T.R. Sullivan Inbox column

by Adam J. Morris on Apr 8, 2011 12:00 PM CDT

Pitcher Alexi Ogando is a bad mama jama. (Photo by Kevork Djansezian/Getty Images)

T.R. Sullivan has a new Inbox column up, dealing with Alexi Ogando's future in the rotation, Eric Hurley's status, and how some minor leaguers are shaking out...

There's one answer he gave, though, to the question about Neftali Feliz pitching multiple innings like Rollie Fingers used to, that I found a bit frustrating:

Feliz pitched 69 1/3 innings last year while saving 40 games. From 1972-76, the Athletics used Fingers strictly as a reliever and he averaged 123 innings a season. He also averaged 21 saves. One big difference: the Rangers had seven complete games last year. The A's staff averaged 42 complete games in 1972-76. They could use Fingers for multiple innings because they didn't need him as much as the Rangers need Feliz.

If the A's didn't need Fingers as much as the Rangers need Feliz, then why did Fingers average 70 games per season from 1972-76 -- the exact same number of games Feliz appeared in for the Rangers last year?

And why did Fingers pitch MORE innings than Feliz, if the Rangers needed Feliz more?

The reality is that this is more about the role of closers in the modern game, the mindset of modern managers and pitching coaches, and a desire to keep relievers from being overworked than it is because the Rangers needed Feliz more than the A's needed Fingers.

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Durrrr home runs are stupid

Last year, the Rangers seemed to make more of a transition to playing “small ball” instead of slugging their way into the playoffs. With our current powerful lineup, are you a little concerned that our team might abandon some of the “small/smart ball” and return to the “slugging” mentality?
— Josh R., Weatherford, Texas

by Josh Lile on Apr 8, 2011 12:03 PM CDT reply actions

I sorta thought the drop in homers had more to do with Cruz, Kinsler, and Hamilton missing a season's worth of games between them.

And a fairly appalling 1B situation, power-wise.

Who knew it was really small ball?

by Big D Bam Bam on Apr 8, 2011 1:23 PM CDT up reply actions

Maybe "small ball" was the whole reason Davis couldn't make contact.

by casew on Apr 8, 2011 2:40 PM CDT up reply actions

Seems like a logical way to stretch him out, build his arm strength, and give him more work

as he transitions to the rotation next year. But, you’re right AJM, Wash wouldn’t use Neftali like that, and I’m not sure any other manager would either, unless you just make him your long man.

"...out of the shadows of unprecedented success, the sun shines down upon this team waiting to thrill anew." - ghostofErikThompson

by jam0152 on Apr 8, 2011 12:03 PM CDT reply actions

I do wish we would get Feliz 120 innings this season

clearly it’s possible, the current view towards how to use closers will pretty much prevent that from happening.

by elvis1isking on Apr 8, 2011 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions

at this pace he'll be used in 120 of 160 games

and the Rangers win 173

A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings.

by NothinG on Apr 8, 2011 1:55 PM CDT up reply actions

Eat it TR!!!! In the face!!

by ryjadubya on Apr 8, 2011 12:15 PM CDT reply actions

It seems that many who want Feliz as closer

overlook that closers/relief pitchers seem to have shorter careers because of injury. I’m not saying it’s bound to happen this year, but it’s another aspect of the Feliz in the bullpen thing that I’m not entirely comfortable with.

I’ve seen it thrown out around here that maybe you pitch him in more multi-inning outings to get him ready, but it seems to me that only makes sense if you reduce the total number of appearances. If you were to do that though…hmm. I’m just not sure.

"I’d love to walk in and hug everybody every day, but that’s not critical to us winning." - Jon Daniels

by GhettoBear04 on Apr 8, 2011 12:17 PM CDT reply actions

appearances

I really think (though I have no studies to back it up) that a pitcher on a regular schedule but more innings may be less at risk than a pitcher with fewer innings but more appearances. The starter’s schedule every 5 days means regular use and rest, vs. the reliever that might be up 3 or more days in a row after one day of rest. And those are short, high-effort appearances in high leverage situations.

Are there any studies comparing pitcher health of starters vs. relievers along those lines? I think it would be hard to quantify since you might run into sample bias.

Nelson Cruz - 2011 MVP

by t ball on Apr 8, 2011 1:00 PM CDT up reply actions

starters don't go 100% most of the time like relievers as well

and with the regular rest their muscles have ample time to recover. Pitch counts are usually a big concern as well, and those are usually only a problem for starters. Ultimately, pitching is strenuous on the joints and muscles, and staying healthy seems mostly dependent on how good your mechanics are.

that is what worries me about Ogando, and makes me have confidence in Feliz as a starter.

A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings.

by NothinG on Apr 8, 2011 1:59 PM CDT up reply actions

I remember the Red Sox a while back

wanted to move Papelbon to the rotation because they felt it was the safer bet for him to pitch on a regular schedule than sporadically and possibly on back-back days. It was after he had whatever arm problems he was dealing with a few years ago.

By 2028, Mark Teixeira will be in the HOF.

"I am one of the biggest Texas Ranger fans out there but I'm also one of the smartest. Deal with it."
-The Outlaw

by Gdawg on Apr 8, 2011 5:08 PM CDT up reply actions

didn't know that, thanks

my confirmation bias likes that. :)

Nelson Cruz - 2011 MVP

by t ball on Apr 8, 2011 8:30 PM CDT up reply actions

I don't know about injury

However, I do agree relievers who spend their careers as relievers tend to have shorter careers, although I’d argue that is because their stuff isn’t good enough to have longer careers.

by Adam J. Morris on Apr 8, 2011 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions

I think that what the author was saying by Rollie getting more innings

than Feliz is that since his team had more complete games they didn’t need him in as many games and thus would pitch more innings in the games he did get into, while with Feliz you need him almost every other game and thus don’t have the chance to pitch him much more than an inning, not saying I agree with any of that just that I think that’s what he was implying.

by groundingout on Apr 8, 2011 12:23 PM CDT reply actions

That isn't an author. It's TR.

by Josh Lile on Apr 8, 2011 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs

Its a very complex situation

If you have a rotation that you could expect to give you 40+ complete games that changes the dynamics of your bullpen. Your closer can go from being a guy you only use 1 inning at a time so that he is available multiple days in a row to a guy you can use for multiple innings ata time since theres a very good chance he won’t be needed the following game.

by bigsteve on Apr 8, 2011 12:45 PM CDT up reply actions

The answer on Hank Blalock makes me sad

by BEW on Apr 8, 2011 12:24 PM CDT reply actions

What happened?

Did he turn down our 3 year 30 million offer?

"Calmer than you are dude"

I feel much better about the long-term major league futures of Boggs & Teagarden than Nelson Cruz.
"Dying ain't hard. It's living that's hard."
by Josey Wales

by Arlington Stadium Legend on Apr 8, 2011 12:35 PM CDT up reply actions

fixed

~~The answer on~~ Hank Blalock makes me sad

by blakethegr8 on Apr 8, 2011 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions

Gotta admit

I laughed

by BEW on Apr 8, 2011 1:14 PM CDT up reply actions

30 years old...

by Big D Bam Bam on Apr 8, 2011 1:26 PM CDT up reply actions

Yeah I thought the same thing

"Look if you want a journalist hire a UT grad. If you want a doctor you pick a Baylor grad. If you need a vet you see an Aggie grad. And if you need a pizza you call a Tech grad." -BUBacker

by Mike E on Apr 8, 2011 1:01 PM CDT reply actions

How come sometimes on the side it shows stuff from years back?

I wasn’t paying attention and went to click on a Hurley overrated topic (to discuss how ridiculous that thought is!) but it was from 2008. Heh.

"Look if you want a journalist hire a UT grad. If you want a doctor you pick a Baylor grad. If you need a vet you see an Aggie grad. And if you need a pizza you call a Tech grad." -BUBacker

by Mike E on Apr 8, 2011 1:05 PM CDT reply actions

"Related" as opposed to "Recent"

by booyakasha on Apr 8, 2011 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions

I did something similar

I clicked on a Ron Spellman fanpost which led to the 4/29 minor league thread with him and Finnerty. Golden.

by Josh Lile on Apr 8, 2011 1:27 PM CDT up reply actions

Ding, Ding, Ding!

I absolutely agree with you Adam on the appearances issue, and the role of the modern reliever. If the Rangers were to stretch Feliz out into Fingers-land this season, he might be more ready to make the transition to starter next year.

by Philar on Apr 8, 2011 1:18 PM CDT reply actions

What the fuck does that last answer even mean?

What a weirdass.

My Music Blog

by FuturePants on Apr 8, 2011 1:22 PM CDT reply actions

I think it was actually the last part of the second-to-last answer.

Proofreading fail.

by Big D Bam Bam on Apr 8, 2011 1:25 PM CDT up reply actions

I think it belongs to the previous question

and the real last answer is not there at all.

Nelson Cruz - 2011 MVP

by t ball on Apr 8, 2011 1:27 PM CDT up reply actions

I thought it meant that if he could hear Ranger braodcasts on WBAP instead of being on weak signalled ESPN, it would be better.

by Radar1 on Apr 8, 2011 2:13 PM CDT up reply actions

On the first question,

I fear Nolan will put Hunter back in the roto for Ogando if he comes back this month regardless of what Ogando does.

by booyakasha on Apr 8, 2011 1:38 PM CDT reply actions

Three things wrong with this post, in my opinion

1. Nolan doesn’t make those decisions, or at the very least, he is one voice among several making that call.
2. It might not be wise to pitch Ogando in the rotation all year no matter how well he does there if you want to keep him healthy.
3. Let’s wait until Ogando has more than 6 innings before we even think about this.

Nelson Cruz - 2011 MVP

by t ball on Apr 8, 2011 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions

Responses...

1. Agreed, but he was the one who made the statement about “temporary”. If he doesn’t make the decisions, he shouldn’t talk like that.
2. I agree with this
3. I agree with this, just responding to TR’s response

by booyakasha on Apr 8, 2011 1:47 PM CDT up reply actions