Saturday a.m. Rangers things (drug edition)
by Adam J. Morris on Mar 20, 2010 10:55 AM CDT
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PrintI'm tired of the Ron Washington cocaine talk swamping all the baseball talk, so I'm doing a separate post this morning for the stuff related to that...
Tracy Ringolsby says Washington's managerial career is over, and accuses the Rangers of a "cover up." Craig Calcaterra counters by pointing out that abiding by MLB's confidentiality rules isn't really a "cover up."
Jennifer Floyd Engel says Washington should have been fired.
Tim Cowlishaw says that Ron Washington should have resigned, because the Rangers franchise is tainted by past drug use (such as the "tainted" MVP Awards Juan Gonzalez, Pudge Rodriguez and Alex Rodriguez won), and the team needs to "clean up its act."
Over at the DMN blog, it is suggested that Bill Simmons was out of line for making jokes about Ron Washington's drug use during a chat session yesterday. I'm not offended by Simmons making jokes about Washington admitting to testing positive for coke...I am offended, though, that his jokes and comments were so lame.
Jon Heyman -- the person who chose to break this story -- praises the Rangers for not firing Washington.
Which is interesting. I've been thinking the past few days about this, and about the decision to run with this story. The drug testing process is supposed to be confidential. Of course, so was the PED testing that led to the list of 100+ names of players who tested dirty, and there's been no qualms about outing at least a few of those folks.
But as far as this goes...one of the things that really bothers me about this is why the story ran. Washington tested dirty, acknowledged his use, has complied with the treatment required by MLB, has stayed clean...what does outing him now really accomplish? Is it advancing any sort of "news"? Not really. At least the PED stuff impacted players' on-the-field performance, supposedly.
This, though? This is, despite the high-minded moralizing from certain quarters, simply a gossip piece, a news item designed to titillate.
I am sure I'll be accused of not looking at this rationally because it is the Rangers' manager, that if this were Brad Mills or Don Wakamatsu or someone, I wouldn't have an issue with it. But I don't think that's the case. And I really have to question not just the wisdom, but the propriety, of Heyman and SI opting to go public with this info.
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pretty funny, AJM!
"Drinks are on me if Lewis posts >168IP and an era lower than 3.86." by RangerMad on Jan 20, 2010 12:36 PM PST
Hooray Drugs!!!
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
I'm taken by how relaxed he/she is.
'Waiting for a girl and she gets me into fights
Waiting for a girl we get drunk on Friday night'
Cowlishaw
I wonder why his drunk ass didn’t resign from the DMN.
by LoneStarBallUser on Mar 20, 2010 11:00 AM CDT reply actions 2 recs
He's having too much fun posting his retarded stories on facebook
And making an ass of himself on ATH.
I am Jurickson Profar son of judeska and chesmond.. And I was born ready! ready to play baseball!!- Jurickson Profar 2/15/2010
by Aquaman, Esq. on Mar 20, 2010 11:01 AM CDT up reply actions
He likes doing PTI, thats why.....
"Josey drives to games???
I always assumed he rides in on his high horse"
jam0152
Martin Perez, "Mucho queso"
If he does any mailbags or call-in shows
He should be asked why he didn’t resign when he had a problem with drugs.
Like, Grant Schiller style.
Look at the comments under Jeff Wilson's blog post on dallasnews.com. What a bunch of rocket scientists.- Keith Law
Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal!
Well, we the paying public deserved to know.
We have a stake in the team and if the manager isn’t who we think he is, we have to be apprised of that. When Wash made that mistake, he sacrificed any secrecy or anonymity about the incident. That’s part of the price one pays when he’s in the public eye.
Ephesians 3:20-21...and I can only imagine
We the "paying" public
actually don’t deserve anything. We don’t own the team and actually have no right to know based on the agreement of these drug tests. And doing coke once doesn’t change who you are and shouldn’t change someone’s perception of you by that much. He might have done it more, but of course, we have no proof to know and that’s the problem with this whole thing. It leads to a bunch of ignorant people thinking that Wash must be a coke addict or crackhead and it gets blown completely out of proportion.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
What sorts of mistakes does anyone "sacrifice any secrecy or anonymity" about?
Being a poor tipper? Being a poor parent?
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
This really bothers me.
People don’t sacrifice their rights to privacy because of the positions they hold within various public organizations. Furthermore, they don’t sacrifice their rights to privacy when they fail drug tests when the results of said tests are purportedly 100% confidential.
To assert that we somehow deserve to know what happens in other people’s lives is invasive at best and nefarious at worst.
No
You want to be able to look down on him, admit it. That’s why you think you deserve to know.
by Black Francis on Mar 20, 2010 1:34 PM CDT up reply actions
Why aren't there ever any repercussions
for the people who ran with a story that is supposed to be legally confidential. Shouldn’t Heyman or SI be punished some way for this?
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
punished by who?
there is no law against talking about someone’s failed test. There is an agreement between the tester and testee.
Go Rice Owls!
If there's a contract saying that it should remain confidential
Then how are you not breaking the law by being the one to go the press or being the one to run with the story. I’m not saying give him life, but I think it was wrong how it leaked out that guys like A-Rod took steroids and I think its wrong how this got leaked out.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
oh, the one who leaked the information violated the contract
that I fully agree with. We’re talking about Heyman writing the article though – big, big difference
Go Rice Owls!
You don't think he has any responsiblity to uphold the agreement
He got information that he wasn’t supposed to have and he will likely never reveal his source. Therefore, you get more of these confidential agreements broken because everyone can get away with it.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
ethical? Sure. Legal? No.
Reporters use leaks breaking internal confidentiality rules all the time.
Go Rice Owls!
I know that's true
But you’re telling me that there’s no legal responsibility on there part to not run with information that a contract specifically says they shouldn’t have? I could be completely wrong on this, and I’m sure a few people here know the answer, but I would think that they are doing something that isn’t completely kosher.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
completely kosher
freedom of the press and such.
""It was a ball, dude," Davis said. "I don’t swing at balls anymore." -CD
Why would Heyman have any responsibility
to keep this confidential? He didn’t sign the agreement. He isn’t party to the agreement.
He's talking about legal responsibility.
by brettgardner on Mar 20, 2010 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions
What's your opinion on this
Does he have any legal respnosibility to not reveal confidential information he received from a random source?
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
I don't see how
Seems like anonymity was broken much further up the chain than when he ran the story.
by brettgardner on Mar 20, 2010 12:00 PM CDT up reply actions
So would it depend on how direct the source was
or does the buck stop with the first one to break the agreement and everyone else is free to go.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
The person would have to be in some form a
party to the agreement in my opinion. I’m not a lawyer, but I do work on contracts that include confidentiality language all the time. More for buisness though.
the second one
not only that, but even reporters who goad someone into breaking the contracts are not held liable
""It was a ball, dude," Davis said. "I don’t swing at balls anymore." -CD
Yep
He’s in the BBWAA and is a part of MLB, even if it is only on the media side.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
Is the BBWAA
a party to the labor agreements that put the confidentiality agreement in place? I doubt it.
I'd think that being a part of the BBWAA
should at least have him think twice about putting out a story that MLB said was confidential and that the public had no right to know.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
legally not morally
You can argue the moral side all you want. It’s a pretty slippery slope though so be careful what you wish for.
Point being
if you expect things like this to be swept under the rug, you know because it’s not cool to out the manager when he’s been contrite, then where does the line stop.
To be clear I’m not really making an arguement either way just making sure my point about the slippery slope was clear.
problem is
if Washington sued, the story lives indefinately. let the 24 hours new cycle roll over and hope it never resurfaces is basically all he can do.
You can guarantee
that Wash and the Rangers want this to blow over as soon as possible.
"If this video was an ice cream flavor, it'd be pralines and dick." Clark
re: Matthew Wilder-Break My Stride, 4/17/09
That's what a lot of people in here (and the players as well) want as well
They properly see this as a distraction and think it could impact how the club plays.
That’s dumbass short-term thinking by all involved because in the long-term you are not going to win when you have a manager with a coke problem or should I say, couldn’t turn down coke at the most important time of the season to date.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 11:47 AM CDT up reply actions
x
You just said yesterday that teams can win in spite of their manager.
by brettgardner on Mar 20, 2010 11:48 AM CDT up reply actions
Yes, they can but I don't believe it happens very often.
I believe if it does, it’s usually short-term success.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 11:51 AM CDT up reply actions
You said that in relation to a World Series win.
If that’s short-term success, I’ll take it.
by brettgardner on Mar 20, 2010 11:52 AM CDT up reply actions
I just reread my post.
Did you see what I did there?
"If this video was an ice cream flavor, it'd be pralines and dick." Clark
re: Matthew Wilder-Break My Stride, 4/17/09
Shhh
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"When you have a weapon on your shoulder like he has, you can be cool." RW on Perez
And the little bastard threw it for a swinging strike three in a 3-2 count. He’s blessed. And ballsy.
My one problem with the story being leaked
is that it is probably somewhat arbitrary, or worse, driven by a leak with an agenda.
I actually have no problem with guys being outed for failing drug tests; but they all should be revealed. I don’t think there should necessarily be confidentiality when it comes to cocaine or steroids or whatever. But given that there is, there could be dozens of players, coaches, and managers who test positive every year, and we just heard about Washington because someone doesn’t like the Rangers and/or the man.
Go Rice Owls!
drug tests are hardly infallible
that’s why i would never work anywhere that required it as a condition of employment. get the wrong thing in your system that produces a false positive and it doesn’t matter. there’s a presumption of guilt. add to that that it becomes public information and your entire life can be ruined. i think it’s insanity that anyone would agree to such terms.
fair enough
your choice. To me, assuming confidentiality exists in a very public world, like professional sports, is somewhat naive.
Go Rice Owls!
But what happens to confidentiality if the clubhouse person is with
the manager when he does coke and then sees the boys from MLB show up with their cups 48 hours later?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 11:35 AM CDT up reply actions
well said
…I really have to question not just the wisdom, but the propriety, of Heyman and SI opting to go public with this info.
Just because you break a big story doesn’t mean it was the right thing to do. I mean, if someone came up positive for HIV or another infectious disease, HIPAA protects the medical history of any person from becoming public information. How does what Heyman did qualify as anything short of violation of a federal mandate?
Doesn’t the MLB CBA preclude this stuff from become public as well? Why isn’t Heyman liable for some of this?
"Drinks are on me if Lewis posts >168IP and an era lower than 3.86." by RangerMad on Jan 20, 2010 12:36 PM PST
it is a stretch to say that testing positive in a work drug screen is medical history
and Heyman doesn’t fall under MLB’s internal rules or agreements – he doesn’t work for MLB
Go Rice Owls!
And as a member of managementt
Wash is not covered by the CBA
"Thats all we got? One goddamned hit?" - Harry Doyle
"You cant say god damn on the radio."- Colorman Monte
"Ehhh, who cares...nobody's listening!"- Harry Doyle
Heyman himself would probably come out OK in a legal case
A court could subpoena his notes and hold him in contempt of court if he doesn’t reveal his source, though. That’s about the only legal hot water he could get into here. They can’t sue him for libel because Washington actually did fail a drug test (well, they could sue but they wouldn’t win). But if it was a crime to leak the info, then law enforcement has subpoena power.
thank you all for answering my legal questions
it still pisses me off, but at least I know it wasn’t illegal. It’s just getting harder and harder to defend Wash.
"Drinks are on me if Lewis posts >168IP and an era lower than 3.86." by RangerMad on Jan 20, 2010 12:36 PM PST
Defending Wash has nothing to do with whether the story was leaked or not
The only two things that matter are (1) how you feel about his use of coke and (2) whether several months of thrice weekly clean tests temper your initial opinion.
I'm back guys! heh
Now have a baby boy..and I’ve actually been too held up to even look at Ranges news. So..I missed ALL of the Washington cocaine talk! =/ heh.. I’m sure everyone is tired of it all now.. I guess I’ll go through past threads to see what everyone thinks.
Congratulations!!
My two “babies” are now 14 and 12. It goes fast, so enjoy every day!
"I’m not in the meetings and not part of the discussions; it’s not my responsibility. . My responsibility is to go out and win tonight. My focus is to win tonight. The club has to look at more than just this year." -Michael Young
Congraulations MIchael.
Enjoy the ride.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
by Cecilio's Guante on Mar 20, 2010 11:14 AM CDT up reply actions
He already did...
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"When you have a weapon on your shoulder like he has, you can be cool." RW on Perez
And the little bastard threw it for a swinging strike three in a 3-2 count. He’s blessed. And ballsy.
by Rodney on Mar 20, 2010 11:45 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
lol
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
by Cecilio's Guante on Mar 20, 2010 11:46 AM CDT up reply actions
At least once
"If this video was an ice cream flavor, it'd be pralines and dick." Clark
re: Matthew Wilder-Break My Stride, 4/17/09
oh wait I missed this earlier, REC!
If the Rangers don't make the play-offs this year I'm gonna go all Epic Bearded Man on your ass.
Excellent news!
Congratulations! Is this your first? If so, your life will never be the same…enjoy it!!
"I've had a lot of experience with semantics, so don't try to lure me into some maze of circular logic."
by GhostofSteveFoucault on Mar 20, 2010 11:15 AM CDT up reply actions
congratulations sir! I can't wait to see pics of baby Mike E!
If the Rangers don't make the play-offs this year I'm gonna go all Epic Bearded Man on your ass.
Congrats Mike!
It’s a helluva ride. Don’t know if this is your first, but it’s a wonderful thing.
"If this video was an ice cream flavor, it'd be pralines and dick." Clark
re: Matthew Wilder-Break My Stride, 4/17/09
Hearty congratulations.
"Don’t want to spend my night waiting in line unless it’s for more beer."
--EssBee, on LoneStarBall, Jan. 21, 2010
congrats
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
by Cecilio's Guante on Mar 20, 2010 12:27 PM CDT up reply actions
Congrats man.
And don’t waste your time looking through the threads. Just a train wreck that’s not worth your time.
Now get to making that baby boy a future Ranger!
"grilled cheese punches like a bitch" -Gdawg
"i feel like k-rod after a save." -by reagan on Jan 23, 2010, that glorious day Hicks was out of our lives.
AJM
You seem more grounded in reality than most regarding the Rangers but sorry, your takes on the Ron Washington Cocaine Scandal make it seem like you’re being a homer.
First, saying you don’t see the problem with Wash using cocaine recreationally if his employers didn’t think it was hurting his performance as manager. That’s mind-boggling.
Then criticizing SI for running the piece? You wanted them to sweep it under the rug? I don’t think so, a manager failing a drug test is a really big deal …IT’’S NEVER HAPPENED BEFORE. It seems like you disagree with this story only because it hurts the Rangers or at the very least serves as a distraction.
Heyman obviously didn’t get his info from MLB although they may have confirmed some of the story. This came from an outside source who was looking to make the Rangers look bad at the worst possible time and I have no problems whatsoever with SI running with this.
I want the Rangers to win more than anybody but I don’t think you can do it when your manager has a coke problem. That’s why I’m glad this came out and I cannot wait to see this team fire Washington’s ass.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
Its not sweeping anything under the rug
Its also not a guarantee its never happened before. Its a guarantee that we’ve never found out about it before. Thus the whole confidentiality agreement. If you have a problem with that, take it up with MLB and the player’s union
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
he's not being a homer
he’d be saying this with anyone – he’s pretty libertarian on this type of stuff.
Go Rice Owls!
x
I don’t think so, a manager failing a drug test is a really big deal …IT’’S NEVER HAPPENED BEFORE.
They didn’t start testing managers until a couple of years ago, of course. And you don’t know that ITS NEVER HAPPENED BEFORE…you just know that a manager failing has never gone public before.
And sure, Heyman got this from an “outside source,” and I think we can all make a pretty good guess as to who that “outside source” is. You tell me…why do you think that person wants to make the Rangers look bad?
by Adam J. Morris on Mar 20, 2010 11:12 AM CDT up reply actions
Why do I think that person wants the Rangers to look bad?
I don’t know but that’s a separate issue and an attempt to muddy up the water.
That person is no longer affiliated with the team but Ron Washington, the person who can’t turn down cocaine when the team is playing it’s most important games to date, thought it would be a good idea to use coke and is still the manager of the team.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 11:17 AM CDT up reply actions
But he can turn down coke...
he did it for half a season, at least.
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
What if he'd gotten black-out drunk that night instead of using coke
Should he have deserved to be fired?
by Adam J. Morris on Mar 20, 2010 11:18 AM CDT up reply actions
Again, muddying up the water. THAT didn't happen that we know.
What did happen is that the manager used cocaine during the season and at the most important time of the year to date and still thought it was a good idea to use coke.
That’s a deal-breaker to me but you don’t seem to think it’s a problem if he uses it recreationally, as long as his employers don’t think it is hurting his performance.
That is absolutely mind-boggling.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions
There are a lot of incidents...
that can possibly happen that indicate poor judgement that don’t carry this particular stigma. We wouldn’t have heard of this, because of confidentiality, except that someone with an axe to grind released the info. Adam is trying to get you to elaborate on where you draw the line at incidents that indicate poor judgement.
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
ben,
Every issue has extenuating circumstances.
A deal-breaker for me is a manager that uses cocaine during the most important time of the season.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 11:32 AM CDT up reply actions
I think the most important time of the season
Would be after the all-star break.
I'm just goofin' new boot goofin'
The most important games of the season at the time (early July)
were those games v LAAA and our manager thought it was a good time to use coke.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 11:36 AM CDT up reply actions
We didn't do too bad in those games
Also as far as we know it was a one time mistake. You didn’t notice anything different about Wash last season. He wasn’t passed out in the dug out. He’s been tested 3 times a week since, and has not failed a drug test. I am completely confident in the fact the he does not have a problem, and that he is perfectly capable of managing my favorite baseball team.
I'm just goofin' new boot goofin'
Until the team is eliminated from the race...
… practically speaking, if not mathematically, all games are the “most important … of the season at the time”.
He just keeps saying that
So in his mind what he is saying is still rational.
I'm just goofin' new boot goofin'
I think
if at the time of those games you didn’t single out his managing decisions as a problem, then you can’t use hindsight to do so, because that means that you didn’t notice any effect of a one time incedent, and THAT is all we know that it was; there is zero supporting evidence that you can provide that says a) this wasn’t the first time he tried it, b) that he is a coke head, c) that he is a crack head, and d) that you can make any argument to the contrary, because you have no idea, you’re just spewing irrational hate in defense of an evidenceless position. on top of all that though, I agree that he should have been fired at the All-Star break, I agree that I don’t want a manager who did cocaine, but I can do those things without applying some tired schtick that contributes nothing to ANY conversation and drags down an entire message board. that is all
You hear about the "Electric Arms", they're all the rage.
"If the Rangers have marked improvement in 2010, I'm going to need to give JD credit." Josey Wales, Feb. 10, 2010 11:45 AM CST
by sunlegend54 on Mar 20, 2010 2:05 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Ahaha...
the most important games of a baseball season are always played in July? Of course they are.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
Hence the term, "to date."
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
You're right...
this year the April 9-11 series against the M’s are the most important games to date of the season.
Does your stupidity have any limits?
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
Why does it matter when he did it?
As long as he did it during the season, that’s bad enough for me. It doesn’t matter whether the series was important or not.
by nathanbaum09 on Mar 20, 2010 4:14 PM CDT up reply actions
It really is eerie
how often you ride into the rescue for Josey once he’s exhausted all of his ridiculous arguments…
"calmer than you are dude" Walter (Big Lebowski)
by Arlington Stadium Legend on Mar 20, 2010 5:52 PM CDT up reply actions
my point was against joseys......
but nice try.
by nathanbaum09 on Mar 20, 2010 5:55 PM CDT up reply actions
Being in or close to first place in early July is much
more important than being in or close to first place in early April or does your stupidity not have limits?
You’re looking for a loophole to give the crack head/coke head a break but the fact of the matter is, a 57 year old man jumped into the Cocaine River in the most important games to date of the 2009 season.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
I wonder...
if you have to give the boatman 2 drachma before he’ll allow you to travel down the Cocaine River.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
"A deal-breaker for me is a manager that uses cocaine during the most important time of the season."
So, the cocaine use isn’t the problem, just when it happened? Would it have been OK in spring training or at the all star break?
It's the straw
that breaks the back.
If he did this during the off-season, say over the holidays with some of his friends back in Nawlins, I’d take a very, very dim view of it and need to review all the other circumstances before rendering a final decision.
Doing it during the season at the most important time of the season to date (after all the other crap we’ve had to endure while he’s been manager) along with being 57 years old is the deal-breaker to me.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
I asked you a hypothetical
Personally, from an impacting-your-job standpoint, I don’t think using cocaine is any worse than getting blackout drunk. Neither of those things are particularly good for your health or mental state, and neither of them are things you should do regularly, but at the same time, the fact that one would choose to do one of those things on occasion is not, in my mind, something that should automatically make that person disqualified for most jobs.
by Adam J. Morris on Mar 20, 2010 11:27 AM CDT up reply actions
We disagree profoundly on this issue, Adam.
I don’t think you can use coke recreationally and be a good manager.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 11:31 AM CDT up reply actions
duly noted...move along.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
by Cecilio's Guante on Mar 20, 2010 11:32 AM CDT up reply actions
Okay
Can you use coke recreationally and be a good VP for a Fortune 500 company?
A good investment banker?
A good lawyer?
A good accountant?
by Adam J. Morris on Mar 20, 2010 11:34 AM CDT up reply actions
Or a sports radio talk show host?
"If this video was an ice cream flavor, it'd be pralines and dick." Clark
re: Matthew Wilder-Break My Stride, 4/17/09
Maybe but those jobs are all different
than being a big league manager.
When you’re a big league manager, you are one of the faces of the franchise and represent much more than a good investment banker, lawyer or accountant.
A large part of your job is to make thousands of good decisions every day and be beyond reproach.
If you do cocaine at the most important time of the year, your ability to make good decisions is going to be questioned by everybody.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 11:40 AM CDT up reply actions
What?
When you’re a big league manager, you are one of the faces of the franchise and represent much more than a good investment banker, lawyer or accountant.
by brettgardner on Mar 20, 2010 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions
HAHAHA!
Yeah, ’cause those jobs are so fucking trivial…
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"When you have a weapon on your shoulder like he has, you can be cool." RW on Perez
And the little bastard threw it for a swinging strike three in a 3-2 count. He’s blessed. And ballsy.
I know I can do any of those jobs in my sleep
But writing down that Elvis starts at second, Feldman is starting on his scheduled day to start, Frankie pitches the 9th if there is a 1-3 run lead, etc. Man, I can’t do that shit at all.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
lol, good catch
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
jkshdklfjsalhfdh
When you’re a big league manager, you are one of the faces of the franchise and represent much more than a good investment banker, lawyer or accountant.
You’re overrating the position and the field it’s in.
No shit...
managers mean very little and it’s still a fucking game.
To say they mean more than any other position he listed is just absurd.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
Okay
What if President Obama tested positive for recreationally doing coke? Would that be news?
my better is better than your better.
My lord.
People really are horrible at constructing hypotheticals.
by brettgardner on Mar 20, 2010 11:46 AM CDT up reply actions
How so?
Adam used an argument of hypotheticals of individuals that are not in the public eye at all. I used a hypothetical of someone who is much more in the public eye than Ron. The reason Ron failing a coke test is news is because he is a public figure.
my better is better than your better.
Compared to Obama
Ron is the guy scratching lottery tickets in the gas station.
I'm just goofin' new boot goofin'
This analogy should be FBG approved
;)
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"When you have a weapon on your shoulder like he has, you can be cool." RW on Perez
And the little bastard threw it for a swinging strike three in a 3-2 count. He’s blessed. And ballsy.
x
Being a “public figure” doesn’t mean anything by itself. It’s a very generic term. And being a public figure alone doesn’t make something newsworthy.
by brettgardner on Mar 20, 2010 11:50 AM CDT up reply actions
Then we disagree.
To me anyone who could be viewed as a role model for children, failing a drug test, showing poor judgment, and breaking the law is news.
my better is better than your better.
A role model for children?
What stupid kids are looking up to a baseball manager?
by brettgardner on Mar 20, 2010 11:55 AM CDT up reply actions
ugh
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
by Cecilio's Guante on Mar 20, 2010 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions
Great movie
"Josey drives to games???
I always assumed he rides in on his high horse"
jam0152
Martin Perez, "Mucho queso"
I said
anyone who “could” be viewed as a role model for children…I’m not saying he is the number one role model, but I am sure there are kids who know they’ll never make it to the major leagues playing but dream of managing a team and the Rangers are their favorite team. Do you think there is not one kid out there who views Ron Washington as a role model?
my better is better than your better.
Think of the kids!!!!
How will their parents ever explain this to their kids.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
I don't think some kid is going to ...
go buy an 8 ball for the first time because he heard Ron effin Washington does a little blow. Look at Hollywood they ALL party. It’s not that big of a deal.
If the Rangers don't make the play-offs this year I'm gonna go all Epic Bearded Man on your ass.
Miley does coke & horses, I've heard
She’s much more of a role model than some 50-something brother.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"When you have a weapon on your shoulder like he has, you can be cool." RW on Perez
And the little bastard threw it for a swinging strike three in a 3-2 count. He’s blessed. And ballsy.
So the reason why it is a problem for Washington...
…is because he is a public figure, and not because it impacts his job performance?
by Adam J. Morris on Mar 20, 2010 11:54 AM CDT up reply actions
You really don't know why this is
a problem for Washington?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions
That is why it is newsworthy
If i failed a coke test Heyman would not be running a story about it, if someone that is a public figure fails one then it is a story.
my better is better than your better.
If you have kids,
by your definition, it would — assuming your kids look up to you.
Watch out for a snooping Heyman around your house.
by robert_d_wilfong on Mar 20, 2010 5:24 PM CDT up reply actions
How about not doing cocaine instead?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
I don't know about that....
Billy Martin was drunk on his ass most of the time and was a pretty good manager.
I'm with Josey on this one...
Using cocaine is illegal, getting black out drunk is not. While both might have similar affects on being able to handle his job responsibilities there is a legal side. If Ron was caught shoplifting or breaking some other law that showed poor character I would think it would be news. Someone who is supposed to be a role model for children doing something unethical is news in my mind. The whole situation reminds me of the whole Tiger thing, the Rangers were arrogant enough to think it wouldn’t ever catch up with them and they could get away with never acknowledging it. And to answer your question below, if I was paying an investmen banker, lawyer, or accountant, millions of dollars, to manage a team of young 20 year old something professionals, and to be a public figure of my firm, and he was caught doing coke I would fire him immediately without any thought. While it doesn’t stop him from doing a good job necessarily it would make me lose all trust I had in him and I would not want to stake my name, business, and reputation on someone I could not trust.
my better is better than your better.
The legal side has been handled
He went through the program, has taken all the drug tests required. He offered his resignation and the team felt he was still the right man for the job or he would have been gone.
The legal side is just not an issue anymore.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
you sure do conflate the term legal
you suggest Heyman broke the law by reporting the story, yet using cocaine is no longer a legal question because he worked out an arrangement with his employer.
I’m not suggesting Wash should go to jail or be prosecuted or anything. But ‘legal’ in the sense rangerjake is using it implies state and federal laws.
Go Rice Owls!
If you get arrested with possession of cocaine
Should we talk about how to punish you a year later after you get out of jail? The punishment has already happened, but since the public didn’t know about it, they have this sense that he got off with no punishment. As far as state and federal laws, he wasn’t caught by the state or anyone else. If you fail a drug test while trying to get a job, you don’t get thrown in jail the next day. You just probably don’t get the job.
Heyman on the other hand is one of many who do find ways to leak confidential information and like philkid mentioned below, he claims its his responsibility and that he doesn’t want to do this which is just slapping us in the face IMO. The problem with not punishing him in any way continues to allow these sorts of things to happen. And people do have a right to privacy, especially when a legal document says so.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
I think he was referring to at the time
and with regard to the Rangers response. The legality of his actions certainly would have been a factor then. Obviously no one is advocating any legal action now.
And nothing Heyman did was illegal. Unethical? Perhaps. But illegal?
Go Rice Owls!
You must realize how ridiculous this is
If the press cannot report information they receive that is controlled by a confidentiality agreement, then everyone (politicians, CEOs, teachers, etc.) would just create confidentiality agreements and the watchdogs (the media in most cases) would have no recourse for reporting any negligence.
Heyman never agreed with anyone to not share the test results. I’m not saying it was responsibility, but he certainly has every legal right to report this as news.
by robert_d_wilfong on Mar 20, 2010 5:35 PM CDT up reply actions
Arrogant?
How is it arrogant to abide by MLB’s confidentiality laws, and the federal confidentiality laws, in terms of not acknowledging it happened?
by Adam J. Morris on Mar 20, 2010 11:55 AM CDT up reply actions
This is stupid
Cocaine is an illegal drug, alcohol is not. Furthermore, lets say Wash did get arrested for DUI. That, imo, is much more socially acceptable than testing positive for coke. Your reasoning for Heyman ignoring this isn’t rational at all.
It's pretty rational.
And you gave no reason to dispute it.
by brettgardner on Mar 20, 2010 11:45 AM CDT up reply actions
AJM question the "wisdom"
of going public with the news? Why wouldn’t he? He isn’t doing anything wrong by informing the public of this. I don’t see the argument as to why he had the obligation not to cover this story
Did you read what he wrote?
It’s one thing to disagree with Adam, but it’s another to not understand what he said.
by brettgardner on Mar 20, 2010 11:53 AM CDT up reply actions
So because the goverment...
says one drug is legal and another one isn’t that makes one of them more acceptable?
Quick question. What do you think is the cause of more deaths in our society, cocaine or alcohol?
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
x
You can’t keep saying “that’s not what happened.” We’re talking about reasoning, here. That’s how hypotheticals work.
by brettgardner on Mar 20, 2010 11:31 AM CDT up reply actions
LOL, AJM's muddying up the water
but the guys saying Wash has a coke problem and is a crack head, that’s completely on topic
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
Water---River...
Get It?!
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"When you have a weapon on your shoulder like he has, you can be cool." RW on Perez
And the little bastard threw it for a swinging strike three in a 3-2 count. He’s blessed. And ballsy.
Also
Why do you think “that person” who is the source is no longer affiliated with the team? Heyman’s key source historically has been someone with no affiliation to the Rangers at all.
by Adam J. Morris on Mar 20, 2010 11:19 AM CDT up reply actions
Who are you inferring is the leak?
Isn’t Heyman usually a parrot for Boras, who presumably is far away from this story?
Are you suggesting someone at MLB, even up to Selig himself? That’d be a huge story – I’d be utterly shocked if Selig were so stupid. And anyone in MLB leaking this would be completely risking their job to score some points against the Rangers? Highly unlikely.
I think it is far more likely that it was someone within the Rangers organization at the time – Wash starting to get tested multiple times wouldn’t go unnoticed, and who knows who Wash told “off the record” in the clubhouse.
Go Rice Owls!
One of the fired employees also had to take a drug test
and I would imagine they all took the tests on the same day.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 11:43 AM CDT up reply actions
The fired employee...
is covered by confidentiality. We wouldn’t know if he tested positive or not.
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
The fired employee didn't write the story.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions
And your point?
That the person who wrote the story should also have outed their informant?
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
My point is that neither JD or Ryan told Tom Hicks and that
particular secret getting out would not benefit either one of them.
How does MLB benefit by leaking this?
I think Heyman’s source came to him because he knew Wash had been partying in So Cal (possibly with him) and then knew they all had to pee in a cup 48 hours later.
Then the players find out about it in September and more people become aware of it (and maybe they have stories of their own about Wash because this surely pissed off somebody).
Then the longtime employee gets his walking papers when the season is over and has an axe to grind.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 12:07 PM CDT up reply actions
Sometimes talking to you...
is like talking to my dear departed grandfather. “Of course, the Masons are involved in this! It’s as plain as the nose on your face!”
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
What's your theory on the leak?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 12:15 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't have a theory on the leak.
It doesn’t matter to me. Theories are unlikely to ever be confirmed, and so are about as illuminating as how many angels can dance on the stitch of a baseball.
What we know is what we know, Ron apparently did coke, he still works for the Rangers, and has apparently done whatever followup was required by the league.
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
Very safe opinion.
I don’t think RG would make something like that up.Many in here don’t like him but he doesn’t have the rep of making anything up.
It may not have been technically blackmail but the leak came from somwhere and it didn’t come from JD & Ryan.
While it may not have been the person with the 22 year history with the team who says he’s writing a tell-all memoir, maybe it was somebody else very close (maybe not that mature) to him that was also fired. Maybe somebody who is fairly young and would like to stay in MLB didn’t get their glowing rec letter.
I have no idea but the leak came from somewhere and the timing for the Rangers couldn’t be worse which suggests that somebody had an axe to grind.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 12:34 PM CDT up reply actions
who is writing a memoir?
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
by Cecilio's Guante on Mar 20, 2010 12:37 PM CDT up reply actions
Zack Minasian
Not sure why Josey won’t just refer to him by his name
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
I read in the DMN that
Zack Minassian wants to write a tell-all memoir because he’s been involved in the game since the early 60s as a bat boy with the Angels or Dodgers.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 12:39 PM CDT up reply actions
Meh.
It’s ultimately not a big deal. Gives us all something to talk about before the season starts, but in a couple of weeks we’ll be bitching about on-the-field performance, not this nonsense.
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
Winning cures cancer, little bro
and that’s Wash’s only option this year and there can’t be any 7-16 hiccups to start the season.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 12:40 PM CDT up reply actions
That's no different than it would have been without this story.
by brettgardner on Mar 20, 2010 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions
I think Wash
sans the story of a 57 year old jumping in the Cocaine River during the most important time of the year could have faded the heat of another 7-16 start but not now.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 12:43 PM CDT up reply actions
bg
They’ve been very reluctant to fire him in the past…the idiot did cocaine during the most important games of the year to date and still survived…and Nolan seems to be very patient/non kneejerk when it comes to making changes in season.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 12:46 PM CDT up reply actions
Weren't you just saying a couple of weeks ago...
the exact same thing, only without the cocaine aspect?
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
I'll let you look for any quotes I may
have said but my recollection is that I said neither JD nor Wash will survive unless this team shows marked improvement in 2010.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 12:48 PM CDT up reply actions
Which is different than present circumstances...
how?
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
Like I said,
I thought Wash could survive another 7-16 start and be permitted to finish out the season before this bombshell landed.
I think the leash became much shorter.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
Hold the line, dude
You’re marked down for Wash/JD losing jobs unless they win 92 games in the regular season.
Look at the comments under Jeff Wilson's blog post on dallasnews.com. What a bunch of rocket scientists.- Keith Law
Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal!
There is no way Wash survives yet another slow start to the season
If this team starts May 1st with a record below .500, Wash is going to need a miracle to remain as manager.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
It was Hank Blalock
he’s getting back at Wash for losing all those ABs to Chris Davis
by simplesimon on Mar 20, 2010 12:50 PM CDT up reply actions
Boras
Given Heyman’s history, it would surprise me if he wasn’t the source for the story.
by Adam J. Morris on Mar 20, 2010 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions
If Heyman heard it from Boras, then you can't really blame Heyman for going public.
If Boras knows, it is no longer confidential.
If Heyman got it from anyone
it is no longer confidential.
How does Boras benefit
by being a source? That’s one less team to shop his free agents to in the future.
I think this came from inside the Ranger clubhouse. Somebody was fired (after 22 years with the team) and had an axe to grind.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 12:00 PM CDT up reply actions
Ah
So it is the clubhouse attendant guy who you think leaked this?
by Adam J. Morris on Mar 20, 2010 12:02 PM CDT up reply actions
Quit pussyfootin' around and give us your detailed theory.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
by Cecilio's Guante on Mar 20, 2010 12:02 PM CDT up reply actions
I heard on the radio earlier that it was a disgruntled ex-employee
and they were trying to blackmail the Rangers into something. Is that not confirmed? (seriously have no idea..haven’t been around)
RG ran that story and the Rangers denied it happened.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
by Cecilio's Guante on Mar 20, 2010 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions
The Rangers brass denied they were blackmailed.
It is not a good precedent to set and they want this over now.
I would imagine that a severance was agreed upon and when the disgruntled employee asked for more non-financial stuff (like a glowing rec letter) and was turned down, he went public.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 12:11 PM CDT up reply actions
According to reports, that is the case...
and they actually gave into some of his demands.
"I've had a lot of experience with semantics, so don't try to lure me into some maze of circular logic."
by GhostofSteveFoucault on Mar 20, 2010 12:04 PM CDT up reply actions
Noland and JD have both said that didn't happen
Galloway says that they won’t admit it, but its true.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
What is Boras' motive to hurt Ron Washington or the Rangers?
Not saying there isn’t one, I’m just not seeing it at the moment.
Wrong angle
His motive could just be to give juicy info to a writer in return for puffing up his guys.
by brettgardner on Mar 20, 2010 12:02 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree that Boras feeds Heymann
things but that particular nugget of info hurts a potential Boras client and that’s bad for bidness.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 12:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Only if it came out that it was Boras
Which seems unlikely.
by brettgardner on Mar 20, 2010 12:13 PM CDT up reply actions
it wasn't Boras
"I’m not in the meetings and not part of the discussions; it’s not my responsibility. . My responsibility is to go out and win tonight. My focus is to win tonight. The club has to look at more than just this year." -Michael Young
Okay, that sounds plausible.
So under this theory, someone who had the information and wanted to see it go public (for their own reasons) would give it to Boras, figuring that the information would then get to Heyman? Perhaps with the added tidbit that this was being leaked to other sources, implying that there was an imperative to publish this sooner or risk being scooped?
A complete hypothetical with not a shred of proof backing it up, of course, but there’s been plenty of that going around the last few days. This one is merely for entertainment purposes.
It all comes back to Blalock!
Blalock and his fucking zombie-ism TOS!
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
And the Masons!
I’ll bet Wash had to piss in a mason jar too. And Heyman’s a member…yeah.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"When you have a weapon on your shoulder like he has, you can be cool." RW on Perez
And the little bastard threw it for a swinging strike three in a 3-2 count. He’s blessed. And ballsy.
You only care about this cause it gives you another reason to want Wash fired.
I’m not defending Washington, but your position, as always, lacks sophistication.
Having your manager brandishing a crack pipe during the most
important time of the year to date, is another good reason to fire him.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 11:15 AM CDT up reply actions
Wait
I must have missed the story where it was revealed he was smoking crack.
by Adam J. Morris on Mar 20, 2010 11:15 AM CDT up reply actions
Or why...
crack is worse than cocaine, except in the classist or racial sense.
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
Does it really matter how the coke was ingested?
To me it doesn’t matter if he was rolling with his buddies in a car, doing it with a stripper, at the Playboy Mansion or anything else.
The manager of our favorite team who was 57 years old thought it was a good idea to jump off a bridge into the Cocaine River either the night after or the day of a very important game.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 11:20 AM CDT up reply actions
It doesn't matter at all to me how he ingested coke.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 11:44 AM CDT up reply actions
Then why do you keep calling him a crackhead?
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
Because he's young and he's black
and his hat’s real low.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
What is your preferred nickname of
choice for somebody who ingests coke?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 12:17 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't see it as a revelant point.
You choosing “crackhead,” however, is revelatory in the sense that it has certain specific connotations… revelatory in the sense that it tells us how you wish to frame this debate, and your own specific biases, not revelatory in the sense that it tells us anything important about how we should view what the Rangers organization did.
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
by benmor78 on Mar 20, 2010 12:23 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Connotations...
I imagine there are more white people who use crack than black people just because there are more white people in this country. Do you have a breakdown on who uses it more often?
I also don’t think there’s too much of a difference between being a crackhead or a cokehead. Both are dumbasses.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 12:37 PM CDT up reply actions
Libertarian groups...
generally have been opposed to sentencing disparities for coke vs. crack because the the disparities in racial impact. So, yeah, there appears to be a racial divide in how it’s used.
But, more importantly for this convo, is how it’s perceived, which is why you’re saying “crackhead” as opposed to something else.
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
So you'd prefer that I call him a coke head
instead of a crackhead even though we don’t know exactly what he did that evening?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions
If we don't know exactly what he did...
why does it make sense to call him a crackhead? It’s not accurate in the sense that cokehead would be.
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
This is reminiscent of...
…the P.J. O’Rourke story that talked about the subtext of a lot of the “War on Drugs” stories, about how crack is destroying our cities, crack is the biggest threat to the future of the country, crack is ruining our young people…
And how, if you replace “crack is” with “black people are,” you probably get a clearer picture of what a lot of those folks were worked up about.
Fortunately, with 9/11 and the War on Terror, we’ve found a new group of dark-skinned people to be the bugaboo for white America, besides young black men selling drugs.
In any case, to feign innocence and naivete over the racial connotations with the use of the word “crack,” while continuing to use it in reference to Washington (even though there’s nothing to indicate that he used crack), is disingenuous.
by Adam J. Morris on Mar 20, 2010 12:57 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Sorry if you feel that way
but I don’t think being a coke head is any more glamorous than being a crack head.
As mentioned previously, both are dumbasses.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 12:59 PM CDT up reply actions
That's great
But I also think that you are purposely using a loaded word, because of the fact that crackhead has a much different connotation than cokehead.
I know you like referencing my calling you a very gifted writer, and this is the sort of thing I’m talking about…you are great at finding the most most loaded word possible to get across the subtleties of your message, and hammering that word again and again. You have a gift for propaganda.
by Adam J. Morris on Mar 20, 2010 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions
So what would your reaction be if Buck Showalter
was found to have a coke problem during the most important part (to date) of the 2005 season?
One more thing, I still cannot believe you said yesterday that you don’t mind or have a problem if Wash uses coke recreationally as long as his employers have determined it’s not affecting his performance.
I find that mind boggling, did you misspeak or are you standing by that thought a day later?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
How many times
do you have to ask the same question?
"calmer than you are dude" Walter (Big Lebowski)
by Arlington Stadium Legend on Mar 20, 2010 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions
Believe it or not
Drugs aren’t that bad if you aren’t letting them run your life, certainly not much worse than things like cigarettes, alcohol, and prescription drugs that people abuse every day.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
this is very true actually
I’d MUCH rather be around an occasional drug user than a sloppy drunkard. Boy have I seen some messy drunks in my life and that is an ugly, pathetic and obnoxious existence.
Not to mention will kill you before the occasional drug bit will.
If the Rangers don't make the play-offs this year I'm gonna go all Epic Bearded Man on your ass.
I don't know what my reaction would have been
I wouldn’t have called him a crackhead, though.
by Adam J. Morris on Mar 20, 2010 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions
Question
Should Billy Beane be fired if it is determined he has used cocaine while g.m. of the A’s?
by Adam J. Morris on Mar 20, 2010 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Every situation is different (including this one becase Beane is the GM and also a part of ownership), Adam.
I’d lean very heavily towards firing him but that would depend on all the other extenuating circumstances (including job performance).
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
If Nelson Cruz tested positive for cocaine...
…would you advocate releasing him?
What about Ian Kinsler?
by Adam J. Morris on Mar 20, 2010 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions
No on both of them. They're both young, great talents and aren't managers of the team. Big differences with them.
You never answered my question about what your reaction to this would be if it happened to Buck before the 2006 season.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
You said you wouldn't call him a crack head which wasn't the question.
Would you have wanted him fired for smoking/snorting/otherwise ingesting coke at his age at the most important time of year?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
Nope
At least, not any more so than I did beforehand.
by Adam J. Morris on Mar 20, 2010 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions
And
you’re standing by your statement that you wouldn’t care if Washington did coke recreationally as long as it didn’t hurt his job performance?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
Or that his employers
didn’t think it was affecting his performance?
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
why would anyone care...
…unless it was affecting his performance? Everybody knows you don’t like Washington. Most here don’t like Washington. I don’t understand why one incident of cocaine use is something you’re clinging to when there are so many other things to bitch about.
Are you really one of these war on drugs crusaders? I don’t think you are. You just found something new to obsess about.
This guy has been tested three times every week since then and has come up clean. He’s done the counseling or whatever. Paid his dues and isn’t a habitual user or a recreational user and is certainly not a cokehead or crackhead.
Leave him alone about that. Call into question his baseball judgment all you like but this is the most overblown non-issue ever.
by Black Francis on Mar 20, 2010 3:52 PM CDT up reply actions
Is there a point to these hypotheticals?
by nathanbaum09 on Mar 20, 2010 4:20 PM CDT up reply actions
im referring to the back and forth between Adam and Josey
by nathanbaum09 on Mar 20, 2010 5:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Of course there's a point.
It’s to probe Josey’s reasoning and see how far it extends.
by brettgardner on Mar 20, 2010 6:26 PM CDT up reply actions
oh come on Josey Wales..
you have to do a line or two before you kick the bucket just so you can say you tried it and either liked it or hated it. It’s not going to kill you. Make sure and take some hair ball medicine before because you may be spending most of the night “eating at the Y.”
If the Rangers don't make the play-offs this year I'm gonna go all Epic Bearded Man on your ass.
No BigGuns, crossed that bridge a long time ago
and don’t care to F my life up.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
There's your problem
I’m not saying everyone should do drugs, but the fact that you think doing a line or two of cocaine will fuck your life up shows that you clearly don’t understand the drug. I’ve never done it and that’s my choice to not do it, but that doesn’t mean that I think anyone who tries it out is destroying their life.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
This was exactly what I was thinking about.
“Parliament of Whores.” Amazing how much of that book is still relevant 20 years later. The chapter on the Audi scare is now relevant again, too.
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
I'll have to go back and read that.
PJ is the shit.
"If this video was an ice cream flavor, it'd be pralines and dick." Clark
re: Matthew Wilder-Break My Stride, 4/17/09
this.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
by Cecilio's Guante on Mar 20, 2010 12:30 PM CDT up reply actions
crack and coke
are different drugs
You hear about the "Electric Arms", they're all the rage.
"If the Rangers have marked improvement in 2010, I'm going to need to give JD credit." Josey Wales, Feb. 10, 2010 11:45 AM CST
If it doesn't matter...
why do you keep insisting that it was crack?
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
Lol cocaine river?
You’re that guy I heard on the radio saying Wash was funding terrorists with his drug usage, and that he should be fired, huh?
I'm just goofin' new boot goofin'
What do you think cocaine does to a person?
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
Fuck and yes it matters
If you’re comparing coke to crack.
That’s like drinking an energy drink versus battery acid, dude.
Look at the comments under Jeff Wilson's blog post on dallasnews.com. What a bunch of rocket scientists.- Keith Law
Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal!
this is true...
crack or meth <——-poor mans coke
If the Rangers don't make the play-offs this year I'm gonna go all Epic Bearded Man on your ass.
And I'm assuming with his income and being in LA
He could score some pretty decent coke, which means little to no shit that isn’t cocaine going into his nose, which is pretty decent, all things considered.
Coke is pretty damned low on the hierarchy of addictive/destructive drugs.
Look at the comments under Jeff Wilson's blog post on dallasnews.com. What a bunch of rocket scientists.- Keith Law
Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal!
yep he got some high test coke, maybe kept him up a few hours..
while he did who knows what, but so what?
If the Rangers don't make the play-offs this year I'm gonna go all Epic Bearded Man on your ass.
I've done coke...
and I’ve done crack. There’s not much difference except in the length of the experience and the time it takes for the drug to take effect.
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
It's been a while since I've done any studyin' on it
But the crack has a much higher chance of having some serious you-don’t-want-this-shit-in-your-body stuff in it than coke, no?
Look at the comments under Jeff Wilson's blog post on dallasnews.com. What a bunch of rocket scientists.- Keith Law
Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal!
The come down off crack sucks.
But other than that, spot on.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
by Cecilio's Guante on Mar 20, 2010 12:31 PM CDT up reply actions
The come down off of cocaine of any sort sucks.
A sort of existential hangover. But I don’t think the majority of people would say, “Yeah, tried coke and then the next week I was sucking off sailors to get a fix.”
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
heh, True.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
by Cecilio's Guante on Mar 20, 2010 12:39 PM CDT up reply actions
I've never done crack..
I’ve done ecstacy, meth, mushrooms, and coke. I’d never do anything that requires a needle. Meth was the best high and the most incredibly sexual drug I’ve ever done. Thankfully I can do such things once in a while because I don’t have an addictive personality. I’d do a couple lines of coke with Ron Washington. Can you imagine the awesome baseball stories he would tell? One night I did a couple hits of ecstacy with David Geffen. It was one of the coolest nights of my life.
We spend the night talking about how he started out in the William Morris mail room and worked his way up to being a billionaire. What it was like being best friends with John Lennon, dating Cher and a bunch of other fascinating shit (to me). I wouldn’t change all that for nothing and would do it all over again in a heartbeat.
If the Rangers don't make the play-offs this year I'm gonna go all Epic Bearded Man on your ass.
P.S.
I’ve seen a bunch of stuff saying that the Simon thing was just interpreted badly, and it wasn’t Geffen.
by brettgardner on Mar 20, 2010 12:46 PM CDT up reply actions
LOL no as nice as can be, to me anyway.
If the Rangers don't make the play-offs this year I'm gonna go all Epic Bearded Man on your ass.
Yeah
I don’t think it was him. Warren Beatty seems much more likely.
by brettgardner on Mar 20, 2010 12:48 PM CDT up reply actions
Mick Jagger is great on that song.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 12:49 PM CDT up reply actions
Speaking of Jagger and vain
The Stones’ cover of Love in Vain is the standout track of Let it Bleed.
by brettgardner on Mar 20, 2010 12:52 PM CDT up reply actions
That's a good tune (wasn't that an old
Robert Johnson blues number from the 30’s?), hell that entire record is greatness but I have soft spots for Monkey Man, the title song, and Gimme Shelter.
That entire record was so different than anything else being made. It’s true greatness and stands the test of time.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions
yeh I can't imagine it was Geffen but it could of been..
he does have a huge ego, like most billionaires.
If the Rangers don't make the play-offs this year I'm gonna go all Epic Bearded Man on your ass.
I think she says Geffen's name backwards
in a recent recording.
Dick Ebersol paid 50G couple years ago to find out.
'Waiting for a girl and she gets me into fights
Waiting for a girl we get drunk on Friday night'
Haven't you seen Wash? It must have been a crack pipe.
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
Please stick to the facts...
fabrications only weaken an argument.
"I've had a lot of experience with semantics, so don't try to lure me into some maze of circular logic."
by GhostofSteveFoucault on Mar 20, 2010 11:16 AM CDT up reply actions
It was before the all star break
So it really wasn’t all that important. You claim AJM is a homer and is not looking at this rationally. But it’s clear as fucking day you would be looking at any reason to fire Wash, and you’re the one not looking at this rationally. Usually I stay away from your convos, but you’re just pissing me off this morning.
I'm just goofin' new boot goofin'
wow...i.Orange has had it with you!
If the Rangers don't make the play-offs this year I'm gonna go all Epic Bearded Man on your ass.
Must be a crackhead
got a hold of the wrong stuff
"The one constant through all the years, Ray, has been baseball." - Terence Mann
I wanna know where da' gold
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"When you have a weapon on your shoulder like he has, you can be cool." RW on Perez
And the little bastard threw it for a swinging strike three in a 3-2 count. He’s blessed. And ballsy.
Gonna get a backhoe and uproot that tree.
"If this video was an ice cream flavor, it'd be pralines and dick." Clark
re: Matthew Wilder-Break My Stride, 4/17/09
This is just part of the standard Josey rhetorical two-step.
If he got tested and caught, that’s a cocaine problem. If they win, he doesn’t have a cocaine problem anymore.
"Blalock in the cleanup spot makes gives me agita." - Dustin
+ 1 so he likes to party once in a while...who cares??? I don't ...
If the Rangers don't make the play-offs this year I'm gonna go all Epic Bearded Man on your ass.
You boy's baseball game get rained out?
Go to an indoor cage and throw him some bp or something, no need to waste your Saturday around here holmes.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
by Cecilio's Guante on Mar 20, 2010 11:17 AM CDT up reply actions
Mine did, and it sucks!
This weather is where we left off last fall.
"I’m not in the meetings and not part of the discussions; it’s not my responsibility. . My responsibility is to go out and win tonight. My focus is to win tonight. The club has to look at more than just this year." -Michael Young
Dude....I haven't been this sick for 15 years...
fucking miserable.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
by Cecilio's Guante on Mar 20, 2010 11:24 AM CDT up reply actions
Yeah, about an hour after I posted my smart ass update I started getting sick...
started projectiling (from both ends) around 10pm.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
by Cecilio's Guante on Mar 20, 2010 11:27 AM CDT up reply actions
You have to perfect the move
of spinning off the toilet to puke. Just don’t get the ends mixed up.
"If this video was an ice cream flavor, it'd be pralines and dick." Clark
re: Matthew Wilder-Break My Stride, 4/17/09
You do mean puking in the sink or shower, right?
Because elsewise you have blowback hell coming right at you
Look at the comments under Jeff Wilson's blog post on dallasnews.com. What a bunch of rocket scientists.- Keith Law
Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal!
If the other receptacles are nearby, that will work.
Our toilet is in it’s own little stink room away from the shower, sinks, etc. If you spin to puke, that’s where the blow-back effect can rear it’s ugly head.
"If this video was an ice cream flavor, it'd be pralines and dick." Clark
re: Matthew Wilder-Break My Stride, 4/17/09
This.
Just put a trash can in front of you or aim for the tub if it’s close enough. No thanks to getting splashed in the face by a vomit/diarrhea cocktail.
Ready for some baseball.
I'm not sure what's more disgusting in this thread.
The poop/vomit talk or the Josey talk. Toss up.
"grilled cheese punches like a bitch" -Gdawg
"i feel like k-rod after a save." -by reagan on Jan 23, 2010, that glorious day Hicks was out of our lives.
If Washington had a coke "problem"
There’s no way he would have tested clean the three times a week he was being tested since the incident. No chance in hell, I’ve seen people with addiction to coke, there’s no stopping them. He would have been popped a second time and we wouldn’t even be talking about this shit right now Washington would be gone.
"We pitched, we caught the ball, we ran the bases, we had good days where we out-fundamentalized the other team." - Ronald Washington
by Pocket Ninja on Mar 20, 2010 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions
So who wants to party in the drug-free AM thread?
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
heh, this thread will have 3 times the comments as that one.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
by Cecilio's Guante on Mar 20, 2010 11:18 AM CDT up reply actions
there ain't no partying going on over there...
If the Rangers don't make the play-offs this year I'm gonna go all Epic Bearded Man on your ass.
I just checked in over there and it's not pretty....
unless you consider serving hot tea and a music combo of church/elevator a good time.
If the Rangers don't make the play-offs this year I'm gonna go all Epic Bearded Man on your ass.
It's more like this.
"If this video was an ice cream flavor, it'd be pralines and dick." Clark
re: Matthew Wilder-Break My Stride, 4/17/09
ME ME ME ME
"Josey drives to games???
I always assumed he rides in on his high horse"
jam0152
Martin Perez, "Mucho queso"
The lack of respect for confidentiality around baseball is going to hurt baseball in the long run
At at minimum, it could make negotiations over the next CBA very interesting. If I’m a player, I wouldn’t trust MLB with any information that isn’t designed to go public.
by cstorm15 on Mar 20, 2010 11:18 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Or could it actually help clean it up?
The threat of an something going public (steroids, drug use, etc) could be used as a deterent to some.
"I've had a lot of experience with semantics, so don't try to lure me into some maze of circular logic."
by GhostofSteveFoucault on Mar 20, 2010 11:20 AM CDT up reply actions
Not on all issues...
I don’t think steroids should be confidential. This seems like more of a personal issue to be handled by the Rangers and MLB.
"I've had a lot of experience with semantics, so don't try to lure me into some maze of circular logic."
by GhostofSteveFoucault on Mar 20, 2010 12:22 PM CDT up reply actions
I used to really enjoy Bill Simmons writing...
now he’s just an arrogant shit (or maybe he just always has been.)
Simmons is greatness.
His basketball book is now one of my all-time favorite sports books (and I’ve read a boatload).
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Ranger players, especially veterans, weren’t surprised that Daniels couldn’t find a deal"
"The Influence continues." Josey Wales (1/18/10)
by Josey Wales on Mar 20, 2010 11:26 AM CDT up reply actions
I agree about the BoB
But his writing has continually gone downhill.
I am Jurickson Profar son of judeska and chesmond.. And I was born ready! ready to play baseball!!- Jurickson Profar 2/15/2010
by Aquaman, Esq. on Mar 20, 2010 11:31 AM CDT up reply actions
I never knew a point when I liked him.
It’s some guy who reminds me of frat kids at school writing about the stupid things he and his friends do, how much of a piece of trash he is and giving his almost-always incorrect analysis of sports. Fun read!
what are the chances
that in the near future we read that Warsh has resigned and entered a drug rehab program?
I soloed in the Mile High Club!
Probably pretty high if the team stumbles out of the gate.
I am Jurickson Profar son of judeska and chesmond.. And I was born ready! ready to play baseball!!- Jurickson Profar 2/15/2010
by Aquaman, Esq. on Mar 20, 2010 11:32 AM CDT up reply actions
he already did a drug rehab program mandated by MLB
He’s not an addict.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
by Cecilio's Guante on Mar 20, 2010 11:33 AM CDT up reply actions
Sez the guy who deals with it for a living
And yup.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"When you have a weapon on your shoulder like he has, you can be cool." RW on Perez
And the little bastard threw it for a swinging strike three in a 3-2 count. He’s blessed. And ballsy.
This. . .
This, though? This is, despite the high-minded moralizing from certain quarters, simply a gossip piece, a news item designed to titillate.
But on MLBN, Heyman said you have to report the news and you can’t hide the facts when you find something out, no matter how much you want to. And he said it with such pain and conflict in his voice, about how it was hard but he was doing the right thing.
Bullshit.
If hes going to break the story, fine. But don’t be a wuss, and say he didn’t want to, but it was the right thing to do. He knows exactly why he did it, and it worked.
I'm just goofin' new boot goofin'
He's always struck me as a smarmy little prick
So, par for the course.
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"When you have a weapon on your shoulder like he has, you can be cool." RW on Perez
And the little bastard threw it for a swinging strike three in a 3-2 count. He’s blessed. And ballsy.
The more I think about this, the more I think it comes down to two issues...
1. Was this newsworthy? No…due to privacy issues, this shoud have never been made public. That being said, let’s suppose Wash was fired last week (or at the time of the test results)…what would have been the reason given? Would they have thrown Wash under the bus? How would they possibly have explained this? Unfortunately for Wash, this would have come out either way…the Rangers, either through belief in Wash as a manager and as a person (probably both) decided to work through this with him…personally, I think this says a lot for the Rangers as an organization.
2. Should he have been fired? No…many of us would have been fired from our jobs if it were discovered we had been using drugs BUT we’re not working in the MLB world…most of our employers don’t have mechanisms in place to deal with these issues like the CBA does. Since MLB does, procedures are being followed, he’s getting treatment and Wash still has a job.
People who want Wash’s head on a platter are applying their own reality to MLB reality…those two worlds will never meet.
"I've had a lot of experience with semantics, so don't try to lure me into some maze of circular logic."
by GhostofSteveFoucault on Mar 20, 2010 11:49 AM CDT reply actions
To add to your second point
The world of professional sports is nowhere near the same as the rest of the business world. And no number of analogies and comparisons between the two will ever make it the same. It can help for us to understand certain things, but we need to remember that they aren’t and never will be the same thing.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
Wow
I picked a bad week to be out of contact with the outside world. Wonder how long it will take me to go through all of the previous week’s comments…anybody care to sum them up?
meta-signature
cue Ron Washington doing blow GIF..it would be a sin if this thread didn't have it :)
If the Rangers don't make the play-offs this year I'm gonna go all Epic Bearded Man on your ass.
Sure:
Something significant happened and everyone has differing opinions on the matter.
Also, Rodney threw up on a hooker last night.
Wait, WTF?
Were you the guy I hi-fived Eiffel style? Man, was I ever trashed….
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
"When you have a weapon on your shoulder like he has, you can be cool." RW on Perez
And the little bastard threw it for a swinging strike three in a 3-2 count. He’s blessed. And ballsy.
Okay.
Before the cocaine story
Josey: Ron should be fired! He is so stupid
After the cocaine story
Josey: Ron should be fired! He is so stupid.
I'm just goofin' new boot goofin'
by iorange555 on Mar 20, 2010 12:08 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I've been saying that since it came to light
And yet people keep arguing with Josey.
It is a lot to digest...
suffice it to say that Wash did cocaine last season (once), he is in the treatment plan and has passed subsequent tests…the great debate now is whether or not Wash should still have a job …the Rangers (ownership, management and players) are backing Wash…
"I've had a lot of experience with semantics, so don't try to lure me into some maze of circular logic."
by GhostofSteveFoucault on Mar 20, 2010 12:08 PM CDT up reply actions
funny.... let me sum it up....
We’ve had some very productive discussions here and come to some important conclusions: 1.. Doing coke is bad, 2. Doing coke is not so bad 3. Wash should have been fired, 4. The Rangers did the right think by not firing Wash.
There you go, see you in a week.
Great post Adam.
I agree the bad guys here are Heyman/SI and the guy who leaked, and it bugs me that all those up-in-arms over Wash’s side of this are doing exactly what the bad guys wanted.
Have to agree
I really don’t care if the manager (Ron) owner (w) did coke or anything else. The tome person I would care is if it was a yankee, because my cousin is a Typical smug Yankees fan.
by pancake on Mar 20, 2010 12:32 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
If you don't think this story is news
you are kind of delusional.
But as far as this goes…one of the things that really bothers me about this is why the story ran. Washington tested dirty, acknowledged his use, has complied with the treatment required by MLB, has stayed clean…what does outing him now really accomplish? Is it advancing any sort of “news”? Not really. At least the PED stuff impacted players’ on-the-field performance, supposedly.
Considering DFW and the baseball world has talked about this nonstop, I’d say that SI got a pretty big scoop when they got this story.
News has always been about gathering stories people care about. Folks in baseball definitely seem to care about this story. News Reporters have never really been about accomplishing an agenda. They try to tell a story folks care enough so they will buy newspapers, watch tv programs and listen to the radio.
"I don't condone steroids or any other type of growth hormones or anything else, but I could care less, and, for the most part, I don't think the fans give a (bleep). The people that care about it are the people that probably don't like baseball," - Jim Leyland
I suspect that...
…there are lots of things that writers could choose to write about that, would result in lots of discussion, but that it is questionable whether it should be written about.
See, e.g., the stories about ARod’s extramarital activities that resulted in such a big brouhaha.
by Adam J. Morris on Mar 20, 2010 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions
If it sells papers
its making the news.
This story is at least as newsworthy as Britney shaving her head.
If you are a public person and you do something like this, it most likely will get reported if the story leaks to enough writers. Sooner or later someone is gonna run with it.
"I don't condone steroids or any other type of growth hormones or anything else, but I could care less, and, for the most part, I don't think the fans give a (bleep). The people that care about it are the people that probably don't like baseball," - Jim Leyland
You're making a descriptive statement
Adam’s in normative.
by brettgardner on Mar 20, 2010 2:05 PM CDT up reply actions
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