Rob Neyer on Aaron Gleeman, Michael Young, Brandon McCarthy, and 2000 hits
Rob Neyer has a post up on SBN-Baseball about the kerfluffle that erupted yesterday in regards to Aaron Gleeman's blog post on Michael Young's 2000th hit, and the ensuing Twitter responses by Brandon McCarthy and C.J. Nitkowski.
McCarthy and Nitkowski were both rather critical of Gleeman on Twitter, for what they felt (and what a lot of Rangers fans here seemed to feel) was an attempt to denigrate Young's accomplishment.
This incident has been rattling around in my head, in large part because of how folks here reacted to it, particularly given that there have been several comments/tweets from folks who post around here that suggested those in the local media were making too big of a deal out of the countdown, the 2000th hit, etc.
That said...I remember reading years ago, in one of Bill James' early editions of the Baseball Abstract, an absolutely scathing paragraph about the incompetence of Enos Cabell. James was talking about teams and managers overvaluing intangibles such as "leadership," and went through, in harsh detail, just how bad a player Cabell was at that time, and that no amount of "clubhouse leadership" could outweigh the on-the-field negatives.
A year or two later, James wrote that he and Cabell had some mutual friends, that Cabell was by all accounts a good guy, and seemed to indicate some regret that he'd been as harsh about Cabell as he was.
But his main point was that he wasn't writing about Enos Cabell -- if he were writing about Enos Cabell, he wouldn't have taken as aggressive a stance as he was. Rather, he was writing about how teams and managers get infatuated with the nebulous "intangible" contributions of players, which leads them to ignore how little those players contribute on the field. Cabell was an illustration for that point.
And I think that that sort of disconnect is what leads to a lot of the rancor and uproar that ensues when, for example, Gleeman writes a post suggesting Michael Young's 2000th hit isn't that big of a deal.
I don't know Gleeman, have never met him, have never talked to him, have never even exchanged emails (or IMs or texts) with him. However, I would guess that he did not write that blog post in order to denigrate Michael Young. I also don't think that he (as some here suggested) was being purposely inflammatory in order to drive hits to the Hardball Talk website.
I suspect that he saw the coverage of Young's 2000th hit, and used the event as a jumping-off point to talk about 2000 hits and it being a milestone that players hit more often than we probably think. Yes, the fact that Young has been, in his career, a very good but not really great player who many in the interwebs/stathead community consider to be somewhat overrated probably was a factor in addressing it with Young getting to 2000, rather than someone like Albert Pujols.
But I don't see the post as being about Michael Young, per se, but being more about the 2000 hit milestone in general, with Young's reaching the mark used as a platform to talk about it more generally. Yes, Gleeman's remarks can be read (and were read) as a criticism/denigration of Young, but I don't think it was particularly intended that way.
(And I didn't ask Gleeman about this before writing this post, so if he tells me I'm wrong, well, I'll sit in the corner wearing a funny hat.)
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Why does Lenny look like he took a few too many fastballs to the head?
What are we at the park for except to win? I'd trip my mother. I'd help her up, brush her off, tell her I'm sorry. But mother don't make it to third. ~Leo Durocher
Agreed all the way around.
"Don’t want to spend my night waiting in line unless it’s for more beer."
--EssBee, on LoneStarBall, Jan. 21, 2010
The Newberg Report: Where are they now?
article is a really good read
"...out of the shadows of unprecedented success, the sun shines down upon this team waiting to thrill anew." - ghostofErikThompson
Totally agree...
Hadn’t thought of so many of those players in awhile.
Nice to hear about Tatusko having a future, in particular.
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on Aug 9, 2011 3:11 PM CDT up reply actions
Well my issue wasn't so much the original article
but more the, “Look at all the Rangers fans who are mad at me” posts he made after that.
But even still, what is the point of raining on someone’s parade. People want to celebrate Michael Young’s 2000th hit. Part of that is about celebrating the accomplishment but part of that is just celebrating Michael Young because he’s been with the club for so long and, like it or not, is inextricably linked with DFW sports for the past 10 years. What is the point of writing an article to talk about how that celebration is irrational? Especially the way he did it – calling out the local beat writers. Because it really just looks like you are trying to be a dick.
Exactly
The Rangers have never had a player reach 2000 hits before. This team has lagged behind much of the league in things like this, so it’s a big deal to our fan base. It’s not so much whether 2000 hits is significant or not, but the importance of what that symbolizes: long-term success on the field, wise roster management to keep good players around, etc. It celebrates something that there’s been too little of in the 40-year existence of the team.
Going to the World Series last year was phenomenal to us. A fanbase like the Yankees’ would have taken a 4-to-1 loss as a subpar season, but we enjoyed it for all it was worth. Was that irrational, too?
MAKE IT HAPPEN GLEEMAN!
(And I didn’t ask Gleeman about this before writing this post, so if he tells me I’m wrong, well, I’ll sit in the corner wearing a funny hat.)
I just think he was plain wrong
There wasn’t that much attention given to it, other than that it happened, and celebration that Young has played his entire career with the Rangers.
And any time you are only the 100th player to do something, it’s at least worth a pause.
265 players
have 2,000 hits
If I had a gun to my head and had to pick one pitcher to pitch a game to save my life.... I'd pick 1999 Rick Helling.
Dear Rangers, Make me forget about 2010.......
by matthewbschultz83 on Aug 9, 2011 3:05 PM CDT up reply actions
100-ish by his age
The Texas Rangers have been synonymous with explosive firepower ever since they emptied 130 rounds into Bonnie Parker and Clyde Barrow in 1934. - Alyssa Milano
I just read Gleeman's post for the first time... I don't see a problem with it, really.
His “oh ha, look guys, I made Rangers’ fans mad!” tweets were just stupid.
Congrats brah. you’re an internet superstar now. Does this guy have a loyal following or something? Who is bragging about this to?
This day is slightly marred by the fact that John Rhadigan sucks a flaming bag of shit. - LiamP
Gleeman
was the most respected Twins blogger out there when there were no other Twins bloggers. He is still nobody.
"If the Saints can reach the Superbowl, the Rangers can reach the World Series." - PhilKid
The Animated Ballpark in Arlington
No one here obssesses about the Twins.
If I had a gun to my head and had to pick one pitcher to pitch a game to save my life.... I'd pick 1999 Rick Helling.
Dear Rangers, Make me forget about 2010.......
by matthewbschultz83 on Aug 9, 2011 3:17 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
That is pretty harsh criticism.
I don’t see a big difference between Gleeman and AJM. Why so much criticism? Have you followed his work at HBT?
I used to read his blog
after being linked to by Seth Speaks and Batgirl. It was pretty bad, and I think you’re wrong when you say he’s anywhere near the best Twins blogger.
"If the Saints can reach the Superbowl, the Rangers can reach the World Series." - PhilKid
The Animated Ballpark in Arlington
I didn't say best. I said most respected.
And I’m not wrong about that.
Whether or not he’s the best, who knows. I don’t really care. He works for HBT now and has probably changed a lot of his focus.
Yeah, that's the only thing I can work up a mild negative opinion about
It really does read like he relished the backlash.
The Texas Rangers have been synonymous with explosive firepower ever since they emptied 130 rounds into Bonnie Parker and Clyde Barrow in 1934. - Alyssa Milano
I'm more bothered by Rangers fans who think Michael Young is the greatest Ranger to ever put on a uniform.
You could make an argument he’s not in the top 10.
"Don’t want to spend my night waiting in line unless it’s for more beer."
--EssBee, on LoneStarBall, Jan. 21, 2010
I can't.
But please, go right ahead.
"...out of the shadows of unprecedented success, the sun shines down upon this team waiting to thrill anew." - ghostofErikThompson
Rodriguez, Palmiero, Bell, Harrah, Sundberg, Hough, Howard, Gonzalez, Rogers, Rodriguez.
"Don’t want to spend my night waiting in line unless it’s for more beer."
--EssBee, on LoneStarBall, Jan. 21, 2010
Howard?
he was a Ranger for about 4 months… now if you’re counting Senators days, that’s different, but that isn’t what you said.
Go Rice Owls!
Would be a Matt Harrison fan, but I only like superstars
Let me rephrase.
You could make an argument he’s not in the top 10 in franchise history.
"Don’t want to spend my night waiting in line unless it’s for more beer."
--EssBee, on LoneStarBall, Jan. 21, 2010
wait...wait...wait
Kenny Rogers has a higher Rangers WAR than Pudge?
If I had a gun to my head and had to pick one pitcher to pitch a game to save my life.... I'd pick 1999 Rick Helling.
Dear Rangers, Make me forget about 2010.......
by matthewbschultz83 on Aug 9, 2011 3:09 PM CDT up reply actions
wait they're not in order are they...
If I had a gun to my head and had to pick one pitcher to pitch a game to save my life.... I'd pick 1999 Rick Helling.
Dear Rangers, Make me forget about 2010.......
by matthewbschultz83 on Aug 9, 2011 3:11 PM CDT up reply actions
I need to take a 5 minute Time Out
If I had a gun to my head and had to pick one pitcher to pitch a game to save my life.... I'd pick 1999 Rick Helling.
Dear Rangers, Make me forget about 2010.......
by matthewbschultz83 on Aug 9, 2011 3:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes.
"I’d love to walk in and hug everybody every day, but that’s not critical to us winning." - Jon Daniels
Ok 5 minutes is up asshat
When I saw Rodriguez, I immediately thought Arod. Then I see “Rodriguez” bringing up the rear – I thought that was Pudge.
That 5 minutes helped.
If I had a gun to my head and had to pick one pitcher to pitch a game to save my life.... I'd pick 1999 Rick Helling.
Dear Rangers, Make me forget about 2010.......
by matthewbschultz83 on Aug 9, 2011 3:18 PM CDT up reply actions
heh....melt down much?
NO This is why i dont come here so much anymore. it has become a destination for certain types which i am not.
Love the rangers, not this -- Mark from OC on Arrested Development
Only if you include value as an icon or whatever.
Which I don’t think is necessarily required for a list like this.
SB Nation Dallas-Ft. Worth - Christopher Fittz is better than porn!
by philkid3 on Aug 9, 2011 5:40 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
While the intent of his article was likely not as bad as it seemed...
It seemed worse than it was because it only focused on Michael Young. The article he wrote was about one player. If it was intended to be about the 2000 hit mark in general and not about one player, I wish it had more convincingly conveyed that point. It didn’t, and that makes it somewhat of a failure on the writer’s part. Plus, you are never going to get a warm reception when you take a positive accomplishment and write a negative article about it. An article like that will always rub people the wrong way.
But honestly, while I didn’t like the article, I could have ignored it had he not egged us on with his tweets…
I hate this site so much
Most of the time its F you Michael this, F you Michael that on this place. And its undeserved a lot of the time. Then someone else uses his 2,000 hits to say its not that big of a deal and this place comes unglued. Make up your collective damn minds.
If I had a gun to my head and had to pick one pitcher to pitch a game to save my life.... I'd pick 1999 Rick Helling.
Dear Rangers, Make me forget about 2010.......
by matthewbschultz83 on Aug 9, 2011 3:07 PM CDT reply actions
It's kinda like a sibling dynamic.
It’s okay for me to make fun of and pick on my sibling, but if someone else does it, i wanna whoop their ass.
Does that make sense?
Probably not.
Honey Badger don't give a shit!
I was a little confused by the strong reaction to the article
but there’s also a distinction between hating MY’s defense and not giving credit to his offense I guess…
The article bit was snarky
and it was patronizing to the Rangers and their fans. I don’t really even care who Gleeman is or disagree with his overall point. But the title was obnoxious and he even cited the reason Young isn’t a good example for bringing it up (the small detail that they were all with the Rangers)
And if AJM or anyone else says “bloggers don’t write their own headlines” that is besides the point. It was snarky and condescending. And when someone is condescending then they deserve to get called out on it.
Go Rice Owls!
Would be a Matt Harrison fan, but I only like superstars
The title is what I had a problem with when I read it yesterday
It insinuated that Michael Young was going out of his way to brag and create fanfare around this event. His post-game quotes were the exact opposite.
The actual article is fine.
I mentioned that yesterday.
The whole article seemed pointless based on the title because Young had already said 2,000 hits is inconsequential. If he was writing to prove that 2,000 hits wasn’t that big of a deal, he probably could have mentioned a few other players who had reached the milestone.
"Calmer than you are dude"
by Arlington Stadium Legend on Aug 9, 2011 3:30 PM CDT up reply actions
I will agree that the article is mostly pointless
I don’t think he was really trying to call out Michael Young. I don’t know why he would. Why would he care?
I don't know why he would care.
But he obviously cared enough to write an article about it. I don’t think he realized that Young didn’t really see it as a big deal and he thought he would make headlines by telling the world Young and Rangers fans were being sooooooo silly.
"Calmer than you are dude"
by Arlington Stadium Legend on Aug 9, 2011 3:48 PM CDT up reply actions
"The article bit was snarky and it was patronizing to the Rangers and their fans."
That’s how I felt. It was a layered bit of insult: 1) Your team has such a crappy history that this is a big deal. 2) Michael is making this such a big deal. 3) Rangers fans know so little about baseball they think this is a big deal. All the evidence was that 2 and 3 are definitely not true. And 1 is just an insult.
by OJsApprentice on Aug 9, 2011 3:37 PM CDT up reply actions
Ogando back
Blanco to the DL again.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
"do you a jet ski rental place would work here" - Mike E, 5/10/2011, in response to me saying I would rather face the Thunder than the Grizzlies in the WCF.
Interesting.
I’m glad Tea is staying up if that allows Napoli to play every day.
"I'll text AJM a picture of my junk if he wants to use it" by ab03 on Jul 7, 2011 9:30 PM CDT
Just means we have a megahuge bullpen again.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
"do you a jet ski rental place would work here" - Mike E, 5/10/2011, in response to me saying I would rather face the Thunder than the Grizzlies in the WCF.
Though I'm sure O'Day is here until Gentry comes back.
Ever been in a boardroom, or a gang fight? Ever save a life? Ever won a court case against the odds? Ever held a dying buddy in your arms?.- jackanape on "perspective," 11/8/2010.
"do you a jet ski rental place would work here" - Mike E, 5/10/2011, in response to me saying I would rather face the Thunder than the Grizzlies in the WCF.
Right... which is like tomorrow.
"I'll text AJM a picture of my junk if he wants to use it" by ab03 on Jul 7, 2011 9:30 PM CDT
I think my favorite ex-Ranger may be B-Mac now
Well besides Pudge and Marlon.
Formerly Rangers121032
We want...#1 Josh #2 Barnet #10000000 Rhadigan
Piss on Gleeman.
The premise of the article was stupid: “Gee whiz … getting 2000 hits is no big deal. 200+ other guys have done it too ….” Which means how many thousands of baseball players and how many billions of other human beings have not? It’s not as sexy as 3000 hits or 700 home runs, but to say it isn’t a big deal is like saying it’s not a big deal to become a Supreme Court Justice because 112 other people have done it as well.
It was a petty and nonsensical article—a complete waste of cyber space.
"Ok, post your favorite moment of the Tom Hicks era
Mine is today when he sold the team." - t ball
I've completely ignored all of this...
should I even bother reading about any of it?
"The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."-Socrates
Lenny Dykstra
wasn’t Dykstra a pal of Limbaugh. I used to listen to Rush now and then and I seem to remember him talking about Dykstra as a big buddy.
I soloed in the Mile High Club!
I missed this entire saga yesterday...
so from the outside looking in, I find it pretty hilarious.
LSB did what LSB does, but it’s almost like Gleeman was waiting for cyber high-fives for an obvious post someone was going to write. Also, the real winner here is Brandon McCarthy.
by ghostofErikThompson on Aug 9, 2011 6:22 PM CDT reply actions
August 15th Signing Deadline
What drama remains? Are we close on anyone?
"I'm fighting boredom just like you are, bro." "Whoa, Whoa, Whoa, pal. Stop saying Douchebag!"

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