Durrett on Hurley

by Adam J. Morris on Dec 18, 2007 3:30 PM CST in News Comment 33 comments

Richard Durrett discusses Eric Hurley's role in 2008, and whether he should spend the whole season in AAA, or take his lumps at the major league level.

Personally, my feeling is that unless Hurley is lights out in spring training, and someone from the expected Opening Day rotation isn't healthy, Hurley should start the season at Oklahoma.

My ideal scenario would be for him to go down there, dominate AAA hitters for three months, and then come up around Independence Day and spend 6-8 weeks working out of the pen. If and when a rotation slot opens up in the second half of the season, you can slot him in there, but it seems like it would make more sense to break him in working out of the pen, if possible.

Then, if all goes well, he comes into 2009 pencilled into the rotation and ready to go...

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trade

he'll be trade.

why are we even talking about him, or any player, as if he has any future with the team. its very odd and incongreous for lsb.

Mike Huckabee, next president of the United States

by Sharky on Dec 18, 2007 3:27 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

your act...

is tired, bland and sophomoric. Get some new material, already.

by TheBZA on Dec 18, 2007 3:30 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

So he wont be traded in the next few years?

Really?

Do you want to bet?

Unless he suffers catastrophic injury or sucks..

Mike Huckabee, next president of the United States

by Sharky on Dec 19, 2007 4:36 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

bet

i swear if you pay out any bets before mine, I'll be pissed

by ab03 on Dec 19, 2007 12:59 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

OKC, then Arlington

I'd also like to see him start at OKC -- even if he is absolutely lights out in spring training. I think the opening day rotation needs to be
Millwood
Padilla
McCarthy
Gabbard
Volquez

They need to keep looking at Gabbard and Volquez did everything they asked of him last year and deserves to stay in the rotation as well for an extended look.

When the inevitable injury happens there will be ample opportunity later in the year for the several guys waiting in the wings to get a look. Galarraga, Mendoza and maybe even Tejeda are there to consider as well. Let Hurley go to finishing school until July 4 or so.

Ideally, Milly and Padilla get off to strong starts and become hot trade targets. That would make more room for these young arms to get a look and maybe bring back a young outfielder.

Tomorrow Never Knows

by t ball on Dec 18, 2007 3:28 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

edit

I don't mean you trade both Millwood and Padilla really. Padilla is 1st choice if he raises his value with a strong start.

Tomorrow Never Knows

by t ball on Dec 18, 2007 3:32 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Agree, basically

Whether starters get traded or just flame out (looking at you, Kason), Hurley will very likely get his turn in 2008.

Put him in AAA till further notice.

Go Strangers.

by hightowersmith on Dec 18, 2007 3:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

let's not forget...

...this is a big season for Mr. McCarthy also...

...very much like to see him bounce back with a healthy season...

by oc on Dec 18, 2007 4:41 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I'd like to get

BGR's take on Adam's idea of working out of the bullpen to get adjusted to MLB hitters. Seemed like it may have stunted his growth as far as not being stretched out so to speak to deal with the rigors of being a major league starter.

"But the major difference is where Showalter tried to overthink everything Washington at times seems like he isn't thinking at all. " - rentz

by hillcrest on Dec 18, 2007 3:36 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

I think it is a tremendous

confidence builder, especially for guys with great stuff.

Joba was a good prospect going into last season, but after dominating big league hitters out of the bullpen at the end of the year, his stock grew tenfold.

Same can be said for Wainwright.

Now I cant speak for what it does about long term development, because I think it's going to take both Joba and Wainwright a couple of years to readjust to starting.

by Nichols22 on Dec 18, 2007 3:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

McCarthy

I wouldn't guess that the bullpen had any negative effects on him - his 2006 numbers (except for HRs) were very solid. If anything, pitching for that crazy jackass of a manager is the biggest challange for a young pitcher.

by Randy Richardson on Dec 18, 2007 3:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

what?

by Longhorn on Dec 18, 2007 4:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Guillen

by Randy Richardson on Dec 18, 2007 4:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Um, no

If we bring him up even once in '08, that means we'd have to add him to the 40.

The 40 trumps all.

"God plays by his own rules, folks. And HGH is f***ing legal as hell up in heaven." -Andy Pettitte

by thedirkatron on Dec 18, 2007 3:47 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

So add

him to the 40. We, or I, want to see him at some point of the 2008 season. We can just get rid of someone else who is not in our plans.

by the other dierk in dallas on Dec 18, 2007 4:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Gabbard...

Unfortunately, I imagine this guy will break down at some point during the year. I think we see Hurley - not because he is ready, but probably because he will be needed.

by JB on Dec 18, 2007 3:57 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

how about Harrison?

We should see him sometime next year or in the rotation of 09 if there is room. Id much rather have Harrison and Hurley in my rotation then Gabbard and Padilla.

""I love GOOOOOOOLLLLLLLLLLD" blueglovelefty

by NYTXFAN on Dec 18, 2007 4:05 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Whats wrong with Kason

Im curious what did Gabbard do to make so many people not want him? Seemed to me like the guy has a pretty good grasp at how to pitch in The Ballpark. He is still young and will go through some rough spots but I am extremely encouraged at Kason.

As for the bullpen idea. I think that is a horrible idea. Starting pitchers are a different breed. They have their own routines and nuances that they do in between starts. Relievers don't have that same luxury. They could pitch 3 days in a row and then not pitch for a week.

It would be great if BGR could add his insight as to how it helped or hurt his development. I think if a guy is destined to be a starter keep him as one. Let him spend time in AAA if you have to as long as he keeps his routine of every 5 days.

by Steven on Dec 18, 2007 4:51 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

johan santana

by ab03 on Dec 18, 2007 4:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Little different situation here

He was a Rule V draft pick so it was a lot easier to keep him on the active roster as a reliever and use him sparingly,i.e how we tried with Fabio Castro recently, than keep him as a starter. Hurley is almost ready for the bigs. Just like BGR was ready in 06.

by Steven on Dec 18, 2007 7:28 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

bullpen

Explain to me the benefit of breaking a pitcher in through the bullpen. I mean I know that there are cases that it has worked, but I'd venture to guess that there are just about at many cases that it hasn't worked.

On top of that, pitching out of the bullpen seems very different. It seems like it is high effort short duration which is very different from the pacing that a starter must have to remain strong throughout the game.

I am open to the idea, I just don't really understand the benefits.

by Brandon Wilson on Dec 18, 2007 4:53 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Well...

I think it acclimates a pitcher to pitching in the majors in a less stressful environment.

Earl Weaver used to swear by breaking pitchers in in a long relief role.

Roy Oswalt started out that way. So did Johan Santana. The Yanks did it with Joba Chamberlain this year.

by Adam J. Morris on Dec 18, 2007 4:59 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

hmmmmmm

Overall not very compelling examples... I mean yes, they all started in the bullpen and are great (2 out of 3, third TBD), but not the way you are proposing with Hurley (at least as I understand your proposal).

Santana was a special case. He started in the minors as a hitter, didn't work out so started pitching. Was in A-ball when he had to be exposed to the rule V draft and went to Minnesota. With his inexperience, the Twins kind of had to use him in the bullpen in order to keep him on the active roster. If they had a choice, I think they would have left him in the minors to start.

I'm not sure I'd call Oswalt's 14 innings over 8 appearances prior to his first career start "breaking in" through the bullpen.

I think the Yankees really needed another arm in the bullpen more than they thought it was a good idea for Joba's development. And the jury is still out on whether it helped or hindered his development.

Finally, it seems to me the less stressful environment thing is a little overstated. First, it is still a big league game and your job is on the line and several pitchers have shown it is just as easy to suck in relief as it is as a starter. Second, I think that needing a less stressful breaking in period (if there is such a thing) is individual. Maybe some players need it, other players probably don't. I think I'd rather have the guy that doesn't be the guy I depend on. Either way, I don't know which Hurley is.

by Brandon Wilson on Dec 18, 2007 8:28 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Santana

He pitched primarily out of the pen even in the three seasons following his Rule 5 season.

by Adam J. Morris on Dec 18, 2007 9:17 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Just my opinion

But I think that had alot to do with Santanas arm not having had thrown 180-200 innings in a season yet. Here are his innings pitched totals until he became a full time starter

40.1
93.1
160.1
86
43.2
157
158.1

If I remember correctly he had an injury in 01 which limited his innings and as was stated earlier by someone he was originally a hitter. Just like teams do with HS kids and limit their pitch counts and innings in their early development he was limited originally. It has obviously turned out to be a great decision by Minnessota but I don't think Hurley should be put through that course of development.

by Steven on Dec 18, 2007 9:40 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

sounds like

a possible CJ Wilson career path? [crossing my fingers]

by Brandon Wilson on Dec 19, 2007 9:06 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

What was

BGL's role in Oklahoma? Was he a starter? I can't remember...

by FuturePants on Dec 18, 2007 5:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I think

BGL's story is a bit different as he was being groomed to be a starter with the big club, then had the dreaded TJ and came back slowly as a reliever until the Rangers needed a reliever and he just kind of stuck. There had been talk publicly as recent as this summer of stretching BGL out to become a starter again and then the Aki elbow issue and the lack of options on the FA market has necessitated that BGL be used as the closer with his make up, arsenal and experience from last year.

"But the major difference is where Showalter tried to overthink everything Washington at times seems like he isn't thinking at all. " - rentz

by hillcrest on Dec 18, 2007 5:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs