Michael Young and Frank Catalanotto
by Adam J. Morris on Feb 6, 2011 11:27 AM CST
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PrintWay back in the days when Doug Melvin was still the team's g.m., there was a debate about whether Michael Young or Frank Catalanotto should be the Rangers' starting second baseman. Some in the D/FW media claim that Jerry Narron was fired as manager by John Hart after the 2002 season in large part because he insisted on playing Young ahead of Catalanotto, even though the reality is that Hart was probably going to want to bring in his own guy no matter what Narron did in 2002.
In any case...the irony is that Catalanotto and Young ended up becoming, during their primes, very similar offensive players. Both became line-drive .300 hitters with some pop, guys who would walk some but not a lot, guys whose value was based on making solid contact and putting the ball in play, hard.
Catalanotto was signed by the Rangers prior to the awful 2007 season, and ended up being a major disappointment, ultimately getting released before the 2009 season kicked off.
I'm wondering if the experience with Catalanotto is influencing the Rangers' opinion of what the next few years hold for Michael Young, a player who, like Cat, is at a point where he doesn't really have much defensive value,
Dan Cahill has been making the comparison between Cat and Young a lot in the comments, and it prompted me to go look at their numbers.
Cat's age 33 season, as a Ranger, he posted a .260/.337/.444 line, good for a 781 OPS and a 104 OPS+.
Young's age 33 season was 2010. He posted a .284/.330/.444 line, good for a 784 OPS and a 105 OPS+.
Through age 33, Cat had a .294/.359/.453 line, good for a 812 OPS and a 109 OPS+.
Through age 33, Young has a .300/.347/.448, good for a 795 OPS and a 105 OPS+.
After age 33, Cat posted a .269/.335/.381 line, and was out of baseball after his age 36 season.
Is it possible that the Rangers foresee a similar decline on the horizon for Young, and that, moreso than the imminent 10/5 rights, is what has them trying to move Young now, rather than waiting until after the 2011 season?
Because if Young puts up a line similar to what Cat did in his age 34 season -- a .274/.342/.399 line -- then I'd be surprised if the Rangers could move him after 2011 to any team without eating at least $25 million of the $32 million he'll be owed after 2011.
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Stop it, you're going to upset Athos
Ambition is a poor excuse for not having sense enough to be lazy.
shhhhhhhhhh
the rockies might read this!
by I am Neftali Feliz on Feb 6, 2011 11:31 AM CST reply actions 2 recs
I think this idea of a precipitous dropoff is secondary, but a consideration.
The primary consideration, I’m inclined to believe, is their ability to make a move at the ASB, which might be hindered by Young’s contract.
They found ways to get better on defense and offense and it’s made it hard to justify the performance they get from MY with the salary he commands. I think it’s that simple.
The risk of declining productivity from MY would exacerbate the situation, so it clearly would be a consideration, but not necessarily the fundamental problem.
Godspeed Mike Olt. Oops. Sorry, to see you're trade bait now.
You forget to mention
that Cat was a platoon player at best. You would never want him hitting against lefties. Young on the other hand might not have perfectly even platoon splits, but he’s still an everyday player
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
This is dumb
I’m sure if 90% of Michael Young’s PA’s came against LH pitching, then Michael Young would far out perform Cat.
90.4% of Cat’s PA’s have come against RH pitching.
by octoberty on Feb 6, 2011 11:33 AM CST reply actions 9 recs
I'm all for dealing Young
But this is right. It’s a stupid, lazy comparison.
by JDT217 on Feb 6, 2011 11:39 AM CST up reply actions 8 recs
Just a quick check of the numbers.
Young in 2010 v. LHPs .322/.374/.497
FCat in his last full year in Toronto v. RHPs .306/.379/.449 (and he was a year younger than Young in 2010)
"A stupid, lazy comparison"
Gee, thanks.
by Adam J. Morris on Feb 6, 2011 11:58 AM CST up reply actions
I regularly heap you with praise.
But this was a stupid, lazy comparison, for the exact reason octoberty articulated.
Yeah, this post was like a crack sniper shooting from the hip and hitting his CO in the ass.
Ambition is a poor excuse for not having sense enough to be lazy.
by LSJ on Feb 6, 2011 3:42 PM CST up reply actions
Not really.
I didn't realize you were veganalyst! This makes it totally different! You're one of my favorite twitter/ANers. - Susan Slusser
by vegAN ryAN on Feb 6, 2011 11:35 AM CST reply actions 4 recs
I'm looking at offensive production
Young’s WAR is better because he was putting up his numbers at premium defensive positions. Cat didn’t.
by Adam J. Morris on Feb 6, 2011 11:37 AM CST up reply actions
Young's defense negatively effected his WAR
A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings.
by NothinG on Feb 6, 2011 11:45 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
No it didn't
due to the way they calculate replacement and positional value.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
yeah
Basically, Young didn’t get the full credit for playing league average 3b for his WAR because he didn’t play league average 3b.
I think there was some boost because he wasn’t as awful at 3b as people acted (basically, his playing 3b still gave value to the team, much as LSB hated to recognize that fact). But his value wasn’t entirely due to playing 3b.
Go Rice Owls!
Actually,
according to WAR he played precisely league average 3B last year. He was 5.4 runs better with the bat and 5.4 runs worse with the glove.
His entire WAR is based on positional and replacement level adjustments.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
out on monday
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
No
Evan Grant has been telling me for years that Michael Young is going to morph into Paul Molitor.
"Whenever I'm about to do something, I think 'Would an idiot do that?' And if they would, I do not do that thing."
by Hard8 on Feb 6, 2011 11:38 AM CST via mobile reply actions
I think the greater likelihood
is if MY stays with the Ranger as a DH for 3 more years, his next contract will be an NRI, if he gets one at all.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
First off
the Rangers almost certainly aren’t going to move him after 2011. Young will have total no trade protection, and his contract is going to get worse. I don’t think going into next year hoping Young’s value changes such that some team will want to take the back end of his deal is a realistic option. You either trade him now or never.
Second, as Garoon just said… come on. Cat is the worst case scenario for Young (heck, Cat’s performance was the worst case scenario for Cat). Could that happen? Sure. But is it likely?
Go Rice Owls!
Yeah, this scenario is probably about as likely as Young repeating his 2009 season.
Ambition is a poor excuse for not having sense enough to be lazy.
also
can someone point me to an article where JD or Nolan have said what their opinion is of Young?
I’m wondering if the experience with Catalanotto is influencing the Rangers’ opinion of what the next few years hold for Michael Young, a player who, like Cat, is at a point where he doesn’t really have much defensive value,
Clearly the Rangers would like to do something about that long-term commitment on the books. So that is obvious. But really… is there any evidence beyond complete, total baseless speculation that they view him as Catalanotto?
Go Rice Owls!
No.
More importantly, the FO need not think Young is going to perform like FCat to justify trading him.
No
That’s why I said things like “I’m wondering if” that’s the case.
by Adam J. Morris on Feb 6, 2011 11:51 AM CST up reply actions
PAUL MOLITOR!
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
BRef Most Similar Hitters to Michael Young thru age 33
Ray Durham
Craig Biggio
Jay Bell
Tony Lazzeri
Paul Molitor
Lou Whitaker
Nomar
Carney Lansford
Most (but not all) of these players aged quite well.
No mention of Frankie Cat.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Don't become the '82 Milwaukee Brewers."
"You want false modesty? F that."
i dunno why
but i was thinking he was close to maybe someone like Chuck Knoblauch. But, i think Chuck was a better OBP guy…
"what I have learned in 11 years in the sports business is that the dumbest guys in the room are always the media guys." - mark cuban
that actually makes me feel a lot better if we end up keeping him
"what I have learned in 11 years in the sports business is that the dumbest guys in the room are always the media guys." - mark cuban
Assuming you don't think Cat is the worst case scenario for Young
Would Nomar be his worst case scenario? His last good season was age 33.
Thank you Cliff Lee!
by DerekSTheRed on Feb 6, 2011 11:59 AM CST up reply actions
x
Ray Durham
Craig Biggio
Jay Bell
Tony Lazzeri
Paul Molitor
Lou Whitaker
Nomar
Carney Lansford
Most (but not all) of these players aged quite well.
Bullshit.
Bell was done after age 33.
So was Lansford.
So was Nomar.
Biggio hung around as a decent, not great, player.
Molitor was great, and is the guy everyone’s been wishcasting Young to be for years.
Lazzeri had 245 PAs after age 33.
Whitaker was great after age 33.
Durham had two very good seasons and one awful season, and was done after age 36.
So no, most of those players didn’t age well after age 33.
by Adam J. Morris on Feb 6, 2011 12:04 PM CST up reply actions 14 recs
welp....so much for that.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
Don't bother folks with facts.
It unsettles the HIVEMIND!
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
Nomar had a .792 OPS at age 34.
Biggio had an OPS somewhere between .734 to .838 from ages 34-39 and then hit 21 HR’s when he was 40. That’s more than just hanging around.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Don't become the '82 Milwaukee Brewers."
"You want false modesty? F that."
So are two players most of that list?
"Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor."-Capote
he's probably adding those guys to Whitaker, Molitor, Biggio, Durham
"what I have learned in 11 years in the sports business is that the dumbest guys in the room are always the media guys." - mark cuban
Nomar had a 792 OPS in less than 200 PAs at age 34
Then a 701, then out of baseball.
If he’s one of your “success stories,” then you’ve pretty well made the case about why the Rangers want to move Young.
by Adam J. Morris on Feb 6, 2011 12:16 PM CST up reply actions
This is a bad comp.
Nomar’s problem wasn’t as simple as “he got old and couldn’t hit.” He got hurt and never got healthy again – it’s an issue of durability. Which is also a problem which Young has not exhibited too much. I’m not saying it won’t happen, especially as Young ages, but comparing Young to Nomar is kind of head scratching because they are very different.
Nomar was done because of injury...he couldn't stay healthy. That's not Young's issue.
Paying the Rox $ 20 million, means the acquistion of Beltre is going to cost the team nearly $ 23 million per for the next three years and swells the Beltre contract (which you said would have been “ridiculous” at 6/90) to 6/116.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Don't become the '82 Milwaukee Brewers."
"You want false modesty? F that."
that doesn't add to the cost of Beltre
you can maybe factor in MY’s cost to whoever we replace him with on the bench/DH. Beltre and Young are both here right now.
A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings.
And if they're both here...that's $ 32 million per for the next 3 years.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Don't become the '82 Milwaukee Brewers."
"You want false modesty? F that."
Your case for trading Young is compelling.
"Don’t want to spend my night waiting in line unless it’s for more beer."
--EssBee, on LoneStarBall, Jan. 21, 2010
Look at you cherry picking partial seasons all of a sudden
I guess its okay to do it with Nomar if it helps defend Young, but to look at a season where Napoli had over 400 PAs is crap, right?
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
I would say that most, 5 compared to 3, aged decently
The 5 that aged decently, for their 34, 35, and 36 seasons, put up an OPS of at least 750 12 our of 15 seasons.
Lansford even came back to put up a 100 OPS+ and 2.5 WAR at 35
i’m guessing he was hurt the previous year.
"what I have learned in 11 years in the sports business is that the dumbest guys in the room are always the media guys." - mark cuban
Bell
OPS+ of 93, 88, and 40 in his age 34-36 seasons.
That’s not a success story.
by Adam J. Morris on Feb 6, 2011 12:30 PM CST up reply actions
he was a great bunter.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
So
we consider a 750 OPS success for a guy whose only position is DH? Maybe we can drag Sosa back out of retirement.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
He would love for you to pay him $16 million.
And I guarandamntee you Bonds could OPS .750 right fucking now.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
His best season was a .609....
OBP.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
by GhettoBear04 on Feb 6, 2011 12:40 PM CST up reply actions
every time I look at Bonds' season from that period
it’s mind boggling. That and Pedro’s 1999-2000, just unbelievable.
What if something happens?!?
What could happen to an Old Fashioned?
Yeah, but how many songs did Pedro have named after him?
Now here’s another hit, Barry Bonds.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
by GhettoBear04 on Feb 6, 2011 12:43 PM CST up reply actions
That song is not as excellent compared to other songs
as Bonds is to other ball players…
What if something happens?!?
What could happen to an Old Fashioned?
Very weird note:
In the 2002 World Series, Benji Gil went 4 for 5 with a double.
Barry Bonds still had a higher OPS that series: 8 for 17 with 2 2Bs, 4 HRs, 13 BBs.
for 40 games maybe
unless we move him. To unload that contract, I’d live with Blanco at 2B those 40 games.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
I notice you said "thru age 33" and then attempted to use the data presented to predict the future.
That’s not what those comparisons do.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Chief of Multiple Endpoints.
Blah.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
by GhettoBear04 on Feb 6, 2011 12:38 PM CST up reply actions
Once again, he was pretty clear to say "is it possible?" and presented the whole thing as a hypothetical to explain what the Rangers are thinking.
And it’s much more likely that the Rangers are influenced by something that happened to their club specifically than what happened to Nomar, Biggio, or anyone else not affiliated with the Rangers.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
That would be an even worse process!
And it’s much more likely that the Rangers are influenced by something that happened to their club specifically than what happened to Nomar, Biggio, or anyone else not affiliated with the Rangers.
I never said it was a good idea, but does that not seem more likely?
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Yes,
in the sense that it would be exposing yourself to SSS bias, but is it really unreasonable to expect people to be biased in trying not to make the same mistake twice?
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
by GhettoBear04 on Feb 6, 2011 12:48 PM CST up reply actions
That's hardly the "same mistake."
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Ugh.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
by GhettoBear04 on Feb 6, 2011 12:55 PM CST up reply actions
One of my good friends is from Boston and a diehard Sox fan.
This is really what he was saying to me about Beltre and why it was a terrible contract for us. Of course, his review of Cliff Lee as a Ranger: “He really wasn’t very good for you guys….he didn’t have many wins.”
Now you've done it...
…you’ve pissed off Cahill, AJM and Marissa all in one statement.
* flees *
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
by GhettoBear04 on Feb 6, 2011 12:58 PM CST up reply actions
Could be.
We could be having these same threads in 2-3 years. Wouldn’t surprise me at all.
Que sera, sera.
Young is not in Beltre's class defensively.
Beltre may steeply decline or get injured, but I feel better about his decline phase than I do about Young’s.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
by GhettoBear04 on Feb 6, 2011 12:56 PM CST up reply actions
The issue with the Beltre acquisition
is you were displacing a league average 3B who you would be converting into a bad DH, and he was under contract for 48 million. Well, that and Beltre’s pretty suspicious “career” years that are as probable to be repeated as MYs ’05 and ’09.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
And yet...
Beltre has been a very good player even if you discount his best years (which seems like a poor statistical technique):
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
I'm not arguing
he isn’t a good player, but you still are displacing an average to above average player rather than filling a hole. I am saying that while he is good, I doubt he is anywhere as good as he looked last year. I think Beltre’s 2 spike years mean about as much as MY’s 2005 and 2009.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
I don't think Hamilton will be as good as he was last year,
but I think both Beltre and Hamilton will play at All Star levels this year (~4 WAR and up)
The Rangers displaced a guy who was average to above average last year, but who is declining due to age and was poor defensively even before taking into account another year of aging. Young was unlikely to be a 2.5 WAR player at 3B this year.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
Look a year or so ahead.
While you may be right for 2011, this was their best chance to get a quality 3B to replace Young in the next couple of years. The decent 3B on the market in the next couple of years would be David Wright in 2013, and if he’s not extended he’ll cost a shitload.
They displaced him because this was the best opportunity to displace him in the foreseeable future.
It's not like I'd be shocked if they did it,
but I’d much rather have the FO that said “look at all these dudes who declined at 34” than just “look at this one dude we had who declined at 34.”
PR-wise it would be bad to make the same mistake twice, but I hope our FO doesn’t base too much of their decision-making on “let’s not look bad” (and the whole willingness to move Face suggests they don’t, anyway).
and most (but not all) of those players had significant differences w/ tools than fotf
duram, biggio to be very specific
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
Young vs. LHP last year
.322/.374/.497
by Randy Richardson on Feb 6, 2011 12:07 PM CST reply actions
I'm sure Young would be happy to reduce his role to
only hit against lefties, what do you think?
What if something happens?!?
What could happen to an Old Fashioned?
Pfft.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
by GhettoBear04 on Feb 6, 2011 12:14 PM CST up reply actions
no,
I don’t think Young would be happy with that role.
If we’re comparing Young and Cat’s numbers, seems more accurate to look at Young’s numbers against LHP.
by Randy Richardson on Feb 6, 2011 12:15 PM CST up reply actions
What was compared
were relative rates of growth and decline, but that seems lost on folks.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
Adam directly
compared their statistical performance, while not noting that one of guys was an everyday player and the other strictly a platoon guy (in his age 33 season).
by Randy Richardson on Feb 6, 2011 12:22 PM CST up reply actions
If I thought
you could dramatically limit MY’s role to injury replacement, and platoon bat and PH and the like, I’d be much less inclined to move him.
But if you are gonna get a primadonna who wants his 600+ PAs, has limited if any defensive value, and is probably a sub 800 bat, I’d just as soon move him before the 10/5 kicks in.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
exactly
though I suspect other teams are at least as aware as we are that he’s not happy with the role planned for him, so the Rangers’ negotiating position is shit.
What if something happens?!?
What could happen to an Old Fashioned?
Well
he doesn’t get 10 and 5 on other teams, so there is that. Also, the Rockies seem good with having him as an everyday 2B, and he certainly is worth more as a 2B than a DH. His bat looks better at 2B.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
I'm sure the Rockies will be happy to have Young
if the Rangers pay half his salary.
What if something happens?!?
What could happen to an Old Fashioned?
You could say you are going to dramatically limit Young's role to that.
But will Wash comply with that edict?
I think we all know the answer.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Right.
Moreover, the Napoli acquisition means Young can’t even be 1/2 of a DH platoon even if he was willing to fill that role. The only role that fits is $16MM bench bat.
What killed MYs value
wasn’t the Napoli acquisition. It was the Beltre acquisition.
MY quite simply isn’t worth all that much as a pure bat. He is worth more as a bad defender at a good defensive position, according to WAR. That may say more about WAR than MY, but there it is.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
x
That’s also kind of like a couple of years ago when people were arguing that Young should not be moved off SS because his bat at SS is passable, but at 3B, it is severely below average. While that may be true, one way or another, Young was going to be in the lineup somewhere, and give our options at 3B then, and DH now, he’s going to hit. Yet another reason why the Napoli acquisition baffles me (unless they move Young).
Acquiring Napoli was...
…their way of telling Young that he can’t listen to the radio at a reasonable volume between nine and eleven.
by Adam J. Morris on Feb 6, 2011 12:29 PM CST up reply actions
Heh
Good example, but you really think that they are going to bench Young for extended periods because they have Napoli? Doubtful.
Once you signed Beltre
you really have to move Young. Almost any cheap DH situation you get yourself into is going to be an upgrade from Young.
Young is just a terrible, terrible DH, if you believe, like me, he is likely to be a sub-800 guy, and probably closer to a 775-750 OPS guy the rest of his career. Napoli doesn’t really puzzle me much. Holding on to Young after you sign Beltre puzzles the hell out of me though. He is just a bad DH option, and we could probably do as well by scrubbing the NRI lists.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
Don't know why the Napoli signing would be puzzling either.
Moreland’s hardly a sure thing and regardless of how well he may or may not handle lefties, there’s next to no chance he’ll do as well against them as Napoli will.
And you are still pretty weak at catcher
If anything happens to Yorvit, you don’t want Treanor going full-time and the 3rd catcher on the depth chart is Teagarden. That’s not an ideal situation after the mess we had at catcher last season
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
Teagarden!
Just kidding. If that jerk plays in the majors this year, something has gone catastrophically wrong.
Or we'll know for sure that the Devil is real and he can be bargained with.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Yep
a RH bat, who plays 1B and Catcher.
I mean, what is not to like? Its a beautiful match for this club.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
It's a question of playing time.
The team keeps saying Young is going to hit, Beltre is a high dollar acquisition and will for sure play; Moreland is going to be the everyday 1B, then they say they are excited about Napoli. They can’t all play.
Yes,
I think the biggest disconnect is how LSB views Moreland and how the Rangers FO views him.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
I thought most here
were hopeful that Moreland could put up near average production at 1B, especially with some platooning. Does the front office see it differently? Or am I wrong about how LSB views him?
What if something happens?!?
What could happen to an Old Fashioned?
Most LSB'ers are skeptical of his ability to hit lefties.
So we’re relegating him to a platoon role the FO doesn’t seem to envision.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
I think he'll end up being platooned some
but his minor league stats indicate he should be ok against lefties. Still, if you’re going to sit him, I’d think against lefties is the time to do it.
What if something happens?!?
What could happen to an Old Fashioned?
if the team ever wants Napoli to get in the lineup...
….Moreland is going to have to be platooned. Very simply: Moreland and Napoli can’t play all the time. Young is just not going to be benched 80 times a year.
Sounds like the FO
is committed to Moreland as a guy who will get the majority of PA at 1B.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
we need to find out what Nolan thinks and then look at the opposite.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
Well
it’s tough to see him hitting so little that playing MY instead looks smart.
Unless you think MY is going to spring back to 800+. Personally, I wouldn’t at all be surprised to see him between 750 and 775 OPS.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
I agree we had to move Young.
I was saying that last season, before we got Beltre. I think your OPS prediction is likely correct, but the fact remains that this team is not going to sit Young 80 games a season. It just is not going to happen, at least this year.
May.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
by GhettoBear04 on Feb 6, 2011 12:14 PM CST up reply actions
Obviously the Super Bowl and pregame coverage is as boring to you guys as it is to me.
by FuturePants on Feb 6, 2011 12:23 PM CST reply actions 2 recs
What's the Super Bowl?
I own Mickey Tettleton's couch.
by Pith on Feb 6, 2011 12:23 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
it's pronounced 'Super Ball'
"what I have learned in 11 years in the sports business is that the dumbest guys in the room are always the media guys." - mark cuban
Chelsea lost.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
by GhettoBear04 on Feb 6, 2011 12:46 PM CST up reply actions
So did Liverpool
Torres who?
"Napoli batting regularly in Arlington will be the biggest explosion in the American Southwest since Robert Oppenheimer tested the Manahttan Project."
-- RevHaloFan
Yes, it's quite apparent,
thanks to the commentators for repeatedly making self-righteous, snide remarks regarding how much Chelsea spent at the deadline. Good grief, you’d think they were some combination of auditors and Abramovich’s grandchildren for all the time they spent talking about Chelsea’s finances instead of the actual bloody game.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
I was entertained by Jennifer Anniston talking about her love of the Cowboys.
And Owen Wilson saying his favorite player was Drew Pearson.
Wish I hadn't missed that.
I will always love Jennifer Aniston.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Drew Pearson should be in the Ring of Honor.
Jerry you keep screwing these things up.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
Dexter Fowler
I’d be willing to eat alot of the money if we could get Fowler.
How realistic does this sound?
Young plus $20-25 million for Dexter Fowler & Jose Lopez.
Then cut Lopez because his contract isn’t guaranteed.
So an experienced unicorn, then?
To each his own, I guess.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Someone is mixing up their mythology.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
by GhettoBear04 on Feb 6, 2011 12:46 PM CST up reply actions
i don't follow
i’m new here, not a part of your inner circle… i’m on the outside of your inside jokes
any opinion on the actual trade idea?
Young and $20MM for Fowler & Lopez ??
How about
$20 and a six pack of beer for Milas Kunis and Natalie Portman.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
Well done.
Ambition is a poor excuse for not having sense enough to be lazy.
by LSJ on Feb 6, 2011 3:45 PM CST up reply actions
I'd take Lively over Kunis.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
ok, congratulations
pat yourself on the back for being a baseball web-genius
that plus your $30,000 salary gets you a ’95 nissan sentra and an apartment in arlington so you can drive by the ballpark and dream
You give me far too much credit.
I don’t even own a car.
by Josh Garoon on Feb 6, 2011 12:46 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I've never even been to Mexico.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
You'd think one could get
a 96 sentra, maybe even a 97 on a $30,000/year salary. What has this country come to?
by behindthebag on Feb 6, 2011 12:47 PM CST up reply actions
Or a Dodge Stratus
"Napoli batting regularly in Arlington will be the biggest explosion in the American Southwest since Robert Oppenheimer tested the Manahttan Project."
-- RevHaloFan
my point is...
i’m new here, i just discovered this website a couple days ago.
the articles seem to be a decent read, but the comments section appears to be 5% baseball and 95% high-school trash talk.
sorry, not trying to be a dick… i’m just not in with this in crowd
Not trying to be.
But certainly accomplishing the feat.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
I don't know
I was thinking of putting that snark and Garoon guy on my FOE list.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
Which channel?
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
I was sure I had that one, but it appears I do not.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Garoon seems ambivalent.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
You should write a song about it.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
wrote a song about it. wanna hear it
hear it goes
The snozberries taste like snozberries!!
by Chrom on Feb 6, 2011 4:40 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
Correct
If it has beans it’s just stew.
Hi, my name is Josey Wales and I'm a douche. Prove me wrong.
Oh, it's not just HS trash talk.
If certain posters return, you’ll get to find out, in exquisite detail, how they’d like you to die.
by JDT217 on Feb 6, 2011 12:51 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
So just like HS, then.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
It's been a long offseason,
and we’ve basically discussed everything that’s happened baseball-related ten times already.
So we’re mainly commenting about OT stuff, or old personal grudges.
Just ignore Garoon, dirty Louisianan dude.
And don’t worry, you’re definitely not in with this crowd. Take it as a compliment. Who wants to be a part of a site like this, anyhow? I mean, the comments/forums at ESPN Dallas, the DMN, NMLR, Crops on the Farm — all offer far better baseball minds than LSB does.
Oh, and definitely stay away from BBTiA: it’s just an LSB supplement.
"What the fuck kind of name is 'Garoon,' anyhow? Sounds fake."
by Snark on Feb 6, 2011 1:06 PM CST up reply actions 6 recs
rabble
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
Only to spare himself the pain of spelling out "percent."
"What the fuck kind of name is 'Garoon,' anyhow? Sounds fake."
I can respect the fact that
he wants to use th least amount of effort possible
"Torture you? That's a good idea. I like that." - Mr. Blonde
5% baseball and 95% high-school trash talk.
yep
5% limp dick know it all curmudgeon talk
95% little dick self pleasuring immature virgin talk
It's the offseason.
The baseball talk gets more serious once actual baseball stuff starts happening. But yes, we talk about all kinds of shit on here.
"The Angels are like the villain in the movie that isn't dead until he's been stabbed 150 times in the bath tub, yet he still might come back up one more time." - Eric Nadel
But how would he be able to drive it with his small arms?
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
I'm more interested in her front ground
at least, before the pregnancy.
What if something happens?!?
What could happen to an Old Fashioned?
Rangers100?
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
I'm not as high on Kunis as some around here.
I can think of at least 15 ladies I’d take over her. Probably more like 50.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
If there were a button put in front of me.
And they said, “If you press this, you get Kunis but a member of LSB (not me) has to die,” I press it before they finish the sentence.
Define "getting" Kunis.
Is it just one night or is she madly in love with you for all time?
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
The concept of Mila Kunis being "madly in love with me" kind of freaks me out.
I don’t know the girl, after all. She could be a complete psycho. So let’s just say it’s more of a physical relationship, unless we actually like each other.
Speaking of - this girl texted me the other day...
….she said that in dating me, she’s not sure we are compatible in the end because she is a penguin, and she doesn’t think I’m a penguin.
What the fuck does this even mean?
by FuturePants on Feb 6, 2011 12:55 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
I'm guessing it doesn't mean she's a Linux user...
But that explanation would at least make sense, whereas I have no idea what other “penguins” there are.
(SLIDE!)
So you're saying
he needs a red hat?
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
I've only dabbled a little with SUSE and Ubuntu.
"The Angels are like the villain in the movie that isn't dead until he's been stabbed 150 times in the bath tub, yet he still might come back up one more time." - Eric Nadel
Well, obviously...
you’re a frog.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
by GhettoBear04 on Feb 6, 2011 12:59 PM CST up reply actions
Are there any environments where they coexist?
I’m not sure they’d ever have occasion to meet outside of a Disney movie.
Well,
he is wearing a coat. Perhaps that’s what generated the confusion.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
She likes penguins of Madagascar
Tell her you are more like Rico. One of my favorite cartoons.
by CDorsey on Feb 6, 2011 3:37 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
That you've got a whackjob on your hands?
"The Angels are like the villain in the movie that isn't dead until he's been stabbed 150 times in the bath tub, yet he still might come back up one more time." - Eric Nadel
I dunno...
Pretty much every GF I ever had, I felt like they liked me a lot more than I liked them.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
As long as it doesn't go creepy stalkery that's not a bad thing.
Or something like “I’m dumping you cause you don’t like me as much as I like you and feel like you’re using me.”
Lively over both.
Ambition is a poor excuse for not having sense enough to be lazy.
by LSJ on Feb 6, 2011 3:45 PM CST up reply actions
Yes, please
"Napoli batting regularly in Arlington will be the biggest explosion in the American Southwest since Robert Oppenheimer tested the Manahttan Project."
-- RevHaloFan
she is experienced....
and I like it
by death of the cool on Feb 6, 2011 12:47 PM CST up reply actions
Does experience with
McCauley Caulkin count?
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
................
………………….
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
Where, when, and how?
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
I have friends in the culinary scene in Manhattan...
I was doing the seven course tasting menu at the Lincoln Restaurant at Lincoln Center on a Sunday night… stayed late, was given a tour around the place, etc.
Ended up being my table (two of us) and her table (her and two friends).
Didn’t get to “mingle” with her, but it was just the five of us basically hanging out in this little area.
Pretty cool scene.
So can you actually get a table
on a Saturday night in NYC?
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
First available Saturday reservation as of today is
Feb. 19 per OpenTable.
As I said, I didn’t go through “proper” channels.
Heh,
more of a joke. I’ve heard some horror stories about fine dining in NYC on Saturday night.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
Unfortunately
it’s not always indicative of quality – most restaurants worth a damn are booked up if you wait until a day or two before.
Right,
and even then, it’s apparently no guarantee of getting your table within 20 minutes of the scheduled time.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
Most places that I go to that I have ressies for
tend to treat me very well. Only times I’ve had trouble is that month’s “trendy” spot. Then you’re SOL when it comes to certainty. Trendy spots I avoid until the month after.
Ah, I see.
So you live in NYC?
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
No, Dallas now. Houston in March.
Studied in Philly and lived in NYC for a bit – visit every 6 weeks or so for a few days.
Ah, ok.
I’m contemplating a trip up there, but can’t decide. I’m annoyed by many New Yorkers I meet…I’m not sure how I’d handle millions of them.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
Gotcha.
Yeah, I don’t ever intend on visiting Philly…
Still, between Broadway and the restaurants and cool things like Batali’s Eataly, it’s becoming harder to avoid.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
How many times have you been?
And go to Philly once, just get a local to give you advice. Philly is a wonderful city if you changed the people.
NYC?
Twice. Only once in the last 15 years though.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
Will do.
’preciate it.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
Perfection.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
I add points for anyone above 5'5" or so.
Especially for Hollywood people cause most of them tend to be short, it seems.
Never dated anyone above 5’10ish, so I don’t know if I have an upper bound, though.
Yeah, 5'10" was my max as well.
I’m not even 6 ft though, so it’s a bit different.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
I like girls who are 5'7"
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
Or above.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
I'm 6'2" so I like taller women
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
How was I supposed to google her if I didn't know her name?
But thanks, at least I have an answer now.
Que sera, sera.
Primarily known for Gossip Girl.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Just look at that forehead...
/LSJ
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Russian Thunder
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
What they are getting at
is that Colorado would never accept that in a million years.
Although if they would I’m sure we’d all be very happy.
The Rockies would never do that trade.
Why would they?
They want $20 million just to take Young, why would they give us a good young player? Just because we want them to?
That’s why Cahill said that he wanted the virgin a la unicorn, it is equally as likely for him to get it as the Rangers getting Fowler. You would do well to put it out of your mind.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
OT: I'm going to try and walk-on to OU's baseball team as a submarine knuckleball pitcher
Bets?
I own Mickey Tettleton's couch.
Can you throw a submarine knuckleball?
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Well then your chances are better than I would have originally thought.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
If you make it I will
Come watch every game you pitch in and hole up a sign that says. “The Pither”
Hi, my name is Josey Wales and I'm a douche. Prove me wrong.
Now Pithing ...
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
x
Pithing is a slaughtering technique in which the brain of the animal is scrambled with a tool inserted through the hole in the skull created by captive bolt stunning. Pithing further immobilizes the animal after stunning and before exsanguination.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
by GhettoBear04 on Feb 6, 2011 12:42 PM CST up reply actions
I did it to frogs,
but perhaps that’s what they do to cows as well.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
by GhettoBear04 on Feb 6, 2011 12:44 PM CST up reply actions
For something as deliciuos as veal..
…I can handle looking the other way. You know how stupid a cow is, after all?
I already have a red pith hat.
Just have to have OU put on the front and The Pither on the back.
Hi, my name is Josey Wales and I'm a douche. Prove me wrong.
Well, it's not (always) used on animals for eating...
…wait, does this mean an Orthodox Jew couldn’t sacrifice lab animals in certain ways?
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
by GhettoBear04 on Feb 6, 2011 12:45 PM CST up reply actions
"Mr. Conjunction, please pick up the LSB paging phone."
I’m not certain, but (as long as the Jew’s not planning on eating the animal after the lab procedure), I don’t think this would fall afoul of any laws about cruelty to animals, so long as it serves a greater purpose, or some such.
So animal testing for makeup? Probably not so good.
I'd be willing to make sure
she wasn’t unclean.
What if something happens?!?
What could happen to an Old Fashioned?
I see what you did there.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
How are female frogs supposed to get any love?
All the stories are about the male frogs getting kissed…
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
by GhettoBear04 on Feb 6, 2011 12:57 PM CST up reply actions
Fuck yeah.
I’ve never even heard of anybody doing that. Pretty original. If you can get outs with it and throw it where you want go for it.
"The Angels are like the villain in the movie that isn't dead until he's been stabbed 150 times in the bath tub, yet he still might come back up one more time." - Eric Nadel
how hard do you throw your knuckler?
A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings.
how hard is your fastball. you'd still have to mix that up as well
good luck though with the tryout
A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings.
I would just throw your knuckler overhand
Being a sidearming knuckleball pitcher just makes you look like that much more of a gimmick and makes it less likely the coach is going to pay attention to you.
Throwing a knuckleball is hard enough overhand. I’d just focus on that.
by Adam J. Morris on Feb 6, 2011 1:21 PM CST up reply actions
That may be the only way he can get it to dance well, is by throwing it sidearm.
But who knows.
"I don't really like pitchers." - Nelson Cruz
dream crusher
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
yeah, I saw that...lol
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
Unless they are actually using puppies as bowling balls
I am not interested
"Torture you? That's a good idea. I like that." - Mr. Blonde
Exchange kittens with puppies in that sentence, then you might be on to something.
"I don't really like pitchers." - Nelson Cruz
x
I remember being very pissed that the Rangers signed Catalanotto when he was a type A free agent and they had to forfeit their first round draft pick, which was like the 15th pick in the draft.
Forgot who Toronto used that pick on.
Ahrens
Doesn’t look like the Rangers missed out on much:
http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=ahrens001kev
"Napoli batting regularly in Arlington will be the biggest explosion in the American Southwest since Robert Oppenheimer tested the Manahttan Project."
-- RevHaloFan
Why is there a saddle on that longhorn?
Could they possibly try to make Texans look like fucking cowboys any more?
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Before I go back and read through the morning thread.
Is it worth it? Just looking at the first few comments, it appears our friend from the mountains threw down some knowledge in there.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Probably because I wasn't there.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
All Star crew this morning...
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
My bad.
I was at church.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
C'mon, this is LSB.
Smash Mouth.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
Have I ever told you my friend's theory about that song?
"What the fuck kind of name is 'Garoon,' anyhow? Sounds fake."
What? All that glitters isn't really gold?
Well isn’t that ironic…
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
Aqua must be the MY of the All Star crew, right scoop?
"I don't really like pitchers." - Nelson Cruz
I'm whoever gets to go from the Pirates because they have to send someone.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Incidentally,
I find an LSB All Stars fan post to be at least as entertaining an idea as a 25/40 man roster.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
Do it.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Busy, today.
I welcome somebody else to steal the idea, though.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
May not play well, but damn it, I'm here.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
I try to play within myself.
Do what I do.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
So you're the reason why Baylor basketball has been struggling.
Oh, oh, withIN. My bad.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
I resent the idea that you just called me AJ Walton.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Well, with Lomers gone...
I just had to pick the whitest sounding name. And let’s be honest, you’re no Perry Jones, III.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
That name is ridiculously white-sounding, though.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Yes, exactly.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
He is still angry about me making fun of Tech so much with Josey.
He says he’s not, but he remembers every time.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
how's bullpen catcher sound
A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings.
young vs cat by wOBA
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
Watching the Military Channel right now
The show is about FDR’s decisionmaking in 1940 and 1941. Bill Clinton has been on from time to time to talk about FDR and his time as President, and he just spoke at length about what it means to “abuse power” sufficiently to justify impeachment. His definition of “abuse of power” was “when a President violates the letter and the spirit of the law for some narrow ends, to increase his own position, or to unfairly benefit from his Presidency.”
Thought that was interesting.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Jimmy Carter just said that the violation of US law by a president is justified if the president believes it to be justified.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
They were talking about how FDR technically violated US law in rearming the country before WWII and supply the UK with both economic and military aid
And they went to Carter for that statement, that a technical violation of US law is justified basically where the ends justify it in the mind of the president.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
I don't know if that's what the Military Channel was really going for at all, but it was funny anyway.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
I agree, that will be the most interesting thing, Evan. Other than the return, obviously.
Evan_P_Grant Evan Grant
When/if Michael Young trade happens, the most interesting thing to come out of it will be spin. Did he want out? Did team push him?
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
I can't imagine
he doesn’t want out. Look, DH is a career death sentence for MY.
He’s a 795 OPS guy for his career, and most likely will decline from that. 3 years from now, when his contract is up, if he is a position player, say at 2B, he gets another contract. If he is a DH, he is a borderline NRI.
Unless you think MYs bat will magically defy gravity over the next 3 years.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
I want to see that bat, if it does.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Is it any coincidence
that Molitor’s late season surge happened during the steroid and HGH era? just sayin.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
I think it could very well be coincidence, yes.
1990-1993’s a little early for that era, anyhow.
I think it’s equally possible that Molitor was just one of those players.
I think you are naive on the era.
the steroid era started in the ’60s or ’70s according to players like Reggie Jackson and Tom House.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
I could well be naïve, but then Molitor's entire career happened during the era,
and the question would be why there weren’t many more players whose careers followed the trajectory that Molitor did.
Either way, I don’t see anything persuasive in your points.
I agree with Evan, assuming that the return has negligible value.
The only way making a trade right now makes any sense is if Young really wants out—and even then it doesn’t really make sense for the team. There is no evidence to suggest that MY’s contract is viewed as a financial problem by the new ownership group. And the arguments that have been made about various lineups being better without MY all hinge upon the Rangers doing something they’ve never been able to do—stay healthy.
So if a trade does go down, and we get the steaming pile of crap back that we all seem to expect, it really will be interesting to see how the team spins the move. Now, on the other hand, if they actually get a useful return that makes the team better now or in the immediate future, that’s a different matter.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
They don't necessarily have to get a good return
if they use the money to acquire a player either offseason or midseason.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
That's assuming they have to free up that money to make a move.
And at this point that’s all it is—an assumption.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
No,
just free up the roster spot to get rid of a guy who is most likely no better than Sammy Sosa or Frank Catalanotto for a DH.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
So do they need the money or the roster spot?
I think your Cat comparison was debunked above based upon Cat’s limited role as a platoon player. And Sosa was basically the same thing from the right side when he played for the Rangers.
I still haven’t seen anything to suggest that money is an issue for the post-Hicks ownership group.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
So are you going to be a pile of goo
and go off like JaySlick when they trade Young?
Hi, my name is Josey Wales and I'm a douche. Prove me wrong.
My reaction will depend on the return.
I think trading him for the sake of trading him, no matter what value comes back, is stupid. So if they pay Colorado to take Young and get something like Jose Lopez in return, I’ll be very upset.
And I’m not really sure what you mean by “pile of goo”.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
It wasn't debunked at all.
You may not believe it, but I don’t think many reputable projections project MY as much better than the 774 OPS Sosa put up as a Ranger or the 764 OPS Cat put up while here a 2nd time. MY’s league average of 795 including his prime years don’t argue that he will be significantly better
The only folks who think he will do much better are MY Fanbois like yourself who were applauding this monstrosity of a contract from the start.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
Being a full time average player is better than being a part time average player.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
Sosa
was a full time player until the end of the season.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
He was great against lefties and sucked ass against righties.
He was an improperly used platoon bat.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
Yet he averaged out
to be right around where MY is expected to be,
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
Not really
he wasn’t played as a platoon player. If he had faced a majority of lefties you might have a point.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
Until I can calculate it
I don’t give a shit about it. I find a lot of stuff on Fangraphs to be nonsense once I take the time to look at the formulas, like much of their WAR nonsense.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
Wow. OK.
If you want to ignore the way that OPS weights slugging and on-base percentage, not even try to figure out calculate wRC+, and completely write off WAR (except, it seems, when Szymborski posts about it and it backs your point?) — that’s your prerogative, obviously.
But that also tells me what I need to know about this exchange.
by Josh Garoon on Feb 6, 2011 2:35 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I already know
WAR sucks for pitchers, 1B, and Catchers. That’s enough for me.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
to be fair
this is because defensive metrics for pitchers adn catchers suck (be it UZR or whatever else) and defining it for 1Bs is not easy either
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
well in general it does suck for C/1B
defensive metrics that is
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
And using
FIP for WAR is also more than a little silly.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
waht does b-ref use?
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
Disagree.
Avoiding outs and slugging(bases accumulated) is apparent.
Defensive metrics are questionable.
Que sera, sera.
That doesn't make sense.
OPS doesn’t weigh avoiding outs and slugging properly.
And in terms of measuring true talent, the value of one year of OPS is far from “apparent” — as is true for UZR and DRS.
Maybe going forward.
But if a guy has a big year getting on base and slugging, than that was his value for that year.
I’m not talking about a GM looking for regression/progression, but just that year. This is my big problem with FIP and BABIP determining WAR.
Que sera, sera.
I think you're mixing a few things.
OPS is problematic in telling you the value of a guy, because, based on the empirical evidence, it doesn’t properly weigh slugging versus OBP, in terms of actual runs created. In other words, it gives you a value that doesn’t reflect the player’s value.
wOBA isn’t just about regression or projection.
I don't have a problem with wOBA.
This started with me saying I don’t put a lot of stock in UZR or Total Zone.
And I still put more stock in OPS than those two stats.
Que sera, sera.
I get that.
What I’m pointing out is that it seems inconsistent that you put a lot of stock in OPS.
OPS has a large empirical flaw, and in other respects, it mirrors the issues over which UZR and DRS are criticized.
Well, it's very easy for me
to determine how much of it was due to avoiding outs.
If you’re saying I have no access to how the two were added, there’s a problem with the stat.
Que sera, sera.
What do you mean,
“it’s very easy to determine how much of it was due to avoiding outs.”
What is “it,” and how are you determining how much of “it” was due to avoiding outs?
Half of it is OBP. Half SLG.
I can look at a guy’s OBP to see how much of his overall OPS was due to avoiding outs.
Que sera, sera.
I can't determine secondary averages by looking at the differential b/w on-base and slugging?
Que sera, sera.
I can do that.
I still don’t see how that relates to me not liking defensive metrics.
Que sera, sera.
Where to start?
Does it tell me arm strength, throwing to the right base, relay accuracy, reliable hands…? Those sort of things. It tells me someone’s range, not what they do with it.
Que sera, sera.
What stats are you looking at?
Moreover, how does OPS not have some of the same issues, translated to the offensive side of the game?
UZR, Total Zone.
OBP tells me how good a guy is at avoiding outs. SLG tells me how well he’s accumulating bases.
It might not be perfect, but it’s a lot clearer than defensive metric. To me, at least. Look at the top OPS guys throughout history, and you’ll find they’re the top guys offensively. There’s not guys in that top 50 that make me do a double take.
Que sera, sera.
You think Todd Helton
is the 11th best player offensively in MLB history?
As for UZR: how does it not have components for arm, range, and reliability?
And what does OPS tell you about bat speed, taking extra bases, avoiding double plays, and other elements of offensive play that parallel the categories of defensive play you raise?
UZR doesn’t just “tell [you] somebody’s range, not what they do with it.” That’s just a flat-out mischaracterization.
Also, I wonder how much you'd disagree
with a list of the top 50 fielders by UZR or DRS?
(Not that I have one handy.)
Eh, wasn't ignoring you. Went and watched that damn football game.
Anyways, no I don’t think Helton is 11th best. I’m not saying the order in OPS is how I’d rank offensive players. Just that it’s a pretty clear indicator of the top offensive players. And the Coors affect should be obvious to anyone that follows baseball. I know Vinny Castilla wasn’t Mike Schmidt.
I’m not sure what bat speed has to do with judgment of offensive ability. If you get it done, you got it done. GIDPs will hurt your OBP, but no, it doesn’t show that extra out created. Not perfect, but seems pretty minimal unless it’s an outlier. We can look at Rice as an example.
I’m not trying to mischaracterize UZR. What else does it tell me?
Que sera, sera.
And it's somewhat circular.
The argument seems to be that OPS is a valid measure of plate performance because it allows you to separate the value of avoiding outs from a “slugging” value that’s independent of the outs-avoided value. Which is, of course, not the case.
go for wRC (wOBA) or wRC+
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
by knockoutking on Feb 6, 2011 10:22 PM CST up reply actions
It is
at the very least, very transparent. The equations to calculate it, and all constants and data, are clearly available to all.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
So what's wrong with wOBA?
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
The fact that the weights vary
yearly isn’t a feature, imo.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
I don't use it much
too many problems with the adjustments. Most people who do use it use it improperly, IMO.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
So is wOBA
and it’s more accurate.
Just linear weights applied to the events that can occur when you’re batting.
wRC+ is just the same concepts of OPS+ being applied to wOBA.
…I think.
yeah it is
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
by knockoutking on Feb 6, 2011 10:23 PM CST up reply actions
The same is true of wOBA and wRC+.
Granted, one of the issues with UZR and DRS is that they use proprietary data, but OPS doesn’t even weight its components properly, and that’s not a feature.
Of course changing weighting every year
makes comparing data across multiple years logically suspect. If a number increases, you don’t know if the player got better, or the league got worse.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
That's true of any stat.
Which is the beauty of stats which tell you how the player did relative to the league.
Your certainly free to believe
in a system that says a HR, relative to a single, is worth 7.3% more if hit in 2000 than in 2010, but I’ll stick to OPS and its faults.
Maybe next year Singles will rise so high in value relative to doubles, triples, and HRs that banjo hitters like Borbon will be worth something!
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
You don't believe scarcity creates value?
Or that an overabundance (like the steroid era) lowers it?
Not in the case
of a single versus a double versus a triple versus a HR.
Barring a rule change that changes scoring, it is just stupidly adding noise to data.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
...
A home run is disproportionately more valuable in depressed run environments because it guarantees a run.
Context definitely matters.
This is also ridiculous.
I mean, it’d be one thing if you were actually trying to engage with what’s being debated…
Conceptually it sounds good
but it depends on the details of the park and defense adjustments.
Without taking the hours it would take to go through the data and equations, I really don’t know how good the B-R stuff is.
All these numbers sound good on papers, but a lot of time when you actually go into their detailed methodology, you find they are just selling snake oil.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
So,
because new stats might have (smaller) errors, we should avoid using them and keep using older stats that we know have errors?
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
Doesn't they know
that guys in their mothers’ basements are scared of snakes?
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
Yes
Due to being a great platoon player. He was shit against righties and great against lefties. Overall, that averaged out to what you expect MY to be at, but that doesn’t mean he wasn’t still a platoon player.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
It helped him a great deal that he only played against lefties late in the season.
Had he continued to play everyday, I think it’s safe to say his OPS would have been well south of where it ended up. His August OPS in 51 ABs was .855 and it was .934 in September playing against primarily lefties.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
Not really
69% of his PAs were against righties, which is approximately league average. I think last years league average was 72%. Certainly not enough difference to change conclusions.
He didn’t play a particular platoon split. He would have been much more effective if he had been though.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
As I wrote on the other thread,
setting AB aside, if Young played third and matched his ZiPS projection for 2011 with the bat, and had a slight drop-off defensively in 2011 relative to 2010, then he’ll almost certainly be around a 2.5 WAR player.
As a full-time DH/1B/utility infielder, he probably drops to a 1.5-2 WAR player.
And Sammy Sosa posted a 96 wRC+ in 2007, which is 8-10 points less than what Young would likely put up in 2011, if he meets his third-base ZiPS projections as a DH/1B/utility infielder.
IIRC the ZIPS projection was posted in december?
before beltre signed. how would that effect his projection i wonder? (beltre being signed)
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
November, and I'm just working with Young as full-time at 3B
for the sake of the comparisons that are being drawn out here and elsewhere…
I'm a MY fan, sure.
But I’ve also been pretty objective about his shortcomings. He had an awful 2008. Many, yourself included, said he was done then. In 2009 he had the second best year of his career. I think I’m far more willing to see his downside than you are to see his upside. I think that in the role he’s projected to fill you won’t see the late-season drop off we saw in 2010. And when the inevitable injuries to Hambone, Kins, Nellie, etc. occur, he’ll be a damned good player to have around, that is unless you think the Blanco’s of the world can produce at the plate well enough in his absence—something I seriously doubt.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
Blanco's defense plus offense
as a replacement probably is fairly close to MYs at 2B, SS, and 3B, because MY’s glove is pretty bad when he is a fulltime player, I imagine it is worse when he is just replacing for a game or 2.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
What's your basis for that.
According to Fangraphs, Blanco was horrid at second and ok at third, all while putting up a .679 OPS. I think MY would be just a tad bit better than that.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
And much, much, much more expensive.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Which is only a problem if the cost keeps you from otherwise improving the team.
There has been zero evidence to suggest MY’s contract is a problem for the current ownership group.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
Do we really need evidence to prove that our FO would rather not pay $16 million per year to a player not likely to be worth it in his current role?
Or happy about having that role in the first place?
Doesn’t your entire outlook rely on the assumption that the FO is the driving force here?
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Sure we do.
I’ve been saying that I don’t understand the motivation for the team to make a move. If they’ve got financial concerns they’ve hidden them well.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
So you need proof
that money is good? OK.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
Every dollar spent or to be spent is a "financial concern" for every single org in baseball.
Even the mighty Yankees with their hundreds of millions care about money, even if it is not an immediate “concern.”
Financial flexibility is good, if not immediately necessary.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
I agree.
But there is nothing out there to suggest that MY’s contract is negatively affecting the Rangers’ financial flexibility. Or have I missed something? I understand it is fashionable to assume that it does, but I’d prefer to have a little hard evidence before committing to such a rigid line of thinking.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
Really?
You don’t think there’s any evidence to support the argument that a $16 million per year commitment to Young has ramifications for the Rangers’ payroll overall?
If we can't assume that the Rangers would rather not spend $16 million (really $13, but whatever) on Michael Young, what can we assume?
And what kind of evidence can we possibly provide to satisfy you? It sounds like you’ve created a Sisyphean task.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
I'm sure they'd rather not pay that much.
I’m sure they’d rather pay less to everyone on the team. But that’s really not the issue here. They are presumably trading him a) because he wants out, or b) because they can’t afford his contract (meaning they have to have that money to make moves now or on the future). If they are trading him for nothing and eating a large portion of his contract because (a) is the case, then that’s dumb. If they are doing it for (b), then the move becomes more understandable. However, again, there is nothing beyond speculation to suggest that (b) is the primary motivating factor.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
Or they are trading him because of c) he isn't worth the money they have to pay him.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
This makes my head hurt.
I’m going to have to start calling you Pathos if you keep this up.
Paying too much to declining, average players is a bad idea, regardless of your budget. It may be less bad for the Yankees than for the A’s, but it’s still bad.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
And you're assuming that Young wants to be our UIF.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
He's under contract to play where they tell him to play.
So his desires in the matter don’t have much relevance. And I don’t see him as the type of guy that would dog it.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
So if he comes to the Rangers and says "I want to be traded," and the Rangers can make that trade happen in a manner that both
a) Sheds the majority of his remaining contract, and b) clears up the supposed logjam at the DH/1B positions … you don’t think they should do it?
And I’m ignoring for now the argument that this actually makes the team better, not worse, even in the short term.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
We're all operating on assumptions here.
I don’t think you trade him unless it makes you better. If the payroll isn’t a concern, there’s no real reason to move him because of financial concerns.
And unless you are committed to rolling with Moreland as an everyday player with a Murph/Nap DH platoon, there really isn’t a logjam. And don’t kid yourself into believing that such an arrangement has significant question marks, especially when the inevitable injuries begin to occur.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
Your definition of "concern" is the problem.
Just because you have the money now, assuming we even do, doesn’t mean you should spend it. What if we have the chance to take on (just shooting out a name, don’t kill me for it) someone like Pujols at the deadline, but don’t have the money at that point?
Now the Michael Young contract we could have traded at minimal cost before the season suddenly looms large, doesn’t it?
Same goes for the LA signing period this year. Without paying MY, we could have more money to pay top J2 kids, or draft picks, or whoever else we might want to pay.
You’re operating under the assumption that we have to spend that money right now and that Young is the most efficient use. Neither thing is necessarily true.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Not really.
The money guys in the new ownership group made it clear they would go outside their budget to land a marquee player. Pujols is that type of player.
You’re operating under the assumption that MY’s contract will have a negative impact in the future. We don’t KNOW that to be the case. It’s all speculation. The difference between my speculation and yours, however, is that mine seems to be supported by the teams actions up to now. They’ve been the high bidder on a number of FA’s that have signed elsewhere. The went to the mat for Lee. And nothing has come out suggesting that financial concerns loom.
I get your points. And if Hicks was still in charge, shedding that contract would be a no-brainer. But if the team is not in a financial bind, then the quality of the return has to be the biggest issue in making a trade. Maybe I’m wrong about the money. But if I am, they’re doing a fantastic job of keeping it quiet.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
Assuming
that Michael Young will be one of the very, very few players to not decline in his age 34-36 seasons seems like a tremendously bad idea. Then you look at what level he’s declining from, which isn’t a consistent MVP or All Star level, and it becomes apparent he’s not likely to be a ~3 WAR player and be worth his contract.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
I wouldn't draw conclusions
on Blanco’s true defensive ability based on splitting time at several positions.
do you consider rogers or blackmon a "steaming pile"?
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
I was referring more to the Jose Lopez reports we've been seeing.
Just giving those other two guys a quick and dirty look, they don’t appear to be anything really special, but I don’t know enough about them to simply write them off.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
ahhh ok
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
do you consider rogers or blackmon a "steaming pile"?
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
Bad contracts are bad contracts,
regardless of team.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
The Ranger FO will throw him under
the bus to cover their own asses.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Don't become the '82 Milwaukee Brewers."
"You want false modesty? F that."
because if they make the move, they are just doing it to spite FOTF, right?
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
It's not to make the team better.
It’s also the kind of move that can get your ass fired if it doesn’t work.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Don't become the '82 Milwaukee Brewers."
"You want false modesty? F that."
wrong.
wrong, wrong, wrong.
it is very possible that a move could make the team better based on usage of FOTF, health, etc
and i can say this with 99% certainty, trading FOTF would not get JD fired.
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
Gotta win more than 90 games and a World Series to make the team
better than it was in 2010.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Don't become the '82 Milwaukee Brewers."
"You want false modesty? F that."
So if JD trades Face
And the Rangers go to the playoffs with 89 wins and lose the ALCS JD should be fired?
Hi, my name is Josey Wales and I'm a douche. Prove me wrong.
yes.
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
what a stupid question.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
This is stupid
the Rangers could have a better team and not make it to the World Series.
A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings.
THAT IS UNPOSSIBLE!
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
See: Luck
heh
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
If you're going to trade Michael Young
and then pay somebody $ 20 million to do so…you better be damned sure your team is better….immediately.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Don't become the '82 Milwaukee Brewers."
"You want false modesty? F that."
For a team that relies on the players policing themselves (remember Lee saying the team ran on auto-pilot),
losing key leaders like Young & Vlad is a serious gamble.
Moreso with Young because of everybody knows what the hell is going on (the history) between him and JD.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Don't become the '82 Milwaukee Brewers."
"You want false modesty? F that."
I wish Young wasn't being such a brat about it
It really sends a good message to everyone in the clubhouse that in the year you’re coming off a WS run, you think your playing time is more important than the good of the team.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
Theo really fucked up this past decade then
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
Fire Brian Cashman.
And that slouch Billy Beane. They’ve never even won a pennant with him there.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Not really.
Nobody had to come out of retirement and undo his mess.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Don't become the '82 Milwaukee Brewers."
"You want false modesty? F that."
STBF in progress
Hi, my name is Josey Wales and I'm a douche. Prove me wrong.
by boomer1 on Feb 6, 2011 3:13 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
That'll do, Pig.
That’ll do.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
by Aqua on Feb 6, 2011 1:56 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Gammons apparently thinks Young will be traded to Colorado
According to his twitter convo with Boomer.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Good
I still have doubts it will happen, but it is probably the best thing for all involved, since they have a 2B spot, and it is another hitters park.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
The more I think about
the more I think MY is really pushing for a trade to the Rockies.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
He'd be stupid
not to. DH is a shitty, shitty deal for him. He just doesn’t have the bat for it.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
In general
the Rangers have really fucked around with MY’s career quite a bit. Of course, he was well compensated for it, but he would be silly not to have at least some interest in his next contract.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
He's done that himself
by not being good defensively and not having the bat to make up for it.
By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.
"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw
True, but not all of the gerryYoungering was to his detriment.
The shift from second to short probably boosted his market value.
People are dumb
darrenrovell Folks @StubHub just told me they sold a standing outside stadium ticket (Party Plaza) for $559!
Moran
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
I just turned it to the Boston/Magic game.
Who just got carted off the court on a stretcher? What happened? They aren’t showing replays yet.
"I don't really like pitchers." - Nelson Cruz
Round 5 of the Prospect Rankings is up and ready for voting!
http://www.lonestarball.com/2011/2/4/1975913/2011-lsb-community-prospect-project-pre-season-2
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
Fixed.
Gracias
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
is there a reason this is being done all in 1 post?
do not like.
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
Well, it doesn't clutter up the entire fanpost sidebar.
Remember to retire Fin's number, Mark.
"I've had people walk out on me before, but not when I was being so charming."
Keeps it current and everyone can go back to the same post
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
shitty for comments or looking back though
not a fan of the 1 post thing myself. i missed 2-4 due to that…
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
Sorry.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
no worries
just shitty system- but then again i was not the one who took the jump to start doing it
Scout: He was a first-round pick right? Got a huge bonus?
KG: Oh yeah.
Scout: Well, he spent a lot of it on milkshakes.
Tim Brown has an article out now saying that it is Michael Young who wants out, and the Rangers are obliging him.
by FormerLSBUser on Feb 6, 2011 2:38 PM CST reply actions
he lost a bit a cred for me though
especially after he said Lee was coming back if Rangers go to 6.
"what I have learned in 11 years in the sports business is that the dumbest guys in the room are always the media guys." - mark cuban
here's the link
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=ti-youngrangers020711
"what I have learned in 11 years in the sports business is that the dumbest guys in the room are always the media guys." - mark cuban
At that point, he might well have been.
Things obviously changed after he wrote that.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
I'm fine trading him to the Angels.
Face for Kazmir.
so, anyone watch jimmy and jerry on fox?
"what I have learned in 11 years in the sports business is that the dumbest guys in the room are always the media guys." - mark cuban
Making me so upset to think about what might have been.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
For some reason...
…I can’t do Super Bowl pregame.
"Don’t want to spend my night waiting in line unless it’s for more beer."
--EssBee, on LoneStarBall, Jan. 21, 2010
Jerry was sitting there wanting to punch innocent kittens I bet.
Especially after they brought up Jimmy in the Ring of Honor.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
God, I love Harrison Ford.
He is sofa king awesome.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
What are you watching?
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
Fox Pregame Show.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
He has multiple times saved people who were lost in the woods.
And he patrols some river in New York with this helicopter to chase down anyone who throws garbage in it.
I know!
And his Conan clip is the icing on the cake.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
I'm going to have to look that up.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
I like the matt damon ad ben affleck songs
"Torture you? That's a good idea. I like that." - Mr. Blonde
This will be fun....
Young wants out of Texas, and now
Yahoo.com’s Tim Brown..
Did I miss this somewhere?
JD’s like, "you want some fucking pitching? Here’s all the pitching you can stand. Now choke on it, bitches!"- RCCook
LSB: "Oh shit, JD. You crazy!"
8 posts ^^^
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
going blind...
JD’s like, "you want some fucking pitching? Here’s all the pitching you can stand. Now choke on it, bitches!"- RCCook
LSB: "Oh shit, JD. You crazy!"
forgot to include the money quote
The Texas Rangers have told infielder Michael Young(notes) they will attempt to trade him in the coming days, according to a source familiar with those conversations, in part because Young has grown disillusioned with his diminished role on the team.
JD’s like, "you want some fucking pitching? Here’s all the pitching you can stand. Now choke on it, bitches!"- RCCook
LSB: "Oh shit, JD. You crazy!"
I don't think they'll trade him for something hat doesn't give them the value they need.
“attempt” is a big word there.
Godspeed Mike Olt. Oops. Sorry, to see you're trade bait now.
God, i Love Moose Johnston
the classiest of person i’ve ever seen on TV.
"what I have learned in 11 years in the sports business is that the dumbest guys in the room are always the media guys." - mark cuban
I'll agree with this.
Irving gets on my nerves like no other.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
Bad enough to misspell his name.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Yes.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
Twice in consecutive days
"The world would truly be a better place if you didn’t exsist. You should just lean over the plate and take one for the team, run into oncoming traffic or something." -S l c Ranger HE MAD! The internet is serious business.
by TooLegitToQuit on Feb 6, 2011 3:35 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
Well aren't you mister perfect.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
No arguments there.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
Why can't someone Texan be doing this stupid one song concerts.
NFL sucks at planning, MLB is much better.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
when is kickoff?
meaning..when does someone’s toe meet the ball to kick to the other team?
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
5:29 I think.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
530, I think.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
Oh man...which is it?
Crucial.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
My wife is watching "Mama Mia" for the SECOND time today....
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
Abba sucked the first time.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
They were talented, but dadgum they are annoying.
Maybe it was the times, but I can’t stand to listen to it, except for those rare occasions when it comes on the radio. I’m still on my Stones kick and I don’t see leaving it for a long while. Goats Head Soup has been on most of the day.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
i'm pretty surprised all this info about MY is coming out
JD likes to keep everything pretty close to the vest.
Only thing i can think of is that this stuff is coming from MY himself, agent?
"what I have learned in 11 years in the sports business is that the dumbest guys in the room are always the media guys." - mark cuban
The original trade concept probably came from the FO, then people reacted negatively, so now we're hearing spin control on why they're trying to trade him.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
I don't think it's spin control
I think Young saw that Napoli would take away from his at bats and demanded a trade again. Pretty straight forward.
Well yeah. That doesn't count though.
Bergkamp turn pretty much trumps all.
I'm not arguing that.
I think the FO originally didn’t want that information known because it limits what little bargaining power they have at this point. A player basically forcing his way out makes it more imperative that he be traded, which puts the Rangers in a more difficult position.
So originally, they didn’t say that Young had demanded a trade. Now they’re letting it out, though, because people reacted negatively toward the FO for thinking about trading Young.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Or JD wants the public to know that MY is unhappy
by Adam J. Morris on Feb 6, 2011 3:23 PM CST up reply actions
Or, as in any complex deal
like trying to move MY, there are other parties besides JD and MY’s people.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
Sure
I just think this whole, “JD doesn’t let anyone know what he’s doing, so any information must be wrong or coming from the player” idea is silly.
by Adam J. Morris on Feb 6, 2011 3:28 PM CST up reply actions
Yep
I agree with that, but I also think its silly in a deal this big that there isn’t going to be a leak somewhere. The more folks that know, and one would assume JD has run the deal past more than the Rockies, the more likely a leak.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
That would potentially help if they know the return will be crappy.
It would still seem like an uncharacteristic move for JD.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
That's another aspect of this thing that makes no sense.
I’m not sure to whose advantage it is to have all this press. And most of it is still based on “we heard” type of information. If it’s the team, that is an uncharacteristic play by JD. And it wouldn’t make sense for it to come from MY unless the team told him “we’re not trading you and you’ll play wherever and whenever we tell you” and he’s trying to put public pressure on the team to move him-which could easily blow up on MY’s face.
None of this makes any sense.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
Actually, it all makes sense
A) MY is probably better off for his next contract if he is an everyday position player than a DH/utility guy.
B) The Rangers are probably better off over the length of MY’s contract if they can move it.
C) The Rangers are probably talking to teams, finding the best deal available that is workable.
D) One of the counterparties probably has a leak.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
Interesting that we're actually talking with LA, if you believe that article.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
I don't know
why we wouldn’t. Whatever deal we can make that costs us the least amount of money and gets us the most talent back is in our interest.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
You would have to assume that any deal with LA would have better pieces coming back.
I don’t see JD making a salary dump move to a division rival that makes them better while not improving the Rangers in some tangible and significant way.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
Personally
MY on the Angels doesn’t really scare me, especially since his hitting will plunge in Anaheim. If they eat a bigger chunk of the money, thats even less midseason moves they can make.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
Wow, he was epically bad in LA last season.
A rocking .321 OPS over 40 ABs. Ouch.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
He's never hit for crap
in LA, and honestly, he’s never hit much away from Texas.
For his career in 390 PAs in Angel Stadium MY is .246/.272/.351 OPS .624
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
If the Rangers think MY is going to go Frankie Cat....
…instead of Steve Nash if they let him go, you’d think they’d take a lesser deal from Anaheim to send him there.
by Adam J. Morris on Feb 6, 2011 3:32 PM CST up reply actions
True, but that's something the average fan definitely does not understand.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
The average fan can kiss my ass.
I want to win the division and if trading MY makes the Rangers better and Anaheim worse, so be it.
"I don't really like pitchers." - Nelson Cruz
Obviously, we agree.
That’s just the ultimate “I’m Keith Hernandez” moment for JD.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
That would be ideal, to be sure.
So what comes back from Anaheim that makes us better and the Angels worse?
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
I'm asking a serious question.
What could we expect from the Angels that makes us better and them worse?
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
Hola
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
I don't think the Rangers are going to get anything from anyone that will make the Rangers better in this deal.
But, suppose it’s possible, just for discussion.
Maybe the Angels would like to swap bad contracts, seems like Kazmir would be in the discussion.
Godspeed Mike Olt. Oops. Sorry, to see you're trade bait now.
I'll be honest, I'm not very familiar with the Angel's farm or depth
but I would assume MY would be worth maybe one more win than the 3B they have now. So assuming losing MY doesn’t cost the Rangers a win (i don’t think it will), then you will have to get either something back worth that win, or have the Angels take on enough money that the Rangers can turn into an addition later in the season.
That would be just short term better and worse scenario. In the long term, not having MY’s contract could also help with additional signings, contracts, etc.
"I don't really like pitchers." - Nelson Cruz
Yep...a lot better.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Don't become the '82 Milwaukee Brewers."
"You want false modesty? F that."
No, not a lot better.
It makes them go from an 85 win team to an 86 win team.
"I don't really like pitchers." - Nelson Cruz
No, but I do see good and bad qualities in a few stats.
I’m going quick and dirty on this one. But with WAR, you said your major problem with it was the defensive metric part and what else? I can’t recall what else you said you didn’t like about it.
And since I doubt MY is going to be underrated on his defense with WAR, I can’t see it being too far off. Plus, it’s not like MY>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Callaspo and Wood. More like MY>C&W.
Lastly, wins seems to be the easiest way I can quantify one team getting better and another team getting worse.
"I don't really like pitchers." - Nelson Cruz
I think WAR is a fun, little way of comparing players.
I think using it to determine how many wins a player is actually worth is flawed. I’m not sure it’s possible.
Que sera, sera.
Yep
if you want to do fun, quickie comparisons, its fine.
Its always amusing to me when some of the propellorheads get all upset when awards go to folks who weren’t high on this years arbitrary stat though.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
So Derek Jeter deserves those gold gloves?
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
I don't blame him either
but personally, I suspect its more than pride. If MY is a DH for 3 more years, there is a reasonable chance he never gets another major league contract.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
Since his value is completely tied to his bat ...
if he declines as you’re predicting, it would seem unlikely that he gets a ML contract either way, unless there is more demand for bad defending bad hitters than DHing bad hitters.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
His value is not completely tied to his bat, it is tied to his ability to play a reasonably valuable defensive position
Although he does not play it well, he is passable at third base – it is the difference between him and guys like Vlad and Thome.
You think he will be playing passable 3B defense
over the next 3 years?
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
I would be surprised
if it’s just one.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
Young is a true leader
Reporter-MY you are the heart and soul of this team a true leader.
MY-Aww thanks
Reporter-You just went to your first WS what are you going to do next year?
MY-Ask for a MF’ing trade!
Hi, my name is Josey Wales and I'm a douche. Prove me wrong.
Makes no sense.
Neither does the FO trading him away while eating 40% of his salary over the next three seasons and getting little if any talent in return.
You can only be young once but can be immature forever!
I don't blame Michael
but I don’t blame the Rangers either. MY needed to be out of the field, and the only ones who fail to realize this are the fans that say…. “BUT HE WON A GOLD GLOVE.” gtfo, come on now.
Question:
Switch the Bills with the Cardinals in the 90s. As in, Bills are now in the NFC East.
How do they do?
They still make it to the playoffs and win the division prob once (the first year)
but I think the only chance they’d have made it to the Super Bowl is in 90. They weren’t going to get past the Skins in 91 and the Cowboys/49ers in the next two years. Even with 1990, though, I’m still not sure they’d have made it past the 49ers or the Giants.
Looking back at the NFC standings in 91
Its crazy to see that two teams (Phili and San Fran) both missed the playoffs with 10—6 records and there wasn’t a case like Seattle this year where one of the teams was terrible while the AFC had an 8-8 and 9-7 team make it!
How many more games do the Bills lose playing the NFC East half the season?
I wouldn’t be surprised if two is conservative.
2 to the Redskins for sure
I don’t know if the Cowboys could’ve swept them yet. They might’ve taken one. And I think having to go into Veterans might have given Buffalo another one.
Jerrah is not happy
@newbury1310
David Newbury
Breaking news out of Cowboys Stadium. People are being turned away because two of the temporary sections did not pass inspection
Hi, my name is Josey Wales and I'm a douche. Prove me wrong.
huh?
temporary sections…what is that…and where is that
"what I have learned in 11 years in the sports business is that the dumbest guys in the room are always the media guys." - mark cuban
So no idea which items? I'm just wondering if it's planning or implementation.
Since a dry run cannot preclude a botched implementation the second time through.
Is that the bleachers in the party pass area?
"Torture you? That's a good idea. I like that." - Mr. Blonde
The people who are turned away can come up to Denton ...
and stand in my backyard for $3 during the big game. If they want.
If you make it 2 buck I'm on my way.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
They're showing them on NFLN right now.
It’s like sitting on a mirror. It’s so bright and aluminum.
They think they’ll be able to get them set up by game time.
Because of the weather...
…which has been occurring pretty much everywhere else in the country as well.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
I'll still bet a stadium that huge and nice will become a fairly regular part of the rotation.
They can’t be so stupid as to assume weather will always be like this.
I hope so.
And considering Jerry is involved…I would bet on it.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
It's in Indy next year.
And New Orleans after that.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
So he can brag to his office buddies in Dallas
that he was at the Super Bowl on the 50 yard line.
"I don't really like pitchers." - Nelson Cruz
Most of the people I was around at the World Series were like this.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
I think going to the World Series is more impressive.
I mean your team actually has to be good for this to happen.
x
BreakingNews Breaking News
Failure to complete temporary Super Bowl seating leaves some ticket holders out in the cold – PFT http://bit.ly/gghg0X
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@KT1310
Kevin Turner
The fact is that if Michael Young wasn’t being a whining emo, he’d still be a Ranger and play 150 games in 2011. Consummate Pro my ass.
Hi, my name is Josey Wales and I'm a douche. Prove me wrong.
by boomer1 on Feb 6, 2011 3:38 PM CST reply actions 2 recs
pretty stupid.
"Sometimes you just want to sit back and watch somebody throw 100." - Jeff Passan on Neftali Feliz
"Baseball's all that's real" - JB
ditto!
You can only be young once but can be immature forever!
I think he's saying if Mike would just accept his role...
…he’d still play 150 games over the course of the year at DH/1B/2B/3B. But because MY still views himself as a gold glove IF, he’s forcing his way out. If true, that’s not professional at all. You make $16MM a year. Shut up and do what you’re told.
I don't think there's any way Young plays 150 games this year for the Rangers.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
I was thinking more 100-120
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
With Wash making the calls, perhaps you're right.
God I hope not, though. That will mean less Napoli and less Murphy.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
I'd guess it's closer to 135-140, unless an injury forces him into the field.
That’s playing him roughly 6 of every 7 games.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
Wash loves him some veteranny goodness
He certainly played Vlad more than most sane folks would, during the season and during the playoffs.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
I agree that 150 is high
But I can easily see him playing in the 130 game range if healthy all year. Considering the health issues of other players on this team I see his playing time being only slightly less on the 2011 Rangers when compared to being traded.
You can only be young once but can be immature forever!
130 games is roughly one day off a week
You can only be young once but can be immature forever!
Yep.
Barring a DL stay, expect to see his name penciled in every single day. In 10 seasons as a fulltime player, he has played over 150 8 times.
"I wanted to go out there and punch Julio" - Ron Washington
Different year, different role, different circumstances.
I see Wash getting him in 80% of the games but can’t see him playing 90% in 2011.
You can only be young once but can be immature forever!
So, not just regional?
That’s a lot of coin.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
Why the heck are they talking politics before the Super Bowl?
Sports and politics are a bad recipe.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
What else is on TV?
I’m going through tons of old crap and throwing stuff away. It’s also raining here so I can’t go run.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
There are at least three channels doing pregame, yes?
I have yet to be disinterested enough in NFLN’s to switch to Fox.
3 channels?
"what I have learned in 11 years in the sports business is that the dumbest guys in the room are always the media guys." - mark cuban
They could add in religion and really have a mess.
You can only be young once but can be immature forever!
Wait, the superbowl is today?
I totally didn’t realize that.
Ambition is a poor excuse for not having sense enough to be lazy.
by LSJ on Feb 6, 2011 3:56 PM CST up reply actions
The worst part is it's FOX news interviewing a democratic president.
I’m not high on Obama but Fox News is absolutely ridiculous.
How did that work out?
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
O'Reilly wouldn't shut up
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
I wondered if he would be more deferential
than his tough, lone ranger persona would allow for on his show.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
I could barely watch
A third grader would have more professionalism and respect for our president, regardless of his or her political affiliation.
I'm sure you were a beacon of respect for his predecessor.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Voted for GW in '04 and Obama in '08
Questioned his capacity, still respect the role of our President.
And I would NEVER be short or cut-off
any sitting or former President in conversation if I was ever afforded that privilege.
But he's on TV, he's allowed to do what he wants.
The popularity of TV stars and the actions and things they are able to say and get away with is annoying to me.
I’m pretty sure they are pushed to it by the public who watch them, which is another issue I have. Ugh.
This is where I go scoop like and say life is too short to worry about things like this.
"I don't really like pitchers." - Nelson Cruz
What you're talking about isn't respect, it's devotion.
Our president is not a deity worthy only of pure reverence. That interview was as tame and harmless as any I’ve seen. If you have a problem with that particular interview, basically nothing would please you.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
I doubt anyone you know has ever had the chance.
So your statement is meaningless.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
You don't like disagreement, so you call me a dickhead?
Nice.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
Eh, maybe the "meaningless" part was unnecessarily rude.
I’ll give you that.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
No, because you
converted a debate over how people should interact with a President into personal attacks for seemingly no reason. That’s how you are a dickhead.
That’s obnoxious.
You called me a dickhead.
And you’re complaining about personal attacks?
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
I don't think he was going all personal attack on you...
But I can see how him assuming you don’t have any friends who have met the president can appear like a dick move.
But I’m sure he’s just assuming since the vast majority of people do not have the chance to interact with the President of the United States, your friend haven’t.
This is why I’m not a big fan of politics.
"I don't really like pitchers." - Nelson Cruz
It was just the transition from
conversation on what’s appropriate to inappropriate personal attacks, when he doesn’t know me from Adam.
“I’m sure you were a beacon of respect for his predecessor.”
“I doubt anyone you know has ever had the chance. So your statement is meaningless.”
Just stupid. And this was before I called you a dickhead, brother. They were dickhead comments.
You don’t know who I am or anything about me, nor did I ever attack you.
Any merit or level of respect that I could have had for anything you think instantly shoots out the window the minute you transition from rational argument to idiotic personal attacks, especially over the internet.
Oh definitely.
That was a dumb thing to do for all involved.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
heh
FO_ASchatz Aaron Schatz
Fascinating graphic shows which how the teams chosen by online Madden players gradually changed during the season: http://nyti.ms/dO6fgi
No one likes Seattle.
What a poor town to be a sports fan.
"I don't really like pitchers." - Nelson Cruz
Best thing they've ever had got taken away from them to get placed in Oklahoma
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
When the weather is nice...
Whoops.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
You need to expand your horizons. =)
I’m not saying it’s not a worthy choice, but it’s a big world and we’re talking about hypothetically being rich here. Dream big, Holmes.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
Nice is very nice.
Sorry, couldn’t resist. Seriously though, the people are very friendly, the food is fantastic and the scenery is gorgeous.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
I just need to learn French.
Roundtrips to nice right now from IAH only $750ish after tax. Might go..
Heh, yeah, that's the problem.
Though if you’re close enough to Monaco, there are enough who speak English. And, unlike the self-righteous, Francocentric Parisians who go overboard in their insistence that everybody speak French, the people in southern France generally try to work with you.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
But we're talking about a vacation home.
You’re trying to get away from them. =)
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
Well, tickets are cheap.
So there’s that. It’s a great town to be a sports fan in if you don’t have an emotional attachment to the teams!
Or if you do have an emotional attachment to the Mariners and it’s that you like when they lose.
They have cheaper tickets cause they suck.
Even though I’m not a fan, if I lived up there I’d be there every time Felix pitches.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
And the Rangers were in town.
You could go an entire series in Seattle for the price of one game in Arlington.
"I don't really like pitchers." - Nelson Cruz
Fair point as well and probably sit in great seats as well.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
When I went to the Rangers series, I spent about 30 bucks on Stub Hub.
Two games lower level in the outfield, one game over the bullpen (which was actually a great seat other than being on a bleacher).
I have a feeling my years of at least 5 games, while living 6 hours away are over this year.
From the way my friend who was going to get season tickets and has a friend within the org said it’s going to be slim pickings for individual game tickets.
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
It's a really cool stadium.
It’s annoying to hear how much their fans complain about not getting enough respect, though.
If Brad Pitt is playing Beane who do you want playing you?
JD: Eddie Guardado.
It is.
Unfortunately, the first Cowboys game I ever saw there was the first time it ever rained at a Seahawks game.
:(
Well every team has their down spells.
But 2008 Seattle had to be the worst.
2008- Mariners embarassingly bad.
Seahawks also embarassingly bad.
Washington football goes winless
Sonics move to Oklahoma.
This must be the greatest day in LSB's life
Trading the hated, despised, Micheal Young is ten times, nay 1,000 times, more important than winning a WS to this board…no honest doubt about that at all.
13
It goes deeper. People take out their frustrations with Josey on their real-life acquaintances, which propagates forward, and before you know it you’ve got more marriages in an easily-smashable state. by Closure GT on Dec 14, 2010 9:48 AM
by RangersSD on Feb 6, 2011 9:59 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Just wait until JD signs his extension.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
"Don't become the '82 Milwaukee Brewers."
"You want false modesty? F that."
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