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LSB Community Prospect Project: Wrap-up

Tongue_out_tiny by thedirkatron on

After 126 votes Evan Reed and Carlos Pimentel were separated by a single vote. Because the race was so close I decided to declare a tie, meaning Evan Reed and Carlos Pimentel will share the right to be called the Lonestarball community #29 prospect.

And, since that brings us up to 30 total players on the list, we are now officially done with this thing.

Final List:

   1. RHP, Eric Hurley
   2. 1b/3b, Chris Davis
   3. SS, Elvis Andrus
   4. LHP, Kasey Kiker
   5. C, Taylor Teagarden
   6. RHP, Michael Main
   7. RHP, Blake Beavan
   8. 2b, German Duran
   9. OF, Engel Beltre
   10. C/DH, Max Ramirez
   11. LHP, Matt Harrison
   12. RHP, Omar Poveda
   13. (TIE) 3b, Johnny Whittleman
   13. (TIE) RHP, Neftali Feliz
   13. (TIE) RHP, Thomas Diamond
   16. OF, John Mayberry, Jr.
   17. RHP, Fabio Castillo
   18. LHP, Zach Phillips
   19. C, Cristian Santana
   20. RHP, Wilmer Font
   21. OF, Julio Borbon
   22. RHP, Neil Ramirez
   23. SS, Joaquin Arias
   24. OF, Brandon Boggs
   25. RHP, Tommy Hunter
   26. SS, Marcus Lemon
   27. RHP, Armando Galarraga
   28. LHP, Beau Jones
   29. (TIE) RHP, Evan Reed
   29. (TIE) RHP, Carlos Pimentel

Making this list inspired a lot of passionate discussion about our farm system. And that's a good thing.

I hope y'all had as much fun voting and discussing this thing as I did running it.

Let's do it again at mid-season:)

Links:

  • '07 Mid-Season List.
  • '06 Winter List.

    • 1 recs | Comment 70 comments

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    Comments

    Display:

    Some discussion starters
    Just throwing out some general discussion questions:

    Who do y'all think we as a group voted in too high?

    Too low?

    Is there a player who missed entirely that you are high on?

    Ben Franklin. Gandhi. Jackie Robinson. Winston Churchill. Martin Luther King. Jesus Christ. And now... Dwyade!!!

    by thedirkatron on Nov 10, 2007 12:41 PM CST   0 recs

    Mayberry
    I thought Mayberry was too high and Borbon was too low.  Despite his somewhat disappointing showing in the AZL, I still like LHP Grullon as a prospect.  
    "On-base percentage is great if you can score runs and do something with that on-base percentage," Baker said. "Clogging up the bases isn't that great to me."

    by jparks77 on Nov 10, 2007 12:45 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Funny
    Those two were my picks, too.

    Mayberry does nothing for me.

    Borbon gets hated on way too hard.

    Ben Franklin. Gandhi. Jackie Robinson. Winston Churchill. Martin Luther King. Jesus Christ. And now... Dwyade!!!

    by thedirkatron on Nov 10, 2007 3:06 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    My thoughts.
    Borbon too low (I hope), AJ too low, Font and Santana way too low.  JMJ too high.

    I'm beginning to rethink Harrison.  He appears to be able to keep the ball down, a great skill.  Maybe someone can teach him to K a few more guys.  He could be low, but I'm not as high on him as the BA guy, and I don't think his upside exceeds Danks, unless he can learn to K a few more guys.

    My breakout candidates for next year: Lemon, Feliz, Jonathon Greene, Main (breakout in that he'll jump into the top-10 prospect bracket)

    Colbert/Colbert '08

    by rooster on Nov 10, 2007 1:08 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Thoughts
    Too high-

    Beltre
    Beaven (hasn't thrown a pitch)
    Main (just slightly too high although very promising)

    Too low-

    Duran
    Harrison (should be above Beaven at this point IMO)
    Boggs
    Galarraga
    Reed

    by slimshadty12 on Nov 10, 2007 7:10 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Maybe somewhat surprisingly
    Too high:
    Andrus
    MaxRam
    JMJ

    Too low:
    Harrison
    Santana
    B. Jones

    My prediction for guys that we'll be saying "How the hell wasn't he in our top 30 last winter?"

    Josh Rupe, Jesse Ingram, Grullon

    by badradiorules on Nov 11, 2007 1:33 AM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Thanks for the effort
    I'm still upset that Drew Meyer didn't make the cut.
    "On-base percentage is great if you can score runs and do something with that on-base percentage," Baker said. "Clogging up the bases isn't that great to me."

    by jparks77 on Nov 10, 2007 12:41 PM CST   0 recs

    Yeah, thx,
    nice job running things - always fun to do
    Shrooms - The Movie

    by shroomer on Nov 10, 2007 2:13 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    no problemo
    Ben Franklin. Gandhi. Jackie Robinson. Winston Churchill. Martin Luther King. Jesus Christ. And now... Dwyade!!!

    by thedirkatron on Nov 10, 2007 9:53 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Im a little upset
    that guys who are major league ready,  murray and mendoza, did not make the cut.  I understand their cielings might not be as high as others but the can contribute at the ML level.
    "I'd need a picture of Jamey with a shotgun saying "This is my Boomstick!" before I could see that one." DJCahill

    by NYTXFAN on Nov 10, 2007 12:51 PM CST   0 recs

    I know
    This list favors magic beanness, something guys like Murray, Mendoza and Galarraga don't have anymore.

    Projectibility...the greater your accomplishments, the less of it you have.

    by hightowersmith on Nov 10, 2007 1:02 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    I couldn't disagree more
    A player's projectability does not diminish with professional success. When their on the field accomplishments don't measure up to their projected ability is when their status suffers.
    "On-base percentage is great if you can score runs and do something with that on-base percentage," Baker said. "Clogging up the bases isn't that great to me."

    by jparks77 on Nov 10, 2007 1:17 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Y'know
    I reflected on this idea a lot today.

    I still find the list very hall-of-mirrors when guys like Blake Beaven rank 10, 15 places ahead of pitchers that have already debuted (ie Mendoza) and some that have debuted and still project (eg Galaragga and Murray).

    by hightowersmith on Nov 11, 2007 3:19 AM CST to parent up   0 recs

    well
    the way i view it is just because a guy is "major league ready" doesn't make him a higher ranked more valuable prospect.
    Can you please Look into getting a less funny signature? That's sarcasm, btw. - Sharky

    by rentz on Nov 10, 2007 1:54 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    There's a careful balance...
    when comparing talent at a low level to a guy who's made it through to AAA/Majors. The rate of players actually making it to the majors is so low that you have to weigh guys that have made it that far very heavily.

    Now saying that, can you possibly rate Arias higher then Andrus just because Arias made it to the majors? Obviously not because that's not taking into account the fact of Arias' own problems and Andrus' higher ceiling.

    I just think this list is a classic example of hype over reality. It's still a good list, it's just biased towards higher ceiling guys mostly regardless of what level they are at.

    One more example that sticks to mind. Would you rather have 1 Boggs or 1 Beltre? Me personally, 1 Boggs and that's because we know what we have in Boggs and it can be beneficial right now while we don't know what we have in Beltre and it's going to take 3-5 years to find out. But would you rather have 10 Beltre's or 10 Boggs? Seems like the same question and my answer is the same but for different reasons. Chances are you are going to have 1-2 Beltre's stick at a productive to superstar level. Which seems to favor going with the Beltre's but you have to figure maybe 3-5 Boggs sticking in the majors in some role and maybe one hitting that productive-all star level but never superstar. I'll take the higher probability with Boggs cause you have more quantity in ammo through trade and it's easier to fill out a lineup when you constantly have guys who can contribute coming through the minors. It's a complicated issue and really there's no truly right or wrong answer but it's quite fascinating.

    by slimshadty12 on Nov 11, 2007 1:54 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Personally...
    I'd take 1-2 Beltres over 3-5 Boggs.

    Getting 1-2 superstars, and controlling them for 6 years at below market prices, is huge.

    Those guys are a lot harder to find, and more expensive to pay, on the market than the Boggs-types.

    by Adam J. Morris on Nov 11, 2007 2:19 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    It's an interesting issue, slimshady
    I agreed with your rationale first, then Adam tempered it a little bit.

    I would argue that it's more like 5-7 Boggs' though. If you've hit in AA, that is a legit bench mark for your resume.

    At that point, like you say, a GM should be shrewd enough to be able to swing the extras into something resembling an all-star level player. Then, if Boggs were to continue to improve and somehow maximize his ceiling, he could possibly put up an AS season or two.

    Then it becomes: are two all-stars (with one potentially being a pitcher) worth one superstar?

    Sideshow ... onto 800. You can do it!

    by Chase Irwin on Nov 11, 2007 4:45 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    One superstar >>> Two All-Stars
    Superstars are the rarest of commodities in the game.

    Let's look at the Yankees, for example, because ARod was the first person I thought when I thought of "superstar".

    ARod had a VORP of 96 this season. That's crazy good.

    Hideki Matsui posted a VORP of 32, which is still pretty good (it would have ranked second on the Rangers), but it's exactly 1/3 of what ARod produced.

    Would you rather have one ARod, or three Matsui's?

    I take one ARod over three Matsui's, and I don't even have to think about it.

    Ben Franklin. Gandhi. Jackie Robinson. Winston Churchill. Martin Luther King. Jesus Christ. And now... Dwyade!!!

    by thedirkatron on Nov 11, 2007 5:34 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    I don't disagree
    BUT, what would you say the chances are that an Engel Beltre type toolsy teenager reaches that superstar level?

    Maybe 1 in 100?

    Some professionals get better with age and experience. Lawyers, professors, engineers. Hookers? Not so much. -- DJ Cahill

    by tricer on Nov 11, 2007 7:26 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Yep...
    "Lebron James drags down the Cavs roster"- Skip Bayless

    by miles on Nov 11, 2007 8:34 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Probably more than that
    If you take, say, the top 5 prospects from each of the two rookie leagues, for a 10 year span (eliminating any duplicates), my guess is that you'd end up with more than 1 player.

    I figured it would be more like 1 in 10, although 1 in 15 or 1 in 20 may be more accurate.

    by Adam J. Morris on Nov 11, 2007 8:43 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    True
    BUT what are the chances a late blooming college outfielder with a history of injuries reaches the All-Star level?

    Very low, I'm guessing.

    Ben Franklin. Gandhi. Jackie Robinson. Winston Churchill. Martin Luther King. Jesus Christ. And now... Dwyade!!!

    by thedirkatron on Nov 11, 2007 9:43 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    yeah, low
    but the "odds of Boggs as an All-Star" part of the discussion kinda gives me tired head and I was just ignoring that.

    I'm just curious what people would say are the odds that a 17 year old like Engel Beltre actually becomes a ML superstar, say on the level of Sizemore or Beltran. Pure guesswork on my part, but it doesn't seem like it could be any better than 1 in 20 like AJM offered above. Those are really slim odds, but of course it is a better chance than you would have w/out Beltre in the system.

    Some professionals get better with age and experience. Lawyers, professors, engineers. Hookers? Not so much. -- DJ Cahill

    by tricer on Nov 11, 2007 9:58 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Well...
    I'd clarify that I think Brandon Boggs does not have a 60% chance of becoming a productive major leaguer.  And I'd give him only a 20% chance or so of being more than a 4th outfielder/platoon CF'er.

    I think the chances of 10 Brandon Boggs becoming two All Stars is well less than 50/50.

    In addition, with 10 Engel Beltres, you might expect to get 1-2 star/superstar caliber players, but you are also going to likely wind up with a couple of the Boggs-types you are referring to...a great young toolsy player can end up panning out like Jose Guillen, for example, not a star, but a solid contributor.  Or could pan out like a Corey Patterson, a decent 4th/5th outfielder.

    Here's the GCL top 10 list from 2000, btw, to give us a frame of reference (I picked the GCL because a rookie league is where the top prospects are going to be the really young, projectable types):

    1. *Tony Blanco, 3b, Red Sox
    2. *Adam Wainwright, rhp, Braves
    3. Deivi Mendez, ss, Yankees
    4. *Justin Morneau, 1b, Twins
    5. *Adrian Gonzalez, 1b, Marlins
    6. Yoel Hernandez, rhp, Phillies
    7. Matt Wheatland, rhp, Tigers
    8. *Grady Sizemore, of, Expos
    9. *Jason Botts, 1b, Rangers
    10. Omar Beltre, rhp, Rangers
    You've got 1 superstar, a couple of star-level players, a solid pitcher, and a couple of fringe/bench types.  Of course, that was a particularly good year for prospects in that league...the AZL top 10 that year has Clint Nageotte as its only major leaguer...

    by Adam J. Morris on Nov 11, 2007 5:46 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Interesting
    but since pitching is the scarcest commodity of all in baseball, I would wager that the differential between two all-stars [if one is a pitcher] and one superstar [if he is a hitter]-- which is how I had it constructed in my mind -- is smaller than how dirk framed it. Of course, the most independent variable in this hypothetical would be what a GM could theoretically spin the other 9 Boggs' for if he was presented with 10 to work with. He would probably not be able to spin the same level of returns from year to year, obviously, based on market conditions, player contracts, league situations, externalities, etc. etc.  So there's a lot of variability there as well.

    In order to substantiate that, I'll have to do some VORP research [in terms of the value differential of the top pitchers vs. top hitters] to give a few frames of reference. It would be diary worthy.

    Hopefully I'll get bored enough over thanksgiving to crank that out.

    If anyone knows where I could find scroll lists of VORP without having to pay, a link would be appreciated.

    Sideshow ... onto 800. You can do it!

    by Chase Irwin on Nov 11, 2007 8:42 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    FWIW, my list
    1. Hurley
    2. Davis
    3. Main
    4. Kiker
    5. Teagarden
    6. Andrus
    7. Beltre
    8. Castillo
    9. Beavan
    10. Duran
    11. Santana
    12. MaxRam
    13. Diamond
    14. Font
    15. Borbon
    16. Feliz
    17. Harrison
    18. Lemon
    19. Mendoza
    20. Hunter
    21. AJ/Boggs
    22. Poveda
    23. Phillips
    24. Whittleman
    25. JMJ
    26. Beau Jones
    27. Arias
    28. Brigham
    29. Quintero
    30. Ramirez
    31. Grullon
    32. Evan Reed
    33. Galarraga
    34. Velazquez
    35. Yan/West/Garr/Wilkins/DRH
    So, I made this before we started the community list, and I'm beginning to change my thoughts on some of these players based on the information everyone has brought forward.  Don't take it too seriously, since I'm not a professional, and since I would probably make changes right now, if I took the time to rethink it.  It's been fun talking about all of these kids, and I really like the top 20 or so.  There are a number of guys in the top 20 that could do something special and make a leap to uber-prospect status.
    Colbert/Colbert '08

    by rooster on Nov 10, 2007 1:14 PM CST   0 recs

    Thanks dirkatron
    Can't wait until the mid season rankings. Great job.
    Look out Baylor Cubbies you will be crying David Keresh after the Sooners get done with you. Boomer Sooner!

    by boomer1 on Nov 10, 2007 3:12 PM CST   0 recs

    thank you
    Ben Franklin. Gandhi. Jackie Robinson. Winston Churchill. Martin Luther King. Jesus Christ. And now... Dwyade!!!

    by thedirkatron on Nov 10, 2007 9:52 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    I wonder
    if Mayberry will even make the next list if he doesn't do something quick.
    Tomorrow Never Knows

    by t ball on Nov 10, 2007 4:23 PM CST   0 recs

    Harrison
    After seeing him last week, I have to move Harrison up on my list, he'd be 6-7-8 ahead of Duran and not sure whether he is ahead even with or slightly behind Main and Beavan.

    I still think Chris Davis is too high. I'd probably have him in that same 6-7-8 range

    This probably how I'd go:
    1 Hurley
    2 Kiker
    3 Andrus
    4 Teagarden
    5 Main
    6 Davis
    7 Harrison
    8 Beavan
    9 Duran
    10 Whittleman
    11 Beltre
    12 Ramirez
    13 Poveda
    14 Mayberry, Jr
    15 Arias

    by Brandon Wilson on Nov 10, 2007 5:12 PM CST   0 recs

    I'm so Upset
    ...It's all over!

    I may need to cry in my wine, while eating Godiva, and watching anything with Shirley McClain.*

    Thanks, dirkatron!

    *=sub whiskey, chicken parm, and anything with female nudity-in that order.

    You're hijacking the thread and being repetitive. Move forward.

    by Rodney on Nov 10, 2007 6:13 PM CST   0 recs

    +1
    Hand Claps
    "On-base percentage is great if you can score runs and do something with that on-base percentage," Baker said. "Clogging up the bases isn't that great to me."

    by jparks77 on Nov 10, 2007 6:14 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Thanks, Dirk
    It's great when the community bands together for things like this, and it wouldn't be possible without you starting these things up.
    sportsdeals.blogspot.com

    by BudLight on Nov 10, 2007 6:56 PM CST   0 recs

    You're welcome
    I really enjoy doing this, and I'm glad y'all enjoy participating.
    Ben Franklin. Gandhi. Jackie Robinson. Winston Churchill. Martin Luther King. Jesus Christ. And now... Dwyade!!!

    by thedirkatron on Nov 10, 2007 9:52 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    I wonder if BGL
    voted on any of this.
    "I'd need a picture of Jamey with a shotgun saying "This is my Boomstick!" before I could see that one." DJCahill

    by NYTXFAN on Nov 10, 2007 7:13 PM CST   0 recs

    He is
    in Europe with his new Porsche I beleive...
    "Lebron James drags down the Cavs roster"- Skip Bayless

    by miles on Nov 10, 2007 7:37 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Great work...
    Nice job.  Not an easy list to put together these days.

    by Jamey Newberg on Nov 10, 2007 8:19 PM CST   0 recs

    Thanks
    Well done.  It will be fun to see all these guys progress.  Some will fail, and here's hoping some will flat out shine.
    'At Georgia Southern, we don't cheat. That costs money and we don't have any.' Erk Russell / Georgia Southern

    by Ed Coffin on Nov 10, 2007 8:21 PM CST   0 recs

    I can tell you right now...
    Beltre won't shine...
    "Lebron James drags down the Cavs roster"- Skip Bayless

    by miles on Nov 10, 2007 8:23 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Wet blanket
    Look out Baylor Cubbies you will be crying David Keresh after the Sooners get done with you. Boomer Sooner!

    by boomer1 on Nov 10, 2007 8:25 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Hey Miles
    I wasn't talking about shoeshine stands .....
    'At Georgia Southern, we don't cheat. That costs money and we don't have any.' Erk Russell / Georgia Southern

    by Ed Coffin on Nov 10, 2007 8:26 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Shoe shining...
    That is what Arias will be doing...
    "Lebron James drags down the Cavs roster"- Skip Bayless

    by miles on Nov 10, 2007 8:54 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    But
    he'll be damn good at it.

    by Agreen07 on Nov 11, 2007 7:27 AM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Actually
    he'll probably do it very fast.

    But it won't be a good job.  But folks will marvel at how young he was when he did it.

    "I promise, if elected, I will crush the state of Georgia" - Stephen Colbert www.colbert08.org

    by DJCahill on Nov 11, 2007 10:38 AM CST to parent up   0 recs

    The shine
    will look like shit, but some customers will walk away raving about all the fancy brushes, rags, and polishes in his shine kit.
    Some professionals get better with age and experience. Lawyers, professors, engineers. Hookers? Not so much. -- DJ Cahill

    by tricer on Nov 11, 2007 10:51 AM CST to parent up   0 recs

    beltre
    so what makes you think he won't be any good? what's your criteria for judging him?

    or is this just that you feel arias may be traded away so you need to find a new player to dislike?

    Can you please Look into getting a less funny signature? That's sarcasm, btw. - Sharky

    by rentz on Nov 10, 2007 8:55 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    I have
    already explained my reasoning 10 times before.

    Because all the hype over him is "omg, he got the highest bonus for a latino player ever!"  

    The reason people are impressed is because he is young and latin...

    There are MANY players just like him that are white, people just want to think he is so much better because of where he comes from...

    If he was spoke english and was from the states, there would be NO hype around him...

    And you can't say "But hes like 17!"  Okay...Doesn't mean he is good.

    "Lebron James drags down the Cavs roster"- Skip Bayless

    by miles on Nov 10, 2007 9:03 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    It also doesn't mean
    He is a shit player like you think. So in your world "white is right"?
    Look out Baylor Cubbies you will be crying David Keresh after the Sooners get done with you. Boomer Sooner!

    by boomer1 on Nov 10, 2007 9:08 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    No.
    Now you are just puting words in my mouth...

    The reason why people hype about him is because he is a mystery, and trying to compare him to Barry Bonds or Sammy Sosa...

    If he was born here, people would consider along with all the other out of high school players.

    At this point in his career, he has not proved anything.  At this point in his career, he has not done anything...

    "Lebron James drags down the Cavs roster"- Skip Bayless

    by miles on Nov 10, 2007 9:16 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    So he is an unknown right?
    If that is so he is neither good or bad until he proves otherwise right? So for you to say he sucks is wrong until we have more info.
    Look out Baylor Cubbies you will be crying David Keresh after the Sooners get done with you. Boomer Sooner!

    by boomer1 on Nov 10, 2007 9:20 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    I said
    he is over hyped...

    He is unknown, so why is everyone already calling him the next Barry Bonds?

    "Lebron James drags down the Cavs roster"- Skip Bayless

    by miles on Nov 10, 2007 9:56 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    you said
    "he won't shine" which presumably means you're saying he won't be good.

    by ab03 on Nov 11, 2007 12:56 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    So...
    "He would be considered along with the other high school players." I don't know what that means.

    You don't think a kid with his tools who earned a promotion to Spokane would have crushed the competition in high school?

    Is your point that no one that young should be considered a prospect?

    That's ignorant.

    Justin Upton became a top tier prospect the second the D-Backs drafted him, and he hadn't proved anything at that point. He was just like Beltre. He wasn't "white", he spoke English, and he hadn't "proven anything".

    Was it dumb to consider him a prospect at that point?

    Ben Franklin. Gandhi. Jackie Robinson. Winston Churchill. Martin Luther King. Jesus Christ. And now... Dwyade!!!

    by thedirkatron on Nov 10, 2007 9:50 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Upton
    put up pretty good stats his first year in the minors.
    AVG      OBP     SLG
    .263    .343    .413   
    "Lebron James drags down the Cavs roster"- Skip Bayless

    by miles on Nov 10, 2007 9:55 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    JustinUpton signed too late to play his first year
    after being drafted.

    And yet people still rated him highly.

    Why was that, Miles?

    He hadn't "proven anything" according to your warped definition of what that means.

    Ben Franklin. Gandhi. Jackie Robinson. Winston Churchill. Martin Luther King. Jesus Christ. And now... Dwyade!!!

    by thedirkatron on Nov 10, 2007 10:01 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Because
    when you bat .508 with 12 homers you are pretty good....
    "Lebron James drags down the Cavs roster"- Skip Bayless

    by miles on Nov 10, 2007 10:08 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    And when did Upton do this?
    In high school, I assume?

    So you're saying high school is more impressive than the AZL?

    Really, Miles?

    I mean... really?

    And listen, kid, I'm not saying Beltre is as god a prospect as Upton was. He's not. Upton had truly special tools.

    But how can you say that we shouldn't rate someone as a good prospect before they prove anything, and then say that people were right to rate Justin Upton highly when the only thing he had going for him was tools?

    Ben Franklin. Gandhi. Jackie Robinson. Winston Churchill. Martin Luther King. Jesus Christ. And now... Dwyade!!!

    by thedirkatron on Nov 10, 2007 10:13 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Upton had good tools.
    Beltre has good power?  So did Nelson Cruz.

    What does Beltre do so well then?  Becasue he hasn't shown it.

    "Lebron James drags down the Cavs roster"- Skip Bayless

    by miles on Nov 10, 2007 10:25 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    A .900+ OPS as a 17 year old in the AZL
    that's not impressive? Not even a little?

    The scouting reports on his speed, defense and arm aren't evidence of "good tools"?

    Your argument makes no sense, Miles.

    Ben Franklin. Gandhi. Jackie Robinson. Winston Churchill. Martin Luther King. Jesus Christ. And now... Dwyade!!!

    by thedirkatron on Nov 10, 2007 10:50 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    actually
    many pundits thought Upton's debut was poor and while someone of his stature would normally vault to the top of the prospect rankings (see Delmon Young) Upton actually slipped coming into 2007. Then he showed everyone by lighting it up in the minors this year at 19.

    by Brandon Wilson on Nov 11, 2007 1:36 AM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Belre
    put up impressive numbers of...
    AVG       OBP       SLG
    .211    .250      .211

    I think I know why Upton was a better prospect...

    "Lebron James drags down the Cavs roster"- Skip Bayless

    by miles on Nov 10, 2007 10:00 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Miles
    Your blind hatred knows no bounds.

    You cherry picked those stats. Those were from his 38 ab's in Spokane.

    You think that's more statistically significant than his .900+ OPS in 80+ AB's in the AZL once he came over in the trade?

    He total numbers for last year were .243/.329/.433.

    He was also a full year younger than Upton was when he put up the stats you listed for him... though I'd be pulling a Miles if I didn't mention that Upton was in Low-A when he put up those numbers at 18.

    Ben Franklin. Gandhi. Jackie Robinson. Winston Churchill. Martin Luther King. Jesus Christ. And now... Dwyade!!!

    by thedirkatron on Nov 10, 2007 10:10 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    give it up, Miles
    your argument is weak and misdirected.  Beltre is an impressive prospect and he's still very young.
    Tomorrow Never Knows

    by t ball on Nov 11, 2007 12:25 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    LEAVE MILES ALONE
    HA
    Loves me some LSB NMLR NR RFR RFP PFEF GDKAAB STCJW

    by hurlerhurley on Nov 13, 2007 12:47 AM CST to parent up   0 recs

    To be fair
    The same kind of hype was floated for J.D. Drew, and others.  Going way back, there was an 18 year old lefty named Seth Moorehead, signed by the Phillies, whose name was in midwestern, southern, and eastern papers every day.  Until he had pitched about 120 games or so (can't remember) and his elbow blew out.  Being pre-Tommy John, he went from 'amazing bonus baby' to 'who?' almost overnight.
    'At Georgia Southern, we don't cheat. That costs money and we don't have any.' Erk Russell / Georgia Southern

    by Ed Coffin on Nov 10, 2007 9:32 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    He does speak English
    He spent a chunk of his youth in the states.

    But to know that you'd actually have to do some research rather than just randomly choosing guys to hate.

    Ben Franklin. Gandhi. Jackie Robinson. Winston Churchill. Martin Luther King. Jesus Christ. And now... Dwyade!!!

    by thedirkatron on Nov 10, 2007 9:45 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Beltre
    Actually speaks fluent English and played a couple of years of PSAL ball at the Bronx's DeWitt Clinton High School.
    http://rangers.scout.com

    by JasonCole on Nov 10, 2007 10:04 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

    Question
    There are MANY players just like him that are white,

    Such as?

    Keep in mind, if he were in the States, he'd be a high school senior right now, and eligible to be drafted in 2008.

    by Adam J. Morris on Nov 10, 2007 10:51 PM CST to parent up   0 recs