
No
by oc on Jul 27, 2009 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm talking about the starts
from whichever starter Halladay would replace.
Say Nippert or Holland goes to the bullpen (or is traded) because Doc comes. I’m saying that had Doc never come, the team would have gone 6-7 or 7-6 with whatever pitcher had been pitching instead.
Go Rice Owls!
The way they're hitting this year ...
6-7/7-6 with Halladay on the mound is not beyond the realm of possibility. Anybody that thinks the Rangers will hit well enough in Halladay’s starts to win 9 or 10 of them might be a tad optimistic.
It's kind of a mute point
since Halladay won’t agree to come to Texas, don’t even have to think about it.
This is a sports blog
impossible is nothing!
will people stop saying "mute point"
"I just want to comment on how it’s become like a common thing in the [MLB] for guys to fall in love with [the Rangers’s] sloppy seconds." (thanks cstorm)
No
There are too many holes on this team right now to be trading away to prospects.
Who is the catcher going forward? Same question for firstbase.
Can Borbon play CF so Josh can move to RF?
Can Frankie stay healthy or should Feliz be prepped for the closer role?
Is the pitching depth so great that we can afford to trade away top pitching prospects?
I am sure there are more questions to be answered. Let the farm continue to develop. Then next year trade away some of the depth for positions that need shoring up.
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
Mitch Moreland - 2009 Rangers Minor League POY
I like this
The Rangers have too many questions to address on this team
One thing for certain is that we have a great amount of pitching prospects. But what we don’t have is positional prospects really outside of Borbon and Smoak. And you want to give them up for Halladay?
Halladay really doesn’t come in here and fixes this team overnight. I think the main concern of this team is more of our offense than our pitching. Unless Halladay can come in here and get on base, I really don’t see the need to trade for him
Bill Simmons: "I will tell you right now, if the Boston Red Sox traded Clay Buchholz for Justin Smoak, I will run around my neighborhood naked...celebrating for an hour. I love Justin Smoak"
better question would be
if you knew this trade would put us in the World Series (not win, just put us there)…then, yay or nay on the trade?
usa
I've been wondering about this
Bud Selig says he won’t prevent the Rangers from taking on payroll even though the commissioner’s office has helped Rangers owner Tom Hicks make payments
So that’s good news (not just for Halladay, but potentially for Willingham/Johnson or whatver we try for)
i think if the Phillies
included Drabek in the talks then it would be close
You are obsessed with bodily wastes A turd being held under my nose, this team being a steaming pile, Jonny Donuts having a stinky diaper, the front office pissing themselves, the team crapping the bed…
I think you should seek counselling.
(AJM to Josey Donuts)
by Michael Cave on Jul 27, 2009 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions
More likely
Eyre will head to AAA when we call up Neftali.
I’m a white boy who doesn’t think a black man is good enough to manage my baseball team. - LSJ
"I really think that" - LSJ, on being asked by AirJordan
We have a pitcher named today?
I’m a white boy who doesn’t think a black man is good enough to manage my baseball team. - LSJ
"I really think that" - LSJ, on being asked by AirJordan
We got him in the first place
because he was out of options
Alma para conquistarte, corazón para quererte, y vida para vivirla junto a ti.
Eyre and Mathis
will be the ones sent down when FRankie comes back and they decide to add a position player.
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
Mitch Moreland - 2009 Rangers Minor League POY
Do you think
there’d be a market for someone like Jason Jennings? Because he and Mathis are like the exact same pitcher.
I’m a white boy who doesn’t think a black man is good enough to manage my baseball team. - LSJ
"I really think that" - LSJ, on being asked by AirJordan
You think
a team like Colorado would be interested in taking a flier on him?
He’s got experience pitching there, they’ve got a history, and it’s not like the Rangers would be asking for much for him.
I’m a white boy who doesn’t think a black man is good enough to manage my baseball team. - LSJ
"I really think that" - LSJ, on being asked by AirJordan
Eyre will get shipped out for the extra position player, right?
"You can probably stick a fork in the Rangers' playoff chances for 2009." - AJM on 7/26 with the team 4.5 games out
They keep saying that
but no move has been made. With Millwood’s injury and the innings the pen had to throw last night I wouldn’t be surprised if they kept rolling with just 3 bench players.
I’m a white boy who doesn’t think a black man is good enough to manage my baseball team. - LSJ
"I really think that" - LSJ, on being asked by AirJordan
Three spots in the bullpen need to shake loose
One for Feliz, one for Frankie, one for a position player
by Adam J. Morris on Jul 27, 2009 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions
most likely
I got to think a trade of either Jennings or Nippert would have to happen to open up a spot for Feliz.
As good as Feliz is you don’t disrupt a successful bullpen in the middle of a pennant race to break in a rookie. And being that all the guys in the pen are going very good right now I don’t see anything happening right now to open up a spot for Neftali
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
I would be fine
with losing Jennings for Feliz, especially since Mathis pretty much replicates Jenning’s skillset.
I’m a white boy who doesn’t think a black man is good enough to manage my baseball team. - LSJ
"I really think that" - LSJ, on being asked by AirJordan
Feliz
Wouldn’t it be kinda nice if he was still starting and about ready to step into the rotation, where we have a need, instead of the bullpen, where we don’t really have a need?
"You can probably stick a fork in the Rangers' playoff chances for 2009." - AJM on 7/26 with the team 4.5 games out
If Holland continues to be mediocre why wouldn't you try Feliz
He couldn’t be any worse could he?
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
Hes mediocre right now
Why not trot out your other top pitching prospect and see if hes any better? If anything you’ll probably have a little edge at first due to guys never having faced him. If it contributes to an extra win or two that could be the difference between playoffs and no playoffs.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
Im not giving up
Simply saying had we left Feliz in the rotation in OKC he could be a candidate to come up and replace Holland right now, or Millwood if hes hurt. Being as how hardly any major leaguers have faced him he would probably have the edge initially and in a playoff race if that helps you win one or two games you would have lost it could be the difference maker
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
Why not?
Hes not exactly shutting people down out there. Do you think Feliz as a starter couldn’t at least match what Holland has done?
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
I have no idea.
I’m sure if it were Feliz up putting up similar numbers with Holland in the minors, you’d be wishing Holland was up.
In a playoff race...yeah
We aren’t 10 games back and looking forward to next year solely. We have a legit shot at the playoffs this year. Holland has had moments where you can tell he is going to be a very good ML pitcher….in due time. But we are at the point now where we can’t be sacrificing games just for the sake of getting a guy ML innings.
So if you feel Feliz is a ML starter and can do as good if not better than Holland has done over a short period of time and it can possibly give you one or two extra wins then you do it in my opinion.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
What?
Is it that big an assumption that Feliz could come in here and put up a ~6 ERA while getting the same valubale “feet wet in the majors” that Holland has gotten?
And wheres the hindsight?
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
The assumption is that Derek Holland is not going to improve
That Feliz could come up and be better than Feliz from here on out.
The hindsight is you being pissed that Feliz has pitched 16 or whatever innings of relief in triple-A when he could have been starting. Boston switched Papelbon from starter to reliever in the minors and he pitched 5 innings of relief before being called up. I’m sure there bullpen situation was a little more desperate than ours. Alot of things have gone right in the bullpen over the last couple of weeks to keep Feliz in AAA. You should be glad we haven’t a need to call him up yet.
I fully hope and believe Derek Holland improves
But I don’t know if it happens this yearand I don’t think its the right thing to do to sacrifice a possible playoff berth just so you can hope a young pitcher improves on the mound.
My hindsight is that they never should have switched Feliz to the pen in the first place. Our bullpen wasn’t that bad at the time they did it anyway and its only gotten better since then. What happens if Holland or Hunter go down with an injury and instead of being able to bring Feliz up as a starter we have to bring up someone like Kris Benson or Elizardo Ramirez?
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
Nippert is our 6th starter, right now.
And again, you want to pull a rookie for a rookie, and assume it improves our playoff chances.
Yep
Its been a month since his first relief appearance. Which means hes probably missed out on about 6 starts roughly. Hes pitched almost 15 innings in the last month as opposed to probably close to 30 had he stayed in the rotation. I still don’t see why we moved him. It seems like such a knee jery action that now looks like it is going to backfire on us.
Bryan Smith (12:17:17 PM PT): Justin Smoak and Josh Hamilton. The AL West might just have found their Bash Brothers, v. 2.0.
Now all we got to do
is to throw 50 tons of pollutants into the air and lay of 1/2 our work force and they’d feel right at home.
I’m a white boy who doesn’t think a black man is good enough to manage my baseball team. - LSJ
"I really think that" - LSJ, on being asked by AirJordan
by FirebatM3 on Jul 27, 2009 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions 8 recs
Heh!
Mabe fire-bomb 1/2 of some lesser neighborhoods too.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"you gonna lose your horse. seriously." FX2
And the little bastard threw it for a swinging strike three in a 3-2 count. He’s blessed. And ballsy.
OT: It looks like the Mariners are officially sellers
and Washburn is on the market. Thank god Bedard is now Dl’d
I’m a white boy who doesn’t think a black man is good enough to manage my baseball team. - LSJ
"I really think that" - LSJ, on being asked by AirJordan
That may be Jays fans lurking.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
by DerekSTheRed on Jul 27, 2009 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions
or Randy Galloway or JJT or Engel or Cowlishaw
'Howard makes me fear the NKoreans less... If they shot anything at us, he’d be there to block it." - Aquaman56
"Also Ian’s season is following the same pattern as Ricky Martins Career. Both needed another hit, bad." - SaltyGoesYard
I think it's because people like Jamey and Adam
are advocating going right to the limit to trade for Halladay. If Jamey and Adam were telling people ‘this isn’t the time for this trade’ very few would come to that conclusion on their own. Just my guess.
by Brett Perryman on Jul 27, 2009 3:00 PM CDT up reply actions
Adam's stance is more moderate
but he did say above that if Texas was ahead of rather than behind the Angels he’d consider this Smoak/Holland/Borbon/Beavan deal very seriously.
by Brett Perryman on Jul 27, 2009 6:52 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah, I think
the difference between the Rangers being 3.5 up and 3.5 back is fairly large in doing the deal. I don’t think Halladay is worth more than a few games between now and the end of the season. I know I’d be more interested in trading for Halladay if I thought the postseason was more likely.
"I saw a soldier try to dig a foxhole with his bare hands. He didn't notice that he'd torn off all his fingernails. I got him out of there quickly; not for his sake, but for ours. Fear is poison in combat...destructive, contagious." - Band of Brothers
I think its more having to do with Grant
going bonkers over Halladay, trying to convince people that you have to go out and get an Ace no matter what the price is and no matter how pathetic your offense is.
by behindthebag on Jul 27, 2009 6:26 PM CDT up reply actions
care to give everyone a summary?
I’m a white boy who doesn’t think a black man is good enough to manage my baseball team. - LSJ
"I really think that" - LSJ, on being asked by AirJordan
Never smoked the good stuff
Got invited to smoke with Ricky Henderson once and was a pussy about it.
Trade for Ian Snell.
Nevermind he's advocating deals for Adam Dunn, that was the pussiest story I've ever heard
by oc on Jul 27, 2009 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Rhadigan: Did you inhale?
Bascik: I… don’t know
Motherfucker thinks he has an image to maintain. Shhiii…
by oc on Jul 27, 2009 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions
And why is that?
Elvis Andrus - 2009 AL Rookie of the Year
Mitch Moreland - 2009 Rangers Minor League POY
I'm sick and tired of Hicks
honestly, ever since he bought Liverpool, not only has he not given a crap about the Rangers, but also the Stars. Whats more, Liverpool fans still hate him for not gettng them enough help. I only hope that he sells the Rangers by this time next year so that, in 2010, when we’re in a better position, we can actually take on some salary.
'Howard makes me fear the NKoreans less... If they shot anything at us, he’d be there to block it." - Aquaman56
"Also Ian’s season is following the same pattern as Ricky Martins Career. Both needed another hit, bad." - SaltyGoesYard
What does that have to do with the Halladay trade?
I mean, I know he isn’t in a financial position, but Hicks probably has little control over this trade. I’m sure this will be a JD and Nolan move if it was to go through.
Halladay
At this point I would most likely stand pat, but if I was going to make an offer, I wouldn’t go higher than something like Feliz, Davis, Teagarden and Beavan (or Borbon).
I make that move
Though it is the maximum I make, and I probably want a bullpen arm as well.
Go Rice Owls!
thats the limit for me as well...maybe even a bit over it.
I am not sold on Davis, Teagarden, or Beaven….Feliz would be the one piece that would hurt, but every legitimate trade will hurt some.
Davis- I would be willing to move him just because I am sick of having high K/ low walk homerun guys with low obps…, but we are really selling low on him.
by death of the cool on Jul 27, 2009 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions
hmm
the more i think about it, I guess the more this is the limit for me as well. I’m not sure I trade smoak. Plus, didn’t J.P. make overtures about Davis earlier in the year?
"I just want to comment on how it’s become like a common thing in the [MLB] for guys to fall in love with [the Rangers’s] sloppy seconds." (thanks cstorm)
I think my max is:
Perez, Davis, Font, Kiker…seems like they don’t need a catcher because of a near ready prospect.
by GhettoBear04 on Jul 27, 2009 4:11 PM CDT up reply actions
Everyone that voted 'yes'
Should be banned
by the funk on Jul 27, 2009 3:35 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
The way I see it
Is that a trade of Halladay is going to cost more than for Tex a few years back. And to this day many Brave fans regret doing that trade. There are similarities of Tex back then and Halladay this year:
Both have 1.5 years left on their deal
Both have the change to be the difference maker on a contending team
Both require the trading team to give up a hefty amount of prospects
Tex didn’t put the Braves over the top that year, and the following season was traded for a quarter of what the Braves had traded to get him
Halladay is going to require more than Tex from what has been seen. We could go get him for Smoak, Feliz, Borbon, and Beaven, but really does that make our team better? What about the guys going to the Jays? Do you really want to hear about those guys for the next five years?
What if Halladay comes here and we fail to make the playoffs and then next year we can’t sign him to an extension so we have to pull what the Braves did and trade him for a quarter of what we trade to get him?
Anyone really want to go down that path?
Bill Simmons: "I will tell you right now, if the Boston Red Sox traded Clay Buchholz for Justin Smoak, I will run around my neighborhood naked...celebrating for an hour. I love Justin Smoak"
How many times
Has a major deadline-deal actually gotten a team to the promised land? Seems more often than not to be major victory for the team getting the prospects, and the team getting the “star” is left with their pants down around his ankles, bent over a tree stump squealing like a pig.
Never argue with a fool. Onlookers might not be able to tell you apart.
You’re going to have a hard time convincing a lot of folks that the first round of the playoffs isn’t the promised land.
by Brett Perryman on Jul 27, 2009 6:54 PM CDT up reply actions
You're probably right
and I know it has been a long time, but short-term thinking usually gets you in a bind in the long run. I think a long-term plan is in place, and has gotten us to this point. Stay the course, and take advantage of opportunites if they arise, instead of being taken advantage when unexpected circumstances pop up.
Never argue with a fool. Onlookers might not be able to tell you apart.
Hell no...
why would you spend two seasons building up a farm system with young talent only to trade away 4 large pieces of that system for Halladay. Especially considering the state of the Rangers ownership right now. It’s looking more and more like the Rangers are going to have to develop young players because they won’t be able to sign guys like Halladay on the FA market. You can’t develop young players by trading them away.
Also, unless Halladay is a RH bat who can hit in the middle of the order and take a fucking pitch or two he will not help the Rangers enough to win the West. I’m sorry, I hope I’m wrong, but this offense is my biggest concern right now. Smoak is the one guy that the Rangers have in the minors who could come in as early as next year and go into the middle of that lineup and be a solid OBP type guy. I’d give up my right nut right now before trading him away.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
Bigger question
How long are we going to be “developing” from our farm system, and then firing managers because they can’t win enough games when we trade away our stars to make room for that farm system?
I say make the trade, use the guys in the farm system to get a star and win now, and then more free agent players may actually want to come to Texas in the near future when we show we can win…
And for those who think 1 pitcher can’t make a difference, I refer them to the years that Nolan Ryan was pitching… him being here made us the winning team that we had for 3-4 years.
"How long are we going to be developing our farm system?"
It has been 2 fucking years? Exactly how long do you think it takes to develop young players?
This isn’t the NBA or NFL you don’t draft a kid out of HS or college and have him in the bigs to start the next season. The lack of patience by some amazes me.
Have you been living under a rock? Perhaps you haven’t heard about the financial problems the teams owner is having. What FA’s are you going to sign with no money?
I don’t even know what to say about the Nolan Ryan shit. Sigh.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
my proposal
any combo of 3 players not named hamilton, andrus, smoak, holland, feliz. (maybe kinsler & salty too). that’s a hell of a lot better than the draft picks they are going to get otherwise.
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