My estimates of the Rangers payroll in 2011 and 2012
The discussions over the past week or so about the benefit of signing Cliff Lee got me thinking about exactly what the Rangers roster situation for the next couple of years. Below is my attempt to fairly assess what the short-term payroll situation of the club is going forward, specifically years 2011-2012. All the data on service time is from Scott Lucas’s site, and money is from there and Cots.
The format is as follows: I’m going to list the players who are under team control and what their salaries will be or should be through arbitration process. This is obviously a guess, and can be discussed; but I’m going to go roughly off the following equation: Arb year 1/2/3: 25%/50%/75% free agent value, with a fudge for changed performance (Hammy’s est. FA value went up this year). Free agent value will be estimated. All numbers are in millions. I apologize ahead of time if there are any minor errors, please let me know if so.
2011
Pitchers
Lewis: 3
Feldman: 4.4
Harden: 1 (assume buyout)
Oliver: 3.25 (assume option vests)
Wilson: 3rd year arbitration. Estimate 6 million
Lowe: 2nd year arbitration. Estimate 1.5 million (not much of a raise due to injury)
Nippert: 1st year arbitration. Estimate 1 million
Lee, Frankie free agents
Hitters
Young: 12
Kinsler: 6
Vlad: 9 (option?)
Hamilton: 2nd year arbitration: 3.25 last year, better season, estimate 8.
Cruz: 1st year arbitration: 3.25 (estimate off Josh’s 2010)
Murphy: 1st year arbitration: 1.5
Molina, Treanor free agents
In summary
Fixed costs: 29.75
Unknown option: 9 (Vlad)
Arbitration estimate: 23.25
12 players (11 w/o Vlad)
Estimate $62.00 ($53.00 w/o Vlad)
Rest of carried over roster is at or around major league minimums. This covers Elvis, Hunter, Holland, Harrison, Feliz, Borbon, etc. Assume 12 players to cover 25 man roster at $500K each for minimum (includes buffer since some DL time will result in team paying double minimums), roughly $6 million
Estimate $68.00 ($59.00 w/o Vlad)
Holes: in addition to Lee, the Rangers would obviously need to fill catcher, replace Vlad (if he walks), possibly replace Frankie, and potentially a first basemen.
Definite needs: catcher
Probable needs: first baseman, bullpen arm
2012
Pitchers
Lewis: 3.25 (option)
Feldman: 6.5 (yay!)
Lowe: 3rd arbitration – I have no idea… say 3
Harrison: 1st arbitration – 1.5
O’Day: 1st arbitration - 1
Holland: Super 2 arbitration? – assume no after AAA time this year
Nippert and Mathis will be up for arbitration, these are likely non-factors/non-tenders
CJ, Oliver gone via free agency
Hitters
Kinsler: 7
Young: 12
Hamilton: 3rd arbitration - 12
Cruz: 2nd arbitration – 7
Murphy: 2nd arbitration - 3
Andrus: 1st arbitration - 3
Teagarden, Blanco, Davis, and Boggs could be up for 1st arbitration, but these are likely non-factors/non-tenders
Vlad gone via free agency
In summary
Fixed costs: 28.75 (4 players)
Arbitration estimate: 30.5 (7 players)
11 players
Estimate $59.25
Rest of carried over roster is at or around major league minimums. This covers Hunter, Holland, Feliz, Borbon, etc., and hopefully Scheppers and Perez. Assume 10 players to cover 25 man roster at $500K each for minimum (includes buffer since some DL time will result in team paying double minimums), roughly $5 million
Estimate $64.25
Holes: At this point, unless we assume that the minors keep providing 4-5 major league quality players a year, there are more holes to fill via the market, as I’ve essentially non-tendered guys like Davis, Teagarden, Nippert, and Mathis before they can cost a lot via free agency.
Definite needs: catcher, DH
Probable needs: first baseman, starter, 1-2 bullpen arms
Conclusions – over 2011 and 2012, the Rangers should be looking at roughly $65-70 million each year to maintain their current roster, minus guys who become eligible for free agency (i.e., Lee, Molina, Wilson, Frankie). There are obvious holes to fill in addition to re-signing Lee, most obviously catcher, but also including 1b, the requisite annual added bullpen arm or two, and the Vlad question. One should note that more players will be required to supplement lost players in 2012, so the equivalent committed salary numbers are somewhat deceiving.
Also, most here would say that locking up players like Elvis and Feliz (as well as Hamilton) is something this front office should be considering. Such actions will not change these numbers dramatically, but they would push a few dollars forward.
I’m going to refrain from making very strong claims about my favorite targets (Lee, Feldman), but I will simply note that these are non-trivial commitments for a team whose total payroll will likely be in the $70-$80 million range, at maximum, over this time period. I will simply say that it will be hard to address other areas of concern via free agency if Lee is signed, though this obviously doesn’t preclude trading for cheaper players to fill those holes. Also, removing Scott Feldman’s bloated salary from this would make things a lot more flexible going forward…
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Ranger might throw out payroll projections next year and go higher
Just reported by Evan Grant, New Rangers Management Willing to Ditch Payroll Projections.
Apparently there is at least some discussion among the front office of going well beyond the $77M projection used during the bankruptcy proceedings.
Greenberg declined to discuss any specifics on payroll projections. When asked if this team could support a contract of at least $20 million or more and not encounter the same financial trouble as previous ownership did following the Alex Rodriguez signing, Greenberg also declined to speak in specifics.
“Everything that we do is going to be very well thought through,” he said. “What I can promise is that it will be thoughtful based on both the near and long-term abilities to contend. We think we can do that and keep this team together.”
Greenberg re-emphasized the club’s desire to re-sign Lee and said he was optimistic it could, but given the projections unveiled during the club’s bankruptcy proceedings, it sounded a little hard
I still doubt they resign Lee, but that is certainly interesting.
Freude schöner Götterfunken, Tochter aus Elysium, Freude!
I suspect some of this talk
is new owner euphoria, but perhaps they’ve looked at the revenue projections with a playoff run and other scenarios and figure they can afford it.
Freude schöner Götterfunken, Tochter aus Elysium, Freude!
other scenarios being
TV, radio and merchandise revenue? Season tickets sells will also go up along with in stadium advertising. It’s nice to have a winning team.
I think all of those are pretty closely related to how deep they go
If they get knocked out by the Yankees in 3 games, you won’t see revenues jump by all that much.
Whereas if they go to (or win….) the WS, then there will be a considerable jump that could alone justify resigning Lee.
Go Rice Owls!
Other scenarios being
keeping vs. letting go other free agents, trades, blah blah blah
I’m sure the revenue projections include probable outcomes for tv, radio, season tickets, etc.
Freude schöner Götterfunken, Tochter aus Elysium, Freude!
That'd be good
They almost certainly have to throw out that mid-70s figure we saw if they’re going to re-sign Lee. And who knows, if they make a decent playoff run they may be able to justify it.
I’m not necessarily against signing Lee, I’m just skeptical of how wise it is if they aren’t going to up payroll significantly faster than they’ve been talking about. Because there are other holes to fill too.
Go Rice Owls!
Nolan said in an interview
in the last week, I think on a pre game show that a good estimated payroll would be around $90 mil by the 2013 season so its evident they intend to keep their good players and not go all Oakland on talented young players
by blueballlefty on Aug 13, 2010 4:36 PM CDT up reply actions
I want two signings, but it would be very costly.
Cliff Lee and Adrian Beltre.
Let Vlad walk after offering him arbitration (if you will think he will walk). Move Face to DH. Plug Beltre in at third and watch no one ever hit it through the left side of your infield again.
Profit.
"When I want my men to remember something important, to really make it stick, I give it to them double dirty."- General George S. Patton
What about CF? Do you think Borbon will suffice? Or is there someone out there they can pick up?
I think the CF position is going to be the biggest discussion point this offseason… Well, that and catcher. And 1B… Geez, JD still has work to do, eh?
"I don't really like pitchers." - Nelson Cruz
I think you'd be hard-pressed to find a team that didn't go into a new season with at least a few holes.
I really do believe that Borbon can handle CF, especially defensively. His poor performance on offense wouldn’t be nearly as noticeable in a lineup that didn’t also have holes at 1B and C.
"When I want my men to remember something important, to really make it stick, I give it to them double dirty."- General George S. Patton
I agree
CF isn’t great, but that’s easily #3 on my list of lineup concerns, maybe #4 depending on what you do with Vlad.
Go Rice Owls!
As far as position players go, I think it has to be C first, 1B second, or vice versa.
Although Michael Young’s defense at third gives Baby Jesus nightmares.
"When I want my men to remember something important, to really make it stick, I give it to them double dirty."- General George S. Patton
I don't worry as much about Young
Josh’s article this morning kind of explains why.
Would it be good if he was better? Absolutely. But like it or not he is the FOTF of a team that is going to go to the playoffs for the first time in a decade. He’s moved positions twice for the team, the last time very much grudgingly. Quite simply, he’s too popular both to fans and in the clubhouse for the front office to completely alienate. In other words, you can’t move Young unless you trade him, and you can’t trade Young the season after the best year in franchise history. Basically, Young isn’t moving.
Go Rice Owls!
So basically what you're saying is that Young would be unwilling to do what would be best for the only team he's ever played for at the MLB level
And the team for which he is supposed to be the FOTF.
Because if we could replace him at third with someone able to give great defense, I don’t see how you decide not to.
"When I want my men to remember something important, to really make it stick, I give it to them double dirty."- General George S. Patton
I'm just being realistic
at least with Elvis, you were talking about moving him for a premier prospect. It is annoying, but I’m sure watching Elvis a few minutes he realized that he could live with it. Besides, moving to 3rd is still the infield.
Going out and signing a free agent for the sole purpose of replacing Young’s glove at 3rd- when the only reason he is at 3rd to begin with is the team moved him there two years before – would be viewed as offensive to Young, to most players on the team, to the media, and to most fans. You may not like it, but that is how it would be viewed.
I think you’d be in the minority if you were angry at Young for not wanting to move over for a free agent signing at 3rd base, regardless of how great the new guy’s glove may be.
Go Rice Owls!
DH'ing in baseball sucks
It’s a lot more justiable to complain about being shoved to DH than from SS to 3b
AKA BuckyB
Personally,
I don’t see much sense in exercising Vlad’s option, since he isn’t a 9 million player. I’d try to move MY to 1B or DH, and concentrate on getting a 3B and C as the top 2 positional priorities.
With the benefit of hindsight, I think I’d rather have had Byrd than Guerrero, as much for defensive value as anything else.
"Look, we're basically on earth to shit and fuck. So unless your job's to help people shit or fuck, it's not that important, so relax."-https://twitter.com/shitmydadsays
Byrd has had an amazing season
6th most valuable OF in baseball, 4th best CFer.
Hey Tom - It's over now, so do you know how - to pick up the pieces and go home?
Yep
he has been fantastic. Then again, he wasn’t exactly a slouch while here, he usually was the 4th most valuable Rangers positional player.
"Look, we're basically on earth to shit and fuck. So unless your job's to help people shit or fuck, it's not that important, so relax."-https://twitter.com/shitmydadsays
That's not the point
It is how good/valuable will he be in 11 & 12?
"I support you, Wash; I’ve always supported you," Young said
"Back on the scene, with a gangsta lean" RW
Probably worth way more
than the 5 million per year he got paid by the cubs.
He’s got a 4 year track record now that says most likely he is going to be a huge bargain for the Cubs. Considering one of our bigger needs is a CF who can hit and field (probably 3rd biggest need after C and 1B), I think there is a good chance he would have been a huge bargain.
"Look, we're basically on earth to shit and fuck. So unless your job's to help people shit or fuck, it's not that important, so relax."-https://twitter.com/shitmydadsays
It's nice to feel confident
that we’ve got the right man for the job, though.
"Drinks are on me if Lewis posts >168IP and an era lower than 3.86." by RangerMad on Jan 20, 2010 12:36 PM PST
The talk of the payroll going way up next year
is only good PR by the new group. I do not think they will go much above $83 million next year, and provided they have another successful year, could stretch that to $90 million the next year.
But, this post is a good way to look at another major challenge to signing Cliff… Rangers have other holes, Cliff take up a huge chunk. Either enhance 3-4 positions, or get Cliff Lee and fill the others with major league run around status.
"Hey Sanka, you can pee now... uuummm, too late...."
This used to be links to my websites... But the man got in the way, shut them all down... Damn the man...
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by FormerLSBUser on Aug 13, 2010 3:24 PM CDT reply actions
Too much
and his defense sucks
"I was going to say, 'You’re gay for Elvis.' But then I realized that I, too, am gay for Elvis." ~Adam J. Morris.
by Kinslerhomer on Aug 13, 2010 4:58 PM CDT up reply actions
V-Mart's arm plus our pitchers lack of pick off move = Record for most SB against.
"I don't really like pitchers." - Nelson Cruz
No worse than that Wakefield game where we stole like 8
If you walked Ichiro or Figgins you might as well just tell them to go on to 2nd
"Hell's frozen over, Pigs are flying! The Saints have won the Super Bowl"
Shreveport Captains in LSB H2H Fantasy League
2011
I think you are a little low.
Young makes $16 million per season. I realize that $4 million is deferred, but his salary is $16 million and we all say what happens when you don’t deal with deferred money when A-Rod because a significant creditor in the bankruptcy case.
I think you have Hamilton and Wilson’s arbitration salaries a couple million low each.
O’Day is arbitration eligible as well.
Those adjustments take you to about $75 million or so, before Lee, Francisco, a catcher, or anything at 1B other than Moreland and Davis.
Add Lee and a catcher, and you are probably between $95 and $100 million.
That said, Greenberg said they were committed to keeping the current team together, so perhaps they are willing to go a good bit higher. I think how this team draws the next two months in games against teams other than the Yankees and Red Sox may go a long way in determining what they are comfortable doing.
I have trouble seeing them
exercising the 9 million option on Vlad unless he goes on fire the rest of the year. 9 million is pretty steep.
"Look, we're basically on earth to shit and fuck. So unless your job's to help people shit or fuck, it's not that important, so relax."-https://twitter.com/shitmydadsays
I don't disagree
But, if you let him walk, I think you are still going to have to commit $8-10 million to a righthanded hitter for the middle of the order (plus I believe they would owe Vlad a $1 million buyout in that event as well).
I don’t know what the market for Manny Ramirez will be this offseason, but l think he’s a guy you should at least consider for Vlad’s role next season.
by Darrell McKown on Aug 15, 2010 5:58 PM CDT up reply actions

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